# Why do they feel they can barter our prices?should we?



## woody123 (Apr 29, 2018)

i`m sure this happens to you 

how do you feel about that?

been doing this for years ( i`m 59 )
still bugs me when new clients think its good business on their end to bargain us down.
just yesterday , i went on an estimate

he got my name off "Angieslist"
said he called because i have a :" a" rating on there since 2006

small job. 5 or 6 items to get the home ready to sell.
would have to go 2 different days and buy some materials

called him when i got home, and told him it would be $600
he texted me within 5 minutes back with " can you do $500?"
text him back with " i really don`t like to bargain . buy i`ll split the difference "
he texted " well , i have a bid n 3 days, ill see what price they give me , and get back to you"

for $50??
he called this morning again and asked if i would be willing to go down to the $500.
told him i really can`t .

how would a these people feel if everyday , when they went to work , their boss wanted to bargain how much they were going to make that day?

am i seeing this wrong?


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

I call it the _WalMarting of America_.

Price alone drives most people. You need to sell quality, reliability etc. 

You need to qualify your potential customers better and stand firm. The instant you lower your price, you tell them two things:

1. You were overcharging them.
2. You're a push-over.

BTW, it's not _bartering_. Barter means you're taking something beside money in exchange for the service you're providing. What they're doing is _negotiating_.


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## RyNinDaCleM (Jun 20, 2018)

It's not like buying a car. What we do is supply a utility, a service that they are in need of. If they want to get 1, 3 or 10 quotes, that is their way of comparison shopping. It's fine and acceptable. The quote is exactly that, the quote. If they take yours and you try to up the balance without good cause, they show you the quote, so (almost) never deviate from what you believe your time, skill, and the utility of the service you are providing is worth.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

There's little room for pride when they don't know us and we're a commodity. Goes double for home sales. I think of it as a relationship game that can be played a bit. For instance, if there's paint required, you pause thoughtfully....and say "if you supply the paint, I'll do it this time. Don't tell others." 

I'm doing a home inspection punch list quote right now, and I've already weeded out a few b.s. items on the front end (I'm not bringing a 40 foot ladder for one piece of rotted trim this time..since it might blow up the whole bid), but there are other tasks that are considered difficult to a homeowner, but I'll do them. A tiny bit of haggling on a punch list isn't a bid deal.


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

You certainly don't have to lower your price. 9 times out of 10, I wouldn't negotiate on a residential bid. The 1 in 10 was if I really wanted the job due to timing or if I really liked the particular project or client. I'll admit that I lowered my price for plenty of little old ladies too.

If someone lobs a lower price to see if you'll bite then there's nothing wrong with coming back with an explanation of the value you bring. I found that most times they were just fishing and seemed happy to establish that I took pride in my work and was confident in my prices. They really have no idea what construction costs so it's reassuring when a pro is confident that their price is fair and explains why. I always said that I would definitely NOT be the cheapest guy in my first conversation with any potential customer.

If they really want to grind you down then you probably don't want to work for them unless you can still make a margin you're comfortable with and you really need to cash flow. I know a lot of guys that will take the lower offer and then juice any change orders to get it back but there's not much opportunity to do that on a $500 job.


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## KAP (Feb 19, 2011)

woody123 said:


> i`m sure this happens to you
> 
> how do you feel about that?
> 
> ...


I think you answered your own question... because you just did... so why wouldn't they do what they've been trained to do?


We don't give away money without them giving something up... that's actual negotiating... them getting $50 off without giving something up just makes them wonder how low the discount well will go... 

Unless you're starving for work, I would of taken it away and told him...*
"Your instinct to call me because I have an A-rating was the right one... I'm sure you understood that I have that rating for a reason and what I charge is a more than fair price for that reputation that spans over so many years and it's not because I'm the cheapest, but because of the quality of work... just read the reviews... that said, I've no doubt you can find a B-lister who might do it for the $50 less you seem to be focused on instead of getting the A-level of service that's really what's in your best interest to be focused on and what initially drew you to contact me... I'm sure if you showed up at work on Monday and your boss said he could find someone younger, less experienced, and without a strong track record to do your job for less, you'd view that $50 in a different light... so only you can decide if the quality of work you're looking to do to sell is worth the extra $50..."
*​


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## MattK (Apr 2, 2009)

RyNinDaCleM said:


> It's not like buying a car. What we do is supply a utility, a service that they are in need of. If they want to get 1, 3 or 10 quotes, that is their way of comparison shopping. It's fine and acceptable. The quote is exactly that, the quote. If they take yours and you try to up the balance without good cause, they show you the quote, so (almost) never deviate from what you believe your time, skill, and the utility of the service you are providing is worth.


You mentioned 10 quotes. I once went to look at a vinyl job and as I was ringing the bell, a truck with a bunch of half filled vinyl boxes, random channels, a couple partial coils in his bed pulled up. Looking confused, the husband(who initially called me) tells me the wife hired this guy yesterday afternoon and they had 16 total consults and had totally lost track of where they had left off with everyone, hence why I never was told not to come out and look at the job because it's no longer available. 

Having just left the site an hour early and driven about 45 mins out of the way, I was pissed. I told him had he told me I was one of almost 20 guys coming I would have laughed on the phone, told him I definitely won't be the cheapest as that's clearly what they were looking for and to have a nice day. 

I get some people are nervous and if you call 2 or 3 guys and maybe 1 gives you a bad feeling, you may want to call another or 2 at most, but 20?!? Who has 15-30 mins to walk your exterior explaining what you're looking for regarding specifics or repairs and then answer the litany of questions a good contractor would have...20 freaking times!

Sorry to take the thread off track but when I read about your customer who wants to squeeze you on a $600 job, these people immediately came to mind.


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## fred54 (Dec 1, 2010)

This is why I am so happy I don't advertise anywhere.


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## RickP (Jan 31, 2018)

I can only think of one time I was asked if I could do better on my pricing. I told the guy I can't lower my labor cost, but i could use inferior materials which might save him a few bucks. He went with my original bid.


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## Windycity (Oct 3, 2015)

woody123 said:


> he got my name off "Angieslist"



Found the problem......


People that use Angie’s list, home advisor or whatever are shopping online just like we all do like looking for deals on amazon. 

I don’t make a whole ton of money on small jobs like that to begin with so I don’t bargain at all, I just tell them good luck and make sure whoever they hire has workers comp and general liability insurance to protect themselves 




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## t.carpenter00 (Jan 28, 2018)

Your not thinking wrong. People are ridiculous! 

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## mstrat (Jul 10, 2013)

Took an employee up to measure up a complicated roof job once...the owner called because his best friend was a good customer of mine. We pulled into the driveway (25 minute drive to another city mind you) and there are 2 different company trucks there, one was pulling out and another in the driveway. I normally would have just left and called on the way home saying 'no thanks' but since it was a close friend of a good customer I circled the block and toured the neighborhood. We walked into the best non-customer interaction ever. 

First, they owners wanted to show me the skylight inside, so I slid off my shoes and the guy lit up and yelled to his wife in a Russian accent "LOOK! CONTRACTOR WHO CARES!!! TOOK OFF HIS SHOES!!!"

We then went on the roof to measure some things up, and I could see the bad flashing around the skylight...clear as day. I asked if he wanted us to do a temporary repair to the flashing since they were calling for rain, he said NO...JUST WANT NEW ROOF PRICE. ok ok ok, did some math and gave him a price. He laughed and said, "NO WAY, LAST GUY WAS LESS $500. YOU CAN DO $600 LESS? 

Nope, truth was I didn't particularly want the job anyway, but was willing to patch together the skylight so it didn't rain in on his grand piano in a few hours, but he wanted nothing to do with it. 

Fast forward 6 weeks, and I get an e-mail with a full video attached, complete with an absolute ton of rain coming into the same skylight, and several buckets catching the rain on top of the grand piano. You could hear the couple speaking 'unbelievable.......new roof....new skylight....now this...." in russian accents. His e-mail asked if I could come fix the flashing now and charge the company that did his roof...no thanks...


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

mstrat said:


> Took an employee up to measure up a complicated roof job once...the owner called because his best friend was a good customer of mine. We pulled into the driveway (25 minute drive to another city mind you) and there are 2 different company trucks there, one was pulling out and another in the driveway. I normally would have just left and called on the way home saying 'no thanks' but since it was a close friend of a good customer I circled the block and toured the neighborhood. We walked into the best non-customer interaction ever.
> 
> First, they owners wanted to show me the skylight inside, so I slid off my shoes and the guy lit up and yelled to his wife in a Russian accent "LOOK! CONTRACTOR WHO CARES!!! TOOK OFF HIS SHOES!!!"
> 
> ...


Ha. For my latest home sale job, the Eastern European owners have a steam shower with some "issues" as identified on the home inspection. (I probably should have taken pics to post here, but it seemed like bad form.) The owner is a big shot in the stone business, so imagine some really swanky stone in a bathroom....and a really bad tile installer and plumber....there's no access for the steam unit...gaps behind all the Kohler fixtures that no caulk can fix, etc. 

It was such a pleasure to say "I can't fix that item....it's all wrong." I washed my hands, so to speak. I suggested that owner call his installer for the repair since he's so well-connected. Pretty hot home, otherwise.


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## MattK (Apr 2, 2009)

mstrat said:


> Took an employee up to measure up a complicated roof job once...the owner called because his best friend was a good customer of mine. We pulled into the driveway (25 minute drive to another city mind you) and there are 2 different company trucks there, one was pulling out and another in the driveway. I normally would have just left and called on the way home saying 'no thanks' but since it was a close friend of a good customer I circled the block and toured the neighborhood. We walked into the best non-customer interaction ever.
> 
> First, they owners wanted to show me the skylight inside, so I slid off my shoes and the guy lit up and yelled to his wife in a Russian accent "LOOK! CONTRACTOR WHO CARES!!! TOOK OFF HIS SHOES!!!"
> 
> ...


It's probably because I'm a spiteful jerk but these are my favorite phone calls and emails! :thumbsup:

Once priced a full cedar impression 40 sq ranch for my Dad's close friend. I think I was 2k higher than this straphanger who convinced him he was going to make this extra hemmed kick bend on all the windows to create a shadow in the 6" wrapped metal. I'm looking at the drawing of what he wanted and I told him it can't be done on a brake. We could discuss other options in different materials but the way the other contractor had explained it was wrong and impossible due to the way you have to bend materials and how all bends need to be in a certain order and how there are minimums you can get before the mouth of even a tight brake will slip out.

Anyway, he tells me thanks but he trusts this guy knows what he's doing because he was in his 50's and at the time I was late 20's. Job goes horribly. Impressions crooked all over, face nails everywhere. Dad says it looks like the guy nailed his rake and fascia metal with a sledge hammer. Best part is his stupid window wraps he sold the HO, he wasn't able to actually make and what he did put up looked horrible. HO was furious and called my Dad asking how much I'd charge him to fully redo the 20+ windows with something a little more exotic than the hacked mess that was installed. Dad tells him laughing you don't have enough money in the world.....


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

woody123 said:


> ................................
> 
> am i seeing this wrong?


Yes. You are. People bargain. That's what they do.

The reasons are endless.

Your price is your price.

Smile, state your price, and show some balls.

Because some times, there's going to be a 20 something kid wearing tights, arm tattoos of comic book heroes that will undercut you by 100 bucks.

And they may well get the job.

They serve a vital purpose. They educate the customer so next time, you get someone more appreciative of what the word "value" means.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

woody123 said:


> how would a these people feel if everyday , when they went to work , their boss wanted to bargain how much they were going to make that day?
> 
> am i seeing this wrong?




Everyone has to negotiate a salary with their hiring boss. Only difference is those jobs are long term and yours are short.


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## KAP (Feb 19, 2011)

mstrat said:


> Took an employee up to measure up a complicated roof job once...the owner called because his best friend was a good customer of mine. We pulled into the driveway (25 minute drive to another city mind you) and there are 2 different company trucks there, one was pulling out and another in the driveway. I normally would have just left and called on the way home saying 'no thanks' but since it was a close friend of a good customer I circled the block and toured the neighborhood. We walked into the best non-customer interaction ever.
> 
> First, they owners wanted to show me the skylight inside, so I slid off my shoes and the guy lit up and yelled to his wife in a Russian accent "LOOK! CONTRACTOR WHO CARES!!! TOOK OFF HIS SHOES!!!"
> 
> ...


Bet that $600 looks cheap now !!... :laughing:


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## PancakeBrock (Jun 19, 2018)

I once had a guy try to talk me down then admitted he got another price before me that was about the same I was like $200 higher. Guess he ended up finding someone real cheap.

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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

The only time I negotiate price is if they want less work done than originally estimated or if they decide to downgrade on materials.

I don't have the situation arise too often but when I do, I simply tell them that if I could do it for less, that would have been the price I originally quoted you.


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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

A few years ago I got a call from the 'neighborhood cheapskate" that wanted some work done.

I don't remember the exact figures but I sent him an estimate for $1000.00.
A day later he emails me and says they have had a lot of expenses this year and wanted to know if I could do it for $500.00.

I was real tempted to respond with "Ya know...I just found out my truck needs some work and I'm going to have to charge you more than I originally quoted.

I bit my tongue and just said no. 
I was working across the street and watched him and his neighbor sweat and swear for two days with the project.


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