# Last Words Cemetery



## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

This was in the paper yesterday:


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

How many people have actually died as a result of doing electrical work in their house?


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

Inner10 said:


> How many people have actually died as a result of doing electrical work in their house?


The NFPA used to keeps tabs. I recall 68 a year, but it's been years since I've seen that book.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

I've never run across that statistic as far as I recall, but the great majority of electrical fatalities both in the home and occupationally result from some form of contact with overhead lines. That would seem to indicate that strictly in terms of direct electrical shock, Harry Homeowner is relatively safe when it comes to wiring up an extra line in his basement.


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

Tinstaafl said:


> I've never run across that statistic as far as I recall, but the great majority of electrical fatalities both in the home and occupationally result from some form of contact with overhead lines. That would seem to indicate that strictly in terms of direct electrical shock, Harry Homeowner is relatively safe when it comes to wiring up an extra line in his basement.


I recall a table that listed the number of deaths that were directly attributed to poor wiring (including fires as a result of it). It was broken down into things like 'wiring done by licensed electrician', 'wiring done by utility lineman', 'wiring done by homeowner'.

Keep in mind, many of the deaths could not be able to be categorized, so many are simply 'unknown'. If the person is dead, laying on the ground in front of a burned-out panel, yeah it's kinda obvious. If they die in an electrically-induced fire, it's kind of hard to ask, "Hey, did you do this wiring yourself or did you hire a licensed electrician?"

So the figure of 68 is *exceedingly* low if the *true* facts could be found.

I'll email a friend who's on the CMP... maybe he knows if they still keep those stats.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

No argument there, Ken. That's why I used the "electrical shock" qualifier. :thumbsup:


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## skyhook (Mar 17, 2007)

Tinstaafl said:


> Harry Homeowner is relatively safe when it comes to wiring up an extra line in his basement.


Actually, I think Harry HO is not only putting himself in danger, but also his family, friends, and any tradesmen who come in to work after him.


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

Tinstaafl said:


> No argument there, Ken. That's why I used the "electrical shock" qualifier. :thumbsup:


One does not die to due 'electrical shock'. One dies from 'electrocution' :laughing:.


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

skyhook said:


> Actually, I think Harry HO is not only putting himself in danger, but also his family, friends, and any tradesmen who come in to work after him.


Anyone who enters the structure is at risk.

And Harry Homeowner won't have any insurance to cover the losses & lawsuits, either.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

Unfortunately, I can't use the smiley I would like to respond with. :whistling:


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

480sparky said:


> And Harry Homeowner won't have any insurance to cover the losses & lawsuits, either.


Don't start. Maybe Harry lives in a no-license state, and is conscientious enough to get an inspection when he's finished. :thumbup:


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

Tinstaafl said:


> Don't start. Maybe Harry lives in a no-license state,


Small consolation to the victim's family & friends.



Tinstaafl said:


> and is conscientious enough to get an inspection when he's finished. :thumbup:


And does not prevent lawsuits.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

If he did the work right, there would be no basis for a lawsuit.


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## asbestos (Mar 22, 2006)

*hacks*

I have seen some real lousy work done by licensed guys. and some decent work by HO's it should really say "why bother to find out how to do it right" when people start seeing all the stuff they will need to figure out then they realize a tradesman may be the way to go. The funny thing is in WA Joe homeowner can add a new panel to his house but if I want to change a light fixture I need 3000 hours of apprentice time to get a residential maintenance license. does not matter if I spent the 3000 hours running NM in crawls either.


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

Tinstaafl said:


> If he did the work right, there would be no basis for a lawsuit.


Sure there is..... the lawyer gets paid anyway, doesn't he?


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## aptpupil (Jun 12, 2010)

Tinstaafl said:


> I've never run across that statistic as far as I recall, but the great majority of electrical fatalities both in the home and occupationally result from some form of contact with overhead lines. That would seem to indicate that strictly in terms of direct electrical shock, Harry Homeowner is relatively safe when it comes to wiring up an extra line in his basement.


the guy who taught me electrical work (he was in the trade for 40 years) always said that more people died from 120v than any other voltage because of its accessibility. never asked him for a source, though, so i have no way of verifying this.


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

Not to argue the importance of the issue, but I've seen at least one case first hand where there was a fire. Tragically there were also deaths. The investigation eventually listed the cause as faulty wiring.

Years later a young lad tried to turn himself in to the sheriff's office claiming responsibility for starting the fire intentionally. They declined any action citing statue of limitations for arson. The lad eventually went suicidal with guilt.

My point being, sometimes faulty wiring can be a matter of convenience for the investigator and skew the stats.

Again, not to argue the importance of the issue, but stats are often tailored to fit the point.

Good Luck
Dave


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## skyhook (Mar 17, 2007)

Tinstaafl said:


> Unfortunately, I can't use the smiley I would like to respond with. :whistling:


No offense to you Tin, the OP's subject needed emphisis.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

Nah, the smiley crack was in response to Ken's shock vs electrocution distinction. :laughing:


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

aptpupil said:


> the guy who taught me electrical work (he was in the trade for 40 years) always said that more people died from 120v than any other voltage because of its accessibility. never asked him for a source, though, so i have no way of verifying this.


My first "teacher" was an old school electrician. He would intentionally touch wires, connections, breakers, etc. to test for live or not. Claimed he could tell the difference between 210 and 120. 

He tried to teach that trick but I resisted. To this day I still need to read it with a meter. I have failed my teacher.

Good Luck
Dave


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