# are new appliances crap or do I have bad luck



## GettingBy (Aug 19, 2010)

A $2 component (our onesy-twosy price) would harden the electronics against power problems.

These companies know what the public will put up with as far as unreliable operation. If you call them some companies will send you the fix (if only you had asked!).


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

Speed Queen makes the best washing machines out there.


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## 66 Shelby (Jan 11, 2009)

Well, ain't _this_ a *****! I got some more work T-Shirts today and I threw them in the washer. I just checked on them and the damn washer took a crap AGAIN! It appears the control board is fried again    . Apparently the POS heard about me bad mouthing it. I need a drink.


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

EricBrancard said:


> Speed Queen makes the best washing machines out there.


for the last 20 or more years also:thumbsup:


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

rrk said:


> for the last 20 or more years also:thumbsup:


Yup. I bought one. Told my best friend, my inlaws and one of my customers all to get one as well. Does a load of laundry in 30 min better than the "HE" ones will do in 90 min. 10 year warranty, only one on the the market with metal gears.


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## RangoWA (Jun 25, 2014)

I bought a top of the line Samsung and it lasted 7 or 8 years. The main board went out. I determined it after tearing apart the whole thing and testing everything else. I ordered it....and waited. And waited. Three months later they tell me the part is No Longer Available. Samsung moved on.

I also discovered the spider arm that rotates the drum was being eaten by soap that cakes in there, due to the design. A hole 1/4" was eaten clean through with the rest of it looking cancerous.

But I saved some money on water!

I did my homework and put the $12 I got for it from the recyclers into a new Speed Queen. Sounds like a laudrymat machine. Well, it pretty much is except for the coin slots.


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## Chopsaw Chick (May 6, 2011)

Anyone else buy one of those GE Cafe over-range microwaves with the fancy programmable touch screen? I bought one 7 years ago for $1,000 and it was nothing but trouble. The screen would become unresponsive for hours, days or weeks. Then, it wouldn't work at all! 

Come to find out, all those units had the same problem because if you actually used the range under the microwave, steam would short out the circuit board above! You'd think somebody would have considered this possibility in the design. I replaced the dumb thing with a $250 model (all by myself - for those of you who think girls are wimpy!) And I'm never buying GE appliances again!


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## CO762 (Feb 22, 2010)

Needed to verify the dimensions for a wall over in order to build a cabinet for it...and have the rest in that bank fit where they should. That's when I found out that the name on the appliance is pretty meaningless. 
http://www.appliance411.com/parts/sears.shtml
http://www.appliance411.com/parts/make.shtml


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

RangoWA said:


> I did my homework and put the $12 I got for it from the recyclers into a new Speed Queen. Sounds like a laudrymat machine. Well, it pretty much is except for the coin slots.


Not much to look at, but they sure do a good job and last a long time. When I got mine, the sales guy is like "We sell a lot of these to schools and commercial places." Well, yeah, that's why I'm buying it.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

EricBrancard said:


> Yup. I bought one. Told my best friend, my inlaws and one of my customers all to get one as well. Does a load of laundry in 30 min better than the "HE" ones will do in 90 min. 10 year warranty, only one on the the market with metal gears.


Most speed queens are HE. I wouldn't buy anything but a front loader.



RangoWA said:


> I bought a top of the line Samsung and it lasted 7 or 8 years. The main board went out. I determined it after tearing apart the whole thing and testing everything else. I ordered it....and waited. And waited. Three months later they tell me the part is No Longer Available. Samsung moved on.
> 
> I also discovered the spider arm that rotates the drum was being eaten by soap that cakes in there, due to the design. A hole 1/4" was eaten clean through with the rest of it looking cancerous.
> 
> ...


Speed Queen is the only line of residential machines that Alliance Laundry makes, they sure know their commercial products well.


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

Inner10 said:


> Most speed queens are HE. I wouldn't buy anything but a front loader.


I have an AWN412 top loader. Full rinse cycle - non of that spritzer junk, mechanical controls. I wouldn't ever buy a front loader again.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

EricBrancard said:


> I have an AWN412 top loader. Full rinse cycle - non of that spritzer junk, mechanical controls. I wouldn't ever buy a front loader again.


There is a reason you see so many front loaders in commercial applications.

- They wash better.
- Use less water.
- Spin out WAY more water.
- They wash when overloaded.


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

Inner10 said:


> There is a reason you see so many front loaders in commercial applications.
> 
> - They wash better.
> - Use less water.
> ...


In residential applications they

-don't wash better
-they break often and are expensive to repair
-I have a well
-I have a very good gas dryer
-Mine does too


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

EricBrancard said:


> In residential applications they
> 
> -don't wash better
> -they break often and are expensive to repair
> ...


What did you have before?


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

Inner10 said:


> What did you have before?


This is my first new house, so I have the experience of front loaders from my friends and family. Maytags, Bosch, LG, etc. The only set of Front loaders that are still working well are my friend's old Frigidaire set. 

How many of them are knocking out a load of laundry in 30 min?

Not a single repair person I've talked to has recommended a front loader either.


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## tgeb (Feb 9, 2006)

I bought Eletrolux washer and dryer a few years ago, front loaders and they work pretty well. The washer has an issue now and again with a screen device on the outlet that gets clogged with threads and other debris. But I take it out and clean it....though it does involve nearly turning the machine inside out, once cleaned it works like new.

I can't imagine paying a repair tech to do the fix.

GE, I'll never buy again. Wasted a lot of money on our Kitchen appliances over the last 15 years, replaced almost everything with KitchenAid last year.....we'll see how well they last....


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

EricBrancard said:


> This is my first new house, so I have the experience of front loaders from my friends and family. Maytags, Bosch, LG, etc. The only set of Front loaders that are still working well are my friend's old Frigidaire set.
> 
> How many of them are knocking out a load of laundry in 30 min?
> 
> Not a single repair person I've talked to has recommended a front loader either.


LG are the worst, you can't get parts for them. Bosch are ****, Maytags get cheaper every year. You are comparing a quality top loader to junk front loaders.

A front loader will always complete a load faster because they can extract more water in the spin cycle. You have the choice between quick wash, standard wash and pre-wash.


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

Inner10 said:


> LG are the worst, you can't get parts for them. Bosch are ****, Maytags get cheaper every year. You are comparing a quality top loader to junk front loaders.
> 
> A front loader will always complete a load faster because they can extract more water in the spin cycle. You have the choice between quick wash, standard wash and pre-wash.


But my quality top loader cost less than all those front loaders by a wide margin. And I don't really care that much about water consumption and my monthly electric bill is like $100, so I don't really care much about that either. I just want to dump laundry in, dump soap in turn a knob and toss it into the dryer 30 min later. I don't really need a Miele to do that and this one does it better than any other washer I've used in the past.


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

EricBrancard said:


> But my quality top loader cost less than all those front loaders by a wide margin. And I don't really care that much about water consumption and my monthly electric bill is like $100, so I don't really care much about that either. I just want to dump laundry in, dump soap in turn a knob and toss it into the dryer 30 min later. I don't really need a Miele to do that and this one does it better than any other washer I've used in the past.


Top loaders are less expensive...I will give them that. And easier to load and unload.


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

Inner10 said:


> Top loaders are less expensive...I will give them that. And easier to load and unload.


I mean, maybe I am just soured by bad experiences with front loaders, but I have to say I'm very happy with this particular top loader and it does an awesome job with the wash. Plus, it's probably going to last a while. My Bosch 800 Series kitchen on the other hand.....I guess we'll see how they hold up.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

EricBrancard said:


> Wow, that's weird. Those numbers from the Stevenson Company - a market research firm. You got yours from where? A guesstimate based on how many floor models you've seen? It's about what I'd expect from you. If some data supports your point, it's gospel, but if some data doesn't support your point, the testing is flawed or it's just fanboy talk. Please



Wait a minute I posted proof that you were wrong about the performance of the washers and a link to the speed queen site to back it up and you just post numbers with no proof! Yeah sounds about right for you!


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## Xtrememtnbiker (Jun 9, 2013)

Around here, I bet I see one front loader for every ten top loaders.

Guess in Barri's world that makes the top loader the vastly superior machine destroying the performance of all others...


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

BCConstruction said:


> Wait a minute I posted proof that you were wrong about the performance of the washers and a link to the speed queen site to back it up and you just post numbers with no proof! Yeah sounds about right for you!


You posted specs about cycle time and water consumption. I guess "performance" is that easy to quantify? So where are your numbers for FL having more market share? You can search all day and all night and all the numbers you will find will point to TL always having more market share than FL.


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## Xtrememtnbiker (Jun 9, 2013)

BCConstruction said:


> Wait a minute I posted proof that you were wrong about the performance of the washers and a link to the speed queen site to back it up and you just post numbers with no proof! Yeah sounds about right for you!



http://stevensoncompany.com/2014/10/21/6440/

There is your proof...


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> Around here, I bet I see one front loader for every ten top loaders.
> 
> Guess in Barri's world that makes the top loader the vastly superior machine destroying the performance of all others...


No, it means you just don't know what your talking about. Your own eyes are lying to you. If you see more top loaders than front loaders, it's just an anomaly. If he sees more front loaders than top loaders it means that the entire country is trending that way.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> Around here, I bet I see one front loader for every ten top loaders.
> 
> Guess in Barri's world that makes the top loader the vastly superior machine destroying the performance of all others...



No that don't make them vastly superior machine destroying the performance of all others. The facts alone back that up so no need for amounts of machines to prove that. It's already been figured out. 

And around here it's about 30-40 front loaders to every top loader so what's your point or you just hanging around to try and prop ya bum buddies up.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> http://stevensoncompany.com/2014/10/21/6440/
> 
> There is your proof...



Again where's the proof. I want to see numbers from the company's who make them. You know like the facts I used to back up how front loaders use less water, faster cleaning cycles, better drying, more efficient etc etc. not some random unknown washing machine tester. 

You understand how sales floors work right. You display and stock the best selling items. It's the reason your local Audi dealership is not full of R8's yet full of A3's. It's because they sell vastly more of them. Same goes for tools. Why do they stock and display so much dewalt in lowes. It ain't because everyone is buying hitachi. It's because they are selling vastly more dewalt and guess what the same goes for washing machines, vacuum cleaners, fridge freezers etc etc. 

Let me guess you appliance stores are full of top loaders!


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

BCConstruction said:


> not some random unknown washing machine tester.


Traqline is the market research firm that the appliance industry uses for compiling such data. When manufacturers make certain claims, it's usually footnoted with Traqline data. Just admit you're wrong about the market share and move on. It's not that hard. 

I'll even compromise with you and concede to the claim that "on average" front loaders clean better than top loaders.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

*Are New Appliances Crap Or Do I Have Bad Luck*



EricBrancard said:


> Traqline is the market research firm that the appliance industry uses for compiling such data. When manufacturers make certain claims, it's usually footnoted with Traqline data. Just admit you're wrong about the market share and move on. It's not that hard.
> 
> 
> 
> I'll even compromise with you and concede to the claim that "on average" front loaders clean better than top loaders.



You know how many different market research company their are for appliances alone. We used to have to goto the NEC in the UK to be upto date on new brown and white goods. There were as many market research booths as there were appliance company's. All trying to say they were the ones to pay attention listen to. One says Samsung is best, one says whirlpool is best, one says bosch is best. You get the point. Until I see unit's sold from the makers I'm gonna believe my mate who sells them and what I see with my own eyes in every store and every home.


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

BCConstruction said:


> You know how many different market research company their are for appliances alone. We used to have to goto the NEC in the UK to be upto date on new brown and white goods. There were as many market research booths as there were appliance company's. All trying to say they were the ones to pay attention listen to. One says Samsung is best, one says whirlpool is best, one says bosch is best. You get the point. Until I see unit's sold from the makers I'm gonna believe my mate who sells them and what I see with my own eyes in every store and every home.


They aren't saying one is better than the other, they are telling you the market share. But go ahead and believe your minuscule sample size over the big picture. Like I said in an earlier post, it's only true if it supports your statements, otherwise it's just made up. If the data had shown a 70/30 split in favor of FL, you would be saying "see, look." There's no talking to some, though.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

EricBrancard said:


> They aren't saying one is better than the other, they are telling you the market share. But go ahead and believe your minuscule sample size over the big picture. Like I said in an earlier post, it's only true if it supports your statements, otherwise it's just made up. If the data had shown a 70/30 split in favor of FL, you would be saying "see, look." There's no talking to some, though.



No it's true if it's from the company it's self who post their stats or sales figures. Like I said your using a market research company for figures. There's thousands of appliance market research company's and they will all have different opinions. It's how they make their money. 

Until we have proper figures for what sell more then this is gonna go around and around.


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## Xtrememtnbiker (Jun 9, 2013)

I just want proof that there are thousand's of appliance research companies... :laughing:


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

BCConstruction said:


> No it's true if it's from the company it's self who post their stats or sales figures. Like I said your using a market research company for figures. There's thousands of appliance market research company's and they will all have different opinions. It's how they make their money.
> 
> Until we have proper figures for what sell more then this is gonna go around and around.


Out of those _thousands_ of companies I wonder why I only ever see one cited by magazines, newspapers and manufactures? I mean, out of thousands, you'd figure you'd at least see a couple dozen mentioned. But, hey, can't argue with the all knowing Barri and his mates. Moses could have the numbers struck into a stone tablet and if it was contrary to your beliefs, you wouldn't accept it. 

I'll say again, if the data wasn't contrary, you'd be all for it. A little humility now and then doesn't hurt.


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## TimNJ (Sep 7, 2005)

I bought my front loader W/D from Sears surplus.
Top of the line Kenmores for 1/2 price because there was a small dent on the side of the dryer that is against the washer, and a small scratch in the paint on the top of the washer that you can only see if you are over 
5'8".
I would never go back to top loaders after owning this one.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> I just want proof that there are thousand's of appliance research companies... :laughing:



Travis you get your self sar far up people assess on this from its pretty pathetic. 

Here you go moron. Pretty simple to figure these things out by your self but keep up the brown ringing. 

Type appliance market research into google. Google is your friend


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

EricBrancard said:


> Out of those _thousands_ of companies I wonder why I only ever see one cited by magazines, newspapers and manufactures? I mean, out of thousands, you'd figure you'd at least see a couple dozen mentioned. But, hey, can't argue with the all knowing Barri and his mates. Moses could have the numbers struck into a stone tablet and if it was contrary to your beliefs, you wouldn't accept it.
> 
> 
> 
> I'll say again, if the data wasn't contrary, you'd be all for it. A little humility now and then doesn't hurt.



No if the data was from reliable sources and not market research company's then yes I would believe it. There's a difference between actual facts and paid opinions. 

You do know what market research does right. Anyone can be paid to stand on a street to log a yes or no answer to a question. The problem is when company's are paying these market research company's big $ to report these findings it's not a reliable way to gauge the market. For all you know that company is on board with whirlpool who sell more top loaders than front loaders mainly because their front loaders are **** but they make massive amounts of profit on top loaders compared to front loaders. I used to buy these things so I know what they cost and sell for. until I see combined figures from every brand them self then like I said we are gonna go around in circles. Again Using results from market research company's is not a way to prove something's right. Clearly it is to you though and brown tongue boy


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## Xtrememtnbiker (Jun 9, 2013)

BCConstruction said:


> Travis you get your self sar far up people assess on this from its pretty pathetic.
> 
> Here you go moron. Pretty simple to figure these things out by your self but keep up the brown ringing.
> 
> Type appliance market research into google. Google is your friend



Sorry to be a pain in your hiney.

You're a funny guy, you really are.


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

BCConstruction said:


> Travis you get your self sar far up people assess on this from its pretty pathetic.
> 
> Here you go moron. Pretty simple to figure these things out by your self but keep up the brown ringing.
> 
> Type appliance market research into google. Google is your friend


Why do you get your panties in a knot when someone disagrees with you?


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## TxElectrician (May 21, 2008)

BCConstruction said:


> No if the data was from reliable sources and not market research company's then yes I would believe it. There's a difference between actual facts and paid opinions.
> 
> You do know what market research does right. Anyone can be paid to stand on a street to log a yes or no answer to a question. The problem is when company's are paying these market research company's big $ to report these findings it's not a reliable way to gauge the market. For all you know that company is on board with whirlpool who sell more top loaders than front loaders mainly because their front loaders are **** but they make massive amounts of profit on top loaders compared to front loaders. I used to buy these things so I know what they cost and sell for. until I see combined figures from every brand them self then like I said we are gonna go around in circles. Again Using results from market research company's is not a way to prove something's right. Clearly it is to you though and brown tongue boy


I thought the name calling was reserved for p&r.


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## RangoWA (Jun 25, 2014)

EricBrancard said:


> Let me add, I bet that Miele washer is awesome, but it better be awesome for the price. Just like my Heating system better be awesome for the price considering it performs a similar function to the ones that are more than $10K less installed. But it certainly won't make a Speed Queen look like a Wal Mart special. Let me know how many other makes on the market use all metal gears still? The thing is low tech as could be, but built like a tank for heavy use.


True, my mom has a Meile set, well because she's German. But they do cost way more and clothes are no cleaner. I also like the fact that SQ is a US company and hanging in there in a global market, shipping a lot overseas as well.

I never would have thought top vs front loaders would be so controversial for some. There are advantages and disadvantages to everything, being informed just gives you better decision making tools. I will say it takes on a bit of a religious flare when you ignore people's real world experience in favor of floor sales talking points. They are tools, no more, no less.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> Sorry to be a pain in your hiney.
> 
> You're a funny guy, you really are.



Carry on lap dog


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

rrk said:


> Why do you get your panties in a knot when someone disagrees with you?



I have not got my panties in a knot. Far from it. I was being told I was wrong about something and I supplied from the the company who makes both machines then everyone shut up. Then they wanted to move it along to "well top loaders sell more" then try and back that up with a random market research company thinking that will pass as fact. Well no it don't pass as fact. 

Neither of us can prove that one sells more than the other. He has market research figures which is funny on its own and I have what I have been told by sales person and what I see every day in stores and people's homes. 

Either could be right but selling the things for 4 years my self vastly out weights a market research company.


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## mnld (Jun 4, 2013)

Late to the show here, but my two cents anyways. Bought a new speed queen when we got married. When we remodeled and moved the laundry room upstairs 15 years later replaced it with a front loader. We did our research and ended up buying a commercial 5000 sites Maytag. Full warrantee was the best thing we did. Within the first eighteen months replaced the drum, the pump, and the motor. Real life experience. Oh, and it takes 55 minutes to run a load to my wife's satisfaction. And yes we sometimes get the off smelling load and the machine itself developed an odor if the door isn't left open and the soap drawer isn't pulled out, and you'd better check the door gasket for socks or they'll get sucked in to the pump! And don't even think about leaving a load sit over night.

The last two years the thing has been fine and we've figured out all it's idiosyncrasies but the days of just throwing a load in and pulling it out and not worrying about anything else are gone.

And the old speed queen? 40 minutes to wash, never replaced anything and didn't have to worry about stinky clothes.


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## CO762 (Feb 22, 2010)

mnld said:


> And the old speed queen? ...never replaced anything and didn't have to worry about stinky clothes.


Old School Baby. Our **** just keep on working and working and working.....


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## Xtrememtnbiker (Jun 9, 2013)

BCConstruction said:


> I have not got my panties in a knot. Far from it. I was being told I was wrong about something and I supplied from the the company who makes both machines then everyone shut up. Then they wanted to move it along to "well top loaders sell more" then try and back that up with a random market research company thinking that will pass as fact. Well no it don't pass as fact.
> 
> Neither of us can prove that one sells more than the other. He has market research figures which is funny on its own and I have what I have been told by sales person and what I see every day in stores and people's homes.
> 
> Either could be right but selling the things for 4 years my self vastly out weights a market research company.



Why do you go to appliance stores every day? Your front loader keep breaking?


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Electronics are fine. That is when things are alright. The problem is that we rely heavily on appliances, and when they fail everything can come to a temporary halt. The elcectromechanical devices are much more reliable.


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## mnld (Jun 4, 2013)

CO762 said:


> Old School Baby. Our **** just keep on working and working and working.....


Worst part is I got rid of the stupid thing.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> Why do you go to appliance stores every day? Your front loader keep breaking?



I go to places that sell appliances almost every day. I been looking for a new beer fridge for outside so been looking more often lately. Been to every place that sells appliances in this area as I need a strange size fridge. 

I'm in best buy at least 2x a week buying stuff I don't need and always browse the rest of the store for stuff I don't need.


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## CO762 (Feb 22, 2010)

Mnld, don't fret, I bet all of us at one time or another moved on to the shiny new object/girl, only to regret that move. I still fall into that trap sometimes....



flashheatingand said:


> Electronics are fine. That is when things are alright. The problem is...


When they fail, there's seldom any warning, like something is gradually wearing out. Then 91 HO jeep wranglers were notorious for sometimes when you turned your it off, it wouldn't start back up again. Then a little while later, it would and be fine. Or some didn't. Or some would have this problem on and off. 

This is why the "three foot drop test" came into being. If something electrical or has components in it and it wasn't working, drop it from three feet. If it works, then it works. If it doesn't, then it's broken.....
Couldn't figure out how to do that to a jeep, so I sold it for an old one.


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