# Contractors NOT returning phone calls



## kevinmckenzie (Sep 22, 2016)

There's this crazy cost/benefit thinking going on, where a contractor is trying to cherry pick which of his phone calls will yield him the best odds of a sale.

It's crazy logic, because 1 unanswered phone call can easily turn into a 1 star Yelp review for unprofessional practices. Always return phone calls!


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

If you owe me money I'll answer on the first ring!!!


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## DaVinciRemodel (Oct 7, 2009)

blacktop said:


> If you owe me money I'll answer on the first ring!!!


Who you kidding? You’d answer before it rang.


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## WalnutBuilders (Sep 24, 2016)

I try to return calls asap, but some times it takes 24 hours or so. 

I actually have concrete sub that is horrible about returning calls...like 3 days later bad. And the dude can't seem to keep an appointment either...we will set an appointment to have him look at a prospective job and he will cancel right before the scheduled time. 

He makes a ton of money from us too...and we pay the guy immediately, literally before he goes home on the final day. If not for his stellar work, I'd be looking for another sub.


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## Metro M & L (Jun 3, 2009)

Hes just focused on the job at hand. Everything else is secondary. If the concrete isnt right theres no fixing it.


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## Veronica494 (Sep 21, 2016)

I hear this from customers all the time, contractors not returning calls, or starting a job then disappearing for a while when they get their first payment. I remember when I was young, my parents went through like 6 different contractors on an old house they were trying to remodel. They'd always start off good for a week or so, then vanish or not return calls for a long time.

I think it's just lack of responsibility, or when they start a new job they're all gung-ho but get bored...or they get the first payment and decide to go on a drinking binge 

But you're right, a simple returned phone can make all the difference to a customer.


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## WalnutBuilders (Sep 24, 2016)

Veronica494 said:


> I hear this from customers all the time, contractors not returning calls, or starting a job then disappearing for a while when they get their first payment. I remember when I was young, my parents went through like 6 different contractors on an old house they were trying to remodel. They'd always start off good for a week or so, then vanish or not return calls for a long time.
> 
> I think it's just lack of responsibility, or when they start a new job they're all gung-ho but get bored...or they get the first payment and decide to go on a drinking binge
> 
> But you're right, a simple returned phone can make all the difference to a customer.




I can't imagine doing that...or experiencing it from the homeowner stand point. 

How can you stay in business if you aren't completing the job? Eventually, word would get around and you wouldn't be hired anymore...


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## robotnbr1 (May 30, 2014)

WalnutBuilders said:


> I can't imagine doing that...or experiencing it from the homeowner stand point.
> 
> How can you stay in business if you aren't completing the job? Eventually, word would get around and you wouldn't be hired anymore...



I agree with that! I have anxiety over telling a customer I'm taking a Friday off, or leaving early or coming late one day.


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## MrPower30 (Oct 8, 2016)

I have been trying to wrap my head around this forever! I still don't get it. Contractors that do this are basically saying they don't want the prospect's money. Don't get it.


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## MrPower30 (Oct 8, 2016)

NYgutterguy said:


> Since I had the website made I get calls from all over the place. If it's too far and sounds like a bs job I won't call or email back.
> 
> Wast of time calling back Mr Moore who lives an hour away and looking to have his gutters cleaned.
> 
> ...


I can definitely understand not calling someone back that sounds too far away.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

kevinmckenzie said:


> 1 unanswered phone call can easily turn into a 1 star Yelp review for unprofessional practices.


I have no idea what Yelp Is. and you can take that one star and... :whistling


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## wazez (Oct 25, 2008)

blacktop said:


> I have no idea what Yelp Is. and you can take that one star and... :whistling


Is that not when a dog cries out in pain?


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## FrankSmith (Feb 21, 2013)

This is why I try to answer. It's a one step deal. Answer and let them know you are slammed. 

Once you have to call them back at a minimum you have to check a message and then call. Thats two steps assuming they answer. Some times it goes on and on.


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## RangoWA (Jun 25, 2014)

kevinmckenzie said:


> It's crazy logic, because 1 unanswered phone call can easily turn into a 1 star Yelp review for unprofessional practices. Always return phone calls!


LOL, anyone that takes Yelp seriously is a fool. It's the equivelent of a bathroom wall in cyberspace. Anyone can say anything and they won't help unless you "advertise" with them. It's designed that way for a reason. I had one that claimed I told her husband to go eff themselves when he asked me my name. I've given up on that trash site.

Plus they can make all of you 5 star reviews go away. Anytime for any reason. It's gone all the way up to the 9th District Circuit court, as high as it can go besides the SCOTUS. Headquartered in San Fran, just like Yelp. I don't want the customers that kind of drive by spite would attract.

If it's a job I don't want I typically don't call back. Sometimes I do if I can refer someone but many times people have been rude for not wanting the work. If I had a secretary they'd all get called back but sometimes just too busy is the answer. I don't want to call someone and say I can't help them.


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## SectorSecurity (Nov 26, 2013)

I just had a guy call several times while I was on vacation and complain I wasn't returning his calls.

Had he bothered to listen to my message he would have known I said I will be on vacation from this time to this time and will return calls when I get back


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## kevinmckenzie (Sep 22, 2016)

RangoWA said:


> LOL, anyone that takes Yelp seriously is a fool. It's the equivelent of a bathroom wall in cyberspace.


No one loves Yelp, but it is a serious problem if you only have 1-star reviews there. They're shady as all get out, like you say, but contracting is just too competitive to have 1-star reviews anywhere. Believe it or not, most customers aren't nearly as suspicious of Yelp as we are.

You don't want to get bitten on any review platform, especially over something preventable with a quick call.

Answer your phone and save yourself the trouble!


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## RangoWA (Jun 25, 2014)

kevinmckenzie said:


> No one loves Yelp, but it is a serious problem if you only have 1-star reviews there. They're shady as all get out, like you say, but contracting is just too competitive to have 1-star reviews anywhere. Believe it or not, most customers aren't nearly as suspicious of Yelp as we are.
> 
> You don't want to get bitten on any review platform, especially over something preventable with a quick call.
> 
> Answer your phone and save yourself the trouble!


I don't think you understood. I don't want people that use smear sites. Period!


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## kevinmckenzie (Sep 22, 2016)

RangoWA said:


> I don't think you understood. I don't want people that use smear sites. Period!


I understand! That's a tall order, though - we ran a survey of about 1,000 homeowners, and 98% of them read online reviews before hiring a remodeler. Makes sense, it's an expensive purchase!

Ultimately, it's a good thing. You impress most your customers. If even a small handful of your happy customers review you, those reviews will get a lot of readership (at no cost to you!). 

All your business processes need to be oriented towards not making angry customers, though. That's why I jump onto threads like this, to point out how important it is to nail basic customer service like promptly returning calls.


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## RangoWA (Jun 25, 2014)

kevinmckenzie said:


> I understand! That's a tall order, though - we ran a survey of about 1,000 homeowners, and 98% of them read online reviews before hiring a remodeler. Makes sense, it's an expensive purchase!
> 
> Ultimately, it's a good thing. You impress most your customers. If even a small handful of your happy customers review you, those reviews will get a lot of readership (at no cost to you!).
> 
> All your business processes need to be oriented towards not making angry customers, though. That's why I jump onto threads like this, to point out how important it is to nail basic customer service like promptly returning calls.


Some people are born angry. I'm not in business to 
A. Fix people.
B. Support corrupt online businesses.

I don't know if you actually read the post of just go full auto for whatever your true motives are. BUT like I said, the only way to get help from Yelp, and probably others, is to pay them. I don't support crooks. 

It works out for us because the people that know those site are full of phony reviews, pro and con, call from the website. The people that don't know any better or care get to deal with the businesses dumb enough to pay an extortion racket.


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## kevinmckenzie (Sep 22, 2016)

RangoWA said:


> I don't know if you actually read the post of just go full auto for whatever your true motives are.


I read the post, and I'm not a robot. My only motive here is to help you market your business. 

You'll see me around, and I'm usually stumping on the value of online reviews. No ulterior motive there, that's just what motivates customers in 2016!

If you don't believe me, read my post right here on ContractorTalk's blogs: http://www.contractortalk.com/blogs/top-4-review-sites-for-contractors-and-2-to-avoid


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## RangoWA (Jun 25, 2014)

kevinmckenzie said:


> I read the post, and I'm not a robot. My only motive here is to help you market your business.
> 
> You'll see me around, and I'm usually stumping on the value of online reviews. No ulterior motive there, that's just what motivates customers in 2016!
> 
> If you don't believe me, read my post right here on ContractorTalk's blogs: http://www.contractortalk.com/blogs/top-4-review-sites-for-contractors-and-2-to-avoid


I didn't ask for your help and made it clear those are not the customers I want. Some online reviews are filled with garbage, I have personal experience and know of others first hand. Sounds like you have skin in the game.


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## kevinmckenzie (Sep 22, 2016)

RangoWA said:


> I didn't ask for your help and made it clear those are not the customers I want. Some online reviews are filled with garbage, I have personal experience and know of others first hand. Sounds like you have skin in the game.


Hey, run your company how you like. I'd recommend paying attention to customer feedback, but what do I know? :laughing:


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## kevjob (Aug 14, 2006)

yelp is absolute joke.... 

I have 3 1 star reviews all of them never hired my company. 2 are from husband and wife tag teaming me after I fired them for trying to get my costs on cabinets which they still owe me 1500 but claim they are suing me...still waiting 2.5 years late...:whistling

One was 2 weeks ago web inquiry and she didn't like that I charge more for one bathroom than she budgeted for 2!

Anyone who reads yelp to hire a contractor can hire someone else. It is a smear site for passive aggressive online self important knuckle heads.

I have given up with AL, BBB, yelp and all the other 3rd party jackleg sites. If someone won't call because of yelp I dodged a bullet. :thumbup:


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## FrankSmith (Feb 21, 2013)

kevinmckenzie said:


> Hey, run your company how you like. I'd recommend paying attention to customer feedback, but what do I know? :laughing:


Just and FYI. You come off like you hope to monetize your helpfulness in some way. Maybe you don't. Your delivery causes your message to get lost. 

On an unrelated note. I have never considered that not following up with people inquiring about work that I don't do could cause a bad review. If I have a relationship with someone and don't call back that is an issue. If I have a commitment to someone and don't all back that is an issue. I don't feel I need to call back everyone who calls. I don't call back people seeking me things I don't need. Should I be? I also don't call back people purchasing things I don't sell. If I call the local mechanic shop to get a price on preparing my furnace should I really expect someone to take the time out of their day to return my call? 

I feel answering your phone is a professional thing to do. Regardless if it means you personally or a person you have do that for you. Once a call is missed, I don't think a return call is required. I have never read a bad review because someone didn't call back in this manner.


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## RangoWA (Jun 25, 2014)

kevinmckenzie said:


> Hey, run your company how you like. I'd recommend paying attention to customer feedback, but what do I know? :laughing:


Apparently not much that differs from your formed opinion. But thanks for granting me permission to run my company how I like. I'd love to have your permission granted retroactively to cover the previous 32 years. 

You ignored everything I said. I don't value review sites for the reasons I mentioned, too much fraud and corruption these days. Those sites are created to line the pockets of the owners, not provide useful information to the public at large. 

You mentioned getting a possible one star rating from Yelp for simply not returning a phone call. You proved my point but you're apparently too arrogant to see it. Some calls are even decipherable, some are sales calls. You may not want to spend what precious time you have returning calls for work you have no interest in doing.

And last I checked being a business owner is not a societal agreement to be abused and held hostage to the lowest common denominator. In my opinion, those funding the review sites are part of the problem. People only have as much power as you allow them to have.


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## kevinmckenzie (Sep 22, 2016)

FrankSmith said:


> Just and FYI. You come off like you hope to monetize your helpfulness in some way. Maybe you don't. Your delivery causes your message to get lost.


Yikes, that is the opposite of my intended message. Sorry if I came off like I was looking to sell you guys anything. *I'm not trying to sell anything!* I've got nothing to sell you in any case. I do data analytics at one of the larger digital marketing agencies for the home improvement industry.

Only reason I'm even in this thread is that our partners have been dinged before with one-star reviews for not promptly answering phone calls. Thought I'd share that.


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## kevinmckenzie (Sep 22, 2016)

RangoWA said:


> Apparently not much that differs from your formed opinion.


So, we've surveyed home owners, we've studied the analytics of companies after they get reviews, we've studied state-level tax data compared to company's review scores. I've put a lot of thought into this, and I can tell you categorically that your online reviews matter. _Not my opinion, just something I've observed in a few different contexts.
_
I didn't mean to offend you by making that point, and I do mean it when I say 'do your own thing.' It's your business, do what you want with it.

But, this has left a bad taste in my mouth. I'm unsubscribing from this thread.


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## Unger.const (Jun 3, 2012)

I agree with rangowa that review sites are a disgusting racket for contractors. However I think he missed the professionalism part of the day.

And Frank too...

If you go and sit down at restaurant that serves pizza and you ask the waitress if they serve hamburgers. And she just turns and walks away and never returns to your table. Never says anything. Never stops by while delivering orders to others . How lonh would you wait before you got mad and left? Would you just think right away that she delt with your inquiry in a professional manner? 

Are you mad when people say things like contractors are a-holes?

If you're a roofing company how many times are you getting phone msgs about painting? Or if youre a framer how many calls are you getting to fix a toilet?

Chances are your company name isn't enough for them to understand what you dont do. So if your company is named XYZ remodelers how would they know that roofing isn't part of what you do? (Yes you and i know the difference but homeowners don't take classes on what contractors do so they call and ask)

Yesterday we had to clean the rental we just moved out of. And the Dyson vacuum came with a sample of cleaning product. So instead of wasting time on it I told the wife to look up online reviews to see if it worked or just another sucky thing you get with an expensive vacuum . Lots of people raved about it so used it. So why look at reviews when it's already in hand? I'm not going to buy it or not I already have it why not just try it to see if it works and then if not go buy something else? Because it's how things work now. I dont have time for trial and error if someone else used it to only find error.

People are built to go with the crowed. If most people grab a pitch fork and head to city hall others grab their pitch forks and join them. Like it or not it's how American culture works.

It use to be that if you put a blonde bimbo in a bikini on tv selling roofing toothpaste to make your roof shine.........people bought the product. Now a days I dont care how great the commercial I'm not buying it. But if I read where two dozen average Joe's reviewed it and said stupid name for a product but all the moss and mildew are gone in two days from their roofs. I might buy it then.

I dont like how some of the review sites hound us for money or else. But people do look at the reviews. Why put a permanent mark on your public record by not returning a call?


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## DaVinciRemodel (Oct 7, 2009)

I’m grabbing my pitch fork. Where do we meet-up?

I’m with Unger. 

Review sites suck,

I don’t like to be ignored,

It only takes a few minutes to be professional and personable.

So how’d the cleaning product work? :laughing:


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

Last season of South Park had an episode about "yelpers" that hit the nail right on the head. It was called "You're not yelping." I suggest everyone watch it.


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## RangoWA (Jun 25, 2014)

kevinmckenzie said:


> So, we've surveyed home owners, we've studied the analytics of companies after they get reviews, we've studied state-level tax data compared to company's review scores. I've put a lot of thought into this, and I can tell you categorically that your online reviews matter. _Not my opinion, just something I've observed in a few different contexts.
> _
> I didn't mean to offend you by making that point, and I do mean it when I say 'do your own thing.' It's your business, do what you want with it.
> 
> But, this has left a bad taste in my mouth. I'm unsubscribing from this thread.


You don't listen, that's the problem, you created your own bad taste. You can poll the population and find most of them believe in UFOs but that doesn't make it true or not. It just makes it a good database for those hawking UFO paraphernalia.

Some, maybe many do use review sites and see Yelp and some others as gospel. It isn't and I know first hand how corrupt it is. Now I'm supposed to somehow ignore it and favor your opinion because you have numbers? It doesn't work that way for me, sorry. 

I do not and never have tailored my business to serve everybody. I learned long ago that there's different strokes for different folks. For example, trying to convince someone that's just looking for the cheapest thing possible that they would be better served by investing in some quality work is usually a waste of time. I learned that from experience, not something I polled.

My only point to you was that I might be deserving of a one star review on Yelp for not returning a phone call. Now, I don't know how you make you living, you sound like a desk jockey but yesterday is a good example.

I repaired the siding and trim on a rotting shed. It was freezing when I started and so hot I thought I was going to pass out at the end. I busted my butt like I usually do but there were some circumstances that made the work challenging. Plus, I had to get it all primered in case it rained last night or today. I saved the guy a bundle by figuring out a good solution while I easily could have maximized the deal for me. It's what I usually do.

When I got home I was so exhausted I couldn't even totally empty my truck. I brought in the expensive tool and left the rest hoping for the best. I didn't listen to or answer any of the phones calls I got with some leaving messages. So I come here and have to find out how unprofessional I am from a desk jockey that has analytics to demonstrate the superiority of his wisdom with his dataset and polling research? Well, excuse me for not caring a whole bunch.

I'll take that one star rating from Yelp by some drive by loon, it's never "they didn't return my call", it's more like "the guy answering cursed my husband out for asking his name", which btw is advertised in full along with a bio right on my website. It makes no sense so if someone were to give it any credence then good riddance, we're both better off.


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## RangoWA (Jun 25, 2014)

Unger.const said:


> I agree with rangowa that review sites are a disgusting racket for contractors. However I think he missed the professionalism part of the day.
> 
> I dont like how some of the review sites hound us for money or else. But people do look at the reviews. Why put a permanent mark on your public record by not returning a call?


And you are entitled to your opinion. I don't want to participate in a corrupt system. If in your eyes that makes one unprofessional then you and I differ greatly on what that means. 

If someone publicly slanders you because you didn't return their call and you pay the website to take care of the problem, you are part of the problem, not part of the solution.


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## blueskyglass (May 8, 2014)

There are a lot of people including contractors that do not like confrontation or bad news. So they don't respond if they don't feel comfortable. They create a bad name for themselves and elevate contractors that communicate well. Their loss is our gain. It is of course a shame but is human nature.

Rod
Blue Sky Glass
Seattle


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## Unger.const (Jun 3, 2012)

RangoWA said:


> And you are entitled to your opinion. I don't want to participate in a corrupt system. If in your eyes that makes one unprofessional then you and I differ greatly on what that means.
> 
> If someone publicly slanders you because you didn't return their call and you pay the website to take care of the problem, you are part of the problem, not part of the solution.


Oh noooo. I dont pay any of those sites. And i hope to never have yelp reviews (id like to stay off rhe radar there) but i do make alot of money from another review website and still refuse to pay for their "deal".


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## Big Shoe (Jun 16, 2008)

I've always returned every single call I've ever got.................


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## Metro M & L (Jun 3, 2009)

Both of them? Good on you Shoe!


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## Unger.const (Jun 3, 2012)

Good one.


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## RangoWA (Jun 25, 2014)

Unger.const said:


> Oh noooo. I dont pay any of those sites. And i hope to never have yelp reviews (id like to stay off rhe radar there) but i do make alot of money from another review website and still refuse to pay for their "deal".


I never asked Yelp be on their site. They snag you off the internet, then if you get any negative reviews the game is on.

I had one guy lie about our phone conversion and post a one star "review" because he was angry that I was unwilling to drive over and give him a free estimate. I contacted Yelp and told them it was a lie. A few days later a gal from them called and asked if I wanted to advertise. I explained they were publishing a lie about us and no way would I fork over any money.

A few days later she called back and said the problem was taken care of. And sure enough it was gone. She had asked about advertising again but the rates were too high, I didn't ask for it and don't need it so I declined. They have not helped with any other drive by slander posts so I quit going there trying to defend myself. 

The internet makes it easy to communicate but not everyone has something worthwhile to offer.


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## TBM (Oct 13, 2016)

I take a phone call as someone saying hey I want to give you money. It's stupidity not to answer phone calls. Even tho sometime i just want it smash it with a hammer and then sent through a table saw, answering a phone call is the only way your business will stay afloat. If your having a problem with a business not answer simply dont call anymore and call someone else next time. They will soon be calling you and they will be taught.


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## RangoWA (Jun 25, 2014)

Can you translate that into English? Thanks.


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## Andrew32 (Oct 19, 2016)

I've heard it many times also. "I've called 5 different guys and I can't even get a call back". I know it gets busy and we all hate the tire kickers but I've set aside 30 - 45 minutes at the end of the day to ensure I get back to everyone. Some have already gotten what they need from elsewhere and that is ok with me. If I make that call back in the first 12 hours, I've tried to do my part to help them and most of the customers are appreciative of that.

I'm hoping to get a little more help in the administration side of the house but until then, this is the best I can do.


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