# Baby's room much cooler than the other rooms.



## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

That's the nature of the complaint. Room is about 13'x13' with two outdoor walls.

8" supply, 6" or 8" return. Ducts are alright, and we adjusted air flow to make sure there was plenty of supply air. Still, no major changes. I don't think adding another supply will help (ceiling). At this point, I think it's an insulation issue, but, looking for some other ideas.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

Could be lack of insulation in walls, ceiling or behind the window casing. I just redid a wall where that was the issue, and it was easy to tell by putting my hand on the walls, etc.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

New construction, inspected and all, so I doubt the walls are un-insulated, but, I agree, got to check to see where we could be losing the heat. Thanks


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## 98crewcab (Oct 7, 2013)

what about an in-fared camera. to find where the cold is entering/heat is escaping?


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## cleveman (Dec 28, 2007)

Switch the baby to another room and see if that room cools down.


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## Morning Wood (Jan 12, 2008)

Blower door with IR camera. You can track it down easy. Might as well do the whole house to find all the others


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

I see that I am not the only one who is gifted at spending somebody else's money. ,I meant ideas that don't involve the purchase of a $1500 device.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

flashheatingand said:


> I see that I am not the only one who is gifted at spending somebody else's money. ,I meant ideas that don't involve the purchase of a $1500 device.


Booster fan in the supply duct.


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

Is it a bonus room?


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## loneframer (Feb 13, 2009)

Could be uninsulated floor/box, excessive crawl ventilation, lack of or insufficient ceiling insulation, wet insulation due to improper paper/flashing, gaps from improper window installation, exposure to wind/ north side of building with no solar gain.... just a few things to consider, or all of the above.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

Cheap fix? Put a hat on the little one. Cooler room is probably better for baby.


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## Golden view (Feb 16, 2012)

It's either insufficient heat or too much heat loss. Which is cheapest to fix, considering long term fuel bills? If it's new construction done moderately well, it seems like it's just an insufficient heat issue. I like the booster fan idea, or bigger or more ducts if easy.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Inner10 said:


> Booster fan in the supply duct.


Plenty of air flow. Already. Perhaps adding another supply, but, on paper, an 8" supply in a 13x13 room should be enough.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

overanalyze said:


> Is it a bonus room?


No, as a matter of fact, there is another room with a similar problem, but it's not being used. Two story house with one unit for downstairs, and the other (three ton system) for the upstairs.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

MarkJames said:


> Cheap fix? Put a hat on the little one. Cooler room is probably better for baby.


Perhaps, but she called Flash Heating, not Flash Baby Toughening and Midwifery.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Golden view said:


> It's either insufficient heat or too much heat loss. Which is cheapest to fix, considering long term fuel bills? If it's new construction done moderately well, it seems like it's just an insufficient heat issue. I like the booster fan idea, or bigger or more ducts if easy.


Perhaps more ducts would be an answer, but, if the issue is really heat loss, we need to find where it's losing the heat. Don't get me wrong, we can easily add another supply, but, if we still have an issue with heat loss, it could get embarrassing.


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

Temp of conditioned air the same as other rooms?
Is there sufficient C/A return or it's blocked-long convoluted run? Door is probably closed when baby is in there.


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## B.D.R. (May 22, 2007)

Good point about the door being closed.
What is the gap under the doors?
I like to see 3/4 inch.


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## Golden view (Feb 16, 2012)

B.D.R. said:


> Good point about the door being closed.
> What is the gap under the doors?
> I like to see 3/4 inch.


It sounds like there's a CA return in the room.

Regarding heat loss, can you describe what might make the room different? Two exterior walls for a corner room can make a big difference. 208 square feet (if 8' ceiling) of exterior walls vs another room not on the corner could be double the heat loss. Often the ceiling is almost nothing compared to walls when doing heat loss calculations. 

How many floors is the house and what floor is the room on? If it's upstairs, it's probably not infiltration. You could try restricting the return in the room so any airflow is leaving the room, or do a cheap smoke test to see where it's leaking if that's the case.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Only thing that might make this room different, is possibly a slight overhang with the floor? I don't know the exact terminology. Other than that, only one window


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## TimelessQuality (Sep 23, 2007)

flashheatingand said:


> Perhaps, but she called Flash Heating, not Flash Baby Toughening and Midwifery.


That does have a nice ring to it though...


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## SuperiorHIP (Aug 15, 2010)

flashheatingand said:


> Perhaps, but she called Flash Heating, not Flash Baby Toughening and Midwifery.


A little long to go on a van but perhaps a secondary business?


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

flashheatingand said:


> Only thing that might make this room different, is possibly a slight overhang with the floor? I don't know the exact terminology. Other than that, only one window


Good thought...does the second floor have a cantilever?


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## loneframer (Feb 13, 2009)

flashheatingand said:


> Only thing that might make this room different, is possibly a slight overhang with the floor? I don't know the exact terminology. Other than that, only one window


If the floor is cantilevered, there is a huge possibility that there is a problem. If it is uninsulated and/or improperly sealed, it will be very drafty and result in a huge amount of cold air infiltration.

We have had several situations with cantilevers where a strip of electric baseboard was added to help balance the room. These were typically on the Northern exposure with no solar gain and cold North winds.


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

loneframer said:


> If the floor is cantilevered, there is a huge possibility that there is a problem. If it is uninsulated and/or improperly sealed, it will be very drafty and result in a huge amount of cold air infiltration.
> 
> We have had several situations with cantilevers where a strip of electric baseboard was added to help balance the room. These were typically on the Northern exposure with no solar gain and cold North winds.


Exactly! This alone could be the reason. Pull down the soffit and install some 2" Dow to block off the opening in between joist cavities. Then foam around the edges and re-install the soffit.


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## beenthere (Mar 5, 2009)

Air flow is good. So how many CFM is that? What is the supply air temp. What is the return air temp at that rooms return grille.

Where is the thermostat located. Is it in a hallway so that it is being effected by heat rising from the first floor, and turning off the heat too soon.


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## SLSTech (Sep 13, 2008)

I would definitely check the cantilever & if using foam like overanalyze says, use it to fill the cavity at least one or two layers
If that isn't it - no need to spend $1500 for the camera (which you still really need the blower door for) - find an energy auditor in your area to do a scan with said blower door & shadow him (don't forget to look up also)


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

beenthere said:


> Air flow is good. So how many CFM is that? What is the supply air temp. What is the return air temp at that rooms return grille.
> 
> Where is the thermostat located. Is it in a hallway so that it is being effected by heat rising from the first floor, and turning off the heat too soon.


Sorry for the delayed response. Don't have a cellmate, but Rd between rAw, and as was 52 (68 and 120). Turns out three out of the four walls were exterior. Did not drill a hole to check the digits, but no major heat loss detected from the infrared thermometer.

The hallway thermostat and closed door thing does explain a lot. I think you are onto something there:thumbsup:


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## the rock (Feb 27, 2011)

What is the CFM reading at the register?What is the temp reading?


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Sorry, I read my last post, and that was a cluster of garble. Got to quit posting from my tablet. Return air 68, Supply air 120, TD is 52. Don't have a velometer, but the duct was sized at about 200 cfm ( a little less since it is flex duct).


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## the rock (Feb 27, 2011)

I have a hunch,maybe I'm wrong.Is this bedroom above a garage?


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## beenthere (Mar 5, 2009)

What kind of supply register.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

the rock said:


> I have a hunch,maybe I'm wrong.Is this bedroom above a garage?


No. Actually, above a dining room..


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## pcplumber (Oct 12, 2008)

*Cool room problem*

The first thing we do is measure the warm air temperature coming out of the register and we want no less than 105 degrees. The average temperature we get from our furnaces is about 120 degrees at the register.

The second thing we check is the location of the large return air duct. The air temperature at this location is always cold and I relate this feeling like coming out of the water at a lake when the temperature is 110 degrees and the wind is blowing. Your skin is going to get goose bumps.

We don't usually see return air ducts in bedrooms, but when we do have a return duct in the room then our first bet is to cap this duct because we don't want to have the same problem as where the large return duct is located. We want the room to only fill with new air so the warm air is pushing out of the room and through the cracks in windows vs. being sucked out through a return duct where cold air is drawn into the room.

Let some other return duct in another room make up for the return duct in the cold room.

Every year, we get several complaints from elderly people because they have rooms that are cold while others are too hot and there is no way to cure this problem by adjusting the registers. The only solution is to reduce the air movement near the intake register and have the intake air come from outside the house, or from another part of the house where the occupants won't be affected by the colder temperature.

There are times you have to have an intake register in a room and times when the register creates problems. I don't believe for one minute that the problem is related to insulation or any other problem.

If there is not an intake duct in the cold room then you want to make sure that there is sufficient space underneath the bedroom door so the new air pushed into the room can get outside the room. For some jobs, we cut 1-1/2 to 2 inches of the bottom of the door, installed louvers in the door, installed louvers in the plaster wall above the door, and installed louvers in the bedroom wall to another room.


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## pappagor (Jan 29, 2008)

in cold weather states you need cold air return in all rooms but bath and kitchen :whistling
check the cant for heat loss


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## pcplumber (Oct 12, 2008)

pappagor said:


> in cold weather states you need cold air return in all rooms but bath and kitchen :whistling
> check the cant for heat loss


I would never ever install an FAU in a cold state. I was born in Massachusetts in 1950, installed boilers and hydronic systems starting when I was 15 and never saw one house with a FAU. We had a very high percent of gravity furnaces and they made more sense that FAU''s because the gravity furnaces did not create the problems caused by FAU intake drafts.

My favorite heat system was a pot-belly stove installed in a basement. My parents threw two logs in the furnace that burned for several hours and they made holes in the floors so the heat could rise into the living portion of the house. When burning oil they paid about $150 per month and they always got their wood for free (another long story). They had the wood burning stove for about 20 years, but my father installed the stove in what he thought was a second pipe in a chimney that was intended for the stove in the basement. End of the story...the house burned to the ground and he didn't have insurance. I had just moved to California when the fire occurred and I went back to Massachusetts and rebuilt the house for my parents (I'm still a nice guy).


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## Railman (Jan 19, 2008)

pcplumber said:


> We don't usually see return air ducts in bedrooms, but when we do have a return duct in the room then our first bet is to cap this duct because we don't want to have the same problem as where the large return duct is located. We want the room to only fill with new air so the warm air is pushing out of the room and through the cracks in windows vs. being sucked out through a return duct where cold air is drawn into the room.
> 
> Let some other return duct in another room make up for the return duct in the cold room.
> 
> ...


 This logic totaly escapes me!
What you are suggesting is that by increasing the backpressure on the supply, it's going to increase air flow? In addition, you are saying to reduce return air in room, so that you draw cold air from cracks & crevices? 

Most likely problem is the 3 ext/cold walls, along with a cold ceiling. That isn't normal, or average in a home. If you have 120' supply air, you just need more of it. Adding return air will do that, adding a supply booster will do that. Reducing return air will lessen supply air, not increase it! 
Three cold walls needs more supply.

Joe


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## Railman (Jan 19, 2008)

After re-reading PC's above post, I think I get what he's saying. He's basically saying to create a positive pressure within the colder room, so as to force cold room air outward, as leaking room air to the exterior of room. A booster would do that, reducing return air, probably not.

I like do something similar with my pc's so as to keep dust out. I just add a filtered pressure fan so that the case interior is at a higher pressure than outside. That way, only filtered air enters the case. My pc's tend to fill with dog hair, & dust! 

Lead paint remediation companies do the same in reverse by lowering the contaminated enclosed room/rooms by drawing air out, & filtering output air to atmosphere.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

I suspect PC is onto something. Three of four exterrior walls do not help. Ceiling supply, with a ceiling return about 12' from each other doesn't help. Baby's door is usually closed doesn't help.Probably should make a return chase, low on the interrior wall, and close off the high return. Don't know if this was mentioned, there is a nice size return grill just outside of said bedroom. No major heat leakage (infra red thermometer, and a delightful patchouli smoke test).


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## beenthere (Mar 5, 2009)

Is the furnace over sized and short cycling.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Would not be surprised, if that is the case. They installed a three ton coil, so, I will assume that there was a three ton a/c. At least around here, there aren't any furnaces less than 70k btuh. that have a three ton blower. I seriously doubt they changed the orifices, and, although I did not perform a man J, but, doubt the space needed a 70k (80%) furnace (or 56k output).

Good question. Man, do you moon light as a lawyer or something.


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## beenthere (Mar 5, 2009)

Uneven heat in a house is common on grossly over sized units.


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