# buyer beware? How about contractor beware!



## outlaw (Jan 7, 2009)

Every day you hear about contractors ripping off customers. What about contractors getting ripped off by customers?

You are always told to carefully screen a contractor before hiring (which I totally agree with), but what about us? They got the BBB, What do we have?

Case-in -point
I have two customers that live directly across the street from each other.
Both vinyl siding jobs. One calls me out on a call-back. His siding is cracking. I go and look. Of course the siding isn't cracking, its been beaten up with the weed wacker. I asked him what he thought the problem was. He doesn't know. I asked him who does the lawn matenience. Well, he does. Now I calmly tell him he has caused this problem hisself and I will fix it-for a price. "naw, thats OK, I'll just live with it".

The guy across the street calls me. His siding is buckling. I go and look. Well, the grill is sitting about two feet away and there is no denying that he melted his own siding. He will not admit to it at first. He tells me I am a bad contractor for not fixing it. I tell him he is lying and make him feel about as low as possible. He says that he is in the Navy and he will let everybody he knows that I'm a crook. I say that anybody that knows him and still trusts his opinion is not the type of person that I would like to work for anyhow.

Where do these people come from. I would never buy something, tear it up, and then expect the seller to fix it for nothing!


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## Mellison (Aug 3, 2008)

Some people are $cum Bag$!


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## ribuilder (Jan 10, 2009)

Well, theres just no winning with some people. I've had to swallow my pride and do some stuff for free before just to go the extra mile and be a nice guy. Did it help? Well, I dont have any bad relationships with people I did work for. I see your point though..if we had to fix everything like you mentioned...we could get suckered in to being a 24/7 free maintanence guy Catch 22 sometimes


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## Jason Whipple (Dec 22, 2007)

outlaw said:


> Every day you hear about contractors ripping off customers. What about contractors getting ripped off by customers?
> 
> You are always told to carefully screen a contractor before hiring (which I totally agree with), but what about us? They got the BBB, What do we have?
> 
> ...


Thanks for letting me love wood a little more:thumbsup:


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## Meetre (Nov 2, 2007)

perfect example of why you should have a written warranty on your work. cover what is and isn't covered, and be open ended about it...ie., list possible problems that you don't cover. then write that it isn't all inclusive. once the expectation is set, you know, they know, you have a great piece of paper to back-up your claims about not covering the problem.


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## MCerminaro (Oct 26, 2007)

Its unfortunate for us, You "the general public" only hear about the contractor horror stories, never the good stories or the millions of home improvements completed by us each year with out a hitch.

We are kind like Pitbulls, you only hear about them if someone is attacked, you never get to hear about all the good ones.


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## Mike Finley (Apr 28, 2004)

It's the big box return mentality. The liberal return policies of major stores have polluted the minds of the public and clouded thier lines that they think they can cross.

Buy a faucet, break something trying to installer, harry homeowner, just stuffs it back in the box and returns it. Anything wrong with it he is asked? Yeah, it's broken, when I opened it up it was broken. Okay, no problem here is another one or do you want you money back?

Return stories of customers are ridiculous if you talk to anybody in retail, women buy shoes for a party and return them the next day. It goes on and on.

The public has muddled in their mind how they cheat the big stores by taking advantage of liberal customer service policies and they assume it will fly with anybody. Make enough noise, deny what's obvious and the company will just bend over to quiet you down. :furious:


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

Jason W said:


> Thanks for letting me love wood a little more:thumbsup:


 
Me Too!!


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## dirt diggler (May 14, 2006)

Jason W said:


> Thanks for letting me love wood a little more:thumbsup:


uh .... :blink: :laughing::laughing:




damned if you didn't set the Dirt Bait on that one - lol


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## Flatrooferstl (Dec 18, 2008)

you really have to be careful who you work for these days


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## ModernStyle (May 7, 2007)

I have an aunt who is like that, she buys new lawn furniture each spring and returns it each fall for a refund. She goes to restraunts and complains about the meal untill it is free, nobody can stand to be around her. I made the mistake of painting the wood trim on her house once, 2 coats of latex is what we agreed on but when I finished she thought there was enough paint left for a 3rd coat and got pissed because I wouldnt apply one for free. It is the mentallity of people these days to expect everything for nothing, to get more then you paid for, and to get pissed when someone tells you no.


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## flippinfool (Jan 6, 2009)

Two warnings always go into all my contracts.
1. Using a grill to close to siding WILL damage your siding.
2. If your landscaper go's behind your bushes with a power pack or any other gas blower on, they will damage your siding.

I've had mutiple call backs for this. Even with the warnings in the contract. Cover yourself and put it writing. I've been paid every time for the repairs. If anyone can add any more I'd love to here it.


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## CHM (Nov 8, 2008)

People will push you as far as you let them.


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## MarkmillerConst (Feb 3, 2009)

I think that our customers try half the games they play just so they can tell their friends how they one-upped their stupid contractor.


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## simplejack (Jan 15, 2009)

*What do you think of these services...?*

I booked marked these sites a a while back: http://www.businessbeware.biz/howitworks.html & http://thecontractorsside.com/ I don't know how it works or *if* it does...just from what I read on the home page.


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## outlaw (Jan 7, 2009)

Jason W said:


> Thanks for letting me love wood a little more:thumbsup:


 
That is what my wife said after our third date:tt2:


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## outlaw (Jan 7, 2009)

I wanted to add that these customers are not directly mine. They bought homes from a builder that I furnish and install roofing and siding for. I have done over 600 homes for this builder in the 8 years and I have seen all types.


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## Max Nomad (Aug 29, 2008)

outlaw said:


> Every day you hear about contractors ripping off customers. What about contractors getting ripped off by customers?
> 
> You are always told to carefully screen a contractor before hiring (which I totally agree with), but what about us? They got the BBB, What do we have?
> 
> ...


Documentation is your Friend.

A Completion of Work certificate (agreement) signed by you and the customer, a bunch of time/date stamped photos of the job itself (preferably from start to finish), and some photos of the problem spot when you've come to inspect it could have shut these jerks up quick -- especially Forrest Gump with the grill. If someone is really going to badmouth you or your work, they're going to do so regardless. If they're using it as a bluff, that documentation will be the evidence you need to stack the odds in your favor if it's time to take it to court.


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## bert0168 (Jan 28, 2008)

outlaw said:


> that is what my wife said after our third date:tt2:



nice!!!


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## HomeGuard (Dec 13, 2007)

I had a estimate for a woman who had choosen the cheapest bid on a deck. The guy had gouged the deck pretty bad with the pressure washer and applied a solid stain in place of semi transparent. She paid him at the end without a walk through and then couldn't reach him after discovering the mistakes. 
So I go out and she cries this story about "being ripped off and how she has all these medical bills, so please give her a good price." I do my estimate and she tries to negotiate. I tell her my price is firm, but she will also get what was promised. She then wants to negotiate the down payment (20%), again siting that she had just been ripped off.(my watch out for this crazy b!tch radar is going off) I tell her that it is standard. And that just as homeowners occationally get ripped off, contractors do as well and at a higher frequency. She then goes with the well don't you trust me?:no::no: I say, " I don't like to make judgements on people after first meeting them"(PC as I could be) . This kind of goes on for a while, almost 2 hrs going no where.

I have an app on my Iphone that will ring in X minutes if I set it.(so I set it). When it rang I excused myself and said this is an emergency. She calls me the next day and says that she really wants me to do the job but I need to give her a discount and lower the deposit. I decline and tell her that I have a busy shcedule and might not be able to get to her for a few months, and that maybe she should look for a differnt contractor. Then the **** flies, she goes into this rant sayinbg she is going to tell all of her neighbors that I do terrible work and ripped her off.:laughing:. I explain that I have worked for multiple people in the neighborhood without complaint and that she is free to say what see wants but I and my lawyer take slander very seriously. 

Basically she thought because I'm a younger guy that she could take me along for a ride. But you have to learn quick in this business who the crazies are.


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## Wolfgang (Nov 16, 2008)

I just go by gut feeling anymore. I used to take every job that came along, and that meant every type of homeowner. About 5 or 6 years ago I finally figured out it wasnt worth the money.

When I first meet a potential client/customer I talk to them without even starting my bid. While they "interview" me, I interview them. I ask alot of questions pertaining to the bid and make my decision to proceed based on their answers and attitudes. Some of them I just tell "I think you should find another contractor". I dont lie to them or BS them. I dont care if the economy takes a major dump, I have no desire to work for people like that.

And did you ever notice that the people who want to pay next to nothing want everything for nothing? "While you're doing that, can you do this?", at no extra charge of course. And as always they're the ones who are never satisfied. Aint worth it.

Life's a ***** and misery is optional.


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## Heritage (Mar 20, 2007)

Wolfgang said:


> I just go by gut feeling anymore. I used to take every job that came along, and that meant every type of homeowner. About 5 or 6 years ago I finally figured out it wasnt worth the money.
> 
> When I first meet a potential client/customer I talk to them without even starting my bid. While they "interview" me, I interview them. I ask alot of questions pertaining to the bid and make my decision to proceed based on their answers and attitudes. Some of them I just tell "I think you should find another contractor". I dont lie to them or BS them. I dont care if the economy takes a major dump, I have no desire to work for people like that.
> 
> ...


 Amen!:notworthy

I didn't get into this biz to be a slave.

Case in point
-HO calls me
-4.5 million dollar custom built, 2 years old, built by a large outfit
-House exhibiting major problems, foundation, floors cracking, electrical, mold...list goes on
-She hires me, she needs expert testimony & a contractor to fix
-I supply 300 page report
-Footings too small, water table too high, water infiltration, design problems, contract issues, overall mis-management. 
-My quote to fix, around 750k.
-I line up engineers, subs, etc. and get crackin'

Remediation begins
-Week three, I have the mould remediation contractors on site working in the basement.
-Everytime I entered her home (prob. 30 times by this point), she told me to leave shoes/boots on. Even after the 5th/6th time, I would still bend down in the gesture until she stopped me and insisted I leave them on. She told me I have free access to her home at any time.
-I need to speak to her, I wipe boots in basement, walk up stairs, down hallway and knock on kitchen door (where she always is)...I've done this routine many many times.
-She comes to door...
-"You're dragging dust all through my hallway and over my tiles"
-No HI, nothing.
-I look back, no dust.
-"I'm sorry, I don't see any dust"
-"Yes, there's your footprints"
-"I'm sorry, I can mop it"...still seeing no dust.
-I immediately bend over and take my boots off (this is unprecedented), but I was confused.
-I say, in an earnest tone "I'm sorry, I wiped my boots before coming upstairs. From now on I'll walk around to the front door and ring the bell whenever I need you".
-"That's not necessary, I just don't like strange men walking through my house unannounced...what if I was naked in my bedroom?"
-:blink:----->Then I would probably have to drop acid into my eyes. Was she serious? I put on my best poker face.
-She starts walking away..."*You know, you're developing a real attitude lately and I don't like it".*
-:blink:-----> Oh no she didnt'!
-Most people would swallow their pride at this point, but I have a very sensitive BS tolerance...I still hold myself back. But she continued...
-"You drag dust onto the tiles then take off your boots with an attitude.."
-"Wait a minute" I say with a gesture of my hand to stop...now to make the situation worse, I'm told I'm a mean looking guy and I don't have much of a humour so it makes me look even meaner...I'm in a kitchen with a nice old lady and the second my hand went up the look on her face went to fear and she shut up...
-"You talk to me in your condescending tone as if I'm an idiot, scorn me today for what I've been doing for the last 3 months on your insistence and you fly off into a lecture as if you're talking to a child after I do everything to accomodate your whim...so don't act as if it's common sense...you're out of line!"
-It was tense, she's a single woman (loaded) and this is her house, and she's the feminist type...let me re-phrase that....extremely feminist, all she talked about was how the 1st contractors took her for a ride because she's a woman...extremely insecure. Bad recipe.

I ended up keeping the job...but I was perfectly willing to walk away from a 3/4 million dollar job.

Life is too short. So if I'm willing to walk away from that job, imagine how I feel about John Smith with a bathroom reno....

Respect is a two way deal and unfortunately I was born with a backbone. So let me hear what John Smith thinks about my prices and how I should be quoting him...if you want it done right, you sign on the line. You want to haggle or play games, google "craigslist" and don't waste my time.


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## jamestrd (Oct 26, 2008)

_that is what my wife said after our third date:tt2:_



_third? that long?_


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## outlaw (Jan 7, 2009)

Heritage- Kudos to you brother. Respect is a two-way street. Sometimes people with a lot of money think that it entitles them to repsect:no: No sir. You have to give it to get it.


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## DetailHandyman (Jul 21, 2008)

Wolfgang said:


> Life's a ***** and misery is optional.



Words to live by!


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