# Material costs going crazy



## 107415 (Sep 16, 2014)

I just started a new spec house after a 2 year hiatus doing other projects. Framing material prices are going crazy Just in the last month here in Tennessee. Advantech is $33-36. OSB today $15.25-$18.99 depending on which supplier. Framing lumber also climbing daily. Is everyone seeing this? Are we going to see it in all phases of materials? I’m trying to place all my major orders ASAP to lock in prices.


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

Material going up out here as well.

IMO, a good chunk of it is due to mills,middlemen etc raising prices and blaming it on covid...


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## VinylHanger (Jul 14, 2011)

Yep. Just paid 14 dollars for 2 2x6x8 kd DF.

Usually 4 bucks each or so. OSB is headimg to 25-27 a sheet according to my lumberyard. If you can get any. May be october until we see any volume.

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## Kingcarpenter1 (May 5, 2020)

Getting ready to start one here. Hot market, covid, election all factors here. Don’t know what the market is there in my ol stomping grounds but it’s red hot in South Tx. Prices been steadily going up on all material here. Same salesman @ my yard 30 years now & he always welcomes shopping other suppliers so I know I’m getting my best price. Being out of the loop a couple years don’t help

Mike


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## Warren (Feb 19, 2005)

Have talked with a couple lumber salesmen lately who tell me that we are at an all time high now, and the price is going higher. One GC I work for is starting an 11k ft house now, and his lumber/trusses went from 120k to 210k from March thru August. The supply has been iffy here lately on certain things, but the higher prices will assure that the materials will be there. Supply and demand in action.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

https://www.tribdem.com/features/bu...cle_05af10e8-d8d8-11ea-98dc-fff1625e4f8f.html


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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

4x4x8... PT...$17+ yesterday. I called to find out the price. She said that would probably go up by Monday.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/08/08/will-the-worsening-lumber-shortage-derail-home-dep.aspx


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

https://www.post-gazette.com/busine...uaker-State-Construction/stories/202007270065


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## Fishindude (Aug 15, 2017)

That's why you want to make your proposal price good for only (10-15) days or so, and if you can pull it off, work material escalation terms into your contracts.

Soon as you are awarded a contract, place material orders and lock in prices.

When fuel prices were going crazy, many of the equipment and trucking heavy trades were working fuel surcharges into their bills to pick up the rise in fuel cost.


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## VinylHanger (Jul 14, 2011)

Yeah, and when fuel went back down to comparable peanuts, the surcharges stayed.

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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

VinylHanger said:


> Yeah, and when fuel went back down to comparable peanuts, the surcharges stayed.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


This is why they never incorporated fuel into their prices. When the cost of fuel decreased so would their special profit. Now it's just part of the delivery charge. For me it's a big ripoff. My supplier Atlantic Plywood charges $18 and can get to me in 14 minutes. But I suppose it averages out when they have to drive 45 miles for deliveries at the edge of their routes.


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## VinylHanger (Jul 14, 2011)

I pay like 15 bucks for delivery. Even 2 hour round trip away. I don't mind that at all.

One supplier though adds the surcharge as a percent of the cost of the materials.


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

That's like when you order something online and they determine the shipping costs on how much the item costs instead of its weight. Buy a diamond ring online and they charge you $350 to deliver it because it cost a lot, but they could ship it for $10 in a standard shipping box from USPS.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

$15 bucks here too. Used to be free until 2012ish.


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## Kingcarpenter1 (May 5, 2020)

15 bucks don’t pay for gas, wear & tear much less my shopping time. I’ll gladly pay that


Mike


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## 107415 (Sep 16, 2014)

It was free up until this year. Now $25 per delivery. Its worth every penny. Concrete yard still charges fuel surcharge, which kinda burns my ass. Footer mix (3000psi) is $118/yd, plus $25/load for fuel surcharge and environmental fee.


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## Kingcarpenter1 (May 5, 2020)

25 bucks a load again is cheap. All to be passed on to client. If client don’t like upcharges I tell them they can haul it


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

I guess even HO’s need tape measures to build their shltty decks, these 2 for 1’s are hard to find now.


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## Kingcarpenter1 (May 5, 2020)

Or wannabes clipping them on their belt to try to make people think they know how to use it & look like an idiot


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## shanewreckd (Oct 2, 2014)

Material costs are going up in BC too. Lumber isn't cheap, even with something like 7-10 sawmills in my immediate area. And my boss was saying that apparently OSB is over or heading over the cost of plywood. Cedar and PT is in very scarce supply around here too.

I have 6 tapes in my truck, but none have hooks on them anymore so it's bags or bust for me lol.

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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Big Johnson said:


> Cali Mike
> Brg
> Jaws


:laughing::laughing:

No cowboy boots or house shoes though :whistling


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## rblakes1 (Jan 8, 2015)

rrk said:


> just checked my yard $61.74


Must be that North Jersey surcharge lol

-Rich


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## Stunt Carpenter (Dec 31, 2011)

shanewreckd said:


> Material costs are going up in BC too. Lumber isn't cheap, even with something like 7-10 sawmills in my immediate area. And my boss was saying that apparently OSB is over or heading over the cost of plywood. Cedar and PT is in very scarce supply around here too.
> 
> I have 6 tapes in my truck, but none have hooks on them anymore so it's bags or bust for me lol.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G973W using Tapatalk



I just got quoted $35.49 for 3/8 osb up from $14.97 30 days ago and I though that was a bit high.


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

6x6X18', $77.50

Bid good for 21 days.

This is comnercial grade lumber and not your landscape timbers.

Helped a friend bid a commercial project.

Bid docs said bid price was guaranteed price for the job.

Talked with a commercial lumber broker and he gave me an idea where prices are going.

Took SWAG as to when we would need lumber package and to get good pricing material bid was for everything dropped shipped.

We didnt get the job due to the lumber pricing. #1& #2 bids used current lumber prices. I asked powers to be about including an escalator clause for material.

ABSOLUTELY NOT!!!!

Dont know what the winning bidder is going to do as he wont need lumber for 4-6 weeks.

Concrete and sheetrock are wild cards also.


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## mrcat (Jun 27, 2015)

griz said:


> Talked with a commercial lumber broker and he gave me an idea where prices are going.


What were your broker's thoughts on where we are in regards to the peak of this increase?

The lumber yard I do the most business with is saying we've got a ways to go yet.

One of the owners at another yard we are working on building a relationship with, thinks we are close to the top now. 

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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

two lumber brokers and a local yard feel we have not topped out yet.

however, they all agreed there are way to many unknown variables to provide much more than a SWAG...

how the media plays the covid has a great deal to do with what may or may not happen.

what seems VERY ODD with this whole material price thing is there does not seem to be any real shortage of material, not like in past material roller coasters...


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## Kingcarpenter1 (May 5, 2020)

My main supplier 30 plus years tells me shortage is b.s. said the’ve blown this thing so far out it’s a gouging war like gas after the storms. He also said some of the majors are holding back to fool us all into panic mode. This guys in the know & has top connects with a few majors


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## pinwheel (Dec 7, 2009)

Tinstaafl said:


> These days I avoid wearing bags unless I really have to. You'll usually see me with a tape clipped to my pocket while working, though. Just sayin'...


I don't wear bags, haven't for years, but I've always got a tape measure clipped to my pocket. My good friends know that about me & make fun of me when I show up somewhere without one. Hell, I've been known to wear a tape to funerals & weddings, mostly as a running joke with close friends who expect it. I always break out a brand new one for the occasion though.:laughing:


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

Kingcarpenter1 said:


> My main supplier 30 plus years tells me shortage is b.s. said the’ve blown this thing so far out it’s a gouging war like gas after the storms. He also said some of the majors are holding back to fool us all into panic mode. This guys in the know & has top connects with a few majors


I wouldn't doubt it in the least. Taking advantage of a situation to make monetary gain is nothing new.

Hey Frank, hold that order for a couple of days. We'll be able to tack on another 15% when we let it go.


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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

Haven't noticed any change in hardwoods. I bought some soft maple yesterday and the price was the same as it was 6 months ago. The manager said he hasn't seen any pricing increases.


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## NYCB (Sep 20, 2010)

Tinstaafl said:


> These days I avoid wearing bags unless I really have to. You'll usually see me with a tape clipped to my pocket while working, though. Just sayin'...


I hate wearing a belt and pouches, I do my best to avoid it, we work out of a bucket or wheelbarrow when possible and I save my belt for when I have to move around a lot.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

What is it about bags you boys don't like? Even not being used to wearing heavy bags anymore I cannot do anything of substance without them on except punch list. If im forming or framing I want my full set up. Setting bag pro framers with suspenders. Probably 25 pounds fully loaded with a gun and fasteners

I do not want to be wandering around looking for tools, want them on me

If it's minor trim work I will just put a tape on my belt and put a square my back pocket. Id its a bit of work I put on bags 

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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

I went to a yard for some PT 4x4's and they had four (4!) pieces on the shelf. I didn't even bother to go look at them. Expecting more after labor day. :blink:

4x4-10 PT = $31.03
6x6-8 PT = $50.19
4x6- 8 PT #2 were only $21.88


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## mrcat (Jun 27, 2015)

Jaws said:


> What is it about bags you boys don't like? Even not being used to wearing heavy bags anymore I cannot do anything of substance without them on except punch list. If im forming or framing I want my full set up. Setting bag pro framers with suspenders. Probably 25 pounds fully loaded with a gun and fasteners
> 
> I do not want to be wandering around looking for tools, want them on me
> 
> ...


No ass syndrome is a b!tch when wearing heavy bags.

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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

Contractor trash bags. I don't buy a whole lot of them but it seems (to me) they have skyrocketed.


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## pinwheel (Dec 7, 2009)

Jaws said:


> What is it about bags you boys don't like? Even not being used to wearing heavy bags anymore I cannot do anything of substance without them on except punch list. If im forming or framing I want my full set up. Setting bag pro framers with suspenders. Probably 25 pounds fully loaded with a gun and fasteners
> 
> I do not want to be wandering around looking for tools, want them on me
> 
> ...


Don't need bags to run a floor sander. Don't want bags scratching up cabinets on the job site. In the shop running machines, don't need bags. I have 2 roll around carts in the shop that hold essentials while doing assembly. I've even gotten to the point of taking a cart to the job site to keep essentials close & organized when trimming or setting cabinets. Tape clipped to my pocket speed square pencil & scribe in my back pocket.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

Jaws said:


> What is it about bags you boys don't like?


Wait till you get to my age, whippersnapper. There are days it's a chore just to haul my own skinny butt around, let alone a few pounds of tools. :laughing:

I wear 'em when I need to. Fortunately, my balls-to-the-walls days are pretty much a thing of the past.


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## rblakes1 (Jan 8, 2015)

I basically only wear bags when framing or siding, neither of which I do often. I don't need them for trim, so I pretty much just have a tape clipped to my belt most days with pencils and a knife in the carpenter side pocket

-Rich


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## NYCB (Sep 20, 2010)

mrcat said:


> No ass syndrome is a b!tch when wearing heavy bags.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


Start deadlifting, I have a fine set of glutes.

I just don't like belt rubbing on my hips all day.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Leo G said:


> They just spent 3 trillion dollar that they invented out of thin air. This is simple inflation by dilution of the money supply. That on top of the virus shutting a lot of places down temporarily and putting a monkey wrench into the supply chain probably make up a lot of the supply price increases.


Inflation from the artificial money hasn't hit yet. Will be 2021 before we start seeing the true effects of that

There is a chit ton of houses going up in some parts of the country with 2.5% interedt rates - close the mills for a bit and boom  

Just like meat. There is no meat shortage and never was. There was a processing plant shortage 

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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

> The current index is the highest it has been in 35 years, after dropping to a score of 30 in April. New home demand continues to be strong, *but Dumain said demand could lose momentum if lumber prices continue to rise*.


https://www.constructiondive.com/news/lumber-prices-soar-due-to-shutdowns-higher-demand/583899/


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## Kingcarpenter1 (May 5, 2020)

I think you could be on to something Robbie. Any of us who has been in the game a while knows that the market is always played with in some shape or form around election time. My supplier again who has some top majors called me when I left Houston Friday we talked & he said part political part majors holding back. B-u-t who knows. All I know is I’m sick of all the drama

Mike


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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

I'll be the first to admit that i don't know squat about the lumber industry.

With that said, thinking through the processes, it seems like most everything is done with big heavy equipment and machinery, with a lone person operating that machinery. I just don't see a lot of close-quarter contact with others....in any of the procedures...from cutting the trees to loading the lumber on the shelves at Lowe's. It's all machinery and equipment.


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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

Delaware is a huge chicken processing state. 

Though the processing plants closed for a little while, and the workers are all standing right next to each other, I don't know anyone who can't find chicken in the supermarket.

Seems like lumber demand would be less than chicken.


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## AustinDB (Sep 11, 2006)

Robie said:


> And yes, homeowners probably bought some lumber during the quarantine to do some projects with but I have to say...I'm not seeing any "Honey-Do-Decks" around.


HD's around the big city has been jam packed with more homeowner looking people pushing large carts of lumber than ever before. haven't noticed as much of this push in the small city HD (Marble Falls) but then again population is a fraction. Picked up some fasteners yesterday (Saturday) for my van build and the Pflugerville HD was obnoxiously packed-like Black Friday crowds without the sale.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Robie said:


> Delaware is a huge chicken processing state.
> 
> Though the processing plants closed for a little while, and the workers are all standing right next to each other, I don't know anyone who can't find chicken in the supermarket.
> 
> Seems like lumber demand would be less than chicken.


I know a lot about the lumber market, how it is bought and sold in different parts of the country, how wholesale sellers sell to disturbute down, earmarking, down to how lumber salesman are compensated in different ways on it as well as how the yard makes their money. As well as loss leaders, like Lowes used to do with Hardie 

This is about high demand and low supply, its a real situation, not fabricated 

What I agree on is it was caused by government and a lot of it was caused for control and 100% there is an effort to fvck with the economy for this administration 

Like Mike said, this chit happens at election time but this is a huge hike in price. Like I said a lot of dudes were talking about this happening months ago when it first started affecting mills

That hurricane hits a lot of construction projects may even shut down 

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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

AustinDB said:


> HD's around the big city has been jam packed with more homeowner looking people pushing large carts of lumber than ever before. haven't noticed as much of this push in the small city HD (Marble Falls) but then again population is a fraction. Picked up some fasteners yesterday (Saturday) for my van build and the Pflugerville HD was obnoxiously packed-like Black Friday crowds without the sale.


Your braver than me. No way I'd go in those places right now. 

Then again I haven't been in HEB since April either lol

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## mrcat (Jun 27, 2015)

rrk said:


> Yards will hold quote for 7 days tops here


24 hours here lately, my main yard is usually good for 30 days 

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## mrcat (Jun 27, 2015)

AustinDB said:


> HD's around the big city has been jam packed with more homeowner looking people pushing large carts of lumber than ever before. haven't noticed as much of this push in the small city HD (Marble Falls) but then again population is a fraction. Picked up some fasteners yesterday (Saturday) for my van build and the Pflugerville HD was obnoxiously packed-like Black Friday crowds without the sale.


Same here, the big box stores have been jam packed ever since the end of March. 

The last month or so it hasn't been to bad, but I can't believe how long it lasted.

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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Not like they’re building any restaurants or sports stadiums right now.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

If you have a house with a normally $30K lumber bill and that’s now $65K, it’s pretty tough to make that up in markup if your customer has a budget. Then add in everyone else has raised their prices too. I did recently get the best prices ever on appliances though.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Big Johnson said:


> If you have a house with a normally $30K lumber bill and that’s now $65K, it’s pretty tough to make that up in markup if your customer has a budget. Then add in everyone else has raised their prices too. I did recently get the best prices ever on appliances though.


Yep, we aren't double yet but its killing me on these i have in the pipeline. The bigger the house the bigger the lumber package the bigger the dollar amount of the increase


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

Maybe removing the trade duties on Canadian lumber would help. Weren't we trying to support higher timber prices?


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Another way to look at it is our domestic lumber production would be in better shape if Canada hadn’t been dumping lumber on our markets for years.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

Big Johnson said:


> Another way to look at it is our domestic lumber production would be in better shape if Canada hadn’t been dumping lumber on our markets for years.


Was it really that bad, or was the timber lobby just angling for more?


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## cedarboarder (Mar 30, 2015)

Lumber mills *****ed up shutting down thinking demand would drop with covid.. Demand went up! And now we have a shortage.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

MarkJames said:


> Was it really that bad, or was the timber lobby just angling for more?


They were found guilty of dumping by a NAFTA panel.


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## Dirtywhiteboy (Oct 15, 2010)

A 2x4x8' is only 6.40$ at home depot now


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## cedarboarder (Mar 30, 2015)

Does Cali have trex stock? thing has been going up like crazy. haha


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Apparently there’s also a bike shortage. 


https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/coronavirus-induced-bike-shortage-spinning-through-2021


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## cedarboarder (Mar 30, 2015)

Big Johnson said:


> Apparently there’s also a bike shortage.
> 
> 
> https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/coronavirus-induced-bike-shortage-spinning-through-2021


old news the whole summer has been no bikes on the shelf it seems.
I sold my old BMX bike this summer for almost what I paid 10 years ago, I'm waiting for the winter when all the wannabe cyclists sell them off cheap. 
But this time a mountain bike with some gears to tow my kid around in the trailer.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

All this am I tried get a handle on this chit, I got three that I have signed intent to builds and atleast 2500 in good faith deposits from each i could easily lose over this. I started moving numbers around trying to make room for the approximate 8 dollars a square foot this cost each house. One of the houses is three stories with 2000 sq ft of decking. Had planned on Azek Vintage in the allowance but with the frame package being over 150k up from 87k got to start finding room, and at 5 a lf + a buck for fasteners i got lots of room - i hollered at the lumber yard to get pricing on 2x6 smooth cedar with stainless fasteners. I knew that it was up when he started the call "your fixing to get mad at me" 

My framer was high as giraffe ***** on it too. I met him and went over the plans and tried to see if there was some room. He was basically like dude you have framed chit, here's how I figured it and handed me his chicken scratch. Broke down by floor, deck, stair case, siding etc... i couldn't argue with any of it. The only thing that was very high was the lift, so I said to take it out and I would order and take the risk on it 

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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Jaws said:


> Al
> My framer was high as giraffe ***** on it too. I met him and went over the plans and tried to see if there was some room. He was basically like dude you have framed chit, here's how I figured it and handed me his chicken scratch. Broke down by floor, deck, stair case, siding etc... i couldn't argue with any of it. The only thing that was very high was the lift, so I said to take it out and I would order and take the risk on it
> 
> Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk



Now you sound like that 7 things to never say to a contractor guy.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Big Johnson said:


> Now you sound like that 7 things to never say to a contractor guy.


I didn't beat him down. I just was making sure I wasn't buying a new truck or vacation lol

He was all to happy to not rent the lift 

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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

I just averaged my latest frame package qoute - 19 bucks a ft, up from under 11.... 

Lumber is now over $800.00 for thousand board feet


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

I guess there’s a babysitter shortage too. The lady my wife picked makes almost $100K/yr watching 4 kids.


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## Randy Bush (Mar 7, 2011)

Lumber is crazy. Bought some 1/2 osb today. $22 a sheet. Has doubled in cost since 1st of the year. 

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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

Same here.


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## VinylHanger (Jul 14, 2011)

Big Johnson said:


> I guess there’s a babysitter shortage too. The lady my wife picked makes almost $100K/yr watching 4 kids.


That is f'ing insane. I assume she makes more than 15 bucks an hour. How does anyone afford that. I am so glad we don't have to worry about that anymore.

Never did daycare or babysitters, so maybe I don't have a basis to base it on. But that seems insane to me. 

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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Big Johnson said:


> I guess there’s a babysitter shortage too. The lady my wife picked makes almost $100K/yr watching 4 kids.


I thought 600 a week cash was a lot for a nanny lol. 

I feel bad for you son lol

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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

Big Johnson said:


> I guess there’s a babysitter shortage too. The lady my wife picked makes almost $100K/yr watching 4 kids.


your numbers don't add up.

say 2000 billable hours in a year she would need $50/hr to make the 100k...

i know daycare is in short supply & expensive but not quite that expensive...at least out here...


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

She charges $25,***/yr for 45 hours a week per kid.


And from what I understand I have to pay the whole 15.3% fica plus Federal and state unemployment taxes.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Apparently she’s top notch, I’m told she rocks the kid when they’re upset and shlt. That’s great but my kid doesn’t even like to be held.


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

She should be paying 1/2 if you are the employer.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Randy Bush said:


> Lumber is crazy. Bought some 1/2 osb today. $22 a sheet. Has doubled in cost since 1st of the year.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A115A using Tapatalk


I think I paid $8 sheet for 1/2” earlier this year. I have a full sheet leftover maybe I should put it on Craigslist for $20.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Leo G said:


> She should be paying 1/2 if you are the employer.


Normally but she doesn’t want to and it’s perfectly legal for me to cover her half.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

This lumber thing has gotten totally out of control and I hear the prices are going to continue to increase.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

So who’s making all the money? If a lumberjack was making $30/hr last year is he getting $60/hr now? Is it Wall Street? Yard? Mill? Trucker?


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Big Johnson said:


> Apparently she’s top notch, I’m told she rocks the kid when they’re upset and shlt. That’s great but my kid doesn’t even like to be held.


Is this an actual gig or you have 4 kids and pay your wife 100k for tax reasons? 

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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Jaws said:


> Is this an actual gig or you have 4 kids and pay your wife 100k for tax reasons?
> 
> Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk


This is a lady my wife wants to use. We only have one but the sitter watches other kids.


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

Big Johnson said:


> Normally but she doesn’t want to and it’s perfectly legal for me to cover her half.


Well neither do I. But the govt makes me if I'm collecting a paycheck over $600.00


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## Kingcarpenter1 (May 5, 2020)

Think I’d be looking elsewhere


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Jaws said:


> I thought 600 a week cash was a lot for a nanny lol.
> 
> I feel bad for you son lol
> 
> Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk


Not sure how I hit 6, its 400, 2 kids

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## mrcat (Jun 27, 2015)

Big Johnson said:


> So who’s making all the money? If a lumberjack was making $30/hr last year is he getting $60/hr now? Is it Wall Street? Yard? Mill? Trucker?


Mills and brokers.

My cousin is a logger in Tn. Talked to him the other day, and what he's getting paid has actually dropped a bit.

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## Kingcarpenter1 (May 5, 2020)

Snowball rolls downhill. Brokers, mill, local suppliers other m/men% mark ups the whole roll. The hands harvesting the trees will be the last to get more


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## Stunt Carpenter (Dec 31, 2011)

Randy Bush said:


> Lumber is crazy. Bought some 1/2 osb today. $22 a sheet. Has doubled in cost since 1st of the year.
> 
> Sent from my SM-A115A using Tapatalk



1/2 ply is cheaper than osb here now $27 for the ply today.


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## Randy Bush (Mar 7, 2011)

Stunt Carpenter said:


> 1/2 ply is cheaper than osb here now $27 for the ply today.


 If this does not turn around, is probably going to have a neg effect on building and remodeling.


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## Kingcarpenter1 (May 5, 2020)

With the storms in the Gulf I’m sure hundreds of bundles of ply was sold. Saw a huge commercial building with @ least 300 windows 1 sheet per window leaving H-town Saturday. That’s just 1 building

Mike


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Randy Bush said:


> If this does not turn around, is probably going to have a neg effect on building and remodeling.


We’re in tripling territory now. No way can than not put a damper on building.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

From my outside sales:

Please keep in mind that we are only holding our quotes for*7 days only.
*
Thank you for your understanding and support.
*
*
Market 8/17/20 Highlights:
*
SPF –
Another leap upward in the SPF market on strong demand and fed further by strong housing news. Western mills have now pushed order files into early/mid-October and continue to get little to no resistance on either side of the border.**

SPF Studs –
Studs in the east continue to be in tight supply as offerings were once again very limited. 9’ commanded the most attention in both 2x4 and 2x6 as prices were up $80 to $90 and vary widely supplier to supplier. As with dimension, no relief in the near term as supply just simply can’t keep up with demand.
*
DF Studs –
Mill order files, which now sit into early October on most items, have kept substantial upward pressure on the green market.* Buyers have been forced to stay in the market as increasing demand along with these extended lead times has most scrambling for coverage.
*
SYP –
Mills continue to sell almost anything offered at significant premiums to reported numbers.* Fiber remains tight and order files are deep into September and could be October depending on the item and mill.
*
OSB –
Whoever would have guessed that a small producer with just two mills in the South would become the only producer to quote product and become a national supplier.
*
Treated –
We continue to see relentless upward momentum in sales and an overwhelming surge in prices in all SYP/Treated items.** Treaters are still having difficulty sourcing 5/4 decking, especially 16’, which in some markets remains unattainable.
*
*
Please make sure you are planning accordingly when you are bidding a job. And please keep your salesman apprised on what big jobs are coming up so we can make sure to have material on hand to send out.
*
Keep in mind, all quotes are only good for*7 days, so anything that has been quoted out a month ago or longer the prices*will not*be guaranteed. We will work with you as much as we can, but there could be adjustments as we go.
*
*
Thank you and have a great week!


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## shanewreckd (Oct 2, 2014)

As far as I know it around here, Canfor started curtailing mills last fall when stumpage fees all went up here in BC. With 50% capacity over the winter they were barely keeping up. Then Covid started and several more mills had to shut down (partially positive testing and partially unions pushing against wanting to risk it). Once they started up again, they were already too far behind. If they can ramp up production more, even reopen some mills, maybe it'll all calm down by spring. Delivery driver from my yard was telling me they have less than 200 sheets of 1/2" ply, less OSB, no treated lumber, and haven't seen a truck in 3 weeks.

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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

**** me...just got updated pricing on a build starting in 3 weeks...framing went up $13k for a 1900 sq ft ranch!!! WTF?!! I knew some stuff had gone up but geez!


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

Jaws said:


> From my outside sales:
> 
> Please keep in mind that we are only holding our quotes for*7 days only.
> *
> ...


i recall a time, late 70's/early 80's, when lumber quotes were good for 48 hours from the time of the quote.

FOG at the contractors desk thinks that could be coming again.


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## RichVT (Feb 28, 2009)

Well I guess I shouldn't plan on getting those 16' deck boards that I need until sometime next year. At least it's for my own house and not a customer.


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## TPS BOCO (Jan 30, 2018)

Crazy chit, I'm basically un-selling jobs. One where I was doing 80' of fence and a small low deck wanted me to honor pricing on a quote from February with a start date of mid-April then barely started the landscape project 2 weeks ago. Told another potential client that I'd cut up oilfield pipe before I'd pay for 4x6 or 6x6 cedar.

4x4x9 at my normal yard are now $33, pickets are virtually unavailable. 

Can't even find or get quotes for kiln dried PT and the wet HD chit is absurd too.

**Also virtually no 'hand picking', restock fees on culls getting crazy, some won't take returns at all.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

This article says they were this high in 2018, I don’t remember that. 


“ The last time lumber prices increased this much, back in 2018, the square footage of newly-built homes dropped, Logan said.”



https://www.marketwatch.com/story/l...nd-thats-bad-news-for-home-buyers-11594850533


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## JoeStanton (Sep 24, 2008)

Strange, I quoted a sun room July 14th of just over 10k in materials. Pvc, 4x6 rafter and 2x6 t&g fir ect. Ordered yesterday and the price went down $80. 

Haven't ordered windows or roofing yet, we shall see. Just did a small hardwood job I quoted in Nov, 2 1/4 oak was close enough I could stick to my price. Box store I hear are bare but my lumber yard is going strong.

They can't discount most lumber as they are buying it for more than they sold the last bunk. Not seeing the increases some of you are, yet.


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## A&E Exteriors (Aug 14, 2009)

I bought 4 sheets of 7/16 osb and 8 14' 2x4s the other day and paid $207

Ridiculous 

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## A&E Exteriors (Aug 14, 2009)

Big Johnson said:


> She charges $25,***/yr for 45 hours a week per kid.
> 
> 
> And from what I understand I have to pay the whole 15.3% fica plus Federal and state unemployment taxes.


Holy phuck man

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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

A&E Exteriors said:


> Holy phuck man
> 
> Sent from my SM-G988U using Tapatalk


I showed her the math, she didn’t care at first but I think I’ve talked her off the ledge.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Another thing with lumber prices is sales tax. If a lumber package goes up $50K you have another $3K you send to the commies in your state capitol to fund BLM agendas. Even more in some states.


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## Randy Bush (Mar 7, 2011)

Big Johnson said:


> Another thing with lumber prices is sales tax. If a lumber package goes up $50K you have another $3K you send to the commies in your state capitol to fund BLM agendas. Even more in some states.


Thankfully we don't have a sales tax here.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Big Johnson said:


> I showed her the math, she didn’t care at first but I think I’ve talked her off the ledge.


Mines not a math person either, although she's less likely to spend money on something like that than I am. She botched the first two years of private school Lol

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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

2x4x8 fir $6.89

Maple ply is still below $50 while cdx is at $44 wtf?

clearly this isn't chinese virus related now, what's the real reason ? I think I already have an idea.


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## enterprise (Dec 5, 2017)

i saw 7/16 osb for 27 dollars in denver


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

rrk said:


> 2x4x8 fir $6.89
> 
> Maple ply is still below $50 while cdx is at $44 wtf?
> 
> clearly this isn't chinese virus related now, what's the real reason ? I think I already have an idea.


Because most are stupid enough to pay that much and whatever the market will bear is what the cost will be.


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## Kowboy (May 7, 2009)

flaglor said:


> I’m all for paying reasonable charges for services or products that add value, but these ongoing gouges by some businesses hurt our whole economy.


How can there be "gouging" in a capitalist economy? Price too high? Use something/someone else.


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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

Leo G said:


> Because most are stupid enough to pay that much and whatever the market will bear is what the cost will be.


The contractor or the consumer?


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Kowboy said:


> How can there be "gouging" in a capitalist economy? Price too high? Use something/someone else.


$3 for a 9’ steel stud.


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## rblakes1 (Jan 8, 2015)

rrk said:


> 2x4x8 fir $6.89
> 
> Maple ply is still below $50 while cdx is at $44 wtf?
> 
> clearly this isn't chinese virus related now, what's the real reason ? I think I already have an idea.


Where do you get maple ply for under 50? 

I paid 120 for 1/2 a1 back in May 

-Rich


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

rblakes1 said:


> Where do you get maple ply for under 50?
> 
> I paid 120 for 1/2 a1 back in May
> 
> -Rich


You got prefinished, mine was unfinished. I just got 4 sheets last week at Lowes for a tool cart I was making for a friend. Cant't touch it with a piece of sandpaper tough.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

A&E Exteriors said:


> I bought 4 sheets of 7/16 osb and 8 14' 2x4s the other day and paid $207
> 
> Ridiculous
> 
> Sent from my SM-G988U using Tapatalk


7/16” is only $17 at home depot and Lowes, haven’t checked the ly lately. That’s not too bad, I remember paying $14 a couple years ago. 

Mynards wants $25 though.


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

rblakes1 said:


> Where do you get maple ply for under 50?
> 
> I paid 120 for 1/2 a1 back in May
> 
> -Rich





rrk said:


> You got prefinished, mine was unfinished. I just got 4 sheets last week at Lowes for a tool cart I was making for a friend. Cant't touch it with a piece of sandpaper tough.


Because the box store doesn't sell A1, not even close. Most of the time I've been getting C2 Maple from my supplier. It's 70-80 depending on raw, 1 or 2 sides finished. As far as I know they don't sell A1 prefin.


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## rblakes1 (Jan 8, 2015)

rrk said:


> You got prefinished, mine was unfinished. I just got 4 sheets last week at Lowes for a tool cart I was making for a friend. Cant't touch it with a piece of sandpaper tough.


Wasn't prefinished, my prefinished runs about 75-85 depending on thickness and 1 or 2 side

-Rich


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## VinylHanger (Jul 14, 2011)

Finished, prefinished, semi prefinished. Meh.

Real carpenters use studs.

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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

3/4" maple ply...unfinished...A-1...$107.00 a few weeks ago. The price hadn't changed from March.


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

OSB is almost 3x what it cost in January.

Other supplies & materials following suit.

https://hosted.ap.org/dailycourier/...ouses-increase-price-lumber-demand-skyrockets


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## shanewreckd (Oct 2, 2014)

I bought some 3/8" sheeting to do a quick re-re on a rot job yesterday, $30CAD a sheet. That little bill was much higher than I was expecting...

Our yards aren't selling bunks of lumber right now either, unless you show up with a plan and permit. Preventing hoarding I guess.

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## Stunt Carpenter (Dec 31, 2011)

shanewreckd said:


> I bought some 3/8" sheeting to do a quick re-re on a rot job yesterday, $30CAD a sheet. That little bill was much higher than I was expecting...
> 
> Our yards aren't selling bunks of lumber right now either, unless you show up with a plan and permit. Preventing hoarding I guess.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G973W using Tapatalk



I was told that they don’t want to bring in anything they don’t need so they aren’t stuck with bunks of lumber purchase at a premium when prices hopefully crash


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Been watching the Lowe’s website and 2x4 prices are dropping. Inventory shows 9000 8’ers and 2200 92-5/8 Studs. Studs are currently $4.32. Lowe’s has always been a few cents more than my LY on studs.


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## 107415 (Sep 16, 2014)

So I started this thread 4 months ago and was upset because Advantech had gone to $34 and osb was $16. Now I need to start another house and its up to $43 and $26. Framing lumber is equally higher. Do we see an end in sight, or a time when prices will return to “normal?”

The good news is that higher prices don’t seem to put off new homebuyers. It just pains me to pay that much.


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## VinylHanger (Jul 14, 2011)

Just priced 2x6x16 kd. 34 bucks. Sheesh. Same price as 4x6x12 pt.

Was going to build a large greenhouse at our place. Now we are just going to do a metal framed 12x40 hoop house. Much cheaper right now. I can get all the hoop pipe for the cost of just the 2x's.

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## MTN REMODEL LLC (Sep 3, 2010)

Guys.....I'm retired now, except maybe small stuff on my personal home or minor stuff for a friend....by the way, I sorta remember, but what's a tape measure and bags ?????

Honestly, I'm interested on your consensus of the grossly rising material costs.

1) Is it supply shortages by the fires in Cali etc and the hurricanes thru the SW.

2) I don't necessarily under stand Covid being a direct cause.....except perhaps demand for home renovations and demand for single family move out of cities into homes with availability of office space for remote working in the future.

3) Lack of competition among the Big Boxers....we used to have numerous providers and now basically just Lowes and HD have an almost oligarpy. I'm in a very small town now....have we lost a lot of our local yards. Is it price setting/gouging among two competitors.

4) Trade and embargo tariff issues/costs and devaluation of the dollar on imported materials..

5) Remember, the gov tells us "we don't have inflation in the country" (1.3% last year for your SS payment). Is demand just so strong because we are printing money and artificially manipulating interest costs at very nominal rates.

Maybe it is a "perfect storm" of everything.

I commiserate with you all...what do you practically do bidding/estimateing....call the yard for current price on about everything.... or just use last price and an escalator clause.....got to be a huge\paperwork PIA.


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## MTN REMODEL LLC (Sep 3, 2010)

Guys.....I'm retired now, except maybe small stuff on my personal home or minor stuff for a friend....by the way, I sorta remember, but what's a tape measure and bags ?????

Honestly, I'm interested on your consensus of the grossly rising material costs.

1) Is it supply shortages by the fires in Cali etc and the hurricanes thru the SW.

2) I don't necessarily under stand Covid being a direct cause.....except perhaps demand for home renovations and demand for single family move out of cities into homes with availability of office space for remote working in the future.

3) Lack of competition among the Big Boxers....we used to have numerous providers and now basically just Lowes and HD have an almost oligarpy. I'm in a very small town now....have we lost a lot of our local yards. Is it price setting/gouging among two competitors.

4) Trade and embargo tariff issues/costs and devaluation of the dollar on imported materials..

5) Remember, the gov tells us "we don't have inflation in the country" (1.3% last year for your SS payment). Is demand just so strong because we are printing money and artificially manipulating interest costs at very nominal rates.

Maybe it is a "perfect storm" of everything.

I commiserate with you all...what do you practically do bidding/estimateing....call the yard for current price on about everything.... or just use last price and an escalator clause.....got to be a huge\paperwork PIA.


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## JoeStanton (Sep 24, 2008)

The tariffs did add a small % at least here in MA. Covid shut down so many suppliers for months and construction just kept going. Everyone staying home was doing or having home reno's done. My lumber yard has been great to me and is literally selling me lumber for less than they can replace it. 

Escalation clause is a must and I hold pricing for 7 days only. The other part IMO is just general price gouging because the supplies can and because they were shut down for months. I have gotten some of the strangest calls for work that I would usually never get. I think people walk around their house during lunch break and look for stuff to get done. This thing beat me pretty good as we were out of work for almost 3 months. Nobody wanted us in their house and the sky was falling. Hit it hard from June on and still made this one of our top 5 years.

I truly feel for the restaurants, another round of shut downs is really going to put a lot of them out.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

MTN REMODEL LLC said:


> Guys.....I'm retired now, except maybe small stuff on my personal home or minor stuff for a friend....by the way, I sorta remember, but what's a tape measure and bags ?????
> 
> Honestly, I'm interested on your consensus of the grossly rising material costs.
> 
> ...


DIY demand was up like 600% during the lock downs with a bunch of people used to making 600 a week getting 900 a week on unemployment and nothing to do so took that 3400 or whatever it was stimulus check and their new found money and got 18 months 0% at the Home Cheapo and built decks and hacked up additions on their houses etc... driving material demands high while the covid shutdowns at mills and distribution centers caused a lag in supply. Boom  you get massive inflation caused by retards in office 

I'm glad we have wealthy clients but more than one job has backed out because of the materials. My buddy in Cordelane is remodeling a bathroom right now, bothis remodel/additions backed out until priced go back down. Hed already pulled permit for one 

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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

Jaws said:


> bothis remodel/additions backed out until priced go back down.


I don't think prices are going back down. Maybe a little but not substantially.


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

Up a dollar, down 10 cents up a dollar down 20 cents...

See the price is going down.


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## Kingcarpenter1 (May 5, 2020)

Robie said:


> I don't think prices are going back down. Maybe a little but not substantially


Yeppers ain’t happening. Do you ever see grocery prices go down or truck prices go down. They can take it to what ever level they want. Besides that the demand is ever increasing.

Mike


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## Randy Bush (Mar 7, 2011)

Talked to my guy at the yard the day while getting a bid. Said prices are starting to come down some. Time will tell how much though. 

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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Robie said:


> I don't think prices are going back down. Maybe a little but not substantially.


Commodities traders disagree according to NAHB analysts. Most builders expect it down 20% by March. Doesnt mean it will but it indicates it will

I figure when I order my framing package for my spec in April ill compare to the ones this month id guess off my ass probably 30% difference

How many times osb and plywood shot through the roof and come back down? 

Hard to artificially keep a commodity high, competition won't play ball

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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

Jaws said:


> Commodities traders disagree according to NAHB analysts. Most builders expect it down 20% by March. Doesnt mean it will but it indicates it will
> 
> I figure when I order my framing package for my spec in April ill compare to the ones this month id guess off my ass probably 30% difference
> 
> ...



I don't doubt it at all.

My point and example I've used many times is....way back during the oil embargo in '73-'74, it was reported and fear instilled that a loaf of bread was going to skyrocket to $3.50 per loaf. At the time, a loaf of bread was .99 cents. 
The price went way up but never hit $3.50. After a while, it came down...to $2.00. People were relieved and happy.

I'm sure I'm off on the exact numbers they predicted a loaf to go up and the actual price per loaf at the time. But I'm pretty sure I'm not wrong about the differences in a before and after effect.

That's all.


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## JoeStanton (Sep 24, 2008)

The prices will come down as they always do. Remember when osb shot up from $12 to $30 2-3 years ago? Talking with my salesmen even they want the pricing to come down, lowering margins for their loyal customers. This winter is gonna be a bit tough and then we are gonna roll IMO. This has turned out to be my best year in 14 years, tough to be happy about with other businesses basically going out. I will do what I can locally and my guys will get generous bonuses, it feels like blood money. I have a few friends who have been hit truly hard by this and I am really appreciative I have been able to make things work.

IMO things need to STOP being shut down and let people make their own decision. If you want a burger and will risk the rona then that's your choice. Let the business owners and customers make the choice. ben and jerry just came out with a conlin kapernick ice cream, I will never buy their ice cream again. Defund the police and abolish the police? Who are you gonna call when you get robbed, the whole thing is insane. Yes, there are bad eggs in every part of life.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Robie said:


> I don't doubt it at all.
> 
> My point and example I've used many times is....way back during the oil embargo in '73-'74, it was reported and fear instilled that a loaf of bread was going to skyrocket to $3.50 per loaf. At the time, a loaf of bread was .99 cents.
> The price went way up but never hit $3.50. After a while, it came down...to $2.00. People were relieved and happy.
> ...


They always leave a little extra for sure. I'm still pissed off about pain fuel charges on my shingles when they added the surcharge at $4 a gallon. Lol

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## tgeb (Feb 9, 2006)

Picked up some form lumber yesterday, it's been a while since I bought any 2x12's I think these prices are a bit on the high side.

A few of the 2x4's had a1/2 inch crown, I'll cut those up for braces.


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## cgworks (Mar 17, 2008)

flaglor said:


> I just started a new spec house after a 2 year hiatus doing other projects. Framing material prices are going crazy Just in the last month here in Tennessee. Advantech is $33-36. OSB today $15.25-$18.99 depending on which supplier. Framing lumber also climbing daily. Is everyone seeing this? Are we going to see it in all phases of materials? I’m trying to place all my major orders ASAP to lock in prices.


OSB here in Denver is $35. It is insane.


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## mrcat (Jun 27, 2015)

cgworks said:


> OSB here in Denver is $35. It is insane.


Just got updated pricing from our lumber yard yesterday. 
7/16 osb $40
1/2" cdx. $42
3/4 advantech.... ****ing $64.95

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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

I think you are being taken advantage of


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Jaws said:


> Commodities traders disagree according to NAHB analysts. Most builders expect it down 20% by March. Doesnt mean it will but it indicates it will
> 
> I figure when I order my framing package for my spec in April ill compare to the ones this month id guess off my ass probably 30% difference
> 
> ...


Looks like them commodities traders ****ed up mind Robie was right 😆


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

Looks like the same crap they did with oil years back when it was hitting $130+ bbl. The speculators were pushing up the price so the could make more in the market all the while killing the economy because it's based on moving stuff from one place to the other by vehicles which use fuel.


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## mrcat (Jun 27, 2015)

Leo G said:


> I think you are being taken advantage of


Trust me, we price checked. The other yard in town was about the same.
Lowes has the osb for $11 cheaper, the advantech was $2 cheaper at Lowe's.

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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

7/16 zip is 38 a sheet here, 5/8 is 45.00


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## cgworks (Mar 17, 2008)

mrcat said:


> Just got updated pricing from our lumber yard yesterday.
> 7/16 osb $40
> 1/2" cdx. $42
> 3/4 advantech.... ****ing $64.95
> ...


In two months osb is now at $67 and 2x4 is $7.81


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## VinylHanger (Jul 14, 2011)

1/2 inch plywood is significantly cheaper than osb now.

Weird. 

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## mrcat (Jun 27, 2015)

cgworks said:


> In two months osb is now at $67 and 2x4 is $7.81


We're at $62 for 7/16 osb now, $95 for 3/4 advantech, $19.85 for 2x4x16spf. 1/2"cdx is $66

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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

Will work come to a grinding halt now? customers cant believe how much things are now and lack of availability


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

Can't believe it's still going on with those crazy prices. If it keeps moving forward the suppliers are just going to keep raising prices.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

I can't believe how much things are.

Even building a shed, you need a loan.....


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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

Just spoke to a Sherwin Williams rep about what we are hearing regarding a paint shortage.
He said they are experiencing a problem in getting paint.
I asked him to elaborate.
I haven't checked it out yet but according to him, a major producer of a paint ingredient in Texas virtually has had to start over again because of the week-long freeze they suffered through. The power was out and it resulted in a loss of everything being made in all their vats.
I'll do some research and report back.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Robie said:


> Just spoke to a Sherwin Williams rep about what we are hearing regarding a paint shortage.
> He said they are experiencing a problem in getting paint.
> I asked him to elaborate.
> I haven't checked it out yet but according to him, a major producer of a paint ingredient in Texas virtually has had to start over again because of the week-long freeze they suffered through. The power was out and it resulted in a loss of everything being made in all their vats.
> I'll do some research and report back.


Yep. Luckily for me Pro Classic and Duration haven't been short, just cheaper paints so far. Had to paint a ceiling with duration instead of pro Mar 200 though

Buckets are also an issue they said


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## Stunt Carpenter (Dec 31, 2011)

Robie said:


> Just spoke to a Sherwin Williams rep about what we are hearing regarding a paint shortage.
> He said they are experiencing a problem in getting paint.
> I asked him to elaborate.
> I haven't checked it out yet but according to him, a major producer of a paint ingredient in Texas virtually has had to start over again because of the week-long freeze they suffered through. The power was out and it resulted in a loss of everything being made in all their vats.
> I'll do some research and report back.


I’ve been hearing the same. Also the reasoning behind the Vinyl siding shortage apparently


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## Dirtywhiteboy (Oct 15, 2010)

A 2x4x8' PT is over 10 buck here at homedepot


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