# Need for a professional timber faller?



## MacTimber (Jun 8, 2018)

Hi all, Im new here. Basically im considering starting a side gig as a professional timber faller and was wondering if there was a need for such a service among heavy equip businesses, most likely excavating companies.

Now Im not Joe Schmoe with a chainsaw. Im an experienced faller with pro-grade saws, insurance, and ability to directionally fall timber. Im not a tree company, im much less expensive ($40/hr, 3hr min, clock starts when i start sawing, no travel or hidden fees).

The reason im asking here is that this would be a side hustle and im trying to do some market research. Im a career wildland firefighter and want to make money of my skillset during my off season and free time. Im not a tree climber or trying to start my own forestry business. I want to cut trees for what I think Im worth (based on my govt saw qualifications and hourly rates in the logging industry).

Does this sound like a service youd be interested it?


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## tgeb (Feb 9, 2006)

Location might help a person decide if they would use your services.


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

Location is very important.

But site conditions are way more important.

I live in prime timber country.

Some sites need a timber faller some don't.

With insurance sounds like you are working pretty cheap.

Do you offer a package deal where you can provide the owner with a saw log sale to offset costs?


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## Peter_C (Nov 26, 2014)

As an owner of a Certified Tree Farm, I would say most operations are using feller buncher's for cutting these days, EXCEPT on steep ground where a yarder is needed. Old growth would be another reason for hand logging but hopefully that isn't happening anymore. Should always leave the biggest healthiest trees for propagation. 



I would recommend getting with a yarder operation and see if they have any openings. Or maybe even a helicopter logging operation. 



Good luck


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

Keep in mind, logging insurance doesn't usually allow you to fell within some distance of a building. Check your insurance to see what it covers.

I'd pay $100 an hour for an arborist to work around buildings.


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## MacTimber (Jun 8, 2018)

Okay, so Im located in western Montana.

Selling the logs would more be the job of a logging contractor (who has a skidder, loader, etc). Im just the chainsaw operator.

I also agree that feller bunchers are the way to go for logging these days, but Im trying to see if there's a need for a faller for site prep, etc where only a few acres need to be cleared. A good faller even at $50/hr for a week is probably cheaper than a feller buncher for a day. A lot of homeowners around me also do not like heavy equip tearing up their lawns, etc. Though the point of my research here is to see if heavy equip businesses might occasionally need a good sawyer.

Im also confident in my burning abilities, i.e. burning the slash. So maybe I could work with a excavator contractor to cut, pile, and burn all the trees/debris on a homesite? Seems silly, but burning is a popular method for getting rid of woody debris in my area. Logs, unless they're big logs (18"+) or lots of logs (10+ acres), trees are probably better off being burnt or sold for firewood. The fuel to get equip on site and the logs out of the woods and to the mill pretty much destroys profit for logging any smaller property.

And I don't have insurance set up yet. Id probably go with Tree Removal insurance so Im covered cutting around homes. I also plan on learning to climb a little so I can take on simple removals. Might seem like a classic internet case of, "sonny, go work for an outfit and learn the ropes" but I must re-emphasize that Im an experienced faller/woodsworker and am a career employee in Fire for the USFS. I also fail to see how I could get into an insurance claim situation over felling and making some logs out of the trees a few times a year at building sites.

And finally, $40/hr does seem low the more I think about it. But maybe I should charge that rate to get a couple jobs? The whole goal is to develop a 20-30 day/year side hustle that I enjoy and can make some decent money on. I currently work as a wildland firefighter and work 2000hrs every summer. It would be nice to not have to rely on Overtime so much. Ive worked for a contractor(s) as a sawyer for about 5 years now in the off season. They specialize in fire mitigation work (thinning around homes). That's fine and all, but my saw qualifications for the government command $36/hr+ and those guys are paying me more like $20/hr and I have to buy and maintain my own $1400 chainsaws.


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## Peter_C (Nov 26, 2014)

As you said to move a piece of heavy equipment onsite costs a fortune. Our logger leaves his heavy equipment onsite 365 days a year, only removing it for major maintenance. He owns all his own low boys, trucks, etc. and the costs are still high. We are getting hit with a pretty good fuel surcharge as prices are up over a dollar a gallon from last year. 

Smaller tracts that require thinning are an option. Burning slash is fine and dandy, but there comes a point heavy equipment is needed. Yes I do not know all about hand carrying dropped and bucked trees uphill all too well. Butt kicker is a good description. Slash burning is NOT something you are going to want to do anywhere near a house. Our Forrester once lost control of a fire while burning slash. It can happen to even the most experienced. They cover the slash piles in Tyvek or a tarp and wait until the snow has fallen or at least until after some heavy rains. 

Learning to climb trees throws a whole other level of danger in. It IS one of the worlds most dangerous jobs. I had been climbing with ropes for years in caves and on rock, before throwing a chainsaw into the mix. A tree close to a house many are comfortable dropping in one shot I look at and climb, taking it down in pieces. Gotta buck it anyway right? I love watching Youtube videos of people smashing their prized possessions with trees LOL Climbing requires a decent amount of gear $,$$$ minus saws. Two people are mandatory, not only for safety, but there are times when a Speedline, or pulley rigged drops are needed. You would be right in wanting to work with an established crew to learn the ropes so to speak. Great book: Tree Climbers Companion. I reference when needed, but have read it cover to cover. 

https://www.amazon.com/Tree-Climber...1771&sr=8-1&keywords=tree+climber's+companion

If you already are a sawyer for the USFS you should be pretty good at land clearing. Whacking brush back and taking forests down to bare dirt being super important in fire zones is something more and more people are waking up too...at least in California and Oregon! A way to get jobs would be to drive down rural roads (Create a flyer and/or business cards) and talk to homesteads that appear to be in need of your services. Hit them with their worst fears, loosing everything! Sell it as fire prevention. Take every damn bush down around the house. I learned a lot during and after the Tubbs Fire, and so many houses would not have burned had it not been for a fence or a small bush up against the house. 

Number one thing when talking to people about what you do...ask for a referral. "Do you know anyone that would want land cleared?" "Could you please put me on the phone with them?" NOW is the time to talk to their friends as once you leave your chances of that referral go down 60%. Introductions from their friends in person or over the phone are the way to go. Next door neighbor of a current client..."Lets go say hi". The neighbor you are working for should have it in their best interest to clear ALL surrounding properties. 

FWIW most line loggers are super busy and you should try getting with them for spring/fall/winter work. Just because there is snow on the ground won't stop them from working as in many ways it makes it easier, and the roads aren't muddy causing them to be destroyed. 

In many ways logging is a dying industry. The stud mill nearest our farm is closing due to low profits, caused by ancient machinery. Hand logging has been mostly replaced by machinery. Hmmm...have you considered becoming an equipment operator? Something to be said for working in a forest. Where else do you have to carry a loaded firearm for protection from the wolves, mamma bear, and mountain lions? Montana does sound nice to me.


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## dayexco (Mar 4, 2006)

griz said:


> With insurance sounds like you are working pretty cheap.


yup


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