# What is YOUR definition of a hack?



## Ivinni (Jan 11, 2008)

I have heard a few of you old timers and others throw this word around to describe some others.

Maybe they cut some corners here or there or maybe they are just encroaching on your turf. 

Before you flame me, I have been in business for 12 years and started it alone at 26. So I ain't no hack, see?:clap:


----------



## CrpntrFrk (Oct 25, 2008)

My definition of a hack is;
Someone who steps back to look at the work they just completed as feels that they did an ok job when it really looks like s**t. Either they don't realize it looks bad and have never been told so or they just don't care.


----------



## neolitic (Apr 20, 2006)

Hack, as in hack it up....
hatchet job....


----------



## MMC73 (Aug 31, 2008)

No license, no insurance, no business ethics...look on Craigslist....


----------



## neolitic (Apr 20, 2006)

MMC73 said:


> No license, no insurance, no business ethics...look on Craigslist....


Au contraire! 
Rest assured there are a great many
licensed, bonded, and insured hacks.
Verified, certified, stamped and sealed!


----------



## buildpinnacle (Sep 2, 2008)

MMC73 said:


> No license, no insurance, no business ethics...look on Craigslist....


Not much more to say except no estimating knowledge, no markup knowledge, thinks his gross profits off a job are 'what he made'. 

Wait! Best definition of all. A guy who WILL NOT be in business in six months based on current economic conditions.


----------



## Kent Whitten (Mar 24, 2006)

what a deep question. think about it. what really defines a hack?


----------



## K2 (Jul 8, 2005)

Everybody else. not me.


----------



## neolitic (Apr 20, 2006)

K2 said:


> Everybody else. not me.


:laughing::thumbup:


----------



## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

The person who fixed it the last time, 3 months ago, and now I have to go and take it all apart and start over. I followed a guy around like that for a year and a half, hell I gave out his name and # just so I was assured of some work in a few months. Maybe I should have called that cheap advertising.


----------



## davitk (Oct 3, 2008)

go easy, guys. I've called MYSELF a hack, a wood butcher, a chainsaw carpenter, a cobbler, a dumb sht, etc. etc. etc. and it typically occurs whilst working on my own house, maybe my FIL's :blush:, but NEVER at a customer's.

A hack by definition of davitk is someone who doesn't know or is not willing to go the distance of doing "it" the right way, and therefore is continually reinventing the wheel. "What do you mean, I cant modify those trusses whithout an engineer's stamp arty:"


----------



## silvertree (Jul 22, 2007)

A person bad at their job, who doesn't give a damn and who doesn't want to get better at it.


----------



## Bodger (Oct 23, 2008)

My dad used to call them "Jakelegs", which as I understood, applied more to lumberjacks that were considered less than skilled by the real guys.

Hacks are just hacks, whether intentional or not, they don't do their work, very well, don't take the time to learn the trade or apply any good ethic or high standard to it. 

Most of the men I meet that I would consider hacks are in this business because they aren't very good at anything and find it easier to fake being a contractor than maybe some other vocation.


----------



## RayGoerdt (Nov 13, 2008)

neolitic said:


> Au contraire!
> Rest assured there are a great many
> licensed, bonded, and insured hacks.
> Verified, certified, stamped and sealed!


 
Very true, I have followed a few of these, one in particular that owes a log home outfit lots of $ so they hired him just to try and get some back!:no:

Doesn't work out for them tho, they just have to pay somebody else to go back and fix it all!:w00t:


----------



## K2 (Jul 8, 2005)

neolitic said:


> :laughing::thumbup:


Yeah, the pot and the kettle thing. I've found it takes almost no talent or skill to talk chit about people. Over time the stars will shine or not shine accordingly..


----------



## Bodger (Oct 23, 2008)

RayGoerdt said:


> Very true, I have followed a few of these, one in particular that owes a log home outfit lots of $ so they hired him just to try and get some back!:no:
> 
> Doesn't work out for them tho, they just have to pay somebody else to go back and fix it all!:w00t:


I don't know about other market areas, but here in SoCal, there are a lot of "briefcase contractors". Guys who don't know diddly about the trades, but decided to take advantage of the amnesty licensing guidelines in CA and study up and get a contractor's ticket.

They hire _everything_ out and can't even answer a question without calling a real tradesman into the mix. 
I get calls from these guys occasionally and I am dumbfounded that they could even qualify for a license in this state. But the days are gone out here when only someone who could prove four years of employment with a licensed contractor could apply for a license. 
When CA changed that law. it opened the floodgates for less quality work getting done.
Should have been called the "Hack License Law"


----------



## Max Nomad (Aug 29, 2008)

buildpinnacle said:


> Not much more to say except no estimating knowledge, no markup knowledge, thinks his gross profits off a job are 'what he made'.
> 
> Wait! *Best definition of all. A guy who WILL NOT be in business in six months based on current economic conditions.*


Hacks exist anywhere there is a contract and someone is going to be paid to build something, whether it's an addition to a house or an ecommerce website. 

I might be relatively new to the construction world as an admin but I'm not new to business. From what I've seen, there are Artisans/Craftsmen types, the people that are constantly striving to master their discipline and make sure anything they build they do it correctly. It's almost a combination of deep pride in their trade and the reality that if you half-ass something you'll often have to do it two or three times to get it straight. 

In this context, hacks do what they do because they can half-ass it well enough to get paid for it -- and often have a mastery of cutting corners. These stunts usually go unnoticed by the customer until (1) something breaks, burns, falls off, or deteriorates prematurely, and/or (2) a solid contractor comes along, takes a look at the problem spot and says something like "Who the f*** did this?" 

Unfortunately, hard economic times will not flush out the hacks from any industry. Where a hack might be doing "discount" electrical or plumbing work this week because his main gig is slow, he might be doing framing or hanging drywall next week.

As someone that grew up as a computer hacker back in the 80s, I prefer the term "Jackleg"...


----------



## DecksEtc (Oct 27, 2004)

Someone called "breezesiding":lol::lol::lol:


----------



## reveivl (May 29, 2005)

silvertree said:


> A person bad at their job, who doesn't give a damn and who doesn't want to get better at it.


This nails it for me.


In remodeling you often run into situations that you haven't seen before so you ask friends, colleagues, CT, whoever, to do it the best you can with the accumulated years of experience that you have and with the understanding that you haven't experienced it all. Could you hire a professional in that particular field? By tomorrow? Sure maybe, but not stay in business very long or keep your customers happy. Maybe the 'expert' is right maybe not. Does this make you a hack? Perhaps, in some peoples' mind but as long as the work is good, not in the customers' mind.


----------



## barnbuilder1 (Dec 6, 2008)

I had thought about this in the past trying to answer why someone does what they do. 1) They don't care or 2) They have limited talent. Its sad but a lot of clients don't know the difference, "If I buy it thru Lowes it will be good and Lowes will stand behind it." The hack thinks he will just go on down the road and try something else. He tries to get all he can while he can.


----------



## Bodger (Oct 23, 2008)

barnbuilder1 said:


> I had thought about this in the past trying to answer why someone does what they do. 1) They don't care or 2) They have limited talent. Its sad but a lot of clients don't know the difference, "If I buy it thru Lowes it will be good and Lowes will stand behind it." The hack thinks he will just go on down the road and try something else. He tries to get all he can while he can.


 True, and continually proven by what happens after a big disaster like the Northridge quake in '94 in CA, and all the hurricane re-construction down south. It would appear that the hacks flocked to those areas and muddied the waters for the legit conscientious guys.


----------



## SLSTech (Sep 13, 2008)

DecksEtc said:


> Someone called "breezesiding":lol::lol::lol:


Good example of one :thumbup:




silvertree said:


> A person bad at their job, who doesn't give a damn and who doesn't want to get better at it.


I fully agree - its not about the license, the insurance, the truck, etc... (even though that is a good first indicator) It is simply about the work. There are hacks in the union, not in union, licensed & non licensed.


----------



## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

Hack - Half Ass Construction King

or

someone who doesn't strive to give their absolute very best in both product and service, at a fair price, and with a mission to always be improving.

If you ever say..."it is what it is." or...can't see it from my house....you might be a red-hack


----------



## Stewy (Nov 11, 2007)

Someone who provides quality guaranteed workmanship at a fair price with customer satisfaction being a top priority.
A hack is also a cab driver.


----------



## dirt diggler (May 14, 2006)

My definition of a *hack* (or "jackleg") is "repeated ignorance"

I believe we're all ignorant to things (obviously - or else we'd all know everything, right?)

With that in mind, it's really a matter of a desire to learn that separates a hack from someone who isn't. With a desire to learn, you will learn.


**************

*"Fly by nights," * --- I consider them different from hacks. These folks are simply put themselves into business for short term gain. Essentially, "part-time contractors." Such as a carpenter who takes jobs on the weekends or at night, _conciously_ aware of the fact that they do not plan to make a real business out of what they're doing. 

That same carpenter who takes work on the weekends or at night with the *intent* of trying to become a full-time contractor, that is a different story. To me, he is still a legitimate contractor, even if only part time.

It all lies in the "intention" of the individual. If they are conciously aware that they are being a part-time contractor simply for a _short-term_ gain, yes, that is a fly by night.


********************

*"Gypsy"* - this is the guy who knocks on your door and offers a great deal on asphalt driveways, simply because everyone else in town is on his "schedule." I liken a gypsy to a small-time petty purse snatcher. They are rarely creative & intelligent enough for me to give them the satisfaction of being called "scam artists"


----------



## Deadhead Derek (Dec 3, 2008)

silvertree said:


> A person bad at their job, who doesn't give a damn and who doesn't want to get better at it.


Yup. Like the custom cabinet guys who rolled into a job I was on and set the cab bases with a torpedo level. seriously. Or the hardwood guy who sanded and finished and then went back with Alex cedar latex caulking on the gaps of the brazilian cherry. those guys are hacks to me.


----------



## boman47k (Oct 13, 2006)

buildpinnacle said:


> Not much more to say except no estimating knowledge, no markup knowledge, thinks his gross profits off a job are 'what he made'.
> 
> *Wait! Best definition of all. A guy who WILL NOT be in business in six months based on current economic conditions.*


This statement confuses me. 
I think a hack is someone who can't or won't do work to industry standards. But, I also believe their are good tradesmen and maybe even good business men that will fold in the economic conditions.
Now maybe the good businessmsn will go into another business at some point, but conditions may be that he has to drop out of the contracting business per se.

I just read a thread where a member here is dropping his painting line after looking at his numbers and makeing the decision that it may be detrimental to his pest control business. I do not consider him a hack, more of a diversified businessman making an informed decision as to what is best for his business. He knows which stock put his money in and which stock to drop.


----------



## dlcj (Oct 1, 2007)

I agree. Hacks may actually thrive in these economic conditions. On jobs that are turned down buy the company that cant afford to employ 10 men and high overheads with the prices the average ho can afford now.


----------



## Baron (Nov 23, 2009)

A guy who takes a bad day into a life time experience and hasn't noticed yet.


----------



## Magnettica (Dec 19, 2006)

ATTN: Year Old Thread.


----------



## displacedtexan (Nov 24, 2009)

ATTN: Still a valid discusion. 

I'll add that hacks are usually the first to talk bad about others work. There is a local hack that knows me and several guys I do a lot of work with. We all have excellent repuations for doing great work, being good guys, and we all do high end stuff. He did work on trailers and cheap rent houses. Everytime we come up in conversation he feels the need to tell everyone that we couldn't buld a dog house.


----------



## wyoming 1 (May 7, 2008)

I love it when a guy with less than 20 post tells a guy with over 3000 post board etiquette.


----------



## displacedtexan (Nov 24, 2009)

Then you ought to love me. 

I'm new here. Not to forums. And post count doesn't mean much to me. 

I'm a pretty vocal, outspoken guy. Online, and in person


----------



## Cdat (Apr 18, 2007)

A hack is anyone who starts a thread: _"How much do you charge..."_


----------



## Magnettica (Dec 19, 2006)

The majority of posters here prefer new threads compared to rehashed one's. No big deal though. 

Welcome to the forum.


----------



## Markinthegarden (Nov 27, 2009)

displacedtexan said:


> ATTN: Still a valid discusion.
> 
> I'll add that hacks are usually the first to talk bad about others work. There is a local hack that knows me and several guys I do a lot of work with. We all have excellent repuations for doing great work, being good guys, and we all do high end stuff. He did work on trailers and cheap rent houses. Everytime we come up in conversation he feels the need to tell everyone that we couldn't buld a dog house.


I know this type, bitter and foolish. So I guess the doghouse market in your area is pretty competitive. 

A good business man never disrespects his competition to a potential customer, it would just make you look bad.

So a Hack is a trash talking dog house builder. Glad we cleared that up:clap:


----------



## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

A Hack is who I was when working entirely for someone else while being underpaid!!

No JK.


I just find it to be someone who doesnt care enough to do something right. To tear off a shingle with a low nail in it. 

Then again, I might think the way some other guys do things is the "hack" way although its worked for them their whole lifetime while they think the same of me.

It seems thata "hack" is usually whoever the person was that worked on the house before you, no matter how good of a job they actually did.


----------



## freemason21 (Aug 5, 2009)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> The person who fixed it the last time, 3 months ago, and now I have to go and take it all apart and start over. I followed a guy around like that for a year and a half, hell I gave out his name and # just so I was assured of some work in a few months. Maybe I should have called that cheap advertising.


 that is too funny


----------



## rselectric1 (Sep 20, 2009)

IMHO either of the following qualifies:

1. Obviously the work quality well below par, not following building codes, NEC, Plumbing code, etc. (usually because they don't know any better)

2. Fly by night or part time guys who don't pony up for insurance, comp, ACCEPT CASH FOR LESS and don't report it as income, etc. It's so hard to bid against these guys because they have very little overhead and can bid way lower than those of us who play by the rules. These are also usually the guys run for the hills if anything goes wrong and just relocate, or change their business name.


----------



## NormW (Jun 4, 2009)

Bah, I started reading this thread just before dinner, thought about my answer while eating, and doing the dishes. Only to come back up with my reply to see that its an "old post" :sad:

Oh well, I burnt a brain cell on this... so....

Silvertree put a bullet in the devil a year ago... I'll add one more

A hack is someone who has all the time and money needed, and still settles for less than he's capable of.


----------

