# I fixed the wrong wall, now what?



## dakzaag (Jan 6, 2009)

I recently completed a repair to a wall on a building for the owner. I had prepared two estimates, one for the big, obvious, gaping hole. A second estimate for some little stuff that wasn't so obvious. 

He called and verbally approved both estimates. I completed the work and invoiced him via email. 

Mistake 1. Invoiced only the first repair, not the whole thing.

Mistake 2. The little stuff was all on the left side of the wall, and the big hole was on the right. I did not understand that the center line of the wall was actually the property line. So the small stuff I repaired is owned by a lawyer who did not ask nor approve the repairs. 

The initial customer is happy with my repair and he saved 40% off his bill cause I sent the wrong invoice. (duh)

I have not talked to the lawyer yet, and I am trying to decide if I should even open my trap. I can just hear it now. Trespassing, unsolicited repairs that were not approved. Law suit for pain and suffering. 

What I am probably going to do is go in and negotiate a payment out of him for repairs that he really needed done. Yes he was aware that I was doing the repairs, his office was on the other side of the wall I was working on. (although I did not ever see him or talk to him.) I even stopped in to the front office to notify them that I was working outside the back door and to be careful if they came outside. 

What a stupid mistake. How did I catch it? The original customer paid today and the amount was less than I was expecting. He nicely included a note to me explaining the property lines.


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## S.U.M (Apr 17, 2013)

Tight one, how many hours did you invest in this and what was the cost of the materials?


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

Do not beat yourself up on this one. I just read (I kid you not) in the paper last month about the huge screw ups in the U.S. hospitals every year. If memory serves,there is somewhere around 4,000 operations they cut off the wrong limb / take out the wrong body part .:laughing:


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

This is not the article however,I may have been low with my quote,the numbers may have been for just one state.:laughing:


http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/10/18/health.surgery.mixups.common/


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

The lawyer might not like the repair and say you messed up his wall and go after you to re-do the whole wall, so watch yourself... Next time pay better attention.
At the same time he might be a nice guy and appreciate what you did and be happy to pay you.
If you decide to go and collect from him, try to do it on the Monday and pray he had a good weekend and got laid :laughing: If not, he will screw you :jester:

Good luck


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

greg24k said:


> At the same time he might be a nice guy and appreciate what you did and be happy to pay you.




That is a mighty big,no......huge if.

Do you know why they bury everyone six feet down in cemeteries,and bury lawyers twelve feet down ?????? Cause deep down they are nice guys.:laughing:


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## dakzaag (Jan 6, 2009)

I'm out $750 so not a big deal. I spoke directly with the owner several times, but never in front of the project, his office was down the street. 

Never met the lawyer, it's a small town, but he could be a big Richard...


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

I'd be honest with him, let him know he got some free repair work done and drop off your business card.


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## stonecutter (May 13, 2010)

fjn said:


> Do not beat yourself up on this one. I just read (I kid you not) in the paper last month about the huge screw ups in the U.S. hospitals every year. If memory serves,there is somewhere around 4,000 operations they cut off the wrong limb / take out the wrong body part .:laughing:


My Dad had his knee replacement surgery back in June. We went in to see him in pre-op when my Mom (extensive health care background) looks at his chart.....they marked the wrong knee. I told them they should have let it go and got two for one.:laughing:


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## tgeb (Feb 9, 2006)

> He called and verbally approved both estimates. I completed the work and invoiced him via email.


Why at that point did the customer not inform you that he did not own both walls?

Sucks, but it sounds like you've done some free work for the lawyer..


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## duburban (Apr 10, 2008)

tgeb said:


> Why at that point did the customer not inform you that he did not own both walls?
> 
> Sucks, but it sounds like you've done some free work for the lawyer..


Exactly… whats up with the original client? Are you supposed to track down obscure property lines on your own? Its not like you were working on a house across the street or something, just too far down the same freaking wall.


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## brickhook (May 8, 2012)

I hate this situation for you. You can't beat yourself up over this one. Who would of thought the property line went through the middle of the building. 

This could of happened to any one of us.

I guess maybe I'd go to the other owner and explain to him what happened. If that didn't work, I believe I would go back to the guy that hired me ......

I hope you get your money.


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

fjn said:


> That is a mighty big,no......huge if.
> 
> Do you know why they bury everyone six feet down in cemeteries,and bury lawyers twelve feet down ?????? Cause deep down they are nice guys.:laughing:


:laughing: That is good, which reminds me of a customer I had, she been married 3 times, so when I asked why so many being you a young women, she said:

First I married a psychiatrist, and all he wanted to do is talk about it, so I married a Gynecologist and all he wanted to do is look at it, so I figured if I married a Lawyer, I know I will get screwed. :laughing:


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## tedanderson (May 19, 2010)

Let it go. If the lawyer likes your work, he will hire you to do other stuff.


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

I'd let the work on the wrong property go but there's no reason you can't send a second invoice to correct the amount of the first invoice. You agreed to a scope of work and a price BEFORE you did the work. That's the amount he owes you, the number of invoices is immaterial.


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## Agility (Nov 29, 2013)

It sounds to me like your customer agreed to pay for repairs to his side of the wall and the neighbor's.


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

I agree with Agility. I'd invoice the one customer for both projects. If he argued about the "small project" part show him that he authorised it and that you have no idea what his relationship with the lawyer is. For all you know he's the property manager for the entire building, or he's tired of looking at the other side of the wall and wanted it done and was prepared to meet the lawyer in court.

tell me, has anyone here ever asked for a deed before doing work on someones house? No we do the work for the guy who agreed to pay is for it


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## JBM (Mar 31, 2011)

Last year or maybe 2 years ago I looked at a set of steps to rebuild in early March. I called the lady and said I would be out to do them sometime mid summer. Well in that amount of time I kind of forgot exactly what the house looked like as most of them in the culdesac looked similar and they all had steps that were a mess 

I ended up re doing the tops of the neighbors steps for a thank you young man and a cup of coffee


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## NJ Brickie (Jan 31, 2009)

I'm no lawyer. But I know there is a law that applies to this situation. If I remember correctly, if the person knows you are doing the work and does not stop you, it is considered accepting to pay for the project. But for $750 I don't know how much I'd press it.


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## Agility (Nov 29, 2013)

dom-mas said:


> tell me, has anyone here ever asked for a deed before doing work on someones house? No we do the work for the guy who agreed to pay is for it


When customers call me for estimates and aren't word-of-mouth referrals I ask whose name is on the deed during the initial meeting. I can search county records online to see that they own the property, whether it has a mortgage, and whether or not they have or have had any liens. 

I just recently started doing this because I've been getting more non-WOM calls lately. If someone wanted work performed and didn't own the property, which I haven't encountered yet, it would change the way I word the contract and the payment schedule. I think I would also feel inclined to contact the property owner. But again, it hasn't been an issue for me yet.


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

Agility said:


> When customers call me for estimates and aren't word-of-mouth referrals I ask whose name is on the deed during the initial meeting.


Weird. Never heard of anyone doing that before


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## brickhook (May 8, 2012)

I don't think I've ever heard of that either.


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## chris klee (Feb 5, 2008)

For permits here you have to have a copy of the mortgage survey and all the owners info and they have to sign off on it. 
Either way i always look up the address on the countys website property search just to see what what


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## dakzaag (Jan 6, 2009)

For what it is worth, the initial contact was a word of mouth contact. I had an opportunity to give a presentation to the historical society in this town and he was in attendance. 

As far as sending a second invoice, it just seems dirty pool to ask this guy to pay for work done on his neighbors property. 

I accept responsibility for not getting a clear project scope filled out. The job lasted two short days with a rain delay in between, so it is possible that the original contact did not see me completing the work on the wrong side of the line. I finished the right side on day one and came back, moved scaffold and completed the left "wrong" side on day 2. 

After completion, I stopped by the guys office, just to tell him I was done and to try and sell a water proofing treatment. His assistant told me he had just gone home with a head ach, so I just left a message that we were done.

My thought on pursuing the Lawyer is simply the service was rendered in both a timely and quality manner, it was seriously needed, as the repairs filled in some really nasty erosion. And I would have charged him twice that amount if it was only his half I was looking at. 

So my sales pitch is I'm offering a 50% discount on work that you need done. Unfortunately since I have already completed the work, my leverage is non existent. Being a lawyer, he will instantly recognize the futility of the situation and at best shake my hand and thank me for the good work. At worst he will attempt to extort me for fixing his wall.

I am not afraid of the damages extortion, since I have pictures and any three year old can see that the wall was failing. I did the work and I would hope that he could see that it was a good deal. 

Who knows, maybe I can trade for legal representation on something down the road.


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

dakzaag said:


> Who knows, maybe I can trade for legal representation on something down the road.




Just keep your fingers crossed you never need any. It is the closest thing to throwing good money after bad you will ever experience.:thumbsup:


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## Nick520 (May 2, 2013)

Sucks being out the money obviously but for the 750 I'd take it as a learning experience and cut my losses rather than pursue other options. 

In my opinion makes you look as professional as possible given the strange situation


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## dakzaag (Jan 6, 2009)

fjn said:


> Just keep your fingers crossed you never need any. It is the closest thing to throwing good money after bad you will ever experience.:thumbsup:


Signing a big contract might require legal representation. Just sayin...


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

dakzaag said:


> As far as sending a second invoice, it just seems dirty pool to ask this guy to pay for work done on his neighbors property.


Maybe I don't get what happened here (wouldn't be the first time), but the guy agreed, even if it was verbal, for you to do work on a property that he didn't own. Why does he hold zero culpability? (look at that a lawyer type word). It's not a huge deal and it's not like you lost a ton of money but I'd be sending both invoices to that guy without doubt. I'd also be speaking to the lawyer. I have a very hard time believing that he;d try to get money from you for fixing his wall...unless the US truly is the insanely litigious place that some on this site make it out to be. Chances are he'll laugh about it and pay you. At least that is my experience with humans. 

NOW if you had done something deceitful that would be different, but an honest mistake, most folks are likely to pay if they think the price is reasonable and they can afford it


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## Agility (Nov 29, 2013)

Maybe the lawyer will give you some assistance in collecting on both invoices. Especially if he winds up with a free repair. 

Maybe dropping off a packet of information on the work you did - before/after pictures, structural explanations, and a brief summary of why you repaired his side in the first place - will earn you a good future customer.

I don't think I would try to collect from the lawyer, not for fear of legal repercussions but because he wasn't your customer.


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## cleveman (Dec 28, 2007)

It is probably a good idea to do a bit of a background check on any new client which you extend credit to.

That's right, you are rendering a service to them with the expectation of getting paid later.

If you see that they owe money to everyone except the funeral home, you might want to stay away from them.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

dakzaag said:


> Mistake 2. The little stuff was all on the left side of the wall, and the big hole was on the right. I did not understand that the center line of the wall was actually the property line. So the small stuff I repaired is owned by a lawyer who did not ask nor approve the repairs.


How do you properly repair a wall on one side only? 

The guy wanted the wall fixed, you did it after verbal approvement of the total price. So you goofed with the invoicing, but still did all of the work for the price he agreed to. No big deal, send him a corrected invoice for the full amount with an apology for the oops.

Shouldn't be any need to deal with the lawyer at all.


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## dakzaag (Jan 6, 2009)

Correct, I completed the repair on the original contacts side as agreed. The error was in sending an invoice for just one of the estimates, not both. He requested two estimates.

I based the estimates on a project scope that was more than the owners request. The way I split the estimates turned out to be exactly the way the property is divided. 

I can't in good conscious bill the first guy for repairs that I did for the second guy, even though I was ignorant of the difference. If I had invoiced both estimates to the original customer, I would refund the $750 because he did not receive the benefit of these services. 

It is kinda like a scope change except that it is after the fact and completed in ignorance. 

The confusing part is this wall is the back of one building and I have no idea who owns the second story of the building, or if it just divides in half even though it is an abandoned apartment that takes up the whole upper floor. The back wall ownership is divided in half, how these two owners determine who pays for a new roof or anything else is anyone's guess.


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## Agility (Nov 29, 2013)

Is it possible that the two neighbors had an agreement between themselves that your customer would handle the hiring of a contractor to repair the wall and that the lawyer is actually expecting to receive an invoice from you? How was the note written by your customer on the invoice you sent worded?

Edit: I believe that you can, in good conscience, bill your customer for the entire wall. This confusion is not your fault, it is his.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

stonecutter said:


> My Dad had his knee replacement surgery back in June. We went in to see him in pre-op when my Mom (extensive health care background) looks at his chart.....they marked the wrong knee. I told them they should have let it go and got two for one.:laughing:


I don't think he has a leg to stand on


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

I would absolutely tak to the lawyer. You touched his property without his consent. At the least you need to go and explain yourself. Just stop in some time when he isn't busy and chat for 5 minutes...in my experience he'll chuckle and probably pay you for the work. But you can't just pretend it never happened


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## S.U.M (Apr 17, 2013)

dom-mas said:


> I would absolutely tak to the lawyer. You touched his property without his consent. At the least you need to go and explain yourself. Just stop in some time when he isn't busy and chat for 5 minutes...in my experience he'll chuckle and probably pay you for the work. But you can't just pretend it never happened


Yup that's the best thing, hell he probably will thank you and keep your name for future work to his home


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## dakzaag (Jan 6, 2009)

Just a quick follow up. I had time to stop into the law office today and talk to the owner. He was a real nice guy, wanted to know what it is I do and what I did to his building. Asked how I am getting along and offered to pay the price of my estimate without question. Practically talked my leg off. 

Small town, so your mileage may vary, but I guess the old saying about not painting with a wide brush might have a little truth to it. 

He asked for a quote on pointing the rest of the building as I soon as I told him that he has some issues that I did not address. 

I am sending him an invoice for work completed and an estimate for work that should be done next spring.


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## superseal (Feb 4, 2009)

I work for a lot of lawyers...even some "super" lawyers :laughing:.

Without question, then tend to be some of my best clients.

I'ts like the good looking girl in high school that everybody is afraid to ask out...they often live a lonely existence.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

superseal said:


> I work for a lot of lawyers...even some "super" lawyers :laughing:.
> 
> Without question, then tend to be some of my best clients.
> 
> I'ts like the good looking girl in high school that everybody is afraid to ask out...they often live a lonely existence.


I'm working for a lawyer as we speak, he's just a no nonsense kind of guy, which I like. He's a very nice guy as c well. He told me "My father (who was also a lawyer) always told me to never mess with the working man". I said, jokingly, "because the working man doesn't have anything".


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