# 2012 Sprinter



## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> I want to be able to pull 14k pounds at least, if not more.
> 
> The sprinter can't do that.


You basically don't need to tow that much because your carting everything in the van vs a trailer that's 20+ ft long ! I pull a landscape trailer or rental type of trailer ! My tools go with me and carrying every thing I average 20 mpg but there's not much savings in terms of $ but it's a heavier duty drive train on a diesel !


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## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

BCConstruction said:


> Try another dealer. They should give you at least black book trade in price. That's the lowest of low.
> 
> I don't know what spec your truck is but as a comparison I just had my truck valued a few weeks back by dealer and he used BB and it come out to $32k and that's a 2009 f150 super crew 6.5 bed platinum 4wd with every option. Private sale under KBB is around $36k so that gives you an idea of difference between BB and KBB.
> 
> Dealer also said he would re sell truck at $38k so he would make 6k from me on a trade.


Try craigslist , I sold a ram and a e 250 van to get enough down payment , but after I hot the sprinter it almost kicked me to the next level and my jobs started to get better as the business looked more professional !


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

Craigslist is the worst place to sell anything. I got so much for sale on there at the moment it's unreal. All I get is people low balling me everyday. As an example I got a $1000 wakeboard and boots on there. I'm asking $350 as it is new and I mean brand new. Keep getting idiots send me emails saying they will give me $50-$100 for it all lol same goes for every other thing I have listed. I would hate to think how bad it would be putting vehicle on there. Rather take it to the dealer and not deal with that.


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

I need to haul old machinery on a consistent basis.

Most times I get about 10k pounds worth of stuff at a time, plus the trailer.

I would like a sprinter, but they can't tow that.


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## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

BCConstruction said:


> Craigslist is the worst place to sell anything. I got so much for sale on there at the moment it's unreal. All I get is people low balling me everyday. As an example I got a $1000 wakeboard and boots on there. I'm asking $350 as it is new and I mean brand new. Keep getting idiots send me emails saying they will give me $50-$100 for it all lol same goes for every other thing I have listed. I would hate to think how bad it would be putting vehicle on there. Rather take it to the dealer and not deal with that.


I go through that too but all it takes is one right person and it's sold ! If you want your price hang in there I sold a solo flex last week after 4 months , I sold a snow blower last year I was asking 450 kept getting offers 150 but then the right person came and I took $425


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## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> I need to haul old machinery on a consistent basis.
> 
> Most times I get about 10k pounds worth of stuff at a time, plus the trailer.
> 
> I would like a sprinter, but they can't tow that.


Yeah it's not a every day tow truck , I use it for reg tools , and materials , sounds like you need a durax for what your towing !


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## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

I would not hesitate to tow a 7x14 dump or enclosed trailer if I had too !!









Not all day or week long though !

I saw this at a show thought was interesting



















You can fit a lot in these trucks


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## Winchester (Jun 29, 2008)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> I need to haul old machinery on a consistent basis.
> 
> Most times I get about 10k pounds worth of stuff at a time, plus the trailer.
> 
> I would like a sprinter, but they can't tow that.


You can use a forklift and put the machines right into the sprinter.


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## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

I put a pallet of tile and all my tools no problem !


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

Winchester said:


> You can use a forklift and put the machines right into the sprinter.


For some things.

Not a jointer that is 8'+ long, tall BS and many other things.

It is easier to fork them on an equipment trailer and then fork them off.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> For some things.
> 
> Not a jointer that is 8'+ long, tall BS and many other things.
> 
> It is easier to fork them on an equipment trailer and then fork them off.


If you haul stuff like that on a regular basis I'd get a 24' box truck with a tommy gate. That's what I used when I hauled around commercial laundry equipment with my old man. Powered gate is a life saver.


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## Winchester (Jun 29, 2008)

BCConstruction said:


> depends. i have not heard what models they will have here but they would be silly not to do the high top models
> 
> this ones the standard model


I would definitely look at those if we had them.


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## Winchester (Jun 29, 2008)

Anyone hear that Fiat Ducato is supposed to selling under RAM for 2013?


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## Dirtywhiteboy (Oct 15, 2010)

Winchester said:


> Anyone hear that Fiat Ducato is supposed to selling under RAM for 2013?


Fiat bought Chrysler before the bailout.


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## Philthegreek (Jul 9, 2012)

About 5 years ago i was seriously thinking of purchasing a new vehicle. I knew a standard van was a no go even though I had a few in the past. I didn't like pick-ups (had those too).
I was looking at all those different service bodies on cutaway chassis, but since i am 6'-1" they all seemed lacking in height. I looked at the Sprinter rather seriously. At the time my wife was pregnant with twins and I have a daughter, then six, so I wanted a truck that I could possibly have room for them instead of having to switch vehicles for daycare pick-up and drop off and such.
The Sprinter 3500 series was $58,000.00 for a bare truck with the rear jump seat added. No racking, no organizing, no partitions. After financing, that came out to $1150/mo just P&I with a total of over $70K with all the origination, delivery, taxes, etc. Before I even invested in interior organization. I didn't have the fortitude for that kind of nut to crack.
The Sprinter 3500 had a TOTAL towing capacity of 5000lb. If I needed to get a bobcat to the worksite, I would have been SOL, so that was the final straw. Since then I have been constantly looking at the Sprinters around to see what kind of longevity they have. The MB diesel is super expensive to maintain and has had problems. They have had tranny issues as well. I have noticed a corrosion problem starting at the rocker panels and paint issues. All these things have made me glad i didn't take that plunge.
As far as space and design, I really like the way they look, but if the beauty is only skin deep it's a bad move.
Having a trailer does not work for me as there are too many lake communities that I do work in that are very tight. I wonder what the FIAT will be like. My experience tells me all the European offerings are underpowered and lack payload for what I need them to do.
Whatever you choose, it has to be the right total package that works the way you do. I'm glad there are a lot more choices these days.

Phil


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

I don't know where you got your pricing from but new 3500's now are $42k, 144wb high top including delivery. 
3500 have 5400 lb payload, 2500 has 3400 payload
I have a 2500 which has plenty of power, not underpowered at all

https://sprinterguy.wordpress.com/2011/12/05/2012-sprinter-3500-cargo-vans-in-stock/


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## Philthegreek (Jul 9, 2012)

From when I went to the 3 dealers in my area to find a truck to buy, that's where.
That was 5 years ago. I understand things change. Try adding up all the charges. I thought it was high when I looked back then, but 3 places were within $1K so .............. YMMV

Phil

P.S. I said "towing capacity" i did not mention payload.


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

Philthegreek said:


> My experience tells me all the European offerings are underpowered and lack payload
> Phil


ok then


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## Winchester (Jun 29, 2008)

They are far from underpowered but are usually not designed for towing.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

Winchester said:


> They are far from underpowered but are usually not designed for towing.


This is correct. European models normally have higher bhp per liter than the US models. The issue come when towing. It's vary rare I even see a van towing a trailer in the UK. When ever you needed to move bigger loads you used a flat bed van/lorry. 


And yes that transit you like the look of should be coming here. as far as I know it's currently in production.


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## Philthegreek (Jul 9, 2012)

rrk said:


> ok then


My truck is about 8500lbs empty and is about 13500lbs as is now and i can go over 14000lbs. My towing capacity is 12000lbs. That is what I mean by capacity. All that is motivated by a non turbo 7.3L diesel getting 10-11MPG. Not stellar, but I have everything with me all the time and it cost me the equivalent of 2 payment on a new sprinter. My cost per mile is minuscule compared to buying a new sprinter AND I have all the organization already built in, no added investment. I was also able to donate a lot of what was in the truck to my local volunteer FD.
I will say that maybe my perspective is a little skewed, but vehicle prices on average go up about 12%/yr and that makes it harder on all of us, especially during a down economy.Did not mean to start an argument, just add another viewpoint. Sorry!

Phil


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## GRB (Feb 23, 2009)

BCConstruction said:


> And yes that transit you like the look of should be coming here. as far as I know it's currently in production.


Ford will be discontinuing the E series this year, replacing it with the full size Transit, which will be built in KC for the North American market.


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## GRB (Feb 23, 2009)

Philthegreek said:


> Did not mean to start an argument, just add another viewpoint. Sorry!
> 
> Phil


Trouble maker! :thumbup:


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## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

Philthegreek said:


> From when I went to the 3 dealers in my area to find a truck to buy, that's where.
> That was 5 years ago. I understand things change. Try adding up all the charges. I thought it was high when I looked back then, but 3 places were within $1K so .............. YMMV
> 
> Phil
> ...


Your way off, I paid 34k for my 05! 70k is for a sprinter rv!


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## Philthegreek (Jul 9, 2012)

Five Star said:


> Your way off, I paid 34k for my 05! 70k is for a sprinter rv!


And I'll bet it's fully loaded with Festools too. 
Yer not much into reading everything, are you. I said when all was said and done Including taxes, title, jump seat plus installation, deliver and prep AND financing, that was about where the price was. And that was for a 3500 series. I had no trade-in either.

$34K sale price
$2720 sales tax
$500 delivery
$200 Title and Registration
______________________
$37420 @7% =$741/mo or $44460 total cost


No need to get nasty about it:whistling

Phil


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## TimNJ (Sep 7, 2005)

Philthegreek said:


> ______________________
> $37420 @7% =$741/mo or $44460 total cost
> 
> 
> ...


 Phil,

In all fairness when most people talk about vehicle pricing they don't put that figure in.


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## Philthegreek (Jul 9, 2012)

I would like to amend what I wrote earlier with regards to size. I had priced the 170 wheel base model 5 years ago. 
Just got off the phone with MB

MSRP $47280 Without jump seat
$1000 jump seat plus install
$2900 sales taxes
$1000 delivery and prep
$400 Title and commercial registration 
________________________________
$52580 Cash Money 60mo financing @ 4.9% = $992.25/mo = $59535.00

When i looked 5 yrs ago it was 8% financing = $1066/mo = $63960.00

For discussion sake. 

Phil

BTW 5Klb Tow capacity WITH the tow package (they now offer 7500lb but only on the smaller WB, but also a lower GVWR so it ends up a wash for total curb weight capacity)


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## GRB (Feb 23, 2009)

Philthegreek said:


> I would like to amend what I wrote earlier with regards to size. I had priced the 170 wheel base model 5 years ago.
> Just got off the phone with MB
> 
> MSRP $47280 Without jump seat
> ...


I get where you're coming from, Phil. However, I think if you're going to factor juice into the equation, it's only fair you also factor in any write-offs, including depreciation, then also take into account the residual value. 

Finally, consider how the vehicle will affect your bottom line, not just in money out each month, but in any increase in efficiencies, visibility (mobile billboard opportunity), reduced down time, etc. IMHO that's the only way to get an accurate idea of what the real costs are to a business. Oh, & money's cheap these days, so I'd take issue with the 5% juice figure. I checked recently & 3% seems to be readily available for vehicle financing if you shop around. 

Just sayin'... :whistling


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## Philthegreek (Jul 9, 2012)

GRB said:


> I get where you're coming from, Phil. However, I think if you're going to factor juice into the equation, it's only fair you also factor in any write-offs, including depreciation, then also take into account the residual value.
> 
> Finally, consider how the vehicle will affect your bottom line, not just in money out each month, but in any increase in efficiencies, visibility (mobile billboard opportunity), reduced down time, etc. IMHO that's the only way to get an accurate idea of what the real costs are to a business. Oh, & money's cheap these days, so I'd take issue with the 5% juice figure. I checked recently & 3% seems to be readily available for vehicle financing if you shop around.
> 
> Just sayin'... :whistling


Sure, all those things have to be taken into consideration. I think the rolling billboard aspect of it is worth serious $$$. The truck i just priced also has no organization, ladder rack, etc., And based on what is at the shows these days, that is an entirely other huge nut to crack.

My initial balk at the vehicle when I had looked at it seriously in capacity. They have come a ways since then with things like assisted handling and the like. I still like the styling though and the other "Eurovans" all seem to mimic the lines.

I think the most important number is total cost per mile and whether your business can deal with that number and remain profitable. Whether single truck or multiples. Just the base numbers seem pretty scary to me.
Then again, last year cost us 32500 just in child care and NONE of that was deductible.

Phil


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## Winchester (Jun 29, 2008)

My options for having something I can stand up inside:

Trailer, Cube Van, or Eurovan.

Parking is an issue so that leaves cube van or eurovan, and I'll choose a fuel-efficient eurovan that is a pleasure to drive, even if it costs more money.

The last time I had to have a skidsteer on site for myself was 2 years ago and I had it delivered. I'm not going to buy a truck with a towing capacity for that if I only need that kind of capacity once every few years.


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## Philthegreek (Jul 9, 2012)

Everybody has to find the vehicle that works best for them. I definitely like the fact that the Eurovans have a narrow stance. 
One thing I always liked about the Ford vans was that they used an actual chassis rather than unibody. Their frames were really rugged and serviceable. The Fords were also quieter than the Chevy or Dodge counterparts. It's really too bad they never got into building higher/taller vehicles on that chassis base. All the para ambulances that you see around always looked like an afterthought.


Phil


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

Philthegreek said:


> About 5 years ago i was seriously thinking of purchasing a new vehicle. I knew a standard van was a no go even though I had a few in the past. I didn't like pick-ups (had those too).
> I was looking at all those different service bodies on cutaway chassis, but since i am 6'-1" they all seemed lacking in height. I looked at the Sprinter rather seriously. At the time my wife was pregnant with twins and I have a daughter, then six, so I wanted a truck that I could possibly have room for them instead of having to switch vehicles for daycare pick-up and drop off and such.
> The Sprinter 3500 series was $58,000.00 for a bare truck with the rear jump seat added. No racking, no organizing, no partitions. After financing, that came out to $1150/mo just P&I with a total of over $70K with all the origination, delivery, taxes, etc. Before I even invested in interior organization. I didn't have the fortitude for that kind of nut to crack.
> The Sprinter 3500 had a TOTAL towing capacity of 5000lb. If I needed to get a bobcat to the worksite, I would have been SOL, so that was the final straw. Since then I have been constantly looking at the Sprinters around to see what kind of longevity they have. The MB diesel is super expensive to maintain and has had problems. They have had tranny issues as well. I have noticed a corrosion problem starting at the rocker panels and paint issues. All these things have made me glad i didn't take that plunge.
> ...



your only 6'1''?i thought you were taller then that:turned:


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## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

Winchester said:


> My options for having something I can stand up inside:
> 
> Trailer, Cube Van, or Eurovan.
> 
> ...


Win , check out some used sprinters , if parking is a issue get the 3500 short wheel base , it's still like 11' inside and believe me you'll never look back , it's a rolling billboard , I get calls and looks all the time !


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## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

Philthegreek said:


> Everybody has to find the vehicle that works best for them. I definitely like the fact that the Eurovans have a narrow stance.
> One thing I always liked about the Ford vans was that they used an actual chassis rather than unibody. Their frames were really rugged and serviceable. The Fords were also quieter than the Chevy or Dodge counterparts. It's really too bad they never got into building higher/taller vehicles on that chassis base. All the para ambulances that you see around always looked like an afterthought.
> 
> Phil


Unibody is stronger and quieter ride , there's no rattling or over bounce like the ford ,chevy,dodge vans , it's a much smoother ride !


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## Philthegreek (Jul 9, 2012)

Five Star said:


> Unibody is stronger and quieter ride , there's no rattling or over bounce like the ford ,chevy,dodge vans , it's a much smoother ride !


Dodge and Chevy ARE unibodies.
But hey, I'll admit "Yours is bigger than mine" and call it a day:yawn:


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

Chevy's got the ride,everybody knows that:whistling


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## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

Philthegreek said:


> Dodge and Chevy ARE unibodies.
> But hey, I'll admit "Yours is bigger than mine" and call it a day:yawn:


Your right way bigger , and sharper, don't be hating 

To me it's not about the size , I bought my truck to fit my needs , not to compete with anybody , Or impress any one here ! I had a e250 extented with the triton v8 before that I worked out of pickups , the ford van was good for 2 years or so, i out grew it quick , for me the sprinter was Ia good median between the ford van and a box truck , it's gas mileage back in 05 wasn't a issue ! 

If your happy with your ford and it suits your needs then all the power to you , but you came on here complaining sprinter was to expensive for you so obviously it's a bad truck because you can't afford it ! And your point on the festools in my truck let me guess there crappy tools and there way to over priced like the sprinter ?


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## Philthegreek (Jul 9, 2012)

Five Star said:


> Your right way bigger , and sharper, don't be hating
> 
> To me it's not about the size , I bought my truck to fit my needs , not to compete with anybody , Or impress any one here ! I had a e250 extented with the triton v8 before that I worked out of pickups , the ford van was good for 2 years or so, i out grew it quick , for me the sprinter was Ia good median between the ford van and a box truck , it's gas mileage back in 05 wasn't a issue !
> 
> If your happy with your ford and it suits your needs then all the power to you , but you came on here complaining sprinter was to expensive for you so obviously it's a bad truck because you can't afford it ! And your point on the festools in my truck let me guess there crappy tools and there way to over priced like the sprinter ?


That was not what i was alluding to, and if you were as sharp as you say you would have gotten that.You seem to be passionate about your sprinter in the same way Festool owners are passionate about their Festools, That was what I was alluding to.
Secondly, My first post in this thread just gave an example from my experience, I did not knock the truck, in fact I mentioned more than once in this thread that I liked the truck. The OP brought up price and I put $$$ in there for him to compare. I also mentioned that I continued to look at the truck as a possibility, but kept a eye on others in my area to see how they held up in case I were to revisit the purchase.
Then you mentioned $34K and got all hot because my numbers were higher and just couldn't be right, so I called the local MB dealer and had a chat. The subsequent #'s were from that chat and my additional point is that sticker/purchase price are not the only numbers one has to look at for a "real" number upon which to make a decision.
Then Greg pointed out some things I had not mentioned that would balance out some of my numbers.
I also mentioned twice that the OP should go for a truck that works for HIM and the way that he works. If it turns out that the Sprinter is that truck, GREAT! You are the one being the contrarian for no good reason. You want to be the rightest, OK, you're the rightest.:thumbsup:

Phil


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

:shifty:


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## sunkist (Apr 27, 2012)

yes sir that mb (sprinter) van is our #1 concern in the service drive, screw that guy with the amg, we love vans!, and we charge mb prices to fix um, wait for the ford transit, awd, fwd, rwd, gas, desiel, lwb, h/top, crew cab, rear doors, lift gate, google transit u.k.


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## GRB (Feb 23, 2009)

Tom Struble said:


> Chevy's got the ride,everybody knows that:whistling


And no doubt that's important to you, given all the probing you claim to have undergone. :blink:


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## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

Philthegreek said:


> About 5 years ago i was seriously thinking of purchasing a new vehicle. I knew a standard van was a no go even though I had a few in the past. I didn't like pick-ups (had those too).
> I was looking at all those different service bodies on cutaway chassis, but since i am 6'-1" they all seemed lacking in height. I looked at the Sprinter rather seriously. At the time my wife was pregnant with twins and I have a daughter, then six, so I wanted a truck that I could possibly have room for them instead of having to switch vehicles for daycare pick-up and drop off and such.
> The Sprinter 3500 series was $58,000.00 for a bare truck with the rear jump seat added. No racking, no organizing, no partitions. After financing, that came out to $1150/mo just P&I with a total of over $70K with all the origination, delivery, taxes, etc. Before I even invested in interior organization. I didn't have the fortitude for that kind of nut to crack.
> The Sprinter 3500 had a TOTAL towing capacity of 5000lb. If I needed to get a bobcat to the worksite, I would have been SOL, so that was the final straw. Since then I have been constantly looking at the Sprinters around to see what kind of longevity they have. The MB diesel is super expensive to maintain and has had problems. They have had tranny issues as well. I have noticed a corrosion problem starting at the rocker panels and paint issues. All these things have made me glad i didn't take that plunge.
> ...


Need I say more?


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

don't act all inocent like you never been:thumbsup:..no wait..:thumbup:
no wait..:donatello:


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

please don't 5star:sad:


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## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

Philthegreek said:


> That was not what i was alluding to, and if you were as sharp as you say you would have gotten that.You seem to be passionate about your sprinter in the same way Festool owners are passionate about their Festools, That was what I was alluding to.
> Secondly, My first post in this thread just gave an example from my experience, I did not knock the truck, in fact I mentioned more than once in this thread that I liked the truck. The OP brought up price and I put $$$ in there for him to compare. I also mentioned that I continued to look at the truck as a possibility, but kept a eye on others in my area to see how they held up in case I were to revisit the purchase.
> Then you mentioned $34K and got all hot because my numbers were higher and just couldn't be right, so I called the local MB dealer and had a chat. The subsequent #'s were from that chat and my additional point is that sticker/purchase price are not the only numbers one has to look at for a "real" number upon which to make a decision.
> Then Greg pointed out some things I had not mentioned that would balance out some of my numbers.
> ...



Bigger, righter, prettier hahaha !


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

what did you wait for Phil to go to bed to come up with those post?:whistling


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## Five Star (Jan 15, 2009)

Tom Struble said:


> what did you wait for Phil to go to bed to come up with those post?:whistling


Yeah , I'm sure this will lead into a kapex/ Makita debate in the morning!


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

Five Star said:


> Yeah , I'm sure this will lead into a kapex/ Makita debate in the morning!


There's no debate. The Kapex wins and so it should at more than triple the cost.


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

Here is the pricing for the 2013 sprinters, an increase of 1% over 2012

http://sprinterguy.files.wordpress....guide-introduction-base-prices-and-colors.pdf

does anyone know about pricing for the transit van?

I have the 144 wb the 170 wb is 18' from door to seat back I believe. I downsized from a 16' box truck and increased my mpg from 13 to 20


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## bdoles (Sep 11, 2007)

If you're looking for something used and from a "fleet", check out this eBay dealer - http://stores.ebay.com/corporatefleetvehicles?_trksid=p4340.l2563

I've been shopping and this is one place I routinely check.


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## gastek (Mar 29, 2011)

What the..... A local car dealer is selling a 2004 Dodge Sprinter with almost 165,000 miles for $11,900??? Are you kidding me. These things have that much value to them even at 8 years old and that many miles? Do they never run out of gas or something? That seems crazy.


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## GRB (Feb 23, 2009)

gastek said:


> What the..... A local car dealer is selling a 2004 Dodge Sprinter with almost 165,000 miles for $11,900??? Are you kidding me. These things have that much value to them even at 8 years old and that many miles? Do they never run out of gas or something? That seems crazy.


We bid on one a couple years ago at an auction for a lumberyard that went out of business. IIRC, it was an '05 with something like 80k on the clock. I dropped out at $15k. It ended up going for well over $20k.


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