# Buying a diesel



## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

builder2345 said:


> No idling over 15 mins? why is that?
> Thanks


When a diesel idols they don't produce a lot of heat, when they aren't up to temp they suffer from incomplete combustion. Hence why they have very little power when cold. This can cause residual fuel to wash the cylinders and cause excessive wear as well as contamination. 

So there is no hard and fast rule about idling over 15 min, you should keep it to a minimum.


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## TimNJ (Sep 7, 2005)

Pretty sure it was 6.0.
I'm on an RV site with all the guys bragging about their tow vehicles, and even the loyal Ford guys admit it was a time bomb.

I will double check though.

The "new" diesel problem seems to be with injector pumps.
Ford and GM use CP4 which has rare catastrophic problems, while Ram still uses reliable CP3.

The RV site is a pretty good source of info since everybody with a truck uses it to tow so they are a worked hard. You just have to wade through the brand loyalty wars that erupt between the big three.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

hdavis said:


> Gum up the EGR valve, and it can go lean. Temps rise, and bad things happen.


That's also a valid point. The EGR closes at idle because if it was open it would idle like a heap of crap. Naturally the EGR is a problematic POS that can stick shut.

Temp doesn't rise though.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

TimNJ said:


> Pretty sure it was 6.0.
> I'm on an RV site with all the guys bragging about their tow vehicles, and even the loyal Ford guys admit it was a time bomb.
> 
> I will double check though.
> ...


The 6.0 was a POS.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

TimNJ said:


> Pretty sure it was 6.0.
> I'm on an RV site with all the guys bragging about their tow vehicles, and even the loyal Ford guys admit it was a time bomb.


This very much depends on the year. There were a lot of design changes over the years.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

Inner10 said:


> Temp doesn't rise though.




"
Pumping exhaust (EGR) back into the engine helps to cool the combustion chamber because EGR has almost no oxygen in it. Without oxygen, the temperature stays below the NOx-producing threshold, and the emissions coming out the tailpipe are cleaner. 
"

http://www.trucktrend.com/cool-trucks/1501-1985-dodge-ram-cummins-d001-development-truck/

Temps go up, and you lose your turbo (assuming it's a turbo unit). 

The biggest thing to check on the old 6.0 power strokes (used) is if anyone modded it or used aftermarket performance boosts of any kind, including a chip. If they did, pass on the truck.


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

I want one, but is going to have to be a P pump 12v and go in a square body chevy.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

hdavis said:


> "
> Pumping exhaust (EGR) back into the engine helps to cool the combustion chamber because EGR has almost no oxygen in it. Without oxygen, the temperature stays below the NOx-producing threshold, and the emissions coming out the tailpipe are cleaner.
> "
> 
> ...


That has nothing to do with idling. Temps don't reach N0x producing levels at idle, infact they don't even burn right and experience cylinder wash. At idle your ERG is closed, because if it opened it would dump so much unburnt fuel back into the intake it would run like a sack of crap.

The EGR stays closed when you tromp the throttle and when you idle.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

Inner10 said:


> That has nothing to do with idling. Temps don't reach N0x producing levels at idle, infact they don't even burn right and experience cylinder wash. At idle your ERG is closed, because if it opened it would dump so much unburnt fuel back into the intake it would run like a sack of crap.
> 
> The EGR stays closed when you tromp the throttle and when you idle.


It'll stick and not open when it should. In a 6.0 powerstroke, that has all kinds of implications, from the amount of boost that you run, to cooling demands,

Here's something a little more useful to someone who is considering buying a 6.0:

http://www.trucktrend.com/how-to/engine/0907dp-6-0l-ford-power-stroke-engine/


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

Inner10 said:


> When a diesel idols they don't produce a lot of heat, when they aren't up to temp they suffer from incomplete combustion. Hence why they have very little power when cold. This can cause residual fuel to wash the cylinders and cause excessive wear as well as contamination.
> 
> So there is no hard and fast rule about idling over 15 min, you should keep it to a minimum.


My sprinter manual says no more than 5 min, egr gums up very quick. For has a high idle feature that no one uses, I have a stick that I put on the accelerator and wedge it to the dash 1500rpm

This guy have tons of info on Fords, on youtube also
http://powerstrokehelp.com/
https://www.youtube.com/user/powerstrokehelp


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## Peter_C (Nov 26, 2014)

My friend was going thru the same decision coming from a diesel Chevy 1 ton. We talked about it, he ran the numbers out. For diesel way higher initial upfront costs, higher maintenance costs, DEF costs (It is a pretty large expense actually), and diesel fuel is more expensive (At least in California). Gas doesn't get quit as good of fuel mileage, but the lower upfront cost, less maintenance and hassles means he went that direction. 

The diesel will break even with the gasser at around 120K miles. If you only keep vehicles for 100K and then sell you are loosing money. Accountants will often tell you to flip vehicles every X amount of years for write offs, which depends on profits and other write offs. 

On the other hand if you straight up need the power because you are loaded with tools, and pull heavy equipment or trailers constantly, than diesel makes perfect sense. 

My friends current F350 crew cab long bed truck has tool boxes that are loaded to the brim, THEN he often pulls a 10,000# Trex trailer, or his boat which is a 25ft cabin cruiser. So yes a gasser can get the job done.


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## JT Wood (Dec 17, 2007)

I recently sold a 6.7 diesel. 

Oil changes were $150
I had a heater line replaced on the def system. It was $1600.


I sold the truck 3 days later and went back to had. On the phone the lady said the emission system costs about $15k to replace. 


Gas is the safest most economical choice for due. But the diesel sure had lots of balls


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## CrpntrFrk (Oct 25, 2008)

builder2345 said:


> . I read a ton of reviews and it seemed like the new gas v8 they offer was good option. That is until i test drove it. I was underwhelmed.


Underwhelmed? Not sure what you drove but my 6.2L has been great. I pull a 7x16 tool trailer and it pulls like a champ. That thing has lots of power! I pulled a 32' 1989 camp trailer to the mountains and kept right up with my buddy and his diesel. I love diesels and will have one someday but in the meantime my gasser kicks ass.


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## Mr Latone (Jan 8, 2011)

I own a 2012 F250 4x4 ext cab 6.7 since new.

Dealer oil change $110
Dealer fuel filter change about $100

I only paid the dealer to do these once. Had free oil changes for life, then the dealer sold and the new dealer wouldn't honor it. I was already there that one time :whistling

For the first 50K miles I got 14 - 15 mpg (hand calculated)
Since 50K, I get 16.5 - 17 mpg. I had really hoped to get close to 17mpg since day one. But if it's a 50k mile break in period, I guess I will live with it.

My mileage is 40% - 50% better than the gas motor (11 mpg ?). But I would like to hear from someone who drives a similar gasser for some hard numbers.

I had no additional costs associated with the diesel outside of DEF and fuel filter. DEF is about $.0032 per mile. Fuel filter is $100 every 35K miles or $.0028 per mile. So combined that's $.006/mile.

Yup, I could have a big expensive breakdown. All of my warranty is up and I would be on the hook for the entire amount. So far, so good.

At today's fuel prices, I save about $1400 per year over a gasser. That pays for the diesel option and then some.

I do tend to drive with a light foot as far as acceleration.


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## Randy Bush (Mar 7, 2011)

hdavis said:


> It'll stick and not open when it should. In a 6.0 powerstroke, that has all kinds of implications, from the amount of boost that you run, to cooling demands,
> 
> Here's something a little more useful to someone who is considering buying a 6.0:
> 
> http://www.trucktrend.com/how-to/engine/0907dp-6-0l-ford-power-stroke-engine/


Pretty much what I have heard about the 6.0 engine, stock it was not bad.


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## mikeswoods (Oct 11, 2008)

I'm on my third year with a diesel---

I like it.

Plug in the block heater when it is cold enough to wear a coat.
DO NOT run out of fuel---you will need to prime the fuel filter--(keep a bottle of diesel in your truck.)


Keep a spare fuel filter with you---if the fuel is wet the filter can clog.

Do your own oil changes---

Enjoy.


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## builder2345 (Aug 31, 2010)

Thanks for all the feedback. I actually didn't waste too much time, I bought the truck a few hours ago. So far I love it! Got a 350 4x4, crew cab, long bed. Not a tight turn radius, but oh well. Can't wait to pull my trailer with it. Also it's been nice driving over bumps & whatnot, so much smoother than my last truck.


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## builder2345 (Aug 31, 2010)

CrpntrFrk said:


> Underwhelmed? Not sure what you drove but my 6.2L has been great. I pull a 7x16 tool trailer and it pulls like a champ. That thing has lots of power! I pulled a 32' 1989 camp trailer to the mountains and kept right up with my buddy and his diesel. I love diesels and will have one someday but in the meantime my gasser kicks ass.


The one I test drove felt beat up, even though it was only 2 years old. I probably should have test drove another one, but after test driving the diesel I knew what i wanted.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

My 2015 Silverado 2500 Gasser pulls my dump trailer better than my 2006 F350 Dually Diesel did.


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## builder2345 (Aug 31, 2010)

Went through my first tank of gas, averaged 15.04 miles per gallon. Get 500 miles per tank. It will be nice not to have to stop & fill up so often.


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