# Duro-Last Material Failures & Warranty Refusal



## tarbaby (Sep 12, 2012)

I am a professional commercial roofing contractor who is experiencing cracking on Duro-Last roofs starting when they reach the age of about 12 years. By the time they reach age 15 (the period of the warranty) it is not uncommon for them to be cracked severely. We are seeing roofs with hundreds of cracks by the time they age out of their warranty.

Duro-Last flatly refuses to repair the cracks unless they are actively leaking. They seem to run and hide from their warranty responsibility every chance they get.

Is anyone else experiencing this?


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## 1985gt (Dec 10, 2010)

******* said:


> I am a professional commercial roofing contractor who is experiencing cracking on Duro-Last roofs starting when they reach the age of about 12 years. By the time they reach age 15 (the period of the warranty) it is not uncommon for them to be cracked severely. We are seeing roofs with hundreds of cracks by the time they age out of their warranty.
> 
> Duro-Last flatly refuses to repair the cracks unless they are actively leaking. They seem to run and hide from their warranty responsibility every chance they get.
> 
> Is anyone else experiencing this?


Seen the cracks, repaired the cracks. Not a certified DL installer but it does not surprise me they run away from the warranties. Replace the roof with a manufacture that stands behind their products.

Are these recovers where the duro last is cracked and letting in moisture but the 2nd roof is holding the water in from getting in the building?


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## MAULEMALL (May 16, 2010)

******* said:


> I am a professional commercial roofing contractor who is experiencing cracking on Duro-Last roofs starting when they reach the age of about 12 years. By the time they reach age 15 (the period of the warranty) it is not uncommon for them to be cracked severely. We are seeing roofs with hundreds of cracks by the time they age out of their warranty.
> 
> Duro-Last flatly refuses to repair the cracks unless they are actively leaking. They seem to run and hide from their warranty responsibility every chance they get.
> 
> Is anyone else experiencing this?


If it aint leaking then what is your problem???

What else is the roof supposed to do besides keep out the weather??

here is the warranty if you can show where it says anything about appearences and cosmetics then you got a beef.. If not then sell a different product.



http://duro-last.com/pdf/engineering/specs/15_plus_5_material.pdf


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## tarbaby (Sep 12, 2012)

We're seeing it on most Duro-Last roofs that are 12 years and older. Doesn't seem to matter what they are put over, although it seems to be the worst in low or ponded areas.


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## tarbaby (Sep 12, 2012)

I agree that if it a problem is merely cosmetic cosmetic it's not a warrantable issue based on the terms of the warranty. If it that was the case, I would not have a beef. These are typically hairline cracks that do leak, although many do not leak enough to show up as stained ceiling tiles, they seep water in gradually, and that is a problem. Any time you are allowing moisture to systemically enter the building envelope, it results in problems like insulation that is getting saturated over time, mold, etc. That is the reason for my concern.


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## MAULEMALL (May 16, 2010)

******* said:


> I agree that if it a problem is merely cosmetic cosmetic it's not a warrantable issue based on the terms of the warranty. If it that was the case, I would not have a beef. These are typically hairline cracks that do leak, although many do not leak enough to show up as stained ceiling tiles, they seep water in gradually, and that is a problem. Any time you are allowing moisture to systemically enter the building envelope, it results in problems like insulation that is getting saturated over time, mold, etc. That is the reason for my concern.


That is not what you posted ...

If you have an actual case where they have not covered thier warranty and are able to back it up with evidence I am sure you will recieve the attention you are trying to recieve.

Other than that it just appears as though you just have an agenda.


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## tarbaby (Sep 12, 2012)

I have no "agenda" other than to find out else may be experiencing the same thing. You will note that that is the question I originally posted.


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## MAULEMALL (May 16, 2010)

******* said:


> I have no "agenda" other than to find out else may be experiencing the same thing. You will note that that is the question I originally posted.


You will also note that YOU posted that they were NOT in violation of thier warranty by your own words.

Hence the point of your post is Moot.


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## LCG (May 30, 2011)

I AM a certifed DuroLast installer and have quit installing their product due to this very reason. I had a customer call last year. Her roof WAS leaking. It had been LEAKING for 2 years. She thought it was from a roof drain as did the other roofers including the one who installed it 15 years previous. The roof was 15yrs2mo's old. I called Duro and asked if they would cover it. They said no. I asked if they would give the customer a break on a new Duro roof. They said NO.

It almost looks like hail damage. Like TPO, Duro fails faster adjacent parapet walls, skylights, etc. anywhere where uv's are higher than the remainder of the field. I will say that the roof I am talking about had small circular cracks everywhere but were more prevalant adjacent parapet walls. 

We coated the roof with an elastomeric roof coating and replaced the roof drains for safe measure. No problems since. We just wanted to buy her some time so she could afford a new roofing system.

Then gave her a bid for IB...:laughing:

How's that for an agenda!


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## tarbaby (Sep 12, 2012)

Thank you for your reply. This is similar to the things we are experiencing. Starting at about 12 years we see cracks, and they become progressively worse over time, By the time the roofs reach 15 years (their warranty expiration) they can often be full of cracks. Duro-Last is very unwilling to acknowledge this problem and does everything it can not to stand behind it.
I was wondering if it was just me or if others are experiencing the same failure and the same treatment.


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## MAULEMALL (May 16, 2010)

LCG said:


> I AM a certifed DuroLast installer and have quit installing their product due to this very reason. I had a customer call last year. Her roof WAS leaking. It had been LEAKING for 2 years. She thought it was from a roof drain as did the other roofers including the one who installed it 15 years previous. The roof was 15yrs2mo's old. I called Duro and asked if they would cover it. They said no. I asked if they would give the customer a break on a new Duro roof. They said NO.
> *So you are saying that the warranty was over and they failed to cover something they had no reason to cover*
> It almost looks like hail damage.*And then you say that it almost looks like Hail damage* Like TPO, Duro fails faster adjacent parapet walls, skylights, etc. anywhere where uv's are higher than the remainder of the field. I will say that the roof I am talking about had small circular cracks everywhere but were more prevalant adjacent parapet walls.
> 
> ...


 
And when she filed for the insurance claim for Hail damage to cover the cost of the work you performed what did they say?


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## LCG (May 30, 2011)

MAULEMALL said:


> And when she filed for the insurance claim for Hail damage to cover the cost of the work you performed what did they say?


I said it looks like hail damage! It isn't. I was explaining how the sheet breaks down and how it appears on the surface of the sheet. No insurance claim was performed to my knowledge.

Yes, the warranty was 2 months out of date. However, the customer had evidence of failure two years previous. The main issue was the roofers she had brought out had not been addressing the sheet failure. They all thought it was coming from the drain. Makes sense, afterall the roof taperes to the roof drains. If the sheet fails ten feet away from the drain there is a good possiibility it will appear at the drain itself. This was the case. It was just dissapointing to hear DuroLast tell the customer to get lost even when the customer offered to buy another system if they would reduce the price.

For what it's worth the main installer of Duro for the area (the one who installed the roof in question) in the last 17years is looking for somewhere else to go. He has complained to me that they are not standing behind their product warranties. This is a poster boy for Duro looking to bail!

I actually like the DuroLast system. It does have it's advantages. Believe me I installed it for several years. It wasn't untill I started seeing failures that we decided to go another direction. I think their 60mil is a justifiable system. I just feel it should be sold as it is. 40mil/13-15yrs, 50mil/17-20yrs, 60mil/20-22.5 yrs. 

When we started installing Duro we asked very specific questions about the longevity of the product and EVERY Duro rep told us that the 40mil would last 30yrs. This was before all of the failures started to occur in our area. I feel we were lied to or maybe they actually believed this. I honestly havent seen anything bad about Duro until the last 3 years. Now all of the sudden POW, bad news everywhere. It's too bad.

I will say that DuroLast has the absolute best technical support I have seen the PVC industry with the acception of IB. I don't know if it's just my luck or if both companies are really that contractor oriented. I still have a soft spot for Duro and when I come across a 200sq flat roof with 3 protrusions I have a hard time not pulling the trigger for a new Duro system. 

To sum it up: I feel DuroLast is a GREAT, entry level, comercial roofing system for the residential roofing contractor who wants to offer smaller commercial jobs. It doesn't take $25,000.00 to go to work. A couple of triac's, 2 grip pulls, and a handfull of #3 bits is about all you need. It is a durable sheet that can be used for almost all flat applications. We installed it to all different types of buildings from restraunts to energy and mineral facilities. WITH NO FAILURES, YET! I would recommend DuroLast over ANY TPO or EPDM roof. 

I just wouldn't put it above IB, Fibertite, or Sarnafill. Being in the top 5isn't all that bad. In the top 3 is world class! Even then there are idiots who still screw it up!


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## MAULEMALL (May 16, 2010)

did you inform anyone of the evidence of Hail Damage or did you take it upon yourself to make the judgement for the insurance company?

And Again you haven't shown ANY instance of warranty noncompliance. 



> However, the customer had evidence of failure two years previous.


Then why would you wait *2 years *to have a warrentied product evaluated??


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## MAULEMALL (May 16, 2010)

*2 YEARS and didn't contact anyone even though she had evidence of a leak.*



http://duro-last.com/protect_your_investment

Protecting Your Duro-Last Roofing Investment



If a leak should appear, you should do the following:
•Call Duro-Last immediately at 800-248-0280.
•Duro-Last must be notified in writing within 30 days in order to meet the terms and conditions of the warranty. Caution should be taken when reporting leaks, as the Duro-Last warranty does not provide for leak investigations of claims not attributable to Duro-Last or not covered by the warranty terms.
•You should inspect the leak area to verify that the cause of the leak is indeed covered by the Duro-Last warranty. If an authorized contractor or Duro-Last representative is sent to investigate a leak and finds the leak is due to a cause not covered by the Duro-Last warranty, you will (as with all manufacturers) be invoiced for the cost of the investigation by the contractor or Duro-Last.
•Even if a problem is reported to an authorized Duro-Last contractor, it must also be reported directly to Duro-Last as well.

Our records have proven that many damages are the result of individuals or companies performing maintenance or construction on a building during or after the installation of the Duro-Last roofing system. These persons are liable for any damages to your roofing system.

If emergency repairs are required, the building owner should take immediate action to prevent entry of water into the roofing system and building interior. The building owner must still notify Duro-Last of the repair no later than the next working day. Emergency repairs must be reasonably controlled in the judgment of Duro-Last Roofing, Inc. to have not significantly increased the scope of necessary permanent repairs.


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## 1985gt (Dec 10, 2010)

LCG said:


> I actually like the DuroLast system. It does have it's advantages. Believe me I installed it for several years. It wasn't untill I started seeing failures that we decided to go another direction. I think their 60mil is a justifiable system. I just feel it should be sold as it is. 40mil/13-15yrs, 50mil/17-20yrs, 60mil/20-22.5 yrs.
> 
> 
> To sum it up: I feel DuroLast is a GREAT, entry level, comercial roofing system for the residential roofing contractor who wants to offer smaller commercial jobs. It doesn't take $25,000.00 to go to work. A couple of triac's, 2 grip pulls, and a handfull of #3 bits is about all you need. It is a durable sheet that can be used for almost all flat applications. We installed it to all different types of buildings from restraunts to energy and mineral facilities. WITH NO FAILURES, YET! I would recommend DuroLast over ANY TPO or EPDM roof.
> ...


:laughing: I wouldn't install it on a dog house. I've seen durolast cracking at 8 years, I've seen the crappy looking installs. There is a reason why we have never offered their product, it plain sucks. To rate it better then EPDM is laughable, We've had TPO's last a lot longer and look a lot better. It's an inferior product, they have great sales rep's though but once you need something suddenly the phone calls don't get returned.


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## MAULEMALL (May 16, 2010)

1985gt said:


> :laughing: I wouldn't install it on a dog house. I've seen durolast cracking at 8 years, I've seen the crappy looking installs. There is a reason why we have never offered their product, it plain sucks. To rate it better then EPDM is laughable, We've had TPO's last a lot longer and look a lot better. It's an inferior product, they have great sales rep's though but once you need something suddenly the phone calls don't get returned.


any of them leak?


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## 1985gt (Dec 10, 2010)

The cracking durolast? Yes of course they were, we repaired them and then ultimately replace them DuroLast wouldn't respond to the building owners.


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## MAULEMALL (May 16, 2010)

1985gt said:


> The cracking durolast? Yes of course they were, we repaired them and then ultimately replace them DuroLast wouldn't respond to the building owners.


Any litigation?


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## 1985gt (Dec 10, 2010)

MAULEMALL said:


> Any litigation?


None that we were involved with. We are not a D/L contractor so we couldn't do warranty repairs if they would have returned the calls from the building owner. We merely temp patched it then later on installed a new roof. If there was action after that we are unaware or involved in.


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## LCG (May 30, 2011)

1985gt said:


> :laughing: I wouldn't install it on a dog house. I've seen durolast cracking at 8 years, I've seen the crappy looking installs. There is a reason why we have never offered their product, it plain sucks. To rate it better then EPDM is laughable, We've had TPO's last a lot longer and look a lot better. It's an inferior product, they have great sales rep's though but once you need something suddenly the phone calls don't get returned.


The issue with EPDM and TPO is this.

Most morons who install them are NOT certified. They buy it over the counter and their crap fails within 4 years. 90% of the EPDM failures we repair are less than 5yrs old. FACT.

To the best of my knowledge "and I haven't been keeping tabs" Duro cannot be purchased over the counter.

I too have seen some absolutely horrible Duro installs. To be honest most of the Duro installs in our area are absolutely horrendous. I actually have pictures on my phone that I show to customers when i'm bidding against this guy. Easy money.

As far as the sales rep goes. Never had a good one for duro. Their Technical department IS above and beyond. They do provide a quality service. Just a poor sheet.

I think most of the failures are due to the installers pulling too hard on the sheet. We always installed them fairly loose. I have seen other crews pulling till' they are blue in the face thus drastically reducing the mil of the sheet. Also the packaging is not exactly desirable. In the cold months it is absoutely impossible to work with!

So GT let me ask you this. 

You have a 30X30 building. Basic plumbing protrusions with moderate ponding issues. 

You have to choose between "Johnny has a ladder and a bucket not certified in anything roofing company installing a 60 mil MA EPDM that he is going to buy over the counter.

or

A rookie "Certified Durolast" installer installing a 30'X30' factory welded sheet with a tech rep onsite?

The fact is not all things are created equal.

Would I prefer you installing an EPDM roof or me installing a Duro roof? I would take you installing an EPDM. You have the experience to install it correctly, as do I. 

Hence the reason I stated that Durolast is a great "entry level" single ply. I can guarantee the Duro roofs we installed will last a very long time. Because they were installed correctly by a roofer who addresses water ponding and doesn't pull the living hell out of the sheet.

You know i'm an IB guy anyway. And yes, I will take IB over ANY other roofing system with the exception of Fibertite. Including your precious EPDM!

As a small peace offering, I will take the EPDM over ANY TPO.:laughing:

I said small offering. I'm not going to buy you lobster!


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## 1985gt (Dec 10, 2010)

LCG said:


> You know i'm an IB guy anyway. And yes, I will take IB over ANY other roofing system with the exception of Fibertite. Including your precious EPDM!
> 
> As a small peace offering, I will take the EPDM over ANY TPO.:laughing:
> 
> I said small offering. I'm not going to buy you lobster!



I will agree to your points. There are bad roofers everywhere, and some times being "factory certified" isn't worth the paper it's written on.

I will admit we do not have much experience with PVC. PVC has a very small market share here and if a PVC is spec'd its generally a sarnafil spec. In our are it's just not around a side from the Targets and such that spec PVC (sarnafil) and the Durolast roofs that the fly by nighters install around here. I say fly by nighters because no one here does durolast except one company and you do not want to see their handy work. I've heard great things about IB's and Fibertites sheets. But I can't recall ever seeing one. 

It's ok I'll settle for a Steak! Medium please.


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