# Can this be done correctly?



## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

I am bidding a ceiling drywall fix. The 1/2" drywall on a ceiling is starting to sag between the joist. It is very noticable and it appears that light weight drywall was used. 16" OC are the joists and blown in insulation is on top. I really do not want to pull all insulation, demo drywall and blow in new insulation but I will if that is the only fix. But my question is, can I just install 5/8" right over the current 1/2"? Ceiling height is not an issue and will that stop the bowing from continuing as it would have more structure between joists? I have never tried this approach but would save a ton of mess and time as this is the main living area in a home that also serves as a in home daycare. 

There is also the option of running 2x studs perpendicular to joists to help suck the drywall back up and then installing new drywall but would just challenge me a bit with electrical as far as lighting. 

Thoughts all?


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## A&E Exteriors (Aug 14, 2009)

brhokel606 said:


> I am bidding a ceiling drywall fix. The 1/2" drywall on a ceiling is starting to sag between the joist. It is very noticable and it appears that light weight drywall was used. 16" OC are the joists and blown in insulation is on top. I really do not want to pull all insulation, demo drywall and blow in new insulation but I will if that is the only fix. But my question is, can I just install 5/8" right over the current 1/2"? Ceiling height is not an issue and will that stop the bowing from continuing as it would have more structure between joists? I have never tried this approach but would save a ton of mess and time as this is the main living area in a home that also serves as a in home daycare.
> 
> There is also the option of running 2x studs perpendicular to joists to help suck the drywall back up and then installing new drywall but would just challenge me a bit with electrical as far as lighting.
> 
> Thoughts all?


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

Thats an option I was thinking too, would still like to just put up 5/8" but thats an option too, thank you.


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## nickko (Nov 11, 2012)

another question would be if the 5/8 drywall would push the sag in the 1/2" dry wall up. I think it would be a lot of pressure on the 5/8 dry wall, pushing up the existing and holding the weight of the 5/8. Could you fur it down with 1/4 or 1/2 inch plywood running right on the existing joist. Or whatever thickness it would take to get down past the sag so that you are not pushing the dry wall back up. It seems that you would have a lot of screws pull right thru the board trying to push the sag out.

nicko


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## stevelovesgod (Oct 31, 2015)

if the joist can hold the extra weight, laminating it with a 5/8 type X (fire rated) which is a denser board. Make sure you screw on the joist all the way across should suffice.

Pictures help as well. 

The question is what caused the sag, not screwed off properly, or light weight drywall.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

Why is the drywall sagging ? I put L/W On 2ft centers all the time ..[with no issues] If the board is sagging on 16s SOMETHINGS WRONG!! L/W or not!


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## superseal (Feb 4, 2009)

blacktop said:


> Why is the drywall sagging ? I put L/W On 2ft centers all the time ..[with no issues] If the board is sagging on 16s SOMETHINGS WRONG!! L/W or not!


I would agree, just screw it off and strap the ceiling, get a fresh start...and use glue.


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

I've only had 2 instances of drywall bellying on new builds, and both times it was due to excess humidity.

The excess humidity was due to the homeowners cranking up the whole house humidifiers to max (because of allergies).

So, regardless what method you use, then the question I have is: what will prevent the problem from reoccurring?

Because regardless of the cause, the new drywall - if IT sags again - now its YOUR dime warranty-wise.


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## Golden view (Feb 16, 2012)

superseal said:


> I would agree, just screw it off and strap the ceiling, get a fresh start...and use glue.


And this way, there's no insulation weight on the new DW. Even in high humidity, I wouldn't think it would sag.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

Sounds to me ..the OP is dealing with railroading .


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

Sorry, been busy all day. I posted on a call from another contractor that recommended me and had looked at....

Well left a few things out. Joists are 24" OC and a load bearing wall had been removed, no header. So the ceiling is sagging at a spot but that would not cause the drywall to sag throughout. I am going to attach pics

I will have to put a support beam back in and probably have to tear down all drywall, it is bowed that bad.


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

#2 pic


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

#3 pic

Also, that stub wall was the support wall and is definetly load bearing. I can not believe how many people tear out load bearing walls! How do more houses not collapse?


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

Pic #4


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

Next pic


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

That's a classic case of railroading !


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

blacktop said:


> That's a classic case of railroading !


I have never heard of that, what is that?


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Running your drywall parallel with your joists. It's a big no no!


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

Ahhhh, gotcha! Didn't realize that's what that was called, thank you.


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## Big Shoe (Jun 16, 2008)

Looks pretty f'd up. Screw 1x3 onto trusses same direction, adjust electric and then rehang with 5/8"


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

blacktop said:


> If cost is a factor ....strap with 2x across the truss 1x tend to to split on the ends when screwing into. Plus 2x will draw up the ceiling a bit better ..if you have problem with the bellies just cut a v groove between the trusses . It'll push up! Then hang it with whatever you want ! Just make sure that strapping is secure .. (as I'm sure you know) a complete tear out would be best ..but strap and hang will save them a few dollars and will work out just as well imo.. in my travels trusses 2ft on center tend to be wavy and have double and even triple crowns ... I'd say it's best to strap across the trusses.. but it's kinda hard for me to say without walking in and seeing it first hand pics just don't do justice on something like this..


Thank you, I agree on full demo too but I don't think they can swing it. I like the 2x idea, the header and bringing the sagging portion alone is going to hit them kind of hard I think, but it's real bad!


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

brhokel606 said:


> Thank you, I agree on full demo too but I don't think they can swing it. I like the 2x idea, the header and bringing the sagging portion alone is going to hit them kind of hard I think, but it's real bad!


Thank you for starting the thread .. I like hearing different opinions on chit like this !


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

blacktop said:


> Thank you for starting the thread .. I like hearing different opinions on chit like this !


What makes me shake my head is I looked at that and kept trying to figure out why it would bow so bad. I had not seen one like that before and just thought it was the 1/2", then the railroading came up and it was like a light bulb came on! Well duh! It was hung parallel and not perpendicular! 

I would have hung it right but missed the obvious staring me right in the face! 

Your welcome on the post, it had me stumped but now I am just a wee bit smarter on the cause, I wonder what I had to loose from my brain to retain this new information.


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## Snow580 (Mar 4, 2015)

I did a job last fall that the same thing was happening. It was 5/8's drywall but it was railroaded and it was sagging bad throughout the whole house! I ran 1x4's right on top of the trusses and I couldn't believe how much that pulled it up! I then went over it all with 1/2 drywall and it looked just perfect. Wayyyy easier and faster than tearing all of that out to start over. 
Oh and I forgot to mention all the perimeters were nailed 😦 Alot of the nails were half pulled out. I was honestly surprised that it didn't fall down. Well in one bedroom there was a spot that the ceiling was sagging almost 2 inches!!


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## CyclingSkating (Jul 27, 2016)

SmallTownGuy said:


> I've only had 2 instances of drywall bellying on new builds, and both times it was due to excess humidity.
> 
> The excess humidity was due to the homeowners cranking up the whole house humidifiers to max (because of allergies).
> 
> ...


As he said, covering up something that has been drenched via humidity, it is asking for trouble. The sheetrock has lost a bit of its strength due to the added weight. It stinks to have to think about redoing it all but it sounds like the right thing to do with the info that I have read about.:clap::clap:


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## CyclingSkating (Jul 27, 2016)

brhokel606 said:


> What makes me shake my head is I looked at that and kept trying to figure out why it would bow so bad. I had not seen one like that before and just thought it was the 1/2", then the railroading came up and it was like a light bulb came on! Well duh! It was hung parallel and not perpendicular!
> 
> I would have hung it right but missed the obvious staring me right in the face!
> 
> Your welcome on the post, it had me stumped but now I am just a wee bit smarter on the cause, I wonder what I had to loose from my brain to retain this new information.


Nice find! I enjoy finding the different ways people think things should be installed vs the proper way!


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## Randy Bush (Mar 7, 2011)

brhokel606 said:


> They are trusses, I have thought about that too. The costs involved with that approach I think are going to make it cost prohibited to HO.


So being trusses don't have to worry about the load bearing wall like you thought.


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

Randy Bush said:


> So being trusses don't have to worry about the load bearing wall like you thought.


Not necessarily true, some trusses are built with load bearing walls in mind. Just because they are a truss doesn't mean it's not a load bearing wall.


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## Randy Bush (Mar 7, 2011)

brhokel606 said:


> Not necessarily true, some trusses are built with load bearing walls in mind. Just because they are a truss doesn't mean it's not a load bearing wall.


Guess did not really know that, learn some new all the time.  All have ever used or seen around here are designed without any bearing walls ,even big machine sheds and livestock barns.

Sent from my LG-V410 using Tapatalk


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

Randy Bush said:


> Guess did not really know that, learn some new all the time.  All have ever used or seen around here are designed without any bearing walls ,even big machine sheds and livestock barns.
> 
> Sent from my LG-V410 using Tapatalk


That's why we communicate on this forum, can't even begin to tell you how much I have learned.

A couple of years ago I get called called by a home owner via a drywall contractor that was doing some repairs ans noticed the ceiling saggIng. I get there and it will s sagging 5"! 

HO explains that his brother and him removed a wall, his brother checked and it was truss built and said it would be ok because of trusses. Well that wall was load bearing, very load bearing actually. Wall was Dead center of house and the wall had been removed a few weeks prior, my buddy was in to fix the drywall mess as they couldn't get the finish smooth. Wish I would have taken a picture but they were probably days from ceiling failing. 

We put in double LVL with double jack studs and good to go. HO really wanted the smooth open room look and wasnt a fan of the header as it "still broke up the room" but was satisfied when I explained the concept of a open roof design and how they could look at the stars daily from their living room couch if I didn't use a header. Floor plan was too cut up to put a header above the ceiling and tie in, let alone the webbing from the truss being in the way.:laughing:


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