# A thread on sales



## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

You: "well hello"

Customer: "hi, are you ***** painting?"

You: "Yes how are you doing today?"

Customer: "Oh... good, my kids are a bunch of ******"

You: "So, yeah, this looks like it needs to be painted, it seems to be rotting!"

Customer: "Oh yeah, we have been putting this off since..... is it really that bad?"

You: "Yeah, do you see those boards up there?, it's pretty bad"

Customer: "Oh I never saw that....."

You: "why don't we go inside...."


Now inside is when you pull out the ipad, with self made videos on it, that work on your own sales approach, while you measure, and throw subliminal words out for the closure.


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

Imagine once inside, all measurements are done, the video is over, and now her mind is slowing up.... you've wated about an hour of time so far. Sounds strange, yet now you talk colors, and bring out a full fandex of a thousand colors. Next you're talking which color samples to bring over, then how different paints compare...

She is about ready to throw you out of there, yet she is already sold. 

You finally write a number, much larger than you normally charge on a sheet, and slide it her way, and another piece of paper with who the check will be made out to. 

She says, I need to first talk to my mate to decide on this.


You: Change the subject, and continue on about colors and how inspiring they are

Customer: Oh yeah, but I can never decide....

You: well let's narrow it down and choose 2 colors you like.....

Customer: Well I reallly like these...

You: Okay I will order these through my paint rep and we should get them within two days...

Customer: Oh okay....

You: I just need a deposit to get this ordered and everything in place....

SOLD!


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## thomasjmarino (May 1, 2011)

Am I taking a course in script writing? :confused1:


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

How about instead of psyching someone into a purchase they're not ready for, just do quality work and let the referrals do your selling for you? :whistling:


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## thomasjmarino (May 1, 2011)

Tinstaafl said:


> How about instead of psyching someone into a purchase they're not ready for, just do quality work and let the referrals do your selling for you? :whistling:


I don't know, Tin.
Maybe his niche is writing scripts to use to sell jobs.
Maybe he can start writing scripts and selling them to the rest of us. :blink:


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## WildWill (Jun 6, 2008)

I've always had success using the Jedi Mind trick.


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## SuperiorHIP (Aug 15, 2010)

WildWill said:


> I've always had success using the Jedi Mind trick.


"These are the colors you are looking for...."
:laughing:


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## Terrorron (Nov 7, 2008)

Good workmanship and a strong personality are the sales tools that keep me working.

In my own personal experience, if you're generating_ a never ending stream of happy customers_, then your phone never stops ringing...

Or something like that...

I don't own an "Ipood"...nor do I want/need one.

Things are different up here in Alberta however, and I do recognize that fact...

Good luck to you and your plan.


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

SuperiorHIP said:


> "These are the colors you are looking for...."
> :laughing:


I'm not sure if telling the woman on interior, "These are the colors....

Outside, on the other hand, "Let's go with a match, looks great


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Florida11 said:


> Imagine once inside, all measurements are done, the video is over, and now her mind is slowing up.... you've wated about an hour of time so far. Sounds strange, yet now you talk colors, and bring out a full fandex of a thousand colors. Next you're talking which color samples to bring over, then how different paints compare...
> 
> She is about ready to throw you out of there, yet she is already sold.
> 
> ...


That is why you had to move to another state. Thats some kirby vacuum crap. And oh yeah what tins said.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Florida11 said:


> Imagine once inside, all measurements are done, the video is over, and now her mind is slowing up.... you've wated about an hour of time so far. Sounds strange, yet now you talk colors, and bring out a full fandex of a thousand colors. Next you're talking which color samples to bring over, then how different paints compare...
> 
> She is about ready to throw you out of there, yet she is already sold.
> 
> ...


Maybe that was harsh but first of all I do not think she will be watching your beloved video but instead tending to the kids. You will have better success with low pressure high quality sales. Try including the video in your emailed eztimate if you want.


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> Maybe that was harsh but first of all I do not think she will be watching your beloved video but instead tending to the kids. You will have better success with low pressure high quality sales. Try including the video in your emailed eztimate if you want.


Well, we agree to disagree possibly, I'm not really sure at this point. What I will say is that people react to different people very different.

For example, if a salesman is very easy to read, a customer prospect is very likely to either be turned off or on right away. A salesman that may not be so easy to read, is greeted with diffent types, or very similar types of gestures and convo. 

Customers today are very sharp, they have read many things on negotiating, and today nothing is full price as they say.


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## rselectric1 (Sep 20, 2009)

Mitch, the strategy you described is called "closing" in sales lingo. It's posing a question that does not have an available answer of "no". Example, would you like us to start Tuesday or Wednesday.

It's old, high pressure, and anyone who tries to close on me gets their arse handed to them. (I do use it on my kid though :laughing

But is does seem to work sometimes apparently. Around here, high pressure window salesmen are the worst offenders. (Yes offenders)

I lay it all out and don't rely on "sales techniques". With a more educated, high end consumer (both), it may not be effective since when I come in after them on a sales call, they usually complain about the last guy who tried this.

Just my 2 pennies based on my experiences.


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

rselectric1 said:


> Mitch, the strategy you described is called "closing" in sales lingo. It's posing a question that does not have an available answer of "no". Example, would you like us to start Tuesday or Wednesday.
> 
> It's old, high pressure, and anyone who tries to close on me gets their arse handed to them. (I do use it on my kid though :laughing
> 
> ...


Great post RS! I know what you're saying in this thread, you really spelled it out. This is one of my personal techniques that for some reason really works for me, but I agree we should keep the sales techniques out.

So many techniques, which to choose, but it may help some. There are some other techniques I want to post too... :thumbsup:


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

I just re-read that thread, and I meant there are a few other basic techniques I want to bring up, but that nobody should use a specific, but to find what works.


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

Something someone else mentioned in this thread, was that the Ho may not watch my video, but instead tend to her kids...

If the kids are unrully, it's possible, but let me say that about 3 weeks ago, I had a customer(a lady) who was in a new vehicle, and was being a bit picky about some things. I ended up changing the subject to my new IPhone, after asking her what phone she uses. She ended up being sold on both, the Iphone is her business though. Yet I used a diversion to keep things moving along.

That may be a similar technique as I described above, so I will add another.

Show up to the house I am estimating, and I don't even care about it, all I care about is the Homeowner I am talking to. Small talk all day long, and I'm controlling it, not them. Then the conversation gets very deep, and then I pull it back, they follow, and then I go in for a casual, soft sell.


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## Steve Richards (Mar 7, 2006)

Florida11 said:


> If the kids are unrully, it's possible, but let me say that about 3 weeks ago, I had a customer(a lady) who was in a new vehicle, and was being a bit picky about some things. I ended up changing the subject to my new IPhone, after asking her what phone she uses. She ended up being sold on both, the Iphone is her business though. Yet I used a diversion to keep things moving along.


I usually save my diversionary tactics until the end..right before they start writing the check.

if they say "a couple things I wanted to point out"

I'll come back with, "so, how do you stay in such good shape?" (she'll start "blah blah blah")..then I'll come back with: "oh I'm sorry, what were you saying...oh yes...you were about to write a check"


But anyhow..very nice, Mitch.

I for one hope the PT mods will come in here and see this..and then realize what an asset you were (and could be again) to PT.

But by now, you've probably decided ta hellw/them, and I don't blame you.


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## DeanV (Feb 20, 2006)

Steve Richards said:


> I usually save my diversionary tactics until the end..right before they start writing the check.
> 
> if they say "a couple things I wanted to point out"
> 
> ...


Taking notes and adding to your PT file.:whistling


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

Sometimes having a nice ego, works too, depending on the behavior of the customer. Not an above reproach attitude but something in which you become their educator, their teacher, in a nice but direct way along the way. Most HO's don't know much of anything involved in their home. They watched an hgtv episode and see these ho's running these nice contractor actors, and they believe they are better than you. 

If you let them believe they are, they see you as nothing. 

A little psychology can turn this around, such as another poster called it "The Jedi Mind Trick". You must stay at or a bit above their level in conversation. Say they have a lower price or know another contractor already... well they called you because they don't and even if they did they don't trust that other guy now because you are now showing real confidence and intrigue. It's really not even about money. Trust is good but confidence is the key.


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## CompleteW&D (May 28, 2011)

> It's really not even about money. Trust is good but confidence is the key.


It's ALWAYS about the money. If you've done your job, explained everything in details that they understand, filled their wants and needs and presented them a value for the dollar you're asking them to spend.... that's when you close the sale. The trust and confidence factor is gained or lost in the first five minutes most of the time. 

In the end, if it's not affordable for them or fits into their monthly budget, you're not going to sell a thing whether they trust you or not. So it's ALWAYS about the money.


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

CompleteW&D said:


> It's ALWAYS about the money. If you've done your job, explained everything in details that they understand, filled their wants and needs and presented them a value for the dollar you're asking them to spend.... that's when you close the sale. The trust and confidence factor is gained or lost in the first five minutes most of the time.
> 
> In the end, if it's not affordable for them or fits into their monthly budget, you're not going to sell a thing whether they trust you or not. So it's ALWAYS about the money.


Well, I used to believe that, and customers will make you always feel the pressure of "how much", we're looking to spend "very little". Of course they are and say that, it's how they protect themselves, by playing that act on the sales stage when you arrive. For example the most well off people, are the cheapest and "refuse to be sold", they behave as "shoppers". That's called acting. 

A salesman is an actor too. 

What these people or actors too, I should say are doing, is acting out their part, and openly admitting they have yet to be sold.

That is where the confidence, and "come with me" part comes in. Again...

Technology
Confidence
Jedi Mind Tricks

BTW, we aren't in here to just repeat the mantra of what we all are hearing out there on the streets are we? I thought we're here together to gain a sharp edge on profits and revenues. The bottom line


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

A good test to see if you have honed your sales skills, or selling yourself skills, is to perform a test on a total stranger. Start talking to the person, if that person begins to leave or have to go... continue talking and see how long you can keep that person's attention in a good way.

When you conquered this, you decide when to leave. If that other person is still the one to leave or walk away, well, that's a customer saying "no deal".


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## CompleteW&D (May 28, 2011)

> Well, I used to believe that, and customers will make you always feel the pressure of "how much", we're looking to spend "very little". Of course they are and say that, it's how they protect themselves, by playing that act on the sales stage when you arrive. For example the most well off people, are the cheapest and "refuse to be sold", they behave as "shoppers". That's called acting.


Look, you're welcome to believe what you want.... it's your thread. But I close over 50% of every sales call I run on the first visit. Nearly 70% of all my sales calls and when I worked for a company that had a nice showroom, over 83%. I don't do it because of Jedi mind tricks or holywood acting shennanigans. 

I close because I am brutally honest with folks, I educate them and I DON'T play control games (didn't that Tin Man mentality go out in the 80's?), I ask good questions and most importantly.... _*LISTEN*_. Many sales people are so in love with their own voice and their gamesmanship, that they can't get out of their own way and yap right through a close opportunity.

Often times, when I ask a client why they purchased from me rather than someone else, I get comments like.... "You didn't try and BS us like the other guy, You know your stuff, You were a lot more thorough about the details, you were able to make the project affordable (not necessarily by reduced pricing, but often times by restructuring their timeline and doing it in phases), we trusted you, because we felt you were honest" etc. 

I used to keep a journal and write down those comments. I'm gonna have to dig that thing up and find some of the more surprising responses I've gotten over the years.


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

CompleteW&D said:


> Look, you're welcome to believe what you want.... it's your thread. But I close over 50% of every sales call I run on the first visit. Nearly 70% of all my sales calls and when I worked for a company that had a nice showroom, over 83%. I don't do it because of Jedi mind tricks or holywood acting shennanigans.
> 
> I close because I am brutally honest with folks, I educate them and I DON'T play control games (didn't that Tin Man mentality go out in the 80's?), I ask good questions and most importantly.... _*LISTEN*_. Many sales people are so in love with their own voice and their gamesmanship, that they can't get out of their own way and yap right through a close opportunity.
> 
> ...


I bet you are great, I'm not saying you aren't, what I'm talking about is upping sales prices/profits and turning more sales into SOLD

The last thing I would want to hear or be is one of those sales guys who bs and like their own voice. That's the 70's, were in 2011. 

Hey I really love to sell, and watch people's faces turn to smiles, and have alot of fun while were doing a transaction. Get's the adrenilum kicking into high gear and then after some time of success I often think what can I do better, or how can I look at these sales with a new perspective that may up the ante.

As in Vegas, when your sitting at that blackjack table, wondering should I throw it down now, or should I hold back on this next one... These are the types that end up going home early. You ever remember those times you go and your instincts are on fire? When you just know when to throw it all down, and you have the managers sitting around thinking you're counting cards? Just an example of instincts vs. the mind and repetition...

New Perspective and outlook should be added to the list too


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## CarrPainting (Jun 29, 2010)

around these parts, alot of my clients have a hard time working the tv remote... I cant even imagine the nightmare if they made a 'pop up window' appear on the screen on an ipad by accident... the whole 'oh my god i broke it!' line of events come to mind.

Technology is good if presented in a professional manner to the right person. However, as people of trades, from my own experience, fellow contractors are lucky to be able to work thier iphone/android and half the time end up asking some kid to 'fix it' LOL

Point is, in many parts of the country, the technology hasnt caught up with the rest of the trades. Also, alot of tradesmen are absolutely fantastic at their trade, but fly by the seat of their pants in the business end of it... And some are REALLY successful at this. Now you want to add in confusing tech thats expensive and difficult to use?

Unless you are EXTREMELY comfortable with the technology, why would you risk it on selling the job?

give them your URL and your facebook address, and leave it at that. Though a 3 ring binder of pictures, never hurts.

Point is, if you drop your 3 ring binder on their marble floor, no harm no foul. Drop that $600 ipad, and then the awkward moment of needing a broom and dust pan arises.


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## artiospainting (Mar 16, 2011)

you put to much into it. the more you talk the more you loose. by the time you land the job they got you chasing a carrot. florida is tuff.


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

artiospainting said:


> you put to much into it. the more you talk the more you loose. by the time you land the job they got you chasing a carrot. florida is tuff.


This isn't just about Florida, it's about much more to do with the big picture. Listening is key to sales no doubt, but learning to give a professional presentation will leave many customers speechless and asking to do business.


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## VinylHanger (Jul 14, 2011)

You seem to think that customers are morons and you can talk above them and meld them to your will. Maybe so, but in the end they will resent it.

I used to sub for a company who had a guy who did these kinds of tricks. When I would show up, the customers would have nothing but nasty things to say about him. I would spend the entire job babysitting and hand holding them in order to make a positive impression for the company. Why did they go with him? Because it was during the run up to the housing boom and during the housing boom. They would go with whoever could show up and start.

The same company had a guy who sold rings around the first guy. How did he do it? He talked to the customers, sometimes for hours about there cat or college football. He got to know them and they got to know him. He sold a ton of work and the customers loved him. Did he have his tricks? Most definitely, but not one of them was about talking above the customer or pressuring them into buying. It was about respect. He made millions and never had to swing a hammer. I have put some of his "tricks" to use and they work very well and I can sleep at night.

We have a few companies around here that try and push customers. One can usually take the work from them and still charge more if you treat them right. They just want to feel like you care and that they can trust you to watch out for them. That isn't trickery, that is just being a good contractor/salesman.

I am assuming you are telling us about the tricks you don't really use, because the way you tell it, the secret is to be an ass and most customers see through that whether they tell you or not.

If your sales technique is really being an ass, most people aren't proud of that.


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

What choo talkin bout foo? I agree with your post on pushy salesman, I can't stand them or aggressive sales tactics, if that' why you are getting at. I'm talking about being yourself, along with presenting a nice professional over the top presentation.

Not like you will have a power point and all that bs. 

I'm talking about sort of what you said, talking about their cat, being friendly, having fun. Just adding in some sub-consious things here and there.

Example: Say after you are greeting them and listening and just setting up that good first impression of friendliness.. You say let me go get another look, while I do that... here is some work we did down the street on Mrs. Jones house (Ipad video).. While he or she is looking at that you are doing your thing for a few minutes, coming back in after say 5 minutes, of them soakin in that awesome visual and audio of the right stuff that will stick in their mind like glue.

I don't know how you can disagree with that... it's just more positiveness all the way around, and more sales bottom line.




VinylHanger said:


> You seem to think that customers are morons and you can talk above them and meld them to your will. Maybe so, but in the end they will resent it.
> 
> I used to sub for a company who had a guy who did these kinds of tricks. When I would show up, the customers would have nothing but nasty things to say about him. I would spend the entire job babysitting and hand holding them in order to make a positive impression for the company. Why did they go with him? Because it was during the run up to the housing boom and during the housing boom. They would go with whoever could show up and start.
> 
> ...


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

Another part of sales that is desperately missing today by most, is humor mixed in with competence. Get a mix of both of those, and you know the people will eat that up, and you will stand out from the competition who can be lacking personality and competence or even humorly frienliness.

Human to human sales.


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

First let's clear something up. I don't know you at all aside from a few posts I've read recently. If I did, I might have a different understanding of what you are trying to say.

Secondly, I understand you are addressing painters. But it's an open forum and remodelers might read your advice also. That's where I get worried.



Florida11 said:


> You: "why don't we go inside...."
> 
> 
> Now inside is when you pull out the ipad, with self made videos on it, that work on your own sales approach, while you measure, and *throw subliminal words out for the closure*.


Is that some Jedi Mind Sales Technique? Body language will convey much more than the tongue, so relying on some obscure form of mind control using magic words probably isn't going to make the sale. 



Florida11 said:


> She is about ready to throw you out of there, yet she is already sold.


This may make a good movie scene, but this is life. If she is ready to throw you out it's safe to say the sale has already left the building.



Florida11 said:


> You finally write a number, much larger than you normally charge on a sheet, and slide it her way, and another piece of paper with who the check will be made out to.


Another movie scene perhaps. Personally I would not recommend this method of delivering a quote. My experience has been to close a number of deals at a higher price than the guy that writes a number on a note pad. 



Florida11 said:


> She says, I need to first talk to my mate to decide on this.
> 
> 
> You: Change the subject, and continue on about colors and how inspiring they are
> ...


I can't quote everything you wrote, but I'm pretty sure somewhere in there you mentioned the importance of listening to the prospect. Then you throw out the above? I think you need to make up your mind about what you believe. 



Florida11 said:


> What choo talkin bout foo? I agree with your post on pushy salesman, *I can't stand them or aggressive sales tactics,* if that' why you are getting at. I'm talking about being yourself, along with presenting a nice professional over the top presentation.


As described in your meandering techniques, you are them. 

You also say things like be yourself, be honest, be confident. Hit those notes solid and you will sell without mind control trickery or the need to remember scripts.

Again, I may be reading you completely wrong. But it's safe to say you are not selling me on your advice. 

Good Luck
Dave


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

DavidC, I guess I'm trying to convey something that I've learned over the years, with something I've learned of recently. Two different industries, yet very different approaches. The mind may be able to smell a salesman when one sees one, yet it cannot comprehend something it does not recognize. 

An unrecognized salesman is a the best salesman.


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## moorewarner (May 29, 2009)

Florida11 said:


> DavidC, I guess I'm trying to convey something that I've learned over the years, with something I've learned of recently. Two different industries, yet very different approaches. *The mind may be able to smell a salesman when one sees one, yet it cannot comprehend something it does not recognize.
> 
> An unrecognized salesman is a the best salesman.*


I... have no idea what you are talking about.

 I think I will just concentrate on being a good craftsman and an open, honest, knowledgeable/informative, and helpful guy.

Let my work sell, yea, that's the ticket.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

While I've already given my opinion in this thread, it just dawned on me (duh!) that it really has little at all to do with painting. It's about sales, IOW, business.

Therefore, I'm moving the thread to Business.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

That is some crazy **** my friend. What are you doing outside their house with out being called in the first place??? Just chilling? Or rolling around looking for house wives watering their gardens to hit up about painting their house??? 

I have more efficient ways of spending my time, like quality control, which gets referrals which keeps me from having to make videos. Network at your HBA or Chamber or Rotary. Or maybe the Lawn and Garden Club or something where the house wives are hanging.....

No offense intended, just seems a little pushy to me.


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## Florida11 (Dec 22, 2010)

jawtrs said:


> That is some crazy **** my friend. What are you doing outside their house with out being called in the first place??? Just chilling? Or rolling around looking for house wives watering their gardens to hit up about painting their house???
> 
> I have more efficient ways of spending my time, like quality control, which gets referrals which keeps me from having to make videos. Network at your HBA or Chamber or Rotary. Or maybe the Lawn and Garden Club or something where the house wives are hanging.....
> 
> No offense intended, just seems a little pushy to me.


Were talkin about doing sales, and going to their home when they call.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Florida11 said:


> Were talkin about doing sales, and going to their home when they call.


Thanks for clearing that up, I took your first post to mean you happen to see a lady key outside her home and strike up a conversation


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## john elliott (Oct 23, 2005)

jawtrs said:


> Thanks for clearing that up, I took your first post to mean you happen to see a lady key outside her home and strike up a conversation


That's what I thought he meant too, of that someone had called him and when he answered he just said 'hello' without identifying himself, because she then has to ask him if he is ?? Painting.


I wonder what sort of people he sells to though, that can't see through all that


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## KennMacMoragh (Sep 16, 2008)

rselectric1 said:


> Mitch, the strategy you described is called "closing" in sales lingo. It's posing a question that does not have an available answer of "no". Example, would you like us to start Tuesday or Wednesday.


I've heard that before too, I can still say no to that though, "No, I don't want you to start". When I think of sales, I try to focus more on what I can offer them instead of trying to psych them into it. If I do a lot of preparation, for example in the form of presentation packets I will include a folder with warranty, license and insurance info. And I will try and think of three different solutions I can offer to fit their needs. Ask them questions, figure out what they want. I still have a lot to learn about sales I realize, but the key is preparation.


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