# Contractors No License Sting!



## Bubbles (Sep 27, 2007)

Did anyone see that MSNBC show where they are making undercover stings on Contractors with no licenses?? It's a good thing overall but they are kind of making them look like child molestors or something equivelant. I know alot of GC's with licenses that do unethical things and use guys with little knowlege doing horrible work and on other hand no license guys (some master level electricians) that do great work but, overall I guess it's a good thing they are getting tough on it now. I hope they keep it fair and not a witch hunt. Anyone know percentage of contractors (all trades) that operate unlicensed?? Think about the implications if they get rid of ALL no license guys?? Where will they work then??


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## silvertree (Jul 22, 2007)

They will never go away, it's part of the economy. Your right, there are bad licensed contractors and good unlicensed ones. I started out unlicensed and as I became aware of the bigger picture I raised the bar for myself and my customers. But if you have skills and are unemployed I would guess you wouldn't turn down a chance to make some money, and as long as homeowners are willing to work with the unlicensed guys they will be around.


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## Electric_Light (Nov 25, 2007)

Bubbles said:


> Did anyone see that MSNBC show where they are making undercover stings on Contractors with no licenses?? It's a good thing overall but they are kind of making them look like child molestors or something equivelant. I know alot of GC's with licenses that do unethical things and use guys with little knowlege doing horrible work and on other hand no license guys (some master level electricians) that do great work but, overall I guess it's a good thing they are getting tough on it now. I hope they keep it fair and not a witch hunt. Anyone know percentage of contractors (all trades) that operate unlicensed?? Think about the implications if they get rid of ALL no license guys?? Where will they work then??



This argument is like there are licensed, cell phone chatting, burger eating mediocre drivers as well as illegal aliens without license that drives way better. It's hard to get a figure for it since it's only uncovered when they get caught.

I have no problem if they go after them as they'd go after uninsured motorists or drunk drivers.

It puts property owner and tenants at risk of liability of they are injured and they don't have worker's comp. If they do a hack job and they're not licensed, you have little recourse through the regulatory agency.

Where I am, all licensed contractor must be insured and bonded. If they don't do it right, you have the leverage to make it correct and if they don't, you can make a claim against their bond.


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## MacRoadie (Dec 9, 2007)

I guess I don't see the problem. If a "contractor" is a skilled mechanic with journeyman-level experience, then why doesn't he simply get licensed? All these unlicensed guys out there supposedly doing bang-up work didn't stay at Holiday Inn Express, they learned their trade the hard way through experience so what's stopping them from getting their ticket?


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## sguinn (Sep 18, 2007)

Bubbles said:


> Think about the implications if they get rid of ALL no license guys?? Where will they work then??


I'm guessing for the licensed ones.


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## invest (Nov 7, 2007)

I have a problem with unlicensed contractors, I have even seen on this site, guys trying to work under someone elses license, and the funny thing is that people allow total strangers to work under their license for a fee, or help them get around the experience part of the licensing. How do you know this person from adam..someone you meet on line. I honestly knew one guy who let someone work under his license (made it appear all legal) and it turned out the guy was a total convicted felon in another state and a con artist...who's license was on the line, when he scammed the home owner...the licensed contractor, got the law suit and lost his license...I think they should crack down on them, personally.


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## Magnettica (Dec 19, 2006)

I'm sick of doing unlicensed work and all the crappy people I do work for. That's why I decided to go to school, get my EC license/ business permit, and move on to legitimate customers who pay real market value for my work. Then I'll come back to ContractorTalk and complain about all the unlicensed work being done.

Btw, I do work full-time for licensed electrician during the day, sometimes even into the night.


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## Magnettica (Dec 19, 2006)

P.S.

I guess you must be one of the 100 or so people who actually watch MSLSD.


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## thom (Nov 3, 2006)

So, you're licensed, a guy who you fired gets a job, applies for and gets a permit in your name. How will you or the building department know?

We've had that issue in my town. The bldg department checks more closely now, but I'd bet it's still going on.

Now, if they would get real strict, confiscate vehicle, tools, and any bank accounts, that might start to make a difference. In the show, the guys had been caught repeatedly working without a license. What does that tell you? 

They really don't go after them. Contracting without a license is a misdemeanor. They ignore the real significant violations
No comp
No liability
No employees federal withholding
No employees state withholding
No employees futa
No employees fica
No employers futa
No employers fica
No federal unemployment
No state unemployment
No permits.

The unlicensed guy breaks a dozen laws, they prosecute for the most minor, he gets probation and gets to do it again. Now he saved about 30% of the cost of the job by going naked, and he gets to keep it all. Sometimes I think we who follow the laws are the real chumps.


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## kevjob (Aug 14, 2006)

here every time I renew my GC licenses they ask me to fill out a form who can pull my permits including myself


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## silvertree (Jul 22, 2007)

I have friends in NARI and NAHB who don't care about the unlicensed guys, I have other friends who say if they see an unlicensed contractor they will report it. In Minnesota if your unlicensed you will probably get away with it forever unless you steal money from a few people and they call it in. I do all the things required to be a legitimate business, including warranty and service if there is a problem. Personally I think these guys should be pursued and arrested until they go away. But around here we pay to be legit and goverment doesn't back us up.


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## L. B. Condulet (Aug 23, 2007)

I'd say that here in California, 95% of the general contractors doing remodel/addition work are only too happy to find unlicensed subs. I've pretty much given up on the lower end of the residential market for this reason.

As you move up the construction food chain, into large custom homes and commercial work, the general contractors are more professional and you rarely see unlicensed subs.

Residential remodel is the bottom of the barrel from a business standpoint, which is peculiar since it often requires the highest technical skill sets.

The unlicensed guys have driven the prices so low in the remodel/addition market, only one-man shops can eke out a meager living there, you could never charge enough to afford an employee.

Here in California, the CSLB has allowed the unlicensed contractor population to explode exponentially. It's amusing to watch these impotent little sting operations, they make good TV but are strictly for show...


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## Magnettica (Dec 19, 2006)

^^

I disagree. I work at a union shop. I do residential remodeling/ new construction, commercial, and industrial and we do just fine. Sure the company makes more doing commercial/ industrial, but we also make profit doing new and remodel residential. In most cases, In have to know more code for residential-type work than I do for any commerical or industrial work. But then again, different codes apply to each type of work being done.


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## DBack Elec (Nov 30, 2007)

Yeah condulet, same here in AZ. Seems everyone wants to do residental. Can't compete.


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## 220/221 (Sep 29, 2007)

> Residential remodel is the bottom of the barrel from a business standpoint, which is peculiar since it often requires the highest technical skill sets.


 
Not if you have the right clients.

We keep two crews busy just with residential remodel. And you're right. It DOES require a lot of skill to get the stuff done correctly in the given time frame, working with several other trades inside people's homes.


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