# Tips for an outdoor deck tile install



## Oldsarge (Jan 30, 2011)

Greetings all! New member here, and I have a few questions on a job I'm going to be doing on my own place. First off, let me say I'm really impressed at the level of professionals posting here... always nice to be able to tap the collective knowledge from such a great pool as I've seen here!

I'm a small general contractor, and I've done a number of tile jobs, but nothing more than straightforward installs over pristine subfloors, and have never had a failure so far...

I'm adding a deck to the back of our house, and the deck will have a roof over it which will overhang the perimeter of the deck by 24" or so. I'll be framing the deck with 2x6 joists at 16" oc and am contemplating going with 1 1/8" T&G subfloor and tiling the entire deck. Subfloor will be glued & screwed to prevent squeeks and prevent as much deflection as possible.

My questions/concerns are with the small bit of rain that will certainly blow in along the edges ( we live in Washington state) Also, will ceramic tile hold up? I've never done an exterior tiling project before, and I only want to do this ONCE. Eventually I will be fabricating a folding glass wall which will retract to one side of the deck so there will be a track which will be mounted on the tile surface and a good bit of weight which will be concentrated over the rim joist area, but the framing will be addressed for that during construction.

I'm thinking I should red guard about 24" in from the rim to prevent water penetration, and I've never used Ditra, so don't know the pros of using that product v. cement board or hardibacker which is what I planned on using.

The side elevations of the deck will be enclosed to about 42" up and custom double pane windows finishing off the top. The space is going to have an outdoor kitchen and be sort of an arboretum but won't be heated for the most part.... may end up heating the space eventually, and adding a hot tub to one end of the space which will be properly framed for the weight and electrical, but that space will obviously have moisture issues as well i.e. do I tile the area and place the tub over the tile, or tile up to the tub.

Obviously a lot to consider here.. I've done a lot of these types of projects which involves one or two elements, but this is fairly involved so there's a lot of structural and mechanical questions to resolve. Square footage will be around 425-475 

Any insight would be greatly appreciated! Should be starting this in a few months and hopefully finishing it up in time to enjoy the space this summer!


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## kevjob (Aug 14, 2006)

start here www.tileusa.com for waterproofing, honoring relief joints etc..

look for a PEI rating of 5 on the tiles as they are rated for freeze thaw environments.

next look here www.schluter.com for underlayments and edge finishing etc....

use a good quality thinset.


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## gideond (May 17, 2007)

Look at the Ditra handbook on Schluter's website. It has a section near the end that deals with exterior tiling. I'd trust Ditra much more than a liquid membrane in this case.
Also look at http://www.tiproboard.com

Personally, I'd wouldn't trust 2x6 joists for a tile installation.


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## Oldsarge (Jan 30, 2011)

gideond said:


> Personally, I'd wouldn't trust 2x6 joists for a tile installation.


I'd like to jump up to 2x8 at least, but I'm limited by the height above grade for the beams... Planning to add 1 more beam than necessary, and will be blocking between the joists over the beams to reduce any torsion on the joists as much as possible...

Thanks for the resources... Have some reading to do! I've read on some of the posts here about the importance of properly "bedding" the Ditra, and I've seen some failures on tile jobs from not properly preparing the surface, and getting a good bond with the thinset to the subfloor.... In my experience, 90% prep work makes all the difference in the longevity of the finished product! :thumbup:

Not too sure I understand the right way to do "relief joints" How do you do this, and how does it affect the look of the finished product? Is this something done within the subflooring or the tiling?


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## kevjob (Aug 14, 2006)

They are soft joints filled with caulked all the way through the tile to substrate, every 8' i believe for outside installation. http://www.tileusa.com/movementjoint_faq.htm

if the span of the 2x6 is short it may pass the deflector test.


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

There's a lot more to tile a deck than using some waterproofing over the ply.

Even if you don't use a Schluter product, look at their guide on deck tiling. You'll get a very good idea of how much you really need to do. 

Schluter BARA products

That is all _after _you have the proper framing deflection.


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## Oldsarge (Jan 30, 2011)

angus242 said:


> There's a lot more to tile a deck than using some waterproofing over the ply.
> 
> Even if you don't use a Schluter product, look at their guide on deck tiling. You'll get a very good idea of how much you really need to do.
> 
> ...



Thanks! Those edge profiles are awesome! I think with the extra beam I should have about 4' centers on the 4x6 beams, and 16" oc with the joists, and with 1 1/8" sub glued and screwed that I should have _Minimal _deflection. Will aslso be adding an extra beam and 12" oc joists in the area where the hot tub will ultimately go. Is the Schluter stuff available at the box stores, or is it a flooring specialty type of thing? 

Thanks again... Great stuff there.... I love to do stuff the right way whether it's my personal stuff or for a customer... I've seen some real strange homeowner stuff over the years and just have to wonder "What were they thinking!"


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

Do yourself a huge favor; don't consider box stores for your supplies. I cannot imagine you live in such a remote area as to not have a real tile supplier within your range. 

HD stocks only Ditra and a few profiles. Crap for thinset. 

If you need to, call Schluter and they'll tell you suppliers in your area. 

Also, look at Noble products too. I would use their membrane before I'd consider any Schluter product for an exterior patio:

http://www.noblecompany.com/Portals...e Deck Installation Instructions ENG 0809.pdf


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## Oldsarge (Jan 30, 2011)

angus242 said:


> Do yourself a huge favor; don't consider box stores for your supplies. I cannot imagine you live in such a remote area as to not have a real tile supplier within your range.
> 
> HD stocks only Ditra and a few profiles. Crap for thinset.
> 
> ...



Good info.. Thanks! As I suspected, there's a lot more than plunking down tile on a plywood sub regardless of how thick it is... Was considering going with a cbu of some sort and maybe noble over that... Will also be installing a vapor barrier under the deck to prevent moisture from below, and may even be considering encapsulated insulation in the floor as this may eventually turn into a semi-interior type of space with the moveable walls I'm planning. With the amount of overhang I'm planning for the roof, I'm hoping that water isn't as much an issue as it would be with a simple exposed deck... Will post more when this project gets off the ground!


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