# Tired of my trade. Don't think i want to do it anymore



## BradingCon (Dec 17, 2010)

I think a lot of people on here can relate to this story...including me. I felt I was in a rut for a month or two. Then, I decided to stop taking any old project i could get and decided what projects I WANTED do. Then, I went out looking for them.

Right now I am in the middle of a 2 month remodel that is the perfect job (great money, great customer, challenging work). This large challenging project changed my whole mood. I want to go to work every day and I look forward to every part of it. Now I am thinking about how to keep getting projects like this and it has renewed my passion for business.


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## maleko (Jun 6, 2007)

Hey thanks again for all the replies..

First Beer was good.. Just had a few to chill a bit. Not gonna drink myself to a stupor :whistling

I agree its would be very difficult for me at least to go work for someone after being self employed so long.
Ya hiring someone ids def out of the picture.

Now wanting to try something different is what i was thinking. Always wanted to go to school to learn to weld, Welding and fab work is a high interest to me. is there work for that , I have no clue.

I also agree with who wrote about the whole DIY thing. It is a big response i get from new customers. Like " why is the price so high i saw them do a bath on DIY network and it doesn't look that in tailed " Ok so why did you call me?

The amount of time i put into estimates driving back and forth to meet with the same people just to try to make a paycheck drives me nuts.Ya its all part of the job but , adds up after awhile.

They just don't seem to care if hose a and hose b don't have insurance, But why are you so much higher than them they ask.? WTF really, do i need to explain that?
Again i love being my own boss, and i know it would be extremely tough for me to have a boss again , Im stuck in my own ways of doing things.

But hey, i might have to bite the bullet and work for someone. maybe one step back will lead to two steps forward?


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## maleko (Jun 6, 2007)

BradingCon said:


> I think a lot of people on here can relate to this story...including me. I felt I was in a rut for a month or two. Then, I decided to stop taking any old project i could get and decided what projects I WANTED do. Then, I went out looking for them.
> 
> Right now I am in the middle of a 2 month remodel that is the perfect job (great money, great customer, challenging work). This large challenging project changed my whole mood. I want to go to work every day and I look forward to every part of it. Now I am thinking about how to keep getting projects like this and it has renewed my passion for business.


Agree.. I love big jobs like that. I also look forward to going back to the same kit like that. Everything is set up ,so nice working like that.
But there is all this small jobs That you have to take every freakin tool out of the truck to do the smallest job. Uggg Drives me nutty.


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## Spaint90 (Dec 26, 2011)

Gary H said:


> My grand plan was to live on the beach and surf all day. Maybe do some Point Break stuff to keep life interesting.


that is my grand plan now..i left the lovely state of Connecticunt. moved to so cal. built a bed into my van, brought all of my tools/ladders with me. i couldnt surf in CT, plus place was full of insurance pukes and lawyers. sure the money was good but i was f^king miserable.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

I don't know where you guys meet potential customers but I sill have never heard anyone bring anything about a DIY show and how much they said it cost. Maybe it's because thy never show roofing or siding stuff.


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

Spaint90 said:


> that is my grand plan now..i left the lovely state of Connecticunt. moved to so cal. built a bed into my van, brought all of my tools/ladders with me. i couldnt surf in CT, /QUOTE]
> 
> You lucky bast**d:thumbup:You are one of the lucky ones to escape.:clap:


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## Bill Z (Dec 10, 2006)

Maleko, so are you in your early 40's?


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

BamBamm5144 said:


> I don't know where you guys meet potential customers but I sill have never heard anyone bring anything about a DIY show and how much they said it cost. Maybe it's because thy never show roofing or siding stuff.


We are so poor that none of my customers can afford cable.:laughing: So I am free to of somebody saying I saw it on tv.:thumbup:


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Spaint90 said:


> that is my grand plan now..i left the lovely state of Connecticunt. moved to so cal. built a bed into my van, brought all of my tools/ladders with me. i couldnt surf in CT, plus place was full of insurance pukes and lawyers. sure the money was good but i was f^king miserable.


So do you park in the same place every night or is it like a nomadic thing. How long ago did you move? Have you found steady work?


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

Bill Z said:


> Maleko, so are you in your early 40's?


Anybody over the age of 41 is old.:wheelchair:


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> So do you park in the same place every night or is it like a nomadic thing. How long ago did you move? Have you found steady work?


Road trip to CA.:thumbsup:


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Gary H said:


> Anybody over the age of 41 is old.:wheelchair:


Wow, at least I am still ok..


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## davitk (Oct 3, 2008)

Here's a comment from someone who just crossed that bridge...

Similar story as yours, in business 16 years. Main difference is a wife and three kids who eat. And eat. And eat.

I had a job pulled out from under me in January by a designer, which left a big hole in my finances and winter schedule. So I took a job with a K&B company, and a week later was offered a job at the local schools (two blocks away) doing second shift maintenance. Scratched my head for awhile and concluded that in ten years I didn't want to be doing carpentry or contracting, swallowed my pride and took the job with the school. Now I (can :whistling) take on side jobs for cash, and will likely go back to school and better myself. Or just get fat eating bon bons and watching soaps. :laughing:

Seems to me the bigger home improvement companies who can afford salesmen and office personnel to navigate the red tape (thanks EPA), and the Craigslist contractors are the future of this business.


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## maleko (Jun 6, 2007)

Bill Z said:


> Maleko, so are you in your early 40's?


Not yet..:no:

38


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

maleko said:


> Not yet..:no:
> 
> 38


Life gets better after 40.:thumbsup:


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Gary H said:


> Road trip to CA.:thumbsup:


Im down, ill pick you up. The problem is when I get there Ill end up remodeling homes again because its what I know how to do.


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

remodel during the day, and party and surf at night.:thumbsup: We got to pick up DWB to.:thumbup:


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

Coming up to the end of my 30th year and I can say that I have been in your shoes at least twice. When you're looking for the answer you won't know where to look or even how to precisely identify the question. However, you keep looking and eventually you'll find it. Chances are that someday you'll realize that you found it awhile back.

Most recently we decided to rein in our offerings and specialize more. For years my goal was to take care of my clients homes, and that was good to get me some nice repeat business. Some have been on my customer list for over 20 years. But it can get old if you don't change things up now and again.

Just before the recession hit we decided to put all of our marketing into K&B work and my new interest, concrete counter tops. We still do nearly anything an established client would ask, but we only try to sell newbies on K&B. I firmly believe that that switch helped us weather the financial storm better. 

Take a look at Tinner. Plenty of roofers out there, but he specializes and stays booked up. When you are in demand it is much easier to keep your interest in the game.

Single with no kids and no ties to your area, run to another area and check it out. Go to where there is more work.

Or change careers and/or work for someone else. Either one, don't wait if you're serious. Too late comes too soon. At my age the only ones that would hire me are assholes. How could I possibly work for them? :>)

Enjoy the beer and don't make any decisions 'till morning.

Good Luck
Dave


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## TheItalian204 (Jun 1, 2011)

Gary H said:


> Anybody over the age of 41 is old.:wheelchair:


ahahah this reminds me a joke I saw when I was still in Italy. They had arguement about mandatory draft...some old dude was on tv with interviewer shouting that mandatory draft is necessary to protect the motherland and everybody 16 to 70 should sign up and serve if they havent served.

He went off about that for good forty minutes before saying: Well,me personally, I am 71... :laughing:


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Gary H said:


> remodel during the day, and party and surf at night.:thumbsup: We got to pick up DWB to.:thumbup:


You'll need a large boat for that.


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

Thats a good one.:thumbup:


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## knucklehead (Mar 2, 2009)

What else are you gonna do?


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

**** star, what else?


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## TheItalian204 (Jun 1, 2011)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> You'll need a large boat for that.


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## rex (Jul 2, 2007)

smoke weed.


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## CrpntrFrk (Oct 25, 2008)

Gary H said:


> **** star, what else?


There are lots of guys on CT with big heads but the wrong one for that industry.:laughing:


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## Seven-Delta-FortyOne (Mar 5, 2011)

I'm sorry to here about how bad it is. If you are truly tired of it, though, I think you probably should find something else to do. If you dislike it that much, it will inevitably show at some point.

Personally, I would never do anything different, even if it cost _me _money.

If I was in your shoes, with no family commitments, no reason to be any particular place more than another, I would get the fu(k out. Go anywhere. Egypt. Spain. Peru. Anywhere. Anything. Go work as a contract killer in Morocco. You only live twice.


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## Spaint90 (Dec 26, 2011)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> So do you park in the same place every night or is it like a nomadic thing. How long ago did you move? Have you found steady work?


I just moved 3 weeks ago..it was a nomadic thing on the way across the country. i would find motels, park in the lot and crash. got free wifi that way:thumbup: 

Ive been in san diego for the past 5 days, havnet really tried to find work yet. but ive been checking out the areas seeing where i might have a good chance at setting something up. crashing at my buddies place.


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## Spaint90 (Dec 26, 2011)

Gary H said:


> Spaint90 said:
> 
> 
> > You lucky bast**d:thumbup:You are one of the lucky ones to escape.:clap:
> ...


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Spaint90 said:


> I just moved 3 weeks ago..it was a nomadic thing on the way across the country. i would find motels, park in the lot and crash. got free wifi that way:thumbup:
> 
> Ive been in san diego for the past 5 days, havnet really tried to find work yet. but ive been checking out the areas seeing where i might have a good chance at setting something up. crashing at my buddies place.


Was it a bad divorce or job from hel! that pushed you over the edge.


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

I used to road trip back in my early 20's. I really do miss it. Maybe my path was to just wander and hang out. I have a hard time just living in one place too long.


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## Spaint90 (Dec 26, 2011)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> Was it a bad divorce or job from hel! that pushed you over the edge.


neither..not married, for the most part i was able to pick and choose clients. only had a couple that really floored me to the edge. I just wanted to surf, and i had always thought connecticut sucked. Always wanted to check out CA, woke up one morning and was like f#ck it man. Loaded everything up, gave my work to some buddies.


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## knucklehead (Mar 2, 2009)

Spaint90 said:


> Gary H said:
> 
> 
> > yeah..i figured before something happens like waking up with a phone call " im pregnant" i would peace out to somewhere nice. still considering a visectomy
> ...


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

I am going to hike the appalation trail as soon as I teach someone to do my job. That should make me love my home..


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Spaint90 said:


> neither..not married, for the most part i was able to pick and choose clients. only had a couple that really floored me to the edge. I just wanted to surf, and i had always thought connecticut sucked. Always wanted to check out CA, woke up one morning and was like f#ck it man. Loaded everything up, gave my work to some buddies.


What part of ct?


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

Thats a classic move.:thumbsup: I envy you for doing it. I was on my way in 1998 to vist CA,:thumbup: and meet my now ex-wife.  I was so close to freedom.


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

I walked the trail in the early 90's. Didnt finish it and has always been my goal. You meet some great people walking it.


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## Spaint90 (Dec 26, 2011)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> What part of ct?


Farmington Valley, i had it pretty good.

Gary- its never too late. just surfed this morning with a guy in his 50's who ditched his biz and moved out here.


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

Spaint90 said:


> Farmington Valley, i had it pretty good.
> 
> Gary- its never too late. just surfed this morning with a guy in his 50's who ditched his biz and moved out here.


I'm close to it. My youngest son is 11 and when gets a few years older, both my sons and I are going to split to CA.:thumbup: I cant leave now as much as I would love to, I think my kids would grow fuc*ked up without me around. So I hoard my cash and plan for the day when jesse says lets get the fing out of here.:clap:


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## Spaint90 (Dec 26, 2011)

Gary H said:


> I'm close to it. My youngest son is 11 and when gets a few years older, both my sons and I are going to split to CA.:thumbup: I cant leave now as much as I would love to, I think my kids would grow fuc*ked up without me around. So I hoard my cash and plan for the day when jesse says lets get the fing out of here.:clap:


I respect that. Ever since the time i was around 10 all i wanted to do was be by the beach and surf. I really wish my parents moved out here..i was a beached fish being deprived of my natural environment in CT. If i ever have kids(scary thought in my early twenties) im going to do it so they can grow up by the beach with good waves.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Dmitry said:


> I'll tell you how they would react and how they do react- not good for their morale at all.
> 
> I was taught to lead by example and if you basically saying that it's good to be in the trade cause I get to sit in the office, chit chat on CT or play Xbox it's not a good example.
> 
> It's funny that so many times we heard here how it sucks to sit in a cubicle and how everybody fells a pity for pencil pushers and it turns out the same guys spend most of their working time in the office)))


People have different ideas of ownership. I know a guy who is really just an employee of his own company. As I've stated before, I prefer being a business man first and a contractor second. I'm here to make money and to have employees do it for. I enjoy not having to do the physical work unless I want to. I enjoy having guys do that for me and for themselves.

Unlike the majority of contractor companies around here, I am trying to build a company that will have some sort of re-sale value. I want to build one that is self sustaining.

My first year in business (only 2010) I worked on all the jobs, did the selling, etc. it was me and two guys. I have already eclipsed my first years sales by over 35k this first quarter. I believe this is mainly due to me not being involved in the production work but rather being involved in what it takes to get the work.

Moral is great when guys know they have a steady workload ahead of them and know paychecks clear. I also pay employees more than the average and don't expect them to kill themselves. Employees understand someone needs to sell the work.

Start thinking big picture. I hope I never have to physically work again if I don't have to. I had to have two reconstructive surgeries on my swinging hammer wrist and it's painful everyday.


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## katoman (Apr 26, 2009)

BamBamm5144 said:


> I had to have two reconstructive surgeries on my swinging hammer wrist and it's painful everyday.


Bam, do you take anything for the constant ache? I take Advil, but it's not good to be taking that every day. 

Wondering what others do. Just suck it up? And no dope.

What I realy need is a hot tub. :thumbup:


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## Brutus (May 29, 2007)

katoman said:


> What I realy need is a hot tub. :thumbup:


and some hunnies?! :laughing:

My aches and pains go away fairly quickly after work. Dr. Brutus prescribes a beer or two a day. :thumbsup:


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## TheItalian204 (Jun 1, 2011)

katoman said:


> Bam, do you take anything for the constant ache? I take Advil, but it's not good to be taking that every day.
> 
> Wondering what others do. Just suck it up? And no dope.
> 
> What I realy need is a hot tub. :thumbup:


Voltaren hands down is so good from any type of wrist pains.

Aleve does the trick...I also get T3 from my migraines so I guess I am stocked up...Also if I am in a lot of pain ice-bath the wrist in the bucket for some time, then hot shower...cold-hot works great.

Have same issue and only one surgery(tore tendon) in my right hand.


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## TheItalian204 (Jun 1, 2011)

Brutus said:


> and some hunnies?! :laughing:
> 
> My aches and pains go away fairly quickly after work. Dr. Brutus prescribes a beer or two a day. :thumbsup:


thats right...a beer a day keeps docs away.


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## Dmitry (Aug 23, 2010)

And you guys wonder why younger generation is not buying that happy construction career story.

May be you should not say things like: I don't want to do physical work or my part of the job takes only 20 hours the rest of the time I **** around on the web.


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## katoman (Apr 26, 2009)

I usually just suck it up though. Today I was doing tile work and painting. Too much time on my knees. Even with knee pads, I couldn't wait for the end of the day.

Came home, did the chores and had a nice hot long shower. My knees still ache.

Getting old sucks.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

Dmitry said:


> I'll tell you how they would react and how they do react- not good for their morale at all.


You must be accustomed to young crew members. Grownups don't much care what the boss does with his time (as long as he doesn't show up on site to micromanage). As long as he keeps selling jobs and providing work, it's nobody's business what he does besides that--excluding moral turpitude.


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

The world needs ditch diggers too Danny. We can't all be bosses, field workers, salesmen, etc. Not everyone owns their own business because they can't/don't want the stress. Some people will always be employees and are happy doing that. For those of us who choose to get work for others, it's stress come with rewards...usually. If you don't like the stress it's time to be an employee again. Just remember if you are an employee again, that you can relate to the stress your boss is under.


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## katoman (Apr 26, 2009)

Most guys who have been self employed for any length of time are unemployable. :laughing:


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Dmitry said:


> And you guys wonder why younger generation is not buying that happy construction career story.
> 
> May be you should not say things like: I don't want to do physical work or my part of the job takes only 20 hours the rest of the time I **** around on the web.


I'm younger than you brother and only one employee is younger than me. My average employee age is 34. They're over crying about "how the boss has it made because they don't do anything" because they have learned the truth.

Kato, I try to suck it up. Sometimes I'll take half a painkiller but I try not to.


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## katoman (Apr 26, 2009)

Dmitry said:


> And you guys wonder why younger generation is not buying that happy construction career story.
> .


There will always be the guys who sign the front of the cheque and those that will always be signing the back.

The truth is that it is not the business that matters. It's the individual. Those who are construction business owners would be owners in another field.

Those who are construction workers would be workers in another field.

There's nothing wrong with this. The world does need both. But the workers who envy the owner have no clue to what it took to get there.


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## Spaint90 (Dec 26, 2011)

Dmitry said:


> And you guys wonder why younger generation is not buying that happy construction career story.
> 
> May be you should not say things like: I don't want to do physical work or my part of the job takes only 20 hours the rest of the time I **** around on the web.


Theres select guys in that younger generation that would disagree with you. Im in my early twenties, construction so far has been pretty good to me..alot better than my my buddies in their late twenties/ early thirties who work corporate. 

Most guys that are smart know what it took for the guy thats driving around all day doing bids to get there. The ones with half a brain dont..the reason its hard to find good employees is the lack of character. There are two different mindsets among "employees" and "owners"


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

jhark123 said:


> Dmitry,
> 
> I'm 28. I've got 2 boys, 8 and 6. My right knee has very little cartaledge (sp) left, My right shoulder is having some wierd problem for the past 18 months (I shouldn't be on the roof but I have to).
> 
> ...


 I would never of guessed you are 28. I mean that as a compliment.


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## Dmitry (Aug 23, 2010)

Spaint90 said:


> Theres select guys in that younger generation that would disagree with you. Im in my early twenties, construction so far has been pretty good to me..alot better than my my buddies in their late twenties/ early thirties who work corporate.
> 
> Most guys that are smart know what it took for the guy thats driving around all day doing bids to get there. The ones with half a brain dont..the reason its hard to find good employees is the lack of character. There are two different mindsets among "employees" and "owners"


Believe me there are a lot of guys with brains that realize no matter how hard they try the market and demand is not that high nowadays to accommodate all who want and can to price jobs and answer calls.
That's why the trades are predominantly maintained by a huge number of those who have no other choice-undocumented workers.

I don't know how it got here all of you guys just jumped on me but initially my point was---If you are the boss and demand from your employees good work ethic you can't brag how you can fudge around during working while your guys are making you money, it's just plain wrong attitude and it's gonna lead to disaster.
There is always something to do especially if you are the owner.

I've known a guy with a really good siding crew he trained them well and they could do everything without his presence, so on hot days he would go jet skiing on a lake, stay home on colder days. The guys were getting paid per sq ft but nevertheless they figured they could do the same without him and they still are doing it.

One of my former bosses got his business by stealing all of the contacts from the guy who would sit in the office all day to the point that the boss( a foreman) back than talked to customers, did take offs etc.

I bet there are a lot of stories like these.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Dmitry said:


> You spend the rest of the day in the office???


:no:

I think a lot of guys think that if you are not on the job your eating donuts and BSing. 

Most of my time is spent doing PM. Helps in that regard if they see you dig a hole for a sump pump or build a french drain , working late when they go home, and working weekends while they are off. I'm not quite to the 20 hr week stage and sometimes if you want **** work done you got to do it yourself. :laughing: Unfortunately, my time spent working can't always be doing trim.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Dmitry said:


> I'll tell you how they would react and how they do react- not good for their morale at all.
> 
> I was taught to lead by example and if you basically saying that it's good to be in the trade cause I get to sit in the office, chit chat on CT or play Xbox it's not a good example.
> 
> It's funny that so many times we heard here how it sucks to sit in a cubicle and how everybody fells a pity for pencil pushers and it turns out the same guys spend most of their working time in the office)))


 I agree personally, I didn't get into construction to be a desk jockey. I will always work, hopefully at one point only on stuff I want to do, but right now, and maybe always on whatever has to get done. 45+ a week that's PM ( scopes, schedules, ordering materials, delivering materials, staging jobs) another 20 or so in the field. Sometimes flipfopped, sometimes less, sometimes more. I want a construction company, means a lot of admin sometimes. 

But, I think its great for guys who want to be business guys first or only. Nothing wrong with it, never bothered me when I was working for others. I'm not the guy who is ever going to play video games or work 20 hrs a week, but love it for those who do and can. Bam seems to have a great operation going. Different strokes. Employees who feel that way are the same ones who resent their boss anyway, imo.


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## jhark123 (Aug 26, 2008)

jawtrs said:


> I would never of guessed you are 28. I mean that as a compliment.


Thank you, that means a lot coming from you. You are in the position I would like to be as a business man. I really appreciate the knowledge and experience of the guys on here, It's like having a father in the same business as me.

I said earlier that you would need to make 100k to equal 50-60k at a good company, so lets talk about obtaining that goal. I would be there if I worked, with a crew, 40 weeks out of the year (at my current rates). So, what methods have you all used to obtain that amount of work? I have been brainstorming the past few weeks on how to obtain more work in my current market:

1. Residential gutter cleaning with region wide marketing- $175 per home
2. A better web site
3. Bidding larger commercial/government jobs (I would need more capital to do this)
4. Commercial property maintenance accounts (pressure washing, seal coating, painting, etc)
5. Being patient with my current business model to grow referals, increase marketing (home shows, newspaper, etc) and wait for the economy to improve.

sorry for the thread hijack


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

jhark123 said:


> Thank you, that means a lot coming from you. You are in the position I would like to be as a business man. I really appreciate the knowledge and experience of the guys on here, It's like having a father in the same business as me.
> 
> I said earlier that you would need to make 100k to equal 50-60k at a good company, so lets talk about obtaining that goal. I would be there if I worked, with a crew, 40 weeks out of the year (at my current rates). So, what methods have you all used to obtain that amount of work? I have been brainstorming the past few weeks on how to obtain more work in my current market:
> 
> ...



Ill be 29 next week.

Networking my ass off has been the biggest thing, imo. I'm not nearly where I want to be business wise, and income wise. My dad is a superb builder/remodeler, but has never networked. The business is 6 years old. In the last year we've tripled our annual revenue, a lot which can be attributed to networking. Unfortunately, this could unravel at any time. Our plan is network, branding and brand definition, proffesional rates, and keeping overhead low while we remain versatile and hope the economy keeps going good for us here. The economy still sucks here, but we have been fortunate fir the most part.


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## davitk (Oct 3, 2008)

maleko said:


> Im just don't want to do this type of work anymore. Im ready for a change. What do i want to do? Have no freakin idea.
> I just know the feeling i have that i want to do something else.


Sometimes you just have to come to a dead stop to change direction, and there's nothing wrong with that. Clear your table, it'll fill up with something.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Dmitry said:


> I don't know how it got here all of you guys just jumped on me but initially my point was---If you are the boss and demand from your employees good work ethic you can't brag how you can fudge around during working while your guys are making you money, it's just plain wrong attitude and it's gonna lead to disaster.
> There is always something to do especially if you are the owner.
> .


So the owner isn't supposed to have any free time? Why do employees get to go home after 8 hours and do what they want and owners don't?

I bet none of my employees were in the office at 5:30 this morning scheduling this coming week. (I can tell you they won't because I was the only one in there)

There are also days where they get done at 4 and I don't get home until 8:30. I get you're thinking because it's how I used to think until starting my own gig.

The 4 days I spent on the job while having all calls forwarded to my salesman were the easiest 4 days I've had since starting up. When you look around at the successful companies (the ones with nice equipment, steady work, shops, secure financials) do you see the owner involved in the everyday production work? I know I don't here.

Now the above is not what some guys want but it's my plan so I know I can't be on a roof or siding job everyday and expect to have steady work. That's why so many guys don't make it.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

jawtrs said:


> Ill be 29 next week.
> 
> Networking my ass off has been the biggest thing, imo. I'm not nearly where I want to be business wise, and income wise. My dad is a superb builder/remodeler, but has never networked. The business is 6 years old. In the last year we've tripled our annual revenue, a lot which can be attributed to networking. Unfortunately, this could unravel at any time. Our plan is network, branding and brand definition, proffesional rates, and keeping overhead low while we remain versatile and hope the economy keeps going good for us here. The economy still sucks here, but we have been fortunate fir the most part.


Ill be 29 on the 20th. Thats right warner, 4/20. :laughing:


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> Ill be 29 on the 20th. Thats right warner, 4/20. :laughing:


It also surprises me that your 28.


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## Dmitry (Aug 23, 2010)

BamBamm5144 said:


> So the owner isn't supposed to have any free time? Why do employees get to go home after 8 hours and do what they want and owners don't?
> 
> I bet none of my employees were in the office at 5:30 this morning scheduling this coming week. (I can tell you they won't because I was the only one in there)
> 
> ...


I got my own gig. I demand from my guys good work ethic and that's exactly what I must practice myself as the business owner.

You bragged how you can slack while others are making you money because you are the owner and it's just plain inappropriate for an owner. Is it that hard to grasp?
Complaining much about work?Do you like getting paid better than any of your employees?


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Dmitry said:


> I got my own gig. I demand from my guys good work ethic and that's exactly what I must practice myself as the business owner.
> 
> You bragged how you can slack while others are making you money because you are the owner and it's just plain inappropriate for an owner. Is it that hard to grasp?
> Complaining much about work?Do you like getting paid better than any of your employees?



Your way off base bud. However you feel about your own business, any business owner can do whatever he can get away with.

I had a boss who NEVER worked more than four hours a day. EVER. He owned a trim company. Used to rub our noses in the fact he was golfing, or fishing, boating or just relaxing that afternoon. Many days he never came in. He was maybe 30, couldnt carpenter at all for all i know. He made a very good living, now he makes an even better living, has twice as many employees and charges higher rates. He does whatever he wants too. He has unbelievable contacts and is good at talking to HOs. Builders he works for love him. He is a typical Austinite, flipflops everyday. I have never liked the douche bag, but i liked that steady check and the rate he paid me, when i worked for him. I personally would never be like that even if i could, just not my style. 

I have never had a boss , other than my dad when i worked for him who was a hard worker. Boss meaning owner. I worked for a builder who never worked Fridays and took 3 week vacations all the time. He was the biggest influence on me other my dad, and he is a superb business man. None of his guys liked him, but i dont think he cared. He is wealthy now, still operates the same way, and has a great reputation.

My life long goal was to have my name on my pick up and be a builder, now thats a reality. I love being a builder, and i wake up every day and tell myself if you want to keep it, its going to take work. I personally want the respect of my guys, and expect to have to earn it, just as they have to earn mine. Doesnt mean i have to be that way though.

If an employee has issues with his boss not being a worker, let him start his own thing. Most guys who ***** and whine are just that though, bitchs and whiners. Always someone elses fault they dont have what they want.


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

it's really best to work piece work for someone who absolutely has no idea what what he's talking about:clap:


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## kevjob (Aug 14, 2006)

Holy employee mentality Batman:batman:

Dimitry just because you believe you have to outwork your employees for their respect, doesnt mean those of us who choose work on the business side of things are lazy and taking advantage of our employees.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

I am sitting here in the office right now, being a ***** and playing around on the internet while my truck is hooked to my dump trailer , waiting to be filled with more pea gravel to finish that big azz french drain. Any of my other bosses would wait until Monday and have a hand do it. I scheduled it to be done this week, so i will finish it today. Maybe im dumb, but i not so secretly hold most, not all, of my previous bosses in contempt. But i GURANTEE none of those guys are doing a french drain today. All depends on what YOU want. Its your business. 

The thought that i could un hook my pick up and go take the weekend off , or all next week if i want, is awesome to me. I may not do it, but the thought that i could is nice, and part of the reason i do this. The other being that remodeling and building homes and boat docks is all i know how to do, and all i have ever enjoyed.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

kevjob said:


> Holy employee mentality Batman:batman:


 Now i get it


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## kevjob (Aug 14, 2006)

jawtrs said:


> I dont get it


not directed at you. :thumbup:


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## Dmitry (Aug 23, 2010)

kevjob said:


> Holy employee mentality Batman:batman:
> 
> Dimitry just because you believe you have to outwork your employees for their respect, doesnt mean those of us who choose work on the business side of things are lazy and taking advantage of our employees.


It's not what I implied I believe you just have to have right attitude ,reasons and influence on your company atmosphere. That's why I pointed out its not good to SAY things like: ...I'll try not to do any physical work unless I really have to or ...my job takes only 20 hours the rest of the time I spend on the golf course while my guys are making me money.

I personally don't have three framing crews I have to manage and give work to we are small operation unit, otherwise I would be cruising between jobs all day long.
But there is noo waay I would ever give an idea to my guys that while they were working hard to complete a project I was taking a nap because I am the BOSS here and I CAN!!!


I really hope you get my point.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Dmitry said:


> I got my own gig. I demand from my guys good work ethic and that's exactly what I must practice myself as the business owner.
> 
> You bragged how you can slack while others are making you money because you are the owner and it's just plain inappropriate for an owner. Is it that hard to grasp?
> Complaining much about work?Do you like getting paid better than any of your employees?



I don't remember making any posts where I "bragged" that I can slack while others are making me money. I remember saying I spent a few minutes on CT in between appointments and it got you all upset that me, as the owner, actually has a half hour between appointments of time to kill. In your mind, I should've rushed over to the job, put on my tool belt for 15 minutes and then left for the next appointment.

I also don't remember a single complaint about work. It is the path I choose and so far it has treated me nicely. You are the one saying that an owner who isn't on the job every day has no respect of his employees. I know that my employees respect what I do. I also know that my job is much more difficult mentally and emotionally than the employees and that if I get a free hour during the day, I can do whatever I want. I've been in the office for the past 4 hours and am taking a little break because my head hurts from the numbers, should I not respect my employees because I know they are all not working?

As far as pay, I would hope that I get paid more than them so yes, of course I like it. That is the risk I decided to take. My question to you is do you pay yourself as an employee when working on the job or do you consider your wage to be part of the profit of the job?

Here is my take on things. The guys have a solid 5 weeks worth of work lined up when the average job takes at absolute most three days. A lot of this work is contributed to the HomeShow I worked for 50 hours over a 4 day period (including set up and take down) while my guys were doing who knows what. I did my part of the job and continue to do so. Now, their part of the job is to get the work done. It is a mutual respect. They respect having steady work and I respect their work ethics and how they get it done. :clap:


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

a 2 o'clock nap is just what the dr. ordered:clap:


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Dmitry said:


> It's not what I implied I believe you just have to have right attitude ,reasons and influence on your company atmosphere. That's why I pointed out its not good to SAY things like: ...I'll try not to do any physical work unless I really have to or ...my job takes only 20 hours the rest of the time I spend on the golf course while my guys are making me money.
> 
> I personally don't have three framing crews I have to manage and give work to we are small operation unit, otherwise I would be cruising between jobs all day long.
> But there is noo waay I would ever give an idea to my guys that while they were working hard to complete a project I was taking a nap because I am the BOSS here and I CAN!!!
> ...


 I get it, just saying everyone does things different. My old man hasn't done physical work in a long time, he does the business side full time, and works hard at it. I'm sure ill be there eventually, like it or not.


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## Dmitry (Aug 23, 2010)

Bambam,

I don't know how we got to such a heated argument))) may be some misunderstanding on my/your side.

I don't want to fight, just constructive dialogue)


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

Dmitry said:


> Bambam,
> 
> I don't know how we got to such a heated argument))) may be some misunderstanding on my/your side.
> 
> I don't want to fight, just constructive dialogue)


I am not heated. Everyone has different views of business. A lot of guys here don't agree with what I consider a business to be and I don't agree with some guys here. That's how it goes. That's why I come here so frequently. I like hearing and opening up to different points of views on things. I always like to learn and if I think something can apply to make myself and/or the company better, I implement it.


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## BC Carpenter (Dec 28, 2010)

katoman said:


> Bam, do you take anything for the constant ache? I take Advil, but it's not good to be taking that every day.
> 
> Wondering what others do. Just suck it up? And no dope.
> 
> What I realy need is a hot tub. :thumbup:




Be careful with that-I was injured in a car accident a few years ago-For a year strait afterwords, I would pop an advil every day. Even recently when the pain would come back, I would take an advil.

After developing an stomach ulcer-I do mostly stretches, no more pills. I'm 30 and really can't see myself popping pills for the next 20-30 years..


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## Seven-Delta-FortyOne (Mar 5, 2011)

And advil will wreck your liver worse than drinking. :drink:


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

i wanna fight:boxing:


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## Seven-Delta-FortyOne (Mar 5, 2011)

Not me. :no: I'm stayin' out of this one. I think Jaw, Dmitry, and even BamBam, :laughing: all have good points, and in some ways, all of them are right.


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## TheItalian204 (Jun 1, 2011)

katoman said:


> Cabinet Maker. I always wanted to be a carpenter, and I love it still.
> 
> I do basic cabinet making, but I'm not a trained cabinet maker. I can't carve lions feet, lay up veneers, etc.
> 
> ...


Kato you are not an idiot...money cant buy happiness and it definetly cant buy health.


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## katoman (Apr 26, 2009)

TheItalian204 said:


> Kato you are not an idiot...money cant buy happiness and it definetly cant buy health.


Ya, I know. Just joking. I decided at a young age that life was short, so I wanted to spend it doing what I love. Money or not.

I didn't want to end up old and looking back on my life, asking "what did I do with it" and have regrets. 

No regrets :thumbsup: I'll keep doing it till I'm in the ground.



Police officer eh ? Now there's a scary thought :laughing:


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## TheItalian204 (Jun 1, 2011)

katoman said:


> Ya, I know. Just joking. I decided at a young age that life was short, so I wanted to spend it doing what I love. Money or not.
> 
> I didn't want to end up old and looking back on my life, asking "what did I do with it" and have regrets.
> 
> ...


 
I never wanted to be RCMP officer...always wanted to be US Marshall or Texas Ranger(thats if I was in USA).

But realistically just wanted to be Winnipeg police officer to help people. Actually help.


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

Dmitry said:


> ))) I remember when growing up in the country I didn't have anything even close to what kids have nowadays, we would go swimming in the river that was close by or go to the forest, play soccer, hockey all day long on the frozen pond etc. and we were pretty happy.
> 
> These days kids ruin their eye sight and get obese by sitting for hours by the play station, as we see even grown ups do the same.
> I think a six pack and a video game for a few hours a day can make a miserable looser out if a good person.
> Just my 0.2


don't make my post any less valid:whistling


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

Those dang video games have made me totally fat. I think they caused me to go from 142 pounds to 147 pounds over the winter.:laughing:

I don't think I have used it for anything other then watching blu-rays in that last couple months.


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## jhark123 (Aug 26, 2008)

katoman said:


> Cabinet Maker. I always wanted to be a carpenter, and I love it still.
> 
> I do basic cabinet making, but I'm not a trained cabinet maker. I can't carve lions feet, lay up veneers, etc.
> 
> ...


I guess we are both idiots


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

i knew it!:blink:


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## BC Carpenter (Dec 28, 2010)

Personally i always wanted to be in the coast guard growing up...However until recently there didn't seem to be any funding in it (up here anyways) If I had a second choice that would be it.. no regrets though.


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## Spaint90 (Dec 26, 2011)

Dmitry said:


> It's funny how you older guys have and play video games.
> I personally treat video games as one of the worst kinds of time consuming useless addictions. I used to play Counter Strike and other games when I was in high school. But pretty soon realized its no good, I even threw out an x box that I got from my buddies in my BDay.
> My policy is no video games in my house.


Dmitry, i feel bad for your kids if you have any. I played CS 1.6 in high school..started an ebay business with one of the guys i played with. bought my truck straight out with it when i was 16. I currently do not have a place to live at(short term, in the process of moving) but when i do im setting my 360 back up. MW3 ftw. halo2 used to be the chit, not as crazy about 3. Just part of todays youth in society. i have a younger brother that is 12 years younger than me..kid knows so much about tech from video gaming. its not all bad


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

My 9 year old has prestiged 4 times.


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## JesseCocozza (Aug 20, 2011)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> My 9 year old has prestiged 4 times.


He's probably that little kid telling me how stupid I am, and that I'm probably still living in my mother's basement as he's spawn killing me relentlessly.


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## Scribbles (Mar 10, 2009)

Mon, Tues, Wends I love my job, Thursday I need achy, Friday I want to quit. Sat I am happy cuz I have my shop to myself, Mon I am exited about the new week again.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

JesseCocozza said:


> He's probably that little kid telling me how stupid I am, and that I'm probably still living in my mother's basement as he's spawn killing me relentlessly.


Maybe. He is much better than I am. I play with a group of cops from my town. Those guys are hilarious. Its funny how bad of shots most of them are. They are much better poker players though, go figure.


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## JesseCocozza (Aug 20, 2011)

Speaking of hating technology, anyone watching that new show on A&E called Duck Dynasty? If I wasn't doing what I do now for a living, I think I would love to be one of their family members. They're absolutely hysterical.


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## Spaint90 (Dec 26, 2011)

JesseCocozza said:


> He's probably that little kid telling me how stupid I am, and that I'm probably still living in my mother's basement as he's spawn killing me relentlessly.


haha, i love it when you kill them after that thou. its enjoying hearing that "phuck you". i was playing with my buddies one day, we had this kid that wouldnt lay off the mic. kepts spawn killing with his friking sniper. we all ganged up on him the rest of the match. im pretty sure i heard tears. priceless


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## Dmitry (Aug 23, 2010)

Spaint90 said:


> Dmitry, i feel bad for your kids if you have any. I played CS 1.6 in high school..started an ebay business with one of the guys i played with. bought my truck straight out with it when i was 16. I currently do not have a place to live at(short term, in the process of moving) but when i do im setting my 360 back up. MW3 ftw. halo2 used to be the chit, not as crazy about 3. Just part of todays youth in society. i have a younger brother that is 12 years younger than me..kid knows so much about tech from video gaming. its not all bad


Believe it I not, I was one of the few first 3-4 computer owners in the little town in rural Russia when I was in high school.
Amongst my friends were guys who would write their first programs when they still were in 10th grade. So I am all for technology.

As for the xboxes and PS3 how are they gonna make you more advanced in computers? How are you gonna write a program on Xbox?With a joystick?Can you type an essay or learn how to work with Word or Excell?

The difference stroke me when I got here that most of the guys use either Xbox or ps for video games while we back home used PC.

So don't feel bad. The most kids use their brain with Xbox is when hooking it up to TV.


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## katoman (Apr 26, 2009)

Here's the problem - I have a nephew who litteraly played war games on his computer all night for about 8 years. Wouldn't go to school, never graduated high school. 

His parents couldn't change it. (or were unwilling to). At any rate, he is now 24, unemployable (has never had a job), no high school diploma, and lazy as anything.

Just sayin'........... watch your kids don't go down that road.


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## jhark123 (Aug 26, 2008)

katoman said:


> Here's the problem - I have a nephew who litteraly played war games on his computer all night for about 8 years. Wouldn't go to school, never graduated high school.
> 
> His parents couldn't change it. (or were unwilling to). At any rate, he is now 24, unemployable (has never had a job), no high school diploma, and lazy as anything.
> 
> Just sayin'........... watch your kids don't go down that road.


Wow, that's just depressing. With you as an uncle, he could be a journeyman carpenter by now if he had any sense.


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## JesseCocozza (Aug 20, 2011)

katoman said:


> Here's the problem - I have a nephew who litteraly played war games on his computer all night for about 8 years. Wouldn't go to school, never graduated high school.
> 
> His parents couldn't change it. (or were unwilling to). At any rate, he is now 24, unemployable (has never had a job), no high school diploma, and lazy as anything.
> 
> Just sayin'........... watch your kids don't go down that road.


As much as I enjoy getting time to play every now and then... My kids (3-1/2 & 1-1/2) don't even get to watch TV for more than 30-60 mins a day. They might get to watch one tv show a day and two if they're lucky. Trust me. It's a luxury that can be taken away quicker than a flash of lightning. I'm all for allowing certain things, but there are issues like this, that should have been addressed long before the kid had access to a computer for 8 hours a night. Tough love isn't just being a jerk to your kids.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

i don't play video games. i don't even / never have even owned a gaming console. I don't mind. I occasionally play at friends houses but not over the top. I don't get why everyone is so into these war games....
I do play some computer games though. some driving and snowboarding ones. but not for hours on end.
Instead of playing video games i come here... not sure whats a bigger waste of time :laughing::laughing:


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## katoman (Apr 26, 2009)

jhark123 said:


> Wow, that's just depressing. With you as an uncle, he could be a journeyman carpenter by now if he had any sense.


What's truly sad about it is that he is wasting his life. He's already wasted the best years. One day he's going to wake up and regret it.

Maybe, maybe not. I hired him on when he was about 18. That lasted 3 days. It was too hard for him. 

It's the old "you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink".

Truely sad. What a waste. 

If he had been my son, I would have literally thrown the computer out and told him if he wants to eat you're coming to work. 

So many of the young have no work ethic. 

Guys like Framing Pro give me hope though. Don't let that go to your head Nick. :laughing:


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## JesseCocozza (Aug 20, 2011)

katoman said:


> What's truly sad about it is that he is wasting his life. He's already wasted the best years. One day he's going to wake up and regret it.
> 
> Maybe, maybe not. I hired him on when he was about 18. That lasted 3 days. It was too hard for him.
> 
> ...


Don't get me wrong. Just because I like to play a video game here and there doesn't mean that I have no work ethic. I've worked with my pops since I can remember. I was expected to bring home nothing less than a B average. In school. Graduated with a 3.75gpa. While working two part time jobs. As soon as I had a job at 14 (other than working for pops) the only thing he didn't make me pay for was rent and dinner. If I needed or wanted anything else I worked for it. So not all hope is lost, kids just need to know the difference between a need and a want and learn how to work for the wants.


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## Seven-Delta-FortyOne (Mar 5, 2011)

katoman said:


> Video games ? I confess, I've never played. Not once. Who's got time for that ?
> 
> I'd rather spend that time with my dogs, or woodturning. I must be older than I think :laughing:


Yep. Me neither. Never played one. And I'm not nearly as old as you, Kato. :laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

Never played a viedo game. Girls were always more interesting to play with.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

I play video games. Maybe about a total of 3-5 hours a week. Reason being is that it is only one initial cost and its right at home.

It isn't harming anyone and for anyone to blame work ethics on video games is quite frankly out of their mind. I always had video games growing up, doesn't mean I don't have a work ethic. It is the parents that instill a work ethic, not having video games. I am sure I know a few people who have never played a video game and don't have any sort of work ethic.

And the best part, it is funny to get killed by little boys who sound like girls still.


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

Those damn video games cause all those kids to go shootin up their schools too, remember.....


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> Those damn video games cause all those kids to go shootin up their schools too, remember.....


Video games are the root of all problems. 

I actually think they teach eye hand coordination but that's coming from a roofer, not a scientist


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

I like play just dance 3 on my Wii with my 6 year old. I can kick her butt.


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## katoman (Apr 26, 2009)

A.T.C. said:


> Yep. Me neither. Never played one. And I'm not nearly as old as you, Kato. :laughing::laughing::laughing:


I'm not old, just getting well seasoned. :laughing:


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## dayexco (Mar 4, 2006)

ought to be my age, have my mentality on my "trade"...and ask that same question


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

FramingPro said:


> Instead of playing video games i come here... not sure whats a bigger waste of time :laughing::laughing:


I think you need a new screen name: NerdFramer. :laughing:



BamBamm5144 said:


> Video games are the root of all problems.
> 
> I actually think they teach eye hand coordination but that's coming from a roofer, not a scientist


The military has discovered that gamers make great pilots and robotics controllers. :thumbsup:


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

Tinstaafl said:


> I think you need a new screen name: NerdFramer. :laughing:
> 
> 
> 
> The military has discovered that gamers make great pilots and robotics controllers. :thumbsup:


yea well im a framingpro. so.. :laughing:


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## working chump (Mar 31, 2012)

Tinstaafl said:


> I think you need a new screen name: NerdFramer. :laughing:
> 
> 
> 
> The military has discovered that gamers make great pilots and robotics controllers. :thumbsup:


The military has also discovered that the next fighter jets are going to pilot themselves.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

I am sure that my oldest son could clean up some neighborhoods given the right equipment.


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## KennMacMoragh (Sep 16, 2008)

BamBamm5144 said:


> I play video games. Maybe about a total of 3-5 hours a week. Reason being is that it is only one initial cost and its right at home.
> 
> It isn't harming anyone and for anyone to blame work ethics on video games is quite frankly out of their mind. I always had video games growing up, doesn't mean I don't have a work ethic. It is the parents that instill a work ethic, not having video games. I am sure I know a few people who have never played a video game and don't have any sort of work ethic.
> 
> And the best part, it is funny to get killed by little boys who sound like girls still.


I like the mindless games where you blow stuff up, I don't get hooked on those so easy. It's the Facebook games that are getting addicting


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

My girlfriend gets hooked hard on those facebook games too. Naturally being lazy, she can go easily 10-12 hours a day playing them. Then after a couple o fweeks of that she wont play it again for monthes.


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## WilsonRMDL (Sep 4, 2007)

Naturally being lazy haha...nice


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## Gary H (Dec 10, 2008)

I really shouldn't say lazy. When she wants to work, she can really produce. This week i taught her how to mason tend and slick the joints. Every batch of mud was perfect and the joints were near perfect. But once she tires of it or learns what she wants to know, then she returns to lazy mode. She has the mind of a 13 yearold. I'm seroius when i say this. How she thinks and relates is much the same as a young girl. She can weld two pieces of pipe together and when painted, you can not tell where the joint is. But has no interest in doing it for a living. Would rather plant flowers in her garden and sun bath naked.

Which bring up another problem on the job. Will not wear anything more then a skimply two piece swim suit to the job. Very hard to stay focoused.


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## Tom M (Jan 3, 2007)

Sounds like a story without pics Gary


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Yep, I second the bs alarm..


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