# Can I fight the Building inspector



## BuddySteinle (Mar 11, 2016)

We recently came into a project half that consisted of repairing plaster, hanging some board, tile bathrooms, hardwood flooring, installing doors and trim. they electric had been updated and HVAC before the home owner moved in. we didn't move any walls or mess with anything else.

the building inspector showed up on the job and shut us down. he said we need to pull a plumbing, HVAC, elec, and renovation permit.
all the walls are closed, its got most of all the finished materials already installed. 

I explained to him we didn't do any plumbing, HVAC, electric or structural work. 

Him - you expect me to believe that"

me - I don't expect anything I'm just telling you the truth and how can I prove this but how can you just declare I need these permits without any knowledge or evidence that we did that type of work

Him - I see this **** everyday, pull the permits, you guys are done until you do.

Do I have any recourse? what can I do?


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

Homeowner can file an affidavit that the home in it's present condition is as purchased.

Then the homeowner can go round and round w/AHJ about proving that the prior updated work was permitted.

They can also go round nd round with seller if said work was unpermitted as undisclosed encumbrances.

Time and deep pockets sometimes helps. But not always.

Before and after photos have more than one benefit....

Can you touch your toes?:whistling


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## Warren (Feb 19, 2005)

Tile in the bathrooms means a plumbing fixture install. Here is Ohio, that technically means a permit is required. I have never heard of it being enforced though.


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## BuddySteinle (Mar 11, 2016)

We just u screwed the shower head, installed the tile, and put the head and trim back on 


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

BuddySteinle said:


> they *electric had been updated* and HVAC before the home owner moved in. we didn't move any walls or mess with anything else.
> 
> the building inspector showed up on the job and shut us down. he said we need to pull a plumbing, HVAC, elec, and *renovation permit*.


Was the electrical work inspected and stickered?

A renovation permit may well be required for just the work you were doing, depending on the local AHJ. Doesn't sound like you have much of a case. :sad:


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Show them your contract and SOW. Here the permits are the HO responsibility, although we can apply on their behalf. So it is up to them to prove their case. I would also consider a clause in your contract concerning penalties for delays in the project not of your doing.


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## BuddySteinle (Mar 11, 2016)

Yes definitely need that clause


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

The best advice I can offer about fighting an inspector is to pick your battles carefully....very carefully


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## Peter_C (Nov 26, 2014)

Were permits pulled for the previous work? If so the homeowner might be able to get copies to show the fees were paid. Sounds like they want to collect the fees for the renovation permit no matter what. The building inspector in order to justify his job needs to collect as many fees as possible. 

This is a person who you will have to maintain a working relationship with. Find a middle ground where he gets to collect some fees, and move on. As suggested above photos of demolition might help.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Peter_C said:


> Were permits pulled for the previous work? If so the homeowner might be able to get copies to show the fees were paid. Sounds like they want to collect the fees for the renovation permit no matter what. The building inspector in order to justify his job needs to collect as many fees as possible.
> 
> This is a person who you will have to maintain a working relationship with. Find a middle ground where he gets to collect some fees, and move on. As suggested above photos of demolition might help.


The current home owner isn't responsible for any work completed prior to purchasing the home.


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## Peter_C (Nov 26, 2014)

TNTSERVICES said:


> The current home owner isn't responsible for any work completed prior to purchasing the home.


I agree 100%, but if the plumbing, HVAC, elec, fees were already paid from the previous work performed, it will be harder to justify charging for the same fees again. I doubt the inspector will let it go without getting some fees from the home owner, so the renovation fee is going to be a given, it is whether than can get out of the other fees or not. Or just pay all the requested fees and get back to work. Extortion would be a good word.


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## BuddySteinle (Mar 11, 2016)

Pretty much. I don't even understand how there doesn't seem to be any recourse when your gettin the squeez from these jagoffs 


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## pappagor (Jan 29, 2008)

there is but time is not on your side and he knows it.


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## cdkyle (Jul 12, 2009)

I tried once and did NOT win. I tried to go over her head (female inspector) to her boss. That did not work. The only positive that came out of the deal is she kind of gained some respect for us I think. On further projects we did not have quite as much problem with her.


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

griz said:


> The best advice I can offer about fighting an inspector is to pick your battles carefully....very carefully






Especially if you plan on doing more work in their jurisdiction .


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

TNTSERVICES said:


> The current home owner isn't responsible for any work completed prior to purchasing the home.


That is not entirely correct in NJ. After the closing the present homeowner still has to get work permitted/inspected, even though the previous homeowner did the work. The BI can have the section of the home in question blocked off from being used until it passes inspection, normally they do no do that they just give them 30 days to do it. Then the lawyers get involved if previous homeowners can be found.

I had customer who had to remove an unpermitted deck and remove part of their driveway because previous owner did not know about too much lot coverage. 

In NJ the contractor is supposed to pull permits, in many towns there is a page attached to the folder just as a reminder stating the homeowner should not be getting permits for the contractor.

Also they are allowed to collect back taxes on the value of the permits/improvements from the time work was done to the time it was passed. That hardly ever happens except to people who give them a hard time. Usually it is just a $500 fine in addition to permit fees.


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

You in PA I suggest you go and get a permit before they give you a fine so much $ per day until permit is pulled.


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## BuddySteinle (Mar 11, 2016)

Yes I'm going to I feel defeated. Lesson learned. I need a clause in my contract to protect me from situations like this 


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

rrk said:


> That is not entirely correct in NJ. After the closing the present homeowner still has to get work permitted/inspected, even though the previous homeowner did the work. The BI can have the section of the home in question blocked off from being used until it passes inspection, normally they do no do that they just give them 30 days to do it. Then the lawyers get involved if previous homeowners can be found.
> 
> I had customer who had to remove an unpermitted deck and remove part of their driveway because previous owner did not know about too much lot coverage.
> 
> ...


Pretty much same in Michigan.


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## superseal (Feb 4, 2009)

greg24k said:


> You in PA I suggest you go and get a permit before they give you a fine so much $ per day until permit is pulled.


Only if you continue to work...the permit onus is on the homeowner


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## superseal (Feb 4, 2009)

Go to the borough/township/city manager or contact a commissioner...The guy can't make you pull permits for something you didn't do...period.

Whatever scope requires a permit...get it.


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## BuddySteinle (Mar 11, 2016)

superseal said:


> Go to the borough/township/city manager or contact a commissioner...The guy can't make you pull permits for something you didn't do...period.
> 
> 
> 
> Whatever scope requires a permit...get it.



Do you think I can threaten that and he will back off? 


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## digiconsoo (Apr 23, 2012)

It is better not to threaten.

If you tell someone you are going to take the hill, make sure you are prepared to die on it. 

Then go to war.


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## BuddySteinle (Mar 11, 2016)

Lol I hear u 


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Just go down and pull the permits. Fighting those guys is pointless. Whatever it costs you will be cheap compared to what those fellas can do to you in the long run. 

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## Peter_C (Nov 26, 2014)

Why not try to get copies of the previous home owners permits? Then have a calm discussion with the inspector and ask him what he would like you to do and let him know you will pull those permits. Arguing is pointless as you will not win, but you will succeed in pissing him off. If there were no previous permits, pay up!

Like a police officer he has been lied to many times before.


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

I have been through this before, twice actually. If you try to fight he will say to just pull the permits now get inspections then go after the previous owner. If you argue he will then say he is being nice letting the people still stay in the house and issuing small or no fine and no back taxes. You then say thanks and go get the permits and let someone else fight.


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## BuddySteinle (Mar 11, 2016)

Yea it sounds like I got one option which is to pull the permits and add a clause in my contract for situations that arise like this 


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

superseal said:


> Only if you continue to work...the permit onus is on the homeowner


True, but if you on the job and inspector shows up and puts the stop work order he straps to violation on whoever is on the job. He don't care who did what and when they did it, and he don't care who will be answering for the work done without permit, him, the HO, the previous contractor if anyone can find him or the Pope himself. Now its between the HO and him to figure this out and who will be straightening out this mess.

That's like when a cop pulls a kid over and kid starts to talk back to the cop...Cop writes him 5 summonses for whatever he feels like, even if one summons makes any sense and all the others are bs and will be dismissed, the kid, the parents or the lawyer will still have to beat them or cop a plea to get them dismissed.


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## Shellbuilder (May 14, 2006)

You file an appeal with the building code appeals board. I was on that commission here. The city needs to have their city attorney there, a stenographer and usually the inspector and their supervisor. Usually the city attorney advises against this because the inspector can easily be fired or the press can get involved or the inspector just created a bunch of unnecessary expenses for the city. We had 5 days to assemble for these appeals, 9 out of 10 were cancelled.


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## Big Shoe (Jun 16, 2008)

Just wondering......should your work have been permitted? That would/may have here. 

Something smells fishy to me. Best of luck to you.


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## BuddySteinle (Mar 11, 2016)

Well according to the building inspector I'm responsible for work that was done prior to me getting there. He said I need a permit to paint, hang some drywall, trim and interior doors. Which is completely Ridiculous but I said fine I'll get it. But then also he's trying to get me to pull a permit for electric and plumbing which i did not do at all 


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## Shellbuilder (May 14, 2006)

http://pittsburghpa.gov/pli/permits/appeals


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

Appeals where I am take 3-4 months, if they dont get to you that day, another month wait.


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## BuddySteinle (Mar 11, 2016)

How long will it hold up the job in the burg? Do you know? 


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## Shellbuilder (May 14, 2006)

You file it to get a reaction. Inspectors can't bring their attitudes in to an appeal process. Citizen boards do not tolerate this. Watch it go away just asking for the form.


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## BuddySteinle (Mar 11, 2016)

Shellbuilder said:


> You file it to get a reaction. Inspectors can't bring their attitudes in to an appeal process. Citizen boards do not tolerate this. Watch it go away just asking for the form.



Thanks man I appreciate the insight! 


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## TimNJ (Sep 7, 2005)

You are talking to the inspector?

If you are in Pittsburgh, the inspector isn't running the show, there should be the code official running the department.

Talk to him/her.
No way I would have my name attached to electrical or HVAC done by somebody else. Big insurance liability.


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## Jethroe (Jan 27, 2007)

TimNJ said:


> You are talking to the inspector?
> 
> If you are in Pittsburgh, the inspector isn't running the show, there should be the code official running the department.
> 
> ...


Just wondering? Who called the inspector? Here in Oklahoma there is no inspector called in or permits if no structural changes are done and no mechanical work is performed period. Wow... I am happy for that.

If there were no permits pulled in the first place it would make me wonder just how the guy just showed up?? 
If it was the HO that called I would put it on them, nosey neighbor? Or maybe he just drove by and saw a work truck and decided to do some code enforcement work, it wasn't like you were doing a room addition, if you were in OK this would probably never happen and be laughed out of court period if it did.

Another reason why a written contract and jobsite photos are a must.

:cowboy:


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