# Bonding wires within the panel...



## pzeiler (Apr 2, 2010)

In a potential job where I may be moving a washer/dryer from one end of the house to another, here's my situation..
I have 2-20A breakers serving the one car garage, with 4 duplex outlets total in the garage. One of the 20A breakers was dedicated to the washer/dryer outlet in this garage I want to pull the wires off of that 20A dedicated breaker (from the old washer dryer outlet) and "attach" them to the other breaker, so that I have all 4 outlets in the garage served by one 20A breaker. The now free 20A breaker I will re-route to the new location for the washer/dryer.

I have heard a home inspector in the past say that you can't just put multiple wires into one breaker. They need to be bonded with a single line into the one breaker. How does this happen? How do you "bond two wires and "splice" them down to one to go into the breaker? Short of using wire nuts in the panel...:no:

Thanks for your suggestions, and expertise....


----------



## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

It's perfectly acceptable to use wire nuts in a panel.


----------



## BrandConst (May 9, 2011)

Tinstaafl said:


> It's perfectly acceptable to use wire nuts in a panel.


Somewhere in that lenghty response is an answer to a question....


----------



## woodchuck2 (Feb 27, 2008)

I am sure 480 will be all over this with code references to verify tins answer and mine but Yes, wire nuts may be used in the panel and you can put two wires on a breaker. If you look at Square-D beakers you will even see the slots for two wires. There is no difference in the load on the breaker if you put two circuits on the breaker or if you left it as a one wire circuit on the breaker and ran a new circuit from one receptacle circuit to the other receptacle circuit splicing them together.


----------



## boman47k (Oct 13, 2006)

> The now free *20A breaker* I will re-route to the new location for the *washer/dryer*.


????? Washer *and* dryer on one 20 amp breaker??


----------



## holmesismyhero (Jun 6, 2011)

Aren't dryer receptacles 240 volt? Or is it a gas dryer?


----------



## boman47k (Oct 13, 2006)

My bad, I didn't even think of 110 and or gas dryers.


----------



## skyhook (Mar 17, 2007)

Tinstaafl said:


> It's perfectly acceptable to use wire nuts in a panel.


:huh:



woodchuck2 said:


> Yes, wire nuts may be used in the panel and you can put two wires on a breaker. If you look at Square-D beakers you will even see the slots for two wires. There is no difference in the load on the breaker if you put two circuits on the breaker or if you left it as a one wire circuit on the breaker and ran a new circuit from one receptacle circuit to the other receptacle circuit splicing them together.


:blink:



boman47k said:


> My bad, I didn't even think of 110 and or gas dryers.


120v


pzeiler said:


> In a potential job where I may be moving a washer/dryer from one end of the house to another, here's my situation..
> I have 2-20A breakers serving the one car garage, with 4 duplex outlets total in the garage. One of the 20A breakers was dedicated to the washer/dryer outlet in this garage I want to pull the wires off of that 20A dedicated breaker (from the old washer dryer outlet) and "attach" them to the other breaker, so that I have all 4 outlets in the garage served by one 20A breaker. The now free 20A breaker I will re-route to the new location for the washer/dryer.
> 
> I have heard a home inspector in the past say that you can't just put multiple wires into one breaker. They need to be bonded with a single line into the one breaker. How does this happen? How do you "bond two wires and "splice" them down to one to go into the breaker? Short of using wire nuts in the panel...:no:
> ...


Hire a licensed electrician. :thumbsup:


----------



## aptpupil (Jun 12, 2010)

i think what tin is getting at here is that the op should take the two circuits, add a pigtail, wire nut them all together and connect the pigtail to the breaker.
or, if you have breakers that are fine for two wires, then woodchuck's suggestion would work.


----------



## Seven-Delta-FortyOne (Mar 5, 2011)

aptpupil said:


> i think what tin is getting at here is that the op should take the two circuits, add a pigtail, wire nut them all together and connect the pigtail to the breaker.
> or, if you have breakers that are fine for two wires, then woodchuck's suggestion would work.


This is me clicking the "what he said" button. Wire nuts are used inside panels all the time.


----------



## Seven-Delta-FortyOne (Mar 5, 2011)

woodchuck2 said:


> I am sure 480 will be all over this with code references


I think he is burned out on answering questions like this.


----------



## pzeiler (Apr 2, 2010)

*Thanks!!*

Thanks to everyone. Good point about the Square D breakers....I had not even thought about them. I guess I didn't think wire nuts were acceptable within the panel either.....but signs here point to yes. Thanks for everyone's help! I get projects started like this in my head, and mull over the smallest stuff. I'm a small outfit and I don't always have someone close by to bounce questions off of, so thanks for everyone's help.


----------



## pzeiler (Apr 2, 2010)

boman47k said:


> ????? Washer *and* dryer on one 20 amp breaker??


Yeah, it's the most feasible option, without branching off of some existing circuit to test it.... where it may overload and cause for callback to re-do that end. You never know when the H.O. is going to be ironing as she's blow drying her hair in the kitchen, while the dishwasher, wash machine, dryer and microwave are all working at the same time. (the perfect storm) Easier to just re-run this existing dedicated circuit and make sure...the first time. I sleep better at night.


----------



## pzeiler (Apr 2, 2010)

holmesismyhero said:


> Aren't dryer receptacles 240 volt? Or is it a gas dryer?


Yep, Gas.


----------



## holmesismyhero (Jun 6, 2011)

pzeiler said:


> Yep, Gas.


That makes a huge difference, 20 amp for a gas dryer is more than fine, overkill, in fact. Just make sure that if you're moving wires in a panel, that they are proper for the breaker you are hooking them to. Too many homes have burnt down because someone moved a circuit from a 15 to a 20, and then put 20 amps of draw on 14/2 wire...

If you are running new to the new washer/dryer location, then you will use 12/2 hooked up to that 20, right? I love the 15/20 amp receptacles, nice to have in a garage for that occasional chance that you need a 20 amp socket, but need 15 amp sockets most of the time...


----------



## pzeiler (Apr 2, 2010)

holmesismyhero said:


> That makes a huge difference, 20 amp for a gas dryer is more than fine, overkill, in fact. Just make sure that if you're moving wires in a panel, that they are proper for the breaker you are hooking them to. Too many homes have burnt down because someone moved a circuit from a 15 to a 20, and then put 20 amps of draw on 14/2 wire...
> 
> If you are running new to the new washer/dryer location, then you will use 12/2 hooked up to that 20, right? I love the 15/20 amp receptacles, nice to have in a garage for that occasional chance that you need a 20 amp socket, but need 15 amp sockets most of the time...


Yep. 12/2. That one I did know. I know it's overkill, but rather than switching out the breaker, I can leave it, and therefore leave some room for future branching if necessary.


----------



## MarkyMark (Jun 7, 2009)

Wire nuts in a panel are perfectly legal. Two wires fed from one breaker may or may not be legal depending on the listing of the breaker.


----------



## Speedy Petey (Sep 30, 2003)

skyhook said:


> :huh:
> 
> :blink:


Were you confused by these accurate answers?


----------



## skyhook (Mar 17, 2007)

Speedy Petey said:


> Were you confused by these accurate answers?


couldn't find the confuzed emot . :laughing:


----------



## pzeiler (Apr 2, 2010)

Speedy Petey said:


> Were you confused by these accurate answers?


Hardly. All good. I was looking for suggestions, expertise, and knowledge, and thats what I received.


----------



## Redliz75 (Jun 23, 2011)

Hire an electrician, problem solved!!!


----------



## Speedy Petey (Sep 30, 2003)

pzeiler said:


> Hardly. All good. I was looking for suggestions, expertise, and knowledge, and thats what I received.


Glad to hear it. 

Just so you know, if you notice the quote in my reply, that post was not directed at you. :thumbsup:


----------



## bauler (Nov 10, 2006)

Why not just leave whats there alone and add a breaker. Sounds like you should hire a electrician. Stick to what your good at.


----------



## pzeiler (Apr 2, 2010)

bauler said:


> Why not just leave whats there alone and add a breaker. Sounds like you should hire a electrician. Stick to what your good at.


I'm good at a lot. Certain things I want to know more about and become better at...that's why I ask questions and come here to do so. No more room to add another breaker. I don't need an electrician to tell me that. 

No more issue though. First time H.O. almost puked when he saw the price for the job. He'll learn what things cost.....as we all did.

Thanks for everyone's input again...it's just what I wanted....advice.


----------

