# Smoking Policy???



## Pearce Services (Nov 21, 2005)

Who has a formal smoking policy?

We do mostly commercial service calls. run 7 vehicles, and have 3 smokers working for us.

My Lawyer told me that non smokers in the same vehicle as smokers have the same rights to a clean environment as they would in public buildings. And that a non smoker can file a WC claim for any potential exposure to smoke illnesses if exposed in a company vehicle. 

I have a no smoking policy for the shop, expect the workers to abide by the customers smoking areas if any, but currently allow smoking in the vans. I figure that they need to smoke somewhere, and I would rather it be when driving between jobs.

I do not want to be a ball-buster, but am getting pressure to go to a smoke free company. I may loose some good employees if they can not comply, yet do not want to have potential claims either. 

BTW we have gas driven welders in the vans, and do create an air quality issue in the vans that can be considered another liability. Maybe that needs to be included in the policy, with a procedure to exchange the air prior to getting back into the van.

Any thoughts? any real basis to be concerned? Thanks!


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## tedanderson (May 19, 2010)

100% no smoking is my policy. I do work in too many smokeless environments to have smokers on my staff. People who smoke don't realize that they carry this "cloud" around them that can be easily detected by non-smokers. 

It makes a bad impression around family oriented environments and I'd rather lose a good worker who smokes than to smoke up and tarnish the household of a good client.


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## jlsconstruction (Apr 26, 2011)

No smoking in the trucks, shop, or around the job. They guys get a break in the morning, lunch and afternoon to take a walk and do what they gotta do. There butts go in the trash not on the ground.


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## slowsol (Aug 27, 2005)

All of our jobsites are no smoking zones. For employees and subcontractors. Too much liability.

I will say, from what I see, it's very hard to enforce.


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

Right or wrong smoking on construction sites is fastly becoming prohibited. We allow subs to smoke on new and only during rough stage. Once its closed up, no more.


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## Builderlife (Jan 4, 2014)

I have a few smokers and they sneak it when they grab tools from truck or at lunch and I never see the butts. Only disadvantage is the "cloud" that they bring back into the customers home. It's usually pretty thick. I won't tell someone they should or shouldn't smoke but people are getting pickier about it and it is borderline unprofessional in their mind so I do whatever keeps them happy.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Especially with gas in the van


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

No smoking on any job. I don't even like them having one on the way to the job as they wreak when they enter the home.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

This is why I hate working inside. I really like the different kind of freedom working outside brings. Don't get me wrong we still have to to be gentlemen. 

With that said, smoking on the property isn't allowed, but I don't care if they smell like smoke.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

I put a butt can on every job. Everyone knows no smoking in or near an entrance, butts go in the can. Rarely been an issue, had to be a prick at the beginning about it though.


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## Walraven (Jan 24, 2014)

I smoke around the job whenever i want, never inside never been an issue with any customer


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## Kowboy (May 7, 2009)

One of my pastimes is drinking beer. One of the byproducts of my pastime is urine. Smokers would never tolerate my urine on their clothes, but seem to think nothing of putting the byproduct of their pastime, smoke, on mine.

You don't pee in the truck, you don't smoke in the truck.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

I'm A smoker . But A Respectable one. Most of my work Is new construction so It's not that big a deal.. You can walk on one of my jobs at the end of the day and search the place over but you wont find a butt!! Cause There all In my left pocket:whistling If you don't believe ! Ask my wife! :laughing: 

It's just common sense not to smoke In a H/O s home when doing reno work or additions . Or even on the premises . 

I've worked around some guys who didn't know how important personal hygiene Is! What's worse?

If I smell like a Marlboro when you meet me ..And you don't care for It. Just say so! I have other work ! 

Glue fumes /Dust / Fumes from kerosene blowers / Dust/ How Is that any worse than smelling like Stogie ?? 

If I'm riding With anyone ! In a vehicle ..I don't smoke.
I don't smoke In my own home .. But If you have problem with me just because I smell like Humphrey Bogart .... KMA!!!!


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## JAH (Jul 27, 2014)

Half the guys on our crew smoke. Its never been a issue with the HO's or the principal. No butts on the ground, no smoking in the structure.
I would much rather work with smokers than the guys who don't believe in deodorant or the guys who have no problem with farting around everyone.
I have been known to have problems with the guys who chew. Spitting chaw and leaving cups of dip spit laying around usually lead to me having a meltdown.


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## MBristol (Aug 21, 2014)

I have two pretty heavy smokers that I had to chat with about their habit. It is anyone's right to choose to smoke, but I did not like the image of my guys lighting up on a job, or stinking up somebody's house. I convinced them to try an e-cigarette during work hours. it seems to be a good compromise. They still kind of get to smoke, but no butts, they don't stink like an ashtray and it doesn't take 5 minutes to smoke one. Two puffs and they are done for a while.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

MBristol said:


> I have two pretty heavy smokers that I had to chat with about their habit. It is anyone's right to choose to smoke, but I did not like the image of my guys lighting up on a job, or stinking up somebody's house. I convinced them to try an e-cigarette during work hours. it seems to be a good compromise. They still kind of get to smoke, but no butts, they don't stink like an ashtray and it doesn't take 5 minutes to smoke one. Two puffs and they are done for a while.


The E cigarettes Will be a thing of the past very soon .. Too toxic .. Go figure ! I swear! These days you can light up a crack pipe and no one will say chit! But If you light up a Marlboro they go all to pieces !


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## DMJCarpentry (Jan 6, 2014)

I'm a smoker and the majority of my work is as a finish sub for a couple of contractors. Most of our work is high end and all of the companies I do work for have a no smoking policy. Those of us that smoke, do so away from the jobsite, out by the street, or in our trucks.

I can't say I totally disagree with it. I don't smoke in my house or around my children. All my butts go in the garbage. Truth is I have been trying to quit for some time but it is hard.

As with most things, discretion is important. I think if a smoker is willing to be discrete and considerate then its not really a big deal. But absolutely no smoking in a clients house and not right outside the door either.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

After three days the nicotine is out of the body, then it's just the habit you have deal with. That three days is a muddaphucka though.


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## Chad McDade (Oct 14, 2012)

If we are working outside I don't care if guys smoke as long as I don't see butts on the ground. Inside work - smoking is a no go. I used to smoke (quit 4 years ago) and had the same policy then.


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## MBristol (Aug 21, 2014)

blacktop said:


> The E cigarettes Will be a thing of the past very soon .. Too toxic .. Go figure ! I swear! These days you can light up a crack pipe and no one will say chit! But If you light up a Marlboro they go all to pieces !


I have serious doubts that the e-cigarette is more "toxic" than a Winston that has 5000 or so chemicals in it and no fewer than 70 ingredients known to cause cancer. 

Either way though it serves its purpose on a job - guys get their fix and they don't smell like a butt. 

One of the guys says he wants to quit his regular habit and switch to ecigs - says he feels better at the end of the day.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Tobacco wouldn't be as bad if it didn't have all the additives


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

Californiadecks said:


> After three days the nicotine is out of the body, then it's just the habit you have deal with. That three days is a muddaphucka though.


After 32 years ? Your telling me the crave will leave my system in 3 days? If I go cold turkey?? 


No! Naw! It Ain't that simple!:laughing:


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

blacktop said:


> After 32 years ? Your telling me the crave will leave my system in 3 days? If I go cold turkey??
> 
> 
> No! Naw! It Ain't that simple!:laughing:


I smoked for 21 years, haven't smoked in 12, I cold turkeyed the first time I tried. What I'm saying is the bulk of the nicotine is gone in 3 days, the rest can take up to two weeks. But the physical craving wasn't the hard part for me. It was the associations that you get over the years. One of the worst ones is alcohol, I don't drink, so mine was coffee.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Blacktop, not trying at all to preach here, but the feeling I get in the mornings, I can not explain how much better I feel. Not hacking up lung butter every morning was just part of it. I'll bet it will make you feel several years younger, after a good amount of time.


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## Chad McDade (Oct 14, 2012)

Californiadecks said:


> I smoked for 21 years, haven't smoked in 12, I cold turkeyed the first time I tried. What I'm saying is the bulk of the nicotine is gone in 3 days, the rest can take up to two weeks. But the physical craving wasn't the hard part for me. It was the associations that you get over the years. One of the worst ones is alcohol, I don't drink, so mine was coffee.


Same here - I smoked for 20 years and quit cold turkey. I didn't really have any physical cravings but whenever I had a beer, a cup of coffee, or finished a meal my first instinct was to reach for my pack of cigarettes. I think I carried a zippo in my pocket for 6 months after I quit because it didn't feel right not having it in my pocket.


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## DMJCarpentry (Jan 6, 2014)

I don't know...if I go more than an hour my body starts asking me WTF? Where's my fix? I know it won't be easy but I just have to go cold turkey and tough it out. The reward down the road is worth it.


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

I quit a year and a half ago. Told my 9 year old I would do it and just stopped. 

That said, I don't mind smokers, just be respectful to yourself and the people around you.


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## chewy (May 23, 2010)

I dont allow smokers to smoke near me when I am working.


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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

Hard for me to imagine this "cloud" everyone speaks of. I'm a smoker and have had 3 long-time customers in the past 6 months tell me they didn't know I smoked.

I usually go out to the truck, open the door, have a sip or two of coffee, check e-mails, do a power smoke and get back to the job at hand. Never been a problem...never mentioned...never even hinted that it was a problem.


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

You can most definitely smell the aftermath of a cigarette on someone. Never thought anything about it, until 6 months after I quit.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

I have been on a month+ long job currently and had the customer have a melt down about one of my subs smoking outside but in his property. I don't have an issue with them smoking outside but after that little event I may have to change my rules. One guy was smoking prob 20-30 a day and he smelt like a wet ashtray and like someone said this cloud of smoke/smell was hanging around him and every time you passed somewhere he had passed it would hit bad. Smokers just don't realize how bad they smell to non smokers.


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## Rio (Oct 13, 2009)

Some smokers smell worse than other ones, not sure why; it might have to do with personal hygiene or the way they smoke (in a closed up car or ?) but if one is respectful of others and limits it to breaks, do the other things as mentioned up the thread then the smoker should be allowed to smoke. They seem to be the new whipping boy.

As to quitting there's a bunch of different ways to go about it. I was a heavy smoker for many years and quit while still being a heavy drinker (a thing of the past also). The way I did it was when I'd get up in the morning I'd go as long as I could without one and then smoke to my heart's content. When I finally started making it all day and into the evening I made the jump and stopped altogether, taking it 'one day at a time'. 

I'm very happy to have that nasty habit be a thing of the past but must say if it wasn't so bad for the health or if I could have one a day I never would have stopped and after many years still dream occasionally of puffing away (always so happy when I wake up and realize it was just a dream).


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## Mrmac204 (Dec 27, 2006)

I tried a cigarette when I was a kid and it made me sick so that was it for me. On a large job site this last week and I noticed that someone is going into the portapottie for a smoke. I wave the door several times to sort of clear the air.(non smoking on the site)


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

People that smoke in their homes smell worse. The smoke gets into thier closet and onto their clothes before they even wear them. A lot of people these days go outside even at their own homes to smoke.


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## darthdude (Dec 30, 2012)

Our policy is no smoking on client property, or in the honey buckets, period. This includes if your work van is parked in the driveway. You have to go out to the sidewalk, or van/truck off the property and take all your butts with you. None of our companies direct employees smoke and I doubt my boss would hire anyone who did. A lot of our clients expect this nowadays and some have even complained about the sidewalk rule, just because the smell can walk back into a home with whoever was smoking.
I personally don't care if people smoke, but would never want to work someplace where guys could, or do, smoke in the work areas again. I worked in a cabinet shop for 4 years where 2 guys smoked 1-2 packs a day indoors. Realized after I stopped working there how nasty that really was. A lot of my own clothing and even my truck smelled like smoke, just from those guys being around me or riding shotgun......


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## Shane O (Apr 4, 2014)

The worst type of smoker is the one who quit. 

Our policy is "smoke em if you got em"

I'm smoking right now. 

I'd rather have a crew full of smokers than a crew of drug addicts.


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## Driftweed (Nov 7, 2012)

My policy is keep it outside. Either in the van or out back in the back yard in rentals. If it's cold, no smoking inside after we open the paint and begin finish work. Not much of an issue. Be respectful thats all you can ask.


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## fireguy (Oct 29, 2006)

I don't hire smokers. They cannot understand the effect the smoke has on others. I have had smokers tell me they have a right to smoke, and I agree with that comment. But I have a right not to cough, have the burning eyes that second hand smoke gives me. I made my choice not to use tobacco, while my friends were making a choice to become addicted to tobacco.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

Shane O said:


> The worst type of smoker is the one who quit.
> 
> Our policy is "smoke em if you got em"
> 
> ...


I use to deal with a local Mechanic That had a Sign on the wall of the sitting area that read...'' THANK YOU FOR SMOKING'' He passed away from lung cancer in 07 !


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

Driftweed said:


> . Be respectful thats all you can ask.


 

Bottom line!


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## tedanderson (May 19, 2010)

I don't mind if you smoke if I can take a crap in your boots.:whistling

I would have to agree about taking the cigarette all the way to the sidewalk if someone really has to smoke. Too often smokers don't really know (or care) how it affects others so they tend to smoke too close to the house where an open window or open door happens to be down-wind from the smoker.

Then some guys really don't understand what "outside" means. They think that standing in an open doorway is the same thing. They don't realize that the smoke gets drawn back into the house.

Then what REALLY annoys me are the guys that smoke outside, or hold the cigarette outside but they'll exhale INSIDE after taking that last puff.

Then the worst.. the absolute worst are the smokers whose kid has respiratory problems but they won't quit. They'll say that the doctors have no idea what's causing their kid's health problems but will be quick to give you a obscenity filled tongue lashing if you ever suggest the obvious.:no:


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

I don't have employees at this time. But, I'd never hire a smoker. Period.

I've had smokers work for me in the past. Never again.

I don't smoke and I don't drink alcohol whole I'm working. My employees will follow my lead or go work for someone else. Non negotiable.


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

tedanderson said:


> I don't mind if you smoke if I can take a crap in your boots.:whistling
> 
> I would have to agree about taking the cigarette all the way to the sidewalk if someone really has to smoke. Too often smokers don't really know (or care) how it affects others so they tend to smoke too close to the house where an open window or open door happens to be down-wind from the smoker.
> 
> ...


So?


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

jb4211 said:


> I don't have employees at this time. But, I'd never hire a smoker. Period.
> 
> I've had smokers work for me in the past. Never again.
> 
> I don't smoke and I don't drink alcohol whole I'm working. My employees will follow my lead or go work for someone else. Non negotiable.


I believe that is discrimination, correct?


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> I believe that is discrimination, correct?


I don't like anything about cigarettes: the smoke, the smell, the ashes, and anything else I forgot.

Why have that around me for "X" hours a day if I don't have to.

Plus, I'm not paying someone while they're on a cigarette break. Screw that.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> I believe that is discrimination, correct?


There's been a whole lot of that on this thread !!! :whistling


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> I believe that is discrimination, correct?


No its not because the rule applies to everyone.


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

Californiadecks said:


> No its not because the rule applies to everyone.


He said he won't hire a smoker, not that you can't smoke while at work.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

People need to get off their high horses and off the PC bandwagon, and practice a little tolerance. Sure, smoking stinks (to some people). So does vehicle exhaust (to some people), and fresh paint (to some people) and a myriad of other things.

You want sterile and antiseptic, go live in a bubble.


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

jb4211 said:


> I don't like anything about cigarettes: the smoke, the smell, the ashes, and anything else I forgot.
> 
> Why have that around me for "X" hours a day if I don't have to.
> 
> Plus, I'm not paying someone while they're on a cigarette break. Screw that.


Then have a no smoking while working policy, not I won't hire any smokers policy.


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> He said he won't hire a smoker, not that you can't smoke while at work.


Why hire someone only to fire them right after. Smokers can't stop smoking, that's why we call them smokers.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> He said he won't hire a smoker, not that you can't smoke while at work.


Doesn't matter he can have a condition of hire that requires a "non smoker", as long as it applies to every hire across the board.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Californiadecks said:


> Doesn't matter he can have a condition of hire that requires a "non smoker", as long as it applies to every hire across the board.


Unless it's medical nicotine. :laughing:


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

jb4211 said:


> Why hire someone only to fire them right after. Smokers can't stop smoking, that's why we call them smokers.


I know plenty of smokers that abstain all day at work and then smoke after hours. 

Kind of have to with all the smoking nazi's out there now.


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

Tinstaafl said:


> People need to get off their high horses and off the PC bandwagon, and practice a little tolerance. Sure, smoking stinks (to some people). So does vehicle exhaust (to some people), and fresh paint (to some people) and a myriad of other things.
> 
> You want sterile and antiseptic, go live in a bubble.


No high horse. I have a lot of friends that smoke. Great people. I just hate that they smoke. Can't stand it.

Why hire someone that has a bad habit that I hate??


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

jb4211 said:


> No high horse. I have a lot of friends that smoke. Great people. I just hate that they smoke. Can't stand it.
> 
> Why hire someone that has a bad habit that I hate??


I don't know why someone would even want to work for someone that was hateful towards something they did, or even associate with them for that matter.


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## jb4211 (Jul 13, 2010)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> I don't know why someone would even want to work for someone that was hateful towards something they did, or even associate with them for that matter.


I know people who smoke, but hate that they smoke, and hate everything about smoking that I hate. They just can't stop. Or, more obviously, don't hate it as much as they hate the issues associated with quitting.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

As an employer it's my money, I should have the right to pick my employees, and one of the conditions is that they don't stink. Even if they put the smell on at thier house.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

jb4211 said:


> Why hire someone only to fire them right after. Smokers can't stop smoking, that's why we call them smokers.


You said you had no employees ! I wonder why? 

Come on man! If you could see how I control my tobacco use on the job site ..You would say.. Hell yeah! I'd hire that guy!

Like Robie said .. It can be well hidden! At least that's what I took from your post Robie.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

jb4211 said:


> Why hire someone only to fire them right after. Smokers can't stop smoking, that's why we call them smokers.


I know several smokers who dont smoke during the day or when they are not drinking. When I was doing commercial as an employee I did it all the time when I worked on tobacco free campuses. 

Its the last thing on my mind when hiring. Most of the carpenters I know smoke, or used to. Im an ex smoker.


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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

I would pretty much despise anyone who would use the word "wafting"...and I love words.


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## Robie (Feb 25, 2005)

> 'Nanny' Bloomberg Fail: Smoking Rises in NYC


http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2014/09/23/Nanny-Bloomberg-Fail-Smoking-Rises-in-NYC


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## chewy (May 23, 2010)

$20 a pack here in NZ, theres a tobacco tax which takes into account smokers disproportionate slice of the public healthcare system.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

chewy said:


> $20 a pack here in NZ, theres a tobacco tax which takes into account smokers disproportionate slice of the public healthcare system.


What happens is the Government relies on that money and as People quit they have to make up for the revenue somewhere. 

Reminds me of a water district here, they bitched and moan to get People to save water. They ended up saving so much water the water district had to raise rates to cover the lost revenue to keep the pension funds funded.


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## Walraven (Jan 24, 2014)

Tax on ciggies is total bs if their that bad just ban them already,they collect close to a billion a year in tobacco tax over here theirs no way we smokers cost that a year


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Walraven said:


> Tax on ciggies is total bs if their that bad just ban them already,they collect close to a billion a year in tobacco tax over here theirs no way we smokers cost that a year


They took the cig tax here and built a fvcking library. Then they try to say the tax is because cigs are causing healthcare costs to go up. Then WTF build a library?


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

Californiadecks said:


> They took the cig tax here and built a fvcking library. Then they try to say the tax is because cigs are causing healthcare costs to go up. Then WTF build a library?


It's bogus. This is a document from the government, it's kinda old but its funny to read their figures without a break down...some how I'm not buying it...

http://www.mhp.gov.on.ca/en/smoke-free/factsheets/Tobacco_Revenue-120208.pdf


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## tedanderson (May 19, 2010)

Californiadecks said:


> What happens is the Government relies on that money and as People quit they have to make up for the revenue somewhere. Reminds me of a water district here, they bitched and moan to get People to save water. They ended up saving so much water the water district had to raise rates to cover the lost revenue to keep the pension funds funded.


That is the M.O. of many governments. We have several red light and speed cameras around Washington DC. When the DC government started installing them a few years ago, they said that this was supposed to make the roads safer. Then they told on themselves last year they reported that they were having budget woes because they experienced a severe loss in red light/speed camera revenue. :blink: So now you're complaining about budget problems because people are obeying the law. Yeah.. makes sense.


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## Ronald Cruse (Sep 25, 2014)

For me it all depends on the customer. The Golden Rule: the man with the gold makes the rules.


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## Shane O (Apr 4, 2014)

In Canada, smokers cost less to healthcare annually than elderly persons in"good" health. 

Go figure.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Shane O said:


> In Canada, smokers cost less to healthcare annually than elderly persons in"good" health.
> 
> Go figure.


What about when all the smokers become elderly?


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## bytor (Jan 23, 2010)

On our current project, (new build) the property owner's construction insurance policy cost was cut virtually in half (down to $13,000/year) by banning smoking on the property.
Smokers now must go and sit in their car to light up. Up to each sub-trade how they handle that with their employees I suppose...


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## Mike Rue (Mar 8, 2014)

Have a strict policy of no smoking on the property for all trades. 
If they want to light up then they must leave the site to smoke.
We have a "butts" bucket posted at the PL where all smokers have to put out their cigs.


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## MattK (Apr 2, 2009)

No official policy, but:

-I prefer infrequent smoking while on homeowner's property.
-NEVER leave butts on the ground.
-Don't really care if you smoke away on new const work.
-And this goes without saying but you keep working while you smoke.
-I don't usually mind if you have one in my truck if we have a decent commute.


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