# Would you wear someones else's company shirt on a job??



## marc (Mar 18, 2005)

We hire subs for all of our work. If you don't want to wear our shirts that's ok. You just won't work on our jobs. Plenty of subs out there. If you don't like it go work for another GC


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## Bill Z (Dec 10, 2006)

You want the work. He wants you to look presentable and not interfere with his image. You can easily figure out a compromise so neither of you gets your feelings hurt.

Buy some blank shirts that match the look of his company shirts. Go to the job, do your work and focus on whatever it is that you do best.


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## Mike's Plumbing (Jul 19, 2010)

marc said:


> We hire subs for all of our work. If you don't want to wear our shirts that's ok. You just won't work on our jobs. Plenty of subs out there. If you don't like it go work for another GC


Geez, how can I say this in my normally nice way.

Alright, here goes. I used to work for contractors with that attitute of "Your a dime a dozen" yeah, I got work, yeah I got paid but it sucked. After I figured out how to market myself I was able to get away from GC's with this attitude. People demand Mike's Plumbing and because of my marketing they expect ME in my uniform and marketing on my truck. Now the competition is the resident house slave to these people. I can see wearing it for a special job but beyond that forget it.

I especially love it when the owner tells the GC they have no choice but to have me do the plumbing, that's marketing. This is happening more and more for me. That type of attitude of "it's all about me and your nothing" is something I managed, finally, to eliminate.:clap: Man did you make me feel good this morning, thank God I no longer have to work in that sweat shop mentality. The GC's I work for love my shirts and image on the truck, because that's what the consumer really want's to see "GC's that have quality people". Most of the time GC's do this because they hire substandard subs to save a buck.

Mike


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## CookeCarpentry (Feb 26, 2009)

I had a paper-pusher GC do this to me once.

I came recommended to him thru another sub of his. We met off hours (I had my wife's car). Talked about scope of work, compensation, etc.

He said, all subs are required to wear my shirts.

The wage was above fair, and the job was about a month long, so I figured, what the heck. 

Day 1 I pull up with a 16' enclosed trailer with my company info all over it, and step out in his shirt....he almost crapped himself (or maybe he did, I don't really want to know....)


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## Mike Finley (Apr 28, 2004)

Show me a GC who is lying to his customers that he isn't using any subs and you'll show me a GC who is surely lying about many other things. This is the same guy who is 1099ing employees treating them as subs financially, not paying WC and illegally reducing overhead so he can out bid you on jobs.

You can't tell a sub to wear your shirt, it's a simple as that. The IRS is very strict on what entails a sub and what entails an employee. 

This GC is nothing more than a douche bag lieing to his customers and bending rules to his financial benefit because he is weak. He's no different then the guy who pays under the table, the guy that uses illegals, just a simple loser low-baller trying to game the system where ever he can. 

Hope his check doesn't bounce when you finally wrestle it out of him after the arguments over the work, which are sure to be part of his baggage. Where there is smoke there is fire. For all of those who think there is nothing wrong with this simple little trick he is pulling over the customer, I wonder how quickly you would go along with the rest of his bag of tricks? Like when you do some extra work on this job and he starts playing his games about paying you for it? Or when he drops his most used one of all - You get paid when I get paid.

You'll probably just smile and take it, while you're looking like some stupid dumb ass standing there with his company shirt on! :laughing:


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## Mike's Plumbing (Jul 19, 2010)

Mike Finley said:


> Show me a GC who is lying to his customers that he isn't using any subs and you'll show me a GC who is surely lying about many other things. This is the same guy who is 1099ing employees treating them as subs financially, not paying WC and illegally reducing overhead so he can out bid you on jobs.
> 
> You can't tell a sub to wear your shirt, it's a simple as that. The IRS is very strict on what entails a sub and what entails an employee.
> 
> ...


Yeah.....That's another way to say it. :w00t:


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## handyhands (Sep 8, 2008)

marc said:


> We hire subs for all of our work. If you don't want to wear our shirts that's ok. You just won't work on our jobs. Plenty of subs out there. If you don't like it go work for another GC


I agree.

We have our own in-house installation teams/ crews. They are employees.

We are licensed, insured, etc.

However, if we WERE subbing jobs out, I would have no problems making it a point that if it were MY company that had invested the marketing dollars in generating what turned out to be that sale, what's wrong with making it a requirement that any and every person on that job site,...That is working FOR me,...Again, on MY job,...being asked to wear a nice, logo'd company shirt, issued by the company that HIRED YOU to do the work,..Paying you to do the work,....

I mean,....call me stupid,..but-doesn't it look alot more professional to have everyone in "uniform", so to speak? Helping to brand/ market YOUR company?

Why the heck do you want someone on your jobsite advertising for THIER company?

Makes sense to me, but what do I know.:no:

If you're going to get your panties in a bunch about having to wear someone elses t-shirt, then you should be doing your OWN marketing,...generating your OWN business....signing your OWN checks,..and buying your OWN shirts.

-Just my thoughts.


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

Oh, just work naked.


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## ApgarNJ (Apr 16, 2006)

How can there be GC's out there who SUB all their work out, they don't do anything?? That to me is a paper contractor and they shouldn't expect anyone to wear their shirts. I only sub out the work that I don't want to do , or can't legally do because I'm not licensed to do so.


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## JumboJack (Aug 14, 2007)

marc said:


> We hire subs for all of our work. If you don't want to wear our shirts that's ok. You just won't work on our jobs. Plenty of subs out there. If you don't like it go work for another GC


So you're going to insist that any plumbing or electrical sub (or any sub for that matter?) that you hire must wear your company shirt or they can hit the road???:blink:


Do they have to have their truck re-lettered too?




.....:laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## JumboJack (Aug 14, 2007)

handyhands said:


> I agree.
> 
> We have our own in-house installation teams/ crews. They are employees.
> 
> ...


A true sub is not your employee.They are their own employer.They are doing work for you as a subcontractor,not an employee.They pay their own insurance and employee burden....Are you saying that a sub must make HIS employees wear YOUR company shirt?...
Say a plumbing sub sends a crew out to work on your job.He may have spent money on uniforms to keep his crew looking nice.And then they are suposed to take them off and put on your shirts?Are ya' nuts?


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## Darwin (Apr 7, 2009)

I can't imagine going to a worksite ready to work and the guy who's contracting with me says, "Dude. Take yer shirt off and slip into somethin' mo' comfortable."

...........

"You mean, I gotta show my boobies? I didn't even wear my pasties!"





:shutup:


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## Warren (Feb 19, 2005)

I am surprised you guys are getting all huffy over nothing. Maybe its different for me I dunno. I have had company shirts made up on many occasions. I give them to employees, family, friends, other subcontractors, etc. I do not require employees to wear these shirts ever. I also don't think I have ever gotten work from me or any of my guys wearing one. To me they are not much of a marketing tool, but just a way to look a little more professional and show some pride in your employer. I have never experienced the situation where someone would require me to wear one. If I do, I would probably just consider it as getting a few free shirts. What is wrong with that. I do agree with Finley though that if other things follow, it is time to lay down the ground rules.


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

this is common practice,some want it some done,you decide who you want to do work for


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## JumboJack (Aug 14, 2007)

Warren said:


> I am surprised you guys are getting all huffy over nothing. Maybe its different for me I dunno. I have had company shirts made up on many occasions. I give them to employees, family, friends, other subcontractors, etc. I do not require employees to wear these shirts ever. I also don't think I have ever gotten work from me or any of my guys wearing one. To me they are not much of a marketing tool, but just a way to look a little more professional and show some pride in your employer. I have never experienced the situation where someone would require me to wear one. If I do, I would probably just consider it as getting a few free shirts. What is wrong with that. I do agree with Finley though that if other things follow, it is time to lay down the ground rules.


I agree with you about giving them out.If a guy want's to wear one great.
But it is nuts to think I could insist on a subcontractor wearing one and forcing his employees to wear one.


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## Mike's Plumbing (Jul 19, 2010)

Technically, by that rational, if a GC is say....building a McDonalds then McDonalds could make you wear a "drive through service" uniform because they did the marketing, they created the work and the GC benefits just like the subs do. The fact is McDonalds would never do that unless to build a co-op marketing effort for team building.....something I have been part of on great big jobs. In fact I can't imagine McDonalds insurance company would allow it.

When I was an employee back in the day I worked for some big national GC's and they wanted us, and encouraged us to wear our own company uniforms. They were proud to hire the subs they did and create a team environment, that's why they are a national company I suppose.

All in all it's not worth making a mountain out of a mole hill. Although If McDonalds wants me to wear a drive through uniform I'll tell them where to go......Hello sir, can I take your order.

Mike


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## woodworkbykirk (Sep 17, 2008)

in regards to mike finleys post. a few years back i was looking for work, got on with a trim specialist. total douchebag of a sub, he works his guys like dogs expects absolute perfection with above par production. you were his employee yet pays his guys as subs good idea in a way for tax reasons but when top guy was only making $15/hr totally sleazy... so technically a sub yet an imployee having to wear buddys company shirts and hats even hardhats


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## Walker1 (Apr 22, 2007)

marc said:


> We hire subs for all of our work. If you don't want to wear our shirts that's ok. You just won't work on our jobs. Plenty of subs out there. If you don't like it go work for another GC


A worker is an employee when the business has the right to direct and control the worker.

Marc you are walking a fine line if you sub out all your work and treat your subs or should I say companies you hire like you do.

http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/article/0,,id=179111,00.html


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## ApgarNJ (Apr 16, 2006)

Warren said:


> I am surprised you guys are getting all huffy over nothing. Maybe its different for me I dunno. I have had company shirts made up on many occasions. I give them to employees, family, friends, other subcontractors, etc. I do not require employees to wear these shirts ever. I also don't think I have ever gotten work from me or any of my guys wearing one. To me they are not much of a marketing tool, but just a way to look a little more professional and show some pride in your employer. I have never experienced the situation where someone would require me to wear one. If I do, I would probably just consider it as getting a few free shirts. What is wrong with that. I do agree with Finley though that if other things follow, it is time to lay down the ground rules.


It's not about getting ONE job or 100 jobs from people seeing your tshirts.

I make them up and make employees wear them, I even make them for my kids and friends and hand them out. It's name recognition. you want people in the area to get used to seeing your truck, signs, shirts etc. this is how people get familiar with you..

it's also the best way to look professional. I've been telling my roofer for years to make his beer drinking, smoking losers he has working for him, wear tshirts with his company name. it's been 10 years since he made tshirts for hi business so they just come to work looking like slobs. I know they are on the roof, but still, they should be wearing the same shirts. I even go so far as to ask employees after they've been with me a little while to buy the same shorts or pants(same color and brand) as I do. It just looks better that way.


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## opiethetileman (Apr 7, 2005)

well if he is paying you just wear the shirt not a big deal. tell the guy you only wear silk camp shirts to work. And trust me he wouldnt like me wearing his shirts with a set of daisy duke shorts and the shirt tied in a knot suckin on a lolipop all day in flip flops. That would cure the problem of your not his employee.


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## Mike Finley (Apr 28, 2004)

opiethetileman said:


> well if he is paying you just wear the shirt not a big deal. tell the guy you only wear silk camp shirts to work. And trust me he wouldnt like me wearing his shirts with a set of daisy duke shorts and the shirt tied in a knot suckin on a lolipop all day in flip flops. That would cure the problem of your not his employee.


 
:w00t::laughing:


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

If you're a big enough operation to have "uniforms", and a GC hires you as a sub, he's asking a bit much for you to go undercover by wearing his instead. And he should know that.

If you and your guys generally wear nondescript t-shirts and blue jeans, it won't hurt your image a bit to wear some free new clothes on that job. Not a problem.


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## Mike Finley (Apr 28, 2004)

handyhands said:


> However, if we WERE subbing jobs out, I would have no problems making it a point that if it were MY company that had invested the marketing dollars in generating what turned out to be that sale, what's wrong with making it a requirement that any and every person on that job site,...That is working FOR me,...Again, on MY job,...being asked to wear a nice, logo'd company shirt, issued by the company that HIRED YOU to do the work,..Paying you to do the work,.....


 
It's f'n total fraud? How about we start there? A company uniform is worn by an employee of that company. 

Bob's employees where his company shirts.

Ralph's employees where his company shirts.

When Bob hires Ralph to do a job for him, Ralph wear's Bob's shirts? WTF??

There isn't even a bit of logic to this in the least.

It's all about a big fat lie to the customer to pretend everybody on the job site is your employee. End of story.



handyhands said:


> Why the heck do you want someone on your jobsite advertising for THIER company?
> 
> Makes sense to me, but what do I know.:no:


Why would a GC care in the least if anyone, including the customer or somebody walking by sees the electrician in his company letter van, in his company hat and company lettered shirt if, they considered him good enough and qualified enough to hire and trust with the work?

The GC is scared to death that somebody walking by is going to stop and ask the electrician for his card????  Why would he care?



handyhands said:


> If you're going to get your panties in a bunch about having to wear someone elses t-shirt, then you should be doing your OWN marketing,...generating your OWN business....signing your OWN checks,..and buying your OWN shirts.


Didn't the sub already do that????

Is everyone in disagreement of why a GC would require a sub to wear his company's shirt?

Is there actually anybody here that thinks it is about anything other than a big lie to the customer?

If you don't what exactly do you think the motivation is?

That the sub is going to get a phone call for something and the GC is going to miss out on a 10% cut?

Do you think the GC is worried that the sub is going to show up in one of those T-shirts with the little green guy flipping you off? 

Come on now fellas. :no:


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

Mike..Mike...Mike...whats the question again:drink:


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## Mike Finley (Apr 28, 2004)

tomstruble said:


> Mike..Mike...Mike...whats the question again:drink:


I think it's about the same old thing. Only in the world of contractors do such silly things exist. People in other businesses would never believe the ridiculous things that contractors pull due to a lack of even basic business knowledge. 

Hiring illegals, contractors working for minimum wages on jobs because they don't have a clue about even the very basic financial issues of running their business, being in the top 3 complaint categories year after year in every consumer survey, storm chasers, conmen and frauds who run off with old people's deposits, an industry that coined the phrase "tin men", grown men working in an industry that the wages are lower today then they were 20 years ago, business owners who use napkins for proposals... 

and now apparently it's business as usual for companys that wants their subs to pretend to be their employees by wearing their shirts. 

It's no wonder the average contractor in America is making under $26,000 a year. We are an industry filled with boobs and idiots, our own worst enemies. :sad:


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## Tscarborough (Feb 25, 2006)

It really is sad. The things I see, the "contractors" and the predicaments that they get themselves into by doing stupid, mindless things.

It is a shame that there is no higher education that actually teaches someone how to be a professional contractor. Well there are, but they are not called that, they are called "business" and "finance", and very few (edit-small, most of the large professional outfits that I deal with DO have people trained in business and finance) contractors have ever had any schooling in either.

That is not to say that you have to have formal education, but if you don't you damn well better have some practical apprenticeship in how to run a business as well as how to cut a board or read a print.


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## CookeCarpentry (Feb 26, 2009)

Mike Finley said:


> It's no wonder the average contractor in America is *making under $26,000* a year. We are an industry filled with boobs and idiots, our own worst enemies. :sad:


Where did you find this stat?


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## Magnettica (Dec 19, 2006)

maleko said:


> Ok, i have my own company, i have my own company t-shirts etc.. my truck is lettered etc...
> Going to be working on a job as a sub... ok?
> the GC has asked me to wear his company shirts as long as im on "his " job....?
> 
> ...


Why not? What's the big deal? 

As long as your lettered truck is outside the rest of the neighborhood knows your company worked there.


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## Doubleoh7 (Dec 3, 2009)

I'll wear what they want me to wear. But, I get to pick the clothes that they get to wear!


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## opiethetileman (Apr 7, 2005)

HOLY COW i made MIKE FINLEY laugh...that has to be history in the making


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

next try and get Leo to thank you:whistling


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## ApgarNJ (Apr 16, 2006)

I make 26,050.00 a year. i guess I'm above average!!!!!!


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## opiethetileman (Apr 7, 2005)

I can get leo to wear a shirt trust me...it wont beeasy but I can make them all crack


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

so many have tried and failed:hang:but give it your best shot you glorious bastard


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## opiethetileman (Apr 7, 2005)

great now I am getting called out....boy this will be fun............


wait and see to be continued


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## chris klee (Feb 5, 2008)

Mike Finley said:


> with the little green guy flipping you off?


i do believe that is the pirate4x4 salute


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## Darwin (Apr 7, 2009)

opiethetileman said:


> well if he is paying you just wear the shirt not a big deal. tell the guy you only wear silk camp shirts to work. And trust me he wouldnt like me wearing his shirts with a set of daisy duke shorts and the shirt tied in a knot suckin on a lolipop all day in flip flops. That would cure the problem of your not his employee.


Excuse me for a moment...










:laughing:
:thumbsup:


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## Mike's Plumbing (Jul 19, 2010)

Mike Finley said:


> I think it's about the same old thing. Only in the world of contractors do such silly things exist. People in other businesses would never believe the ridiculous things that contractors pull due to a lack of even basic business knowledge.
> 
> Hiring illegals, contractors working for minimum wages on jobs because they don't have a clue about even the very basic financial issues of running their business, being in the top 3 complaint categories year after year in every consumer survey, storm chasers, conmen and frauds who run off with old people's deposits, an industry that coined the phrase "tin men", grown men working in an industry that the wages are lower today then they were 20 years ago, business owners who use napkins for proposals...
> 
> ...


You have this uncanny ability to hit subject like this right on the money.

Mike


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## Mike Finley (Apr 28, 2004)

chris klee said:


> i do believe that is the pirate4x4 salute












Anybody else remember this one from high school days?


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## Hardly Working (Apr 7, 2005)

What's your contract say regarding wearing his shirts? 

When was the last time you saw subs on a commercial job wearing the GC's shirts.

I asked the VP of my fiancee's company (commercial const) what he thought, he laughed. He said that was a little over the line. 

You submitted a bid, it was accepted. Anywhere in the scope did it say you had to wear the GC's shirt.

If he wants to pay your taxes and bond ect. then wear it.


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## JumboJack (Aug 14, 2007)

tomstruble said:


> what if he says you can't wear your lettered shirt on his job?


Then he's an idiot.


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## ApgarNJ (Apr 16, 2006)

tomstruble said:


> what if he says you can't wear your lettered shirt on his job?


Well, being someone that hires subs, I would never be in a situation where someone wouldn't let me on their job due to me wearing my own shirts.

If I were a carpenter who subbed for GC's and they expected me to wear their shirts. I'd be walking.


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## woodchuck2 (Feb 27, 2008)

The GC's that i work prefer that i wear my own lettered shirts so the other crews and HO know who i am. Makes sense to me. Now right now besides my own work i am sub contracting for another Electrician "former employer" and he prefers i not wear my shirts nor tow my trailer to a job unless the HO is not home and then it is permitted. I honor his wishes out of respect. I do however wear my own ball cap with my business name on it and he has no problem with this. I hand out his business cards on his job and state to the HO that i work for this contractor and i keep everything professional. My old boss is backed up on work and i am slow so i am grateful for his picking me up for the extra work. The best part is i only dropped my labor rate $5 an hour so i am not really losing a lot in wages, at least i am working.


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## skyhook (Mar 17, 2007)

I've given many shirts away to subs, family and friends. They wear them when they want to. Sometimes on my jobs, and from there to others. No big deal. I see them all over town.:thumbsup:


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## Metro M & L (Jun 3, 2009)

I think the op knows that the t shirt is going to be the first in a long line of manipulating control freak shenanigans.

If you lose control of marketing you lose control of pricing.


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## ApgarNJ (Apr 16, 2006)

skyhook said:


> I've given many shirts away to subs, family and friends. They wear them when they want to. Sometimes on my jobs, and from there to others. No big deal. I see them all over town.:thumbsup:


Same for me, but the OP is being ASKED to wear them whenever on that GC's job. That's not right. He's lying to the customer is what he's doing.


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

Just my thoughts...
If he's paying for your time and he provies the tee, who cares...wear it, and wear it with pride. It is his job. He may have more work for you in the future and as long as his check clears...remember, it's only a shirt. If your work speaks for itself, that's all that matters. As long as you're making the same money as if it were your job...no big deal.


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## jeffaah (Apr 3, 2008)

I would wear the shirts of other trades with whom I work. I don't mind advertising for "my" plumber or electrician. I would not wear shirts for a company that does the same work as I do in the same area....even if they are friends of mine. 

I would wear a BSA or BergenDecks shirt....hint hint


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## Irishslave (Jun 20, 2010)

Yea it's late but I could not resist this one. This guy is nuts, I think I would give him a hard time about it. Non verbal of course, just a hard Irish look like your full of s*** ! I mean, what am I a free billboard? Put your name anywhere other than craigslist, and guess what? It costs you money. You can hang the shirt up on the street lamp as long as zoning permits it.


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## dorian reeve (Feb 11, 2010)

the op should never give in to bs like this from a gc it is the height insult to a sub to be asked to do something like this. as a gc my self if hire you for a job im proud for you to where your shirt on a job site. if i wasn't i would not have hired you in the first place. my customers know what subs i hire and if they need one of my subs for a different job good for them .but im used to caly rules for being a gc .


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## sandboxdoc (Jul 15, 2009)

Wear his shirt and put your contractor's cellphone number on there! That way if there's a prob.. people hound the hell out of him!

reminds me of when I worked for a contractor. i was given a black berry and my signature included a message to snub at my boss "My supervisor is ***, direct cell ***xx.... comments, suggestions and concerns feel free to call" My supervisor/boss rarely bothered me again after that... a good way to shutup a boss.


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## Upstate Carp (Aug 8, 2010)

I have shirts from a bunch of different contractors....I wear a different one each day..


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

really not what the threads about:no:


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