# working with limestone tile



## orson (Nov 23, 2007)

Alright, I need a translation here. The text is from a Taunton book, the author of this section is Tom Meehan.

He's speaking about doing a floor and shower in 12x12 limestone tile

"Once the tile had been sealed and dried 24 hours, I grouted in pretty much the same way I do for most other tiles, raking the grout in diagonal strokes across the grout joints to ensure that they get completely filled. When I'm grouting limestone, though, I try not to spread or cover more than 40 SF to 50 SF at a time. If any places in the grout joint did not get sealer, the grout could cure too quickly, making it difficult to work and also reducing its strength."

What does he mean by not cover more than 40 to 50 SF at a time? What does he do after that 40 to 50 SF, stop until the grout dries?

www.rubycon.us
Ruby Construction LLC 
Lancaster Kitchen Remodeling
Lancaster Bathroom Remodeling


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## Bill_Vincent (Apr 6, 2005)

No-- he goes back and washes what he has spread. Once that area is finished, then he spreads the next section. The problem is that as I said above. some linestones will literally suck the moisture right out of the grout, just like Saltillo tile (Mexican terra cotta). As soon as the grout float hits the tile, it's like all of the sudden, someone slams on the brakes. That's the reason for sealing the tiles first, and then taking it a bit at a time, because even sealed, they tend to suck the grout dry pretty quickly.

Atleast you have a pretty good source. Tom Meehan is one of the more knowledgeable people in the industry.  I'd put him right up there with Mike Byrne and Dave Gobis.


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## orson (Nov 23, 2007)

Thanx Bill, I thought that was what he meant but in the next section he talks about not washing the grout off for a couple of days and I got confused. He must have just meant the final cleaning.

www.rubycon.us
Ruby Construction LLC 
Lancaster Kitchen Remodeling
Lancaster Bathroom Remodeling


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## Bill_Vincent (Apr 6, 2005)

That's exactly what he meant.


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## orson (Nov 23, 2007)

I forget where I read it but someone said to use only unsanded grout on limestone due to the possibility of scratching. Anyone concur or disagree w/ that one?

www.rubycon.us
Ruby Construction LLC 
Lancaster Kitchen Remodeling
Lancaster Bathroom Remodeling


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## Bill_Vincent (Apr 6, 2005)

I disagree. The ONLY thing that determines whether or not you use sanded grout is the size of the grout joint. No exceptions. Under 1/8", unsanded. 1/8" or more, sanded. Period.


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## MattCoops (Apr 7, 2006)

Actually on *polished* limestone and travertine *sanded* grout *may *leave swirly scratchy marks that are almost impossible to get rid of.


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## Bill_Vincent (Apr 6, 2005)

Ive heard that before. But then I remember back to when I was doing commercial work, and we were grouting by floating, and then using dry grout and a buffing machine with burlap on the bottom of the brush to clean the excess grout off the face. Never left a single mark. I've had this same argument with John Bridge and some of the others at his forum, as well. I know what I've seen though, and if buffing with DRY sanded grout under power wouldn't scratch it, certainly a grout float and wet grout won't.


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## orson (Nov 23, 2007)

Next question....I was reading a taunton book called renovating a bathroom and I was reading about forming a shower pan. (author is Tom Meehan again) He explains the whole process very nicely and lots of nice pictures, but he never explains what he does with the curb. He wraps the membrane up the inside of the curb and onto the top of the curb and nails it down through the top. Then he finishes his mud pan over the membrane. In the illustration they show that the inside of the shower is going to have cement backerboard nailed over it, but that you are not supposed to nail below the level of the threshold(curb). How do you attatch backerboard to the inside edge of the threshold if you are not supposed to nail through below the top of the threshold?

www.rubycon.us
Ruby Construction LLC 
Lancaster Kitchen Remodeling
Lancaster Bathroom Remodeling


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## MattCoops (Apr 7, 2006)

It *may*, and why take that chance?
At the least, inform the customer that the sanded grout may cause scratchy markes on a polish finish tile.




> I know what I've seen though, and if buffing with DRY sanded grout under power wouldn't scratch it, certainly a grout float and wet grout won't.


You can actually take a rock to another rock and rub til your hands hurt and the two rubbed surfaces will shine. But I wouldn't take a rock and rub the surface of a polished stone tile.


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## kevjob (Aug 14, 2006)

orson said:


> Next question... top of the curb and nails it down through the top. How do you attatch backerboard to the inside edge of the threshold if you are not supposed to nail through below the top of the threshold?


dont nail anything to inside or top of curb you need to use metal lathe and mud the curb.


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## MattCoops (Apr 7, 2006)

but kevjob,

you surely need to overlap your curb with a waterproof membrane.

How can you wrap curb in a lath without penetrating the membrane?


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## Bill_Vincent (Apr 6, 2005)

MattCoops said:


> You can actually take a rock to another rock and rub til your hands hurt and the two rubbed surfaces will shine. But I wouldn't take a rock and rub the surface of a polished stone tile.


Huh???? Where'd that come from?


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## MattCoops (Apr 7, 2006)

straight from the mule's mouth.


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## MattCoops (Apr 7, 2006)

Bud Cline said:


> That's more like a buck-fifty!
> 
> Limestone is my favorite of all natural stone tiles to work with. It can be cut and tooled and shaped to do anything you want it to do. You'll love it. The only slight drawback may be that it could have a higher mortality rate than you are used to with ceramic.:thumbsup:



The reason why *quarry tile* is my favorite to work with is because you can almost get ever color and size they sell in bullnose, cove base, corner pieces, and other attractive details. No need for metal strips on your tile job.
And the reaon why they call quarry tile so, is not because it is "quarried" from a quarry, it's because when it was first introduced it was produced small, in a form similar to 1" - 2" "mosaics", as they are called now sometimes.
And believe me, quarry tile is as tough as nails.
Try taking a hammer to a quarry tile job laid over an inch and a quarter of portland and sand.


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## Bud Cline (Feb 12, 2006)

I don't get it!


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## MattCoops (Apr 7, 2006)

And you never will "Bud"


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## Bill_Vincent (Apr 6, 2005)

How does quarry tile have ANYTHING to do with this thread at all?

I don't get it, etiher.


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## MattCoops (Apr 7, 2006)

Quarry tile was originally small.
Now it's in virtually every good commercial kitchen known to man.

The Marine Corps barracks in Yuma, AZ have gray Dal Tile quarry tile in 6" flavor in the shower receptors and shower wall partitions. And the outside mortar walls are painted canary yellow with indian red stripings.
And yes, we did install a pre slope with a 12' waterproof membrane made by MAPEI'.


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## Bill_Vincent (Apr 6, 2005)

That's changing, though. I was going all over NEw England and New York a few years ago doing fast food and restaurant chains, and several of them are going to porcelian. One in particular-- that's all they'll use now is Crossville's either Crosstread or Crossdot tiles.


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## K_Tile (Feb 10, 2006)

For some reason I'm craving Wendy's!


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## Bill_Vincent (Apr 6, 2005)

Be my guest! I won't ever crave Wendys again!!


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## MattCoops (Apr 7, 2006)

Bill_Vincent said:


> That's changing, though. I was going all over NEw England and New York a few years ago doing fast food and restaurant chains, and several of them are going to porcelian. One in particular-- that's all they'll use now is Crossville's either Crosstread or Crossdot tiles.


I like the product made by Crossville. And I like their "sales persons" attitude. They really know how to shake their hips.

But Dal Tile by far, as always, and forever will be, the best manufacturer of quarry tile.


Another thing. Bill, in new england, there are no Marind Corps bases, that's why they are using strictly porcelain, or what I call, China.

The reason why I call porcelain China, is because it breaks when you drop it.


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## Bill_Vincent (Apr 6, 2005)

That's only cuz marines can't handle the cold!!   

GO NAVY!!


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