# Mortar Colour Samples



## oxygenrace (Jan 15, 2013)

Tscarborough said:


> 3/8" plastic channel is what most samples are made in. You make a 6 or 8 foot section, then saw them down to 3-4" long. At 3/8" you can put them between two brick/block/rock, because looking at the mortar alone is a waste of time for final choice, it needs to be shown WITH the material it is being used with.


yes, i have seen those. I tried aluminum U channel which worked well but again came out too light, mainly because the metal would heat up in the summer i think.


if i could find some deep plastic channel that would be perfect, like 1" deep and 3/8' thick. Maybe drilling small holes in the bottom and sides would simulate the moisture leaving against the brick too. Maybe I am over thinking this whole thing!


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## oxygenrace (Jan 15, 2013)

fjn said:


> I do whatever it takes to talk a customer out of using mortar dye. Reasons being,it will weaken the mortar ever so slightly,the colors will change with day to day humidity changes,dampness of mortar at stiking changes color , however the biggest reason,colored mortar SHOULD NOT BE RETEMPERED EVER. If after all that explaining,if they still insist,i have them sign a disclaimer + all mortar discarded will be an surcharge.


good point. unfortunately, much of the work we do is repointing section of wall so we need to match the existing mortar. often the homes are old so there is lime involved and usually very course sand. If you use a sand that is not coarse enough the colour is too uniform and the match is not great. We often try and persuade the client to repoint larger sections so the match is not as critical. I have seen some pretty bad jobs out there!


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## Tscarborough (Feb 25, 2006)

The only way to get accurate color samples will be to use the mud with the materials you are laying, period. Everything else is an approximation.


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## oxygenrace (Jan 15, 2013)

Tscarborough said:


> The only way to get accurate color samples will be to use the mud with the materials you are laying, period. Everything else is an approximation.


good point. thanks


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

oxygenrace said:


> yes, i have seen those. I tried aluminum U channel which worked well but again came out too light, mainly because the metal would heat up in the summer i think.
> 
> 
> if i could find some deep plastic channel that would be perfect, like 1" deep and 3/8' thick. Maybe drilling small holes in the bottom and sides would simulate the moisture leaving against the brick too. Maybe I am over thinking this whole thing!


I don't think you are overthinking. I think that using a material that holds water to make your samples is the problem. What happens when you strike your joints when they're too wet or the unit gets wet? The joint goes too light. 

Use a channel that absorbs some of the water. Like I said, I've used wood that was misted before and kept in a cool damp environment while it cured and one of the bigger projects I did a mortar match on is still looking good 7 years later, I drive by it at least a few times a year.

Do what Tsacr says. Get some old bricks and cut fake joints in them. Or make some concrete pieces with channels maybe bring the paste up on one to see what the difference high and low absorption does to the joint.


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## KennMacMoragh (Sep 16, 2008)

Why not make a sample to show them? That's what I do, they can see what it will look like next to the stone. http://www.contractortalk.com/f48/flagstone-filler-options-125238/


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## oxygenrace (Jan 15, 2013)

KennMacMoragh said:


> Why not make a sample to show them? That's what I do, they can see what it will look like next to the stone. http://www.contractortalk.com/f48/flagstone-filler-options-125238/


well that's exactly what i want to do, but i want the sample in a container of some kind so i can use it over and over again. my problem is the samples seem to lighten when i put the sample in plastic or metal.


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## Tscarborough (Feb 25, 2006)

Here is the P/L box of the SGS color kit.


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

that sample box is at our local yard but it doesn't have anything close to the red that our local bricks are laid in, or the buff that the old lime mortar has changed to. The other problem is that it assumes only 2 choices, grey cement or white cement, no blends of lime/portland etc...


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## Tscarborough (Feb 25, 2006)

This one is Type N portland lime, I have them for MC N and S and used to have the P/L Type S. None for white cement, I had to make my own samples for that.


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## oxygenrace (Jan 15, 2013)

Tscarborough said:


> Here is the P/L box of the SGS color kit.


what are the dimensions of the channels the samples are made in. are they just clear plastic?


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

Tscarborough said:


> This one is Type N portland lime, I have them for MC N and S and used to have the P/L Type S. None for white cement, I had to make my own samples for that.


Really, the top 1/2 isn't regular type N and the bottom 1/2 isn't federal white?


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## Tscarborough (Feb 25, 2006)

No, the top is 1# loading, the middle is 2# loading, the bottom is 4# loading per bag of portland/bag of lime.


edit:


3/8"x3/8" plastic so they fit in brick hand samples.


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

Tscarborough said:


> No, the top is 1# loading, the middle is 2# loading, the bottom is 4# loading per bag of portland/bag of lime.


Ah ha


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