# Boom goes the...Shower glass



## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

So here's the story. 

We do a lot of bathrooms, for our size. 20-25 depending on the year.

I have used the same glass guy for nearly 5 years. No real issues to date. The last job lost him my business forever.

I typically call them in to measure as soon as tile is up around the outside of the shower so that when the glass comes in we are just finishing up. This gets the customer in the bathroom as soon as possible.

First issue we encountered was when they came out to field measure. They came unprepared. He had nothing to build a template. It's an angled ceiling with a bench. So he rescheduled. 

Second issue, he came it the days later. To me, this is his fault for not being prepared. I didn't think we should have to wait an additional 3 days. 

Third issue, after coming out and building the template he called a few days later to see if he could come back to check the template. I asked why he didn't check it while he was there. Apparently he took a rough template back to the shop and built a final template. He wanted to make sure it was right. So he came back and checked the fit. 

Fourth issue, the final fit was on a Thursday. They get pick ups and deliveries from this glass tempering company on Mondays and Thursdays. We missed Thursday due to the final fit visit. I get a call saying there will be no pick up Tuesday so the template will be picked up Thursday. He also asked at that time if he could come back and make sure the panel would fit up the stairs. Shaking my head I arranged another visit. 

At this point my customer is looking at me like who have I got doing their glass. Their confidence in me and the glass company is at an all time low.

Fifth issue, two weeks late I get a call on the morning of the install that they had cut the large panel wrong (no pitch in the bench cut out). They promised it will be in on Thursday. 

Thursday comes and I get a call from them that the large panel didn't come in, just the door and small panel. They promised it would be there Monday for a Tuesday install.

Sixth issue, I get a call the morning of the install, they cut the large panel wrong again. (No slope on the bench, again)

They are supposed to call me back on Friday to let me know what the plan is. No call (seventh issue).

Monday they call and promised a Thursday install. That would be this past Thursday. Now mind you, my customer is having company come in for Christmas and should have had it in right before Thanksgiving.

Well, it was finally installed Thursday. However they had to grind the glass that butts the face of the bench. I guess the angle on the ceiling was off and this would allow them to make the adjustment. 

The installer was nervous as he ground the glass. He told me a few times that grinding can cause the glass to break. He even said he was taking off the most he could before compromising the integrity of the panel.

To add insult to injury, the owner came by after it was installed. The first thing he says to the owner was, "I just wanted to let you know that I'm not getting discounted for ago the miscut panels." As if that is her concern.

They did take off $400 for all of the delays. And when they rescheduled I asked what else they could do. The owner simply said, "Sorry Rob, I have to make something on this project." I thought, well I'm not, why should you.

Last issue. I go over Saturday to install some light switches and take some pics. All is fine. The husband even took a shower in it that morning. I had to run to Home Depot. I get a call from the HO. Guess what? The panel exploded and the door came crashing down. It damaged the cabinet. I caked the shop and they were gone for the day. I had the installers number. So I called him to try an bs hey in touch with the owner. He refused to give me the owners number nor call him to let him know what was going on. I asked what they were going to do about the mess? He said to leave until Monday. I was like, why in the world would I leave glass all over the bathroom until Monday. Not to mention when the door fell it was blocking the door from opening all of the way.

I tracked down a number for the owner, called, but never heard back. I ended up cleaning up the mess and will head back Monday to install a curtain rod so that their bathroom will be functional.

Needless to say I put a stop payment on the check and I am now looking for a new glass company.


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

It sucks when a sub goes sideways....

Pretty impressive you wrote all that so it could be read & understood...:thumbsup:


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## CarpenterSFO (Dec 12, 2012)

The grinder doesn't make sense to me. Any chance they didn't temper that piece? Or any of them?


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Definitely tempered.


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## RiverBG (Jun 1, 2014)

Was it 3/8"? That really sucks. Lucky nobody was in shower and got hurt. I'd make sure and backbill the guy for all your cleanup time and any damage it caused.


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

Wow! That's crazy Rob. That sucks when there is nothing you can do but try and keep the clients trust from diminishing. I hope you find a better glass company Monday! Hopefully the clients see how you are trying to resolve it for them.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Yep 3/8". That was what I was thinking. Just glad no one was hurt. I will definitely send him a bill.


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## avenge (Sep 25, 2008)

I had a very similar situation. About a year and a half ago I did bath, I was completely done by the time the glass guy came. He measured a piece wrong, customer had to wait another 10 days. I had very expensive accent tile that ran all along the room and continued into the shower. The tile had a border that protruded slightly past the surrounding tile thickness, I explained that to him and he said it wasn't an issue.

I went back after the glass was installed, the door was hitting the tile and the enclosure leaked, fixed both myself. Over a year later the glass that was cutout over the bench shattered, they laughed about it, the mess and the damaged tile.

They were one of 3 glass shops I deal with, in this case I let the customer meet and choose which one they wanted to hire.

I won't be using them again.


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## RiverBG (Jun 1, 2014)

That's crazy! Was it in a track? Did the hinge fail?


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

Once glass is tempered nothing can be done to the glass. Even a small scratch can cause spontaneous breakage later on. I think someone here posted a pic of a table that exploded.

Your glass guy was jerking you around the entire time. 

I also would be really pissed


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## jaydee (Mar 20, 2014)

kind of sounds like he used every excuse he had on you.

also sounds like he knew HE was YOUR go to guy.

Time for a new GO TO guy. :thumbsup:


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

My glass guy told me story of this happening to him a while back.

They installed a frameless door. No big deal. Leave. Get a call that the whole door spontaneously exploded sending glass flying everywhere.

I guess the glass guy called the company who tempered it for him and they didn't act surprised, almost like they knew they had screwed up the door and it wasn't shocking to them to hear that it had exploded.

Scary. Talk about a liability issue...

Hang in there Rob. Not really anything you could have done on this one. Sometimes we are just at the mercy of others.


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

Yeah going back and reading it again the grinding part was a bad idea...I know hindsight. I also have been told once it's tempered that's it. 

As a side question, who here likes the sound of breaking glass....I love throwing old windows in the dumpster!


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80A26-uo-CA


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCBm_IESaVA


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## brickhook (May 8, 2012)

Hate you have to go through all of this, TNT. You've used the same glass guys five years....average 20 or so bathrooms a year ? He's definitely taken you and your business for granted.

As a sub-contractor myself, I assure every GC of mine they're #1...and I try to treat them that way. I'm blessed to have their business and I don't won't to lose it.

I'm thankful nobody got hurt when that door exploded.


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## Golden view (Feb 16, 2012)

I was also under the impression you can't do ANYTHING to glass after the tempering process. It puts the surface in compression at 15,000 PSI or something.


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## Keeyter (Sep 18, 2010)

No Offense but why let yourself, reputation, and customer get jerked around 7 times? At that point the writing is on the wall that something is seriously wrong with your Subs ability to execute and credibility. 

I know glass is always a time consuming commodity, but when someone fails with their planning that many times you can't expect much from their finished product, trusted sub or not. 

I would have shut the whole thing down the moment tempered glass and grinding where in the same sentence.


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

Hey Rob, I'm really sorry. That sucks. I have a great glass guy. I wish you lived closer.

Sorry man


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Keeyter said:


> No Offense but why let yourself, reputation, and customer get jerked around 7 times? At that point the writing is on the wall that something is seriously wrong with your Subs ability to execute and credibility.
> 
> I know glass is always a time consuming commodity, but when someone fails with their planning that many times you can't expect much from their finished product, trusted sub or not.
> 
> I would have shut the whole thing down the moment tempered glass and grinding where in the same sentence.


I agree, but hind sight is 20/20. I have used him for 5 years with no real issues, so he had a few oops saved up.

I almost ditched him when the last panel came in wrong, but it was two weeks ago Monday. Every glass place I called was 2 weeks til delivery. I figured I was already in bed with him and the panel should be installed in a week.

It was a tough call.


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## Warren (Feb 19, 2005)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Update:
> 
> I sent a pretty lengthy e-mail Saturday. Have heard a peep out of him today. I think he is hoping that he can just slink away and not get sued at this point.


Ridiculous for him not to respond. It is a panel for goodness sakes. He needs to get another made up asap, eat the cost, and move on. I had to eat a $3000 french door earlier this year. Stuff happens, people mess up. Fix it and make sure it doesn't happen again.


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## MJconstruction (Jun 17, 2013)

This whole situation sucks. I know with tempered glass if you even hit the edge wrong it will crack. It's really only the edge that will crack it accidentally it's hard to break the face. When it goes it really explodes though. I would make sure that you document everything in case he puts a lien on the homeowner or you.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

I look forward to seeing how this one plays out.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

BamBamm5144 said:


> I look forward to seeing how this one plays out.


I don't think Rob is:whistling


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

hdavis said:


> I don't think Rob is:whistling


Actually, the customers have been awesome. I couldn't ask for better customers. I installed a rod and curtain so they can use it over the holidays. When I came over that I had bought everything to make it work, curtain included. She was so overwhelmed with me buying a curtain. She kept telling me that it was too much and that she really appreciated everything that I was doing. 

In fact I was at her mom's house all day completing punch list items for Christmas. I'll be installing two rooms of flooring after the holidays as well as building custom shelves in the family and starting a major basement finish. 

The fact that he didn't call today says a lot. It says a lot about his business and his manhood. He could lien the house but it's only a couple grand. He could sue me, but again it's only a couple grand. I figure he's just going to be a biatch, tuck his tail and hope that I, or the homeowner, doesn't sure his arse for negligence.

I am going to top this cake of with an invoice for the cleanup.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

If they were occupying the bathroom when this happened, it could've been very bad.

If I were you, I'd follow up again tomorrow to find out what he's doing and when he's going to manufacturer and install the new glass. If he says he's not, tell him that's fine, but make sure to draft paperwork that he will need to sign basically saying he cannot lien the house or collect payment, that type of stuff.


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## fridaymean (Feb 17, 2006)

I'd drive to his office.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

TNTSERVICES said:


> I have no idea. Haven't heard from him yet.
> 
> His installer did call me today, but I was in the movies with my family. I'll find out tomorrow.


What did you see?


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## TimNJ (Sep 7, 2005)

BamBamm5144 said:


> If they were occupying the bathroom when this happened, it could've been very bad.



You can say that again.
I would not want to be in the middle of taking a shower and have that go.
Guaranteed to have some cut up feet if you move.


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## FrankSmith (Feb 21, 2013)

Can you make a claim with his insurance company? I had a driver hit a saw on one of my sights this summer. I made a claim including the cost of my saw and the lost labor from the work we where doing coming to a halt 2 hours before the day was over. I also included the time to deal with the claim and to get the saw set up and in the van. They paid for $600 of labor and for the new saw.

I would also like to know who did this glass for you. I am 30 miles west of you and would prefer not to unknowingly hire him. It wouldn't seem so bad if he where dealing with it.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

BamBamm5144 said:


> If they were occupying the bathroom when this happened, it could've been very bad.
> 
> If I were you, I'd follow up again tomorrow to find out what he's doing and when he's going to manufacturer and install the new glass. If he says he's not, tell him that's fine, but make sure to draft paperwork that he will need to sign basically saying he cannot lien the house or collect payment, that type of stuff.


The customers already said they don't want him in their house again.

I've left messages on the shop phone and their home phone. I told their installer and I sent an email. I'm going call an verbally tell them that they are fired.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Californiadecks said:


> What did you see?


Night at the Museum 3, really good.


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## digiconsoo (Apr 23, 2012)

I can't figure out why this guy would light a match to money like this?

You've used him for nearly five years, and do numerous bathrooms a year with glass ?

Quick arithmetic indicates he's burning a lot of money as well as bridges.

I wonder what could possibly be going through his head.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

digiconsoo said:


> I can't figure out why this guy would light a match to money like this?
> 
> You've used him for nearly five years, and do numerous bathrooms a year with glass ?
> 
> ...


Your guess is as good as mine.


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## littlefred811 (Dec 16, 2012)

Sad to say, but this sounds far too familiar. Developing or relapsing a substance abuse problem?
Not happy to read this. Best of luck.


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## concrete2013 (Nov 6, 2014)

Were you able to cancel the check?


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

concrete2013 said:


> Were you able to cancel the check?


Yes


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

I need updates.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Nothing. I called today and left a message from the to call me. Nothing.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Lame. Send them the clean up bill at your standard rates.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Didn't come across that way to me. I apologize. I just wanted a Xmas Eve CT fight.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

...


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

BamBamm5144 said:


> Didn't come across that way to me. I apologize. I just wanted a Xmas Eve CT fight.


That's because you decided to add to my post something I didn't even remotely insinuate or write.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Merry Christmas Bamm


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Is Christmas legal in California?


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## asevereid (Jan 30, 2012)

BamBamm5144 said:


> Is Christmas legal in California?


Yes, but it may contain products or substances that may cause cancer.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

BamBamm5144 said:


> Is Christmas legal in California?


Yes, but you must obtain the proper license and to do so there is a two year school as well as a final exam.

Once you have the license you can apply for a permit to celebrate. If you want a real Christmas tree you must submit an environmental impact study on the cutting down and removal of said tree.

Once the tree has been removed, it will be quarantined for 6 month in order to make sure that you are not transporting any harmful insects. 

After the 6 months has passed you are free to take your tree, however you must register the route you are taking back to your home with CDOT and wait for the proper transportation permits which usually take any where from 3-6 months.

Now that the tree has withered and died, you will have to apply for a disposal permit or hire a properly licensed disposal company. I won't even get into what it takes to decorate your tree. :thumbsup:

Merry Frickin' Christmas from Commifornia!


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

Lmao! :thumbup:


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Yes, but you must obtain the proper license and to do so there is a two year school as well as a final exam.
> 
> Once you have the license you can apply for a permit to celebrate. If you want a real Christmas tree you must submit an environmental impact study on the cutting down and removal of said tree.
> 
> ...


I'll take California with all its problems over any other state in the country. I'm doing very well here and my property taxes are some of the lowest in the United States. Not to mention I'm building decks year around while wearing shorts. All I have to do is turn off the news and nothing is different then a lot of other places. Contractors license aren't unique to Cali nor are permits. 

My home by itself will practically make me a millionaire here as well. At the end of the day I can sell my home here move to any other state and have several hundred thousand dollars left over. However I don't choose to move, simply put I'll pay a premium for the best weather in the world. Having to pay 300 bucks for a contractors license is a small price to pay. I would never want to put up with Chicago politics either. That's even worse. 

So Merry Christmas


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

Ahh man...he went and played the weather card...


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Californiadecks said:


> I'll take California with all its problems over any other state in the country. I'm doing very well here and my property taxes are some of the lowest in the United States. Not to mention I'm building decks year around while wearing shorts. All I have to do is turn off the news and nothing is different then a lot of other places. Contractors license aren't unique to Cali nor are permits.
> 
> My home by itself will practically make me a millionaire here as well. At the end of the day I can sell my home here move to any other state and have several hundred thousand dollars left over. However I don't choose to move, simply put I'll pay a premium for the best weather in the world. Having to pay 300 bucks for a contractors license is a small price to pay. I would never want to put up with Chicago politics either. That's even worse.
> 
> So Merry Christmas


Like you said, just turn off the news and nothing is different than a lot of other places.

But I agree, this is the worst state to live in. If I could, I would move out of here in a heart beat...and Texas has the best weather and taxes in the world.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

Even Cali weather has it's downside. Around June or July I'd start missing a good thunderstorm.

I don't miss the Texas supercells, but then I try not to do roofing:thumbsup:


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

hdavis said:


> Even Cali weather has it's downside. Around June or July I'd start missing a good thunderstorm.
> 
> I don't miss the Texas supercells, but then I try not to do roofing:thumbsup:


I love Texas supercells. You get that cool breeze on a hot day. A dark side of the sky against a beautiful blue sunny sky. The thunder rolling in and then all hell breaks loose. For 15-30 minutes just a beat down. Then a calm and the clouds pass...to leave you with a hot sticky mess. It's the aftermath that I don't miss.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

I lived in Fort Worth for two years, that humidity was something else. Zero humidity in Cali. We never pay more then one percent of purchase price in property taxes either. The politicians hates it, but it was voted in by the taxpayers during the Reagan years. I also did a year on the Siesta Key in Florida as well. The problem there was wages were very low compared to cost of living. I always end up back here in Orange County Cal. We're a conservative stronghold here. It's like a whole other state outside this county.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

I grew up in Arlington. Never that humid. Some years are worse than others. I do love California weather, San Diego for sure. Orange County is close enough. I spent time in those two places as well as LA...LA and Houston are the buttholes of their states.

I would still move to Texas before Cali, time zone is a big one for me. I like being in the middle of things. By the time you guys get up most have been going for half the day. I can also fly any where in the country in 2-4 hours. Plus Texas is full of Texans. Any where you go it's a pretty nice to be.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

TNTSERVICES said:


> I grew up in Arlington. Never that humid. Some years are worse than others. I do love California weather, San Diego for sure. Orange County is close enough. I spent time in those two places as well as LA...LA and Houston are the buttholes of their states.
> 
> I would still move to Texas before Cali, time zone is a big one for me. I like being in the middle of things. By the time you guys get up most have been going for half the day. I can also fly any where in the country in 2-4 hours. Plus Texas is full of Texans. Any where you go it's a pretty nice to be.


One thing you can't beat in a lot of other states is the friendly people, Texas in particular. :thumbsup:


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## Golden view (Feb 16, 2012)

TNTSERVICES said:


> and Texas has the best weather and taxes in the world.


AK beats it for taxes, but not weather!


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

Californiadecks said:


> I lived in Fort Worth for two years, that humidity was something else. Zero humidity in Cali. We never pay more then one percent of purchase price in property taxes either. The politicians hates it, but it was voted in by the taxpayers during the Reagan years. I also did a year on the Siesta Key in Florida as well. The problem there was wages were very low compared to cost of living. I always end up back here in Orange County Cal. We're a conservative stronghold here. It's like a whole other state outside this county.


My brother just came home from San Diego. Haven't seen him in a year and a half. I think he's hooked on the weather...I'm guessing him and his girl friend will be heading back that way.

That is sweet that you've got a conservative stronghold there in orange county. Never would have guessed.


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## ToolNut (Aug 9, 2012)

And you gotta love that beautiful brown Cali grass they get each summer.


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## littlefred811 (Dec 16, 2012)

If it weren't for living in Colorado for a loooong time, I do love Cali. Can't stand their politics, but I was born there and my family comes from Sacramento. Learned to ski at Mammoth, etc.
I am a cold weather person (worked near the North and South Poles), so this is where I stay.
Now about Texas. Too Hot! And filled with folks who take "Southern Hospitality" VERY seriously! Guaranteed fun when I head south.
Merry Christmas to all.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

When I visited Texas it was too darn humid, it reminded me of a summer in Ottawa but with more heat.

Salt Lake City was the nicest summer weather I've ever experienced. Smoking hot but I wasn't drenched in sweat, nice dry heat.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

littlefred811 said:


> If it weren't for living in Colorado for a loooong time, I do love Cali. Can't stand their politics, but I was born there and my family comes from Sacramento. Learned to ski at Mammoth, etc.
> I am a cold weather person (worked near the North and South Poles), so this is where I stay.
> Now about Texas. Too Hot! And filled with folks who take "Southern Hospitality" VERY seriously! Guaranteed fun when I head south.
> Merry Christmas to all.


You can get any weather, climate or terrain you want in Texas. Pretty much the same in Cali.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Inner10 said:


> When I visited Texas it was too darn humid, it reminded me of a summer in Ottawa but with more heat.
> 
> Salt Lake City was the nicest summer weather I've ever experienced. Smoking hot but I wasn't drenched in sweat, nice dry heat.


I find it funny to say that you visited Texas...It's not too humid in West Texas, the Pan Handle can be but not normally, the DFW area is usually not too bad, but like I said, there are years that it's more so. If you want to experience real humidity, come here in July and August. You can't breathe.

But I find it really funny that you compared an entire state to a single city. Like I said, there are plenty of dry heat areas in Texas, visit El Paso some time.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

TNTSERVICES said:


> I find it funny to say that you visited Texas...It's not too humid in West Texas, the Pan Handle can be but not normally, the DFW area is usually not too bad, but like I said, there are years that it's more so. If you want to experience real humidity, come here in July and August. You can't breathe.
> 
> But I find it really funny that you compared an entire state to a single city. Like I said, there are plenty of dry heat areas in Texas, visit El Paso some time.


Yeah I was referring to Dallas, I guess El Paso is a different story.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Difference is all of Cali is humidity free. It's just not a concern anywhere in the state. My county has an average temp year round of 74 degrees zero humidity.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Californiadecks said:


> Difference is all of Cali is humidity free. It's just not a concern anywhere in the state. My county has an average temp year round of 74 degrees zero humidity.


Northern Cali is definitely not humidity free. I also have some friends in the San Fran area that says it can get humid. Here's the current relative humidity in Cali: 

http://www.usairnet.com/weather/maps/current/california/relative-humidity/

But you do have some of the worst droughts and fires...a direct result of a low humidity. I'll take a bit of humidity to not have to deal with droughts and water bans.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Northern Cali is definitely not humidity free. I also have some friends in the San Fran area that says it can get humid. Here's the current relative humidity in Cali:
> 
> http://www.usairnet.com/weather/maps/current/california/relative-humidity/
> 
> But you do have some of the worst droughts and fires...a direct result of a low humidity. I'll take a bit of humidity to not have to deal with droughts and water bans.


It's humidity free enough you don't notice it. Trust me I've lived up there for years. No place is 100 percent humidity free. Been here 47 years never has a drought or a fire effected my quality of life whatsoever. Which neither is unique to Cali by the way.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Northern Cali is definitely not humidity free. I also have some friends in the San Fran area that says it can get humid. Here's the current relative humidity in Cali:
> 
> http://www.usairnet.com/weather/maps/current/california/relative-humidity/
> 
> But you do have some of the worst droughts and fires...a direct result of a low humidity. I'll take a bit of humidity to not have to deal with droughts and water bans.


I'm an expert in this state because we'll I've been here all my life. We may get a humid week if a tropical storm from Mexico blows in but it's actually nice. I lived in San Francisco is not humid there enough to even feel it. sorry I know more about this then you by a long shot. San Francisco in the summer can even be a little chilly at times.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Northern Cali is definitely not humidity free. I also have some friends in the San Fran area that says it can get humid. Here's the current relative humidity in Cali:
> 
> http://www.usairnet.com/weather/maps/current/california/relative-humidity/
> 
> But you do have some of the worst droughts and fires...a direct result of a low humidity. I'll take a bit of humidity to not have to deal with droughts and water bans.


I can't believe your trying to convince anyone Cali weather is anything like other states weather. It's not. Cali weather is by far not only the best in the United States is arguably the best in the world. Period!


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Californiadecks said:


> I can't believe your trying to convince anyone Cali weather is anything like other states weather. It's not. Cali weather is by far not only the best in the United States is arguably the best in the world. Period!


Never said it was like any other states weather. Just addressing the claim that there is ZERO humidity, when in fact there is.


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## littlefred811 (Dec 16, 2012)

Didn't Mark Twain say something like: "The coldest winter I've ever seen was a summer in San Francisco?"
Funny thing is, I also have a blast going there.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Californiadecks said:


> It's humidity free enough you don't notice it. Trust me I've lived up there for years. No place is 100 percent humidity free. Been here 47 years never has a drought or a fire effected my quality of life whatsoever. Which neither is unique to Cali by the way.


Why is it that we are now just talking about your part of the state? I thought we were taking about California as a whole. Much of California had to deal with it.

And I didn't say it was unique to your state but seems to happen there more than other states, at least that is what we hear all the time.


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## TxElectrician (May 21, 2008)

Californiadecks said:


> One thing you can't beat in a lot of other states is the friendly people, Texas in particular. :thumbsup:


Oh, screw you


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

TxElectrician said:


> Oh, screw you


I said Texas has friendly people. That's a compliment.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

Californiadecks said:


> I said Texas has friendly people. That's a compliment.


And he was making a joke by not being nice toward you...and he's from texas...


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## cwatbay (Mar 16, 2010)

Well, since discussion has migrated from an alcoholic glass company owner to how the weather is in California, I have no choice but to put in my 2 cents....as far as California goes. 

Most of my family came to California in 1868, although some relatives were here before that. I have been in CA for all my life and that would be in the northern part, around SF. 

It does get humid here, maybe not in the southern CA orange county enclave, but it does get humid, especially in areas in the Central Valley. I will agree that the humidity is not as bad as some other places like: Chicago, Hawaii, the Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico, Miami, Taipei and a few other places I have been. 

We have planning on getting the heck outta here pretty much due to the taxes and the politics. On a 1000sf condo we pay over $6100 a year in property taxes (they go up each year). The other costs of living go up too, especially in Silicon Valley. The overcrowding, the crime, the traffic, the on going tidal wave of illegals and H1-B foreign workers have all downgraded the living conditions of what was a nice place to live ( I have lived long enough to see the change). 

The politics in Sacramento and on a local level all contribute to the downgrading of living conditions unless you are extremely wealthy on one end, or, getting all the freebies and government assistance on the other end. 

However, I do have to temper this a bit. We are going to sell our condo for an atrocious amount of money, while at the same time buy a house in a nearby state, and , with the left over money, buy a nice mobile home in an over 55 community in a more affordable area close-by. I have to admit that the money is in CA, certainly in the SF/Silicon Valley area. So I am still going to have my business here ( and in Nevada and Arizona ). The idea is to be like most other and soak CA for the money, but have our main residence in an area that is less crowded, more affordable, less crime and less Draconian-nanny state -"progressive" politics.


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## slowsol (Aug 27, 2005)

This was an interesting thread until you guys vomited all over it.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

slowsol said:


> This was an interesting thread until you guys vomited all over it.


Par for the course my friend.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

slowsol said:


> This was an interesting thread until you guys vomited all over it.


I'll get it back on track.

Sent another email and left another vm. Still no response.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Have you billed them yet?


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Travis is correct. Schluter tile drain.


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## TaylorMadeAB (Nov 11, 2014)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Travis is correct. Schluter tile drain.



How much time does one of those drains add to a shower? That is great..


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

TNTSERVICES said:


> The customer. The old glass company is ignoring me and because I was just the go between (no markup), they are okay with that.


Do you just act as a go between normally? I have been trying to get the markup on the shower doors but recently gave a quote and left the shower door out for a number of reasons. I decided the markup wasn't worth my time to micromanage. 

Just curious if you ever go after the markup?


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Spencer said:


> Do you just act as a go between normally? I have been trying to get the markup on the shower doors but recently gave a quote and left the shower door out for a number of reasons. I decided the markup wasn't worth my time to micromanage.
> 
> Just curious if you ever go after the markup?


Every one I markup. If I have to deal with scheduling and coordination, I'm marking up. 

The only reason I cut myself out of this one was so the trouble they had to endure.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Looks great. Didn't know you had it in you. That shower is bigger than two of the bathrooms in my house combined.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

TaylorMadeCon said:


> How much time does one of those drains add to a shower? That is great..


Not much at all. It's a kit. The drain kit is $99. A Sioux Cheif drain and nicer grate (solid brass in a variety of finishes) is about the same at my local dealer.

I actually did this because the plumber who referred me couldn't be reached to find out the finish they were ordering. So i figured this would be a cool alternative and I didn't have to worry about matching anything.

I do and don't like it though. It looks pretty neat but the customer has removed it a few times and chipped the edge of the tile.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

It was worth the wait to see the final pics - great job!


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## WRGlass (Feb 10, 2015)

That is a very nice looking shower enclosure...looks like it was expertly measured and installed...I bet the guy who measured didn't even need help with the fractions :thumbup:

lol :lol:...but seriously....

It was a pleasure doing business with you Rob. I am sorry that we had to start off with a headache of a job like this. I never like walking into these types of situations. As you can tell we were definitely up to the task. We look forward to working with you in the future.

And thanks to Gary @ Affordable Flooring for the reference. :biggrin:


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

I've got a ton a bathrooms coming up so I'll be giving you a call in the next week or so.

Thanks again for the awesome job.


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## GO Remodeling (Apr 5, 2005)

Turned out great. Nice glass. Oh, and the tile looks good ,too. lol :laughing:

Where was the leak?


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

WRGlass said:


> That is a very nice looking shower enclosure...looks like it was expertly measured and installed...I bet the guy who measured didn't even need help with the fractions :thumbup:
> 
> lol :lol:...but seriously....
> 
> ...


I love to see suppliers and subs step in and make it happen, and show up on this site, and I think everyone else does as well.

Thanks for the post.:thumbsup:


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## Oberon (Nov 2, 2006)

*tempered glass*











This is an edge picture of a piece of 8mm tempered glass after it was broken.

That bit of haze in the center of the sample is the remainder of the tension layer after the glass has "exploded" into hundreds of relatively small pieces.

Tempered glass has an interior tension layer and an exterior compression layer. 

Basically the glass is heated and as it heats it expands. When the glass has reached temperature it is rapidly cooled by blowing air on the top and bottom - it's the cooling portion of the cycle that determines the ultimate psi of the compression layer. 

As the outer layer is cooled it contracts while the center of the glass is still hot and in an expanded state resulting in the surface compression layer and center tension layer. 

To be considered tempered glass the surface compression has to be at least 10,000psi, but it's not uncommon for glass fabricators to temper to 12,000 or even higher (15-16,000 not uncommon) to add an additional safety factor to the finished product.

The surface compression layer is going to be about 21% of the glass to each side of the center tension layer - which is center 58% of the total thickness of the glass prior to release of the tension.

Slowly cooling the glass results in "heat strengthened" rather than tempered glass with a surface compression of between 3500-7500psi. While stronger than annealed glass, heat strengthened glass is not considered a safety product and it cannot be used in place of tempered glass in safety applications.

Anytime the boundary layer between the compression layer and the tension layer in tempered glass is penetrated, for any reason whatsoever, you are going to have catastrophic failure.

You cannot cut or drill tempered glass. Not diamond saw, not waterjet (waterjets are fun to watch with tempered glass), not laser, not underwater, not flaming string, nothing...there is NO special equipment or techniques that allow you to cut or drill tempered glass.

People have claimed that they have successfully cut tempered glass; they have not. Anyone who believes that they have cut tempered glass has cut glass that was not tempered no matter if it was labeled tempered of not.

You _can_ do edge work on tempered glass and you _can_ etch tempered glass and sometimes the glass won't even explode on you, however, don't since it's never a very good idea and modifying tempered glass can definitely affect it's effectiveness as a safety product.

I am frankly surprised that an experienced glass installer would attempt to modify tempered glass in the field. He had to know that eventual failure was almost inevitable.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

Oberon said:


>


Thanks for the very informative post!


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## GO Remodeling (Apr 5, 2005)

Oberon,
yeh, we all know that :whistling. Just kidding.

Can't wait to pull that out when taking glass with somebody.:thumbsup:


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## GO Remodeling (Apr 5, 2005)

Rob,

Clear some room in your mailbox. Got a question for you.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

olzo55 said:


> Rob,
> 
> Clear some room in your mailbox. Got a question for you.


Cleared.


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## littlefred811 (Dec 16, 2012)

Outstanding stuff!

I have never worked with it and likely never will. And I enjoyed this whole thread!

Thanks!!!


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

littlefred811 said:


> Outstanding stuff!
> 
> I have never worked with it and likely never will. And I enjoyed this whole thread!
> 
> Thanks!!!


I'm glad some enjoyment could be had during my hell! :laughing:


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## Oberon (Nov 2, 2006)

TNTSERVICES said:


> I'm glad some enjoyment could be had during my hell! :laughing:


All's well that ends well? That is a great looking shower.


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

You do some nice work, TNT. The niches and the accent strip are all laid out perfect. It really shows proper planning and thought.


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