# Starting and growing a grading business (1 year update)



## Dodge jr (Jan 5, 2020)

Reply #12 for update

Hi all, my name is Jake Dodge and I own a little grading business in north Georgia. I'm new to the forum but not machinery. I'm looking for some advice that could help me grow my business and help starting out.

A little background, I'm young (16) but I've been running heavy equipment since I was old enough to reach the sticks. My dad had a company like this before the market crashed in 08 then he moved to a different job. Now the market is back up and I'm at an age where I believe I can get it back going. He still has all his equipment and tools for me to use. I'm licensed and insured under his old company name. I've done a couple jobs solo but he still helps me with his experience.

I'd say I'm pretty good at running equipment, at least compared to other my age. I've done sub work for pretty major companies in my area and they were impressed. I'm good with the tools, very ambitious and I want to see this company succeed. I know I've got a LOT to learn and thats why I'm here.

So if anyone could give advice on how to advertise to get work or basically anything you can think of to help me grow. I know my hourly charges, how to run all the equipment and tools, and the other basic stuff. I just want to get a little more experienced and smarter with how I'm running things. Thanks


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## NYCB (Sep 20, 2010)

Finish high school first.


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## Stunt Carpenter (Dec 31, 2011)

Work for someone else for a while. There is so much to learn still about every aspect of the business.


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## Dodge jr (Jan 5, 2020)

Hey guys, thanks for the responses. Obviously school comes first. I have every intention of finishing high school and possibly college. Weather that's tech school or a business degree. Haven't decided on that yet. I've never been the kind of person that will work fast food or retail. I believe that I should be happy with what I do and there is no better time to start than the present. And to be honest, I like toys. I own a boat, a respectable truck and a dirt bike is on the wishlist. We all know mcdonalds minimum wage doesn't pay enough for the addiction 

My age might throw some of y'all off but why start later in life when I can go ahead and get experience and stay ahead of the curve. I have worked for multiple companies both big and small. I got tons of experience with running a wider variety of equipment and learned some aspects of how plans come together, but one thing I never had the chance to see was the business side of it. I was hired as a laborer and that's what I was there to do.

As of now I am 5 jobs backed up and 3 that are still undecided. With estimates that range from $2000 up to $15k. I am able to get work, but I want more. After I graduate I plan on hiring another laborer to help with time management.

What I'm asking for here is a pros advice when it comes to money management and finances, what to look out for, how to build advertisement, and just lessons that you learned the hard way that could've been avoided if educated.

I know I've been rambling but I appreciate anyone who takes the time to read this and replies. Thanks in advance


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## NJ Contractor (Nov 12, 2016)

Get yourself educated. Start by reading books on running a business and try to hook up with a mentor or business coach early on. Nothing wrong with starting early but by taking some time to learn how to do things right will save you years of frustration and possible failure later. 

https://www.amazon.com/Running-Successful-Construction-Company-Pros/dp/1561585300/ref=pd_bxgy_img_3/138-5790942-9864332?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=1561585300&pd_rd_r=862b6e0d-f013-40f0-a8e6-c80ced696c21&pd_rd_w=Q3xPf&pd_rd_wg=ce38u&pf_rd_p=09627863-9889-4290-b90a-5e9f86682449&pf_rd_r=ZW2HHXRWHCD3B4ZHK78V&psc=1&refRID=ZW2HHXRWHCD3B4ZHK78V


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## rescraft (Nov 28, 2007)

Take a business course or two at a community college. Night school or even online.


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## Dodge jr (Jan 5, 2020)

Thank you guys for the input. I'm about to buy that book after I post this:thumbsup: . I've received multiple jobs since my last update and I'm just trying to keep up. I was given the opportunity to put a bid on a job that was estimated $250k +/- which I passed on to a buddy that runs a much larger company (previously worked for). I asked nothing out of him but advice and to remember me when work gets tough and money is tight. It was pretty cool to me to look at the plans and see what it takes to do a job at that caliber. Also thought it was neat to get that call from the civil engineer and realize how serious it was and he considered a 16 y/o to complete it for him. Helps me out a lot when the customer looks past my age. Although it was way out of my league, it gave me a lot of knowledge about the industry. Again, I know I'm just rambling but it's nice to get feedback from the more experienced.

I started saving up for a Harley a while ago but the way its looking, I'm going to need a bigger machine soon:thumbup:. Toys will just have to wait...


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

i really admire your ambition & wish i had half your energy.

i don't think i could legally have you on a job out here much less run equipment.

as young as you are i am very concerned that you will lose interest/burnout without making huge strides in your business.

there is a great deal of liability to be concerned with.

you should also amass a fairly large cash reserve for operating capital.

one thing you can count on machinery to do is break...at the least opportune time...

keep tight control of your finances. they will be very important should you go buy equipment or have to bond a job. 

although you may have the basic skills & intuition to run equipment you are WAY behind on the experience curve.

time fixes that.

learn to estimate & what is involved in coming up with a price.

learn basic business knowledge. accounting, marketing, tax implications, advertising etc.

network...get your name out there, meet people.

do not make every contact a sales pitch.

you seem to have a pretty good handle on writing, spelling etc, keep it up it is VERY important.

so is your language & conversation to prospective clients.

good luck.


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## Seven-Delta-FortyOne (Mar 5, 2011)

Dang, Hoss, doesn't sound like you need to advertise just yet. Sounds like you're pretty busy already. :thumbsup:

But that will change. That's the nature of construction.

So keep it in mind.

I'm actually quite surprised you are only 16. You sound more mature.

If you're getting the work, and your dad is experienced and can help you out with some of the stuff you don't know, there is not really any reason to go work for someone else. :no:

You'll learn a little more with each job. 

And when you have time, take some business classes, or just read all the classic construction business books.

TAKE IT SLOW. 

There is a lot to learn, and you don't want to get too big too fast.

Keep doing what you're doing. :thumbsup:

Good luck. :thumbsup:


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

one more thing...

get that word grading out of your head.

you are a dirt guy & that means ALL things dirt...

excavating, hauling, utilities, trenches, basements, footings, driveways,
slabs/pads...get my drift...:thumbsup:


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## Dodge jr (Jan 5, 2020)

Thanks guys. I really appreciate the advice. It is very beneficial for me and helps me out a lot.

I understand I’m young and all the legal issues. All documents and licenses are under my dads name. He basically “owns everything under the business and I’m just the kid trying to get some seat time” but in reality, I am making the decision and paying for advertisement and everything moving forward. Beside our current machine which are already paid for. I live in a very rural area and most of my jobs are for older gentleman who understand what I am trying to accomplish. And I can promise you that I will not lose interest. I realize that it is work but at the end of the day, I love running equipment. Owning a huge company is not in the plans right now. I just want to build an honest company that brings in a decent income. 

For every job I complete, I save a percentage of my hourly charge to cover machine damage. Which gets put in a separate account specifically for equipment. 

I know I am behind with experience and that is why I am here. Y’all are helping a ton with lessons that help me from learning the hard way. But in my opinion, the sooner the better and I should be more experienced then when people my age decide to start a business like mine

A lot of my jobs were collected by word of mouth. I’ve learned that no matter the job, if you leave the customer happy, then they will spread your name. 



I appreciate y’alls complement on my social abilities. It really gets under my skin when people talk uneducated and expect a serious response. 


I’ve learned that work comes and goes and some days aren’t as good as others. I save as much money as possible and try to spend only when needed. 

I have no interest is working for someone else again. I do not enjoy seeing things done unprofessionally which is a common practice with other companies. 

Like I said above, I truly want to learn and I am trying to do as much as I can. The plan right now is to stay small and keep it all. A huge company doesn’t excite me. I want to be able to keep things contained without all the headache. 

I do a lot more than just grading. Like the jobs you listed, I try and do it all. If my machines are capable. Then I will try my best to complete it. 

Thanks again


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## Dodge jr (Jan 5, 2020)

*UPDATE. *I know it’s a lot of reading so I appreciate those who take the time.

Hey everyone, it has been a little over a year and a LOT has changed. Not necessarily with capital but my mindsets and plans going forward. My parents are no longer together and I have faced some obstacles with my dad. He is trying to play a bigger part in the business and that is negatively effecting my share.

It’s hard for me to “push the cow off the cliff” because of the resources I have been blessed with. At the same time, I don’t see any growth if I continue with my dad. With that being said, I will have to start from scratch if I separate myself.

My mom is a CFO so she looks over my finances. She wants me to go 100% on my own and has offered to co-sign on a new machine to get me started. I am almost 18 so it is possible but I have a very hard time swallowing that pill of debt.

ANYWAYS that’s the story. Now for the info and questions.

Machine-
If I decide to buy a new, or fairly new, machine. What is my best choice (skid steer)? I’m leaning towards a used Deere 331g with less than 500 hours. Any input on that? Looking for power, not speed. Reliability is very important too.

Trailers-
If I go through with this deal I will need a trailer too. I hate hauling machinery in dump trailers but I feel like it would be useful. I also prefer gooseneck over bumper pull. What’s my best starter trailer? Money is a huge factor obviously

Tools and basic necessities-
Chains, binders, straps, diesel, grease, maintenance, tools, etc. It adds up quick. Do I go and just buy what I need because I will need it? Find “decent” stuff that’s used? That’s a factor that I feel is overlooked.

Invoices and estimates-
What are y’all using to make these? My process right now isn’t even worth explaining. It’s a pita and waste of time. I just need a quick and easy fill in the blank type deal.

I have been staying fairly busy. Trying to grow relationships just and much as I am trying to get jobs. It’s far from easy but I want it so I’m doing all I know to make it successful

Again, any other advice or knowledge is welcome. It can be completely irrelevant, I don’t care as long it teaches me something.

Apologies for the ranting. I am not trying to sulk or be dramatic. Just stating my situation so I can get applicable responses.

Thanks in advance to all that took the time


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## Mordekyle (May 20, 2014)

I would think about getting another CFO.

I don’t know how she can in essence “serve two masters. “

If you and your dad have had a falling out, I don’t see how she can walk the line. I don’t know if it’s fair to ask her to.

QuickBooks online works for my bookkeeping needs. It also gives you the ability to send estimates and invoices.

Are use Joist for my invoicing and estimating. It looks to be the same as QBO.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Dodge jr (Jan 5, 2020)

Mordekyle said:


> I would think about getting another CFO.
> 
> I don’t know how she can in essence “serve two masters. “
> 
> ...


I’m not necessarily asking her or throwing that title on her. She has always done that for us and she is very successful at it. My dad just never listened. She wants to do this for me and has put the offer on the table. She also retires in a few years so she won’t be too busy.

I’ll look into the software for invoices.

I appreciate the response and your opinion. It means a lot.


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## Dodge jr (Jan 5, 2020)

I have just been offered the opportunity to purchase all of my dads equipment for $100k.

This includes a Ram 4500, skid steer, mini excavator, gooseneck trailer, and about 15 attachments. The skid steer is getting wore out and I have no use for the 4500 so they would both get sold and replaced with a newer skid steer.

As of now, my only options going forward would be to buy out my dad for $100k or start from scratch with the bare minimum for roughly $60k. Again, I am 17 years old. My mom wants to help with the loan (I will pay full amount). I have had money and I have had debt but nothing at this caliber.


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## Kowboy (May 7, 2009)

If you can get your dad to hold the note, you'd be a fool to not buy the equipment. Jump in; you'll be fine.


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## mrcat (Jun 27, 2015)

What would you be replacing the truck with and why? Seems like a 4500 would be about the right size for what you're planning to do....I think I remember you said you have a pickup, is it big enough to pull the gooseneck with the equipment on it? 

What about the skidsteer, how many hours? Has it been nickel and diming your Dad? Can you use it for a year to get some cash built up before you upgrade?

It sounds like if you buy your Dad's equipment, you'd pretty much have everything you need to get to work? If so, I think I'd buy it and get to work. 

If you can accurately price jobs, it won't take you that long to pay off 100k. You'll definitely want to have a good handle on what your overhead will be so you can incorporate that into your pricing. 
One thing to keep in mind will be if you're only working part time so you can finish school, your insurance, tags, and loan payment still have to be paid, so your overhead cost per day will have to be higher than if you were working full time.

Good luck, you sound like a hustler, so you'll make it work one way or another. 

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## Dodge jr (Jan 5, 2020)

Thank you guys. I truly appreciate the advice and motivation

I have a 2017 Ram 2500 and it does just fine pulling the equipment. I honestly prefer it over the 4500 just because I keep all of my tools in mine. It might sound dumb but it’s just convenient for me.

The skid steer has 1700 hours on it so it’s not too high but it is 12 years old and has some quirks. It’s definitely not a good long term machine. I could sell the 4500, skid steer, and a few of the attachments that I have no use for. This would give me roughly $65k for a newer 80+ HP machine which would be perfect.

The PROBLEM. I was just informed that he is putting it all in auction in August and I have no chance at buying it. Not necessarily my fault. The way it sounds is that he is upset with my mom and I am just getting caught in the ripple effect.

With that being said, I am left with having to start from scratch. The bright side is that I have a supportive mom that has offered all the help I could ask for. I have been truly blessed with the cards I have been dealt but they all took hard work. I will make it work because I have no other choice than to do so. Time will tell

Again, thank you all sincerely


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## tgeb (Feb 9, 2006)

Not knowing what machines or what condition they are in, it's tough to say whether the $100K is a good deal for you or not.

You should get a trade in quote from a legit dealer, add everything up and you might be overpaying or getting a great deal. If you were to buy those machines, I'd keep the skidsteer for a while and not look at a replacement till you get some work and cash built up.

Even a quirky skidsteer can be repaired relatively cheaply compared to the payment plan on a new loader.

Best of luck!


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## Kingcarpenter1 (May 5, 2020)

Hey Jake 1st of all congrats on your hard work efforts. That desire without doubt, is what got us seasoned hands to the top of the business. Sounds like your Mom has done a great job so take care of her. I had to part ways w/family to go on the commercial chase when I was young & regret not being able to take care of mine. If your still in school, that’s 1st — above all. If something happens you can’t get your dad’s equiptment don’t let it get you down. Since he’s ready to shake it loose you can still work out a plan possibly. You’ve got a good truck & there are plenty of places to get good used equiptment. If not, things happen for good reason & will only make you stronger. Any seasoned hand on here has been in your shoes more than once, unless it’s a paper boy who had it all dumped in his lap. Keep us posted & it will work out

Mike


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## Dodge jr (Jan 5, 2020)

Here are the numbers I have collected. These are low balled for my protection.

2012 Ram 4500 tradesman with 130,000 miles. $30,000

2006 New Holland c185 with 1700 hours. $25,000

2008 New Holland e27 with 700 hours. $18,000. (Cheapest one I’ve found was $25,000 but I don’t see how)

Fairly new Big Tex 22gn gooseneck trailer. $8,000

Attachments value-
Disk mulcher= $8,000
Boom cutter= $6,000
Sheepfoot packer= $4,000
6-way dozer blade= $5,000
Grapple bucket= $2,000
Trencher= $2,000
Harley rake= $5,000
Toothed bucket and smith bucket= $1,500 for both
6ft and 4ft pallet forks= $1,000 for both
Stump bucket= $1,000

This comes out to a little over $100k. Like I said, I would sell the 4500, skid steer, and some attachments I have no use for. This would give me enough to purchase a newer skid steer while staying in the $100k loan.

With ALL of that said. It is now worthless because I have no option to buy it.

If I started over, let’s say I used the same $100k loan. This could get me a skid steer within 4 years old with 500 hours, A fairly new excavator the same size, and a new equipment trailer. This cuts out all attachments and the 4500. I don’t plan on doing that, but it’s good numbers to compare.

$60k-$70k could get me the skid steer I want (Again, not off the lot, but within a few years old with low hours.) and a new equipment trailer.


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## tjbnwi (Feb 24, 2009)

If you don’t have a CDL get it ASAP. 

Other than that, everyone else have covered your questions and offered solid advice.

Tom


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## Dodge jr (Jan 5, 2020)

tjbnwi said:


> If you don’t have a CDL get it ASAP.
> 
> Other than that, everyone else have covered your questions and offered solid advice.
> 
> Tom


I agree, I’ve done the studying and I can borrow an air brake truck from a friend. I’m just waiting to turn 18.

Right now, using my truck with an equipment trailer I am fine. But I have to lay low with the 4500 and gooseneck.


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## Kingcarpenter1 (May 5, 2020)

tjbnwi said:


> If you don’t have a CDL get it ASAP.


For sure. D.P.S. are a l l o v e r trucks & equiptment here. As I’ve stated before, there is a small town P.D. here & one patrol car does nothing but check equiptment/trailers as they exit Hgwy.

Mike


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## Dodge jr (Jan 5, 2020)

I talked to him for the first time since he offered to sell me everything. The offer is still in the table but his shop, land, and tools are still going to auction and I cannot buy. Buying him out is the better way to go in my opinion as of now


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## AustinDB (Sep 11, 2006)

agreed-buying him out seems like a wiser move then going out and buying newer stuff but not having as much at your disposal. 

if you end up buying machinery individually and your mom's not financing this, you could end up with separate loans with higher monthly payments than a single 100k loan. If the machinery is functioning fine, consider using it and not upgrading unless the upgraded machinery can make you more money/job (hour) than what you have made otherwise. there's got to be a reason to shell out $$ on new machinery-figure out if it's necessary because saving some cash up would be 'safe'.


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## aksrealtornc (May 9, 2021)

Dodge jr said:


> Thank you guys for the input. I'm about to buy that book after I post this:thumbsup: . I've received multiple jobs since my last update and I'm just trying to keep up. I was given the opportunity to put a bid on a job that was estimated $250k +/- which I passed on to a buddy that runs a much larger company (previously worked for). I asked nothing out of him but advice and to remember me when work gets tough and money is tight. It was pretty cool to me to look at the plans and see what it takes to do a job at that caliber. Also thought it was neat to get that call from the civil engineer and realize how serious it was and he considered a 16 y/o to complete it for him. Helps me out a lot when the customer looks past my age. Although it was way out of my league, it gave me a lot of knowledge about the industry. Again, I know I'm just rambling but it's nice to get feedback from the more experienced.
> 
> I started saving up for a Harley a while ago but the way its looking, I'm going to need a bigger machine soon:thumbup:. Toys will just have to wait...


Dodge Jr, Contact me for site work/grading partnership. I am very interested in running BIG business in that area. I have capital on hand. Email aksrealtornc at gmail dot com with your phone number.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

aksrealtornc said:


> Dodge Jr, Contact me for site work/grading partnership. I am very interested in running BIG business in that area. I have capital on hand. Email aksrealtornc at gmail dot com with your phone number.


What's your trade? Realtor?


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## aksrealtornc (May 9, 2021)

hdavis said:


> What's your trade? Realtor?


Realtor, home improvement and land development


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