# Some questions about getting C-15 license.



## jflores (Jun 10, 2010)

Hey guys, I'm new here, but not new to flooring. I have been installing flooring for a little over 10 years now here in socal. Carpet, glue down with border, pattern match, berber, vinyl, vct, rubber tile, vinyl planks, subfloor repairs, with little experience on ceramic tile and wood. I was laid off the company I worked for 8 years, because I had a problem with the manager and it has been hard to find work, I applied to one company that does work for home depot, but the problem is that we have to move furniture almost on a daily basis and my helper hurt his back, so I stop going to the warehouse. I've been looking into another companies and many of them require the c-15 license.
My question is where to start, am I even eligible to get one, since I'm not an expert of ceramic tile nor wood and there are a few things that I'm not as experienced as in vinyl welding or vinyl cove, I have installed cove vinyl before and can definitely do it again, but to call myself an expert at that would be wrong. Anyway I've been reading and researching about how to get the license, there are few places online that sell the study guide and there are also a few "schools" that you can go and take some courses here in Socal. I noticed that there are a few guys in the socal area, can you guys recommend me where to go? Since I'm on unemployment right now, i want to invest some of my time in getting the license so it would be easier for me to find work.

thanks in advance


----------



## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

There is way more to being a contractor than knowing your specific trade. The business end of this trade is very important. Look at the thread from the guy in SoCal who got sideways with a HO over color selection and WC. My bet is you will find a "school" who will accept you, fill out all your paperwork and "teach" you the test. Look at the CSLB website for a C-15 lic. Be careful, it's not as easy as it looks.


----------



## BKM Resilient (May 2, 2009)

The test is in two parts. There's questions on flooring and there's questions about the law. When I took the test it was mostly multiple choice. There was also some estimating where you really didn't need to know anything about flooring, just basic math. You would probably be able to pass all the flooring questions and you only need 58% correct to pass. With four choices if you close your eyes and randomly stab at answers you would get 25% just from sheer chance alone. You must know to pass that side of the test. The law questions are things you may know nothing of. That's where you will need to purchase a book, go to the library or take a course. 

I bought some books from one of those contractor's exam publishing companies. In retrospect I think I would have passed the test without the "course" and the books were something like $300-400 if I recall correctly so I was a little pissed to have spent the cash. Anyway, now that I'm older I realize that it would have been very foolish to get the license and not REALLY know all the crap a licensed contractor ought to know. Most of that legal BS is about protecting YOUR rights from all the screwballs out there who would try to cheat you. It's not enough to know how to lay floors. You have to LEARN how to get paid in this world. Good luck.


----------



## mr marble (Nov 3, 2010)

jflores said:


> Hey guys, I'm new here, but not new to flooring. I have been installing flooring for a little over 10 years now here in socal. Carpet, glue down with border, pattern match, berber, vinyl, vct, rubber tile, vinyl planks, subfloor repairs, with little experience on ceramic tile and wood. I was laid off the company I worked for 8 years, because I had a problem with the manager and it has been hard to find work, I applied to one company that does work for home depot, but the problem is that we have to move furniture almost on a daily basis and my helper hurt his back, so I stop going to the warehouse. I've been looking into another companies and many of them require the c-15 license.
> My question is where to start, am I even eligible to get one, since I'm not an expert of ceramic tile nor wood and there are a few things that I'm not as experienced as in vinyl welding or vinyl cove, I have installed cove vinyl before and can definitely do it again, but to call myself an expert at that would be wrong. Anyway I've been reading and researching about how to get the license, there are few places online that sell the study guide and there are also a few "schools" that you can go and take some courses here in Socal. I noticed that there are a few guys in the socal area, can you guys recommend me where to go? Since I'm on unemployment right now, i want to invest some of my time in getting the license so it would be easier for me to find work.
> 
> thanks in advance


Can you say apprentice , yep sorry to say it takes 5 years to get journeyman status but well worth the hassle,, when you get it sign to the union, great pay they stand behind you , benefits , health plans, retirement package,rrsp investments , they do it all for you, I've been a local 31 member in Toronto, for years and run my own business on the side, if I had it my way all flooring installers would need a damn certification we are skilled tradesmen in our field,it keeps the hacks at bay and from stealing our work , do yourself a favor get educated and certified, government is giving money away to revive the trades take advantage while you can ,plus you learn all aspects of the flooring trade not just sheet flooring, it's actually exciting once you know more then just that !! And you open the door to huge money union journeyman 
Makes an average of 40 ph , nice round number isn't it ??? Plus cash work you do the math here , now do you think it is worth the hassle ?


----------



## rusty baker (Jun 14, 2008)

$40 per hour? I wouldn't unload my tools for that.


----------



## tile9 (Aug 23, 2010)

rusty baker said:


> $40 per hour? I wouldn't unload my tools for that.


You wouldn't unload your tools for $80k a year? I know PhDs that dont make that much.


----------



## ParagonFloors (Sep 27, 2010)

The law part of the test is easy if you take the crash course. The trade part is almost all Carpet which made it hard for me . I don't do carpet and never have. I think Hardwood should be its own license. The 2 day class is a MUST.
good luck


----------



## ParagonFloors (Sep 27, 2010)

It will help you get work. But sometimes you need to swallow your pride and just get money. Even if that means helping your competition with their work.


----------



## rusty baker (Jun 14, 2008)

A ggod independent carpet installer will average 20 yds per hour at least. 20 yds at $4.50 is $90 per hour.


----------



## tile9 (Aug 23, 2010)

rusty baker said:


> A ggod independent carpet installer will average 20 yds per hour at least. 20 yds at $4.50 is $90 per hour.



But I doubt that's steady, 40 hours a week, work. Making $90 an hour steady would be way too much money for someone to make independently. That's too much money with basically zero barriers for another company to enter the market. Markets get flooded with installers and either one of two things happen: prices per sq foot/yard get lower or jobs become sparse. 

Hell, $90/hr steady @ 40hrs a week and 50 weeks a year adds up to $180,000 year. Pay a helper $25,000 a year and you are grossing $155,000 a year before taxes with next to nothing for overhead. 

You cannot tell me that is sustainable. If so, I'm hanging up my tile tools for some knee kicks and seam rollers.


My point being, mr. marble above was saying a journeyman in a union makes an average of $40/hr, which is sustainable. I would definitely unload my tools for $40/hr steady work, and you would too.


----------



## rusty baker (Jun 14, 2008)

According to the union installers that I know, that's $28 in money and $12 in benefits. And when I worked in a large city that had both union and independent installers, the independents got more hours. Neither one gets 40 hours a week, 52 weeks a year. By the way, I average 20 yds an hour without a helper.


----------



## tile9 (Aug 23, 2010)

rusty baker said:


> By the way, I average 20 yds an hour without a helper.



Again, you do not average 20 yards an hour *steady*. There is no way. Simple economics says that you don't. If you want to lie and boast that you do, then so be it. You can't convince anyone here that you make $180k a year.


----------



## rusty baker (Jun 14, 2008)

Never said that I made that much. Union installers don't make $80000 either. We were talking hourly, not yearly.


----------



## covaltleveling (Aug 13, 2010)

Study and study some more, then take the test and get ready to pay many fees and deal with red tape.........


----------



## johnt408 (Apr 25, 2012)

Anyone recommend a good school to take the 2 days crash course? I passed the law part but failed the trade twice...


----------



## mrcharles (Sep 27, 2011)

tile9 said:


> You wouldn't unload your tools for $80k a year? I know PhDs that dont make that much.




You mean pay the taxes on 80,000. Then try and support a family. Sorry 80,000 is fine but only if you just have to show up 9-5. 


FYI Union guys that do side work is bullsh*t. They picket when a job doesn't go union, but then build decks or whatever on the side potentially taking away from their union "brothers".


I'm glad you union guys in Canada are doing fine, but in Michigan residential union labor is almost completely gone. I am also completely against the idea that getting a journeyman card qualifies you to run a business. There is way more to being successful in business than knowing your trade. You should be making 80,000 a year salary from your company and then the company should be making decent profits so you can pay yourself bonuses. But when there are tons of guys who think they own a business, but really just own a job it drives the prices down and ruins it for real businessmen. 



End of rant.... This is why I'm doing commercial right now


----------



## asbestos (Mar 22, 2006)

180,000 a year for independent carpet installers? 
Doesn't everyone know? The Unions crashed the economy! it's the unions that caused the financial meltdown and made all the states bankrupt.


----------



## Groutface (Jan 20, 2011)

In Canada there is no residential carpenters union.........only commercial......


----------



## Groutface (Jan 20, 2011)

Sorry ....in Ontario.......not sure about other provinces


----------



## Chris Johnson (Apr 19, 2007)

Groutface said:


> In Canada there is no residential carpenters union.........only commercial......


Where are you? I'm guessing behind a tree!

I know 2 locals alone in Toronto that are framing union - residential. And there are others outside my area


----------

