# Stripping old deck finish



## joedonuts (Jun 1, 2006)

Hi, i am looking into bidding on a deck restaining job. The existing finish seems to be a solid stain and is quite weathered. I have to remove the existing finish and apply a semi transparent stain. I am not sure if the existing finish is an oil base or latex based finish here. Does anyone know of a good finish stripper for this job, any help would be appreciated, thank you.


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## AAPaint (Apr 18, 2005)

I swear I just answered this earlier today..... http://www.contractortalk.com/showthread.php?t=11334

I notice you say solid stain. You better test this to be sure because you might not get enough up depending on what it is to use a semi-trans on it....


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## joedonuts (Jun 1, 2006)

AAPaint said:


> I swear I just answered this earlier today..... http://www.contractortalk.com/showthread.php?t=11334
> 
> I notice you say solid stain. You better test this to be sure because you might not get enough up depending on what it is to use a semi-trans on it....



Hi AA, you did answer this earlier, i saw that. I checked out the website for the link you showed, the only thing i am concerned about is it seems this stripper is pretty caustic, it could damage aluminum siding ,etc. I was looking for something maybe not as powerful, but just as effective. Maybe there isn't anything like that for this job i guess. I am thinking of using Sherwin Williams stain and sealer remover. I have not used this product before. Have you had any experience with this product?


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## slickshift (Jun 14, 2005)

Solid to a semi-trans?
Another good candidate for re-decking


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## Jon F (Jul 15, 2006)

With respect, I am a wood refinisher. Specifically, all I do is restore log homes. But I got my start in college with a biz doing deck refinishing. I've read some of the posts on here about deck questions, what to do, etc. and I'd like to offer some advice.

Stated as positively, and constructively as possible, for the most part, you guys don't have a clue what you are talking about.

That is setting off the red-alert, but hear me out. There are guys out there that specialize in doing just decks, and do quite well. There is very little crossover into painting from wood refinishing. Except we shop together at the paint store. That being said, I read these paint thread, and have absolutely no idea what you guys are talking about......sand once, thin with naptha, wet and dry brush, etc. Too much for me.

My advice, on this and other decks, IS HOOK UP WITH A WOOD REFINISHING CONTRACTOR IN YOUR AREA, AND BOUNCE LEADS TOGETHER!! Original Poster, this job you are considering....this is a nightmare, I don't care who you are. You are going to lose your butt and have a miserable experience. This is a TOUGH job, for anyone. Wouldn't you rather paint some trim? Well, I'd like to tackle this deck, so let's trade!

Please don't take this as criticism, jeez, it surely is not. As I said, there is little common ground between wood restoration and painting, so create a network with someone in your area that can help you. Remember, a guy doing decks is capable of servicing many more customers than a painter, and should always have referrals to spare. I know I always did.

OriginalPoster--if you want a referral in your area, let me know, if you still want help, let me know.

JF


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## AAPaint (Apr 18, 2005)

Those are some mighty harsh words there fife. Wood care is not as complicated as you would like to make it sound, and you're not the only person in the world that understands it. Many paint contractors delve into wood care because, quite honestly, it is _simple_ in comparison to painting. 

With wood care you are dealing with a handful of chemicals, many of which painters already use, and a handful of popular species of wood. Stain application is another simple task. 

With painting we deal with staining both interior and exterior wood of many different species, oils, latexes, urethanes, epoxies, etc. with thousands of differnt formulations for all types of different substrates from not just wood, but all different types of metal, concrecte and stucco, block, brick, steel, you name it, we cover it. We know more about substrates, their proper preparation, and the right types of products from which there is a myriad to choose that fit the needs of the customer than a wood care contractor could care to understand. 
This poster here is talking about an unknown substance...there is no telling how hard that will be. No misinformation has been given. You'll note that in the other thread where two coats of latex are mentioned, the poster is given fair warning how difficult it may be, AND, we're actually discussing which is more _cost effective_ for the customer. In a case where two coats of latex are covering the entire deck, the amount of labor necessary to strip it all and apply anything other than a solid may actually turn out to be more than re-decking it. 

If you see mis-information, please correct. Don't just insult our intelligence by saying we "have no idea what [we're] talking about". There are many members on this site that are certified wood care contractors and have been doing this for a while. Next time, try to be more helpful rather than suggest we just hand all of our leads off to you.


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## slickshift (Jun 14, 2005)

....I'm still looking for the words naptha and wet brush
You in the same thread Fife?

I honestly don't know what _your_ talking about


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## Jon F (Jul 15, 2006)

AAPaint said:


> Those are some mighty harsh words there fife. Wood care is not as complicated as you would like to make it sound, and you're not the only person in the world that understands it. Many paint contractors delve into wood care because, quite honestly, it is _simple_ in comparison to painting.
> 
> Great....should have just bit my tongue. Didn't say it was complicated, said it was different than painting and not a lot of crossover. Nothing I said was harsh. This is just a forum, for crying out loud. I'm trying to offer help, while also benefiting two trades.
> 
> ...


....Your Flood and Thompson's Certifications recognized, I still suggest I was trying to be helpful. My advice is to hand off. Everyone doing wood restoration is trying their darnd'est to eliminate the corralation between WR and painting. Most actually consider WR a facet of PRESSURE WASHING, though WR folks are also trying to move from that. Would you help? 

Misinformation?? You are trying to get a guy to bid something that may not be possible. You are suggesting he use the completely wrong kind of strippers (but thanks, I helped formulate the stripper you recommended), you told a guy about a log home in a previous thread that "just do two coats, probably won't take three" when you had absolutely no idea what products he was talking about. The manufacturer suggests three, if not four. It's not even a stain that "takes" as you put it.

I thought I'd receive some support for referring jobs to fellow residental contractors but I can see that may not be the case, so it may be best not to try. Questioner: sorry if any of this was offensive to you, well actually I'm not, I'd rather offend you and keep you from losing money that fluff you into an endless job with an dissapointed customer. Good luck either way.


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## AAPaint (Apr 18, 2005)

You are reading 4 different threads as if they are one, obviously. I didn't suggest any product for the log home (go check), and with the right products 3 or 4 coats is overkill. No product was even mentioned....so that point is moot. What manufacturer recommends 3 or 4 coats, because none was EVEN mentioned??????

Again, on the latex thread. The only thing I said was a full strength stripper, I did not mention any particular product. (go ahead, check that too so we can be on the same page)

Your comments about painters in general prove you're nothing more than an a$$hole that thinks because he does wood care he is somehow superior to a painter. The type of stuff you speak of can just as easily be said for a hack in any trade. However, if you would take the time to actually read the posts and not get the threads all mixed up in your twisted little mind, you would see there are no hacks here, and that NO misinformation has been posted. 

You didn't think you'd receive some support from painters. You blatantly insulted my/our (painters) intelligence and then assume that we will be over-joyed to give up our customers. Then, to top it off, you come in and spew further insults about our trade. 

As for me, I don't even drink, and don't hire alcoholics. I have one 6 year painter working for me that can not only strip and stain a customer's deck, but paint their entire house in a flawless manner that exceeds today's industry standards. I think it's obvious who was really tippin the bottle in this thread. 

Where I mention a safer process AND admit I have no experience with log homes, you suggest "Ahead of time, make sure they are aware water is going to come into their home like crazy."..........GREAT advice!

I must say GOOD LUCK right back at you if you think you'll EVER be getting leads from people by insulting them. Find another forum to insult people and cause a ruckus at.
:ban:


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## Jon F (Jul 15, 2006)

AAPaint said:


> You are reading 4 different threads as if they are one, obviously. I didn't suggest any product for the log home (go check), and with the right products 3 or 4 coats is overkill. No product was even mentioned....so that point is moot. What manufacturer recommends 3 or 4 coats, because none was EVEN mentioned??????
> 
> First off, are suggesting I be "banned" for disagreeing with you and a method? Obviously, I'll apologize if the "drunk" joke was that offensive....whew. I'm going to try and respond very cool and politely and chalk up your previous post to a "bad day".....life's too short.
> 
> ...


(sigh) I didn't insult anyone. Thus far, I am the only one that has given this guy the correct advice on this job which is to PASS. I haven't caused a ruckus. For the things you've said to me, I think I've been more than polite. Don't worry, I'm not out to take your role as the "resident wood expert", I'm just trying to keep some guy from trying to strip an unknown product that looks like paint off of a deck, when it is obvious he doesn't have the experience to do so. 

AAPaint, I hope you've adaquately taken out your anger and frustrations for the day on me. If you need to let loose again, go ahead, just don't take it home to the family. I'd far rather you come online and curse at me than to unleash the venom on someone less capable. Peace, Shalom, whatever it is you need to hear to lighten up.

JF


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## AAPaint (Apr 18, 2005)

Yet again.......you know nothing of my knowledge, and can not show where I posted mis-information. None of your advice has been wrong, but neither has mine, and that needs cleared up. The equipment for media blasting is expensive, and not a worthy investment for one job. Where did I mis-inform? I know it's safer because I've done my homework on the subject, are you saying it's not safer for a log home?

So, let's not switch this from an attack on painters doing wood care to an attack on my wood care knowledge, of which, you've seen hardly enough to make any determination. 

I don't need ego to run my business. There are many things I still don't know about a lot of topics, and when I don't, you will see me asking. However, we handle numerous wood care projects with ease, and have many satisfied customers to prove it. Matter of factly, we are eventually going to expand our wood care advertising because the work is SO easy in comparison to what we usually do, lol!

You are the one that started in about painters not being able to do wood care, not me. You are the one that suggested we just leave it to someone else, not me. You are also the one that suggested painters just "paint it again" if it's not right, as if we are some lower form of life, or we can't get our work right the first time. 

So, you can be Mr. Superior, because one thing I seriously lack in is the ego department. 

P.S. Nice try at swapping things to make me look like the one with the "venom".


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## Jon F (Jul 15, 2006)

AAPaint said:


> Yet again.......you know nothing of my knowledge, and can not show where I posted mis-information. None of your advice has been wrong, but neither has mine, and that needs cleared up. The equipment for media blasting is expensive, and not a worthy investment for one job. Where did I mis-inform? I know it's safer because I've done my homework on the subject, are you saying it's not safer for a log home?
> 
> ..you told the guy the wood wouldn't need three coats. That's mis-information. Safer how?? Less chance of dying?? Less damage to the wood?? Safer to plants?? Safer to the enviroment?? "Doing homework" is different than "doing".
> 
> ...


...You're serious?? Laughable. My points are: 1) Painters consider handing off woodcare to wood guys/ visa versa (network referrals) 2) Wood guys service more customers than typical paint guy due to size of jobs, more opps for referrals for painter, 3) You'd help wood guys develop the niche of a new trade, as opposed to lumping it with washing or painting. Perhaps a poorly-chosen venue on my part to present such a plan,


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## AAPaint (Apr 18, 2005)

Wow, red text...I think I've said enough.


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## Jon F (Jul 15, 2006)

Agreed....I think we've passed the point of where anything good is going to come of this. I apologize to anyone who reads something I said as an insult to them. I especially apologize to the original poster......good luck with whatever comes of this project.


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## BDA4Life (Jul 26, 2006)

Jon Fife said:


> Agreed....I think we've passed the point of where anything good is going to come of this. I apologize to anyone who reads something I said as an insult to them. I especially apologize to the original poster......good luck with whatever comes of this project.



Come on Jon play nice or they gonna make you sit in the corner!:whistling


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## joedonuts (Jun 1, 2006)

Boy did i stir up something here or what? Slick, i have considered redecking this job because of the probability of not getting the existing finish off. I have to believe that there is some product that would be sufficient to remove this finish. I know it will be labor intensive, i have thought of passing it up, but i believe i can get it done. I called Sherwin Williams about their Stain and Finish remover and they tell me they have no complaints of people using it. It's one product i will look into using here.


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## BDA4Life (Jul 26, 2006)

What you have to do is a test spot with some stripper to see how tough the old stain will be to be removed.

Sherwin Williams stripper is a Sodium Hydroxide base stripper by the way.

There has been only a few old stains i couldn't strip but 95% of decks i've come accross i'm able to strip,"solids you name it"


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## BDA4Life (Jul 26, 2006)

Here is an example of a deck with a solid Behr crap product i've stripped.


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## Michigan Exhaust (Dec 29, 2005)

There's Shane showing off again. Now I am waiting for the other big guy Jon to whip out the beautiful log homes he does.:notworthy


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## BDA4Life (Jul 26, 2006)

Pressure Plus said:


> There's Shane showing off again. Now I am waiting for the other big guy Jon to whip out the beautiful log homes he does.:notworthy


I would never show off like that Dave!:whistling


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## slickshift (Jun 14, 2005)

BDA4Life said:


> Here is an example of a deck with a solid Behr crap product i've stripped.


The only decks I've walked away from and said re-deck them were covered with Behr (...and the wood wasn't in great shape)
That stuff is horrible

I've never tried the SW stripper
Thanks for the tip


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## BDA4Life (Jul 26, 2006)

slickshift said:


> The only decks I've walked away from and said re-deck them were covered with Behr (...and the wood wasn't in great shape)
> That stuff is horrible
> 
> I've never tried the SW stripper
> Thanks for the tip


I agree Behr stains are the worst products for wood especially those damm acrylics! 

I still don't know why the Depot sells that crap for unsuspecting homeowners for a DIY project.

S.W stripper is not bad i've had to buy it in a pinch when i needed it.If you do use it don't forget to use the brightner after stripping.


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## Jon F (Jul 15, 2006)

Slick,

...That is the problem with trying to remove those finishes with a SH stripper....too risky. If it is acrylic, it's a crapshoot at best. Do a test....might work in one spot and not work on half of it. Too much to risk, too little to gain. There are strippers out there that will work everytime/first time, but they are $$ and makes for costly job.


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## AAPaint (Apr 18, 2005)

If it's an acrylic, you can pick up some dad's easy spray stripper, and it WILL pull it up. You can't let it dry or it will allow pigments to soak into the wood, but it will remove all of it. I have completely stripped an interior staircase w/3 coats of latex using it, but it's expensive as mentioned above. However, I think it has been shown to be true that using SH strippers will work with proper dwell time and a strong enough solution. :blink:


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## paint slinger (Sep 21, 2006)

*wood finisher*

John
What you have on this site are 2 types of painters those who are professional with many years experience who are willing to share it with those as my self who are some what new to the trade and are willing and eager to learn from those pros, though you may have not intended to insult these professionals the context of your comments did just that.


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## BDA4Life (Jul 26, 2006)

Jon is a great guy and very smart when it comes to wood restoration,especially log home restoration! I would listen to anything he has to say and probally learn soemthing new and i've been restoring wood going on 9 yrs.


Jon has a great sense of humor by the way i wouldn't take all that serious most of the time.


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## mjay (Feb 2, 2006)

*learn from my mistakes*

If only I'd said no!
I used to do a fair amount of paint removal 15 years ago, so when a customer asked me to look at his deck I felt confident [*1st mistake]* I'd be able to strip it. After trying out a couple of products and contacting the manufacturer [chemical company] went with their recommendations[*2nd mistake]*. .
1,800 sqft no shade, the product dried too quickly to be effective. Different product after testing again, better results. 
Well, after 93hrs of labour and $3,000 in stripper, then sanding with a 3*21 belt sander [exterior deck too uneven to use floor sander]. finally we have a deck that looks like new. I lost $2,000 in chemicals and labour because of my inexperience with current products available. But I have a happy customer. Would I do another one? Depends on how busy I am. Would I want to do another one? Hell, no! Three days on my knees sanding each board.
Was it worth it? No! 


Refer and walk away, no run far, far away. 
The customer couldn't be persuaded to re-deck, it was a complicated design, and he hated the idea of wasting the current lumber...........................
I'll pm chemical details/name [biodegradeable, no skin burns, good to use near ground water supply], but lots of hard,hard work.


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