# Sink hook up number.



## andeeznuts (Feb 21, 2008)

Whats up dudes my my plumber wants to charge 100 dollars to install a faucet on a brand new counter top...the valves are already there...does that seam a little pricey.


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

Do you know his overhead? It will take him time to drive over and do the install properly. Really? Pay the man. Some shops have a minimum charge.


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## chris klee (Feb 5, 2008)

andeeznuts said:


> Whats up dudes my my plumber wants to charge 100 dollars to install a faucet on a brand new counter top...the valves are already there...does that seam a little pricey.


No, it seems cheap. Can I have his number?


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

Honestly?

You can't make money charging any less than 75 buck for a service call...even if it takes 5 minutes.

I assume you either don't run your own business or you are relatively new to this?


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## KillerToiletSpider (May 27, 2007)

andeeznuts said:


> Whats up dudes my my plumber wants to charge 100 dollars to install a faucet on a brand new counter top...the valves are already there...does that seam a little pricey.


I'll do it for twenty boxes of Twinkies.


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## Doctor Handyman (Mar 13, 2012)

Dude, What's it worth to you? How much would you charge this customer if you did it yourself? I typically charge $80 if in a 5 mile radius, FWIW.


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## rselectric1 (Sep 20, 2009)

andeeznuts said:


> Whats up dudes my my plumber wants to charge 100 dollars to install a faucet on a brand new counter top...the valves are already there...does that seam a little pricey.


No! It sounds more than reasonable. (In fact on the inexpensive side in my neck of the woods)

I'll take his number too.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

My average (without actually looking at my records) would be in the neighborhood of $180


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## Builder Butch (Jan 30, 2012)

sounds cheap to me also.


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## Trick1 (Dec 6, 2008)

I wouldn't even start my truck for that price...


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## VAviaCo (Sep 3, 2008)

Oconomowoc said:


> My average (without actually looking at my records) would be in the neighborhood of $180


I need to switch trades


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## r4r&r (Feb 22, 2012)

Hell $180 is cheap here.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

r4r&r said:


> Hell $180 is cheap here.


It depends. I like the word value better.

I have a defined territory for my business model. And in my territory a basic lavatory faucet change out from the time I start my truck to the time I restart my truck is about 1 1/4 hours. 

So an average of 6 service calls a day at around $200 is $1200 a day. That's quite a bit for a one man shop. 

So $180 is a pretty good value. I've had home owners call me frustrated that they've spent half a day on something like this. Some charge more I suspect but overall not many contractors are more efficient than me. Probably none of them actually. 

If a contractor gives them a bill for $225..... which does happen, it's the result of company inefficiencies and poor organization that derives that price. In other words, I make more money at $180 than a guy who charges $225. He charges that because he has to.

That's competitive advantage.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

Oconomowoc said:


> It depends. I like the word value better.
> 
> I have a defined territory for my business model. And in my territory a basic lavatory faucet change out from the time I start my truck to the time I restart my truck is about 1 1/4 hours.
> 
> ...


Maybe plumbing is a little more cut and dry but I have never booked 6 service calls in a day in my life. Too many unforeseen problems can come up in the course of a day to mess up your schedule. Although if a call finished in a fraction of the time I often call and try to move a job up to save time...or go out for breakfast.

But wow 6 calls a day...you are a machine.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

Inner10 said:


> Maybe plumbing is a little more cut and dry but I have never booked 6 service calls in a day in my life. Too many unforeseen problems can come up in the course of a day to mess up your schedule. Although if a call finished in a fraction of the time I often call and try to move a job up to save time...or go out for breakfast.
> 
> But wow 6 calls a day...you are a machine.


I've done over 10 but that's rare. I did 5 water heaters once. I wanted to cry


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

Oconomowoc said:


> I've done over 10 but that's rare. I did 5 water heaters once. I wanted to cry


As a one man show?


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

Keep in mind though, I'm 100% set up for it. It doesn't matter what the surprise is I'm covered and I have the parts. I also schedule things VERY careful like I would never schedule a gas job knowing I have a water heater install at noon. Lol

Well planned I can do quite a bit. Some calls are literally 5 minutes. Experience matters. That's whyso remodelers and new construction plumbers fail at service, it's whole different animal.

Also, some days I have 2 calls and that's it. It can be real up and down. Since the election my phone calls have been cut in half but that's slowly coming back I think.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

Inner10 said:


> As a one man show?


Always.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

Sometimes I completely botch it and piss of customers. Those are bad days.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

I'm friends with a water treatment guy who does 3-4 iron curtains a day 5 days a week all copper and all sweated joints. 

He puts me to shame. He does very well for himself, that's the power of marketing.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

Oconomowoc said:


> Keep in mind though, I'm 100% set up for it. It doesn't matter what the surprise is I'm covered and I have the parts. I also schedule things VERY careful like I would never schedule a gas job knowing I have a water heater install at noon. Lol
> 
> Well planned I can do quite a bit. Some calls are literally 5 minutes. Experience matters. That's whyso remodelers and new construction plumbers fail at service, it's whole different animal.
> 
> Also, some days I have 2 calls and that's it. It can be real up and down. Since the election my phone calls have been cut in half but that's slowly coming back I think.


Still pretty remarkable, if I drill one hole I have to haul in the shop vac then spray and wipe the dust off of near by surfaces. After I pack up all the tools the time really adds up.

I've got employees now and I find I've been more efficient because I can deal with the detailed stuff while they run wires and clean up.

I keep service booked out about a week, I have to leave time to squeeze in emergency alarm calls, leave a bit of room for screw-ups etc. I find if I ever pack a day I end up bumping the calls at the end...then they get re-booked in a priority position and I have to bump another person...and the domino effect begins.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

Yeah, scheduling is always the hardest part for me. We differ in what we do by quite a bit I'd imagine. When I show up my problems are often times confined to a few square feet like a cartridge changout. You on the other hand require moving around a home that's running wires etc, that's a whole different set of problems. 

I can predict with with 90% certainty how long something will take. Assuming I'm well stocked (biggest barrier) most cartridges take me 5 minutes.

Know what I mean?

I bet you're pretty good at judging a sub 2000 sq ft ranch home security installation.


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## skyhook (Mar 17, 2007)

andeeznuts said:


> Whats up dudes my my plumber wants to charge 100 dollars to install a faucet on a brand new counter top...the valves are already there...does that seam a little pricey.


What here you expecting, Tree fiddy?


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## r4r&r (Feb 22, 2012)

Oconomowoc said:


> It depends. I like the word value better.
> 
> I have a defined territory for my business model. And in my territory a basic lavatory faucet change out from the time I start my truck to the time I restart my truck is about 1 1/4 hours.
> 
> ...


My comment was in no way a slam against you. I read your posts in the biz plan thread with great interest and feel it gave a little insight into your efficiencies. 

My Step-Dad called a plumber out, despite my objections and willingness to handle it for them, to replace the supply shutoff for one of their toilets and it was $150 after $50 coupon and they wanted $450 to replace a frost proof in brick. 

Another friend was quoted 6 bills labor only for two lav faucets and it didn't include new shutoff valves. 

I also saw an add in HD for "standard" faucet install for $109 I think it was. I cringe every time I see the words "standard installation" next to a price cuz I have never heard of anyone that had a standard install situation when it came time for the actual price. I would rather quote a real price and eat it every now and then if I had to.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

r4r&r said:


> My comment was in no way a slam against you. I read your posts in the biz plan thread with great interest and feel it gave a little insight into your efficiencies.
> 
> My Step-Dad called a plumber out, despite my objections and willingness to handle it for them, to replace the supply shutoff for one of their toilets and it was $150 after $50 coupon and they wanted $450 to replace a frost proof in brick.
> 
> ...


I wasn't offended in any way.

I'd like to comment on the HD thing. 

I hear and read about contractors trying to bid against HD or hack handyman types. The reality for me is in the course of a month I might get one single call asking me to compete or price shop. And really, that's a stretch because I haven't been asked to compete with them in months. 

That is the power of sound marketing and what I harp on people so hard about it. I never run across these types because I designed a marketing machine that eliminates it as a variable. 

Read very closely what I have written in the past. There's much power in my words but you have to read it slow and implement it into practice. I see people struggle with this and it's ridiculous because they don't have to.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

Oconomowoc said:


> Yeah, scheduling is always the hardest part for me. We differ in what we do by quite a bit I'd imagine. When I show up my problems are often times confined to a few square feet like a cartridge changout. You on the other hand require moving around a home that's running wires etc, that's a whole different set of problems.
> 
> I can predict with with 90% certainty how long something will take. Assuming I'm well stocked (biggest barrier) most cartridges take me 5 minutes.
> 
> ...


Very well said.

I tell ya...you throw a computer in the mix and a 5 min job can turn into an all day ordeal. 

I didn't mean this to turn into a thread about service work...but I use to carry far more stock then I do now. Having the cube van was like a warehouse on wheels. Funny enough I think at the end of the day my profit hasn't really changed when I scaled down my inventory and try to do more JIT. Inventory carrying costs aren't cheap when you deal with electronics that slide into obsolescence so quickly.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

Inner10 said:


> Very well said.
> 
> I tell ya...you throw a computer in the mix and a 5 min job can turn into an all day ordeal.
> 
> I didn't mean this to turn into a thread about service work...but I use to carry far more stock then I do now. Having the cube van was like a warehouse on wheels. Funny enough I think at the end of the day my profit hasn't really changed when I scaled down my inventory and try to do more JIT. Inventory carrying costs aren't cheap when you deal with electronics that slide into obsolescence so quickly.


I find this conversation interesting , so many times on this forum we scratch the surface but never dive deep into topics that really matter. You and I think a lot alike.

I'd like to learn more about your truck and inventory switch. That's my current thinking/issue as my business evolves. 

We should start a cool thread on this.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

I keep coming back to this. Lol. It could change my entire business


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## r4r&r (Feb 22, 2012)

I figured you had already pulled the trigger on that based on the post a few weeks back about pricing it at a dealer. Sounds like you are ready but something about it is scratchen at the back of your head. Any idea what it is?


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

Oconomowoc said:


> I keep coming back to this. Lol. It could change my entire business
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 81785


Yeah working for ADT would change things for ya. :laughing:

Seriously though...I was never the type to take pictures but I wish I had, I think part of the problem was the cube van gave me too much freedom to spread my junk around and I wasn't proactive enough to force myself to keep things tidy. Having a smaller vehicle and doing the daily shuffle you don't have a choice.

The condensed version is I was driving a 16 foot cube van and a 99 ford taurus wagon. Well next thing you know I got a few back to back jobs at downtown condos. We all know what having a truck downtown is like...you can't fit in half of the lots and the other half won't let you park...the ones that do charge the bus rate which is 3-4x the price. So I started just putting what I needed into the wagon and it worked pretty well. I stored large quantities of stock in the van and kept small portable containers in the car that I just topped up when I needed. 

Then the taurus was written off and I got a Honda Element, after that I only used the van for transporting large TVs, extension ladders, strut and conduit. 

Then I bought a house near downtown and could only park one vehicle, so I bought my truck which I use for business and personal use. I like the truck for picking up materials and transporting my motorcycle but I'm still a little short on space from time to time. I think I'm going to ditch the tonneau cover for a cap with a ladder rack.

I guess you could say I'm constantly searching for the perfect setup and have never found it. I think my ideal would be one of the smaller Sprinters and keep everything neatly organized in there...then keep my truck for mostly personal use.

The difference now is instead of digging through the truck for a part for half an hour and either finding it or not finding it I know right away if I have it or not. If I don't I re-book a time to finish. 

It got to the point where years later I would be throwing thousands of dollars of parts in the trash because they were worthless. Who needs a case of S-Video cables anymore? No one. I'd find multiple boxes of antiquated components that are now usless or could be sold for 10 cents on the dollar.

I looked around at component video and VGA baluns worth scads of money and I'l probably never use them again but kept them in stock...what a waste. 

So now I stock small amounts, re-order a little more often, try not to get sucked in by sales and stock up like crazy. If I think I know what the problem is I will order the part I think it is and bring it with me...if I'm wrong I'l keep it in stock unless it's an oddball then it gets returned. I'm still bad at keeping when I should really be returning.

Anyway...that was quite the rambling...but bottom line is I really don't know if my new way is anymore or less efficient. It's probably a wash.


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## rex (Jul 2, 2007)

Oconomowoc said:


> I've done over 10 but that's rare. I did 5 water heaters once. I wanted to cry


Water heaters are money makers, I'd be good with one 50 standard install a day. 5 sliders would be even better.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

rex said:


> Water heaters are money makers, I'd be good with one 50 standard install a day. 5 sliders would be even better.


It made sense to do it all in one day Rex. It was 5 electrics on a 5 unit condo. I had them all draining at the same time. The risers were about 4" off the top so I just barely got couplings on. It was really tight. I put in Bradfords.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

r4r&r said:


> I figured you had already pulled the trigger on that based on the post a few weeks back about pricing it at a dealer. Sounds like you are ready but something about it is scratchen at the back of your head. Any idea what it is?


I'm a bit nervous about the Ford Transit Connect. To make it work I'd have to tig weld up a rack to build pullouts then reduce my inventory. 

Pretty sure I could reduce my costs by around $15k a year but along with that comes risk like inventory and storage capacity.

Plumbers are doing it though, I'm just not 100% on this yet.


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## chris klee (Feb 5, 2008)

Do you have a shop or garage mike? Maybe keep a stock there and top off every morning?

That way you can still have a good stock, just carry 5 of everything instead of 20 of them.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

chris klee said:


> Do you have a shop or garage mike? Maybe keep a stock there and top off every morning?
> 
> That way you can still have a good stock, just carry 5 of everything instead of 20 of them.


That's exactly what I'm thinking Chris. 

Basically breaks down like this.....

Most people have smart phones and tablets. The way I currently do business is I have these people snap a photo of the fixture and text or email it to me. From that I can bid of course but more importantly make sure I have the parts. I always do have these parts but on the new truck I might not. The question of course is whether or not I can truly stock everything even if it's only one of each.

So I spent a few days writing down frequency of usage of parts. It was a tall task let me tell you. Lol

I figured I needed enough on the truck for 3 days, that would get me through the week and still gets parts delivered by Friday if need be.

Then I sat down and designed a killer rack. The rack is a rectangular cube and it would have pullouts. The pullouts are one piece drawers and because the Transit Connect has dual sliding side doors I can simply open either side and pull it out from either direction. The max width of the rack and the drawer is 60".

The rack/cube would be 48" tall by about 28" wide and of course 5' long. The rack would have 8 custom build pullout drawers. 

One drawer for 3" pvc

One drawer for 1 1/2" & 2" pvc

One drawer for copper and cpvc and pex

One drawer for gas and miscellaneous parts

One drawer for toilet and faucet repair parts

One drawer for hangers and supports of all sorts

One drawer for water supplies for lavs and toilets.

I still have one drawer left.


That would give me most of my parts. Now, there's not much space left but in the back I also have a left and right side where I could build shelves. I still need to keep consumables like putty, glue, dope, tape, fluids, mapp gas, oil, screws, nails etc etc.

The other side would be nipple trays and some other stuff like tools.

Still not done. The transit is 4' 6" tall inside so on top of the rack, but accessed from the back I have space available. Here I could stock over runs, flashings, flue pipe, hose bibbs, check valves, ferncos etc etc. I could even keep faucets and a garbage disposer. 

If push comes to shove I could tear out the passenger seat and build storage on that side.

Then, and this is weird, I would put a hitch on and weld a custom carrier for hauling a water heater. I could also pull a trailer because I don't do that many water heaters.


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## mrcharles (Sep 27, 2011)

rex said:


> Water heaters are money makers, I'd be good with one 50 standard install a day. 5 sliders would be even better.


Yeah but we already know you sell out of the box heaters as new, so its easy to make margins that way.


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