# Daily Logbook/Record Keeping



## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

Spencer said:


> I'm thinking this would suit my needs well.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/DayMinder-Weekly-Planner-Inches-G590-00/dp/B00D516XWU/ref=sr_1_2?s=office-products&ie=UTF8&qid=1392561810&sr=1-2&keywords=dayminder+weekly+2014


Spencer go digital, the reason I use my smartphone so much is because that information is instantly stored to the cloud. You loose that book and you are up crap creek...ontop of that it's one less thing to carry around with you.


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

Leo G said:


> ............ I don't ever plan on using it in court as I am a one man show.


I'll file this under "Famous Last Words". :laughing:

Seriously... one-man shops can't end up in court? :whistling


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## tedanderson (May 19, 2010)

Spencer said:


> Not don't mean this in an offensive way so please don't take it that way, but my old boss used to operate like that and he is out of business. Someone is losing in situations like you are talking about and I think more often than not it is the contractor.


You are absolutely right. I don't mind taking a hit here and there because I always make it back up in extras and change orders but I wouldn't be surprised that I am losing more money than I realize by not documenting everything. Even if I let some things slide here and there, I think that I'll do better knowing how much I am giving away in order to get more work and if it is actually making me more profitable.


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## Stephen H (Feb 18, 2011)

this is something I have been planning to improve upon this year.

In the past it really has not mattered much. most of our jobs are completed in one day-------- occasionally we will work somewhere 2-3 days-and 5 days on a single job is an eternity
however- now with additional employees there are significant workers comp. savings to be had with detailed records of how many hours carpentry,how many hours roofing, how many hours sheet metal etc.
stephen


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

Inner10 said:


> Spencer go digital, the reason I use my smartphone so much is because that information is instantly stored to the cloud. You loose that book and you are up crap creek...ontop of that it's one less thing to carry around with you.


Explain to me the process of how you do this. I've never used google calendar...


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

Spencer said:


> Explain to me the process of how you do this. I've never used google calendar...


It's not a great logbook per-say, if you want to track specifics for medium sized jobs use an app like "Timesheet". That way you can export to excel and do further analysis.

I do mostly fixed price jobs, but a few hourly, tracking time isn't as important. I schedule all my work in Google calander, then when I'm done I edit the title to indicate the hours. That way I look at my calender and all I see is "Job PO***X 8-3". Then materials or things I need to remember I type in the notes section.


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

I use evernote, just write all my notes, time, prices, shopping list in there and its accessible from phone/desktop/tablet


FWIW- I know someone who used to produce journals / daily diaries for accountants
it is a black market business that she used to do in her spare time. All of those out of date daily calendars are sold and kept until needed. If you need it bad enough there is a place to buy it.


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

Spencer said:


> Explain to me the process of how you do this. I've never used google calendar...


Just to share the system that I developed for myself(which I abandoned) that worked well for a guy who worked solo or with 1 helper. I would use the Gleeo app to track my time every day and then export the data at the end of the week. I used Google Calendar purely to compare my time estimates with the reality so I could improve my accuracy. I almost always think I'm going to be faster than I really am.

Here was my schedule:
- Start of week - I would have all my planned projects entered into Gleeo. It's very simple, just add a customer name and select any project breakdowns you want to track, e.g. framing, tile, talking to the dog, etc.
- Daily - Just fire up the app when you start a job and tap it again when you stop or switch projects. You can easily add or adjust a timeslot if you forget to start or switch projects.
- End of week - Export the weekly file from Gleeo and save it in my Dropbox account where I keep backups of all my critical files. Enter the times on a Google calender I had set up for Time Worked and compare to the times on my Estimated Time calender(they're side by side when you enter them. I would then put any upcoming job time estimates in for next week on my Google calender Estimated Time and enter the new projects in Gleeo(this is actually the first step I noted). Make the two calenders very different colors and you'll easily see how accurate you were.

Google calender is a great piece of software that can be a simple as click and drag or as complicated as inviting multiple people, adding reminders, addresses, etc. It also plays very well with android phones.


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

480sparky said:


> I'll file this under "Famous Last Words". :laughing:
> 
> Seriously... one-man shops can't end up in court? :whistling


Nothing I write in that book would do me anything in court. Mainly for IRS purposes for mileage.


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

Leo G said:


> Nothing I write in that book would do me anything in court. Mainly for IRS purposes for mileage.


The book has nothing to do with getting sued.


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

Neither does mine. It's for my own personal use. I know many guys who are surprised that I keep a log of my daily activities. On more than one occasion it has helped me find a receipt or what a figure was when doing my checkbook. Turns out to be pretty handy at times.


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

Leo G said:


> ........ Turns out to be pretty handy at times.


'Specially when you get dragged into court over a 6-figure dispute. :whistling


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## KennMacMoragh (Sep 16, 2008)

480sparky said:


> However you record it, make sure the method will stand up in court. Punched pages in a 3-ring binder ain't gonna cut it. Trust me on this. Been there, done that.


I learned of this too, not from personal experience but after hearing from others. There's certain rules as to how you keep records if you want it to hold up in court. I can't remember all of them but I know it's got to be written in ink.


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

480sparky said:


> 'Specially when you get dragged into court over a 6-figure dispute. :whistling


Not to worry. Only dealt with 5 figure numbers.:whistling


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

KennMacMoragh said:


> I learned of this too, not from personal experience but after hearing from others. There's certain rules as to how you keep records if you want it to hold up in court. I can't remember all of them but I know it's got to be written in ink.


A bound book where the pages cannot be exchanged is paramount. Ringed or spiral bindings will not stand up.

As for ink, I was questioned why all my pages were written with what appeared to be the same pen. I responded with, "Well, I go to work every day with the same pair of boots, the same belt, the same glasses, the same wallet, the same cell phone, the same keys......... why not carry the same pen every day?"

The judge agreed.


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## KennMacMoragh (Sep 16, 2008)

480sparky said:


> A bound book where the pages cannot be exchanged is paramount. Ringed or spiral bindings will not stand up. As for ink, I was questioned why all my pages were written with what appeared to be the same pen. I responded with, "Well, I go to work every day with the same pair of boots, the same belt, the same glasses, the same wallet, the same cell phone, the same keys......... why not carry the same pen every day?" The judge agreed.


 That's because it makes it look like you wrote the whole thing the day before you went to court instead of every day. I had a boss who would look for the same thing on our time sheets. He said "No one ever keeps the same pen!"


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

Pencil. I've made enough mistakes writing things in that I use pencil. Guess I'm screwed.


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

KennMacMoragh said:


> That's because it makes it look like you wrote the whole thing the day before you went to court instead of every day. I had a boss who would look for the same thing on our time sheets. He said "No one ever keeps the same pen!"


Even if I had used a different pen, it would have come out the box of 50 I bought at Office Depot.


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## [email protected] (Jan 3, 2014)

griz said:


> Daily Log SOP on commercial jobs and large residential projects.
> 
> Provides a record of weather, deliveries, discrepancies/issues that arise, inspections, who's on the job with what man power, change orders/RFI's/RFP's and daily progress.
> 
> Invaluable for preventing/resolving disputes or concerns that may come up.


Griz, would you mind sharing yours, or who/where you get yours, within the last six months I have gone from mainly residential to mainly commercial, and im starting to get into jobs that are quite large for my company. I really need something like this.


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

[email protected] said:


> Griz, would you mind sharing yours, or who/where you get yours, within the last six months I have gone from mainly residential to mainly commercial, and im starting to get into jobs that are quite large for my company. I really need something like this.


Do a Google search "Construction Log Books" and look around.

Pretty sure I used this one on the last job:

http://www.logbooks.com/logbooks_pro.php?category_id=29


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## [email protected] (Jan 3, 2014)

griz said:


> Do a Google search "Construction Log Books" and look around.
> 
> Pretty sure I used this one on the last job:
> 
> http://www.logbooks.com/logbooks_pro.php?category_id=29


Thats what I immediately did, figured id ask what you used for a point of interest.

Google is my *****, its the first thing I do when I want info on something. Having a point of reference as to the quality of what you find on google is always good as well.

As the saying goes, "I could get a good look at a bulls ass by sticking my hand up it, but id rather take the butchers word for it."


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## aptpupil (Jun 12, 2010)

I just have an excel document that I print out. 
Columns for: date, customer, address (for mileage tracking), hours on site, job description, materials used and supplies needed to complete job for next visit. Pretty simple. If I wanted to track it online I could make it into a google spreadsheet and do it that way, but I like writing it out by hand.


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## smalpierre (Jan 19, 2011)

480sparky said:


> However you record it, make sure the method will stand up in court.
> 
> Punched pages in a 3-ring binder ain't gonna cut it.
> 
> ...


How is the log book better?


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

smalpierre said:


> How is the log book better?


Anything where you can pull a page out and replace it won't stand up in court. Period.

3-ring binders, spiral-bound, etc. would get tossed out in half a heartbeat. Only a _permanently bound_ book can be submitted as evidence.


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## smalpierre (Jan 19, 2011)

480sparky said:


> Anything where you can pull a page out and replace it won't stand up in court. Period.
> 
> 3-ring binders, spiral-bound, etc. would get tossed out in half a heartbeat. Only a _permanently bound_ book can be submitted as evidence.


I see where that's coming from, but what's to prevent someone from keeping two sets of books, or reproducing the book later in an altered form?

Spiral bound doesn't work for them? I wouldn't think you could get pages back in those, but I've never tried.


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

smalpierre said:


> I see where that's coming from, but what's to prevent someone from keeping two sets of books, or reproducing the book later in an altered form?
> 
> Spiral bound doesn't work for them? I wouldn't think you could get pages back in those, but I've never tried.


An entire book would be time-consuming to create. It might be obvious it's a fake.

Spiral bound is out. Too easy to spin the spiral off the book, replace a page, and spin the spiral back in. Easy to do if you're truly motivated, and would only take a couple minutes.


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## Leo G (May 12, 2005)

It's been done for decades. One book for the business and one book for the feds.


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## smalpierre (Jan 19, 2011)

Leo G said:


> It's been done for decades. One book for the business and one book for the feds.


I believe that's called "cooking the books". It's been done since the dawn of record keeping.

If you have accounting software, there is an audit feature. If you go in and say change a date for a transaction, it logs that "user X changed this information on THIS date." Some audit trails will log not only that it was changed, but the value it was, and the value it was changed to. "User X deleted customer payment for $14,234.23 at 12:23pm 11/23/2013".

These records are hidden from the user end of the system, and much more difficult to falsify than a bound book.

Of course you can turn the audit trail off, but that basically turns it into an electronic 3 ring binder.

Like any system, there are ways around things, but it's extremely difficult, and prone to indication of tampering.


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## masonkable (Apr 8, 2013)

maybe this site will clear up what type of log book could be used; http://www.safetymeetingoutlines.com/logbooks.html I have been using them for 20+ years and yes I have a lot of log books (20+ years) stored in the mezzanine for just in case. 
I think the main thing is to decide for yourself what you want to use them for. I write just about anything pertinent to that days work, oh yea, some stuff not pertinent.


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## SamM (Dec 13, 2009)

Does it have to be an actual logbook? Can't you just use a permanently bound notebook? 

I don't see why I should spend 25$ on a fancy version when I can buy a nice notebook for 3$ if it does the same thing.


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## KennMacMoragh (Sep 16, 2008)

SamM said:


> Does it have to be an actual logbook? Can't you just use a permanently bound notebook?
> 
> I don't see why I should spend 25$ on a fancy version when I can buy a nice notebook for 3$ if it does the same thing.


Whatever you use, it has to be apparent when a page is ripped out. If you use a ringed binder then you can rip a page out to hide it and nobody would know.

This is a list out of a book by Edward Fisk:

Format of the Construction Diary


Use only a hard-cover, stitched-binding field book such as used by surveyors for their note keeping, or a "record book" obtainable at stationers.
Pages should be consecutively numbered in ink, and no numbers should be skipped.
No erasures should be made. In case of error, simply cross out the incorrect information and enter the correct data next to it.
No pages should be torn out of the book at any time. If a page is to be voided, place a large "X" through the page and mark "void."
Every day should be reported, and every calendar date should be accounted for. If there is no work performed on a given date, the date should be entered on the page followed by the words "no work" or similar wording. It is still desirable to record the weather on "no work" days, as it may have later bearing on why no work was performed in a case involving a claim for liquidated damages.
All entries must be made on the same date that they occur. If notes are kept on a separate scratch paper, and later transcribed into the diary, and this fact is disclosed during a trial, the credibility of the entire diary comes into question.


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## Labamba84 (Mar 16, 2014)

*I use evernote.*

I use evernote to make notes when I go see the job and when I create the estimate. I been thinking about just using evernote for all my projects and for keeping track of what is done. Who thinks that system would stand on court.


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## 480sparky (Feb 1, 2009)

Labamba84 said:


> ..... Who thinks that system would stand on court.


Not me. :no::no::no::no::no::no:


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## HUI (Jan 21, 2011)

I get your point about court but do you use a 35mm camera as well because a digital pic can be modified? If you have all the information and a history of keeping records you shouldn't have a horrible time in court.


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## KennMacMoragh (Sep 16, 2008)

A digital camera is fine. I was told by an attorney if they think a picture is fake, they will bring in an expert who can tell if it's been modified.


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## Hardly Working (Apr 7, 2005)

Old job I used a MS Word template and kept a digital log. It allowed me to import photos of work completed, issues, c/o's. New boss could care less about logs just written time sheets and they are kind of vague.


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## Big Shoe (Jun 16, 2008)

I keep things real simple. Any regular small book works for me. Just blank pages with lines will do. Every day starts with date and day of the week, customer,scope of work and hours on the right side of page.

Works for me.


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