# Plaster Repair



## philcav7 (Jan 15, 2009)

I need to fix a couple of ceilings that have water damage from a roof leak. One of the areas is down to the lathe and all plaster is missing, the other (mud swirl finish) is intact, but the white coat has separated. I am having no luck finding local suppliers that carry kal kote, or other plaster.

All I can find is regular plaster of Paris, white bag joint compound, brown bag durabond. I can also order a DAP plaster patch product, which is a one step product. What do you guys use for plaster work...or at least what would be the best option from what I have available?


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## iDAHOchris (Feb 11, 2012)

I would break loose the rest and mix up some 5 min. hot mud in a pan or a small amount of 20 minute in a bucket (depending how much more came off) and flush it up . As the mud is going off (setting) I would buff it out smoothe and flat . Throw a fan on it and 10 15 minutes later put the ole coffee can swirl on er:thumbsup:


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## Ohio painter (Dec 4, 2011)

For the basecoat of plaster I use Structolite Basecoat by USG. I finish with USG Easy Sand. Any good drywall supplier should carry it. Home Depot can order it.


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## philcav7 (Jan 15, 2009)

I will check their lead time on ordering it. I don't shop at HD unless I have to and have no idea what their turn around is. 

It blows my mind that HD doesn't offer discounts for contractors, nor do they carry half the stuff I need... Yet they call themselves "the place for pros" 

I usually walk out of Lowes/HD both empty handed and pissed off.


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## Ohio painter (Dec 4, 2011)

I am with you regarding HD and Lowes. For the Structolite I will drive 40 miles to a decent drywall supplier knowing they have it in stock rather than waiting on HD to order it. 

Just a heads up, the structolite is not a finish product as it is very coarse, that's why I finish with the Easy Sand.


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## tyb525 (Feb 26, 2013)

I have done it a few time, and I use brown bag Durabond, polished as it sets up. I have used easy sand if a 2nd coat is needed.

The durabond is most likely stronger than the old plaster ever was, and I think it bonds better to the wood lathe (or anything for that matter) than "real" plaster like structolite IMO.


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## BUTCHERMAN (Jan 19, 2008)

I agree. I would lock it up with brown bag durabond, Big screen mesh it. I do like the Quick Set 20 better than the easy sand. It sets softer, more like joint compound than easy sand. Better to work with and cheaper. I would only make one mix and use it for all three coats. Just mix it loose, put it on your hawk or pan with a couple handfuls of plaster of paris to accelerate drying. For the texture, I would use a wallpaper brush.


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## Sir Mixalot (Jan 6, 2008)

One thing I might add, is to prime the areas of plaster to be repaired with Plaster-Weld® or some other type of sealer or bonding agent. :thumbsup:


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## icerock drywall (Aug 16, 2012)

durabond with a 24X24 peace of fibafuse skim with any kind of mud and your done


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## JackP23 (Jan 1, 2013)

Sir Mixalot said:


> One thing I might add, is to prime the areas of plaster to be repaired with Plaster-Weld® or some other type of sealer or bonding agent. :thumbsup:


Big 10-4 on the plaster weld. I've had really good results with that product. No call backs.


___________
Mike


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## Lanya LaPunta (Oct 31, 2010)

In this area, Home Dopey keeps Structolite in stock.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

First, I'd make sure the existing is tight to the lath still - if not, you're going to have to get it stuck back on. There's a good chance it's getting loose at the ceiling location. 

I'd do the ceiling with either bucket mud or easy sand. Bonding / sealing agents should be used first for setting compounds.

Walls I'd do with Durabond - same comment about bonding / sealing.


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

hdavis said:


> First, I'd make sure the existing is tight to the lath still - if not, you're going to have to get it stuck back on. There's a good chance it's getting loose at the ceiling location.
> 
> I'd do the ceiling with either bucket mud or easy sand. Bonding / sealing agents should be used first for setting compounds.
> 
> Walls I'd do with Durabond - same comment about bonding / sealing.


I've had very good results re attaching loose plaster with Big Wallys Plaster Magic. I know, it sounds dumb but it's a good system.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

EthanB said:


> I've had very good results re attaching loose plaster with Big Wallys Plaster Magic. I know, it sounds dumb but it's a good system.


It looks to be a pretty (new) standard approach for plaster repair, so it should be good. The old way of using metal plaster washers isn't as good, IMO, and takes a lot longer because of the surface build up required to get a finish surface.


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

hdavis said:


> It looks to be a pretty (new) standard approach for plaster repair, so it should be good. The old way of using metal plaster washers isn't as good, IMO, and takes a lot longer because of the surface build up required to get a finish surface.


My oldest application with it is about 5 years old now and it's still tight as a drum. This wall had about 40% loose plaster but it was in a very difficult location so the replacement quotes were really high. I was able to apply Big Wally's in about 4 hours and then skim the wall. Using very sharp drill bits is essential otherwise you're likely to just force the lath away from the plaster causing even more separation.


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## philcav7 (Jan 15, 2009)

Big Wally's seems kinda pricey. Too much for what I bid this job, but I may try it in the future. 

I planned to use plaster weld. Have heard many recommendations for it. 

I think I will cut away the loose top coat on the swirled ceiling, put some washers in and then refinish. The hole that's down to the lath will be durabond, mesh, and easy sand. 

Thanks for all the input, fellas.


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## D.E.P.S. (Aug 3, 2013)

Sir Mixalot said:


> One thing I might add, is to prime the areas of plaster to be repaired with Plaster-Weld® or some other type of sealer or bonding agent. :thumbsup:


I love me some Plaster Weld. I use it a lot when I do tie in work. Locks right on to glossy surfaces as well.


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## D.E.P.S. (Aug 3, 2013)

philcav7 said:


> I need to fix a couple of ceilings that have water damage from a roof leak. One of the areas is down to the lathe and all plaster is missing, the other (mud swirl finish) is intact, but the white coat has separated. I am having no luck finding local suppliers that carry kal kote, or other plaster.
> 
> All I can find is regular plaster of Paris, white bag joint compound, brown bag durabond. I can also order a DAP plaster patch product, which is a one step product. What do you guys use for plaster work...or at least what would be the best option from what I have available?


 
I get a lot of these repairs. Looks like a nightmare.....but it it's a simple fix. 

1. You will have to keep removing the loose material until you get where it's fairly tight to the substrate.

2. I always cut out the area of repair off as square as possible once it gets past the 2'x2". ( grinder - oscillating tool- 18 volt circ saw)

3. Secure the edges of the orginal plaster with plaster buttons to prevent movement and cracking long after you get paid. Heres a link to show you what they look like.

http://www.kilianhardware.com/ceilbutplasw.html

4. Take a straight edge and determine the depth of the repair. I run into some plaster repairs where it is about a 1/4" thick. I will pre fill the void with plywood some times. If it's fairy thin........just fill it with hot mud of your choice. 

5. Mesh and mud. Keep the hot mud coat as thin as possible. I have been doing it long enough that I can see almost see the mesh under my mud. Bust out the mud far enough to kill the visual transition. Make sure that you feather the edges of the repair with a wet sponge to where the original swirls are popping through your repair mud.

5. If you are not used to using plaster, you can do a nice swirl with hot mud. Just mix up a pan full of hot mud and mix it up a little on the loose side. If it is a sand swirl finish.......add a little sand to the mud.

6. _Sponge for swirl:_ I like to use a porous sponge with holes up to 1/4". LOWES and HD both sell them. Most swirl patterns are fairly consistent in spacing. Lay the sponge on the wall and cut it to the length of the spacing. It doesn't have to be perfect, but you don't want your repair to have a 6' swirl spacing pattern when the rest of the wall has 4". If the wall had random swirls.....(_some do_)..... let your imagination take over. Nip all 4 edges with a pair of scissors like you are just killing the sharp edging. This prevents plowing.

7. Knife on a nice thin coat of your loosely mixed mud and let it set for a minute or two. 

8. Take your damp sponge a try to follow the original swirl pattern. It is trial and error until you get the feel for it.

Sounds like alot of detail......but it is _old hand_ after you have a little practice. Make sure you kill the edges of your repair to blend in after with a damp sponge to get the old plaster to pop through the new.


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## tyb525 (Feb 26, 2013)

Pva primer has worked fine for me to seal the lathe. The reason for sealing is to kill the dust.

It's a good idea to key the old plaster, using a knife to undercut the edge of the old plaster.

Btw, did I mention I hate old horsehair plaster on wood lathe? I've never encountered any that wasn't somewhat loose. I love plaster on blueboard though


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## philcav7 (Jan 15, 2009)

Excellent write up deps. Thanks for that. 

The job I am finishing up now I had to patch a few holes in swirled drywall and they turned out okay. I used easy sand 90, just to give me extra time to work it. In the past, I have just watered down bucket mud as well. I have worked with kal kote a couple times, but am more comfortable with mud rather than plaster. I normally use 45 or 90 min and use warm water if needed to speed it up. 

Plaster work truly is a lost art and can be difficult to match on repairs. Some has sand, some doesn't. Some are sponge textured, some brush, knockdown, or polished. It amazes me the level of craftsmanship and effort the old timers were faced with. We are spoiled with drywall and mud boxes.


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## D.E.P.S. (Aug 3, 2013)

philcav7 said:


> Excellent write up deps. Thanks for that.
> 
> The job I am finishing up now I had to patch a few holes in swirled drywall and they turned out okay. I used easy sand 90, just to give me extra time to work it. In the past, I have just watered down bucket mud as well. I have worked with kal kote a couple times, but am more comfortable with mud rather than plaster. I normally use 45 or 90 min and use warm water if needed to speed it up.
> 
> Plaster work truly is a lost art and can be difficult to match on repairs. Some has sand, some doesn't. Some are sponge textured, some brush, knockdown, or polished. It amazes me the level of craftsmanship and effort the old timers were faced with. We are spoiled with drywall and mud boxes.


Thats the beauty in drywall/plaster repair work, especially with a lot of the products out there today. You are only limited to your own imagination in finding a work around. It's kinda fun to do a plaster repair to a 50-60 year old wall and match the original work perfectly. I have used paint brushes, hair brushes, wire brushes, etc. etc......to get just the right depth with a texture swirl. I was on a repair job one day and and realized that I left some of my tools at home 45 miles away. I ended up floating a pattern using a little piece of turf mat the lady had cut up for some hobby of hers. We both had a pretty good laugh and she was quite happy with the results.


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## Ohio painter (Dec 4, 2011)

Interesting thread and replies. I too enjoy doing old plaster repair work that many others avoid. I always remove all loose plaster down to the lath and be sure clean out the lath so new basecoat has space for keys to hold it. 

In regards to prepping the lath for before repair, a plasterer told me to use PVA glue (like Elmers glue) water down 50/50. Brush it on very liberally over the lath and let it dry. The reason to do so is because the lath is so dry that it will suck the moisture out of the new repair and eventually fail. 
I have always followed this advice and had good results. 

Great topic.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

Ohio painter said:


> Interesting thread and replies. I too enjoy doing old plaster repair work that many others avoid. I always remove all loose plaster down to the lath and be sure clean out the lath so new basecoat has space for keys to hold it.
> 
> In regards to prepping the lath for before repair, a plasterer told me to use PVA glue (like Elmers glue) water down 50/50. Brush it on very liberally over the lath and let it dry. The reason to do so is because the lath is so dry that it will suck the moisture out of the new repair and eventually fail.
> I have always followed this advice and had good results.
> ...


Lots of things work to prep the lath and plaster edge for the patch. In some ways it's a choice of what you want to keep handy. Any PVA, likePVA primer or thinned glue, acrylic primer, various acrylic conditioners or thinned acrylic caulk, shellac, ...


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## philcav7 (Jan 15, 2009)

Lots of great info guys. I appreciate your feedback and input.


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