# Help! Kitchen remodel mess. Subs messing up Soffit advice,full overlay cabinets.



## rselectric1 (Sep 20, 2009)

Just keeping my mod hat on here. Now let's all digress and concentrate back to the subject of this thread.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

MTN REMODEL LLC said:


> Where/what is a carriage return:thumbup:


It's the return or now enter key, but in publishing it is called carriage return. If you go into Word and "edit view" you will see carriage return symbols in every paragraph break. 

I think on the original Macintosh it was labeled carriage return.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

I wouldn't touch the 2" trim back - it's a little risky.

Moving switches / wiring in a demo is usually a necessity - most inspectors don't really want you to delete stuff and make it less code compliant. I haven't done a kitchen reno that didn't require bringing the kitchen up to code.

Check their licenses, check the electricians' licenses, plumbers' licenses, etc. Then check for permits. FYI, I've seen masters get permits issued for work they aren't licensed to perform. Personally, I'd bounce these guys, but I'm not sure how complicated that would be under the circumstances.

If you do try the trim back, use something like a multimaster. It'll take longer, but less chance of catching and tearing the soffit partially off the wall / ceiling.


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## Big Shoe (Jun 16, 2008)

pics.....pics.........pics :confused1:


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## AustinDB (Sep 11, 2006)

does the refrigerator require a dedicated circuit?


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

I haven't seen 480sparky chime in, but the simple answer is no. The more complicated answer is if the refrigerator install instructions say it has to be dedicated, then technically it would need dedicated. 

Perhaps the confusion comes from a single outlet allowed behind something like a refrigerator or washer that wasn't GFCI in a location that would otherwise require it. It's still common practice but not required- people don't want their food going bad when something else on the branch pops a breaker, GFCI, arc fault.


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## Morning Wood (Jan 12, 2008)

I think fridges usually are on dedicated circuits. 

Your daughter should get rid of her real estate agent buddy. Sounds like a moron if they thought current GC was good.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

72chevy4x4 said:


> does the refrigerator require a dedicated circuit?


All major appliances should have their own circuit, but that is my feeling and may not reflect the codes in your area.

I always put them on a dedicated 15amp if I am redoing a kitchen or putting one in a basement. The last thing that you want is someone blowing the frig circuit.


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## MTN REMODEL LLC (Sep 3, 2010)

I'm no sparky and even less so knowledgeable in current code, but I thought that a refrigerator was no longer required to be dedicated.

Refers have gotten very efficient.... I doubt they pull 5A.

Can't go wrong with a dedicated circut to a light bulb... but there is reasonable cost efficiency issues involved.

I do0n't think there is any code restriction from putting on a GFI circut (apart from dedicated GFI kitchen counters circuts), but common sense
dictates obviously that you don't.

Maybe 480 will straighten/clear the issue.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

MTN REMODEL LLC said:


> I'm no sparky and even less so knowledgeable in current code, but I thought that a refrigerator was no longer required to be dedicated.
> 
> Refers have gotten very efficient.... I doubt they pull 5A.
> 
> ...


I would rather hear from Ron, more humble.

Back to frigs, while they may not consume as much juice, taking the risk of adding to that circuit, risks blowing that circuit, and spoiling food, is just not worth it.


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## MTN REMODEL LLC (Sep 3, 2010)

TNTSERVICES said:


> I would rather hear from Ron, more humble.
> 
> Back to frigs, while they may not consume as much juice, taking the risk of adding to that circuit, risks blowing that circuit, and spoiling food, is just not worth it.


+1.....understand.....:thumbsup:


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## rselectric1 (Sep 20, 2009)

TNTSERVICES said:


> hear from Ron


There are several things that actually CAN be fed from the small appliance branch circuits for kitchens. One of these things is a refrigerator. Whenever possible though, I prefer to run a 15 amp dedicated to the fridge.


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## Live_oak (Jul 22, 2013)

I prefer to spec the fridge be dedicated, as well as any MW. I've seen too many breakers needing to be reset if the MW and a coffee maker are going at the same time, or someone plugs in one of those countertop convection toaster ovens when the fridge compressor kicks on. Not to mention the possibility of the George Foreman grill, and the waffle maker, and the blender and the I-phone charger and the baby flat screen....... America loves their electronic gadgets. You can't go wrong even with having 3 small appliance circuits on a kitchen redo. Unless the home just doesn't have the juice for it period.


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## MTN REMODEL LLC (Sep 3, 2010)

rselectric1 said:


> There are several things that actually CAN be fed from the small appliance branch circuits for kitchens. One of these things is a refrigerator. Whenever possible though, I prefer to run a 15 amp dedicated to the fridge.


RS.... Understand your explanation/logic...., 

....just clarrification.... you can run run your counter SABC off the GFI.... but run your refer off the unprotected side of the the GFI.... as far as code is concerned.....ie the whole SABC does not have to be GFI protected.????

Thanks


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## MTN REMODEL LLC (Sep 3, 2010)

Live_oak said:


> I prefer to spec the fridge be dedicated, as well as any MW. I've seen too many breakers needing to be reset if the MW and a coffee maker are going at the same time, or someone plugs in one of those countertop convection toaster ovens when the fridge compressor kicks on. Not to mention the possibility of the George Foreman grill, and the waffle maker, and the blender and the I-phone charger and the baby flat screen....... *America loves their electronic gadgets. You can't go wrong even with having 3 small appliance circuits on a kitchen redo. Unless the home just doesn't have the juice for it period*.


Number of branch circuts will not affect what your service can provide.... 

...but I agree, with varying electrical loads, even though we are getting more efficient appliances, extra circuts are beneficial in general....(so you don't overload a branch)


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## rselectric1 (Sep 20, 2009)

MTN REMODEL LLC said:


> ....just clarrification.... you can run run your counter SABC off the GFI.... but run your refer off the unprotected side of the the GFI


Perhaps just a terminology thing, but yes you can pigtail a refrigerator receptacle to the line side of one of the 2 SABC's required. The loaded "or protected" side would need to supply the countertop receptacles if you are using that method. Sometimes it's actually less hassle to just install GFCI receptacles at every location at the countertop.


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## MTN REMODEL LLC (Sep 3, 2010)

rselectric1 said:


> Perhaps just a terminology thing, but yes you can pigtail a refrigerator receptacle to the line side of one of the 2 SABC's required. The loaded "or protected" side would need to supply the countertop receptacles if you are using that method. Sometimes it's actually less hassle to just install GFCI receptacles at every location at the countertop.


:thumbsup:... Thank Ya


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## Eric K (Nov 24, 2005)

We usually run a 15a to frig and 15a light circuit. Everything else is 20a in kitchen. To OP fire that idiot and get a real kitchen man in there. These guys sound like a bunch of bar stool contractors.


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## ArtisanRemod (Dec 25, 2012)

OP disappeared and no pics


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## CO762 (Feb 22, 2010)

TNTSERVICES said:


> OP, Please learn to use the carriage return.


lol....you're showing your age.


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