# Green Building - Any Impact on Drywall Trade?



## mseneker (Dec 22, 2007)

There has been a lot of talk and articles about "green-building". Using recycled materials, land-fill issues and energy efficiency are all examples.

Does anyone have any specific ideas about "green-building" and its potential effects on our drywall trade in the future? A recent article in a national magazine suggest "green-building" will grow for a 2 billion industry to a 200 billion industry in the next 10 years.

How does green-building effect the drywall trade? Is it a an idea that will pass or is it here to stay?


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## mseneker (Dec 22, 2007)

So far I've seen the following very short list of effects of "green-building" in drywall:

1. Commercial projects often ask for details on waste disposal such as location and cost of land-fill.

2. We are seeing more high-tech and energy efficient homes that require special drywall attention. An example is a radiant heat floor system installed prior to drywall that limited mobility. 

Still wondering how and if to spend time marketing in this area? Are there drywall materials and methods for "green-building"? Or is it just simply, drywall has recycled paper on it. Wondering if we will see a return to those days when companies bought our waste drywall. At that time it did not make cost since to recycle drywall waste.


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## leadarrows (May 26, 2004)

My company recycles drywall by grinding it into a fine powder and selling it to farmers as a soil amendment. 
I have been in the new construction drywall scrape removal business for 11 years. in the last year I have become aware of several builders in my area that are interested in building green. We are ready to do our part when we are needed. I will post a link to a story the local paper did or our business and be glad to answer any questions you might have. 

http://www.heraldbulletin.com/homenews/local_story_200174942.html?start:int=0

As for impact on builders I think the demand is going no where but up. The home owners I have spoken with are always enthusiastically pleased to find out we recycle the drywall trimmings from their homes. More and more people are looking to see what they can do to recycle....this gives them something to brag about and to feel good about.

" Wondering if we will see a return to those days when companies bought our waste drywall. At that time it did not make cost since to recycle drywall waste."I don't see that happening in my industry. Recycling drywall for use as a soil amendment dose not generate the income that would allow me to pay for the scrapes. I can afford to charge about half of what the landfills charge to accept them however.


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## mseneker (Dec 22, 2007)

Thanks for the reply concerning drywall recycle. I have to admit that I hope the green building trend does not impact the drywall trade. Not that I'm against protecting resources and nature. Drywall contractors rarely get paid the added cost of some changes in the market. For example, I'm doing a lot more of what had been a trim carpenters trade. Wrapping drywall around things we never did in the past. More archways, columns and stem wall tops in basements. 

I would like to find a niche in green building that I can add value and get paid for. I'd like to recycle waste or at least point my clean up contractor to the recycle center and split he cost savings of him not hauling it to a dump.

I also do not want to get blind sided if the market shifts to more green building and there is anything the drywall contractor needs to do just to maintain business with current or future customers.

I'm not hearing a single request from individuals nor builders for any type of green building and the drywall process. Either they are slow to respond to the changes or there is nothing for the drywall contractor to do in terms of green building.


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## Tim0282 (Dec 11, 2007)

Hey Leadarrows, Do you use the drywall crusher sold by a company in Texas. Can't remember the name right now. We thought about getting it and bagging the crushed rock and selling it to local garden centers and the like. Looked like a lot of work for a little return. Mainly because our landfill prices to dump are so low.


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## leadarrows (May 26, 2004)

This is a picture of the tub grinder I use. Sorry about the poor quality of the picture it was taken with a camera phone.

The reason this has worked out for me is because we make our main income from scraping new construction drywall. We were paying $35.00 per ton to dump at a transfer station 10 miles from where we keep our truck. That's the fuel costs for a 20 mile round trip and $35.00 per ton we save. OK Then we get paid for our ground up drywall. So if you add the savings in with the profit it dose pay for us too do this. I wish to add though profit isn't what originally led me to research this. I just don't like being a part of a problem. Burying drywall in our land fills creates, under the right conditions, sulfur gas. That's a problem for all of us. 
This solution dosent come with out it's problems but we hope it is a start in the right direction and we believe it helps more than it hurts. You see gypsum has a tendency to facilitate the leaching of some chemicals trapped in farm fields into the ground water. 
It also dosent help some soil types, it is a waste and can be harmful to crop yeilds to use it on them, sandy soils being one. 
Gypsum is best suited for clay soils. Whenever it is used we always recommend soil testing first. Most of the farmers I sell it to not only grid test their fields they have GPS maps of their soil types linked to there soil testing results. When the gypsum is applied only the areas that will benefit the most receive an application. 
Gypsum is just one more choice farmers have when they are considering what they can do to improve there soil. We here at Roy's Recycling Inc. Are happy we can be a local source of this valuable material while doing our part to lessen the burden on our landfills. So for us it's not just about the profits even though we must profit to stay in business of course.


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## leadarrows (May 26, 2004)

Here is one more picture of the grinder that shows some of the end product.


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## leadarrows (May 26, 2004)

mseneker said:


> Thanks for the reply concerning drywall recycle. I have to admit that I hope the green building trend does not impact the drywall trade. Not that I'm against protecting resources and nature. Drywall contractors rarely get paid the added cost of some changes in the market. For example, I'm doing a lot more of what had been a trim carpenters trade. Wrapping drywall around things we never did in the past. More archways, columns and stem wall tops in basements.
> 
> I would like to find a niche in green building that I can add value and get paid for. I'd like to recycle waste or at least point my clean up contractor to the recycle center and split he cost savings of him not hauling it to a dump.
> 
> ...


I am curious. Why would you believe if your clean-up contractor saved on his dump cost that you would be entitled to some of his savings? 
That would to my way of thinking be the same as if he bought a different truck that got better fuel mileage and you wanting him to split that savings with you.
How are you entitled to his savings? When you bid a job and somehow on that job you end up making more than you expected ...do you share the extras with him? 
If you pay his dump fees then I see it but if you have a set price....so much a foot to scrap like I get then I don't agree you should share in his savings. JMO. 

Demand for building green will come as each state enacts laws that are designed to encourage it. 


"Green building is a mind set, not just a collection of recycled products that you stick in a home. It starts with the site layout and includes almost every phase and element in the home's design, construction and finishes. It’s an integrated approach and careful thought must be given to the home as a "system". A 2000 study by the International Interior Designers Association showed that while 83% of designers believe they have a moral obligation to offer sustainable solutions to clients, only 37% do." 
Credit John Brooks..Lone Star Homes. 

http://johnbrooks.com/the_right_house.htm#

Look I am just an old farm boy trying to do my part. Here is a link to a builder that I cleaned the drywall scrapes out for. He is the President of the Indianapolis chapter of the green building association. 
Look through his site you will find he has much more information to offer than I do about building green. The house he shows on his home page is the first house we were involved with.


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## Milhaus (Feb 11, 2007)

Great post you two; I hadn't given drywall much thought with green building. Man - the market amazes me; albeit slow. I hope people continue to see the benefits and make the effort towards building sustainably. Most of the things we do in this industry can be recycled, reused, or disposed of in a better way (or not used). Green building IS a mindset. It is the right one. That's great to hear leadarrows. This post just made my day.

mark


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## Milhaus (Feb 11, 2007)

mesneker - you know of anyone that does handyman/jack of all trades work down there? I have a customer that has a son in the KC area. She lives here in Iowa, but wants to hire someone from down there. Any tips? She's got to be able to trust them, and she has a hell of a sense for character. 

mark


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## Tim0282 (Dec 11, 2007)

Interesting pictures, Leadarrows. Looks like your grinder does a good job of making the rock a nice powder. Is there an issue with the paper? Do you have to separate much before putting in the grinder? 
Our dump fee is 13.00 per ton. Rather cheap. But I do understand the problem we cause for adding to the landfill. We take a lot in a year.
Your system sounds interesting. Do you charge by the foot of rock or floor space or flat fee? You must work for a good number of rockers to keep flowing.


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## leadarrows (May 26, 2004)

Tim0282 said:


> Interesting pictures, Leadarrows. Looks like your grinder does a good job of making the rock a nice powder. Is there an issue with the paper? Do you have to separate much before putting in the grinder?
> Our dump fee is 13.00 per ton. Rather cheap. But I do understand the problem we cause for adding to the landfill. We take a lot in a year.
> Your system sounds interesting. Do you charge by the foot of rock or floor space or flat fee? You must work for a good number of rockers to keep flowing.


Drywall is about 93% gypsum and 7% paper. When we first brought this idea to the state they wanted us to strip the paper. A much more costly process.
After some research at my request they concluded that not only did the paper cause no problems it turned out the earth worms love it. Earth worms produce nitrogen and are the best aerators on the planet. So it turns out the paper is a bonus for this use. 
We keep the white board separate at the building site. We keep the green board to throw on the truck last so we can throw it off in our dumpster at the recycling center and we bag up the sweepings for disposal the same way. 
We get paid by the board foot to scrap the drywall. Roy's Recycling Inc. Charges a tonnage fee to receive the scrapes then charges a tonnage price for the gyp. 
We are currently servicing 4 drywall hanging companies and are looking for more. The four companies we have now service about 100 builders some off and on some regularly. We probably average 60 builders. 
Even with that many builders we are currently experiencing a slow period. 

I just sold all of the gyp I have in stock to one farmer, about 400 tons. He would have taken 4 times that amount if I had it available.


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## dryrocker27 (Dec 2, 2007)

anybody the attempt in the 80's to "go green" with drywall? 

recycled paper was fairly new and had alot of problems. Now all drywall board paper is from recycled paper as well as all the paper tape we use.

Remember when they tried to caulk the joints and just apply one coat of mud in an effort to save the earth.

I personally don't see any changes coming for quite a while. 

mseneker-i charge for each door/window i have to wrap. I make sure what i charge is equal to what the cost is for the carpenter to trim with wood. I charge $100.00 for each arched doorway/window, 50.00 for any columns


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## Capt-Sheetrock (Aug 8, 2007)

dryrocker27 said:


> anybody the attempt in the 80's to "go green" with drywall?
> 
> recycled paper was fairly new and had alot of problems. Now all drywall board paper is from recycled paper as well as all the paper tape we use.
> 
> ...


I agree!!!!

If you don't charge extra for wraping windows etc, you will be doing ALOT of that.

Next time you hear someone complaining about wrapping windows, ask em if they charge for it, most the time their answer is "no"

contractors are more than happy to let you shoot yourself in the foot


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## mseneker (Dec 22, 2007)

Sorry, should have told you we do pay the dump costs on our account regardless if one of my hourly employees does the cleanup or not. Many reasons behind that decision.




leadarrows said:


> I am curious. Why would you believe if your clean-up contractor saved on his dump cost that you would be entitled to some of his savings?
> That would to my way of thinking be the same as if he bought a different truck that got better fuel mileage and you wanting him to split that savings with you.
> How are you entitled to his savings? When you bid a job and somehow on that job you end up making more than you expected ...do you share the extras with him?
> * If you pay his dump fees then I see it but if you have a set price....so much a foot to scrap like I get then I don't agree you should share in his savings. JMO. *
> ...


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## mseneker (Dec 22, 2007)

Milhaus said:


> mesneker - you know of anyone that does handyman/jack of all trades work down there? I have a customer that has a son in the KC area. She lives here in Iowa, but wants to hire someone from down there. Any tips? She's got to be able to trust them, and she has a hell of a sense for character.
> 
> mark


I know a few handyman types but frankly would not recommend any of them at this point. I would be happy to refer you to individual trades however. If you want a good remodel person I can send you to some of my trusted customers.


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## mseneker (Dec 22, 2007)

One market potential for drywall contractors I think in time may be going out and getting professional building contractors on the customer list who specialize in "green building". For example, certain types of green building construction involves special care on the drywall companies part. The last very energy efficient house we worked on had special framing and special floor heating to work around. 

We hope the new customer will appreciate our ability to flow with the changes on the job site and special attention to detail. This last project had several change orders as a result of the builder and his customer modifying systems they were installing for the first time.

Hope that makes since.


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## leadarrows (May 26, 2004)

Sure it makes sense. We use rosin paper before the finish crews get there on radiant heated floors. It's a hassle but not as bad as not using it and it's not slick to walk on like plastic. The trick on clean-up is not to rip the paper up Helter-skelter. Fold it all from the sides and ends in each room and keep it all together in one square keeping all the crap inside. Keep it as dry as you can. Use some plastic where you mix your mud to help out there. Rosin paper as you know I am sure comes apart when wet.


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