# Shotty craftsmanship



## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

Trial and error for me. 
Yes, I would do test copes on both ends and if the wall required one full piece, make sure my measurements are spot on.

An old member, Tom, turned the light on for me years ago on installing crown in a square/rectangular room.


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## DenverCountryBoy (Jan 10, 2021)

Same way you would measure and cope it for one end.

Measure and cut as if it was an inside miter to establish your lines on the face, then cope. With crown, the back cut needs to take into account the angle of tilt to the adjoining piece.

Edit: words


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## Subs (Mar 21, 2021)

Accurate Precision LLC said:


> Had these two guys at $25 and $30 an hour for work we had to completely redo.
> Thankfully my company policies state we will withhold final payments until projects reach substantial completion so I've been forced to do so until we finish and collect final payment.


So your policy states to withhold final payment until substantial completion so you are going to withhold these guys money until final payment is received?

Sounds pretty typical for a lot of GCs. There are a few questions that I would ask. First would be Wouldn't holding these guys pay until final payment go against your policies?

Who sets your policies and when were they set? 

Have you put a square into that corner?

If the corner isn't square and the trim was cut to 45 degrees then it wouldn't match. Did you withhold money from the guy that built the wall?

How much did you pay the guys to completely redo the work?

Those are just a few of my reactions to your post. There are many good points made in this thread. It might be that these hourly employees are way down the list of your problems.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

I was blamed once by a guy who said I framed a wall out of square. Yeah right. Turned out that there was debris behind the Sheetrock keeping it from sitting tight against the plates. This was back before camera phones so I had to drive out there just to explode.


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## Railman (Jan 19, 2008)

This is a foolproof method, that works especialy well for built up crown.

Make a crown ht marking gauge something like drawing from 1x4, base, to size needed. Relieve top so it only touches ceiling at crown width.
Notch opening for crown ht mark on wall.
Mark walls every 5 ft or so.

Loosely fasten crown at last 5ft or so so that you can roll end of crown for perfect fit to close cope gaps. If you marked, & coped correctly, little adjustment if any will be needed.


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## jbdivinedesign (Mar 1, 2018)

Accurate Precision LLC said:


> Would anyone pay a sub for these hideous 45's and completely friggin covering up your power for the dishwasher and disposal?


Apparently no one had an angle finder on them nor knew how to use it. It’s a simple tool that works amazingly well. Also seriously $25.00 an hour for finish trim work is insanely cheap and you got exactly what you paid for. And 100% agree that installation of the carpet prior to trim being painted showed your lack of knowledge and it’s knowledge you will pay to learn the hard way. You won’t make that mistake again, so take that part with you. We all in the Trades have learned stuff the hard way and some begin to have arrogant attitudes towards those still learning. I prefer to pass on my knowledge rather than die with it. We are ALL always learning and choose to become better or bitter. Let this make you better.


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## Pounder (Nov 28, 2020)

My only comment here is that "shotty" work is something done with a firearm. Shoddy work is of poor quality.


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## avenge (Sep 25, 2008)

Pounder said:


> My only comment here is that "shotty" work is something done with a firearm. Shoddy work is of poor quality.


Took 47 posts for someone to notice.


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## Rio (Oct 13, 2009)

Maybe shotty because whoever did it took a few shots whilst working?


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## avenge (Sep 25, 2008)

Maybe sh*tty work?


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## fourcornerhome (Feb 19, 2008)

Shot to hell


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## smalpierre (Jan 19, 2011)

Shot themselves in the foot


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## Pounder (Nov 28, 2020)

smalpierre said:


> Shot themselves in the foot


Which is the handle I use when playing games. Shotmyfoot.


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## DenverCountryBoy (Jan 10, 2021)

avenge said:


> Took 47 posts for someone to notice.


Noticed days ago, but didn't want get pegged as pedantic.


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## Dirtywhiteboy (Oct 15, 2010)

reggi said:


> Newb question: do you guys actually use those dainty little coping saws for this job, or is there a bluetooth compatible, 24volt trim coperupper you can use?
> 
> More generally, is finish carpentry a production job, or is it slow and fiddly? Obviously you can do a lousy job and go fast. But can you do good work and really cruise without hunching over a bench with a tiny saw, coping the day away?
> 
> I seldom work near other trades, particularly _those_ guys.


No,,, I cope with a 18 volt grinder!


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## Ed Corrigan (Jul 18, 2019)

Dirtywhiteboy said:


> No,,, I cope with a 18 volt grinder!


I coped some chair rail(?) at my Mom's house a couple years ago. "Invented" a new way by using my grinder. Bet you didn't have a tuckpointing blade on yours, though.


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## nickko (Nov 11, 2012)

I sometimes cope with a grinder using two 36 or 50 grit 4 inch sanding disc back to back on a mini grinder.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

DenverCountryBoy said:


> Noticed days ago, but didn't want get pegged as pedantic.


Jim Carey - Liar! Liar!
Nice


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