# knock down texture



## enfyre (Aug 16, 2012)

Hi, I'm new in the hang/tape/tex business, the single problem I'm having is with my texture, it just never looks quite right.
my problems are: Darker colored areas, like "shadows".
Texture drying too fast and getting flakey before I can knock it all down(large ceilings)
Too much "direction" in texture pattern(wiping in one direction)
I use a standard hoppergun tex machine, a tex undercoat spray from ICI paints, and synko tex mud. I was using a 14inch floppy tex wipedown knife, but I felt that it was making making high and low areas show through, so I am using a standard 8 inch sq style mud knife.
anyone have any tips or info? how much paint is normal? I was also thinking of trying 2 tex coats, thoughts on this?


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## ryanshull (Nov 1, 2012)

Don't "practice" on your clients homes. Do some work for yourself, free for your family who may not be picky, etc. Learn how to do it before you start charging people, cuz you are gonna get yourself in a heap of trouble.


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## enfyre (Aug 16, 2012)

ryanshull said:


> Don't "practice" on your clients homes. Do some work for yourself, free for your family who may not be picky, etc. Learn how to do it before you start charging people, cuz you are gonna get yourself in a heap of trouble.


I'm not "practicing". My taping finish is nearly perfect, skim finish, a double check through with 300watt light, floors someone could eat off. Textures fine, just not absolutely perfect, I doubt anyone without my trained eye for detail and a 500watt halogen in their hand could see these issues. I'm trying to PERFECT my work here.
Anyone care to partake in this discussion without bashing?


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## ryanshull (Nov 1, 2012)

Let me try again and clarify myself. I am not bashing you, or your work. How could I if I have never seen it? I assume you are a beginer because I consider myself a novice when it comes to drywall finishing and I can answer every question you have here with ease. 

Sorry if it came out the wrong way. The way your question is worded, it sounds like all you need to do is practice more, but let me try to be more helpful.

I assume you are talking specifically about knockdown texture:

I don't understand what you mean by "darker colored areas" Is this after the tex is dry? After painting?

"texture drying too fast" This one kind of answers itself. What I do is lay out sections that take me 15 minutes or so to spray. When I finish spraying section two, I knock down section 1. When I finish spraying section 3, I knock down section 2 and so on. It also gives your shoulders a break from that hopper gun. After spraying the last section, I clean out my gun while waiting for it to be dry enough to knock down. You want it to be just a little flakey when you knock it down, thats how you know it is dry enough IMO. You can come back when it is 100% dry and wipe the flakiness off with a slightly damp cloth. (actually I always do this before painting.) A very light sanding will work too, but it softens the look of the texture as well...... thats up to preference.

"too much "direction" in knockdown pattern" The question halfway answers itself. If the mud is at the right dryness, you can knock it down in several directions and it will look great. The key here is right dryness. Dry enough to knock down without leaving knife edges, flat spots, or drag marks, but still damp enough to manipulate. 15 to 20 minutes is a round estimate, but it depends a lot on temp and humidity.

I use a 24" knock down knife with a long handle and it works well for me. If you have high and low spots, your hanging and finishing skills aren't what you say they are.

Read the paint can. It will tell you the approximate coverage of the paint- usually 350 to 400 square feet per gallon. 1 coat of primer, 2 coats of paint is standard. You can go up from there depending on price range and overall quality. Use good paint, its worth the cost.

2 coats of texture is ok I guess, but probably not neccesary if you do the first one right and you aren't trying to cover up a shoddy tape/ finish job. If I have big flat spots in my knockdown (cuz I knifed it too wet) I will come back and spit a little more in those areas after it dries to even out the overall look.

If you ask a hundred different drywallers, you will get a hundred different ways of doing texture. Everyone kind of has thier own style. Let yours develop through practice practice practice.


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## Sir Mixalot (Jan 6, 2008)

enfyre said:


> Hi, I'm new in the hang/tape/tex business, the single problem I'm having is with my texture, it just never looks quite right.
> my problems are: Darker colored areas, like "shadows".
> Texture drying too fast and getting flakey before I can knock it all down(large ceilings)
> Too much "direction" in texture pattern(wiping in one direction)
> ...


The darker areas sound like possible humps or bumps.

If the knockdown is drying to fast and flaking, you're either getting to far head of yourself or theres to much airflow in the room drying the top of the texture to quick.

I personally like to knock down the texture in all different directions. So there is no visible pattern.

I use a 24" plexiglass paddle for knocking down. If you use a metal knife, it squishes the texture to out much. IMO.

Hope this helps. :thumbsup:


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

If this only happened on one job or even only a few houses then it is also possible that the attic coule be poorly insulated in areas causing diverse substrate temperatures and consequently vastly different drying times. 

A few degrees makes a huge difference when talking knock down. I like to wait ten or fifteen minutes then let the knocking roll.


I find myself knocking down diagonally similar to the way I grout. Not sure why but thats the way I roll,, or knock.. :laughing:


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## enfyre (Aug 16, 2012)

thanks for the helpful info. What kind brand and type of materials do you guys use? I suspect my shadows might be bad paint I use a product called ICI Texture undercoat, I have a good sprayer(graco mark V, fresh tip) even coverage, and generous spray.
Other flat paints Ive tried left too much shine. I also wonder if the fast drying I get is from the products I use, I will spray a ceiling with reasonably sloppy mud that takes under 10 minutes to spray and go immediately to knockdown and its somewhat flaking and rolling off. I used synko texture mud. A tip I got was to use taping mud instead so the last job I used yellow synko and it was a little slower drying but wouldnt spread nice, and definitely not enough time to do a second pass in another direction. This happens with normal temperature and humidity.

what I mean by higher and lower areas is mainly my butt joints, I coat them over 40 inches wide with just enough depth to hide the tape, but balance a 14-24 inch knife across the top and it will be unavoidably higher the the surrounding surface. this isn't really a big problem but occasionally when i used a large knife it would hit a butt joint just the wrong way and leave a slight difference in spread

I have to be this picky mainly because my competitor is my area is an absolute perfectionist, he even completely drop cloths the floors in full sized homes.


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## ryanshull (Nov 1, 2012)

I have honestly never used a texture undercoat. What is your process, start to finish?


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## AARC Drywall (May 11, 2008)

Have you concidered this:
if the house is hot your text has way less time to dry, 
airflow will also make a shorter work time.
primer is all you need on the lid before knockdown. if you have paint, the texture will not look right. It will elongate more than normal. The primer has to be dry to the touch.
8" knife will also make you work harder and make your texture dry faster, as you are slower to get to it, to knock it down. USE a texture paddle, that is what they are ment for. And you will get a better outcome, due to even pressure.
Question....what is the level of finish on the ceiling?


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