# Is it okay to leave the old felt on?



## outlaw

I know of roofers around here that word their contracts "new felt as nessecary". These guys will try to save the old felt and even go with the old chalk lines if they can. Ride around all summer with the same 5 rolls of felt in the back of the truck.


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## Handyman4u

I have done numerous tear off roofs and the felt usually would stay on. If some came off, then we would patch it where the felt was missing.


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## neolitic

outlaw said:


> I know of roofers around here that word their contracts "new felt as nessecary". These guys will try to save the old felt and even go with the old chalk lines if they can. Ride around all summer with the same 5 rolls of felt in the back of the truck.





Handyman4u said:


> I have done numerous tear off roofs and the felt usually would stay on. If some came off, then we would patch it where the felt was missing.


Two more in Witness Protection.
Damn, those marshals must be
busy "around here." :whistling


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## guyinthesky

When I do a roof, as with a few other boys on here it is also in my contract that a COMPLETE strip down of ALL old roofing material, down to the sheathing to ensure that my customer gets the best possible roof for their dollar, meaning if there are any current or developing problems with the sheathing they are taken care of before they become a problem. I mean seriously, with what a roll of felt paper costs, and how long it takes to rip off, and clean up I kinda find it lazy when someone doesn't?! just my .02 cents


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## Tom M

I see no harm in leaving the felt or the fasteners. He found rot and showed you, I like to nail my seams off so I would have pulled it. Too cold the shingle shatters, too hot it scuffs. There are hundreds of nails being punched in a sweeping motion not all will land flat. Underdriven nails are a bigger issue, they become exposed to the weather as they melt through the surface come summer. What I can see and I hate is such a close seam with a Timberland style. I three step, I thought I saw a seam like 4 inches away.


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## scott.emp

i remove the felt, it takes very little effort or time. plus the h.o. siting in the lawn chair likes that. it probably takes more time debating about it or explaining it than removing it..


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## davitk

Since I woke up with a headache I thought I'd muddy the water. For those tearing off the old felt, how many go back and hammer flat/pull every old staple (assuming the felt was stapled)? My pet peeve is seeing rusty old one-leggers sticking through the new underlayment.


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## shanekw1

davitk said:


> Since I woke up with a headache I thought I'd muddy the water. For those tearing off the old felt, how many go back and hammer flat/pull every old staple (assuming the felt was stapled)? My pet peeve is seeing rusty old one-leggers sticking through the new underlayment.


*raises hand*

I do it at the same time as I'm pulling nails that the shovel didn't get and re-nailing the sheathing.


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## skyhook

MJW said:


> I agree with inspecting the sheathing.
> * Just depends on how new it is*. :laughing:
> * Most good roofers will see and notice bad rotted spots without removing even the shingles.* :laughing:
> I*t won't hurt anything to leave it on.*:laughing:
> Alot of our roofs we just did a few years ago.
> *We don't waste the time tearing all the paper off all the time.*


:laughing: :laughing: :laughing: 

Do you waste time getting a permit? 
Tear off means just that.
Sheathing inspection comes before any ASTM felt.


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## JMWconstruction

*What about possible damage*

The only thing I could think of that would potentially be a problem is this. If you do not remove the old tar paper you will not be able to see potential damage hiding under it. There have been plenty of times that we've torn off and noticed ice and water damage on decking that needed replaced.


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## MJW

To the smarty pants' out there...............

Do you tear off the I&W too?

If you can't see water damage without looking directly at the sheathing, you aren't much of a roofer. It should be obvious.


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## JMWconstruction

also if by removing all tar paper you do happen to find rot... it makes for a nice back charge to pad your earnings.


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## JMWconstruction

*to superman with x ray vision*

yes I do tear off Ice and water whenever possible. and also replace dripedge. Valleys and some peaks are also completely stripped. When the roof is stripped I take 10 min to make sure there are no nails, staples or uneven boards sticking up that could take away from the finish product. Then I redu all I&W, dripedge, and tar paper to give my customer a complete job. We've done plenty of roofs and have never had a single leak or call back. I wonder if you can say the same thing?:jester:


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## MJW

We do hundreds of squares a year (for 20 years) and have had very few call backs or leaks. Have never had a call back or leak that ended up to be our fault.

If you are removing the I&W, you are doing more damage than good. I hope you have inspectors in your part of the country. We have inspections on everything.


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## Tom M

What could be more aggravating than tearing off ice shield. MAJOR TIME KILLER Its like torture.


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## Tom M

Never seen an inspector inspect a roof, they just drive by.


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## johnk

JMWconstruction said:


> yes I do tear off Ice and water whenever possible. and also replace dripedge. Valleys and some peaks are also completely stripped. When the roof is stripped I take 10 min to make sure there are no nails, staples or uneven boards sticking up that could take away from the finish product. Then I redu all I&W, dripedge, and tar paper to give my customer a complete job. We've done plenty of roofs and have never had a single leak or call back. I wonder if you can say the same thing?:jester:


Not a single leak or call back,how many roofs you done.When you do several hundred a year,see if you can say the same thing.It happens to even the best of us,its part of the biz.


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## StoneRenew

haha its funny. Every guy out there who doesnt have a job becomes a roofer. Why? Because its not rocket science. I did the roof on my own house with no prior roofing experience. Guess What? No Leaks! and its been 5 years! Saved thousands of dollars too!  There were a couple company's localy that were doing roofs in my neighborhood, so I had them leave estimates. 5,000? I dont think so. These guys had Mexican's working for them that didnt speak a word of english. Now how much experience do you think those guys had before swimming the river? Exactly. Point being? Are there hacks out there who screw stuff up? Of course...but it doesnt take doing "hundreds of roofs a year!" to do a good job.


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## MJW

I agree with you about the mexicans and hacks, there are plenty of them especially now........That being said...yes it DOES take hundreds of squares to do a good job. If someone disagrees with that, they either have a simple house or they themselves are the hacks or scabs.


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## JMWconstruction

*ok bud*

That is not the face of someone I'd consider the "best of us". I guess looking like a complete Jack, cutting corners, and a farmers tan is something you have in common with these other posters. I'd take one look at your crazy mug and go straight to the local home depot and hire 5 of my own mexicans to do the roof. 

I've been in the business long enough to know there are hacks out there who charge for materials they dont use, cut corners to get the job finished quicker, and are dishonest with the homeowners. Thanks for the business, I'm the one they call to come fix there leaky roof. 

So in closing, it's probably not that big of a deal to leave the felt on. If you charge the homeowner to lay the felt then lay it. If they agree its not neccessary than f it. But don't reply to my post to patch your busted up consience for 20 years of jipping the customer


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## willworkforbeer

MJW said:


> Tarpaper's purpose it two things
> 
> 1. keep the roof dry until it is shingled
> 2. prevent the shingles from sticking to the sheathing
> 
> The 3rd reason is in case of a blow off, but I don't think that happens much anymore.


Thats the most intelligable reason I've heard of, what happens when the shingles stick? Maybe shingle damage? A lot of people tell me it prevents roof damage when the shingles fail at which point I laugh in their face. Worked for a guy who combined owned and controlled rentals were over 10k units. He have a screaming fit if someone tried to put down felt on a reroof, he'd grown tired of paying for osb mulch.


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## VAviaCo

willworkforbeer said:


> I did my share of residential shingle roofing when I was younger, saw a lot of different things but to this day I have no idea what tarpaper is for. Saw a lot of damage caused by it. *ducks head down*


What damage was ever caused by felt?
(psst: every asphalt shingle manufacturer requires the stuff under their product. Is that a clue?)


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## PA woodbutcher

MJW said:


> Tarpaper's purpose it two things
> 
> 1. keep the roof dry until it is shingled
> 2. prevent the shingles from sticking to the sheathing
> 
> The 3rd reason is in case of a blow off, but I don't think that happens much anymore.


I patched a barn roof years ago that had some blow offs. The only place it had blow offs was where they had run out a roll of felt paper. The shingles there were brittle and dried out and the rest of the shingles were fairly pliable.


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## MJW

Do you think the paper was so dry that it sucked the moisture right out of the shingle? On a barn, I guess I could see that.


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## willworkforbeer

VAviaCo said:


> What damage was ever caused by felt?
> (psst: every asphalt shingle manufacturer requires the stuff under their product. Is that a clue?)


Moisture can be trapped under felt, do you beleive everything manufacturers tells you? Oil manufacterers will tell you change your engine oil every 3000 miles, in truth you can go 5-6000 miles without worry. Dont have a clue why they would say such :whistling


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## PA woodbutcher

MJW said:


> Do you think the paper was so dry that it sucked the moisture right out of the shingle? On a barn, I guess I could see that.


Sorry, poor way to explain it.....Where the felt was missing the shingles were brittle. Where there was felt the shingles were still pliable. I'm not a roofer by any stretch of the imagination, but I don't cut any corners. The past couple of years I have been using Pro-tech on my roofs. A little more expensive, but better footing on it, it lays flatter and faster.


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## Safety1st2009

> The question is where does one draw the line, every instance of roof is different and unique, so that line needs to be re-evaluated each and every time.


 can you even be truly serious about your statement depending on your contract, which I would love to review sometime provided I am not on the throne and need it for other things, if you are telling your customer base that you are removing the existing and replacing with new that is EXACTLY what you do, as far as shiplapped/board decked roofs T&G 
from the old school roofs, do you not want to see what the decking looks like underneath that paper? perhaps , just maybe there can be knotted pieces, fractures in the deck that you cannot see until inspections are done? how is it possible that you can say to your client base that you have done everything possible to ensuree that they will now have a new roof that will carry them into the future?


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## TracyLynn

MJW said:


> Ahh, Latinos!! haha
> 
> I thought it looked like it.


What the hell does 'ah Latinos I thought it looked like it's even mean? Why would you even say that?


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## griz

Did you bother to see the date on this post?????

We need some kind of filter for this BS...


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## Robie

They need to get rid of or put into a differect section..."Recommended Reading"

This is how all these one post wonders come from.


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## hdavis

TracyLynn said:


> What the hell does 'ah Latinos I thought it looked like it's even mean? Why would you even say that?


Are you a contractor?


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## pinwheel

griz said:


> Did you bother to see the date on this post?????
> 
> We need some kind of filter for this BS...


Part of the woke culture, looking high & low for something to be offended by.


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## VinylHanger

Robie said:


> They need to get rid of or put into a differect section..."Recommended Reading"
> 
> This is how all these one post wonders come from.


It's causing these issues in forums all over that use this software. It is solely to try and drive new revenue and ad views.

It's annoying as all get out.

This one is even worse as it looks like someone popped in to just make a very belated scene. 

I've never even heard those member names before. Many anyway.

How do random people come across these posts and threads? Is it posted in some search engine? 

If so, I may stop posting. Not worth it if random people can take your posts out of all context.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


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## Tricard

I'm not familiar with the software behind this forum. But in the past, a forum i was deeply involved with had the option to show all posts as read for new members. When I joined here I began perusing the boards for interesting reads. I almost posted an answer to a very old post. I then quickly went through the site and set all posts to "read". Now all I see are actual new posts, and any searching I am doing I know for a fact is history.


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