# new pan on concrete - rebuild



## fortwayne (Nov 27, 2010)

I started an install yesterday of a new shower in the place of an old shower. Old was handicap, no curb, built into the slab during the pour. 
During sale process no mold or mildew was visible. Old was standard 4.25/4.25 white florida tile walls, 1/1 floor. 
Rip out exposed denshield walls 2/3 of the way up, green board to the ceiling. Green board had no mold, denshield on the other hand did. Mold hadnt migrated through, but was on its way. 
The pan itself is the question. After ripping the one by ones off, we found the pan soaked. So wet that it will soak into your knees without knee pads. 
I assume this is because there doesnt appear to be a weep seal drain in place, but i cant tell for sure without tearing the pan out. Hence the dilemia - to demo the pan or not. 
There is a pvc liner in place and looks to be doing its job, but the wet pan has me spooked. 
I have a ton of pics if anyone wants to see em. Most just prove why no one should ever ever use denshield in a shower, but my provide clues on the soaked pan as well. 
Tomorrow we are going to rip the pan unless yaall can give me a reason to save it.


----------



## Evan1968 (Dec 5, 2010)

Plugged weep holes maybe??


----------



## JazMan (Feb 16, 2007)

Go ahead and post the pictures, might be useful. The DensShield was probably not installed the way GP wants it done. Of course I think the way they want it done is silly and very few are likely to be installed correctly. (You have to find their specs for shower walls.) 

I agree the weep holes may be plugged, and I'll bet there is no slope under the membrane. You're not gonna correct it unless you start over.

Jaz


----------



## jarvis design (May 6, 2008)

I have been renovating bathrooms in Ontario for over 20 years. I have probably ripped out 150-200 tile showers in that time. I have NEVER seen a pan that was not saturated nor have I ever seen weep holes. 
Yes, we have the same TCNA books as you guys in the States...but, no one has ever (or does to this day) put weeping holes in mud beds and obviously, no preslope (no sense I guess!)

And don't even get me started as to what is behind the wall tile!


----------



## PlasmaGuy (Jul 21, 2007)

*Pictures*

I enjoy seeing some pictures.

Preslope and slope. I am relatively new to shower pans. My experience has been using Ultraset to seal, followed by the mud bed.

Can the pre-slope be skipped and achieve the finish product in one step?


----------



## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

PlasmaGuy said:


> Can the pre-slope be skipped and achieve the finish product in one step?


Pre-slope can be skipped if you are using a waterproofing membrane over the pan and a Kerdi-Drain.


----------



## loumatt (Nov 7, 2010)

I wonder if the poured concrete doesn't allow water to migrate to the drain easily like the drier sharp sand & portland mix.


----------



## K_Tile (Feb 10, 2006)

angus said:


> Pre-slope can be skipped if you are using a waterproofing membrane over the pan and a Kerdi-Drain.


A regular drain with the "divot method" can be used as well.


----------



## Frankwhoa (Oct 20, 2010)

angus242 said:


> Pre-slope can be skipped if you are using a waterproofing membrane over the pan and a Kerdi-Drain.


You can also use a traditional clamp style drain if you reinforce the area around the drain. RedGard requires a 12x12 mesh. Not sure what Laticrete or any other calls for


----------



## Bud Cline (Feb 12, 2006)

> You can also use a traditional clamp style drain if you reinforce the area around the drain.


Can you explain that technique please? Which Handbook is that in? I'm not familiar with the method.



> RedGard requires a 12x12 mesh.


Can you also explain that technique? Which Handbook is that in? My mind isn't comprehending the 12X12 mesh either. What am I missing?

Might also want to verify which liquid membranes can be used for shower pans and which ones don't qualify. I don't know off hand but not all of them will work.

Laticrete's 9235 will work and maybe their Hydroban will also.


----------



## Frankwhoa (Oct 20, 2010)

Bud Cline said:


> Can you explain that technique please? Which Handbook is that in? I'm not familiar with the method.
> 
> 
> Can you also explain that technique? Which Handbook is that in? My mind isn't comprehending the 12X12 mesh either. What am I missing?
> ...


Yes Bud, RedGard specs that you can get online from Custom Building Products website details how to adhere/reinforce the drain flange using a 12" x 12" mesh tape/sheet. It also states it on the bucket in the instructions section.

Also, attached is the TCNA 2008 for applied liquid membranes (which RedGard qualifies as). This one along with the RedGard (which is approved as a shower pan liner by the IMPO also stated on the product itself) is the technique that has been approved here in Louisiana by the Board of Health and Hospitals.


----------

