# Drywall cracks



## GettingBy (Aug 19, 2010)

at framing intersections 
and a ceiling crack that is at right angles to the roof truss.

I do the mesh tape and pre-mixed spackle routine [I'm not so good with hot mud] and they open up again 
so I am now thinking of caulking the crack with paintable caulk, since caulk expands and contracts.

Any other ideas?


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## mako1 (Sep 1, 2013)

Redo it and don't used mesh tape is what I would do.What do you mean by framing intersection? Joints on the rock at studs?
Your doing something wrong but hard to tell without more info on how your installing and finshing it.How are bedding the tape?


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## GettingBy (Aug 19, 2010)

Redo it and don't used mesh tape is what I would do.
>OK, I'll use paper tape.

What do you mean by framing intersection? Joints on the rock at studs?
>There is a duct chase that meets a wall and very close to the end of the chase there is a vertical crack. It's probably over a vertical furring strip. It was done by pros years ago but now it's opening. 
The new crack is now at the tape edge so it looks like the tape + compound pulled loose from wall joint.

How are bedding the tape?
>1/8" or so of compound, by the book, then at least two layers cured and feathered out a few inches.

Any downside to caulking this crack? I doubt anyone's eye will be drawn to it.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Mesh isn't the problem. I wouldn't use it on corners but as long as the structure and drywall is stable mesh will do just fine.

Mesh is meant to be used with hot mud. I don't use anything but hot mud with mesh.

Whenever I have an issue like this I cut all tape out and then see if the dw moves. If it does, that has to be addressed.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

GettingBy said:


> at framing intersections
> and a ceiling crack that is at right angles to the roof truss.
> 
> I do the mesh tape and pre-mixed spackle routine [I'm not so good with hot mud] and they open up again
> ...


Sounds like another truss uplift situation. 

Anyway, you need to get yourself up to speed with hot mud pronto. If you're not that good with it, try mudding up the paper tape first, and then stick it onto the joint and bed it, etc. (I do this occasionally on the floor if I have a scrap piece of drywall laying around.)


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## mako1 (Sep 1, 2013)

From his OP it sounded like he had wall joints cracking too.That's why I asked what he meant by "framing intersections?'
When I bed paper tape I always go over the top of it with a thin layer of mud to get moisture on both sides of the tape.The way I was taught years ago and it's always worked well for me.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

There are some great arguments on paper vs. mesh at www.drywalltalk.com 
Enjoy. :jester:


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## icerock drywall (Aug 16, 2012)

paper or mesh or ff or add some drywall art...but dont calk it !!


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

rubber crown molding.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

GettingBy said:


> at framing intersections
> and a ceiling crack that is at right angles to the roof truss.
> 
> I do the mesh tape and pre-mixed spackle routine [I'm not so good with hot mud] and they open up again
> ...


Man ! Without seeing up close and personal ? Who knows ! [Truss walk?]


Call a Drywall Contractor to take a look at It . 

Not one of those hacks that drive a messy truck with all their tools thrown in the backseat ... Call a Pro! Just see what he says about the issue ..And go from there .


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

MarkJames said:


> There are some great arguments on paper vs. mesh at www.drywalltalk.com
> Enjoy. :jester:


I have nothing against mesh tape . The paper tape is very valuable to me ..So I always keep a roll of mesh In the truck just in case the porta john runs low. :thumbup:


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## mako1 (Sep 1, 2013)

I won't be able to poo for another week now:sad:


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## GettingBy (Aug 19, 2010)

So far, so good.

And to remove the existing patch, tap lightly with a hammer and chip it out with a putty knife?


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

GettingBy said:


> So far, so good.
> 
> And to remove the existing patch, tap lightly with a hammer and chip it out with a putty knife?


Cut the cracking out with a razor knife ..Peel as much of the mess out as possible .. Peel back all loose paper on the board !! Then take a picture and show It to me ! I'll tell you where to go from there. :thumbsup:

:laughing:


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## mako1 (Sep 1, 2013)

Just cut it out like bt said.Down and dirty.Time is money and your already fixing a job gone bad.Better start practicing with the hot mud.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

mako1 said:


> Just cut it out like bt said.Down and dirty.Time is money and your already fixing a job gone bad.Better start practicing with the hot mud.


There may be no need for a fast setting compound . 

This Is like a H/O calling me and asking can I fix It ? And ..How Much?

.....I don't care how well you explain the problem to me ! I need to SEE IT. 


I'm guessing the OP has a truss walk . 2' OC ? 16'' OC ? Stick? Factory? Did the tape coat freeze ? Was the home over heated ? [burning the house ?] Are the trusses properly braced ? 



I need to see the home ! To give a valid opinion .


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

What's mesh good for compared to paper? SPEED!

In drywall .. If you try to do too much at once .. It will fail!


JMO! But then .Drywall can go to chit after a few years depending on the circumstances .. No matter what tape you use ! It's can be a losing battle at times no matter how hard you fight It! :laughing:


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Like I said. I just fixed a ton of failed paper tape on this paint job this week.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Like I said. I just fixed a ton of failed paper tape on this paint job this week.


Yes ... Drywall Is like concrete . It can And will fail no matter how hard you try .. No matter what material you use Or how hard you try to make that material work . I see concrete and drywall much alike .. The conditions need to be near perfect For a perfect finish . Or at'least A decent finish. 



BTW Any tape will fail due to moisture . DRY. Drywall ....Dry. Drywall.. Dry! You dig what i'm sayin? :thumbsup:


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## mako1 (Sep 1, 2013)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Like I said. I just fixed a ton of failed paper tape on this paint job this week.


But do you know how it was applied originally?


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> What are your inside corners done with Rob?


I use straight flex.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

blacktop said:


> Just because one hasn't complained . Don't mean they have no complaints !
> 
> 
> Most times the just live with It .


We've run this circle before. 90% of my customers user me again and again. I also get 80-90% of my business on referrals. So I would know if there was failure.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

If your doing a whole home nothing beats paper tape with the gun, roller and glazer.
I don't care how fast you are with mesh. My dad and I could put on 12 - 500 foot rolls a day with the bazooka and me as his wipe down man, in average tract homes.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

TNTSERVICES said:


> I use straight flex.





TNTSERVICES said:


> We've run this circle before. 90% of my customers user me again and again. I also get 80-90% of my business on referrals. So I would know if there was failure.


What can I say? 


Ain't no wrong way to do It right!! 


But....Your killing me with that diy -flex


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## illbuildit.dd (Jan 7, 2015)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Was hot mud used on the mesh?


No. But it wasn't on the paper either. I once told a guy with an old shifting home "man if we tape these with mesh and paper together and coated it with concrete that crack will find a way to show up somewhere" after he asked me which is better.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

I wouldn't argue with blacktop about drywall, anymore then I would argue with Tom Brady about throwing a football. He's certainly tops in his profession. I don't say that lightly either.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Californiadecks said:


> I wouldn't argue with blacktop about drywall, anymore then I would argue with Tom Brady about throwing a football. He's certainly tops in his profession. I don't say that lightly either.


I totally respect him, that's why he got my vote for COTQ. And I'm not arguing with him, just giving my experience. Mesh has a place. I've always said I would tape a while house with it, but then again I wouldn't take a while house. I'm a remodeler and I use mesh. It's never failed me so why would I stop using it?


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

I'm going to be building this, hey blacktop could you get this done? My drywall guy will be a critical factor for this. I want it don't perfectly too.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Here it is


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

TNTSERVICES said:


> I totally respect him, that's why he got my vote for COTQ. And I'm not arguing with him, just giving my experience. Mesh has a place. I've always said I would tape a while house with it, but then again I wouldn't take a while house. I'm a remodeler and I use mesh. It's never failed me so why would I stop using it?


I give up on you Rob !


I'll just say this and leave It at that .

When you get to New York .. Take a good look around !
It was mostly built from Carnegie Steel ..Not Japanese junk metal !


You dig ? :laughing:


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

Californiadecks said:


> Here it is


I'm about to hit the sack ...But I'll have that done for you by sun rise ! :thumbsup: :laughing:


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

TNTSERVICES said:


> I totally respect him, that's why he got my vote for COTQ. And I'm not arguing with him, just giving my experience. *Mesh has a place.* I've always said I would tape a while house with it, but then again I wouldn't take a while house. I'm a remodeler and I use mesh. It's never failed me so why would I stop using it?


I'm glad they used mesh for my hernia repair rather than paper! :laughing:


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

blacktop said:


> I'm about to hit the sack ...But I'll have that done for you by sun rise ! :thumbsup: :laughing:


I'm serious about building that. My customers handed that to me and said I want this. I'm studying how to frame it now. Still waiting for the plans. I think it's similar to a groin vault.


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

Californiadecks said:


> I'm serious about building that. My customers handed that to me and said I want this. I'm studying how to frame it now. Still waiting for the plans. I think it's similar to a groin vault.


It's the arches within the arches that makes it a bit tricky. But bending 1/4" sheetrock is not so hard.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

m1911 said:


> It's the arches within the arches that makes it a bit tricky. But bending 1/4" sheetrock is not so hard.


Yep, I'm going to have to bend lumber for this one I think.


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## Xtrememtnbiker (Jun 9, 2013)

TNTSERVICES said:


> I use straight flex.


Isn't that a lot more expensive than paper? Why not paper...?

I've never gotten into the Mesh vs. Paper thing and don't really even look at most of those threads. Paper is the only way to do it. :whistling Totally kidding.

I've seen both fail. But I'm sure the mesh was people not knowing you had to use hot mud with it. I didn't know you had to use hot mud with it so I saw it fail from a friend doing it and assumed it was a crappy product. I know better now but still use paper. I want to get FibaFuse though since most of our drywall finishing is patch type stuff which is lots of butt joints.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

m1911 said:


> I'm glad they used mesh for my hernia repair rather than paper! :laughing:


Are you sure they used mesh on the while Hernia ?


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

Californiadecks said:


> Yep, I'm going to have to bend lumber for this one I think.


You frame it like a simple arch, with 2x4 diagonals and plywood cut to shape of arch.

1/4" sheetrock and hot mud takes care of the rest...


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

m1911 said:


> You frame it like a simple arch, with 2x4 diagonals and plywood cut to shape of arch.
> 
> 1/4" sheetrock and hot mud takes care of the rest...


Why diagonals, I'm not following. 2x4's on edge following the plywood arch lines. Start with a typical main arch, correct?


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> Isn't that a lot more expensive than paper? Why not paper...?
> 
> I've never gotten into the Mesh vs. Paper thing and don't really even look at most of those threads. Paper is the only way to do it. :whistling Totally kidding.
> 
> I've seen both fail. But I'm sure the mesh was people not knowing you had to use hot mud with it. I didn't know you had to use hot mud with it so I saw it fail from a friend doing it and assumed it was a crappy product. I know better now but still use paper. I want to get FibaFuse though since most of our drywall finishing is patch type stuff which is lots of butt joints.


It's a perfect corner every time. If I was doing production I would use paper, but with small additions and remodels I'll stick with mesh and straight flex.


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

Californiadecks said:


> Why diagonals, I'm not following. 2x4's on edge following the plywood arch lines. Start with a typical main arch, correct?


I'm picturing one thing in my head and saying something else. I was talking of a simple arch where you would nail 2x4's diagonally in the corners. Yeah, you use combination of plywood with 2x4's on edge. I've seen it framed many ways. It always looks more confusing that it really is.


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## Tom M (Jan 3, 2007)

Why not use oversized diagonal framing and then jigsaw/router a plywood pattern.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

I was also thinking using large sonotubes cut in half on the sides to get my shape. I don't want to over complicate it. But it looks like fun.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Tom M said:


> Why not use oversized diagonal framing and then jigsaw/router a plywood pattern.


Another thought. :thumbsup:


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

The sides look like true radiuses.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

I think I'll start a thread on it.


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

Looking at the picture again, you would frame 4 boxes in the corners above the corbels, then 2 arches in the front and back and 2 on either side, and connect the dots.


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## Big Shoe (Jun 16, 2008)

Groins are elliptical arches connected in the center with intersecting framing members. 

Plywood and metal studs...............Sonotube..........Not.....:no:


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Big Shoe said:


> Groins are elliptical arches connected in the center with intersecting framing members.
> 
> Plywood and metal studs...............Sonotube..........Not.....:no:


I'm going to frame it like this. This is a Loneframer job.


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## KennMacMoragh (Sep 16, 2008)

I had this problem come up in an old house, bad cracks going across the ceiling joists. Surest solution is to add backing where ever you have a crack, meaning blocking between every joist. I'd use hot mud and paper tape, screw the crap out of it to your backing, crack should never come back.


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## Big Shoe (Jun 16, 2008)

Californiadecks said:


> I'm going to frame it like this. This is a Loneframer job.


:thumbsup::thumbsup: Wish I had a smart phone to take pics back in the day.

That is a barrel into a vault..........Same concept to framing a groin.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

Big Shoe said:


> :thumbsup::thumbsup: Wish I had a smart phone to take pics back in the day.
> 
> That is a barrel into a vault..........Same concept to framing a groin.


My groin hurts just looking at That pic. !!!


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