# Trenching in New Residential Development?



## Trencher (Mar 6, 2007)

Guys,

First I would like to say I have enjoyed and found educational advice from most of these posts on this forum. This is why I have registered and am pleading for your advice, if someone can assist.

I am bidding a residential development for trenching and installing electrical conduit. The price of the conduit is not the issue, but what is, is what I charge for the required Workers Compensation which is NOW being requested than in the beginning. *I have to get a policy and do not know how to include this charge in the bid.*

I have already submitted a quote for what I can dig it for, but now I have to re-submit for the adjustment of having to get Worker Compensation (The reason I do not have it now, is because it has never been a necessity since I am the only employee and the field in which I was working - oil and gas)

On a second note: what would be a fair price to ask *per foot* of trenching, material purchasing, installing, backfilling, and labor combined? *What would be a fair markup?*

Any help from you guys would be *greatly *appreciated! 

Fulcrum


----------



## tgeb (Feb 9, 2006)

Welcome to the site! 

No one can tell you what to charge on something like this as we each have our own pricing requirements.

What you need to do is find out what the Workers comp policy will cost you, then build that cost into your pricing.

For instance; policy costs $520/year, you need to make the cost up at $10/week or $2/day unless you will only be working average 4 days per week then it would be $2.50/day. Get the picture?

Most workers comp is based on percent of payroll, so you would have to work that into you price quote for labor on a percentage basis.

If you really don't want the hassle of buying your own policy some builders will deduct the cost of workers comp from your payment, maybe you could talk to them about that. 
Beware however that they will make the deduction on the total payment which can be quite expensive, as you'd then be paying workers comp on the conduit you are selling them.

You really should get the policy as most all builders, and even home owners that you work for should be asking you for it.
Do you have general liability and underground?

Were are you located anyway?

Let me know if anything I said above makes any sense, 
I just read it and have clue what I'm talking about...:laughing:


----------



## Trencher (Mar 6, 2007)

Thanks for the reply,

I understand a price may not be given on here, but how about what mark-up percentage is placed on materials to cover labor, transportation, fuels, etc.? The last thingI want to do is underbid, or over bid.

Maybe someone can suggest a percentage to me via email? [email protected]


Thanks for your help in advance!

Fulcrum
**********
btw, Tom, you made perfect sense!


----------



## tgeb (Feb 9, 2006)

Trencher said:


> I understand a price may not be given on here,


Actually I could spout prices to you all day long, but what I charge here, may not be a good price for you there. I know what my market will bear and try to price jobs accordingly. I also know what my wallet will bear and try not to price jobs too low.




> how about what mark-up percentage is placed on materials to cover labor, transportation, fuels, etc.? The last thingI want to do is underbid, or over bid.


Again this is the type thing that will vary from place to place and even job to job for me. Some areas that I do work in are more difficult do to local restrictions, etc. and that would be reflected in my pricing.

You really have to sit down and work out what it costs you to do business and not worry too much about the other guy.




> Maybe someone can suggest a percentage to me via email?


Someone could do that, but I prefer to keep the discussions out here on the forum where we all can share and learn from each other. 
That's what this place is all about.


----------



## rino1494 (Jan 31, 2006)

I am kinda confused here, are you bidding on doing trenching for the primary's and transformer pads for a new development or the service lines for houses ??

If it is doing the primary trench then we charge $11.25 per ft and $225 per transformer pad. Here, the trenches must be 42" deep and 2ft wide with 3" sand on the bottom, then the primary is laid. Then that is sand padded, then the phone and cable lay their lines, then again I sand pad. It ends up being about 15" of sand. That price includes, layout and supervision, digging, sandpadding, backfill, compaction and exporting spoilage.

For service lines to a house, we charge $10/ft. That includes a 3" conduit and (2) 1.5" conduits, string lined and backfilled with no compaction.

Again, those prices may be way off from the what you should be charging.


----------



## Trencher (Mar 6, 2007)

The image used for my avatar is my equipment. It is capable of digging 36" deep at 8" width (each pass) at 8 ft/minute (dense but easily breakable ground). 

The job consists of 800ft trenching at max depth, no sanding, primary line to trasformer pad (non-exisitent), backfilling and no spoilage.

In this area, for that depth, just to trench it, is *$2.85/ft*. All tolled, after material costs and a"guessed at" mark-up on those materials, plus labor(one man) (subject to change if added tasks accrue), and other costs estimated I ended up at *$5.87/ft*. I know these rates are low for a turnkey operation with digging the primary (not going to the house yet that I know of), but I am getting hungry and competition is stiff here and no one wants to divulge their marketable price (really don't blame them), you know sorta like small town gas stations talking with one another to keep the gas prices *up* at the pumps when they should be *lowered*, just to keep everyone in business...making money.

I had typed up a whole response yesterday to tgeb, but accidentally his "Escape" and lost everything (I usually copy it when I get to certain spots).  Needless to say I was too frustrated to re-type it. But to answer your questeion, tgeb, I am out of south Louisiana.


----------



## dayexco (Mar 4, 2006)

not to parrot what's been said on this forum many, many times...you really, really need to sit down and figure out for yourself....maybe with the help of your acct. and ins. agent...what it's going to cost you to do this job. then you have to decide how much profit you want on it. bidding jobs has many variables. time frame of job, how busy is competition, how busy you are, complexity of the job, etc. etc....for any of us to give you "ballparky" numbers to work with would be a great disservice to you. my cost of operation here in south dakota is no doubt considerably cheaper than the members here that are from the east coast, and our numbers we'd give you would be skewed that way.


----------



## rino1494 (Jan 31, 2006)

The prices that you gave, does that include the conduit ??


----------



## Trencher (Mar 6, 2007)

rino1494 said:


> The prices that you gave, does that include the conduit ??


 
It does, rino. With the cost of PVC conduit, glue, rope, and fittings with a 50% mark-up on materials, that is what it came out to. Again, this may be low, or it may be high...I am unsure at this time, but I know others have bidded this job and I am too hungry to lose it to a large profit attempt. Plus, I am on a time line for the submission; he gave me 3 days for a quote because of a pushed deadline date for him to get started.
I suppose I could have taken that in account when bidding and possibly could have named my amount and he may have taken it, but, since I am just getting my business started back in Louisiana, I feel I need to work my way upward to a larger profit by word-of-mouth. This is why I asked you guys for your help. I feel you all know the ropes pretty damn well and that I appreciate.


----------



## rino1494 (Jan 31, 2006)

Ok, now I ask you, does that include any conduit for phone and cable or is that just for power ?

800' is one day's work, for me at least. So, I would figure one day's rate for your machine, labor, mobilization, and materials plus mark up. You might wanna pad it just a bit, because it may it take you just a bit longer.


----------



## Trencher (Mar 6, 2007)

800' is definitely a one day dig for me. Matter of fact I can cut it, provided there are no other obstructions (other contractors, their vehicles, their materials, etc), install the conduit, fish it, and have it backfilled in a day.
No, that price is just for the trenching, electrical conduit, and installation of it, not the phone nor cable... just only what I am responsible for. I suppose once I get the trenches dug and the other utilities are to go in there, which the developer and I have not discussed, I will end up waiting for the contractors...thus causing me to come back out and finish backfilling.

If this is the case, I stated in my bid if any additional trips are required back to the work site, and it is *not* due to lax in my work, there will be an additional delivery charge ($150 minimum). The hours are figured in for backfilling already.
However, if I am delayed for reasons beyond my control, and am requested to standby, there will be a standby charge.


----------



## rino1494 (Jan 31, 2006)

Actually, I just figured up a price and I came in under your price. Your rates and materials may be higher, plus I only marked up materials 25%.

Not sure how you string you conduits, but I have found that the easiest way is a shop vac and a grocery bag.


----------

