# Girder Beam Splice



## AT_Runner (Sep 22, 2015)

Project is excavating a crawl space to make a garage. I'm a pro but this one is at my place. Girder beam made of 3 2X10 is supporting the joist stagger for the room above and partially supporting interior non-load bearing closet wall.

The overall span is about 16 feet. It seem like the original builder used 12 footers and cut 8 footers to create the beam and supported it on two 6x6s roughly 1/3rd of the way out so one of the posts sits under the splice and the other mid way between the first and the foundation. I figured they did that to save on material and since it was a crawl space, no one would care where the posts stand.

The problem is that the location of the posts is not going to work for parking vehicles. So my plan was to install a metal center post and replace the spliced part with full 2x10s from foundation to post. As I was going about it today I found that the center piece was actually spliced at the other side probably to create a continuous beam. so now I have the first side of solid pieces installed and the original post removed but I am unsure as to what to do with the other side.

I am inclined to leave the beam as is. My thought is that since the splice is in the middle 2x which is sandwiched between the two outer pieces it will hold strong. My other consideration is that since this is the side that is only holding the floor stagger and not the wall, the load requirements for it are much less than the other one. Replacing the wood on that side will be much more involved. There is a 3"waste drain on one side and two 3/4 copper supply on the other.

Thoughts/Ideas?


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## CompleteW&D (May 28, 2011)

Just curious.... what professional trade are you in? 

_"7 Gauge Coffee Brewer" _doesn't give us much information.


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

why not just use a glu-lam or LVL?


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## kiteman (Apr 18, 2012)

Steel and no post


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## AT_Runner (Sep 22, 2015)

CompleteW&D said:


> Just curious.... what professional trade are you in?
> 
> _"7 Gauge Coffee Brewer" _doesn't give us much information.


Custom Built-Ins (and everything around it)


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## AT_Runner (Sep 22, 2015)

griz said:


> why not just use a glu-lam or LVL?


I checked on that. First the cost is up there for an lvl to get the etire span it will be roughly 800 dollars.

Another issue is that the current beam is already holding the joists and is existing. to get a new beam the entire span, I will have to find a way to temporarily support the whole span, than remove the existing girder and somehow stick in an lvl from one foundation wall to another where everything around is built and accomodate shimming for the dimentional difference. The easiest way by far is just replacing the other side of the beam with new lumber because I do not have to take everything out at once but do it one piece at a time. The question is is it necessary considering all the plumbing work around it I would rather not have to do it.


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## kiteman (Apr 18, 2012)

.......... Edit


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

Talk to your architect, have him do a load calculation and use LVL like others suggested or Paralam, because the span in question and per your description of what you got above, you can probably use 5 1/4 x 14" paralam. 

With that said if you plan to move existing column location, you have to cut the slab, install new footing, etc you better off changing the whole beam, not to mention this being your house.


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## tgeb (Feb 9, 2006)

I'd go with a steel beam, and an Engineers stamp.


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## tgeb (Feb 9, 2006)

Oh, and a question.

How much excavation will be going on in this crawl space in order to make it a garage?

Have you figured in the underpinning that might be necessary?


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## Dan_Watson (Mar 1, 2008)

Converting a crawlspace to a garage and the beam is the item that costs to much?!? 

Do you have pictures and plans of this projects? I am very interested.


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## AT_Runner (Sep 22, 2015)

greg24k said:


> Talk to your architect, have him do a load calculation and use LVL like others suggested or Paralam, because the span in question and per your description of what you got above, you can probably use 5 1/4 x 14" paralam.
> 
> With that said if you plan to move existing column location, you have to cut the slab, install new footing, etc you better off changing the whole beam, not to mention this being your house.


There is no slab yet. The old posts were just on minimal footers and buried to the 24"frost. I have most of the area excavated and already placed the post inside footings but have a while to go before pouring the final slab.


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## AT_Runner (Sep 22, 2015)

tgeb said:


> Oh, and a question.
> 
> How much excavation will be going on in this crawl space in order to make it a garage?
> 
> Have you figured in the underpinning that might be necessary?


so this whole area is a crawl space that was left after the previous owner built an addition but did not finish the crawl space underneath. Because this ties to an existing basement, the foundation height was done to match the existing full basement foundation so the space is preety much set as far as clearances and underpinning.

I figured around 25 yds of material need to be excavated. I already have roughly 15 out


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## AT_Runner (Sep 22, 2015)

Dan_Watson said:


> Converting a crawlspace to a garage and the beam is the item that costs to much?!?
> 
> Do you have pictures and plans of this projects? I am very interested.


I am doing this in the after hours by myself with hopefully being done next summer. The beam is costly. and it all adds up but it will not be my biggest expense, I realise that.


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## kiteman (Apr 18, 2012)

How have you calculated that the same size beam that previously spanned 5'4" can now span 8'? The problem we're having is you appear to just be guessing to save a couple hundred bucks. A guy at my lumber yard could tell me in 5 minutes, FOR FREE. how much header I need but you just seem to want to guess and half-azz it no matter what we say. You're not going to hear anything from us you want to hear.


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## AT_Runner (Sep 22, 2015)

Absolutly. The span works perfectly for a girder per the irc charts. The reason for the posts spacing was to place them under the splice. They were overkill for the load.


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## AT_Runner (Sep 22, 2015)

And I am far from guessing here. FYI I used to design and build full fledged additions. No engineer. I would calculate everything myself and take the plans that I made and get them easily approved by the county
The problem is that I have encountered a very specific situation and wanted to see if anyone had any experience with it. Instead, I get a barrage of unrelated opinions, questions and impractical suggestions.


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## kiteman (Apr 18, 2012)

To me the side with the splice only counts as a double. Does it still make it on your chart? It wouldn't pass for an exterior header for roof load at 1/4 span. You have floor load at 1/2 span.


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## AT_Runner (Sep 22, 2015)

So that is the issue. For a girder it is not sufficient per the chart. But from a load calculation it is (weight of floor joists plus ll plus dl). Because that part is not holding anything other than the floor stagger and nothing above. If i were to treat it as an in floor header for example when making space to run a duct it would be enough. That is why I was hoping someone had experience.


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## kiteman (Apr 18, 2012)

I have plenty of experience but not enough info to make an informed calculation. But if you were to tell me you were carrying 12' fj on each side using a double 2x10 header at 8' I'm saying you're over spanned.


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