# T&M Billing Question



## steve-in-kville (Aug 30, 2006)

How closely are you guys itemizing on T&M jobs? Lets say you do a rewire or service upgrade... do you itemize every foot of wire, breaker, fixture, etc?? Or Simply list a labor cost and a material cost??

Thanks!!

steve


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## KillerToiletSpider (May 27, 2007)

I'm not an electrician, but I price mine out in footage of pipe, number of fittings, number of valves, etc., and put an amount for each item, then total it. We don't do much T&M work, but I like things to be detailed.


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## steve-in-kville (Aug 30, 2006)

I'm doing an extensive rewire of a garage as well as some landscape type lighting, fountains, etc. Its been an on-going job that I fit in whenever I can.

I itemized the "big" stuff like the panals, breakers, fixtures, devices, boxes and wire. Small stuff like hardware and conduit connectors I write up as "misc. material." I still keep track of what goes into it, but just don't itemize every little thing like some trades might.

steve


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## Speedy Petey (Sep 30, 2003)

Services almost never get priced T&M. You'll lose your shirt doing it that way. Folks have no clue what "off site" work goes into a service change.

Small jobs I price T&M and I itemize according to the job. Sometimes every piece gets listed, sometimes not, just a "material total".


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## jbelectric777 (Jun 1, 2007)

Always give an estimated cost this way they kinda know what the bill will be. Sometimes I give a " not to exceed " amount. As a pro you know how long it will take as well as the possible trouble you can run into. At the end I just give a total cost of work amount and there is no question. I have never had a customer want me to break it all down and if they did, I would say " I wont know all the material and other overhead until my supplier sends me my monthly statement. But they really shouldnt care and its none of their business. When I need to buy groceries in a store I dont ask them where or how much they paid for the food, I just pay what the cashier says.:thumbup:


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## mahlere (Aug 6, 2006)

or...you can just give them a firm price up front and give them a bill for that amount at the end...just a thought.


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## bhe (Feb 3, 2007)

I currently have two large T&M jobs, I charge no markup on materials (supply customer copies of receipts) and charge for every minute of work, whether I am sitting at home making calls, job planning, sitting at the supply house or actually doing the electrical work, all my time is billed. Works great for me so far, no risk with a guarenteed profit. I also get paid weekly on such projects.


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## macmikeman (Sep 12, 2005)

bhe said:


> I currently have two large T&M jobs, I charge no markup on materials (supply customer copies of receipts) and charge for every minute of work, whether I am sitting at home making calls, job planning, sitting at the supply house or actually doing the electrical work, all my time is billed. Works great for me so far, no risk with a guarenteed profit. I also get paid weekly on such projects.


Sounds all great. How about the cost of your phones, computers, printers, inks, paper, paper clips, desks, secretary?, Her desk?, office building rent, utilities, your vehicle, its gas, its oil, its insurance, its registration and fee's, its servicing like oil change, new tires, new brakes,etc, advertising, workmans comp, liability insurance, bonding insurance, postage charges,uniforms, P.O. box fee's, association fee's, Local license fee's, permit fee's, taxes, your retirement, your health insurance, your family's health insurance, your kids education, your teeth, your glasses, employee bonuses, tools, tool repairs, tool depreciation, workbelts, shoes, educational books, software, upgrades, downtime,downtime, downtime, downtime. etc. As long as you are also charging for all this stuff and more you should be fine.:whistling


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## MechanicalDVR (Jun 23, 2007)

*Overhead*

Every contractor should know what his real overhead is and his hourly rate should be adjusted accordingly. It's worth the investment in time to know the actual cost of doing work. Keeps us all out of bankruptcy court.


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