# Compression T Fitting vs. Re-Threadding Galvanized Water Main



## mtbmac (Sep 5, 2008)

Here is my situation. I am installing a automatic sprinkler system in a older home that has a Galvanized Water Main. I will be tapping into the Water Main just outside the home, and T-ing off to the Sprinkler System. My question is, am I better off to cut the Main, then re-thread both ends and install a Union into the mix, or can I get away with using a Compression T and going from there? I have not had much luck using Compression fittings in the past and the Water Main is down about 6 feet. Hence, I really don’t want to have to dig it up, if the T doesn’t hold.


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## dkillianjr (Aug 28, 2006)

All of the sprinkler systems I have seen around here tap into the main in the basement before the meter and then have a separate meter for just the sprinklers. Why not tap in in the basement or crawlspace.


Dave


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## KillerToiletSpider (May 27, 2007)

If you are asking this question you have no business touching a potable water system.


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## mtbmac (Sep 5, 2008)

KillerToiletSpider said:


> If you are asking this question you have no business touching a potable water system.


 
Your response tells me I already know my answer. A threading we wil go.


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## KillerToiletSpider (May 27, 2007)

Check your local codes, failure to provide backflow protection can result in large fines and criminal charges, there is an irrigation contractor near me serving ten years for involuntary manslaughter for the death of an infant.


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## mtbmac (Sep 5, 2008)

KillerToiletSpider said:


> Check your local codes, failure to provide backflow protection can result in large fines and criminal charges, there is an irrigation contractor near me serving ten years for involuntary manslaughter for the death of an infant.


 
Thanks for the heads up. I have already purchased the backflow protection device. I only asked the Compression T question as I wanted to know if it was a viable method. (I should know better). I have pretty much viewed compression fittings as hodgepodge bandaids. It's really a no brainer... threads are always the better way. Besides who wants to dig up the same 5 -6 ft deep hole. Just to fix a failed bandaid. Not worth the chance...


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## Ron The Plumber (Oct 10, 2006)

Why not just get rid of that galvi main all together, oh that's right it would take a plumber to do it, sorry my bad for asking.


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## mtbmac (Sep 5, 2008)

Ron The Plumber said:


> Why not just get rid of that galvi main all together, oh that's right it would take a plumber to do it, sorry my bad for asking.


A plumber, who wanted to dig a 80' long 6' trench.


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## Ron The Plumber (Oct 10, 2006)

mtbmac said:


> A plumer, who wanted to dig a 80' long 6' trench.


plumer?

Is that someone who works in a plum orchard? No wonder he said that.


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## Teetorbilt (Feb 12, 2004)

As a former employee of a major municipality, we used Dresser couplings and tees all of the time for potable water. I fail to see the problem with a sprinkler system.


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## stp57 (Dec 12, 2007)

Recently, a HO asked me to repair a hole in the ceiling above the water heater. The hole had be boarded up for a few years after a licensed plumber repaired a leak in the galvanized pipe. After removing the board, I called the HO over so that he could see that the "repaired" pipe was about ready to leak all over again. The "plumber" had cut out the bad pipe and used a compression fitting instead of re-threading the good pipe & putting a union in. Needless to say, the compression fitting was a mess & the pipe under it was rotted out.
I will take heat for this, but the HO didn't want to risk paying plumber prices to get a sham job again, so he hired me to do it right. So, out comes my seldom used hand pipe threader (1950's Ridgid model) & I get it done. 
Personally, I would have hunted down that plumber if I was the HO, but he didn't want to hassle with it. The shame is, that this "plumber" probably had an electric threader & would have been done in no time at all.
Steve


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## Teetorbilt (Feb 12, 2004)

Going back to the original post, I don't forecast a problem. It's a sprinkler system!


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## Grumpyplumber (May 6, 2007)

*Welcome to the "All Plumbers are all hacks" forum, my name is Grumpy, I'll be your waiter this evening.*


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## mtbmac (Sep 5, 2008)

Ron the Plum(b)er from Eugene, Oregon. You aren't by chance an Ostrander are you?


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## Ron The Plumber (Oct 10, 2006)

mtbmac said:


> Ron the Plum(b)er from Eugene, Oregon. You aren't by chance an Ostrander are you?


What are you talking about? :huh:


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## mtbmac (Sep 5, 2008)

Ron The Plumber said:


> What are you talking about? :huh:


 
I grew up in Eugene. Some good friends of mine from back then owned a Plumbing Company. (Well their Parents did). The kids worked there however. Anyway, their last name was Ostrander.


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## Ron The Plumber (Oct 10, 2006)

mtbmac said:


> I grew up in Eugene. Some good friends of mine from back then owned a Plumbing Company. (Well their Parents did). The kids worked there however. Anyway, their last name was Ostrander.



Not me sorry.


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## ILPlumber (Aug 26, 2007)

You shouldn't be worrying about the tap in. Up through the backflow preventor it's plumbing. All you need to worry about is getting hooked up to that shiny new RPZ. 

That's how it would be in my state anyway. Your a (***Nice Guy***) for even asking that question. If you know what the hell your doing , you know the answer:no:


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## MALCO.New.York (Feb 27, 2008)

ILPlumber said:


> You shouldn't be worrying about the tap in. Up through the backflow preventor it's plumbing. All you need to worry about is getting hooked up to that shiny new RPZ.
> 
> That's how it would be in my state anyway. Your a (***Nice Guy***) for even asking that question. If you know what the hell your doing , you know the answer:no:


 
For someone who has been on this site for a couplea posts, you sure have a way of acting as a complete arse.

Who are you that YOU get to call another poster a(***Nice Guy***) ?

Are you THAT infallible in your quality and Omniscience concerning plumbing?


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## Nathan (Jul 21, 2003)

Let's drop the name calling folks. Thanks.


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## ILPlumber (Aug 26, 2007)

MALCO.New.York said:


> Are you THAT infallible in your quality and Omniscience concerning plumbing?


Yes. 

Plumbing is what I do. It's what I've always done. It's what I always will do.

If I was asked the same question face to face. He would get the exact same response. 

Don't dabble in plumbing. 

You are also a nice guy:thumbsup:


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## MALCO.New.York (Feb 27, 2008)

ILPlumber said:


> Yes.
> 
> Plumbing is what I do. It's what I've always done. It's what I always will do.
> 
> ...



No! Generally I am a prick. A REAL PITA. But descending to the point of calling another Brother-At-Arms a derogatory word just make no sense.

As for dabbling.............We ALL, each and every one of us, except PLUMBERS apparently, "dabble" in some others expertise from time to time. Does not make it right, but it DOES make it what it is.


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## Double-A (Jul 3, 2006)

MTB, the OP didn't put his location in his profile, so I can't speak to his local codes, but our code prohibits us from branching a water service outside the perimeter of a building, as do many model codes. 

Irrigation systems should be run from a separate meter, as there is usually a sewer charge, unless the home has a private sewage treatment plant. The home owner will wind up paying decidedly more for water than if they requested and installed a landscape meter.

Also, a back flow prevention device should never protect a branch of a private water distribution system unless it is protecting only one piece of equipment. An irrigation system is not one piece of equipment, it is a system of devices. 

The back flow protection should protect the entire service, but then how to protect the home owner and their family from back flow?

Compression couplings underground here are allowed, however they must include pipe restraint devices to prevent separation of the pipe sections due to ground movement and constant pressure trying to push them apart.

This is just wrong on so many levels, I wouldn't recommend this, no matter how cheap the client is, or how badly someone wants a paycheck for it. Plumbing, and yes, tapping into a potable water service, private or otherwise, is considered plumbing in my area, is a crime if you are not licensed for it. Up to six months in county jail and/or a $5,000.00 fine. 

We might date our relatives in Arkansas, but we damn sure don't play when it comes to protecting the health and safety of the public. At least not where potable water is concerned.


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## nhmaster3015 (Sep 6, 2008)

Hey Grumpy, Things get ugly around here real fast huh?:whistling


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## nhmaster3015 (Sep 6, 2008)

First, do no harm. Works for Doctors, should work for plumbers too.


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## ILPlumber (Aug 26, 2007)

nhmaster3015 said:


> First, do no harm. Works for Doctors, should work for plumbers too.


I agree. The internet IMO has been somewhat of a curse to the plumbing community. Instead of helping each other out we sometimes blindly give advice to DIY'ers and hacks to make ourselves feel knowledgeable. 

I don't think we need to be giving it away. If you give advice to some irrigation (nice guy) , you are taking money out of a local plumbers pocket. 

I have had experiences with many of these folks first hand. I will not allow them to do my work. I have and will continue to turn them in to the inspector every time I see em doing plumbing.


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## nhmaster3015 (Sep 6, 2008)

I'll warn everyone ahead of time. When it comes to unlicensed plumbing I make Grumpy sound downright cordial.


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## ILPlumber (Aug 26, 2007)

nhmaster3015 said:


> I'll warn everyone ahead of time. When it comes to unlicensed plumbing I make Grumpy sound downright cordial.


Good for you NH. We all have to do our part in reporting unlicensed acts. A lot of guys don't mess with it because they're busy. They may not be so busy eventually. 

Right now in my state. The inspector has to file a court case to prosecute a hack. I believe they should have the power to write a ticket on the spot. Then if the hack wants to fight it go to court. Just like a traffic ticket.


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## Grumpyplumber (May 6, 2007)

nhmaster3015 said:


> Hey Grumpy, Things get ugly around here real fast huh?:whistling


*HA!*
*Sure took ya long enough to find the place!*


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## Grumpyplumber (May 6, 2007)

nhmaster3015 said:


> I'll warn everyone ahead of time. When it comes to unlicensed plumbing I make Grumpy sound downright cordial.


 :laughing::w00t::shutup:

*I dunno 'bout that...*


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## mtbmac (Sep 5, 2008)

Ouote: "Plumbing, and yes, tapping into a potable water service, private or otherwise, is considered plumbing in my area, is a crime if you are not licensed for it. Up to six months in county jail and/or a $5,000.00 fine." 

In a nutshell, in my area it basically goes like this: If you have a Backflow Cert you can, test and repair backflow prevention devices. Anyone can install them outside of a building so long as they have a permit. This includes tapping into the main water line (Note: Inside installations, or installations at a comercial building have to be done by a licensed plumber).


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## KillerToiletSpider (May 27, 2007)

mtbmac said:


> Ouote: "Plumbing, and yes, tapping into a potable water service, private or otherwise, is considered plumbing in my area, is a crime if you are not licensed for it. Up to six months in county jail and/or a $5,000.00 fine."
> 
> In a nutshell, in my area it basically goes like this: If you have a Backflow Cert you can, test and repair backflow prevention devices. Anyone can install them outside of a building so long as they have a permit. This includes tapping into the main water line (Note: Inside installations, or installations at a comercial building have to be done by a licensed plumber).


Where do you live?

I want to make sure I never even think about moving there.


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## mtbmac (Sep 5, 2008)

Im in Idaho. Oh yea If you are employeed by the owner of a building as their maintence man you don't even need a certification. Crazy isn't it?


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## Ron The Plumber (Oct 10, 2006)

mtbmac said:


> Im in Idaho. Oh yea If you are employeed by the owner of a building as their maintence man you don't even need a certification. Crazy isn't it?


Your are correct, UPC allows this, Idaho is under UPC. But are you an employee of the owners building?


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## mtbmac (Sep 5, 2008)

Nope... better. Im the HO of the home in question.


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## Ron The Plumber (Oct 10, 2006)

mtbmac said:


> Ouote: "Plumbing, and yes, tapping into a potable water service, private or otherwise, is considered plumbing in my area, is a crime if you are not licensed for it. Up to six months in county jail and/or a $5,000.00 fine."
> 
> In a nutshell, in my area it basically goes like this: If you have a Backflow Cert you can, test and repair backflow prevention devices. Anyone can install them outside of a building so long as they have a permit.* This includes tapping into the main water line* (Note: Inside installations, or installations at a comercial building have to be done by a licensed plumber).


Your wrong about this, your not allowed to touch the water service, your suppose to call a plumber to have them set you up for your tie on, I know this cause I'm using UPC, Idaho uses the same book as Oregon, and if you out there doing this your wrong. You can work on your own house but no others.


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## mtbmac (Sep 5, 2008)

The home at issue in this thread is one of my own. I took on the installation of the sprinkler system, because of my experience in Sprinkler Repair. I thought that would be a good place to get my feet wet on an new install. With that said, I do thank you for the heads up about the plumber requirement, as I do plan on doing future installations as a Sprinkler Contractor. (Better to here it here then from a code inspector). Again thanks for the heads up.


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## CA PLMBR (Sep 13, 2008)

mtbmac said:


> Here is my situation. I am installing a automatic sprinkler system in a older home that has a Galvanized Water Main. I will be tapping into the Water Main just outside the home, and T-ing off to the Sprinkler System. My question is, am I better off to cut the Main, then re-thread both ends and install a Union into the mix, or can I get away with using a Compression T and going from there? I have not had much luck using Compression fittings in the past and the Water Main is down about 6 feet. Hence, I really don’t want to have to dig it up, if the T doesn’t hold.


Hey mtbmac,
I would never recommend using a compression tee (I assume you mean with rubber seals) on a water service. Only if it was a repair needing to be done but if it were that bad I would highly recommend to the owner of the property to replace the line because if the outside is falling apart the tenants are eating galvanized particles. If the Galvi is ok to thread than thread away. I would not recommend installing a union as you stated, from my understanding unions must be accessible. I would get a hold of a left/right nipple and coupling and install the system as such. In California it is normal practice on single family residences to tee off the water main just after the (shared) meter. Only on commercial buildings or homes with a lot of acreage do they require 2 meters. Now here we use schedule 40 pvc from the meter to just before the house then we transition from pvc via a FIP to soft copper loop (type K) up to the regulator, either just outside the house or just inside the garage. When connecting be sure to flush out the dirt that always gets in the pipes when irrigation folks tamper with OUR (plumbers) line. I hope this helps. Oh yeah and if your not licensed to do it don't do it.


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## rbsremodeling (Nov 12, 2007)

Sharkkkk Biitteee


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## MALCO.New.York (Feb 27, 2008)

rbsremodeling said:


> Sharkkkk Biitteee


I am going to break that stick of your R&B


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## rbsremodeling (Nov 12, 2007)

MALCO.New.York said:


> I am going to break that stick of your R&B



LoL i could not resist. 

Putting the vodka down and leaving the plumbers alone for the night.:shutup:


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## MALCO.New.York (Feb 27, 2008)

rbsremodeling said:


> LoL i could not resist.
> 
> Putting the vodka down and leaving the plumbers alone for the night.:shutup:


Never put the Vodka down! EVER!


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## rbsremodeling (Nov 12, 2007)

MALCO.New.York said:


> Never put the Vodka down! EVER!


:thumbsup:


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## MALCO.New.York (Feb 27, 2008)

rbsremodeling said:


> :thumbsup:


:thumbsup:


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## CA PLMBR (Sep 13, 2008)

rbsremodeling said:


> Sharkkkk Biitteee


Hey rbs,
Are you a Plumber or do you just play one on TV? Lol, jk but. Shark bites are neat but remember they're only as good as the surface your installing them on.


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## rbsremodeling (Nov 12, 2007)

CA PLMBR said:


> Hey rbs,
> Are you a Plumber or do you just play one on TV? Lol, jk but. Shark bites are neat but remember they're only as good as the surface your installing them on.


The only time I use sharkbites is to hold something together or repair it until my plumber gets there:thumbsup:


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## MALCO.New.York (Feb 27, 2008)

rbsremodeling said:


> The only time I use sharkbites is to hold something together or repair it until my plumber gets there:thumbsup:



Holy effing Diplomacy! (what a suck-up):w00t::laughing::clap::no::thumbup:


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## rbsremodeling (Nov 12, 2007)

MALCO.New.York said:


> Holy effing Diplomacy! (what a suck-up):w00t::laughing::clap::no::thumbup:


ay

I did lay it on a bit thick there didn't I


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## bluefancypants (Nov 20, 2012)

Yes, they are getting "plumb" rude with each other 
:laughing:


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## KillerToiletSpider (May 27, 2007)

Holy thread necromancy Batman.


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