# Average costs for sub-panels



## mdshunk

I'm curious what the steam generator is pulling? Many of these are at least 40-50 amps. If they also have an electric water heater and much else heavy electric (like a heat pump or A/C), this could easily put a crimp on your plans in the total demand load category. That's really beyond the scope of the GC's specialty to sort out, but it is certainly a question I'd recommend bringing up with the EC as a CYA maneuver, if you haven't already. The reason I say this is because if the inspector baulks and wants to see a demand load calc, and from that info wants a bigger service, this "pre-conversation" with the EC where he said "everything is fine" will give you ammo for this additional work to be done at a better price than normal. At least it should. In my opinion, if a sub tells a GC that something is fine, and it turns out that additional work is indeed required, he should not have to do that work for free, but he does owe it done with less than normal profit. That's how I think, anyhow.


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## Celtic

acrwc10 said:


> Because he is not out on his own yet and can't see the "burden" included in running a contracting business yet. You know how it is, most guys don't realize that the cost needs to cover everything from parts to truck maintenance etc,etc,etc. and at the end of the year you should have more money in the bank then you started with, not less.


Mags has been here for awhile (Dec 2006), at this point in his career - I am sure he is watching pricing threads with eagle eyes.


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## Magnettica

Celtic said:


> Why do you think that is high?



Because I know how long it takes to do the work, including the trip to the supply house to get the stuff. 

To whoever said i have no idea about what the actual cost is.... I do know a little bit about what it costs to run a company. I'm not completely naive when it comes to that.


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## Mike Finley

mdshunk said:


> I'm curious what the steam generator is pulling? Many of these are at least 40-50 amps. If they also have an electric water heater and much else heavy electric (like a heat pump or A/C), this could easily put a crimp on your plans in the total demand load category. That's really beyond the scope of the GC's specialty to sort out, but it is certainly a question I'd recommend bringing up with the EC as a CYA maneuver, if you haven't already. The reason I say this is because if the inspector baulks and wants to see a demand load calc, and from that info wants a bigger service, this "pre-conversation" with the EC where he said "everything is fine" will give you ammo for this additional work to be done at a better price than normal. At least it should. In my opinion, if a sub tells a GC that something is fine, and it turns out that additional work is indeed required, he should not have to do that work for free, but he does owe it done with less than normal profit. That's how I think, anyhow.


As I recall, I do believe he said he would figure the steamer at 50amps. We did have a short conversation about the load, his conversation with me is that he is fully confident that the 200 amp service will not be even close to being maxed with this addition. He explained a scenario involving some sort of generator system he put into a home a while back where he did extensive load calcs and testing to make sure the generator was adequate or something like that. I believe the jist of it was something about it was en eye oppener in regard to how much you can get out of 200 ams or something to that regard.

I don't know the details but he insists there is no way from what he looked at in this house that there will be a problem.

Is this over confidence or bravado in your opinion?


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## mdshunk

Mike Finley said:


> Is this over confidence or bravado in your opinion?


Beats me. I havn't looked at the home to know what else in there runs on electricity. Just a head's up on my part, is all.


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## Tiger

Mike Finley said:


> As I recall, I do believe he said he would figure the steamer at 50amps. We did have a short conversation about the load, his conversation with me is that he is fully confident that the 200 amp service will not be even close to being maxed with this addition. He explained a scenario involving some sort of generator system he put into a home a while back where he did extensive load calcs and testing to make sure the generator was adequate or something like that. I believe the jist of it was something about it was en eye oppener in regard to how much you can get out of 200 ams or something to that regard.
> 
> I don't know the details but he insists there is no way from what he looked at in this house that there will be a problem.
> 
> Is this over confidence or bravado in your opinion?


You hired the pro...trust his advice.

Dave


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## Bubbles

*Vagueness?*

Thats my new word vagueness. You reminded my MD of a Steam Generator circuit we ran once. Customer said it was right near panel..how much he asked impatiently?? It was approx. 100ft.ish away since large commercial garage door was in way. Had to go up 30 ft across and down all in conduit (with some weird bends) needing 100 amps 480 volts (1/0 CU) including main 3phase breaker at service, disconnect at machine and all. Customer thought it would be like $500 to run it from advice from his friend. I said try adding a 0 to that and I'll be back. Later he got his info staight and we did it anyhow and he was happy happy. I will say though that is pushing his 400 amp service now when that thing is running. 

"Vagueness"


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## mdcorreia

mdshunk said:


> I'd be right about 500-600 for all surface mounted equipment on a plywood backboard in a basement type situation. I'd be closer to 800-900 for flush mounted equipment, such as a garage or finished basement type situation. Naturally, this is assuming that this won't throw your demand load out of whack and feeding that sub at 60 amps. Add about 150 bucks to feed that sub at 100 amps.


When I install a subpanel I transfer small loads into it and LEAVE additional or all bigger loads in the main panel. The sub panel could be any size of spaces -8, 16, 48 64 etc. Nothing to do with meters or grounding! The sub panel ( even a 30 amp feeder to it ) can be a combination main panel (with a main c. breaker)(remove the neutral bond.) A sub panel does not change the load demand -only access to more ccts. But inspectors around here don't know what a load calculation is (residential). 
The price is never less than $600- 700 for a 24 cct sub on surface. GC like to feel their way around - very sneaky people towards = small contractor = work for $12 if you don't watch ou! I am lucky - I read those like a book - they will not fool me.

PS If I smell a handyman or cheap electrician bidding - I take off like a rocket!

I notice here many contractors - years of in business -still work for peanuts. Many here have no clue how much it costs to operate a business until 3 years later when they loose their shirt, the wife etc. My 2 cents


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## fridaymean

HallisseyDesign said:


> Go to chicago and it is twice that cost on average


Maybe we could offer our services....We are *WAY* lower than that.


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