# Disciplining Employees



## ultralast (May 2, 2016)

For those of you who run your operation like an actual business, what is your approach to disciplining employees? 

Our single biggest problem is tardiness and attendance. We have good solid workers who know their stuff but every single one of them are late at least once per week. We've set up progressive disciplinary structures and they'll mow right through the write ups. I reach a point where I have to make a choice whether to violate my own policies or fire my entire workforce.

They're required to be at our office by 7:30 and on the customer's property by 9:00. We allow a 10 minute grace period. In a regular industry this is considered very reasonable but is this unreasonable for construction workers?


----------



## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

ultralast said:


> For those of you who run your operation like an actual business


me raises eyebrow....


----------



## Warren (Feb 19, 2005)

Any employee who is late once a week, is only an employee for a couple weeks, no exceptions.


----------



## Moxley-Kidwell (Jan 28, 2011)

Start sending them right back out the door to home with no pay. You can right anything on a piece of paper and it doesn't really mean squat to some people. Start hitting them in the pockets and see what happens. If it doesn't help, like Warren said you'll have to make an example out of someone.


----------



## Defenestrate (Aug 13, 2015)

I hate to say it, but making an example of one might sharpen up the rest of the crew.


----------



## Metro M & L (Jun 3, 2009)

You need them more than they need you obviously. I try to structure myself so the opposite is true at all times. This is the application of power in its purest form. If you don't fire someone they will always know you're bluffing.

I don't tolerate a lot of bullsh. Non hackers are gone within a day. I've learned that if I don't like them day one they should just go.

Also, 

Workers work when I call them. Maybe its all the time, maybe its when I feel like you would actually make me money. If you're a good earner I will make sure you're fed. If not, well then, your part time.


----------



## tedanderson (May 19, 2010)

ultralast said:


> Our single biggest problem is tardiness and attendance. We have good solid workers who know their stuff but every single one of them are late at least once per week.
> They're required to be at our office by 7:30 and on the customer's property by 9:00. We allow a 10 minute grace period. In a regular industry this is considered very reasonable but is this unreasonable for construction workers?


Does the lateness cause you any issues with productivity or meeting deadlines?

Do the guys ever work a few minutes through lunch or work beyond the official quitting time on their own? Or are they watching the clock with one foot out the door 10 minutes 'til?

Has their tardiness cost you anything in terms of money or late starts or missed opportunities?

As it relates to your business model, you'd know better than me but as far as I'm concerned, unless I need my guys at a specific place and time for something like a meeting or an inspection, all I care is that they get their 8 hours in and be productive. I share that to say that if your guys are responsible with their time, then maybe keeping the reins a little loose may not be a bad thing. 

But to answer your question specifically, sending someone home for the day (as Moxley pointed out) seems to be the most effective way to enforce the rules, especially when it deals with attendance. The day off gives them time to catch up or prepare for anything that would otherwise cause them to be late the next day. So if it means going to bed a couple of hours earlier, you'll have the entire day to do whatever needs to be done between the clock-out time and bedtime.


----------



## Mordekyle (May 20, 2014)

I wouldn't let a guy work because he was regularly late in the morning. I told him "let's try this again after lunch."

He made it on time then!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## pcplumber (Oct 12, 2008)

"Say what you mean and mean what you say"

"Do as I do"

The first thing you need to do is have a serious meeting in the morning. Explain your precise policies and explain the consequences. I always tell my employees what policies have zero tolerance.

As stated in several posts, the best thing you can do is send the employee home when they violate a policy. Also, as stated in another post, the best thing you can do is constantly look for new workers even when you already have as many as you need. Never let your employees think that they can cause a job to be delayed for even one minute. I always tell my employees that I will get the job done on-time with or without them and their purpose for being employed is to make getting the job done easier and I will not allow them to make getting the job done more difficult.


----------



## avenge (Sep 25, 2008)

ultralast said:


> For those of you who run your operation like an actual business


Evidently if you don't run it like an actual business all your employees are tardy and absent.


----------



## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

Some people are smart enough that if they want a day off, they'll just show up late...


----------



## Youngin' (Sep 16, 2012)

Lateness is a pet peeve of mine. It seriously pisses me off. If you have a legitimate reason that's fine but come up with enough lame excuses and you'll be sent packing very quickly.


----------



## ultralast (May 2, 2016)

I like the idea of sending them home without pay. I know that would work well for a few of my guys but a few others would celebrate their day off.


----------



## Philament (Dec 9, 2014)

ultralast said:


> I like the idea of sending them home without pay. I know that would work well for a few of my guys but a few others would celebrate their day off.


Someone else mentioned having them come back for noon to mitigate that situation. If they're late getting back for noon or don't show up then, fire them.
This kind of policy would be a real pain for them if they actually wanted to keep their job.

Without being too negative, the tone of your posts seem almost apathetic and resigned that there's nothing you can do about this situation. Time to nut up and start running YOUR business instead of letting your employees run you.


----------



## colevalleytim (Mar 1, 2008)

Labor shortages are a problem in the SF Bay area. It's not just tardiness, but also showing up too hung over to be productive etc. I finally let a really skilled guy go because he was late etc. This employee nonsense is part of construction, restaurants and most other service businesses. For most, it's not a career, it's a job. And there is always another job.

And the employee doesn't care about YOUR business success.

Problem with tardiness, or not showing-up, etc, it screws up your schedule, pisses off fellow employees, and degrades productivity.

Generally, you can accept tardiness or fire people: neither is a good alternative because talent acquisition is an expensive endeavor. 

What about telling you whole team they can't start until everyone is there and ready for work?
Or making the offending employee wait, on site, in front of everyone else, until the top of the hour to start working--wasting his time. 
Make the offending employee do some type of punitive work, clean bathroom, clean garbage cans, dig a hole.
Shame and peer pressure can be powerful motivators.

Also, ask the guy if he really wants the job? If he can't be there by 8, ask why? If he does it twice, tell him his new start time is 9, same quitting time.

Just some thoughts


----------



## dsconstructs (Jul 20, 2010)

ultralast said:


> I like the idea of sending them home without pay. I know that would work well for a few of my guys


 Those are the ones you need to get control of your business and mold into better employees


> but a few others would celebrate their day off.


Those are the ones you need to send packing


----------



## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

colevalleytim said:


> What about telling you whole team they can't start until everyone is there and ready for work?


I knew one who wouldn't start until everyone was there, and if one person took a break, everyone took a break. Breaks were unpaid time.


----------



## dibs16 (Nov 30, 2010)

I really like the idea of making them come back after lunch. Ive seen a couple people mention it. 

In your situation, leaving from the shop, rule should be that company vehicles leave at 735 everyday no matter what. If you dont make it you're responsible to get to the job at 1230 after lunch, if you can't then don't show up tomorrow either. 

Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk


----------



## elite-roofing (Jun 13, 2014)

You have to have solid policies and rules that are followed consistently. You can't be moving the target so that nobody knows the "real rule". It sounds like maybe you are not doing that. You also have to decide how important it is to you. Is there really a problem with employees starting late or is it just that you don't like it. If it is critical then the punishment needs to fit. And vice versa.

Jesse
Elite Roofing


----------



## Golden view (Feb 16, 2012)

There was a study done with daycare (not much different than construction) where parents were picking up their kids late a small percentage of the time. They implemented discipline in the form of fines for being late, and the tardiness jumped up hugely. People felt bad about being late, but when it was just a fine, they felt more justified.


----------



## Youngin' (Sep 16, 2012)

Some of these are great suggestions. I'm going to talk to the boss about implementing a few. I've had issues with labourers coming in at 7:15 and still marking their timesheet for 7:00.:no:


----------



## Windycity (Oct 3, 2015)

Sending them home is not an option for me since i need them there to finish the job for the day. My guys are pretty good about showing up on time since i am always letting them leave early with pay when we finish up early....but when they are late this is how it goes......

Employee;.....hey sorry i am 5 minutes late

Me;.... No problem, you are not 5 minutes late you are 25 minutes early. You start at 730 instead of 7

I understand sometimes running late but if employees sees that you are cool with guys showing up late they they start showing up late too then everyone is running late


----------



## Philament (Dec 9, 2014)

Golden view said:


> There was a study done with daycare (not much different than construction) where parents were picking up their kids late a small percentage of the time. They implemented discipline in the form of fines for being late, and the tardiness jumped up hugely. People felt bad about being late, but when it was just a fine, they felt more justified.


That's a totally different dynamic. In your example it's a service provider - client relationship, not an employee-employer relationship. The client views it as an additional service. 

It's no different than a clause I have for moving personal items out of the area to be worked on prior to staring work on the project. I don't like moving personal items like pictures/vases... for liability reasons, so it's a condition of the contract and stated that if I have to move the stuff it's $150/hr on top of the quoted price. About 3/4 of clients move their own stuff, the remainder just can't be bothered and will pay for it (I make exceptions for those who physically can't move their stuff). 

That's a lot different than having an employee policy for reducing hours/pay for violating terms of an employment agreement.


----------



## CCCo. (Jul 19, 2009)

Youngin' said:


> Some of these are great suggestions. I'm going to talk to the boss about implementing a few. I've had issues with labourers coming in at 7:15 and still marking their timesheet for 7:00.:no:


Those guys are stealing. That adds up! Do that 5 days a week, and their getting paid over an hr extra, a month 5 extra- over a years time it can add up to more than an extra weeks pay.

Bad deal


----------



## Youngin' (Sep 16, 2012)

CCCo. said:


> Those guys are stealing. That adds up! Do that 5 days a week, and their getting paid over an hr extra, a month 5 extra- over a years time it can add up to more than an extra weeks pay.
> 
> Bad deal


Absolutely, it's stealing time, no other way around it. Our latest labourer is fired for tardiness and falsifying his timesheet among others things, he just doesn't know it yet. I check the timesheets every time they're handed in and I check them well. Need a few more holes dug before he goes though.


----------



## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

Youngin' said:


> I've had issues with labourers coming in at 7:15 and still marking their timesheet for 7:00.:no:


Any company worth a dam has a rule against falsifying company documents. Grounds for immediate termination.


----------



## FrankSmith (Feb 21, 2013)

Fire according to your system. If you don't follow through with this, you will loose credibility across the board. What did you plan to do when this happened when you unveiled the system?


----------



## Mordekyle (May 20, 2014)

Timeclock?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## nes999 (Apr 14, 2015)

I'm very lucky and rarely have late employees. If it happens usually I'll shrug it off. If it becomes a habit I will send them home without pay plus it's a write up. Three write ups in a year is grounds for dismissal.

I guess my guys are hungry for money and know to show up a few minutes early for free coffee.

Our trucks leave at a certain time no matter who is in them. If someone is more than about 15 minutes late they are driving their own vehical to the jobsite.

Set your rules and stick with them. Your employees will push you as far as you let them. I like to say that I've never fired my best employee, because if they are the best then I wouldn't have to fire them.


----------



## Solidbuilder (Jul 7, 2016)

We had this problem for a while. Started to tell them if they called/texted to say they were late not to bother coming in that day. Let me tell you it stopped real quick.


----------



## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

hdavis said:


> I knew one who wouldn't start until everyone was there, and if one person took a break, everyone took a break. Breaks were unpaid time.


What are breaks? :blink:


----------



## bdog1234 (Feb 25, 2008)

You can't legally do much with an employee's hourly pay so what I do is pay my guys an hourly rate below what they are really worth and give them frequent bonuses. This gives me great flexibility in rewarding them when they do good and punishing them when they do bad. An average week my guys will get anywhere from a $2-400 bonus. They all know I am honest about it and if things go well they get a good bonus and if they screw up they are not expecting much. I give the exact same base bonus to all employees and there are certain things that deduct from it automatically. Late to work? You just lost $100 off whatever the bonus is for that week. Not wearing the required safety gear for the task you are doing? Just lost $100 off the bonus. It works really well but might be hard to implement if you already have set wages for everyone. Not only does it help with addressing bad behaviors it also helps increase productivity because they know it means more money for them if things are done correctly and ahead of schedule.


----------



## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

Don't waste to much time on it, just put it in a prospective way so everyone understands.


----------



## jlhaslip (Dec 31, 2009)

Worked on a project once where the Site Supt stood by the gate and closed it at precisely the announced start time for the day. If you were late, you went home. 
Same thing if you had a scheduled appointment, take the entire day off.
He was not there to babysit the employees. You worked a full shift or not at all. No exceptions.
Pretty sure that my truck bumper had marks on it from that swinging gate... LOL


----------



## TBM (Oct 13, 2016)

I think that maybe everyone is sometimes to quick to jump the gun and fire some one for a stupid reason as being late or absent. Maybe think the other way and reward them for being on time. Just saying that maybe right before lunch you stop everyone and say congratulations Mike you just earned 50.00 for being on time today. Or simply taking them to lunch. Maybe bring donuts in the morning and hand them out in the morning before you roll out for the day. Once starting time hits put them in your truck, tell the late ones how good there donut was. I sometimes think that these kids need someone to teach them and help them become better rather then except everyone to already have a work ethic. Hell the just left moms and stay up all night chasing girls. They need guidance. Of course if you have a 30 who still hasn't learned maybe some tuff love would be required and you'd have to let them go. But first try thinking outside the box.


----------



## KAP (Feb 19, 2011)

TBM said:


> I think that maybe everyone is sometimes to quick to jump the gun and fire some one for a stupid reason as being late or absent. *Maybe think the other way and reward them for being on time. *Just saying that maybe right before lunch you stop everyone and say congratulations Mike you just earned 50.00 for being on time today. Or simply taking them to lunch. Maybe bring donuts in the morning and hand them out in the morning before you roll out for the day. Once starting time hits put them in your truck, tell the late ones how good there donut was. I sometimes think that these kids need someone to teach them and help them become better rather then except everyone to already have a work ethic. Hell the just left moms and stay up all night chasing girls. They need guidance. Of course if you have a 30 who still hasn't learned maybe some tuff love would be required and you'd have to let them go. But first try thinking outside the box.


Not following... You want to _reward _someone for being on time for work? 

No offense, but that's akin to everyone gets a medal for showing up only worse... now it comes with a $50 bonus for doing what should be expected... 

It's like an Oprah construction site... You get $50, you get $50, EVERYBODY gets $50... and the kicker is, even OPRAH closes her door to those who are late when filming starts...


----------



## dsconstructs (Jul 20, 2010)

I give two rewards for showing up on time. Staying employed and getting a paycheck.


----------



## TBM (Oct 13, 2016)

I'm not saying doing it every day. Randomly through the year I do it maybe five times at the most. I dont even have a big problem anymore and i still do it. I think most employees would start coming to work on time for an incentive. I'd hate missing out on 50 dollars when I lived paycheck to paycheck. 
Does even need to be money you through at them could just be like " well John and mike and I are going snowmobiling today sorry everyone was not here this morning when we planned it, but theres plenty of work here to do so get on it." They'd hate miss out on a day of fun with the boss. 
I'm just saying you give a dog a treat for sitting, you don't beat him cause he doesn't.


----------



## heavy_d (Dec 4, 2012)

I will definitely not be rewarding my employees when I get them for being on time.


----------



## KAP (Feb 19, 2011)

TBM said:


> I'm not saying doing it every day. Randomly through the year I do it maybe five times at the most. I dont even have a big problem anymore and i still do it. I think most employees would start coming to work on time for an incentive. I'd hate missing out on 50 dollars when I lived paycheck to paycheck.
> Does even need to be money you through at them could just be like " well John and mike and I are going snowmobiling today sorry everyone was not here this morning when we planned it, but theres plenty of work here to do so get on it." They'd hate miss out on a day of fun with the boss.
> I'm just saying you give a dog a treat for sitting, you don't beat him cause he doesn't.


You gave him the treat because he did what you asked when you asked it (i.e. - showed up on time)... I think you'd agree it'd be counterproductive to give him the treat 10 minutes later (i.e. - late)... 

Have you considered you might be mentally "beating" the guy who shows up on time day in and day out to "reward" another guy for doing what he does in this form of incentive? Average construction guy makes $15-$16/hour... that's $120... if being sent home for being late and losing $120 in pay for the day is not incentive enough, how does $50 every once in a while do it?

IMHO, incentives are for going above and beyond what is normally expected... showing up on time for work is what is normally expected... spiffs are a useful tool, but it's use is diminished when you are rewarded for doing what is already expected...


----------

