# Air Tap Heat Pump water heater?



## Dbower (Mar 5, 2009)

Does anyone have any experience with these? airgenerate .com
A plumber friend of mine said he has installed about 15 now and is hearing good things about them. Im trying to decide If I want to get one. Im interested in seeing how well It could cool down my garage as well as save me money heating the water.


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## protechplumbing (Oct 10, 2008)

Well let's see:

Made in India.

Not a double walled heat exchanger and is therefore illegal to install in the state of Florida (what did you say your friends name was?) due to potable water contamination possibility.

Voids your water heater tank warranty as you have to fish that heat exchanger tube down into the tank where you will have copper touching the steel tank.

Zero part availability for future service.

:thumbsup:















Dbower said:


> Does anyone have any experience with these? airgenerate .com
> A plumber friend of mine said he has installed about 15 now and is hearing good things about them. Im trying to decide If I want to get one. Im interested in seeing how well It could cool down my garage as well as save me money heating the water.


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## Dbower (Mar 5, 2009)

I understand that it will void the warranty of your water heater. If they save as much on the electric cost as they say then they could just about pay for itself in a year. Have you actually seen or installed any? Or would you not recommend them at all? And most he has installed have been supplied by the customer and installed by their choice.


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## Anti-wingnut (Mar 12, 2009)

Dbower said:


> And most he has installed have been supplied by the customer and installed by their choice.


Not to overly criticize your plumber friend, but you did use the term "most", and not "all". And regardless of that fact, if indeed these devices are illegal for use in domestic hot water systems in Florida, any plumber who installs them is acting unethically. Not all houses have whole house back- flow preventers, so even if a HO buys this unit and has a "plumber" or handyman install it, upon failure it could not only affect the house where it was installed, but also neighboring houses.

As a presumed expert, said "plumber" or handyman could be held legally liable by neighbors or subsequent HO's for affects of failure.

What I'm trying to say is that your plumber friend is an idiot


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## protechplumbing (Oct 10, 2008)

Yes, I have seen them and I looked into them extensively. No, I don't recommend them.

That makes no difference. He is the contractor and he is the one installing the item that will contaminate the water supply.

Here's how it will go down in court: People get sick or die from drinking poisoned water from this thing. The judge asks him "Did you pull a building permit to install this? Is it approved by code to install?" When the answer is "no" the lawyers will eat him for lunch. There are plenty of heat pumps out there that are legal to use and actually save more money in operating costs. They just cost a bit more than the air tap unit though. Knowing this, the only excuse for breaking the law and jeopardizing the safety of the general public is because you wanted to save some money up front. The judge will not look kindly on this.

BTW, is your friend a licensed plumbing contractor? If he isn't, he is committing a felony just by installing ANY water heater.




Dbower said:


> I understand that it will void the warranty of your water heater. If they save as much on the electric cost as they say then they could just about pay for itself in a year. Have you actually seen or installed any? Or would you not recommend them at all? And most he has installed have been supplied by the customer and installed by their choice.


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## Dbower (Mar 5, 2009)

Yes, the company he works for has been around the area for quite a long time. The reason this whole topic came up is that I did an addition for him at his own house and he installing one for himself. I only talked to him about for a few minutes and thats the reason I am trying to get more info on the product. What part of this are you saying is not up to code? The plumbing inspector has already seen it and all inspections have been passed.


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## protechplumbing (Oct 10, 2008)

Since you have to fish that copper tube (the heat exchanger) into the water heater tank, there is only 1 layer (the wall of the copper pipe) separating the refrigerant from the potable water. There is also no way to know that is has sprung a leak and started to poison the public water supply until it is too late.

So it basically fails every part of 608.16.3 line by line.

You wouldn't happen to have those inspectors names or municipalities would you? I would be interested to chat with their supervisors about this.
 


*608.5 Chemicals and other substances.* Chemicals and other substances that produce either toxic conditions, taste, odor or discoloration in a potable water system shall not be introduced into, or utilized in, such systems.

*608.16.3 Heat exchangers.* Heat exchangers utilizing an essentially toxic transfer fluid shall be separated from the potable water by double-wall construction. An air gap open to the atmosphere shall be provided between the two walls. Heat exchangers utilizing an essentially nontoxic transfer fluid shall be permitted to be of single-wall construction.



Dbower said:


> Yes, the company he works for has been around the area for quite a long time. The reason this whole topic came up is that I did an addition for him at his own house and he installing one for himself. I only talked to him about for a few minutes and thats the reason I am trying to get more info on the product. What part of this are you saying is not up to code? The plumbing inspector has already seen it and all inspections have been passed.


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## Dbower (Mar 5, 2009)

Its the City of St. Pete. Im going to talk to the plumber again about it and get more info from his side. I understand these concerns and that Is why I'm looking into them more before I made a decision. Thanks for the info.


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