# struggling to find a part time laborer/helper



## huggytree (Nov 3, 2013)

ive been trying to hire a new part time plumbers helper now for 6 weeks

i post the ad on craigs list 1-2x a week to keep it at the top of the list

80%+ of the resume's are horrible...most have no previous construction experience....many work for pizza hut or jiffy lube......some are 65+ year old men or young women....i dont see a 65 year old man digging sewers for 8 hours a day or a woman carrying a water heater up the 
stairs.

most who interviewed had drunk drivings 

the few that are decent dont work out...either the applicant doesnt return the phone call for a interview or they schedule the interview and dont show up....i had a guy hired 2 weeks ago....he stopped returning calls and then didnt show up for his 1st day of work

i am offering $15 an hour and i am considering offering $20 a hour just to get someone.....im not set on previous plumbing experience, but i need someone who can use power tools...

im getting frustrated....my back is mediocre right now...

i had to change my ad from laborer to plumbers helper just to get some resume's......i also shortened the description in case i was scaring people off by listing the duties

any advice on where to find a worker or if $15 an hour isnt enough?


any advice on how to run a ad to get more quality people?


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## NYgutterguy (Mar 3, 2014)

Huggy didnt you have a 6'5 275 pound guy that showed up in a suit for his interview or am i confusing you with someone else?


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## huggytree (Nov 3, 2013)

NYGUTTERGUY said:


> Huggy didnt you have a 6'5 275 pound guy that showed up in a suit for his interview or am i confusing you with someone else?


yep.....wouldnt give me a start date....then stopped returning calls....after 2 weeks he didnt show up

he wasnt perfect, but seemed like a go getter, so i gave him a chance

im frustrated at this point.....if i need to pay more to get a quality applicant then its what i have to do...if i f-up my back and lose customers im out thousands to 100's of thousands, so an extra $5 an hour doesnt seem so bad when your desperate(like me)

when i put too much detail in my ad. i dont get many resume's....when i get rid of most of the details i get resume's, but none are qualified....


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

Around here, you would get some decent applicants for $15. Have you tried looking for a temp agency in your area? You can end up with a long term hire from an agency, just be really clear on their direct hire policy. Most of the time the agency doesn't really add that much to the cost.

I wouldn't have a "no woman" mentality. I've worked with several women who worked harder and with less BS than any of they co-workers. Anything more than 80-100lbs should have 2 people on it anyway.


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## dielectricunion (Feb 27, 2013)

I wish you were in my area! Once things slow down with the "fixer upper" I'm dedicating most of my time to, I'll need to get a steady job ASAP. I'm leaning toward electrical apprenticeship as a long term plan, but plumbing is something that I'm definitely into. Good luck, you'll run into the right person in time


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## Warren (Feb 19, 2005)

Paying more doesn't necessarily get you more. I have been using craigslist for a few years now. It is really hit and miss. I have one guy who has been with me for 6 years that came from there. About 80% of the guys last 2 weeks or less. 

 I agree with keeping the ad vague. The right guys can read between the lines. Mention that you are looking for an employee and not a sub. Also list any other bennys.


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## Metro M & L (Jun 3, 2009)

Put 'work from home' in the ad. Charge them 20$ for the hiring packet only for them to discover you didn't mean their home. Money made I tell you. Put 420 friendly in the ad and earn another grand a month.


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## NYgutterguy (Mar 3, 2014)

huggytree said:


> yep.....wouldnt give me a start date....then stopped returning calls....after 2 weeks he didnt show up
> 
> he wasnt perfect, but seemed like a go getter, so i gave him a chance
> 
> ...


That sucks..The suit thing for a plumbers helper seemed a tad strange. My area all the laborers/helpers for any type of construction business are the non english speaking type.(feeling politically correct tonight) Hard working Americans looking to do that kind of work is non existent here. Theyre usually someone elses ex-employee or some other type of drama going on (drugs, drunk, etc.).


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## Frank Castle (Dec 27, 2011)

Huggy,
Where in Wisconsin are you located, and what is your working radius?
Thanks.


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

I always put "mandatory drug test" in the ad. I run them through a temp staffing agency at first anyway so there actually is a drug and background test. So far, all my applicants have had really high scores....:blink: I think that's good....


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## totes (Oct 17, 2013)

How qualified do they have to be? Part time is tricky. Unless they are a student, it's tough to get someone with trade knowledge who won't want a full time job. 

Why is a DUI on the record a deal breaker?


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

totes said:


> How qualified do they have to be? Part time is tricky. Unless they are a student, it's tough to get someone with trade knowledge who won't want a full time job.
> 
> Why is a DUI on the record a deal breaker?


They usually have a drivers license issue, because they can't get insurance


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## KennMacMoragh (Sep 16, 2008)

Maybe you're having a hard time because you're advertising previous experience and laborer at the same time. If its just a laborer then they shouldn't really need experience. How long does it take to train someone to drill a hole through a stud? Or to make a cut with a sawzall? I never advertise the word laborer, it implies you're never giving them a chance to work their way up. So you'll probably get a lot of trash applicants. Try "plumbers helper, $15 to $18 an hour DOE, will train."


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## WBailey1041 (Jan 31, 2014)

Temp service. Spent 6 months sorting through trash applicants. Went to tradesmen international temp service and hit pay dirt on the 3rd guy. Best part is if the guy sucks in the first 4 hours they don't bill me if I send him back. Also, they cover everything except general liability and auto ins. I'm billed 18.50 each hour he works and they pay him 11. He got sick for a few days so I called my rep and he had another guy there in 2 hours! 

Best damn thing I ever did for my sanity.


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## gastek (Mar 29, 2011)

Too bad you weren't in my area. I could use a little work right now. A very very slow summer here in the pool biz.

Like WBailey1041 said, look else where for the help. Craigslist isn't the best place to find skilled or clean helpers. You don't have any family or friends that knows someone who is clean and looking for work? What about a local church? They might have someone looking for work.


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## Stephen H (Feb 18, 2011)

huggy,
you are approaching this waaaaaaaay the wrong way.
the job you describe is extremely un-desireable.
part time laborer?
dig ditches in the rain for 8 hours one day---and no work the next day ?

who would you EXPECT wants a job like that ?

what you need to do---- hire a FULL TIME "apprentice"-say 30-50 hours a week. emphasize what he is going to learn and what the pay bumps will be-also mention ditch digging, but stress the career path and the pay bumps with increasing skill and responsibility

and YOU need to stretch yourself a bit beyond you r comfort level and sell and maintain work flow to make it economically feasible

the way you are describing your current set up---- you are expecting a laborer to come in and solve your problem----- but you aren't solving any kind of problem for him. who wants a part time job digging ditches???? what kind of a future is THAT ?

it's been several years---- but when we put ads on craigslist--- they are long ,detailed ads.
we stress the pay rate, EXACTLY the work we do, what the candidate will learn, the pay bumps at the appropriate intervals, the tools REQUIRED at hire, and the tools required at the next pay bumps.

In short make it clear to potential candidates that this is a real job, and a REAL career that they have to EARN a place in your employment......
stephen


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## Fingersmasher (May 28, 2013)

Have you tried putting an ad in a local trade school?


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

Have you tried asking the local fire house? Here, the guy's work a nice "4-on, 4-off" schedule. Most are always looking for a side gig


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## TxElectrician (May 21, 2008)

I agree with Stephen. A part time laborer job does not sound too appealing especially if it isn't a regular schedule.


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## huggytree (Nov 3, 2013)

Frank Castle said:


> Huggy,
> Where in Wisconsin are you located, and what is your working radius?
> Thanks.


im in waukesha, wi

i work within 50 miles typically

whitefish bay and wauwatosa are my 2 hot spots to work


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

QCCI said:


> You do sound pretty greedy, I know nothing about you, just saying the way it reads.
> 
> I have several employees and I can tell you I have bid jobs lower than normal on occasion. Not too often but from time to time if we're slowing down and need to keep guys working or trying to get my foot in the door with a new customer who has potential for substantially more future work. Some jobs are a home run and sometimes you just get on base, hell sometimes you strike out. But I like to make sure my men always have work, even if I take it in the shorts a little. Also good to keep equipment running. I never intentionally bid work at a loss though.


Good man. Thats how to run a business to be sustainable over the long haul. Getting good, quality people and taking care of them. 

I call it buying a job. Lol. Never bid to take an actual loss either.


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

pizalm said:


> 80 hours at $12 is $960, 48 hours at $20 is the same. Just find someone at 12 and pay him for 80 hrs every 2 weeks and your problem is solved. I'm not understanding how this is hard to figure out. How skilled do you have to be to dig and carry?


But you need to add comp and insurance . So that wage just doubled.


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## Roofcheck (Dec 27, 2011)

BamBamm5144 said:


> My oldest employee is 63, he will be 64 early next year. Out hustles a lot of the young guys I bring in.


Solid work ethic. Dying breed.... except for maybe Nick.


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

Roofcheck said:


> Solid work ethic. Dying breed.... except for maybe Nick.


It is a dying bread. Which makes it such a wonderful thing for those of us who are young and willing to work our butts off. I don't know anyone else my age (26) doing this. Just have to keep at it and watch my competition retire...


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Gary H said:


> But you need to add comp and insurance . So that wage just doubled.


comp, insurance, and taxes does not equal the hourly pay. Lets be real.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

huggytree said:


> Sam Walton made millions....yet he only pays his employees $8 an hour...how fíng cheap was he???? he should have paid them $100 an hour
> 
> what i make has nothing to do with what i pay......$20 an hour to dig a ditch is insane to me.....yet i will most likely end up paying it


The Sam Walton model is not the best model, on a social basis. If every buisness was run that way, we are in a whole mess of trouble. Your business would be in big trouble, seeing as they are a bottom-line company, and your numbers are not exactly bottom-line friendly.


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## pcplumber (Oct 12, 2008)

Don't look for a plumber's helper. Look for a young person who has no experience, but someone who is bright and capable of learning quickly. 

I still have employees who have been with my company 20 to 40 years and these employees started with me between the ages of 13 and 18. I've had some employees that with just a few weeks of training could perform better than seasoned veterans. After a few weeks of training they may not have the knowledge of a veteran, but they can perform the services that you need. The reason the inexperienced employees are better is because they have more respect for me because they don't have another boss to compare me and because I become a father figure because I was the person in their life who lead them down a good path.


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## pcplumber (Oct 12, 2008)

flashheatingand said:


> The Sam Walton model is not the best model, on a social basis. If every buisness was run that way, we are in a whole mess of trouble. Your business would be in big trouble, seeing as they are a bottom-line company, and your numbers are not exactly bottom-line friendly.


$20 an hours is about the minimum that should be paid. My theory is that to live a decent life and to rent a decent apartment a person needs to earn about $1500 per week. With that he will take home about $1200. A decent apartment runs about $1800 (in California) and to qualify a person needs to earn 3 times the monthly rent.

$20 per hour is only $800 per week. After taxes the employee takes home about $700. Then, he has to pay for his groceries, rent, vehicle, insurance, etc. I think $40,000 per year is below the poverty level. For my underground utility business we just increased our lowest paid grunts (our flag men) to $31 per hour. That is still only $1240 per week and a very low paycheck for a family man.

Unless you are lucky, you get to choose from the bottom of the barrel for less than $20. It is time to get with the times! The way people think about money is strange. A few weeks ago, I offered a girl who never worked one day in her life $11 an hour to do some light office work. I felt very insulted, but I do know many office girls who are earning up to $40 per hour ($1600 per week).


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Something is amiss when the dollar value varies so much between states. Here, $20/ hr. is typical for journey man wages. Most jobs are about $15.


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## JR Shepstone (Jul 14, 2011)

pcplumber said:


> $20 an hours is about the minimum that should be paid. My theory is that to live a decent life and to rent a decent apartment a person needs to earn about $1500 per week. With that he will take home about $1200. A decent apartment runs about $1800 (in California) and to qualify a person needs to earn 3 times the monthly rent. $20 per hour is only $800 per week. After taxes the employee takes home about $700. Then, he has to pay for his groceries, rent, vehicle, insurance, etc. I think $40,000 per year is below the poverty level. For my underground utility business we just increased our lowest paid grunts (our flag men) to $31 per hour. That is still only $1240 per week and a very low paycheck for a family man. Unless you are lucky, you get to choose from the bottom of the barrel for less than $20. It is time to get with the times! The way people think about money is strange. A few weeks ago, I offered a girl who never worked one day in her life $11 an hour to do some light office work. I felt very insulted, but I do know many office girls who are earning up to $40 per hour ($1600 per week).


Where do you live and why are the taxes so low, because I want to go there!


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## JR Shepstone (Jul 14, 2011)

On a serious note huggy, do you have any teenaged family members? (Cousins, nephews, the neighbors kid, etc.) Someone in high school or the like that could help you out in the afternoons?


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

Spencer said:


> It is a dying bread. Which makes it such a wonderful thing for those of us who are young and willing to work our butts off. I don't know anyone else my age (26) doing this. Just have to keep at it and watch my competition retire...


It's not, there were always and will always have those who are worthless pieces of ****, and those who work hard.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Inner10 said:


> It's not, there were always and will always have those who are worthless pieces of ****, and those who work hard.


I don't know, it may be just me but in the 35 years I've been in the workforce there seems to be more and more lazy pussy men than back then.


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

Labor problems boil down to two things:

Piss poor management style....

Low wages....


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## Stephen H (Feb 18, 2011)

pcplumber said:


> $20 an hours is about the minimum that should be paid. My theory is that to live a decent life and to rent a decent apartment a person needs to earn about $1500 per week. With that he will take home about $1200. A decent apartment runs about $1800 (in California) and to qualify a person needs to earn 3 times the monthly rent.
> 
> $20 per hour is only $800 per week. After taxes the employee takes home about $700. Then, he has to pay for his groceries, rent, vehicle, insurance, etc. I think $40,000 per year is below the poverty level. For my underground utility business we just increased our lowest paid grunts (our flag men) to $31 per hour. That is still only $1240 per week and a very low paycheck for a family man.
> 
> Unless you are lucky, you get to choose from the bottom of the barrel for less than $20. It is time to get with the times! The way people think about money is strange. A few weeks ago, I offered a girl who never worked one day in her life $11 an hour to do some light office work. I felt very insulted, but I do know many office girls who are earning up to $40 per hour ($1600 per week).


 PC, while I agree with your main points----- your specific numbers are way off for most of the country.

also----- in my opinion we are not talking about a "family man" as this potential employee.
Aren't we talking about an entry level 18-21 year old kid------ who is one day going to grow and EARN his way into being a family man?

so---a much lower wage is feasible---and most of those guys have room mates to share expenses etc. THEN they have the chance to earn their way up into the middle class.

I can tell you where I live my oldest son just BOUGHT a 2700 sq. ft. house and his monthly payment on that is less than half the apartment rent you mentioned............
youngest son rents a apartment which is very nice for his stage of life----and it's about 1/4 the rent you mentioned( including utilities) . He is getting married in Oct. and he and my future daughter in law are putting away HUGE amounts of money by living comfortably well below their means.
Stephen


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## tedanderson (May 19, 2010)

JR Shepstone said:


> Where do you live and why are the taxes so low, because I want to go there!


They say that Idaho is one of the cheapest places to live in the US. 



huggytree said:


> need someone i can trust not to mess up a customers house
> need someone who can demo with out cutting live wires/water pipes
> need someone who shows up on time


And most of all.. someone who will not embarass you or the company. 

I hired an older guy who does very good work but he had too much drama in his life. (ex wife issues, current wife issues, inlaw issues, etc.) None of this ever stopped him from coming to work or being on time but he would always use the workday to vent his frustrations. I didn't think anything of it until I left him alone with one of my clients. I went to go handle another job and after a few hours my phone just seemed to be a little too "quiet". 

I called the HO to see how things were going. She said that she asked the guy to leave because he started telling his life story and broke down into tears a couple of times in the process and that she didn't feel comfortable with the guy being in her house any more. :blink:


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

Inner10 said:


> It's not, there were always and will always have those who are worthless pieces of ****, and those who work hard.



There will. But the ratio is getting more lopsided everyday. IMO a lot of it has to do with the indoctrination kids get in public school. It's looked down upon to choose a career in the trades. Kids are being told that they have to go to college in order to make any money. Not only that but they are presented with the illusion that the right college degree will automatically land them a job as a professional butt sitter and they can have all the money they need and only work forty hour weeks. I'm not saying this is across the board but that is what I got out of public school for myself.


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

griz said:


> Labor problems boil down to two things:
> 
> Piss poor management style....
> 
> Low wages....


Word!:thumbsup:


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

griz said:


> Labor problems boil down to two things:
> 
> Piss poor management style....
> 
> Low wages....


I always thought wages were part of a management style...

If you're going to be an ass, you have to pay people more to have them stick around, and some people just won't put up with it.


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## QCCI (Jan 28, 2013)

Spencer said:


> There will. But the ratio is getting more lopsided everyday. IMO a lot of it has to do with the indoctrination kids get in public school. It's looked down upon to choose a career in the trades. Kids are being told that they have to go to college in order to make any money. Not only that but they are presented with the illusion that the right college degree will automatically land them a job as a professional butt sitter and they can have all the money they need and only work forty hour weeks. I'm not saying this is across the board but that is what I got out of public school for myself.


You're absolutely right. College is not for everyone and the school system needs to realize this. Trade school is not a bad option for those mechanically inclined. College is also a good option, just not for everyone across the board. My daughter just left for college yesterday.


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

QCCI said:


> You're absolutely right. College is not for everyone and the school system needs to realize this. Trade school is not a bad option for those mechanically inclined. College is also a good option, just not for everyone across the board. My daughter just left for college yesterday.


I would argue that the most valuable part of my k-12 school experience was my last two years of high school. We had a "Building Trades" program where we would almost half of the school day building a house each year. I did that Jr year and the first half of my Senior year. I graduated at midterm to get busy workin. 

I wish I would have taken "Ag Mechanics" my sophomore year. They taught you how to weld and work on small engines in that class. Now they are cutting those trades classes. Ticks me off. But the truth is they are having a hard time finding students interested in "Building Trades."


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Good, I don't want anyone young jointing the trades. More for me in the future.


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

BamBamm5144 said:


> Good, I don't want anyone young jointing the trades. More for me in the future.


Not if you cant find any employees that can read a tape... :whistling

The last job I worked at I had to show an 18 year old how to use a socket wrench. He also had no clue what an impact was or how to use it. No clue how to even begin to read a tape. Sad...I can't even begin to fathom being that clueless. He could text faster than lightning though...thats gotta count for something. :laughing:


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## jstanton (Mar 25, 2012)

I feel that helping others find a career is part of owning your own shop, just as someone did for me. What about using him for more than a "grunt". Get him doing some of the office work, organization and getting systems in place. 

Also, do you not work for homeowners? My plumber makes his best wages that way. GC's are good for consistent work, but like you said most are cheap. Market toward's that and get him working on call to fill some of that time.

I look back at working solo and cringe. Having help makes life so much easier, and you have someone to talk to.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Spencer said:


> Not if you cant find any employees that can read a tape... :whistling
> 
> 
> 
> The last job I worked at I had to show an 18 year old how to use a socket wrench. He also had no clue what an impact was or how to use it. No clue how to even begin to read a tape. Sad...I can't even begin to fathom being that clueless. He could text faster than lightning though...thats gotta count for something. :laughing:



Well I did have to show a guy with "years" of experience what the mitre saw was after I asked him to get it and he pulled out the table saw.


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

Huggy knows exactly what he's looking for. Tall order, but it's his bidness :thumbup: I'm sure he'll find someone.

Bamm - Food for thought as I've been chewing on this. Finding good employees is equal to marketing your business. Time effort consistency and in today's reality creative/innovative solutions may very well be the best solution.


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## straightedgellc (Jul 12, 2014)

Try a different source that CL. I use CL too, but i also use indeed.com. It's a little more pricey but it is reasonable and they have to fill out a resume section. Hope this is helpful.


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## tedanderson (May 19, 2010)

Unfortunately the millennial generation was taught that the internet is all we will ever need in the future. I'm surprised that nobody ever asked how anything will get built, repaired, expanded or modified. 

I'm guessing that you could probably find good help in the least likely of places... like Walmart. I'm willing to believe that there are a few folks in there who've been on the job for the better part of 3-5 years and have enough tenure to take days off as needed to go work elsewhere. When I worked in big-box retail 20+ years ago, the manager said that as long as I'd be willing to do any two days from Friday through Sunday and I can find a way to get at least 25 hours on the clock, he can work with me.

And that's how I got into the construction trade.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

tedanderson said:


> Unfortunately the millennial generation was taught that the internet is all we will ever need in the future. I'm surprised that nobody ever asked how anything will get built, repaired, expanded or modified.
> 
> I'm guessing that you could probably find good help in the least likely of places... like Walmart. I'm willing to believe that there are a few folks in there who've been on the job for the better part of 3-5 years and have enough tenure to take days off as needed to go work elsewhere. When I worked in big-box retail 20+ years ago, the manager said that as long as I'd be willing to do any two days from Friday through Sunday and I can find a way to get at least 25 hours on the clock, he can work with me.
> 
> And that's how I got into the construction trade.


You had a boss (at the big box) that understood people need the door left open to better themselves. Business is about people more then it's about revenue. :thumbsup:


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

tedanderson said:


> Unfortunately the millennial generation was taught that the internet is all we will ever need in the future.



Thatss One aspect. Another is they've never been exposed to the trades.

Told that a good days hard work in the trades is nothing compared to having a degree. 

A certain amount of "pussyfication" has also been introduced to the young males or not been worked out of them yet. :whistling Ooooh I'll get a blister or sliver, do you have a pair of gloves so I can pick up this 2x4'-7'

They are expecting an easier life than reality dictates. Really don't even know what a hard life is or true pain of failure. The world has been too nice to them, they've been protected and saved form facing real consequences of "THIER" actions... Typically what motivates people to change or be successful. 



 They'll get hungry sooner or later, or tired of flippin' burgers when they meet of few tradesman thier age who make 2x what they do as an average skilled wage or much better


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

A little pain never hurt anybody.


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## huggytree (Nov 3, 2013)

Ill post this again because it seems like a few havent noticed yet....I DO HAVE AN EMPLOYEE NOW....He Starts tomorrow!

he owns his own carpentry business/handy man service....So he's working 1/2 time for himself and 1/2 time for me....a perfect situation...just like i was looking for

he was a plumbers apprentice for 3 years and dropped out (why is sketchy still)

no drunk drivings!.....what a shock

i am giving him $17 to start and in 30 days a review and bump him up to $20 if he's good


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## huggytree (Nov 3, 2013)

jstanton said:


> I feel that helping others find a career is part of owning your own shop, just as someone did for me. What about using him for more than a "grunt". Get him doing some of the office work, organization and getting systems in place.
> 
> Also, do you not work for homeowners? My plumber makes his best wages that way. GC's are good for consistent work, but like you said most are cheap. Market toward's that and get him working on call to fill some of that time.
> 
> I look back at working solo and cringe. Having help makes life so much easier, and you have someone to talk to.



i charge the same rate to homeowners as remodelers.....new homes is a lower rate though.....i make very little from homeowners...most projects are 1-2 hours.....with drive time its hard to make anything...i consider homeowner projects as filler work

i make most of my $$ on remodelers.....i bid for what an average plumber would take to complete the project and then pound the work out....this is how i make my high income....if i get the job done 10 hours early thats $1,000 in my pocket.......my prices are high but competitive to some degree.........i give perfect service.....this is how i keep the builders paying my high wages and not looking for cheap....i find the guys who are sick of playing around with schedules....when they have an emergency im there in 1 hour.....

i find homeowners to be as cheap as builders....its the cheap homeowner that drives the cheap builder market

i rarely win large homeowner projects....i make most of my $$ on large remodels w/ builders.....the larger the more potential of getting the job done earlier and making even more $$........when a homeowner runs his own large project its typically to save $$....he hires the cheapest plumber he can find.......

ive spent lots of time on my new website to increase calls....other than that i dont know how to reach them....my homeowner sales are up 50% this year...all from my website....i get 1-2 jobs a week from my website and probably 5 small 1 hour jobs from homeowner referrals....maybe 25% of my total work is from homeowners......if i can find more builder work id drop the homeowner jobs......but my long term thought is to hire a journeyman to handle the homeowner/service work......its all part of my long term idea.....it may take 10 years to build enough though


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

huggytree said:


> ....I DO HAVE AN EMPLOYEE NOW....He Starts tomorrow!
> 
> he owns his own carpentry business/handy man service....So he's working 1/2 time for himself and 1/2 time for me....a perfect situation...just like i was looking for
> 
> ...


Happy for you. 

Not gonna play Devils advocate, tho this situation makes me tighten up. You talked with him and got a feel for what he's about - Trust your feelings and make it work.

Updates if your willing!


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## huggytree (Nov 3, 2013)

he did a decent job for his first day....i dont really care so much for his personality though...im sure we will both adjust to each other..

he was decent today.....saved me a couple of hours, so i made some $$ off of him....give him a month to adjust before i fully judge him....

i DID think about how much i missed the last guy...his personality was much better and we had more in common....

I did have to shush him once for talking too much and saying too much to a homeowner....he really likes to talk & BS..

every worker has his own + and -.....this guy is better in a few ways than the old guy and worse in others...he lives 45 mins away and most jobs are another 45 mins further......my gut says he will leave me over the 3 hours of driving (unpaid) he does every day......0 chance id do it if i were him


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## tedanderson (May 19, 2010)

huggytree said:


> Ill post this again because it seems like a few havent noticed yet....I DO HAVE AN EMPLOYEE NOW....He Starts tomorrow!


So...... did you try running an ad in one of those free newspapers that they give away at the supermarket? I bet you can find good help there too.


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

huggytree said:


> he did a decent job for his first day....i dont really care so much for his personality though...im sure we will both adjust to each other..
> 
> he was decent today.....saved me a couple of hours, so i made some $$ off of him....give him a month to adjust before i fully judge him....
> 
> ...


Congrats on the hire!

I gotta give my opinion on this one though. Why would a self employed carpenter be working for you for $17/hr. Is he just starting out in business for himself? Is he really just looking to learn plumbing off you and move on? Something isn't adding up. It is not easy to cover the overhead costs of a one man show carpentry business when you only work for yourself part time, and the rest of the time you make $17/hr. What are your thoughts on this? I'm coming from personal experience here. Surely he could do a lot better working for himself????


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

True. Eventually, there will be a situation that he has to decide to do his own work, or continue to work for you + the drive. Nobody ever said that finding the right person is easy.


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## huggytree (Nov 3, 2013)

he lives in a poor area in middle of no where.......i think he is more of a handyman type than a carpenter.....he has lots of BS stories, so its hard to tell what he is.....he's one of those guys who has 10 stories about any subject

he is a good worker when i give him a project....but when he is just standing around for 10 minutes he likes to sit and give advice and talk to the customer about his BS...i will have to get on him about it...........i do not want to car pool with him anymore though..i need some time away from him between jobs........not sure if this one will work out at this point......if i judge him by his work he's decent......but i dont really care for his personality and he will have to learn to shut up around customers or ill have to get rid of him.......ill give him 30 days w/ a few warnings and decide then

i am also considering looking for a full time $12 helper.....some kid out of high school.........im still missing my last employee......i should have offered him $25 an hour to stay....he will be hard to replace...we got along great and he never needed any warnings...he was great from day 1


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

huggytree said:


> he lives in a poor area in middle of no where.......i think he is more of a handyman type than a carpenter.....he has lots of BS stories, so its hard to tell what he is.....he's one of those guys who has 10 stories about any subject
> 
> he is a good worker when i give him a project....but when he is just standing around for 10 minutes he likes to sit and give advice and talk to the customer about his BS...i will have to get on him about it...........i do not want to car pool with him anymore though..i need some time away from him between jobs........not sure if this one will work out at this point......if i judge him by his work he's decent......but i dont really care for his personality and he will have to learn to shut up around customers or ill have to get rid of him.......ill give him 30 days w/ a few warnings and decide then
> 
> i am also considering looking for a full time $12 helper.....some kid out of high school.........im still missing my last employee......*i should have offered him $25 an hour to stay....he will be hard to replace...we got along great and he never needed any warnings...he was great from day 1*


Yep. That always seems to happen. Employers don't typically recognize what they've got until its gone. I shouldn't but I thoroughly enjoy the fact that my last place of employment turned into a poop hole after I left. Then its icing on the cake when they have to hire and fire someone every couple months for who knows how long until they find someone who is half as capable. Hope you learn the lesson this time around. Find a good guy and pay him a friggin decent wage!


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## huggytree (Nov 3, 2013)

had a really good interview today...the guy is perfect....this time i took 30+ minutes to sit and BS with him....we went at each other back and forth about expectations we both had...he just wants Mondays off to work on his farm.....plenty of experience with plumbing and labor

ill offer him $16 and let him know we will sit down after 30 days and review his wage



i also looked into hiring a temp...wow its dirt cheap...i have a horrible job coming up next week...i will hire a temp laborer for the day and see how it works out....the temp laborer is $17-20 an hour......its almost better for me to just hire the temp as my permanent part time employee for that $$


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

huggytree said:


> had a really good interview today...the guy is perfect....this time i took 30+ minutes to sit and BS with him....we went at each other back and forth about expectations we both had...he just wants Mondays off to work on his farm.....plenty of experience with plumbing and labor
> 
> ill offer him $16 and let him know we will sit down after 30 days and review his wage
> 
> ...


I use temps so much I know the regulars. I also pay a 20 dollar tip. The manager of the temp agency makes sure I get the best they offer.

That 20 dollars changes attitudes. Attitude is most of it.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

They work side by side with my guys and have no real choice but to keep up.


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## TxElectrician (May 21, 2008)

I know you will run your business and hire you're help as you see fit, but I think in time you will look back and kick yourself for not just biting the bullet and getting a real employee.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

TxElectrician said:


> I know you will run your business and hire you're help as you see fit, but I think in time you will look back and kick yourself for not just biting the bullet and getting a real employee.


I agree you should have regular employees and hire temps when you need a little extra help that's not the usual.


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## huggytree (Nov 3, 2013)

TxElectrician said:


> I know you will run your business and hire you're help as you see fit, but I think in time you will look back and kick yourself for not just biting the bullet and getting a real employee.


i real full time employee with out any gained hours = (-$60k+) off my income

a part time guy = (-$20k) off my income.....

a real full time guy wont be happy with some 10-20 hour work weeks either

i DID rethink about it the past few days.....i keep coming to the conclusion that i really DONT even need the part time guy...im just doing it to save my back

my back is worth $20k a year out of pocket when you consider my income will be $0 if its permanently F'd up

i will be hiring the temp guy for a day next week....very curious how it will work out.....im playing around with idea's at this point


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

huggytree said:


> i real full time employee with out any gained hours = (-$60k+) off my income
> 
> a part time guy = (-$20k) off my income.....
> 
> ...


Good thing about temp is they are exchangeable quickly. 

It doesn't take a rocket surgeon to do the heavy lifting. I always get temps to carry my decking into the back yard including beams and framing material. They are perfect for that. Someone's I tell them you will get b the same about of time from me if you get it done early. They always pick up the pace.


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## huggytree (Nov 3, 2013)

newest guy accepted my offer...so in 2 weeks ill have another new employee.....im much happier this time....he has the potential to be better than my 1st guy--who was awesome

i will be temp hiring 2 days next week...1 day a plumber and another a laborer......so i will see how it works out....i have tight deadlines and my new employee wont be with me yet....its always good to have options and im curious how good the temps will be


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## huggytree (Nov 3, 2013)

new guy started this week...he's decent.....i actually like being around this guy

he struggles a bit with some things, but he will improve....

only took 2 months to find someone good....


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## bmrtoyo (Jul 10, 2016)

sailfish27 said:


> Geez, I can't understand why you can't find any qualified people. After all your offering so much. It's probably never crossed your mind but some of these folks are "people" not just commodities. They want to learn and grow and make money like you.
> 
> Your offering them a dead end and a bad back for 15-20 part time. Wow talk about chutzpah


yes sounds like sheer employment glee  good luck ,funked up back , and words out dont work for that schmuck:clap:


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## bmrtoyo (Jul 10, 2016)

Californiadecks said:


> My guys are allow to talk to them, but they are not allowed to answer building questions, design questions or scheduling questions. But the small talk is fine.
> 
> Unless he's a foreman


i brought out a "potential lead man " told him keep it toned down with the customers so this *$$ hat stands there and proceeds to tell the customer how she can cut out a1/3 of the job ,which came to $3500.00 off the top ! ,,needless to say he made it on the "do not call list" idiot, then his wife sits there and tells me well ,if he ever pulls a decent pay check ,i looked at her and told her well youre old man has a great career in sales ,,,hes the global "down-sale:jester: " queen


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## KAP (Feb 19, 2011)

bmrtoyo... you might want to look at the dates of the threads you're responding to... :whistling


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