# 2011 MBP just died



## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

So I'm just starting to get busy with my new CAD venture and.......blam, 7:40 am yesterday my Apple MacBook Pro goes black. 

Now it won't boot past a gray screen. I'm trying a few things. If I can get it to the recovery mode.....maybe I have a chance. My final option is an SSD install. I've always heard those can make a tired old computer seem new again. 

This is the first time I've experienced a catastrophic fail in the apple realm. So much for, "they just work, huh?"


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## JT Wood (Dec 17, 2007)

wallmaxx said:


> This is the first time I've experienced a catastrophic fail in the apple realm. So much for, "they just work, huh?"


This your chance to free your self from the oppressive, evil realm of Steve Jobs.
:laughing:


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

*2011 MBP Just Died*



JT Wood said:


> This your chance to free your self from the oppressive, evil realm of Steve Jobs.
> 
> :laughing:



Well I'd have to go Linux then...because I'm completely done with windows. I tried WIN 8 virtually. MS just moved everything and made it harder and slower for me to get to what I actually want to do. 

I keep hearing, just wait til the next version.....it'll be great.

They started that lie with Vista and Millennium. 
3.1 was my first. 3 - 3.5" diskettes
NT 3.51. The army used it when I was in. 
95 was a big change to the UI
NT 4 more Army use
98. Very stable and good IMO
2000. A more user friendly NT
ME. Completely lame. No significant improvements
XP. Great version IMO
Vista. holy crap......let's sell a busted bridge to the next version
7. Pretty solid OS
8. who let the retards loose in the coding department. No one will miss the start button. 
8.1. Uh....sorry about that whole start button fiasco. Still, let's play hide and go seek with where everything is. 
10. The unicorn on the horizon standing under the rainbow with a leprechaun riding him to the pot o' gold. 


Yeah...I'm pretty much done with the windows philosophy.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Windows 8 was designed to literate more like our smart phones. Apps and customization. They had to break a few eggs but I run it in the desktop mode and have no issue finding anything. All the hot keys still work. I would really love it if I had a windows phone.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Windows 8 was designed to literate more like our smart phones. Apps and customization. They had to break a few eggs but I run it in the desktop mode and have no issue finding anything. All the hot keys still work. I would really love it if I had a windows phone.


So there's a desktop mode? Is it like Win 7? That would be great. I never saw that option when I was installing it. I will look into that. Thanks!!


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## 1985gt (Dec 10, 2010)

So just use one of the older versions of windows. I still run XP on my work computer, sure it no longer has support but why would it? Doesn't need support.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

wallmaxx said:


> So there's a desktop mode? Is it like Win 7? That would be great. I never saw that option when I was installing it. I will look into that. Thanks!!


On the tile view there should be a tile that says desktop. Click on it and you are back to what you are use to just without the start menu. But you have access to everything on the hidden menu bar on the right.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

1985gt said:


> So just use one of the older versions of windows. I still run XP on my work computer, sure it no longer has support but why would it? Doesn't need support.


NT was the best windows version but XP was a close second after they got the bugs worked out.


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## 1985gt (Dec 10, 2010)

TNTSERVICES said:


> NT was the best windows version but XP was a close second after they got the bugs worked out.


I really dislike change. I will keep using XP until I am no longer able to. I have 8 on my home PC and I feel lost. It use to have Vista before the HD went out. I was lost with Visa but was getting use to it.


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## JT Wood (Dec 17, 2007)

I'm a windows 7 guy myself.

My wife has 8 and it's a piece of crap. Nobody has a windows phone, so they damaged a great os (7) to make it easier and more seamless for a non existent phone market. :blink:


I've never had an issues with windows 7 though.

It's stable, never had a virus and it's fairly quick.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

*2011 MBP Just Died*

I hated 8 at first but now I used it some I like it better than 7. Still on 7 on my PC but waiting to see how these free OS upgrades go with 7 users.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

I downloaded an app on 8 that mimics windows 7. Has the start menu and everything


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

VMWare 7.1.1 wouldn't let the screen resolution of win 8.1 be anything larger than 1152 x 864 so that sucked. It appears to be a known issue. 

So I just migrated to our newest iMac (time machine makes that easy) and I bought parallels. During the win 8.1 install in Parallels I was given an option to have win 8.1 be more like win 7.

Now I have things back. 

View attachment 181377


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## LeeFowler (Nov 3, 2012)

*2011 MBP Just Died*

4 years out of a notebook doesn't seem like a catastrophic failure. Unless of course you didn't have anything backed up. That would suck.

Edit:
I should read the entire thread before I make comments.


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## AustinDB (Sep 11, 2006)

are you running a SSD in your imac? I had a 2011 or 2012 version and added the SSD-the difference was amazing. Cut the lag time in half with speeds closer to the MBPr speeds.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

72chevy4x4 said:


> are you running a SSD in your imac? I had a 2011 or 2012 version and added the SSD-the difference was amazing. Cut the lag time in half with speeds closer to the MBPr speeds.



That's my next move. I'm thinking a Samsung EVO pro. 6GB/s


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

LeeFowler said:


> 4 years out of a notebook doesn't seem like a catastrophic failure. Unless of course you didn't have anything backed up. That would suck.
> 
> Edit:
> I should read the entire thread before I make comments.



I'm good with back ups. 

3 cloud, 2 external drives and a family NAS have all the important stuff. Yeah, I'd be a wee bit peeved if I had no archiving routine in place.


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## Philament (Dec 9, 2014)

I am in a similar situation today. Woke up to my computer on the bios screen, no drives detected. Just two weeks ago I had my phone die too. I have all of the important stuff backed up, it's just the huge time hog to get it all set up again. I think I'm going to ghost this hard drive though so at least I can get back to a semi stable state the next time this happens.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

I have 2 homes to draw asap and BLAM, a whole day lost just getting back up and running. 

The rebuild time is the real problem. When I get enough $$ I think I'm going to get a second computer just to run as a stand in back up...sync'd every day.


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## Philament (Dec 9, 2014)

I'm finally back up and running...waste of a day. 
I have a PC, not a MBP, but I went with the Samsung 850 Pro over the 850 EVO. The Pro comes with a 10yr warranty which was comforting considering the hard drive that crashed on me was an Intel SSD that only lasted 4 years. No warning no nothing, just blam, dead. 

Think I'll ghost it in a week or so after I've ironed out the bugs and got everything to my liking.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

*2011 MBP Just Died*



Philament said:


> I'm finally back up and running...waste of a day.
> 
> I have a PC, not a MBP, but I went with the Samsung 850 Pro over the 850 EVO. The Pro comes with a 10yr warranty which was comforting considering the hard drive that crashed on me was an Intel SSD that only lasted 4 years. No warning no nothing, just blam, dead.
> 
> ...



The Pro and the Evo both have same warranty. But the pro is def the better choice


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## Philament (Dec 9, 2014)

BCConstruction said:


> The Pro and the Evo both have same warranty. But the pro is def the better choice


Maybe I'm not looking at the latest info, but this is what's on the samsung website:
http://www.samsung.com/global/business/semiconductor/minisite/SSD/global/html/support/warranty.html

only the 850 pro has a 10 year warranty from what I read. 

Maybe you're thinking of the 840 pro vs 850 evo which both have a 5 yr warranty.

I don't know if you'd get the all performance bonus with the PRO on a MAC though because you have to enable RAPID with their "Magician" software which only runs on windows.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

Philament said:


> Maybe I'm not looking at the latest info, but this is what's on the samsung website:
> 
> http://www.samsung.com/global/business/semiconductor/minisite/SSD/global/html/support/warranty.html
> 
> ...



Your right. I am thinking you got the same as me but mines a 840pro. The pros the way forward though. It's so fast it's crazy.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

Wow. Samsung 500GB Pro is only $239 and with prime.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

I hope it's an easy swap. I have all the software and backups. If Murphy doesn't jack with me, I should be able to just swap the drives out and get the install going. 

I've rebuilt 4 or 5 pc's over the years but never yet a Mac.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

View attachment 184057


I'm hoping 500GB will be enough.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

I'd heard the flash drives just die with no warning. FWIW, I've seen more infections on Win7 home than winXP Pro or Win7Pro.

Tried a cute little Linux distribution - Porteus. It's small enough to run on a live CD. Wiped the hard drives on a Win7 laptop, and it loaded on pretty well. No problems getting the wireless going. A little slow, presumable due to the Linux drivers. I gave it to my sister, and she's pretty happy with it so far.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

What's up on Amazon? I just checked back to maybe buy that 850 Pro drive and they had changed the price and put a warning up.
View attachment 184218


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

Update:

So the new SSD arrived. Swapped it out.........problem still existed, won't boot past the gray screen.

Found out that 2011 - 2014 MBPs are under an extended warranty program to fix/replace the GPU switching system. It apparently was prone to failure. I'm heading to the Apple store Tuesday to turn in my machine.

http://www.apple.com/support/macbookpro-videoissues/


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## JT Wood (Dec 17, 2007)

Go windows 7. 
It just works. None of this fooling around needed. :laughing:


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

JT Wood said:


> Go windows 7.
> It just works. None of this fooling around needed. :laughing:


Being that this is my first major apple computer issue and they are covering it out of warranty...............i'm happy to stay in the "fold".

Hey the WIN 8.1 looks just like WIN 7 in parallels....so I'm not getting full-screened into things and not finding an intuitive way back.

I'll post some screen shots.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

Okay............video makes it all better

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlDSD9OFAbE


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## AustinDB (Sep 11, 2006)

Any chance you can hook it up to an external monitor and get something different?


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

72chevy4x4 said:


> Any chance you can hook it up to an external monitor and get something different?


It was running a second monitor when it died. I'm just glad Apple is going to fix it for free. Or so they say so on their sit. I'll find out Tuesday.


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## AustinDB (Sep 11, 2006)

think you asked about VMware, I use Virtualbox to run my win setup on my mac. last time I checked there was a printing issue out of virtualbox, but I didn't followup on trying to repair it.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

72chevy4x4 said:


> think you asked about VMware, I use Virtualbox to run my win setup on my mac. last time I checked there was a printing issue out of virtualbox, but I didn't followup on trying to repair it.


I've found Parallels to be the most useful in my experience.

Drag and drop across OS's is pretty cool.


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## JT Wood (Dec 17, 2007)

wallmaxx said:


> Being that this is my first major apple computer issue and they are covering it out of warranty...............i'm happy to stay in the "fold".


Baa-aaa 


Just kidding :laughing:


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

JT Wood said:


> Baa-aaa
> 
> 
> Just kidding :laughing:



I know. 

View attachment 185849


This is as fa as I could get it. Then I tried the Single User Login method. No good there either.


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## TWhite (Oct 29, 2013)

Stay with Apple if you like it. You will have less outside incursions to deal with.


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## AustinDB (Sep 11, 2006)

I might have to check into Parallel's-drag and drop would be nice.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

TWhite said:


> Stay with Apple if you like it. You will have less outside incursions to deal with.


I've owned PC for 20+ years and have never been hacked.

Viruses come from p0rn, games and movie downloads. 99 times out of 100 of you are doing right you won't get a virus.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

TNTSERVICES said:


> I've owned PC for 20+ years and have never been hacked.
> 
> Viruses come from p0rn, games and movie downloads. 99 times out of 100 of you are doing right you won't get a virus.



Same here. Had a couple of viruses that anti virus caught. Well I say viruses but they were "Trojan's" but they didn't even make it far enough to even cause a single problem but I was downloading sketchy stuff from dodge websites.


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## TWhite (Oct 29, 2013)

TNTSERVICES said:


> I've owned PC for 20+ years and have never been hacked.
> 
> Viruses come from p0rn, games and movie downloads. 99 times out of 100 of you are doing right you won't get a virus.


From what I read and people I know, your lucky.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

TWhite said:


> From what I read and people I know, your lucky.


No, they aren't running virus protection and are visiting and D/Ling bad stuff.

That's the problem with hearing and not knowing.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

And not to get in to the debate again, but let's be honest. Apple doesn't get viruses because they aren't a target. Most infrastructure and businesses use PC. Most people use PC. As Apple grows they to will begin to feel the pains of viruses, malware and trojans.


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## TWhite (Oct 29, 2013)

TNTSERVICES said:


> No, they aren't running virus protection and are visiting and D/Ling bad stuff.
> 
> That's the problem with hearing and not knowing.


Why do you have to be such a smartalec all the time?


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## TWhite (Oct 29, 2013)

TNTSERVICES said:


> And not to get in to the debate again, but let's be honest. Apple doesn't get viruses because they aren't a target. Most infrastructure and businesses use PC. Most people use PC. As Apple grows they to will begin to feel the pains of viruses, malware and trojans.


Part of the reason that Apple doesn't have many viruses you are correct it's not as big of a target. But the UNIX platform is inherently more secure than what Windows is based upon.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

TWhite said:


> Part of the reason that Apple doesn't have many viruses you are correct it's not as big of a target. But the UNIX platform is inherently more secure than what Windows is based upon.



No doubt it's more secure platform but there's nothing that can stop the stupidity of a end user who run attachments they have no idea what's in them or what they are. That's the most common reason for infections on both systems and that's why Apple advise to run antivirus


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

TWhite said:


> Part of the reason that Apple doesn't have many viruses you are correct it's not as big of a target. But the UNIX platform is inherently more secure than what Windows is based upon.


Its not a small part, more like 90% of the reason they aren't attacked as much. 

Let's not forget the hacking of icloud.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Its not a small part, more like 90% of the reason they aren't attacked as much.
> 
> Let's not forget the hacking of icloud.



That can't really be blamed on iCloud. It was idiots who opened the emails and replied to them with user name and passwords. You just can't make any system 100% safe. It's always the user that's the issue not the system when it comes to malware and viruses.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

And I wait
View attachment 187114


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

That name cracks me up. Genius lol


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

And the verdict is...
View attachment 187130


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

Free repair!!!

Nice Apple!


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

Did it end up being a known issue?


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

BCConstruction said:


> Did it end up being a known issue?



Yes. 

http://www.apple.com/support/macbookpro-videoissues/


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

And I was out of warranty.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

wallmaxx said:


> Yes.
> 
> http://www.apple.com/support/macbookpro-videoissues/



That was handy then. Nothing worse than just being out of warranty then you have an issue.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

BCConstruction said:


> That was handy then. Nothing worse than just being out of warranty then you have an issue.


Yeah. I went through that with an Alienware back in 03 or 04 before they were bought by Dell. Wife talked me out of the 3 year warranty. At 15 months the mobo died. They wanted $1100 deposit to diagnose and repair it.

I dumped it on craigslist about 2 years or so ago for $100.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

I'm hoping the 850 Pro will bring some much needed speed like this video shows

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B12Zmlf6BAk


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

TWhite said:


> I have one too:
> 
> http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/decrypt-os-security-showdown/


Thanks for that one. It's funny though the author had nothing bad to day about Apple but found holes in every other operating system. Hmmmm....

But I do agree with this, and it does backs up again my claim concerning popularity of OS and volume of attacks. That is something you said I was wrong about...even your Apple fanboy agrees. 

"Apple was able to coast on its low-key laurels for the better half of its lifespan, but now the wolves are circling, ready to attack the Mac’s growing user base."


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## TWhite (Oct 29, 2013)

The only fanboy is you. It's the only thing you "prove".


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

TWhite said:


> The only fanboy is you. It's the only thing you "prove".


Great come back, but not only don't you get that Apple's are not more secure but what a fanboy is. 

A fanboy is someone who, in the face of facts, debits the truth about their preferred product. 

I have never claimed PC or Windows was superior or not vulnerable. I will say I have never been hacked, infected or compromised since I started using PCs back in 93 when I built my first 486 with a dx33 processor.


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## JT Wood (Dec 17, 2007)

I think windows is superior. Not because I really love Microsoft. But because I hate apple so much. 

Although I haven't had a virus or anything that caused me problems since windows Vista. Probably 10 yrs


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

JT Wood said:


> I think windows is superior. Not because I really love Microsoft. But because I hate apple so much.
> 
> Although I haven't had a virus or anything that caused me problems since windows Vista. Probably 10 yrs


If you always steer clear of p_o_r_n and warez, and never click email links from your dead uncle, you will probably be fine.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

Since when did the word *P*apa *O*scar *R*omeo *N*ovember become worthy of the astrix redaction?


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

JT Wood said:


> I think windows is superior. Not because I really love Microsoft. But because I hate apple so much.
> 
> Although I haven't had a virus or anything that caused me problems since windows Vista. Probably 10 yrs


Hate is such a harsh emotion. Has Apple intentionally harmed you in some way?

I know that my productivity flies along great until I have to fire up windows. Then it's update time, reboot time, oh....autoCAD is running out of system memory time (yeah right, 16GB 1333MHz with 12GB allocated to windows)

You like *RED*

I like *BLUE*

You "hate" *BLUE*

I "hate" *RED*


Much more simplified.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

wallmaxx said:


> Hate is such a harsh emotion. Has Apple intentionally harmed you in some way?
> 
> I know that my productivity flies along great until I have to fire up windows. Then it's update time, reboot time, oh....autoCAD is running out of system memory time (yeah right, 16GB 1333MHz with 12GB allocated to windows)
> 
> ...


I have several machines that run the same OS and the one with the best specs is one of the slowest. Last time I buy an all in one monitor. My five year old HP is faster that it. Most issues with PC's are the components and parts. That's the leg up that Apple has, consistency. But that's also a draw back. You can't upgrade anything without taking it in to Apple.


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## TWhite (Oct 29, 2013)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Great come back, but not only don't you get that Apple's are not more secure but what a fanboy is.
> 
> A fanboy is someone who, in the face of facts, debits the truth about their preferred product.
> 
> I have never claimed PC or Windows was superior or not vulnerable. I will say I have never been hacked, infected or compromised since I started using PCs back in 93 when I built my first 486 with a dx33 processor.


You my friend are a fanboy based on your statements. I never said Apple was superior and neither did any one else on here!


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

TWhite said:


> You my friend are a fanboy based on your statements. I never said Apple was superior and neither did any one else on here!


You obviously don't know the meaning of fanboy. I won't waste my time repeating the definition, but i have never made claims concerning Windows. In fact I have admitted that they are attacked and have vulnerabilities. That's the exact opposite of a fanboy. I am not delusional in thinking that Windows is superior or without fault.

And you have claimed that Apple is superior and denied why they don't get attack as much as Windows.


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## TWhite (Oct 29, 2013)

TWhite said:


> You my friend are a fanboy based on your statements. I never said Apple was superior and neither did any one else on here!


Zzzzzzz


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

TWhite said:


> Zzzzzzz


What's funny is when you guys run out of steam and the one or two articles written by fanboys...you start with the personal stuff and then just nonsense. I am pretty sure that everyone can see the truth.

So predictable.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

Apple definitely is the marketing king. 

They make products people "want". That's good business. 

Controlling their ecosystem is another advantage. For those who don't like that, go elsewhere. 

I will buy a maxed out machine and run it for 5 to 7 years then get another one. My days of tweaking a box are over. Nothing fun about that to me anymore.


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## TWhite (Oct 29, 2013)

TNTSERVICES said:


> What's funny is when you guys run out of steam and the one or two articles written by fanboys...you start with the personal stuff and then just nonsense. I am pretty sure that everyone can see the truth.
> 
> So predictable.


Nothing personal here, just calling you the same thing. The truth is buy what you want. I prefer Apple. If you want something else fine, but don't get your panties in a wad if I recommend someone look at an Apple product.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

TWhite said:


> Nothing personal here, just calling you the same thing. The truth is buy what you want. I prefer Apple. If you want something else fine, but don't get your panties in a wad if I recommend someone look at an Apple product.


Where did I call you a fanboy?

And I never got my panties in an uproar over your choice, just your claims that your choice was superior and then telling me I don't know what I'm talking about. Again, you guys always get that all twisted up, especially when you say that I need to educate myself and I end up educating you.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

wallmaxx said:


> Apple definitely is the marketing king.
> 
> They make products people "want". That's good business.
> 
> ...


Market King in what way. There are more windows systems sold than Apple daily. While they are gaining some market share, they are hardly king.

I haven't tweaked a system in years and you get what you pay for. If you spent as much on a PC as a MAC costs, you would far better computer. Faster, more storage and more secure. That's just the facts.


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## JT Wood (Dec 17, 2007)

wallmaxx said:


> Controlling their ecosystem is another Disadvantage. For those who don't like that, go elsewhere.
> .


way ahead of you :laughing:


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Market King in what way. There are more windows systems sold than Apple daily. While they are gaining some market share, they are hardly king.
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't tweaked a system in years and you get what you pay for. If you spent as much on a PC as a MAC costs, you would far better computer. Faster, more storage and more secure. That's just the facts.



Yeah. Good for you. 

Apple makes nice things that people want. $60 billion company. They beat all other tech companies. I'd say that's great marketing. Can HP compete? How about Dell? 

Apple generates a want.......it works for them. 

You're just pissy over something so petty and first world. There are so many things that matter.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

JT Wood said:


> way ahead of you :laughing:



Rewriting my words is so........KAP-ish.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

5 Reasons People Choose to Hate Apple

http://www.computerworld.com/article/2468575/mobile-apps/5-reasons-why-people-hate-apple.html


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## TWhite (Oct 29, 2013)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Where did I call you a fanboy?
> 
> And I never got my panties in an uproar over your choice, just your claims that your choice was superior and then telling me I don't know what I'm talking about. Again, you guys always get that all twisted up, especially when you say that I need to educate myself and I end up educating you.


Post #74


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

TWhite said:


> Post #74


So you have another account? You are also Brumarsh. Cuz I quoted his post, which means I was talking to him. 

Why do you think everything is about you?


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## TWhite (Oct 29, 2013)

TNTSERVICES said:


> So you have another account? You are also Brumarsh. Cuz I quoted his post, which means I was talking to him.
> 
> Why do you think everything is about you?


No I only have one account. You did use the plural form "fanboys" which implies more than one.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

TWhite said:


> No I only have one account. You did use the plural form "fanboys" which implies more than one.


But not necessarily you. Again everything isn't about you.


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## TWhite (Oct 29, 2013)

TNTSERVICES said:


> But not necessarily you. Again everything isn't about you.


You splitting hairs again!


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

As I mentioned on another thread, there aren't any secure OSs. The one exception may be a secure version of Linux developed by the NSA, but that isn't available. I can run either Windows or Linux (or Solaris) in a pretty secure fashion, but that isn't due to the OS, it's how I run it.

Beyond that, you aren't talking security, you're talking statistical events of exploits being used on your specific system. That's real world security.

I don't really understand the logic of the whole discussion. What box to choose boils down to preferences and what software you need to run.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

TWhite said:


> You splitting hairs again!


Not at all. I never called YOU a fanboy. If you accepted the label, that's on you.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

hdavis said:


> As I mentioned on another thread, there aren't any secure OSs. The one exception may be a secure version of Linux developed by the NSA, but that isn't available. I can run either Windows or Linux (or Solaris) in a pretty secure fashion, but that isn't due to the OS, it's how I run it.
> 
> Beyond that, you aren't talking security, you're talking statistical events of exploits being used on your specific system. That's real world security.
> 
> I don't really understand the logic of the whole discussion. What box to choose boils down to preferences and what software you need to run.


I was told that I was uneducated in my thinking that Apple is not attack as much as Windows due to there popularity. I was also told that Apple was a more secure system. That's the discussion. Which I have proven that Apple is just as unsecure and in some cases less secure than Windows (and visa versa).

My point wasn't that one was superior than the other or that one should choose one over the other, just that neither is superior in security.


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## TWhite (Oct 29, 2013)

TNTSERVICES said:


> Not at all. I never called YOU a fanboy. If you accepted the label, that's on you.


I did not accept the label although maybe you did?
I said buy what you like it's only a tool after all.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

TNTSERVICES said:


> I was told that I was uneducated in my thinking that Apple is not attack as much as Windows due to there popularity. I was also told that Apple was a more secure system. That's the discussion. Which I have proven that Apple is just as unsecure and in some cases less secure than Windows (and visa versa).
> 
> My point wasn't that one was superior than the other or that one should choose one over the other, just that neither is superior in security.


Rob, I'm actually agreeing.:thumbsup: There is no secure consumer OS. If people want to talk about likelihood of infection, that is very dependent on the user habits and details of how they have their system set up more so than the specific OS. I view that as a different topic than how secure an OS is.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

hdavis said:


> Rob, I'm actually agreeing.:thumbsup: There is no secure consumer OS. If people want to talk about likelihood of infection, that is very dependent on the user habits and details of how they have their system set up more so than the specific OS. I view that as a different topic than how secure an OS is.


I know. Sorry for the confusion. I was mainly addressing those that were saying I am a PC fanboy or hate Apple. I don't at all. I agree with everything you said and have said before that most infection come from three sources...p0rn, games and unsolicited e-mail files, not from an OS that isn't "secure".


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## madmax718 (Dec 7, 2012)

wallmaxx said:


> I noticed a trend over the years.
> 
> Windows 3.1 came on 3 or 4 floppy diskettes of 1.44 MB capacity each. Hard drives were under a GB in size or near a GB.
> 
> ...


THis isnt quite right. Windows 3.1 came on 10 1.44 disks. The average hard drive during that time was 100-200 megs, and were just becoming standard with 256 colors at 640x480. 

windows 386, came on I think 6. Maybe 7 1.2meg 5.25 floppies. 

It ends when you are happy with what you have. The demand for apps is what drives these increases. Just for reference, we may use Microsoft Word for word processing, but Bill Clintons trial with Monica Lewinsky all fit on a single floppy- and was typed up in Word Perfect.


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## madmax718 (Dec 7, 2012)

There is no secure OS. If you stick things your thing into unknown sources, get ready to visit the clinic.

There are secure operating environments, sand boxes, they work really well. But not being able to download attachments, files, pictures, just makes life less pleasant.


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## wallmaxx (Jun 18, 2007)

madmax718 said:


> THis isnt quite right. Windows 3.1 came on 10 1.44 disks. The average hard drive during that time was 100-200 megs, and were just becoming standard with 256 colors at 640x480.
> 
> windows 386, came on I think 6. Maybe 7 1.2meg 5.25 floppies.
> 
> It ends when you are happy with what you have. The demand for apps is what drives these increases. Just for reference, we may use Microsoft Word for word processing, but Bill Clintons trial with Monica Lewinsky all fit on a single floppy- and was typed up in Word Perfect.


The WIN 3.1 I installed on our brand new Army computers (1995) came on 4 floppy disks. I remember because I had to load it on quite a few machines in our battalion. I REALLY would have remembered 10. Don't know what to tell you.........maybe it was way stripped down..........who knows.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

wallmaxx said:


> The WIN 3.1 I installed on our brand new Army computers (1995) came on 4 floppy disks. I remember because I had to load it on quite a few machines in our battalion. I REALLY would have remembered 10. Don't know what to tell you.........maybe it was way stripped down..........who knows.


I don't recall anything less than a 6 disk installation set. The 10 disk set may have been to install DOS as well or on a smaller disc set. They were available on 720kb, 1.2 and 1.44 discs.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

3 for DOS, 6 for Win3.1:

http://www.windowsreinstall.com/install/msdos/install31/page1.htm

As a side note, the DOS and win 3.1 files are available on the internet - some people are running it in virtualbox:

https://forums.virtualbox.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=51190


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