# Old thinset.



## ccoffer (Jan 30, 2005)

What's the best way to get rid of this crap? I did one yesterday where the old tile had been taken up and all the old thinset was left to deal with before I could install a hundred yards of vinyl over this dumpster fire of a substrate. (talk about a perfect storm of crap)

I knocked the tips off with a Turbo and then just went to town with a couple hundred pounds of floor patch. I have a scrape-away, but it just dances around over good modified thinset.

Any secrets?

Thanks,
Chuck.
I


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## Warren (Feb 19, 2005)

sds with a wide bit.


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## ccoffer (Jan 30, 2005)

Yeah. I figured that was the way to go. I'm not really a tile guy _per se_, so I don't have that hammer. (did I mention I hate tile?) I should probably get one, though. They beat the heck out of the little air hammer I use for the hardly ever I have to take up ceramic. I bet I could find one in a pawn shop pretty cheap.

Thanks.


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## platinumLLC (Nov 18, 2008)

I don't do a ton of tile removal either but I rented a bosch 6" scraper chisel for my bosch sds max rotary hammer and it worked great. I couldn't spend the 200 plus to buy the bosch one so I went with this one off ebay and it works just as good as the bosch, http://www.ebay.com/itm/55-SDS-Max-...673?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a77c9c391. I've used it a few times now and am very happy with it.


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## MIKE ANTONETTI (Jul 17, 2012)

Pawn shops suck, just wasted some time at two this morning. A lot of times the price is 3/4 of the new tool. They buy it for like 15% of new value. I've been wanting a Hilti te-905 or 1000 for about a year I've been watching on eBay, one for 5-600 would work, there's a never ending supply of people buying them up.

The flex bits work well, the dust though is extreme. You can get one of the blades/bits for around 80$ they also come in handy for demo'ing VCT, LVT, even cut about 10" wide rows of gluedown hardwood, so the versatility in that tool pays for itself many times over,

The grinders with dust shrouds and dust vacuums are also good. With all the variations of removal several different blades are needed.

You got me thinking I may even prime and self level after skimming the top with a grinder one day if the situation allows.


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## ccoffer (Jan 30, 2005)

_Pawn shops suck, just wasted some time at two this morning. A lot of times the price is 3/4 of the new tool. _

You have to play. Pay no attention to the price. I get deals all the time, but you have to start at one dollar. Straight face offer one dollar. It gets the bull**** out of the way instantly and then you can arrive at a price. They know what stuff costs. They're hoping you honor their "authority" as price sticker makers and just buy the whatever.

Surprise yourself. Offer nothing and see how low they'll go.


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## ccoffer (Jan 30, 2005)

FWIW: Isn't it amazing how thinset can marry itself to concrete? Dry laid tile will pop off, but the marriage of thinset and slab is pretty amazing. The old way where they soaked tile and then beat it into the mud is pretty cool when you think about it. It made the tile as much a part of the structure as the footings.(hope you like the color)


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## mikeswoods (Oct 11, 2008)

I've had good luck with a rented floor buffer and the carborundum stones plate--

That was over concrete--the machine might chew up sheet vinyl--


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## HS345 (Jan 20, 2008)

I use a 7" cup grinder with a dust shroud, and the Dust Deputy collection system. It removes it like butter with minimal dust. For smaller areas I have a shroud for my 4 1/2" grinder. You can also grind concrete with a more aggressive cup. Removes material pretty quickly.


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## HS345 (Jan 20, 2008)

MIKE ANTONETTI said:


> ,
> The grinders with dust shrouds and dust vacuums are also good. With all the variations of removal several different blades are needed.
> 
> You got me thinking I may even prime and self level after skimming the top with a grinder one day if the situation allows.


If height is not an issue, I just self level.


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## PrecisionFloors (Jan 24, 2006)

HS345 said:


> If height is not an issue, I just self level.


The great thing about that is it takes care of prep as well. Grinding the thinset up just to then have to make it flat is twice the work. Not to mention setting on SLC is like buttah. Makes the install go so much smoother.


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## MIKE ANTONETTI (Jul 17, 2012)

I need to get rid of some bags somewhere, I keep stuff on hand and then don't need it, but when I don't have it I scramble.


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## GO Remodeling (Apr 5, 2005)

Depends on the size of the area. Very large area, I'd grind it like Mike suggested. Smaller areas (under 300 sqft), I choose leveling or grinder removal depending on circumstances.


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## MIKE ANTONETTI (Jul 17, 2012)

This one was 340 ft. Tile came up easy, thinset medium hard, in and out 5 hours dust free, two people, 20$ tip each, goodbye (remodeling kitchen) two or 3 chisel gouges, ready for LVT/P, wife not sure.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

I rarely SLC. It's a wide chisel for the Bosch and then grinder for the rest. Half a day and I'm ready to tile in most cases.

But hearing you guys praise SLC all of the time gets a guy to thinking.


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## HS345 (Jan 20, 2008)

MIKE ANTONETTI said:


> This one was 340 ft. Tile came up easy, thinset medium hard, in and out 5 hours dust free, two people, 20$ tip each, goodbye (remodeling kitchen) two or 3 chisel gouges, ready for LVT/P, wife not sure.
> View attachment 161458
> View attachment 161482


Hey Mike, what kind of shroud is that? I like the metal nozzle.


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## MIKE ANTONETTI (Jul 17, 2012)

Part of the Dustram system, two other guys that asked about getting into it are making excellent money.

Initial investment is @ 30k, I been a little slack on it because of other interests, but they're strictly doing removals. The Sarasota guy I hear is booked for 3 months, and the Dallas guy did 30,000$ in removal this month. Ken said he's gonna get rich, I need to wake the f up and focus on the removals. 

Dustram is training a few new crews, so the "secret" is getting out.


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## charimon (Nov 24, 2008)

Mike I have been loving the TG10. put 2.3 hours on it and had over 600sf cleaned to virgin concrete.


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## MIKE ANTONETTI (Jul 17, 2012)

*Old Thinset.*

Great to hear, I'm probably using mine the end of this week if I have to.

I've got 3 different 10" blades, did you get magnetic/wedge inserts?


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## charimon (Nov 24, 2008)

Yes I got a set of double buttons and a set of backed PCD's for glue

It seems to work well, It will grind about 12X as much as my 7" dewalt based on weight of concrete dust per the same amount of time.


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## Rhode Island (Mar 24, 2015)

My rotary is an sds plus and has been fine for all these years. Here's an in progress pic of a floor I just pulled up.


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## MIKE ANTONETTI (Jul 17, 2012)

How could you be happy with SDS plus? I'm not happy with 500 ft in 8 hours out the door. Jack King can do 1000 ft 3 people in less than 8.


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## MIKE ANTONETTI (Jul 17, 2012)

Chuck, the term "old" thinset, 

What conclusion did you come to, thinking it being down for a long time? Just curious.


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## PrecisionFloors (Jan 24, 2006)

I don't think he was referring to it's age relative to anything other than the "new" install going in


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

ccoffer said:


> Any secrets?


Yep. Sub it out. :laughing:

Seriously, though. When you don't have helpers or a crew, it's probably the best option. I started subbing out demo and have never been happier.


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## ccoffer (Jan 30, 2005)

_What conclusion did you come to, thinking it being down for a long time?_

I had it carbon dated, of course.


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## MIKE ANTONETTI (Jul 17, 2012)

I was thinking being down a long time someone might think it gets weaker or easier to remove.


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

Was doing this today. 3" wide chisel in our Bosch SDS Max. It was adheared very well. We cleaned about 100 sq ft in an hour or so. What's left I'll hit with the grinder tomorrow. 

Question for you guys...this tile was installed about 10 years ago. The slab had some cracks in it. The previous installer had done some type of crack repair/isolation. It was a black material. The thinset was bonded to that better than the slab. Any idea what it was? Just curious.

I didn't know the Dust Deputy would handle fine dust like that.


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## MIKE ANTONETTI (Jul 17, 2012)

Was it in sheet form?


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

MIKE ANTONETTI said:


> Was it in sheet form?


No, just over the cracks and past maybe 6" each way. Very stretchy. Some of it I could chisel away from the slab...some of it is stuck.


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## MIKE ANTONETTI (Jul 17, 2012)

Rubbery stuff, no fun to remove. Only stuff I know was the roll type suppression, Lati, Mapelastic.


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## ccoffer (Jan 30, 2005)

_I was thinking being down a long time someone might think it gets weaker or easier to remove. _

That has everything to do with how it hydrated(or didn't) 

Wannna do a 30 page deal on how thinset hydrates and why you're screwed if they did it the right way? Guys who go right over dry Hardi are the removal guy's best friend.


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## ccoffer (Jan 30, 2005)

It makes me sick that these portland compounds can be such vicious creatures. The "dry set" method is pretty much a tug'o'war tie over super dry substrates, but over concrete, the concrete wins every time.


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## CO762 (Feb 22, 2010)

overanalyze said:


> The slab had some cracks in it. The previous installer had done some type of crack repair/isolation. It was a black material.


First thought was 9235 but that's not thick/rubbery, so who knows, they may have troweled on some roofing stuff. Knew an old old school old school guy that didn't warrant any of his instals unless the floor was shotblasted first. Don't know if anyone ever demo'd his work, nor could they as you wouldn't be able to catch/find an edge. That would be a grinding demo or....just stick carpet/laminate over it.


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

Finished up today with demo. About 200 sq. Ft all together. I had a brain fart today. We have a planetary polisher for our concrete tops. It has a vac attachment. I put on 50 grit pads amd hooked it up to the shop vac. Freaking awesome! Almost no dust. Nice even surface. A little floor patch and this one is good to go.


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## charimon (Nov 24, 2008)

Now you are bitten next thing you will be getting is an HTC 500 and a S 26.


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## MIKE ANTONETTI (Jul 17, 2012)

I saw an HTC 500 on eBay yesterday, 11 bids, 2195$ buy it now was 3k and now it's been pulled.


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

I just went and looked up what that was....HOLY CRAP!! Those are a little out of my price range!


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