# Jetted/Heated Tub



## Sparky Joe (Apr 29, 2006)

I've installed jetted tubs before on dedicated 15amp GFI circuits, but I looked at one today that has jets and heat and needs to wired. It is already installed and of course the lady lost the paper work. I know I could open the tub to find out and ultimately that will be what I do before running the wire, but coming in here and getting chewed for being lazy is so much easier.

Finally my question; do these tubs(jetted/heated) just run on 15 amps as well?


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## Big Dave (Feb 23, 2006)

If I remember correctly you need two dedicated receptacles. One for pump and one for heater.

Dave.


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## Speedy Petey (Sep 30, 2003)

You *really* should have opened it up since you were there. The only thing to do is go in prepared.
The heater may be 220v, but I doubt it.

It most likely requires two 20a/125v GFI circuits. I would run 12/3NM to it and use a two-pole 20a GFCB.
I seriously doubt 15 amps is going to cut it. I never run 15 amps to a hydro tub.


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## Sparky Joe (Apr 29, 2006)

I've never run 14 gauge to a tub either, but on the last one I did the general insisted reapetedly that it only needed a 15 amp. So I insisted he open it so I could read the paper work and also looked at the plug config., it all checked out so that's what I ran, and it's only 5 feet from the panel so I don't think VD will be an issue.

The kicker on the one I looked at is the lady had an electrician that flaked, so I went in weary of what I might see, but it looked very do-able. Perhaps he bid too low, or doesn't like attic crawling, or was simply a flake. 

Anyway she said he already stubbed the wire into the attic and hard wired the tub, she also said he left some wire behind which was about 150' of 14-2. Though I will bid for a 250 roll of 12-2, just in case. I've never used a 2 pole GFI, what's the price compare to two singles?


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## fridaymean (Feb 17, 2006)

The ones we use (GE) go for about $80-$100. I'd just use two GFI recpts.


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## Speedy Petey (Sep 30, 2003)

fridaymean said:


> The ones we use (GE) go for about $80-$100. I'd just use two GFI recpts.


 Even under the tub, behind a (most likely) P-I-A access panel?

A two pole GFCB is typically not much more than two single poles.


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

Speedy Petey said:


> Even under the tub, behind a (most likely) P-I-A access panel?


Yes, that's the way I do them. I use two GFCI recs in a deep 4 square with a 2 GFCI RS cover on the end of a 12-3 home run. Much cheaper than two GFCI breakers. 14 bucks, my cost, to GFCI protect both items. If one ever trips, you'll have to take off the PITA access cover to fix the thing that caused the trip anyhow. 

I see very few reasons to ever use a GFCI breaker for 110 volt branch circuits, even multiwire ones.


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## bmartin (Dec 30, 2005)

What about a dead front gfi in a convenient location like a closet to a standard plug under the tub?


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

Forgot to add... I always wire the jetted tubs as if they'll have heat (ie. two circuits run). I've noticed in the docs for most models show that the heat can be field installed. It's just a darned "box" in the circulation line that must have some sort of heating element inside. I got screwed on two houses in a row in which the tub in place during my ruff had a heat kit installed sometime between the time I ruffed and the time I came back to finish. 

Don't forget to bond the lug on the outside of the heat unit to the lug on the outside of the circulation pump motor and any metal supply piping with a piece of #8 min copper.


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

bmartin said:


> What about a dead front gfi in a convenient location like a closet to a standard plug under the tub?


Yeah, that's cool, but have you priced them bastards lately? 27 bucks each, my cost, at the supply house. Might as well use the breaker in that case.


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## Sparky Joe (Apr 29, 2006)

Thanks for all the good stuff, didn't know about bonding heater to pump and piping, but why with #8?


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## Speedy Petey (Sep 30, 2003)

Actually this rule changed from 2002 to 2005. We dropped the requirement to bond the copper feed lines. It used to be you had to bond the "piping systems". Now it's bonding the piping systems "in contact with the circulating water". Most new package spas do not use metallic piping for this, and if they do they are usually bonded from the factory.
This is not to say it would be a bad thing or wrong to do it. It's just if you are under NEC 2005 it is no longer required.




> _680.74 Bonding
> All metal piping systems and all grounded metal parts in contact with the circulating water shall be bonded together using a copper bonding jumper, insulated, covered, or bare, not smaller than 8 AWG solid._


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

Just wanted to clarify that you still need to bond the heater to the circulation pump, even under the '05. You just do not have to catch the copper water feed line anymore, since it's not part of the "circulation" system. I do anyhow, since a water bond clamp costs just a buck, and old habits die hard.

I happen to use #6 bare copper, since I don't really use bare solid #8 for anything. I always have end roll scraps from #4 and #6 bare solid copper from grounding electrode conductors and 200 amp service water line bonding. Guys that do more swimming pool work will have more scraps of #8 copper available, since that's the popular bonding size for swimming pool bonding grids.

DO NOT LET a knucklehead inspector force you to carry these pump and heater bonds back to the ground bar in the panel. Some have this mistaken impression, and try to enforce this bogus requirement. These items only need bonded to EACH OTHER, and need not go back to the panel. Not that doing so would be bad, it is just wasteful of material, serves no purpose whatsoever, and is not required.


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## Speedy Petey (Sep 30, 2003)

Actually that is true about the heater Marc. If it is not factory installed chances are it is not bonded. Always be sure to check.

I myself typically have lots of short pieces of #8TW solid around from doing pools.

VERY good point about inspectors as well!!!


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## brian11973 (Apr 13, 2006)

I guess I have lucky. It's ways been heater, no heater on the rough in.

I usually put a GFCI outlet in the walkin closet. The motors on these things are about 8-12 amps. It's more than the 50% load rule.( 20 amp breaker). HO gets an "extra" plug in the closet. Have not been busted for it yet. I would just change it out to a faceless. They are paying for it anyways. Just finished a big addition. Put a GFCI outlet in the toilet / extra sink room. Its about 5' from the toilet. Access is through the floor to basement with 12' dropped ceiling. Subpanel underneath got maxed w/ mini's _after_ drywall. I would have put in by the sink w/ sink plug. The framing was a  nightmare. GC & HO asked what is was for. Just replied, "It's for the whirlpool". No more questions. Will have to see what Mr Inspector says.


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## ChuckEA (Apr 8, 2005)

*Grounding jetted tub circulation pump motor*

Have been asked by a home seller to remedy a number of items from the buyer's inspection list. One of the items seems to be related to the discussion above about "bonding" so I thought I would post my questions here. The inspector's report reads as follows: "Ground the electrical motor on the jetted tub in the master bathroom". When I pulled away the access panel I observed the following:
1. The pump motor was plugged into a recepatcle located under the tub deck with a 3 prone plug. 
2. This recepatcle is wired back to a junction box on the wall which contains a switch and GFCI device. The ground lugs of both the switch and the GFCI device are connected to the bare ground wire of the incoming power supply line.
2. All the circulating water pipes are non-metal (PVC I think)
3. Nothing is connected to the ground lug that sits atop the circulation pump.
4. The water supply lines are copper

My questions are these:

1. Assuming that the ground wire of the supply line runs back to and is correctly connected in the service panel, isn't the circulation pump motor already properly grounded?
2. Isn't it more likely that the inspector in this case is referring to the bonding of the circulation pump to the water supply lines ; which in this case would not be mandatory under the 2005 code?

I'll be be subbing this and the other electrical work out to a licensed electrician but just wanted to clarify the issues for my own curiostity.

Thanks in advance.


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## Speedy Petey (Sep 30, 2003)

1) Yes

2) I think you assume correct. Just another example of a clueless H-I. Bonding the motor will not hurt, but it was code until the 2005 cycle. So unless the home was built within the acceptance of the 2005 code (or local code) in your area, you really are required to do this.
Going along with something this trivial will help keep a P-I-A H-I & buyer happy. You may just as well do it.


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

I wouldn't personally spend too much time fretting over it. Get a 3' piece of #8 copper and a water bond clamp, and for 2 dollars you've addressed the somewhat imaginary action item by bonding the motor to the water feed line. Bill them about 75 bucks and sleep well.

Do not, under any circumstance, run a ground wire from the motor bond lug to the service panel ground bar. While this won't hurt a thing, it is not (and has never been) required. Some home inspectors have this mistaken impression, and I would take them to task if they had this foolish notion.


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## Sparky Joe (Apr 29, 2006)

ChuckEA raised a good question for me when he mentioned a GFI switch combo. I imagine the switch is acting as a disconnevt for the tub because it does have serviceable equipment. Now I wonder is this required, or just good practice.

And Pete your abbreviations(forgot what they're actually called) are getting harder and harder to follow. What ever happened to the good old days when one could just simply read something and be able to understand. I assume H-I means "home inspector", but "P-I-A H-I", what the f***, speak english.

And also I have to mention once again I hate "pain in the a$$ home inspectors". Is there only purpose to scare homeowners, call my perfectly legal work crap, or just move money between hands for the greater good of the economy?


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## jbfan (Apr 1, 2004)

"P-I-A H-I=pain in the a$$ home inspectors


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