# No wonder no one takes painters seriously



## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Since they don't even value their own work. 

We are doing a large project and some of it requires painting. I don't like painting so I call painters to find out how much it will cost.

It's a small amount of painting. About 50 sq feet worth of some pillars and a rail. I get the quote for $75 including Sherwin Williams paint. The highest quote was at $130.

What is with that?


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## r4r&r (Feb 22, 2012)

Best guess is they are going on their standard sq. ft. pricing plus about 25% probably because all they heard was about 50 sq. ft.


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

You already know the answer. 

But don't think the worst immediately. It could be left over paint from a very recent job similar to your's. And there may honestly be no work for them right now.

_I'm just trying to play the devil's advocate. Two sides to every story._


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## GPI (Jan 13, 2005)

Why would a Roofer give a chit what someone else charges? Did you screw up 50sf of something? Is it coming out of your pocket? Pointless post only to cause a GPI Tirade!!! ROFL!!!!:boxing:


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## Warren (Feb 19, 2005)

So Bamm......

Did you think they will do it for $60 and the promise of future work?


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## CrpntrFrk (Oct 25, 2008)

You expected tree fity?


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## world llc (Dec 9, 2008)

Warren said:


> So Bamm......
> 
> Did you think they will do it for $60 and the promise of future work?





CrpntrFrk said:


> You expected tree fity?


:laughing::clap:


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

The paint has to be matched to other parts of the house. I was expecting to be paying upwards of $500 and told the HO it would most likely be around that number. It's a half days work according to the painters but hey, what do I know?


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## GPI (Jan 13, 2005)

5 dalla pa owa!!!! hes making a pwofit!!!


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

GPI said:


> 5 dalla pa owa!!!! hes making a pwofit!!!


HO was going to do the job herself but once I told her the quotes she said she would find other things that she wants painted.


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## Kent Whitten (Mar 24, 2006)

You should beat them up in price more :laughing:

Any time I hear talk of paint pricing, I always think of Chris Rock and the prostitute joke.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

You should just give them the $500 out of the kindness of your heart. :whistling:


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## world llc (Dec 9, 2008)

the building industry has done this to painters... most cutthroat trade imo


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

My painters are charging waaaay too much.. :laughing:

Painting is a skilled trade like all others are skilled tradespeople deserve to be paid a fair wage. Bamm pay them a little extra and tell them what they should have charged. Its the right thing to do. This being said they havent finished yet so you might be getting what your paying for. :laughing:


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## r4r&r (Feb 22, 2012)

This all goes back to so many of the posts I have seen in the short time I have been watching this site which boil down to... 
There is what you should be able to charge and what you can charge.
If any of those painters had hit you with the 500 you expected would they have even come close to getting the job after you received the 130 bid? 
Now the question is are you going with the 50 or 130?


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

I have posted before that I used to do a lot of painting work because it was easy to find a lot of customers looking for really top-notch work. Now that people are tightening their wallets and trying to do thing themselves I haven't had a straight painting job in 2.5 years. No skin off my back but I can only imagine being a full time painter.

The last project I bid on was for several rooms and some detailed trim in a older home that was worth around $650k. The customer told me my bid was twice the other companies. I asked if they were using similar techniques and product. The answer was "no". Behr paint, no scuffing, no washing, no priming, no replacement switch plates, no trim repair, etc.. The guy reasoned that if he was going to pay my rate he might as well do it himself


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

r4r&r said:


> This all goes back to so many of the posts I have seen in the short time I have been watching this site which boil down to...
> There is what you should be able to charge and what you can charge.
> If any of those painters had hit you with the 500 you expected would they have even come close to getting the job after you received the 130 bid?
> Now the question is are you going with the 50 or 130?


Yeah why wouldn't they come close to getting the job? I'll gladly pay more to never have a customer call me because of a paint issue.

Haven't decided who I'm going with. Truthfully, I got the best vibe from the lowest priced guy.


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## r4r&r (Feb 22, 2012)

Just hard for anyone,including a gc, to turn over 3 times the amount of the next highest bid is all I'm saying. I hear what ur saying about call backs. That'll eat into profit faster than anything.


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## Sir Mixalot (Jan 6, 2008)

BamBamm5144 said:


> Yeah why wouldn't they come close to getting the job? I'll gladly pay more to never have a customer call me because of a paint issue.
> 
> Haven't decided who I'm going with. Truthfully, I got the best vibe from the lowest priced guy.


So neither painter has seen this job in person. 
All you have is a rough estimate over the phone?

You should take the time and meet with both painters separately at the project location. :thumbsup:


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Sir Mixalot said:


> So neither painter has seen this job in person.
> All you have is a rough estimate over the phone?
> 
> You should take the time and meet with both painters separately at the project location. :thumbsup:


I would hire the one who showed up and looked lime he hadn't done drugs in the last 20 minutes. Good luck with that. :laughing:


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> I would hire the one who showed up and looked lime he hadn't done drugs in the last 20 minutes. Good luck with that. :laughing:


There's some of that but I think a lot of the people who are still painting are new to the trade and are either using it as a bridge between jobs while unemployed or they started that way and gave up looking for other work. They're trying to pocket $10-15 per hour and that's all. I can respect that but I won't try to compete with it.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

My painters are career professionals and their work, knowledge of coatings, and bids reflect that. The quality of the paint/stain work often times separates great jobs from average jobs and paying extra for the best is worth it every time.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Sir Mixalot said:


> So neither painter has seen this job in person.
> All you have is a rough estimate over the phone?
> 
> You should take the time and meet with both painters separately at the project location. :thumbsup:


No, they've all been to the job and met with me.

The HO wanted to paint this area herself and I said I would get her some quotes (shes elderly).


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## Sir Mixalot (Jan 6, 2008)

BamBamm5144 said:


> No, they've all been to the job and met with me.


Wow! :no:
He saw actually looked at the job and said $75. incuding paint!


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## summithomeinc (Jan 3, 2011)

BamBamm5144 said:


> Since they don't even value their own work.
> 
> We are doing a large project and some of it requires painting. I don't like painting so I call painters to find out how much it will cost.
> 
> ...


16.00 for a quart of paint. 16.00 for one hour of labor. 98.00 for everything else. Maybe he has a job 2 blocks over? Maybe he wants more work from you and doesn't want to charge alot now. Who knows? If you figure a service call of 80.00 plus 50.00 per hour plus materials of 16.00. 130.00 isn't far off. I don't see 50sf taking half a day. maybe a picture would help?


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## world llc (Dec 9, 2008)

maybe he'll pull the old " oh, you wanted that preped? holes filled, cracks caulked... $400"


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

r4r&r said:


> Just hard for anyone,including a gc, to turn over 3 times the amount of the next highest bid is all I'm saying. I hear what ur saying about call backs. That'll eat into profit faster than anything.


My gut is worth a lot. If Bams gut says these bids are too low, then they are too low.

I don't find it hard at all to see bids way below what they should be and have some serious concerns. Regardless of the proximity to their current job, or how much a quart of paint is, there should be minimum charges for their expertise and overhead.


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

I just gotta stir the pot....

Why then on the same roof job I get prices from 5k-10k?:whistling


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

griz said:


> I just gotta stir the pot....
> 
> Why then on the same roof job I get prices from 5k-10k?:whistling


Roofers are ALL honest and knowledgeable. You must be mistaken. :no: :laughing:


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## summithomeinc (Jan 3, 2011)

TNTSERVICES said:


> My gut is worth a lot. If Bams gut says these bids are too low, then they are too low.
> 
> I don't find it hard at all to see bids way below what they should be and have some serious concerns. Regardless of the proximity to their current job, or how much a quart of paint is, there should be minimum charges for their expertise and overhead.


I think it depends on your type of business and your business plan. Like I posted before. As a service company if you price your services as a service call plus hourly plus materials then the 130.00 isn't too far off. On the other hand if you define your business as one trade not doing service work then you would need to charge much more.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

griz said:


> I just gotta stir the pot....
> 
> Why then on the same roof job I get prices from 5k-10k?:whistling


I'll answer that one in the morning although I agree, it makes no sense!


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## bconley (Mar 8, 2009)

I think the price is so low because painters everywhere are dropping their labor rates because material increases have killed profits for painters :thumbsup:


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## aptpupil (Jun 12, 2010)

as stated by summithomeinc $130 could make sense for a quick prep and paint job. he'll probably be at the paint store anyway so getting the paint matched doesn't add much time. sounds like he was angling for more work or maybe desperate.
without looking at it i'd say 50sf would be 2 hours at the most so $130 is totally reasonable for a small time guy who has to piece together 40 hours of work a week.


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## KAP (Feb 19, 2011)

BamBamm5144 said:


> HO was going to do the job herself but once I told her the quotes she said she would find other things that she wants painted.


You could have also just charged her $400 instead of $500, and given the painter half and you keep half for saving her $100 and doing the legwork and bringing the business to the painter... She pays less than you thought she would, he makes more, you make more... Everyone wins... :clap:

Painters would do better for themselves and their family by having a minimum daily charge... not alot of prep-jobs to fill a day...


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

KAP , I'm not charging her anything. I did it as a favor as her husband just passed away. I gave her the quotes and told her who I prefer. This is ultimately between her and the painter.

I'm not a big fan of playing middle man.


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## jhark123 (Aug 26, 2008)

Warren said:


> So Bamm......
> 
> Did you think they will do it for $60 and the promise of future work?


:clap:, I can't tell you how many have tried that line with me.


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## Spaint90 (Dec 26, 2011)

bconley said:


> I think the price is so low because painters everywhere are dropping their labor rates because material increases have killed profits for painters :thumbsup:



I cant tell if your serious or sarcastic. my respect is leaning towards the later.

50 sq ft really doesnt sound like half a day to me.. even for pillars and a rail. but that might include burrito making time, and a couple cervezas.


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## ModernStyle (May 7, 2007)

Many painters are just stupid when it comes to pricing their work. I know of 2 guys here who do nice work and charge $20 an hour and will drop down to $15 an hour for wallpaper removal. 
I know another guy who will sub out work to other painters and pay them usually around $20 per hour while charging the customer $23 an hour. 
A decent painter in this area should pull down atleast $35 an hour working for himself. A guy charging $20 and paying taxes and insurance and whatever overhead he has is actually pulling down $10 an hour if he is lucky. 
I try to tell these guys that you need to make the sale on quality not on price. They just don't get it. 
They think that working 50 hours a week painting apartments and low end housing is where it's at. I try to explain to the guy who subs out work that he could be pulling in $3000 a week without touching a brush if he priced everything right, he doesn't get it. For some reason they would rather work 50 hour weeks to make what they should be making in 20 hours. Instead of the money being what's important it's like they value the look of always being busy.


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## bconley (Mar 8, 2009)

Spaint90 said:


> I cant tell if your serious or sarcastic. my respect is leaning towards the later.
> 
> 50 sq ft really doesnt sound like half a day to me.. even for pillars and a rail. but that might include burrito making time, and a couple cervezas.


Thanks, yes sarcastic I was referring to the other thread where painters said they can't pass on the material prices to the customer! So they were cutting out their profit.


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## Spaint90 (Dec 26, 2011)

bconley said:


> Thanks, yes sarcastic I was referring to the other thread where painters said they can't pass on the material prices to the customer! So they were cutting out their profit.


I kind of figured, but with all of those that seriously complained about it i wasnt sure. :thumbsup:

This site could have made a killing if they adverstised tampons on that thread.


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