# York furnace-pilot light will not stay lit....



## PrestigeR&D (Jan 6, 2010)

She is still running great....no problems......:clap:

I have gone to check on it ,now and then...while its cycling , just to make sure all is well......



Just a little paranoid.....:laughing:


Thanks,


B,


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Did you get your money back for the module?


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## PrestigeR&D (Jan 6, 2010)

Yes...........:thumbsup:

not everyone can do that......:whistling....:laughing:...


B,


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Thanks for posting. Just had a service call in which the I had power to the module, but no spark. Dinked around, and took the th wire (hot wire in this case) and hit the main valve and pilot valve terminals. Viola, system sparked and fired up. Going to replace the valve, as I inspected the terminals and soldering points on the module, and all appears clean.


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## Tom M (Jan 3, 2007)

Flash I was told that modern gas is cleaner and drip legs were not needed as much because it has less sediment. I am curious if their is any relevance to sticky gas valves.


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## hvactech_1 (Dec 15, 2012)

Tom, I'm going to say you should always have a drip leg, sediment can come from the interior walls of the piping depending on the type you used- whether its natural gas or propane!


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## Tom M (Jan 3, 2007)

I would want it regardless myself. The inside of black pipe can not doubt cause problems. Its new CSST installations that got my attention. If there was no drip then is the fuel still dirty enough to clog a gas valve.


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## Dr Heat (Dec 25, 2008)

The IMC does not mention a dirt leg, to my memory it never has. The installation guide however does; and, anything required in the installers guide is required by the code.


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## hvactech_1 (Dec 15, 2012)

CSST also needs to be bonded same as an electric panel here, local code.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Tom M said:


> Flash I was told that modern gas is cleaner and drip legs were not needed as much because it has less sediment. I am curious if their is any relevance to sticky gas valves.


My answer is no. But, that doesn't mean "no" is set in stone. Funny you mention that though. I figure that it has something to do with the electrical coil in the valves. Reason being, the valves work will open and close alright after they receive a "jolt". 

Funny, it takes a couple of weeks before , I finally figure out where you were going. Hmmph, maybe I shouldn't go be going to peoples homes to figure out what is wrong with their system.


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## Tom M (Jan 3, 2007)

My first thought was sediment in the coils of the gas valves were causing them to stick...Tapping on them opens them up would kinda verify that.

I have some general background for mechanical but not much product knowledge since I dont install. Sometimes I will talk to some HVAC guys come on the job site and when I ask them a question not many know how to answer it. New construction guys tend not to design or spec the system, they just install or assemble components. They dont have as good of a grasp on the operation of each thing as a guy who troubleshoots. Anytime I ever run a troubleshoot question by them their first words are just change the parts. 

As a business perspective I imagine spending an hour or so tinkering around with an old part may not justify your time and future hassle if it. So just replacing it is a safer bet.
Dont take any offense when I inquiry, I enjoy learning.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

No offense taken, questions like those you post, or Prestige's post are items that make this site a beneficial teaching aid for those of us in the field. Still think it's an electrical thing, but, making sure there is a drip leg while replacing the valve would be prudent.


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## PrestigeR&D (Jan 6, 2010)

I guess the problem decided to come back .......no heat....


Same thing , pilot lights up for a split second /click from the gas valve then nothing....tried pulling the wires again (magical cures)- nothing....


I'm leaning towards replacing the gas valve.....I was reading something on another forum to test the terminals on the valve, if there is an open then apparently it's shot....?

Any suggestions?





B,


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

I should have suggested that you make sure you have a good ground. How many volts between neutral & ground. There should be zero volts. If there is voltage, check out the grounding.


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## Railman (Jan 19, 2008)

I'm not a heating guy, but I've had to replace two gas valves on 2 of 3 of my unit heaters. They get full of garbage, & restrict the flow of gas. 
Mine were only about $65 or so online. The first one I bought local, but local won't sell to me anymore because I don't have a license. So I just bought second one online.

If the gas passage is restricted in the valve, the output pressure would be ok, but could drop under flow, as in when it's called for demand.

You might try looking inside the valve to clean obstructions.
Joe


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## PrestigeR&D (Jan 6, 2010)

Hey guys...

Thank you very much for trying to help me out, good people.....:thumbsup: 


I had an interesting 19 hrs........
Might just be me, but- for some reason ,as I am aging, I am not handling disappoints to well, I mean somewhat major.......

Like no heat, watching the weather forecast ,it's 23 degrees outside. I find myself staring out the window,.....just thinking, it may be the same temperature in here ,in just a few hrs,.........

I'm feeling a shift in my behavior..........

It's time to shift gears.....

Hey, I have a brilliant idea......

What do ya say we shift into ...."Panic mode".....


Like I said,....it may be me getting older, less tolerable to things I may, or may not be able to resolve....not handling a crisis mode to well lately...


...what do I do!!!,.....who do I call,....why is this happening to me..,....



Temps dropping.......(a little faster than I anticipated.)..


But all is well.....

Got up out of bed (didnt sleep- i found myself very paranoid) ,......to a nice toasty 42deg. , ......:clap: 


Gas valves seemed to consume my mind last night,.........

Then came the ignition modular.....



Or ......



The electronic ignotor (mr. Sparky)........

There may be more.....write....:thumbup: ,it's all good.......

BS,.....Who am I kidding...

No!.....things are not good.!..,,who am I fooling...




Ok,....couple hrs go by....Trying to get a grip on everything...

I settled down....wait it out...make some ice cubes on my desk, smoke a stogie, grab some joe,,,,,

Sometimes......ahhhhh.......I don't know about myself....


Anyways,...

Got on the horn with Brian from VP supply at 7:00am,, told me to run a test on the igniter- all is good,...
Then we get to the ignition module, has me measure the voltage of the PV and the MV.......

PV is around 19.00-fluctuating , the MV 10.86,7.53,3.25....then up again...?

So the ignition module was acting strangely ....
Went to vp , picked up the unit,,,,,,"universal" unit.....

Hooked it all up......

And guess what happened , to my surprise and bewilderment,,,..........


Absolutely nothing......::clap:

Here are the terminals on the original ignition modual: S8600H/1048

-MV 
-MV/PV 
-PV
-GND
Blank
-24V(GND)
-TH-W(OPT)- blank (no terminal)
-Blank
-SPARK


So I purchased the universal ignition module:S8610U (Honeywell)

Pretty much the same, with the exception the :Th-W) slot has a clip,.....
Well ,....
After some conversation with Brian while trying different options, he says take the hot lead (24V) ,hook that up to (24V ground ) then hook the (24V GND) into the (TH-W).....turned it on hoping for a positive outcome,,,,


"zap......repeated.....pilot light.......stays on.....things are looking up.....then. "WHOOSH"....flame!!!!!!?......


What is the deal with hooking a hot 24v to a terminal that clearly is stated "24V-GND".........?


$147.37......and some mind altering revaluations about yourself....


Thanks again gents...:thumbsup:


all is good.........


For now........to be continued..........


B,


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

For starters, at this point, I would think your buddy could recommend a good hvac guy to look at the furnace. Too much drama. Bad grounds can cause weird things with ignition systems, and at this point that is what I would check out. It's quick, easy, and would be nice if that was the root of all this malarky.

I had a similar situation once, and had a reading of 110 between neutral and ground. Upon further investigation, I saw that the house was re-plumbed with pex, and the section of pipe that the ground was clamped to was just laying in the crawlspace.

As for the lack of tolerance when things go amuck, take it easy, smoke another stogie, I don't think things get easier in time. It's always something, that's one of the constants that we can depend upon. Hang in there.


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## PrestigeR&D (Jan 6, 2010)

Thanks flash,...

No, I know .....things have been a little hectic ....just venting

Brian is a sales rep for VP. -parts. HVAC ...good guy:thumbsup: I wanted to try and fix it myself, if I knew what was wrong,.....that is what the problem was,,,,

Just glad that's over...and I really appreciate the input you and the others have offered.....seriously.,

:thumbsup:



B,


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

PrestigeR&D said:


> I'm having someone I know coming out tomorrow,.....
> 
> If I attempt to fix this,....it would be like throwing darts , blindfolded ...
> 
> ...


I fixed my heater by whacking it 3 times with a piece of plywood. I'll be right over B,


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Hey Prestige, what was the final outcome?


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## PrestigeR&D (Jan 6, 2010)

It was the ignition modual , I checked the voltage to the seliniod on the gas valve,....I was getting some low voltage to the MV , 7-10vlts, fluctuated around there- no where near 24vltz...
So the original problem I had came back .......

But,...All is good now with the new modual..:thumbup:



Thanks,


B,


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