# Flood test after tile



## zncusn (Sep 17, 2016)

Having my house remodeled and the one thing I keep thinking about is the shower pan liner. A primary mud pan was laid by the plumber then a PVC liner, there was a 24 hour water test performed with no issues. 

A top mud pan was laid over the PVC liner but incorrectly; the mud on top of the PVC was ripped out and replaced without having benefit of a secondary water test. I wasn't around when the work was done and have no idea how rough or gentle they may have been while removing the mud pan, I got home from work at five the new pan had been ripped out and a new one laid in. 

So the walls have red guard over Durock, marble tile has been laid on the floor and walls and now all I can think about is the guys who did the work made a hole in the PVC liner while replacing the mud pan. With an average of three showers a day it's probably going to take years before any hole becomes evident. 

Question is this, has anyone ever done or heard of doing a flood test after the tile has been installed in the shower? 

If I block the drain and flood it how long could it possibly take for any water to come through? 

Or am I just making myself crazy and I should forget about it.


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## CharlieDelta (Aug 17, 2016)

Do you know if they red guarded over the preslope? What about over the mortar bed (tile bed)? RedGuard is a damn good product in my experience. This would be a good question to ask, and I imagine could give you a little peace-of-mind.

To answer your question directly: No, I have not heard of guys doing a flood test after the tile has been laid. Although that doesn't mean guys haven't done it. I also don't know what kind of results said test would provide if done on finished tile.

I do know sealing your grout lines (more than one coat) will prolong the waterproof capability of the grout.


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## zncusn (Sep 17, 2016)

There were a few mess ups along the way and that made me nervous so I applied red guard and two coats myself. 

I applied the red guard to the walls, niche and curb, my application stopped at about 2 inches onto the mud pan because I didn't want to trap moisture between the PVC liner and the red guard. 

I'm going to apply a sealer to the marble on the floor and walls and I think I'm just gonna have to cross my fingers. 

I appreciate your reply, thank you very much.


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## heavy_d (Dec 4, 2012)

I think your making yourself nuts. Was it you that posted this scenario about 2-3 weeks ago?

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk


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## zncusn (Sep 17, 2016)

heavy_d said:


> I think your making yourself nuts. Was it you that posted this scenario about 2-3 weeks ago?
> 
> Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk


 It was about a month ago and yes that was me, i'm a roofer and I think the ultimate irony would be my own home getting destroyed by water. 

Just waiting on the glass doors and then everything is operational, but all I can think about is some doofus stepping on a drywall screw or putting a hammer claw into the membrane and not saying anything. 

I'm gonna let it go, i'll check back in 2020 to let everyone know how it went.


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

It would be really difficult to flood test after the mud bed and tile are in as there are now a few more elements that are going to absorb water. How are you going to know that the drop in the water level isn't due to absorption rather than a leak? I'd give it up and just document the scenario well. If there's an issue down the road you'll be able to file a subrogation claim against the installer.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

What is done is done. Ethan is spot on. The purpose of the flood test is to check for leaks int he liner. If tile has been installed, there is no way to reconcile the source of the drop in the water level. There is too much risk for a false positive.

The real issue I have is marble on the floor of a shower. It's too porous. My feeling is any natural stone is too soft and porous for a shower regardless of wall or floor. I am also not a fan of liner pans to begin with. Too many jokers (plumbers) don't install properly. They don't go far enough up (min 3") in the pan area. They don't go up the curb wall at all, let alone 3" up. They often pierce the liner nailing it to the curb. I am also surprised that a plumber would lay a preslope. That shocks the crap out of me.

I will bring a topical down the wall and onto the curb, but don't trust it on a pan. It's really not designed for that application. You are much better off with Kerdi membrane than a topical.

Currently, we only install Schluter Kerdi pans for curbed installs and TruDek pans for barrier-free installations. I am going to try Wedi. It's waterproof and pretty much ready to tile.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

zncusn said:


> There were a few mess ups along the way and that made me nervous so I applied red guard and two coats myself.
> 
> I applied the red guard to the walls, niche and curb, my application stopped at about 2 inches onto the mud pan because I didn't want to trap moisture between the PVC liner and the red guard.
> 
> ...


Sealers don't last long in shower floors.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

If I were in your shoes, my gut says the pan probably broke up easily and the guys aren't complete dopes. Time will tell, but those liners are pretty tough.


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## charimon (Nov 24, 2008)

Stop the drain and flood it for 24 hours, if the ceiling below is wet the next day you have a leak, if not you are good to go.


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## Krok (Jul 9, 2016)

charimon said:


> Stop the drain and flood it for 24 hours, if the ceiling below is wet the next day you have a leak, if not you are good to go.


...unless it's a slow leak, then over time the wood decays, the mold grows and spreads, structures start to fail, finally, later, there are signs of failure. Then it's a whole lotta tear out in multiple rooms, etc. Second and above floors are the most amusing to witness these hidden failures, but to be fair, I've seen failures on a slab where it got into the framing and just did their moveon.org.

This is why I'd never buy a house from a fix and flipper...or any house that's been newly remodeled. 

Rapid failures are fun though. A woman told me of her first shower experience with her new walk in shower. She was eating downstairs and knew someone was using the shower because water broke through the ceiling and was going into her lap. I think she was eating at the time, so the food may have been put at unnecessary risk due to people figuring it out. Man, such a waste.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Craig is fairly knowledgeable and I would trust that if thinks 24 hours is good enough for a tiled flood test. That being said, I would probably go 48 just so that I could sleep better at night.


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