# Timber SIL rotting in 3-5 years



## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

http://theadvocate.com/news/neworleans/neworleansnews/7899967-123/innovative-wood-product-used-in


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

Kind of goes back to the discussion we were having in that other thread. Perfect example of a product that did not live up to the expectations.


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

EricBrancard said:


> Kind of goes back to the discussion we were having in that other thread. Perfect example of a product that did not live up to the expectations.






You got it !:thumbsup: Very astute observation,was exactly the gist of the post !


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

Funny thing is... It's wood...


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## Deckhead (Dec 9, 2010)

RobertCDF said:


> Funny thing is... It's wood...


"innovative glass-infused wood that was used in some of the homes’ outdoor" which is definitely different than innovative wood infused plastic.

:jester: Sorry Rob had to do it.


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

Deckhead said:


> "innovative glass-infused wood that was used in some of the homes&#146; outdoor" which is definitely different than innovative wood infused plastic.
> 
> :jester: Sorry Rob had to do it.


Huge difference. Unless of course you don't actually know the product being discussed... timbersil is wood that is then glass infused, not sawdust and plastic melted together and extruded.


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

RobertCDF said:


> Funny thing is... It's wood...





Does that infer that all new products except wood are immune from problems ?


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

fjn said:


> Does that infer that all new products except wood are immune from problems ?


No. I just said it was funny.


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## Deckhead (Dec 9, 2010)

RobertCDF said:


> No. I just said it was funny.


I had to mess with you a bit Rob... Plenty of respect for what you do and how you go about it. I'm sure you've done more research on what you're using than I've done on what I'm not.

A lot of you composite guys are big players, I'm definitely not, I only do a small amount of big projects for a small base of clientele and they all really only want wood. Its probably pretty safe to say that capstock is here to stay, though not so sure about the PVC for decking, ceilings:thumbup: decking :no: not so sure.

I think we all know there's more than one high end material and specialists for high end jobs will always say theirs is the best, and should.

Back to the topic, I don't even see the theory behind infusing pine with glass. Why not just use cypress??? They're in Louisiana for Gods sake.


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

Deckhead said:


> Back to the topic, I don't even see the theory behind infusing pine with glass. Why not just use cypress??? They're in Louisiana for Gods sake.


 :thumbsup::thumbsup:



That would make too much sense.:laughing:


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## Birch (Jul 20, 2009)

fjn said:


> You got it !:thumbsup: Very astute observation,was exactly the gist of the post !


One might think that would be enough to halt production of such stuff. I don't think glass infused compost has a future either. 

"Just because they make it, doesn't mean it works." :no:


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

Birch said:


> One might think that would be enough to halt production of such stuff. I don't think glass infused compost has a future either.
> 
> "Just because they make it, doesn't mean it works." :no:


I'm so glad that a failure or setback didn't discourage most inventors, I don't think we'd have anything if people gave up after a failure. Pretty sure the Wright brothers didn't fly the first time, (or the 2nd time, etc) thank goodness they didn't have your "give up" mentality.


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## Birch (Jul 20, 2009)

RobertCDF said:


> I'm so glad that a failure or setback didn't discourage most inventors, I don't think we'd have anything if people gave up after a failure. Pretty sure the Wright brothers didn't fly the first time, (or the 2nd time, etc) thank goodness they didn't have your "give up" mentality.


 
Cram it dude!

Thankfully, the Wright Brothers were the guinea pigs of their own pioneering. And your comparison, pretty ridiculous. Gas infused Verbal Compost.


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

RobertCDF said:


> I'm so glad that a failure or setback didn't discourage most inventors, I don't think we'd have anything if people gave up after a failure. Pretty sure the Wright brothers didn't fly the first time, (or the 2nd time, etc) thank goodness they didn't have your "give up" mentality.





This "logic" is nothing more than an attempt to deflect the real issue. We are not talking about stymieing inventors in their a efforts to produce new inventions / products ; we are talking about companies putting untested products on the market.

The Wright brothers were not interviewing flight attendants at Kitty Hawk.


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

fjn said:


> ...untested products...


Yea, I bet they just made it and sold it... ignorant comment. 
Was it tested in EVERY environment? No, but there rarely is a product tested in EVERY environment. I've heard about this material for years and the only complaints come from New Orleans and new Hampshire... could be working great in other environments.


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

And the new Hampshire complaint is " paint doesn't stick to it".


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

RobertCDF said:


> Was it tested in EVERY environment? No, but there rarely is a product tested in EVERY environment. .





Well,if you don't test it in every environment,maybe they should not sell it in every environment . Ever think of that ?


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

fjn said:


> Well,if you don't test it in every environment,maybe they should not sell it in every environment . Ever think of that ?


That would be a better idea than your original suggestion, remember how you want them to stop production completely. 

That's why you work with established, reputable, knowledgeable specialists, they'll know more about products and what products will perform to the expectations of the customer. I don't know all the back story here, nor do I care but I'll venture a guess that the decision to use this product was decided by someone in an office in another state with virtually no input from a local professional.


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

RobertCDF said:


> That would be a better idea than your original suggestion, remember how you want them to stop production completely.





No,I do not remember that at all,was not me,was someone else.Reread the thread.


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

fjn said:


> No,I do not remember that at all,was not me,was someone else.Reread the thread.


Oh you're right you just thanked it, so I assumed you were agreeing with the post. How silly of me to assume that's what the "thanks" are usually used for.


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

fjn said:


> No,I do not remember that at all,was not me,was someone else.Reread the thread.


Wow... now you "un-thanked" it. At least be a man and not change your position.


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## TimelessQuality (Sep 23, 2007)

RobertCDF said:


> Wow... now you "un-thanked" it. At least be a man and not change your position.


We need a way to unthank a post without thanking it first...


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## Deckhead (Dec 9, 2010)

RobertCDF said:


> Wow... now you "un-thanked" it. At least be a man and not change your position.


Bad day? I can't say I believe anybody who says they can make a lasting treatment with nothing but "green" materials, kinda like those people who try to tell you this veggie burger is delicious.


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## jstanton (Mar 25, 2012)

I did a customers deck 5 years ago, per architects request. I have already replaced deck boards. Some of the joist have rotted an inch or so down. Stuff is junk and it weathers worse than p.t.


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

jstanton said:


> I did a customers deck 5 years ago, per architects request. I have already replaced deck boards. Some of the joist have rotted an inch or so down. Stuff is junk and it weathers worse than p.t.


Interesting to know, where was this project? What kind of exposure does it get?

I don't care about the product, never used it and never would. But it's funny how ignorant some people can get.


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

Deckhead said:


> Bad day? I can't say I believe anybody who says they can make a lasting treatment with nothing but "green" materials, kinda like those people who try to tell you this veggie burger is delicious.


I think I made my point clear, every environment is different and each material will react differently to those different environments. That's why it's critical to work with someone knowledgeable and experienced with YOUR local environment and the products that have proven themselves in that environment. Anyone who doesn't realize this is just fooling themselves.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

I can remember you sending me a picture of regular untreated beams that rotted out in like 3 years. I made a comment that it probably took 20 years to rot like that. But in reality here in Southern Cal it probably would take 20 years to rot out like the pic you showed. But other places are a different story. Geographical location is probably the biggest factor in determining which material is right or wrong to use.


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## Deckhead (Dec 9, 2010)

RobertCDF said:


> I think I made my point clear, every environment is different and each material will react differently to those different environments. That's why it's critical to work with someone knowledgeable and experienced with YOUR local environment and the products that have proven themselves in that environment. Anyone who doesn't realize this is just fooling themselves.


I think you and I agree 100% for the first time. 

Satan just got in snowball fight!


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

Deckhead said:


> I think you and I agree 100% for the first time.
> 
> Satan just got in snowball fight!


It's rare, but it happens. 

I learned this a number of years back and if someone goes and reads my posts and really looks at them you'll see that I've often referred to "my environment" or "your environment might be different". I really try to clarify this as much as possible because it's the biggest reality that gets ignored. 

In this particular situation (the homes in NO built by the charity) the decision to use this product was likely spec'd by someone in an office and if a local specialized contractor had been consulted the product selections may have been different.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Exactly, if you have a mold problem in Washington State on a certain material, I may never see it here in dry, sunny, Southern California.


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## Birch (Jul 20, 2009)

RobertCDF said:


> I think I made my point clear, every environment is different and each material will react differently to those different environments. That's why it's critical to work with someone knowledgeable and experienced with YOUR local environment and the products that have proven themselves in that environment. Anyone who doesn't realize this is just fooling themselves.


After reading the installation instructions, I would not use it. To many do's, don'ts, and precautions. The only environmental precautions were sealing it in freeze prone environments and Do Not Store in direct sunlight, . . .even distribution of water, away from water, etc. Read for yourself, http://timbersilwood.com/, Sounds like a Litigation prone environment?

"Safe to grind up and use as mulch." (MY favorite " . . .") Definitely Green. 

amorphous definition

TimberSIL Rotting . . .

You can use it if you want. Let us know how you like it after you do.


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

I never said I wanted to use it. When is a manufacture going to limit their sales area by saying "don't use in the southern states of north America"? 

You're not hearing what I'm saying so let me try again. "Don't believe manufactures, sales reps, distributors, etc. Trust the guy that has hands on experience local to the project". 

Every manufacture out there believes they have the best product in the world, their reps and sales people are just trying to convince you to believe them. Don't believe hype, trust proven experience.


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## Deckhead (Dec 9, 2010)

RobertCDF said:


> I never said I wanted to use it. When is a manufacture going to limit their sales area by saying "don't use in the southern states of north America"?
> 
> You're not hearing what I'm saying so let me try again. "Don't believe manufactures, sales reps, distributors, etc. Trust the guy that has hands on experience local to the project".
> 
> Every manufacture out there believes they have the best product in the world, their reps and sales people are just trying to convince you to believe them. Don't believe hype, trust proven experience.


Wow, we even sound the same
... 

What the hell is the world coming to? A wood guy guy who frames and finishes with wood is directly on the same page with a metal frame guy who finishes in plastic.

Quick say something about wood sucks so we can make the world normal again and start arguing.

Actually I think about how many jobs I don't take because of the plastic rage and know there's a market for it, but glass infused wood:no:

Hey to each their own but like Rob said :blink: why not ask a local professional first?


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

Deckhead said:


> Wow, we even sound the same
> ...
> 
> What the hell is the world coming to? A wood guy guy who frames and finishes with wood is directly on the same page with a metal frame guy who finishes in plastic.
> ...


Wood sucks...





Unless of course it works great in your environment... 

But wood frames still suck no matter what.


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