# Insurance Quotes/Proposals



## Chris Johnson (Apr 19, 2007)

My neighbor had a flood, wants me to do the work since I was the site super during the initial construction of his home and he trusts me.

He has asked for a proposal for the insurance company, I promise you, I will be the most expensive bid he gets.

But, I always provide bids when asked. So, after reading about all the insurance proposals you guys do, what's the scoop?

Do I need to detail it to death

i.e.

Remove build in cabinetry shelving, 3 hours, 2 men, $ 85.00 per hour
Remove 120 l/f 1/2x3 square baseboard, 2 hours, 2 men, $ 85.00 per hour
Remove 386 sq.ft. of laminate floor and underpad, 4 hours, 2 men, $ 85.00 per hour
.
.
.
.
Supply and install 386 sq.ft. of equal or better laminate floor @ $ 6.50 per sq.ft.
Re-install existing baseboard....
Putty and patch baseboard
Prime baseboard
Paint baseboard

you get the idea, how detailed does it have to be? I think some of you have the software the insurance companies use, if I forward the specs can you enter it for me and return the finished copy of what they want? Who knows, if I do it right I may even land the project.


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## RidgeWalker (Nov 1, 2006)

It should be detailed like you've outlined in your thread. Line item everything you feel is required to restore your clients property to the condition it was prior to the damage.


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## Joasis (Mar 28, 2006)

Pull a list just like you are building a home, and R/R what you will actually, and delete what is ok. That should be plenty of detail.


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## Harmoney Const (Jan 4, 2008)

*Insurance Job*

First you will need a to be a contractor with a Federal ID # for both the insurance company for contract purposes and for the mortgage company. Secondly you will need either Exactimate or Simsol, etc Estimating Software Programs to succesfully estimate the job or else the insurance company will reject your estimate and either send an in house contractor out to estimate the project or just use the adjusters line item estimate.


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## buildpinnacle (Sep 2, 2008)

Harmoney Const said:


> First you will need a to be a contractor with a Federal ID # for both the insurance company for contract purposes and for the mortgage company. Secondly you will need either Exactimate or Simsol, etc Estimating Software Programs to succesfully estimate the job or else the insurance company will reject your estimate and either send an in house contractor out to estimate the project or just use the adjusters line item estimate.


Harmoney has this correct. The insurance industry does not make multi million dollar deals with xactimate, simsol, powerclaim, integriclaim, etc so they can get bids. They (attempt) to train their adjusters in scoping a loss and they will write it up accordingly, using their software of choice. Your numbers, with whatever software or napkins, could be used by the adjuster as a guide, but they will write the claim up using their software. If you want this loss handled correctly, get a signed authorization from your friend to deal with the adjuster directly. Tell your friend that you will negotiate the claim on his behalf and work for the insurance proceeds negotiated. He will be responsible for only his deductible amount. I won't go into the authorization forms as most restoration companies hold these and their personal wording pretty close to the vest...me being one of those guys. If your friend rides the bid train with this loss, he will come up short. Either handle it completely from front to back or walk away.


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## Harmoney Const (Jan 4, 2008)

*Insurance Job*

100% agreed with buildpinnacle! Couldnt say it any better I thought I wrote that! :clap:


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## Chris Johnson (Apr 19, 2007)

Well, I'm about to go meet the adjuster, I have my number figured out, let's see where she comes in.

I spoke with her yesterday and she seemed reasonable, could be a ploy though. She was happy when I told her the laminate floor was basic, not some expensive stuff. I already tore the old floor out since it was starting to smell bad from mildew. She was shocked, but since I took photo's and told her the floor was not expensive she was good with it.

I'll let you know how I make out.

P.S. She uses Xactimate (sp?) for what it is worth and tells me it gets pricing updates every 2 weeks now, not the old quarterly issue they used to have.


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## buildpinnacle (Sep 2, 2008)

Most of the larger ins companies probably do get their price updates every 2 weeks. We are now getting them every month on Xactremodel. My suggestions would be to treat her like a potential customer....flies to honey scenerio. Just casually go over all the issues and items that need to be addressed, be very knowledgabel and factual, and don't try to get into a pissing contest. I have found that I get much more done by 'buddying' instead of 'bullying'. If you know your stuff, she'll probably learn something tomorrow, but be careful and let her 'give it one of these' occasionally (fed ex commercial reference) so it's here idea and she's the smart one. It's all about the money, not the credit.


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## Chris Johnson (Apr 19, 2007)

Actually it was really easy, we met, she reviewed, went over some stuff, I had my figure worked out, she calc'd hers out and was less than me, we discussed certain things the program doesn't allow for (i.e. custom closets, re&re was low) and there was nothing for the 'quiet walk underlayment' she made a few adjustments came out $ 300.00 more than me, we laughed, deducted some depreciation and are within $ 4.00 of what I want. So it's all good.

One thing that made me laugh is she asked if I was a General Contractor (I am, but I don't promote those services, strictly sub-contract concrete unless referred), So I said yes, she than asks if I charge O&P, I thought what kind of question is that? Doesn't everyone charge O&P?


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## SLSTech (Sep 13, 2008)

Chris - based off what you stated above (unless I am misreading it) - she hadn't added in their industry standard 10/10 OH&P part yet


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## Chris Johnson (Apr 19, 2007)

Yes, she did not add in the 10/10 O&P, she did, she asked if I charged it though, I thought what kind of question is that, I thought everyone charged O&P.


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## RidgeWalker (Nov 1, 2006)

Chris Johnson said:


> Actually it was really easy, we met, she reviewed, went over some stuff, I had my figure worked out, she calc'd hers out and was less than me, we discussed certain things the program doesn't allow for (i.e. custom closets, re&re was low) and there was nothing for the 'quiet walk underlayment' she made a few adjustments came out $ 300.00 more than me, we laughed, deducted some depreciation and are within $ 4.00 of what I want. So it's all good.
> 
> One thing that made me laugh is she asked if I was a General Contractor (I am, but I don't promote those services, strictly sub-contract concrete unless referred), So I said yes, she than asks if I charge O&P, I thought what kind of question is that? Doesn't everyone charge O&P?


Chris,
Here's the skinny on O/P in regards to Xactimate or other Insurance Software. 

The line item cost's do NOT include ANY profit or overhead period! They only include material, labor and labor burden, (Taxes involved with labor costs).

The reason the line item does not include a companies over head and profit is because its impossible to determine what the needs and costs are of any particular company. That's why they have left the O&P section open so each contractor can put in the percentages that they require.

The insurance company's have perpetrated a HUGE fraud on policy holders and their contractors alike by insisting that the O&P section of the estimating software is only for General Contractors when in reality it is for ANY contractor who uses the software.

I know this as FACT at least with Xactimate because I spent 2 hours on the phone with an Xactimate pricing specialist who asked to remain nameless. But these are the FACTS!


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## Ed the Roofer (Dec 12, 2006)

You get an EXTRA 10% + 10% for OH & P as GC'ing more than 3 trades.

Tell her that you had the nubers run from a friend of yours with Xactimate and they added the OH & P.

That comes out to an extra 21% approximately for you to supervise and coordinate the job.

Get it.

Ed


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## Chris Johnson (Apr 19, 2007)

So, not that I am planning on getting into the insurance repair business, but I gather if an adjuster showed up and met the owner directly, after their assessment and review the owner could get screwed without representation by a contractor who could argue on their behalf as to the actual value of certain items. Is this correct?

I remember the old days, insurance co. would take 3 estimates, pay the cheapest. Doesn't appear to work that way anymore.

I'll do this, help out a friend and go back to my regular contract work, seems easier to me.

Not that this will affect anything but I wanted an opinion on the type of claim...

Washing machine hose 'jump, popped out, fell out', whatever you want to call it, claim was honored under sewer and drain back up!!! This had a $ 5000.00 limit attached to it, with the deductable ($ 2500.00) we're fine, I came in at $ 7200.00. 

Why that catagory? What would have happened if the Washer was on the second floor and cause worse damage, like the ceiling below, etc. This could have been worth double that in certain scenarios.


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## Ed the Roofer (Dec 12, 2006)

Chris Johnson said:


> So, not that I am planning on getting into the insurance repair business, but I gather if an adjuster showed up and met the owner directly, after their assessment and review the owner could get screwed without representation by a contractor who could argue on their behalf as to the actual value of certain items. Is this correct?
> 
> *Absolutely and they would never ever be informed of the 3 trade bump up for the additional 10% + 10%.*
> 
> ...


Get an authorized exclusive contractors agreement made up with direction to pay to your company and your clients will not be held out for ransom to reverse auction the job to such a low point that the insurance company desires to meet for their own financial Loss Limit Goals.

Ed


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## Chris Johnson (Apr 19, 2007)

Ed,

The check has already been paid out...I guess I should have mentioned, we have an HOA. Check was made payable to them and was sent Thursday afternoon. I expect to see it in today's mailbox. (I also sit on the board of directors), Yes the adjuster was aware of this.

Actually I was really concerned about me being in a conflict of interest position, I was the site super during construction, live here, sit on the board and now am an independent contractor doing the work. I disclosed all this and no one cared. The property manager (who I hired) just writes me a check when needed (which I countersign with him, 2 party signature). And the funny part is I was elected to the board by the membership, no one wants me to quit (I've tried) because the builder I worked for went belly up and I know this place and who worked on what inside and out.


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## Ed the Roofer (Dec 12, 2006)

Did they pay the GC OH & P for the extra 10% + 10%?

If not, put in a supplement for it.

If you don't know what to do, I can give you the name of a company that handles that for a 3% fee of the additional funds they acquire for you.

Send me an e-mail to [email protected] if you need it.

Ed


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## Chris Johnson (Apr 19, 2007)

They have paid the HOA $ 5k, the maximum amount under the policy limits. The HOA will pay me $ 7200.00 for my end, which is what I had originally proposed the costs to be, my bid, this included my O&P. Plus an additional $ 800.00 add dollars to ServiceMaster for there initial clean up of the water, fans, etc. they did this the day the damage occured.

Maybe I am not doing this right, but bottom line, I want $ 7200.00 to do the job, I am being paid $ 7200.00 and that's all I really care about. 

I am sure if I was planning on competing in the insurance business I would need to re-formulate how I calculate things, but this is a one shot deal. The friend is my neighbor. Chances of me doing this type of work again are slim...unless someone else in the HOA has a similar issue.

Did I get lucky in how this turned out? I just don't like complicated things, here's my bid, that's it.


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## buildpinnacle (Sep 2, 2008)

Insurance work has its pros and cons. It all depends on how one views the glass (1/2 empty...) As there is a ton of legwork involved prior to getting to the final number, the most rewarding thing is that I usually have a sold job when I am contacted...prior to showing up. I go over the parameters of how insurance claims work and the process with the HO or BO when I arrive before I even scope the loss. They get my bid right then.....thier deductible. That's it, that's what they pay out of pocket. I handle the rest of the monies through the ins company and take responsibility for negotiating properly to ensure the work can be done. Some contractors don't want to mess with it. Like you said...here's my bid. For me, I like the fact that I am helping people get the repairs they deserve that they may not had gotten otherwise. 

An example: I recieved a phone call from a gentleman last week for a roof replacement. I met with him and he's 86 years young. He shows me some interior leaks and we discuss the fact that I had replaced a couple roofs in his rural neighborhood from hail damage last year and he informs me that's why he called me. I did a full survey on the property and found that he had also been hit by a recent storm that came through that had not been documented and I had found only because I stumbled across it. Long story short, I met the adjuster today, got the roof bought including interior damages, a few window wraps and some siding repairs and the gentleman was excited. I even got the adjuster to pay the entire claim today with no depreciation because the HO and I signed the proposal right in front of him. He goes on to inform me that before his neighbors told him to call me he had called another local who had been out, measured the roof and promised to call back to get started. The other roofer never offered to inspect for damages to help the man out. He knew the man was going to pay out of pocket and didn't want to delay the job with an 'insurance claim'. Needless to say, he made that mistake and didn't call the man back when he promised and got passed over. As I like making money, the biggest bonus to this project will be the fact that this man will have over $10K left in his bank account because we cared enough to do our job. His $12K roof is now just costing him a small deductible amount. That is how referrals are made. The insurance business leads to many because people need you and you are helping them recover from a bad experience. We try to make the process less stressful and take less time.


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## Ed the Roofer (Dec 12, 2006)

buildpinnacle said:


> An example: I recieved a phone call from a gentleman last week for a roof replacement. I met with him and he's 86 years young. He shows me some interior leaks and we discuss the fact that I had replaced a couple roofs in his rural neighborhood from hail damage last year and he informs me that's why he called me.
> 
> I did a full survey on the property and found that *he had also been hit by a recent storm that came through that had not been documented* and I had found only because I stumbled across it.
> 
> Long story short, I met the adjuster today, got the roof bought including interior damages, a few window wraps and some siding repairs and the gentleman was excited. I even got the adjuster to pay the entire claim today with no depreciation because the HO and I signed the proposal right in front of him. He goes on to inform me that before his neighbors told him to call me he had called another local who had been out, measured the roof and promised to call back to get started. The other roofer never offered to inspect for damages to help the man out. He knew the man was going to pay out of pocket and didn't want to delay the job with an 'insurance claim'. Needless to say, he made that mistake and didn't call the man back when he promised and got passed over. As I like making money, the biggest bonus to this project will be the fact that this man will have over $10K left in his bank account because we cared enough to do our job. His $12K roof is now just costing him a small deductible amount. That is how referrals are made. The insurance business leads to many because people need you and you are helping them recover from a bad experience. We try to make the process less stressful and take less time.


Now, what did you use to prove the storm?

I get some of these adjuster weanies that have a reported storm in the neighboring town, which may only be 1 block away, but sine the reported starm data base did not list that specific town, they attempt to logically conclude, in their tiny little minds, that the storm stopped at the boudry.

I get them to accept it usually, but only after much arm twisting.

How do you go about it? I know of most, if not all of the weather sources already, but don't pay for hail-trax or hail-swath.

As a matter of fact, that would make an interesting topic on it's own merit, don't you agree?

Ed


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