# 400-A Service upgrade pricing



## eleservtech (Feb 23, 2006)

Not exactly if your a good salesman price doesnt matter. If your not any good at closing a sale then of course your not going to get the job.


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## RobertWilber (Mar 5, 2006)

*Thanks BigRed*

ok Red..
5200 is about double 2650...
I find 200s advertised from $3k to $2400
i'm doing 100s for 1300+
granted, nobody is peeling the paint off my doors, but i'm working ...


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## BIGRED (Dec 19, 2005)

RW, the most that I get for a 100-A is $900.00, a 200-A, the most that I get is $1,900.00. That is in Del. Co., Mont. Co., and in Philly. I wonder if those guy's who are advertising those prices are actually getting that.


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## RobertWilber (Mar 5, 2006)

*ouch*

really, truly 13+


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## cjonesjr2007 (Jan 15, 2007)

No way! A 200amp service should not cost anymore than $1800 on a snowy and rainy day. I must be in the wrong state for business.


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## MSSI (Mar 25, 2006)

We do plenty of work in Philly and would charge around 1800 min for one basic 200A, over 25ft service cable, Add $$.. arc faults, Add $$ lb's conduit Add $$ if I am going to use my bucket truck, add $125 per hour.....
​Working all day, in the city, with a bucket truck with your name all over it without getting harrassed by the Union guys..........PRICELESS (lol).. I would probably come in at around 5k for what was origionally posted...
unfortunatly there are plenty of "city folk" who will do a job like this for alot less.​ Thanks to our cities housing authority "training " thousands of people to do Revitilization projects. (properties sold at huge discounts and rehabed using grant money, if you hire and train the community to do the work) The result is 10s of thousands of people working in the city that call themselves contractors. most of their work is awful at best.


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

Service changes have been my 'bread and butter' so to speak for quite some time now. For the last year/year and a half, I've been giving estimates with good/better/best options. The "good" being the job I always did in SE cable, "better" maybe some AFCI's and PVC pipe, and best with RMC, maybe outdoor disco, AFCI's, GFCI's in bath and kitchen, maybe a new circuit or two, whatever else I spot that will be easy in that particular dwelling. You'd be surprised at how many people will pick a more expensive (and higher profit) installation when given a few options.

EDIT... crap, this thread sure got pulled from the dead.


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## Bkessler (Oct 8, 2005)

I agree with MD I try and give customers two or three options for everthing and I would say more often than not people choose the middle or higher priced option. Upsell upsell upsell, as long as still giving good service and a quality product! go wings!


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## mahlere (Aug 6, 2006)

cjonesjr2007 said:


> No way! A 200amp service should not cost anymore than $1800 on a snowy and rainy day. I must be in the wrong state for business.


nope, just in the wrong mindset.


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## acrwc10 (Dec 10, 2006)

cjonesjr2007 said:


> No way! A 200amp service should not cost anymore than $1800 on a snowy and rainy day. I must be in the wrong state for business.


I don't feel at all guilty for charging more then that. I get at least $1500 on a 100amp and $2400 on a 200amp.Thats why I *love *service changes.Permits are extra.:clap:


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## Sparky Joe (Apr 29, 2006)

We just did one for 100k, well still waiting for the power company to do their part, that's 1600 amps with 800A manual transfer switch(10k alone) and the generator rental for a maximum 10 minute downtime.

Edit: Woops the thread was named 400 amp, well I guess divide that by 4, ha


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

Sparky Joe said:


> and the generator rental for a maximum 10 minute downtime.


What sort of place was this that would only tolerate 10 minutes without utility power? Data center?


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## Sparky Joe (Apr 29, 2006)

mdshunk said:


> What sort of place was this that would only tolerate 10 minutes without utility power? Data center?


They make exploratory drill bits, about the only one's in the world that do. I'd never have thought there would be much money in that business, but they piss it away like no one else I've seen.

They run 24/7 and still can't keep up with demand. We've been in there for about 10 years and do a lot of Saturdays there when they can afford to stop a couple machines. We did 12 hours last Saturday, just show up disconnect them then go to breakfast then eventually lunch(unknowingly on them) just so we can re-hook them up at 6 and go home.

Pretty sweet gig really, they move machines so much just to try and keep production up. It'd probably be cheaper to build a whole new facility. The other 800amps of their service was for two new 2000 degree induction conveyor heaters with robotic arms, can't imagine what those cost, or saved seeing as they made production probably 10 minutes faster.


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## MSSI (Mar 25, 2006)

Ahhh the good ole days...drive 3 hrs(paid of course) just to throw a diconnect, babysit and wait for the call to unlock.. all for massive OT


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## cjonesjr2007 (Jan 15, 2007)

mahlere said:


> nope, just in the wrong mindset.


NA I AM A PROFESSIONAL AND I JUST REFUSE TO BE A THIEF THAT'S ALL PRETTY MUCH.


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## cjonesjr2007 (Jan 15, 2007)

acrwc10 said:


> I don't feel at all guilty for charging more then that. I get at least $1500 on a 100amp and $2400 on a 200amp.Thats why I *love *service changes.Permits are extra.:clap:


WHAT STATE DO YOU WIN THESE BIDS IN?


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## Sparky Joe (Apr 29, 2006)

What's with the CAPS master of electricity?


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## cjonesjr2007 (Jan 15, 2007)

Sparky Joe said:


> What's with the CAPS master of electricity?


Didn't mean to blind you guys. Take care.


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## faber307 (Jan 7, 2007)

*400 amp service*

I read previously I should have introduced myself! Sorry Spark.

Tab Faber from Beaverton MI, Service only.

I plugged the description in and came up with $4,543.79
$1,739.65 in parts. Charged $250.00 for the truck. permit included.

28 hours estimated. 2 guys could do it in a day if they have the parts ready and hammer it.

There are some contractors around here that would beat that. But I let them go down that road alone.

I do enjoy reading the posts, I'm sure somthing will come up in the future that I'd like to bounce off you guys for ideas.


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## mahlere (Aug 6, 2006)

cjonesjr2007 said:


> NA I AM A PROFESSIONAL AND I JUST REFUSE TO BE A THIEF THAT'S ALL PRETTY MUCH.


i'm a professional too...i just refuse to work for peanuts...my costs dictate that I charge more than $1800...that's all. 

heck we put in $500, our cost, on material alone...yes we uses QO with pvc and copper.

Then my labor costs me a good penny (since my employees deserve to make enough money to pay their bills too)

Then my business expenses and taxes take up a good chunk.

Finally, at the end of the day, I'd like to make some money on the deal as well.

So, like I said, you are just in the wrong mindset.

(BTW-capitals on the internet is the same as screaming...in my mind, a professional can be rational and reasonable...they don't need to scream)


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## mahlere (Aug 6, 2006)

and for the record, please don't confuse being cheap with being professional...thanks.


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## macmikeman (Sep 12, 2005)

I plugged in the price for the description and came up with $6400 for just the meter socket/ disco/ service drop alone. The other stuff is an adder driving it all up to around 8-9 k for this job. Those of you who do this type of job for $3,000, can call me in two years or so for a job mowing my lawn. If you guy's would just learn how to properly sell your work, then you would never need to struggle. Worse part is you get stubborn about it all, and start calling the smarter guys robbers, when in fact you are robbing your family. Go out and buy a copy of the book How Much Should I Charge. Then read it. Then read it again. After you do I bet your whole outlook on who is robbing who will change. I was one of you guys once upon a time. I too was a stubborn son of a gun. Then I met up with Mahlere. Thanks again Erik. :thumbup:


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## mahlere (Aug 6, 2006)

macmikeman said:


> I plugged in the price for the description and came up with $6400 for just the meter socket/ disco/ service drop alone. The other stuff is an adder driving it all up to around 8-9 k for this job. Those of you who do this type of job for $3,000, can call me in two years or so for a job mowing my lawn. If you guy's would just learn how to properly sell your work, then you would never need to struggle. Worse part is you get stubborn about it all, and start calling the smarter guys robbers, when in fact you are robbing your family. Go out and buy a copy of the book How Much Should I Charge. Then read it. Then read it again. After you do I bet your whole outlook on who is robbing who will change. I was one of you guys once upon a time. I too was a stubborn son of a gun. Then I met up with Mahlere. Thanks again Erik. :thumbup:


thanks macmike...$6400/400= $16/amp:whistling 

Go here to purchase the book and find out more information on running a successful small business.

good luck.


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## cjonesjr2007 (Jan 15, 2007)

mahlere said:


> i'm a professional too...i just refuse to work for peanuts...my costs dictate that I charge more than $1800...that's all.
> 
> heck we put in $500, our cost, on material alone...yes we uses QO with pvc and copper.
> 
> ...


Didn't mean to jaw you buddy we're all a team here as we help one another. Take care.


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

cjonesjr2007 said:


> Didn't mean to jaw you buddy we're all a team here as we help one another. Take care.


Then act like a team member, and quit acting like someone wanting to sword fight.


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## cjonesjr2007 (Jan 15, 2007)

mdshunk said:


> Then act like a team member, and quit acting like someone wanting to sword fight.


Didn't know you took it that way. Ooops


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## cjonesjr2007 (Jan 15, 2007)

mahlere said:


> and for the record, please don't confuse being cheap with being professional...thanks.


You have a point there but inexpensive is what I would call $1800 for a 200amp service change not cheap.


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

cjonesjr2007 said:


> You have a point there but inexpensive is what I would call $1800 for a 200amp service change not cheap.


Everyone has different real costs of operating your business. I can't even find yours in The Blue Book, so maybe your overhead is really, really low.


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## mahlere (Aug 6, 2006)

cjonesjr2007 said:


> No way! A 200amp service should not cost anymore than $1800 on a snowy and rainy day. I must be in the wrong state for business.


if you are content with $1800, fine. but please do not tell me that I shouldn't charge more.



cjonesjr said:


> NA I AM A PROFESSIONAL AND I JUST REFUSE TO BE A THIEF THAT'S ALL PRETTY MUCH.


then to call me a thief to boot



cjonesjr said:


> Didn't mean to jaw you buddy we're all a team here as we help one another. Take care.


i think you meant to jaw me (or anyone for that matter)

good luck


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## cjonesjr2007 (Jan 15, 2007)

mdshunk said:


> Everyone has different real costs of operating your business. I can't even find yours in The Blue Book, so maybe your overhead is really, really low.


Lets just find out what our overall customers in the us think we should charge then tell me if i am in the bluebook. http://www.homespecny.com/docs/homeimprov.html


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

cjonesjr2007 said:


> Lets just find out what our overall customers in the us think we should charge then tell me if i am in the bluebook. http://www.homespecny.com/docs/homeimprov.html


The Bluebook is a directory of contractors. It's one of the ways I personally use to seperate posers from legitimate contractors. Even after reading that document related to prices, I staill don't find you in The Bluebook. :jester: 

Nobody is twisting anyone's arm to pay a certain price for anything. They have other options. Everyone has different operating costs. I could charge $10,000 for 100 to 200 upgrades. I suspect that I will sell very few, but there would be nothing illegal about it. You're talking like a homeowner and not a real contractor.


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## cjonesjr2007 (Jan 15, 2007)

mdshunk said:


> The Bluebook is a directory of contractors. It's one of the ways I personally use to seperate posers from legitimate contractors. Even after reading that document related to prices, I staill don't find you in The Bluebook. :jester:
> 
> Nobody is twisting anyone's arm to pay a certain price for anything. They have other options. Everyone has different operating costs. I could charge $10,000 for 100 to 200 upgrades. I suspect that I will sell very few, but there would be nothing illegal about it. You're talking like a homeowner and not a real contractor.


I just believe everyone in the trade should be fair and you all can then see how easy it will be to become a millionaire. GOD sees everything.


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

cjonesjr2007 said:


> GOD sees everything.


You're right. I've done service upgrades in churches, to the glory of God. I charged money for them too !


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## mahlere (Aug 6, 2006)

cjonesjr2007 said:


> I just believe everyone in the trade should be fair and you all can then see how easy it will be to become a millionaire. GOD sees everything.


I agree with you. But to me being fair is paying my employees a good wage, healthcare, and a bunch of other benefits and perks. It's giving my family the very best that I can.

Try reading this book, it might help you

For the record, I'd go broke charging $1800 for a 200A service, not become a millionaire

But I think MD might be on to something, you appear to be either a homeowner, or a part time contractor who works fulltime for another contractor.

Could be wrong, you could also be brand new to the business with no experience.

but good luck with that


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## mahlere (Aug 6, 2006)

cjonesjr2007 said:


> Lets just find out what our overall customers in the us think we should charge then tell me if i am in the bluebook. http://www.homespecny.com/docs/homeimprov.html


does a private home inspector from NY have any idea what your actual costs of doing business are? why would you even consider letting him tell you what you need to charge to make money?

in addition, read his opening paragraph...the part about actual costs varying by as much as 300%


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## fridaymean (Feb 17, 2006)

mahlere said:


> does a private home inspector from NY have any idea what your actual costs of doing business are? why would you even consider letting him tell you what you need to charge to make money?
> 
> in addition, read his opening paragraph...the part about actual costs varying by as much as 300%



Wise words indeed! Why is there a *300%* variance? Sounds like that same 200A upgrade you would do for that lower range of $1300 someone else could get $6000 for. Why is that?


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## MSSI (Mar 25, 2006)

Our Jersey rate is higher than our PA rate $1800 min in PA,, $2400 min in NJ... I have seen prices as high as $3500(north jersey) in NJ for a basic 200A upgrade.
South jersey or pine barrens area you might have to charge on the lower end. You aint making a million dollars on that unless you are doing 6 a day...


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## MSSI (Mar 25, 2006)

Some reasoning on my previous post is That there is a heavier Union presence in North Jersey. So to keep our union brothers happy(for lack of a better description) We do not undercut their prices. They can really make for a bad day in NYC and N. Jersey...Often we have to pay prevailing wage or pull from the hall to do any major work up there..Ill bet you can find someone charging 6k for a service in NYC


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## Sparky Joe (Apr 29, 2006)

MSSI said:


> Some reasoning on my previous post is That there is a heavier Union presence in North Jersey. So to keep our union brothers happy(for lack of a better description) We do not undercut their prices. They can really make for a bad day in NYC and N. Jersey...Often we have to pay prevailing wage or pull from the hall to do any major work up there..Ill bet you can find someone charging 6k for a service in NYC


Wouldn't anyone consider it directly proportional to the home cost? I mean 200A on 200k home is going to be a lot less than 200A on 600k home.

I think my point is; charge what the market will bear, union or otherwise:thumbsup:


Oh and don't undercut some guy just because you think you can.


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## fridaymean (Feb 17, 2006)

Sparky Joe said:


> Wouldn't anyone consider it directly proportional to the home cost? I mean 200A on 200k home is going to be a lot less than 200A on 600k home.
> 
> I think my point is; charge what the market will bear, union or otherwise:thumbsup:
> 
> ...



Very true. On a 1+$MM house you can get more for your work. People in this market are willing to pay more for quality and how clean you keep the job. Character counts!


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