# One coat paint?



## Chris G (May 17, 2006)

I have a rental unit to paint for the owner. He wants to save a few bucks by doing one coat if it will work, (understandable since it's a rental). On the walls are light greens and tans as well as light peach, (ugly). I'm thinking tan over tan, tan over green, and he wants off white over the peach. I think tan over tan I can cover in one coat. Tan over light green...dunno. White over peach, doubtful. 

Am I about right here? I know of Superpaint and Duration, does Benjamin Moore have a "one coat paint"?

Oh yeah, trim is white, so no biggie there. about 3000sq feet of wall space by the way, and............drumrolll.......14 foot ceilings! 1894 mansion divided up into units.


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## ProWallGuy (Oct 17, 2003)

There is no thing such as 'one-coat paint'.


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## slickshift (Jun 14, 2005)

ProWallGuy said:


> There is no thing such as 'one-coat paint'.


Ditto
No such animal

Think about it
If there was nobody would use anything but


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## phinsher (Oct 27, 2005)

I agree with the above opinions. No way you'll change colors and cover in one coat unless he's happy with substandard work. If the walls were in perfect condition and you were painting with the same exact color then maybe.


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## Chris G (May 17, 2006)

slickshift said:


> Ditto
> No such animal
> 
> Think about it
> If there was nobody would use anything but


I agree. It's just that everyone goes on and on about Duration and Superpaint that it's hard not to fall for the hype. I've never used the stuff, so I thought I would ask


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## AAPaint (Apr 18, 2005)

Super paint and duration both require two coats. I can scan the page from the coating systems catalog if necessary.


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## troubleseeker (Sep 24, 2006)

I've said it forever, so here it is again. The only place "one coat paint" exists is in the mind of the paint salesman. In this particular situation (rental) you could probably cover the same color with one coat of top quality just to freshen it up, but it will not look it's best, and changing colors is definately not going to work.

And be warned that the people who tell you they just want to do some sub standard practice and that will be good enough because they want to save money, will not remember those instructions when they are telling you that you have to apply another coat before they will pay..I gaurantee that!!!!!!!!!!!.


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## Chris G (May 17, 2006)

troubleseeker said:


> And be warned that the people who tell you they just want to do some sub standard practice and that will be good enough because they want to save money, will not remember those instructions when they are telling you that you have to apply another coat before they will pay..I gaurantee that!!!!!!!!!!!.


I appreciate that. This is a difficult client. I am limiting my scope of work at evey step. He has other things to be done, but I first want to see how this works out. I'm sure you already know how this will end.


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## Kashmir (Mar 28, 2005)

AAPaint said:


> Super paint and duration both require two coats. I can scan the page from the coating systems catalog if necessary.


Would love two see the page you are talking about


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## Kashmir (Mar 28, 2005)

You might want to check out BM's new Aura (not sure about the spelling) paint. It sounds like what you are looking for. It's not available everywhere yet---haven't tried it yet. Runs about $50 per gallon supposedly


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## AAPaint (Apr 18, 2005)

I can still scan it if you want, but it's basically the same as you'll see here. 



> Block
> 1 ct. Loxon Block Surfacer
> 2 cts. SuperPaint Interior Satin Latex
> Drywall
> ...


This is for super paint interior satin latex, and can be verified at this link: http://www.sherlink.com/sher-link/I...in/applications/sherwinApp/sher-link/temp/dp/


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## painter77 (Sep 22, 2005)

Chris G said:


> I have a rental unit to paint for the owner. He wants to save a few bucks by doing one coat if it will work, (understandable since it's a rental). On the walls are light greens and tans as well as light peach, (ugly). I'm thinking tan over tan, tan over green, and he wants off white over the peach. I think tan over tan I can cover in one coat. Tan over light green...dunno. White over peach, doubtful.
> /
> 
> 
> ...


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## Joewho (Sep 20, 2006)

Keep in mind that anyone who ever printed instructions is selling their product. If the salesman says it covers in one coat, he's trying to sell to a targeted group. 

If sherwin williams says you have to apply Preprite just to change a color, their hoodwinking you too. Each can of SW Superpaint gives instructions on how you have wash, sand, prime and paint, and it implies that the warranty won't be good unless you follow their directions. Poppycock. SW has stores set up for contractors and other stores set up for the retail consumer. We aren't retail consumers.

Your original post is a very good start on this type of job. Don't let people fool you into thinking you're a substandard painter. You'll wind up pricing yourself right out of a job.

do this, instead of superpaint, get promar 200. I'm only talking about flat. On oily stains, use a spray can of kilz. Give the kilz-ed spots a quick sanding with used 100 grit. For the primed spots and marks on the wall, prepaint them with the roller, lightly. (Use a sw contractors wool 3/4 roller. It's the most expensive roller, but you'll see why when you use it. One roller will do this whole job for you and then some.) Then roll the walls out, one coat. Tan is then done.

For the other colors, lay the paint on heavy where you cut in. You will need to go back with the brush a little bit, but not two full coats. Roll out a wall, and if it doesn't completley cover, immediatly go back and roll the same wall out again. This is the best way to do it without two complete coats.


A rental is a rental. Managers have turnover and need the work done cheaply. If not, they will get someone else. You go for it dude. Trust me on the pro mar 200. If my advice is faulty, I'll come and paint it for you myself, for nothing. 3000 sq/ft. is a hell of a lot of work at 14ft high. If you try and do it like a custom home you'll lose your ass.


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## Danahy (Oct 17, 2006)

Colour match the existing colours, located what there lrv would be (use the index), should the answer be 25 or so then use a 25 lrv version but in tan... This would be your best bet, (works like finding a shade of grey to match a red)... However, if you are actually going to do this, you might just want to skip to doing 2 coats.


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## wackman (Nov 14, 2005)

We're finishing a remodel right now where the paint we matched was Bengy Moore's Aura and I was shocked at the price ($50. a gallon!), but I was told (by the salesman) that it would actually save me money because it didn't need a primer coat, even on new drywall, and that it often covered in one coat. 

I was doubtful but had my guys apply it the way he said and I must say it's probably the best paint we've ever used. 

It wasn't one coat on the big color changes but it worked well on similar colors and worked well on the bare drywall. 

I really couldn't tell that it was just one coat over fresh rock with no primer. Closest thing I've seen to a one coat paint yet.

Wack


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## metomeya (Apr 20, 2006)

I can cover in one coat, but it will all be with a brush!


Seriously, there are certain colors that I can get in one coat (given that the wall isn't too porous or has too high of a sheen). It really has to do with the color than the paint (given youre not buying the bottom of the barrel). Certain pigments in paints are more solid, while others are more transparent. As long are you are using a good quality roller and a good application method (I do one vertical strip all the way up and down, with each one over lapping, I also use high solid paints so they start to dry really fast so it kinda like a 2 coat.)

However, most of the colors people tend to like have whats called more color saturation. This means they tend to have more of the transparent pigments or a deeper base (meaning less titanium dioxide, which means more transparent). 

The house I'm doing now definitely requires 2 if not 3 coats, but the colors buyer has been using are really nice.


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## Chris G (May 17, 2006)

metomeya said:


> However, most of the colors people tend to like have whats called more color saturation. This means they tend to have more of the transparent pigments or a deeper base (meaning less titanium dioxide, which means more transparent).
> 
> The house I'm doing now definitely requires 2 if not 3 coats, but the colors buyer has been using are really nice.


Well, I went out and bought Promar 200. I'm using high quality rollers and Purdy Brushes. The colours are really nice. Urban Putty, (lrv 54). And Alabaster (lrv 83). I actually had never read or heard of lrv before, (thanks Danahy!). Greek Villa on the trim. I'll let you know how it goes. Any guesses?


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## metomeya (Apr 20, 2006)

I've worked in a paint department for 2 years color matching and mixing paint, I got really darn good at color matching, but still simply looking at a color and telling if it will cover in one coat is hard. Typically if you can look at what pigment number or symbols and figure out whats in there you can sometimes tell as there are still other factors (for example, titanium dioxide, and yellow oxide are very high hiding, but NOT when by themselves, the brown pigments used you would think would be hide hiding but aren't, but brown paints can be if they use black lamp, and yellow oxide as pigments as most do, but some use really transparent bases, etc.)

So like I said lots of factors (you learn this when your color matching machine doesn't work, and you become the goto guy for color matching), but basically the more different solid pigments used the better chance of one coat coverage.


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## PlainPainter (Dec 29, 2004)

My sister once asked me to paint her house and I did two coats everywhere with Ace Royal touch interior satin paint. All her walls were veneer plaster that had wallpaper on them for 50 years. Once everything was cleaned up I went to town priming and painting. At the end of the job - she wanted her kitchen painted this bold blue against her bright white cabinets. I primed the walls with ppg's oil based max kill - just stock white primer, didn't even add any dark pigment to the mix. Then I cut the walls in with a purdy 100% champagne nylon brush and rolled on one coat of paint - absolute perfect coverage with blue paint which is a transparent pigment! I do get good results with beiges over white walls - and mostly when working with vinyl type acrylic interior paints. 100% acrylic, altough better quality, lack the coverage potential of vinyl acrylics.


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## metomeya (Apr 20, 2006)

Wow, so vinyl acrylics, cover better than 100% acrylic?

Thats a new one. They are a high quality paint though?

Cause most vinyl acrylics are at the lower end meaning they have less solids. The ones I told never covered in one coat. Was the the Ace Royal again when you did the blue?


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## PlainPainter (Dec 29, 2004)

Solids include pigments and resins. 100% acrylic is a better quality more durable resin - but lots of contractors and paint companies think vinyl acrylics are fine for interior paints. They aren't on the low end of the scale - Some companies that have vinyl acrylics are Ace Royal touch interior paints, Pratt&Lambert Redseal interior paint, For the most part Ben Moore interior Regal was a traditional vinyl acrylic paint - I think it is reformulated, but still not 100% acrylic. All ceiling paints are vinyl acrylics. And yes the blue was Ace Royal touch


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## metomeya (Apr 20, 2006)

Ceiling paints uh? 

I remember I usually use normal wall flat paint on ceiling if I'm covering up a color, cause ceiling paint is just so transparent from what I've learned as well as most primers (zinsser your only weak point).


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## Joewho (Sep 20, 2006)

Chris G said:


> Well, I went out and bought Promar 200. I'm using high quality rollers and Purdy Brushes. The colours are really nice. Urban Putty, (lrv 54). And Alabaster (lrv 83). I actually had never read or heard of lrv before, (thanks Danahy!). Greek Villa on the trim. I'll let you know how it goes. Any guesses?


If you got the 200 xp, let us know how it works. I haven't tried it yet.


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## slickshift (Jun 14, 2005)

metomeya said:


> Ceiling paints uh?
> 
> I remember I usually use normal wall flat paint on ceiling if I'm covering up a color, cause ceiling paint is just so transparent from what I've learned as well as most primers (zinsser your only weak point).


I've gone over black with one coat primer (Problock) and one coat ceiling white (Muresco)
Looked great


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## Chris G (May 17, 2006)

I used the 200. The 200xp is apparently more for bare drywall and plaster. One coat over bare board, no priming...now that I have to try when I get a chance. The store only had four gallons of xp in stock. No one had ever asked about it before me.

So...how did the 200 work? F'ing amazingly. Really. The job looks very, very good. Going around the room with my eye about 6 inches from the paint, I noticed very tiny pin point spots, (smaller than usual) of the previous colour in about 5% of the areas. This was a few hours after drying. Absolutley inperceptible from a foot away, and the colour is consistent and clean throughout. Those spots may be bigger today if the paint has shrunk and cured more overnight, so we'll see. Excellent paint to apply, flows on.

I'll take some pics today, (if only because it's a beautiful home).

The semi gloss 200 for the trim was good. Nothing exceptional though, three coats over a red door with white.


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## Chris G (May 17, 2006)

Pics.


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## Joewho (Sep 20, 2006)

Wow, looks good Chris.

200 usually lookes even better after it dries. I doubt it will shrink.

PS. I bet the shelves were fun.


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## Chris G (May 17, 2006)

Ya, I'm really happy with how it's turning out. The coluor is very rich. I let my partner do the shelves. That's so funny you recognized that as a pain in the butt. I just couldn't bring myself to jam a a brand new brush around all the joints. He and his brush survived. Thanks again for your help.

Chris


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