# Lesson learned. Shoulda known better though...



## KAP (Feb 19, 2011)

Inner10 said:


> Because then he would loose 2.5%!


And so would his aunt... 

Only one that makes out there is the bank...


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## parkers5150 (Dec 5, 2008)

Inner10 said:


> Because then he would loose 2.5%!


c'mon Inner quit talkin bush league......just order $900.00 in extra materials and it woks out for everyone:thumbsup:


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Inner10 said:


> How is the $700 yours? Really....
> 
> You her a price of X for materials and labour. She paid materials directly, she get's the refund for extra materials. You still made your labour and the markup on the initial material purchase. How is that money yours?
> 
> Sure if you bought the materials, the refund for extra would be yours...but it would be because YOU paid for them...you didn't pay for these so they belong to her.


Example: He quotes whole job for $8000. Estimates $4K material/$4K labor. Ends up only using $3300 in materials, his “labor” ends up $4700. It could also go the other way with him ending up having to buy more than $4000 in materials and he eats it. The customer agreed on $8000 for the job. Not time + materials. 

Some supply houses give 10% discounts to contractors if they pay within so many days. Material bill for auntie May off the street is $4000 period. His cost would be $3600 if he pays his tab before the deadline. That makes his take $4400. Like he originally said; he screwed up, the extra money should have been his. 

My advice for the future is tell your customer that you get a contractor discount and if said customer wants to pay direct the price will increase to joe blow pricing. Which I guarantee is more than any stupid frequent flyer miles they’ll get from capital one.




But what it sounds like happened in OP’s case was an insurance claim. Customer got $8,000 for the roof from GEICO. OP says he’ll do it for that. Auntie May says: I’ll put materials on my Wells Fargo so I can spring break in Cancun. OP orders more material than necessary which comes out of the $8000. To return it he has to use AM’s CC. End result is Auntie gets a cut of the insurance money.


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## Seven-Delta-FortyOne (Mar 5, 2011)

Come on, man. Tell your Auntie that she's getting $700 back because you're so damn good, Merry Christmas, Auntie! :clap:

Maybe she'll buy you a bottle of Bourbon and refer you to a bunch of friends. It's not really you money, hoss.



Delta


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## Bearded Wonder (Jan 21, 2011)

Seven-Delta-FortyOne said:


> Come on, man. Tell your Auntie that she's getting $700 back because you're so damn good, Merry Christmas, Auntie! :clap:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Exactly what I did. Said hey, great news, you’ll be getting a refund for the extra materials. Acted like it was totally cool and I was happy to do it. Now I’m starting her kitchen remodel in the next two weeks. Love that silver lining. Not sure if that pushed her over the edge into going with me on the kitchen, but couldn’t have hurt. 


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## Bearded Wonder (Jan 21, 2011)

But it WAS my money dammit....


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## KAP (Feb 19, 2011)

Bearded Wonder said:


> *But it WAS my money dammit*...




Bearded Wonder said:


> *Now I’m starting her kitchen remodel* in the next two weeks. Love that silver lining.


If that's the way you feel about it, claw it back with the kitchen... :whistling:laughing:


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## Bull Trout (Dec 6, 2016)

Inner10 said:


> Because then he would loose 2.5%!





KAP said:


> And so would his aunt...
> 
> Only one that makes out there is the bank...


his aunt's invoice would have been 2.5% higher, but she would get all the more points... 

CCs are not my preferred way of accepting payment, but if a customer wants to pay the service fee to use it, they are welcome to. I am all about removing any barriers between money earned and my bank account.


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## KAP (Feb 19, 2011)

Bull Trout said:


> his aunt's invoice would have been 2.5% higher, but she would get all the more points...
> 
> CCs are not my preferred way of accepting payment, but if a customer wants to pay the service fee to use it, they are welcome to.


If it works for you (perceived or not) all the power to you, but do you really think the bank is paying for those points? 

It's literally like paying $10,000 for something, the bank charges you $250 for the privilege of being a go between of money you're going to pay ANYWAY, then giving you $100 back of the $250 YOU paid for that privilege (i.e. - points) and you thinking the bank paid for it... that's IF you pay it in full and there are no interest/fees involved...

Who worked for that money again?




Bull Trout said:


> I am all about removing any barriers between money earned and my bank account.


So am I... that's why we removed the banks 2.5-3% barrier from taking money we earned and our bank account...


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## Bull Trout (Dec 6, 2016)

KAP said:


> If it works for you (perceived or not) all the power to you, but do you really think the bank is paying for those points?
> 
> It's literally like paying $10,000 for something, the bank charges you $250 for the privilege of being a go between of money you're going to pay ANYWAY, then giving you $100 back of the $250 YOU paid for that privilege (i.e. - points) and you thinking the bank paid for it... that's IF you pay it in full and there are no interest/fees involved...
> 
> ...


I agree with you, I don't personally use a CC, but I will accept them as payment, with a processing fee that covers my additional cost


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## NYgutterguy (Mar 3, 2014)

Took a beating this year with CC. Did about 30k worth and many sprung it on me last minute. Need to find out ahead of time from now on if they're paying with a card. 


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## VinylHanger (Jul 14, 2011)

Back in 2007-8 when people had lots of credit and no money, the company I worked for got hit hard that way. It would be on 15,000 dollar siding and window jobs. Everyone had equity lines of credit cards.

Eventually we just added 4 percent to every job and covered the fee or made extra if it was a cash/check sale.

If we told them they had to pay the fee, they would be pretty upset.

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## Bull Trout (Dec 6, 2016)

VinylHanger said:


> Back in 2007-8 when people had lots of credit and no money, the company I worked for got hit hard that way. It would be on 15,000 dollar siding and window jobs. Everyone had equity lines of credit cards.
> 
> Eventually we just added 4 percent to every job and covered the fee or made extra if it was a cash/check sale.
> 
> ...


I know it is a different economy now than then, but most people who want to pay with card ask what the processing fee is going to be


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## Bull Trout (Dec 6, 2016)

NYgutterguy said:


> Took a beating this year with CC. Did about 30k worth and many sprung it on me last minute. Need to find out ahead of time from now on if they're paying with a card.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


can you add a line at the bottom of your estimate that there is a CC processing fee?


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## NYgutterguy (Mar 3, 2014)

Bull Trout said:


> can you add a line at the bottom of your estimate that there is a CC processing fee?




Something I will most likely add to the estimates from now on. Used to be get the money and move on to the next one and it will all even out but we are starting to do too many transactions. It's 1.5 if I swipe and 3% if I have to punch in the numbers. Also looking for a new processing company. 


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## brickhook (May 8, 2012)

I will be the first person to admit that I'm a better Brick Mason than a business man. 

With that being said, If I contract a job for an 'X' amount of money, then thats what I'd charge. (Very rarely do I ever give a contract price)

But I charge by piece (block), by the 1000 (brick) by the ft (stone, stucco)

I dont mark up materials and I give all discounts back to the customer. I make my living off my labor.

I feel like your aunt paid for the materials, you didnt use everything you ordered, the return is hers.

And just my 2 cents, dont ever let an insurance company, supply yard, or any third party figure your job for you, that will bite you one day


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## AustinDB (Sep 11, 2006)

did the insurance company cut the aunt a check for the roof repairs and did you contract to do the work for that amount designated by insurance company? or did you do the work time and materials?


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## Jay hole (Nov 12, 2013)

If you agreed to do the job for X amount then give her an invoice for X amount minus what she paid for materials. The amount that was returned should have nothing to do with the price of corn in China.....


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## SectorSecurity (Nov 26, 2013)

NYgutterguy said:


> Took a beating this year with CC. Did about 30k worth and many sprung it on me last minute. Need to find out ahead of time from now on if they're paying with a card.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It's easier to simply assume they are and build in the cost to the quote.

Then you can hit them with a cash payment discount.

Here in Canada I don't believe we are allowed to charge extra for using a credit card but nothing stops us from factoring it in then offering a discount

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## daffysplumbing (Oct 16, 2017)

It sounds like your aunt is very shrewd and ten steps ahead. Maybe, I need to take a few lessons from her.

If you quoted a flat price the money belongs to you with no questions asked. If you quoted labor only plus materials then the money belongs to your aunt with no questions asked.

I say, "business is business and nothing more". 

"Hello, Aunt. Yah. I am doing fine. Guess what happened to me today. I took back the EXTRA materials I ordered to get MY MONEY back and they want to put MY MONEY on YOUR CREDIT CARD. You know what I mean?"

Maybe, the supply company can wait 30, 60, 90 days or whatever it takes to make sure the credit card cannot be back-charged for the first payment and then you can get the money back. I never could understand why businesses don't accommodate their patrons with the exception that crooks will make their customers pay too much for materials and then screw their customers by taking materials back. I have had that happen to my company thousands of times. 

Just a few weeks ago, I received an email from Home Depot with a receipt stating that about $150 worth of items were returned at 6 pm. The items included things like paper towel, cleaning agents, etc. and my fool employee did not know that Home Depot was going to send me a copy of the receipts. Well, he is gone from me forever.

For my relatives and friends I will either work for them for free, or I will not work for them, at all. That is because most people don't know what the true cost for a job is and they don't know whether or not you are giving them a good deal. I just can't see earning a profit from relatives and friends. I will probably say in every post that these types of issues are addresses very well in the book How To Win Friends and Influence People In The Digital Age. I just finished with the book a few weeks ago and will read it several more times.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

NYgutterguy said:


> Took a beating this year with CC. Did about 30k worth and many sprung it on me last minute. Need to find out ahead of time from now on if they're paying with a card.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Is it really worth it? You save time not having to go deposit the cheque....


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## NYgutterguy (Mar 3, 2014)

Inner10 said:


> Is it really worth it? You save time not having to go deposit the cheque....




Prob not. I haven't seen a bank in a while. Everything deposited through my phone. Always say I'm gonna pay attention to my numbers closer and see where I'm wasting but I never do. 


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

NYgutterguy said:


> Prob not. I haven't seen a bank in a while. Everything deposited through my phone. Always say I'm gonna pay attention to my numbers closer and see where I'm wasting but I never do.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


My feeling is I have vastly larger holes to plug before worrying about CC fees...


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## Frank Castle (Dec 27, 2011)

Inner10 said:


> My feeling is I have vastly larger holes to plug before worrying about CC fees...


:laughing:
Me too...:whistling
But you would be surprised how fast they add up.


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## cedarboarder (Mar 30, 2015)

never trust a man with no shirt on.


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## pinwheel (Dec 7, 2009)

Bearded Wonder said:


> Exactly what I did. Said hey, great news, you’ll be getting a refund for the extra materials. Acted like it was totally cool and I was happy to do it. Now I’m starting her kitchen remodel in the next two weeks. Love that silver lining. Not sure if that pushed her over the edge into going with me on the kitchen, but couldn’t have hurt.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


$700 is small change in the scheme of things. Glad it worked out for you man.


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## Metro M & L (Jun 3, 2009)

pinwheel said:


> $700 is small change in the scheme of things. Glad it worked out for you man.


Everytime you get in one of these situations it is an absolute gold mine! You go to your customer and tell them "I'm saving you money and I'm being honest. Thank you for the business please tell your friends."

When the greedy devil on your left shoulder starting yelling 'keep the money' tell him to stfu it's a marketing expense that will make MORE money later!


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