# first stringers



## Carpenter eyes (Jan 10, 2012)

Built my first set of basement steps today.





























Not done yet. One more tread and more support below


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## Greg (Mar 21, 2010)

Someone once said that the first time is always the best. That might have been about something else...
Good Job!!


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## Carpenter eyes (Jan 10, 2012)

Little stressful. Took my time and triple checked everything. Due to super unlevel floor some shimming was needed.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

Congrats!!

What did your riser:tread ratio turn out to be?


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## Carpenter eyes (Jan 10, 2012)

It worked out to 8 10


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## WildWill (Jun 6, 2008)

Nice! What is the deal with the part that is facing us though?


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

I never did them like that. Your's seem to tie-in past the end joist at the top.

Mine looked more like the one on the far left.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

Is that a 2x12 your using. Sure looks like you got a lot of meat left on the stringer for steps that meet code. I am normally left with about 4"


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

BCConstruction said:


> Is that a 2x12 your using. Sure looks like you got a lot of meat left on the stringer for steps that meet code. I am normally left with about 4"


Ya, I missed that. They do look beefy


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## Carpenter eyes (Jan 10, 2012)

WildWill said:


> Nice! What is the deal with the part that is facing us though?


Had to add a few more poinrs to tie into. New HEAVY furnence will be headed down those in the next few days. Thats y they are beefy like that. Also supporting with 4x4s on the top and mid. Rather overkill them then have them fail


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## thomasjmarino (May 1, 2011)

Little confused by jb's and Bc's posts. :confused1:
You always use 2x12's for stringers. Why wouldn't you?
Provides more structural stability.

And I always cut my stringers so they slide behind the box beam, top riser or whatever you would call it. And I cut them so that they sit flush to the underside of the deck boards, subfloor, etc.
Again, provides more structural stability.
You can fasten them much better this way.
Through the riser (box), decking or subfloor and the floor joist.


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

thomasjmarino said:


> Little confused by jb's and Bc's posts. :confused1:
> You always use 2x12's for stringers. Why wouldn't you?
> Provides more structural stability.
> 
> ...


I always screwed through rim joist of the top platform into the riser. And possibly Simpson make a stringer tie-in braket I used before, but they're ugly so it has to be hidden.


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## Carpenter eyes (Jan 10, 2012)

Yeah i used a 2x12 that was frozen. The workdrive dosnt like icy lumber :laughing:


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

Carpenter eyes said:


> Yeah i used a 2x12 that was frozen. The workdrive dosnt like icy lumber :laughing:


Neither do I. lol


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## Carpenter eyes (Jan 10, 2012)

jb4211 said:


> Neither do I. lol


Adds a few pounds lol


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

jb4211 said:


> I always screwed through rim joist of the top platform into the riser. And possibly Simpson make a stringer tie-in braket I used before, but they're ugly so it has to be hidden.


I always attach my stringers with approved lag bolts attached directly to piers we drive deep into the bedrock. Its the only way you can really be sure.


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## skillman (Sep 23, 2011)

Congrats on your first stringer steps well done.:thumbsup:


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## Carpenter eyes (Jan 10, 2012)

skillman said:


> Congrats on your first stringer steps well done.:thumbsup:


Thank you thank you


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

It is still rewarding to me ,after cutting out tons of stringers, to walk up the finished set. Good job! :thumbsup:


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## bluebird5 (Dec 13, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> I always attach my stringers with approved lag bolts attached directly to piers we drive deep into the bedrock. Its the only way you can really be sure.


But did you remeber to run the drain tile and gutter drainage directly into the mississippi?


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

I've seen many different ways people attach stringers, I can say I would not agree with some ways... But building hundreds if stairs and installing them, I always made sure the full back of the top stringer is fully rested against solid reinforced surface, and the bottom of the staircase stringer is also fully rested on sound solid surface and both ends properly anchored and secured preventing stairs from any movement. I don't believe notching top stringer and going under between the joist, or having the back of it hanging half way down or not fully seated on solid surface unsupported is wrong way of doing it . 

Stringers are important structural part of any stairway and they should handle a much better load the min load requirement is... If I was a building inspector, I would flunked 100 of decks just because of the way stairs were build and attached... and I am not surprised why there is so many deck builders around, but not many out there who know how to layout and build stairs the right way.


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## thomasjmarino (May 1, 2011)

jb4211 said:


> I always screwed through rim joist of the top platform into the riser. And possibly Simpson make a stringer tie-in braket I used before, but they're ugly so it has to be hidden.


:no::no:
Do it the way I said.
Sooooooo much better!! :thumbup:


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## RS Sam (Feb 9, 2009)

First set of stringers - always a milestone for a carpenter. Nice to have that under your belt :thumbsup:. Congrats.


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## Gus Dering (Oct 14, 2008)

It's a good feeling isn't it? 

Keep that feeling alive and you will never work again. :thumbsup:

Thanks for posting it. It has me feeling good too, mostly for you


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

First, I had no idea there were so many ways to build stair and cut stringers. I was trying to find a way that explained how I do it. I was never "taught". I learned by reading and doing. I always use 2 x 12's. I know some use 2 x 10's and I've seen plenty, but there isn't enough stock left for my fat ass when the stringer is finally cut unless a 2 x 12 is used. Plus, I think code calls for over 3" of material to remain between the corner of the thread/riser and the back of the stringer when cut. I know some use LVL's too.

Anyway, below is the best that I could find that explains how I do it. Is this wrong? I like to build steps where the final step is the actual landing and not a bump-out of sorts to the final landing. I think the latter looks weird.

http://www.finehomebuilding.com/PDF/Free/021100054.pdf


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## WildWill (Jun 6, 2008)

jb4211 said:


> First, I had no idea there were so many was to build stair and cut stringers. I was trying to find a way that explained how I do it. I was never "taught". I learned by reading and doing. I always use 2 x 12's. I know some use 2 x 10's and I've seen plenty, but there isn't enough stock left for my fat ass when the stringer is finally cut unless a 2 x 12 is used. Plus, I think code calls for over 3" of material to remain between the corner of the thread/riser and the back of the stringer when cut. I know some use LVL's too.
> 
> Anyway, below is the best that I could find that explains how I do it. Is this wrong? I like to build steps where the final step is the actual landing and not a bump-out of sorts to the final landing. I think the latter looks weird.
> 
> http://www.finehomebuilding.com/PDF/Free/021100054.pdf


I prefer to hook under the box at the top of the stairs and if the joists are running perpendicular then I tie into the next joist as well.


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

WildWill said:


> I prefer to hook under the box at the top of the stairs and if the joists are running perpendicular then I tie into the next joist as well.


I never did that, but it sounds like a more solid way to connect the stringers


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## chris klee (Feb 5, 2008)

The nice thing about stringer is after cutting a few sets it becomes easy. Rafters too.


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## WildWill (Jun 6, 2008)

jb4211 said:


> I never did that, but it sounds like a more solid way to connect the stringers


I like it for the cleanliness of it all. The less is more concept. 

Either works fine though. :thumbsup:


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

But Greg is talking about another way that I think is completely different for your, and my, way.


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## WildWill (Jun 6, 2008)

jb4211 said:


> But Greg is talking about another way that I think is completely different for your, and my, way.


I haven't seen a picture of what Greg is talking about. I did read the words but it didn't really explain much. Maybe I missed something?


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

WildWill said:


> I haven't seen a picture of what Greg is talking about. I did read the words but it didn't really explain much. Maybe I missed something?



agreed. I'm waiting for him to clarify


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

I gotta run, QFT (Quality Family Time)
But, I'm watching the post, because I'm confused.


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## thomasjmarino (May 1, 2011)

WildWill said:


> I prefer to hook under the box at the top of the stairs and if the joists are running perpendicular then I tie into the next joist as well.


:thumbup::thumbup:


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

I understand that, but what's Greg talking about. Because his design seems different


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

greg24k said:


> ...I always made sure the full back of the top stringer is fully rested against solid reinforced surface, and the bottom of the staircase stringer is also fully rested on sound solid surface and both ends properly anchored and secured preventing stairs from any movement.* I don't believe notching top stringer and going under between the joist, or having the back of it hanging half way down or not fully seated on solid surface unsupported is wrong way of doing it* .


This is the part that has me confused. :blink:


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## WildWill (Jun 6, 2008)

He might in part be talking about this situation.


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## katoman (Apr 26, 2009)

I do them the same as Wildwill. If the stringers are finished materials, like oak, that's the only way to do them and have the stringers finish cleanly into the ceiling.


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## JustaFramer (Jan 21, 2005)

I remember my first set of stairs. I thought I learned the best kept secret. :laughing: When I was doing piece work. Anyone could do wall, joists or truss roofs. Well anyone can wall bang. Joist should be easy but you can be surprised. Roof even truss can be challenging to a newb. 

Stairs are the gig I went for. Never needed a dumb **** partner for this gig. Rolled solo.


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

WildWill said:


> I prefer to hook under the box at the top of the stairs and if the joists are running perpendicular then I tie into the next joist as well.


Sometimes if not in all cases, the first tread of the stringer when coming off the deck must be notched around the rim joist and raised up to keep the same riser hight, which will create the the bottom point of the stringer under the first tread the weak point.


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## katoman (Apr 26, 2009)

Greg, where your arrow is pointing to the weak point, I use material size so that doesn't happen.


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## Willie T (Jan 29, 2009)

Am I the only one who believes in trying to incorporate a ledger under the tops, (if possible), and a full "stop block" across the bottoms?

No, the stringers and joist aren't drawn correctly on the left, I know that..... the picture is just to show the ledger.

And I would never do that bolt thing on the far left........ not without something else to help out. I'd probably cut the joist tails back, and fasten on a doubled header joist to their ends, and ledger that.


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## Warren (Feb 19, 2005)

I do them like that also Willie.


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

katoman said:


> Greg, where your arrow is pointing to the weak point, I use material size so that doesn't happen.


I know that but depends on the stringer size you use and how much of a notch you make. Even if using 2x12 stringer on decks after the notch you remove a good portion of the stringer.


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## WildWill (Jun 6, 2008)

Willie T said:


> Am I the only one who believes in trying to incorporate a ledger under the tops, (if possible), and a full "stop block" across the bottoms?
> 
> No, the stringers and joist aren't drawn correctly on the left, I know that..... the picture is just to show the ledger.


I don't ledger the tops of mine but I do stop block the bottoms depending on the situation.


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## Winchester (Jun 29, 2008)

WildWill said:


> I don't ledger the tops of mine but I do stop block the bottoms depending on the situation.


Same.


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

I made a little sketch and if you have a 2x12 with a 7.5" rise, and you make a notch and if you have 2x10 joist on the deck you will not have much left of that stringer which will make a very weak stair.


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## Gus Dering (Oct 14, 2008)

I always use a stop bock at the bottom like Willie. But just blocks in between the stringers at the top.

I have sent the stringers into the joists beyond the stairwell opening before but generally find that to only work where the joists are not that deep, say 2x6 up to 2x8. Taller floor systems and you have that issue Greg is pointing out.

If I have the room to determine the starting point of the stairwell, I just incorporate the first tread to be flush with the deck. Basically adding one tread to the length of the opening. This way the stringer can land on the face of the header. New framing, I can leave the subfloor extended into the opening to create the first tread with that and cut the stringers accordingly. I find this to be the easiest of them all.

The Prazi chain saw attachment was a nice tool for the production work for carpeted stairs. :thumbsup:


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## JustaFramer (Jan 21, 2005)

Stop block and simpson the tops.


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## Gus Dering (Oct 14, 2008)

greg24k said:


> I made a little sketch and if you have a 2x12 with a 7.5" rise, and you make a notch and if you have 2x10 joist on the deck you will not have much left of that stringer which will make a very weak stair.


 Greg,
Your measurement of the meat should be square to the bottom edge to the notch of the stringer. That will tell you what is left as structure.

Have you ever extended the notches up so there was some top edge of the stringer left un-cut to increase the meat below? That little void that is left under the leading edge of the stringer can be supported by the riser. It's one way to increase the strength of a staircase without wider material.


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

Gus Dering said:


> I always use a stop bock at the bottom like Willie. But just blocks in between the stringers at the top.
> 
> I have sent the stringers into the joists beyond the stairwell opening before but generally find that to only work where the joists are not that deep, say 2x6 up to 2x8. Taller floor systems and you have that issue Greg is pointing out.
> 
> ...


It's never a problem with interior oak box stairways, all you do is drop them in place and secure them... I stopped building my own stairs for the houses I build in the late 80's its cheaper to buy them then build your own this days... but I still love to mess around building deck stairs :thumbsup:


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

Gus Dering said:


> Greg,
> Your measurement of the meat should be square to the bottom edge to the notch of the stringer. That will tell you what is left as structure.
> 
> Have you ever extended the notches up so there was some top edge of the stringer left un-cut to increase the meat below? That little void that is left under the leading edge of the stringer can be supported by the riser. It's one way to increase the strength of a staircase without wider material.


I did my stairs this way 1 time and I didn't like it, it was to much of a pain in the a$$ and I re did the stringers my way.


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

Has anyone ever used the Simpson Ties pictured at the bottom? I have and I like them, they're just an eye sore.

Will, I've used blocking under the last, bottom step, but not at the top. In my opinion, if you notch the stringer to accommodate the ledger, you weaken the stringer from say a 2 x 12 to a 2 x 10. Same as if you notched joists. Just my opinion. Like Gus said, I've used blocking between the stringers before. I've done some pretty wide steps before, as much as 6 - 8 feet for a low deck (maybe five steps). I just bought those stringers. I think you can buy up to 6 steps off the shelf.

It may be a better way to attach the stringers, but I don't like the look of the top step being a bump-out from the actual landing.

http://www.strongtie.com/products/connectors/LSU-LSSU.asp#gallery


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

Here's a picture of one


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

jb4211 said:


> Here's a picture of one
> 
> View attachment 63835


USP has a concealed hanger out for the stringers, its a much better way to connect a stringer and it will be hidden and you can bend the seat also to match stringer slope.


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## JustaFramer (Jan 21, 2005)

I used to use roll strap for the tops. LS25 I think it was the 1 1/2 stuff. Used 8's for the nailing.


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## Rich D. (Oct 14, 2011)

I've used those Simpson stair hangers pictured below. What an eye sore.. 

I only went with one in the center stringer and on the left and right I went with just right angle brackets...


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

i use a hanger board.
1/2" plywood and nailed and screwed like crazy


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## Joe Carola (Jun 15, 2004)

This was a good thread on stringers a few years ago.

http://www.contractortalk.com/f50/aussie-stairs-american-style-43998/


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## redwood (Dec 5, 2007)

Assuming the basic stringer material is strong enough for your span and will not shrink very much, you can just lean the top of the stringer against a solid fascia and notch in the bottom to a solid plate, and you stringers cannot fall down. Basic geometry.

I guess I am just agreeing with Willie (without the top ledger) and Gus.


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