# New Drywall Forum!



## Nathan (Jul 21, 2003)

Well, after several requests we have started a drywall forum. Hopefully this will be one more reason (among many  ) for people to keep coming back to this site.

ENJOY ALL! :Thumbs:


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## Teetorbilt (Feb 12, 2004)

Just in time for my big drywall job! 380 ft. X 24 ft. Perfect!


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## aps (Sep 21, 2004)

*Thank You Thank You Thank You !!!!*



Nathan said:


> Well, after several requests we have started a drywall forum. Hopefully this will be one more reason (among many  ) for people to keep coming back to this site.
> 
> ENJOY ALL! :Thumbs:


Thank you so much for including us Drywall installers in your forum
Its great to have a place to call our own !

A.P.S Inc.


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## Teetorbilt (Feb 12, 2004)

I'm a remodeler and mostly do small drywall projects. I now want to place a bid on 4,000 sq.ft. of 5/8 FireShield, primed and painted with SW elastomeric.
My numbers are coming out around 10K. This sounds high to me. Am I in the ballpark? Whoops, forgot to mention that there is fixed shelving loaded with product about 16 ins from the wall, all materials will have to be slid behind and then hoisted. Painting is limited to skinny guys.
If we have enough people to justify a new forum, somebody can answer this.


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## jdlong (Nov 2, 2004)

I like to use the Means estimating guide as a reference when I estimate a job. Because drywall prices changing almost weekly it is difficult to come up with hard numbers. On large jobs, I discount a bit per sq ft compared to small jobs. Working behind shelving should maybe add a 15% premium.

This is what Means lists for 5/8" fire rated drywall, primed and painted.
I don't know the price of SW elasrometric but figured .06 sq ft for paint.

Hang and tape: 1.34/sq ft (includes mat'l @ .24/sq ft) x 4,000= $5360
Clean? .21/sq ft x 4,000 = $840
Prime .18 sq ft (includes primer @ .04 /sq ft) x 4,000 = $720
Paint .27/sq ft (includes paint @ .06/sq ft) x 4,000 = $1080
Total matl and labor $8000
Premium for working behind shelves .15 x $8000 = $1,200
Total $9,200

You are not to far off from Means price guide.


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## housedocs (Jan 10, 2005)

I do alot of drywall here in the midwest, materials are running more in the neighborhood of $.30-$.35 here. Labor for what you're saying are very tight working conditions, would be $.65-$.70 Primer and paint- labor & mat. $.40

Those are s/f rates that are currently being charged in this area anyway.


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## pondman (Dec 29, 2004)

Walldoc,

You ever have problems in the midwest with long runs and a wave in the sheetrock?

I know its not the sheetrocker? Just wondering.


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## housedocs (Jan 10, 2005)

All depends on who built the house. You definitely better be looking over the studs if you've got a huge great room, they seem to build alot of new homes with one room having like a 14'-16' ceiling and the room like 24'x30' or something. Personally I'd rather go after a couple of simple split level entry type homes than one huge custom anyday.


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## pondman (Dec 29, 2004)

I do understand. All I'm asking is have you come across that. After you hang the rock you look down a wall and see it? Not putting blame on ANYONE just want to know.


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## Teetorbilt (Feb 12, 2004)

pond, I get that on smaller jobs and with steel studs, how someone could mess that up defeats me. The old string line can discover problems before you ever get started.


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## pondman (Dec 29, 2004)

Teetor,

All us upper scale good ol' boys with brains, and use them know that. But when you have a crew and their job is to hang and finish, they get there and do just that.

Most of these guys don't use the ol' brains. They are just pure labor force. I'm trying to see what others come across in the construction industry. 

I'm not asking what people do, or how they manage a job. I'm glad to know you even see it on metal studs, because I know it is out there.

Thanks for the input!


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## housedocs (Jan 10, 2005)

Stuff like that is real common with the tract home builders, we don't usually run into as much with the commericial work, but that's only about 20% of our business. Like I said it is more of a common problem with the volume builders, they seem to run thru alot of crews, the work is plentiful, but you have to do quite a bit of extras, adding nailers, shimming studs, etc.


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## BobBuild (Feb 7, 2005)

*Metal walls and drywall*

I'm also looking for pricing on a job. The job is 109,000 SF with 3-5/8 studs with 2 -4X10 sheets of 5/8" Drywall also acoustical panel fill and finished to a level 5 finish on the drywall. What do I charge per SF.


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## PlainPainter (Dec 29, 2004)

I have been hearing $0.25/sq.ft to hang and $0.25/sq.ft to finish plus whatever materials are per square foot {mud, tape, sheetrock}. What I want to know - Is this what a sub-contractor charges the G.C? Or what the sub pays his worker? Or do some guys actually go to homeowners with this? Let's say materials are $0.25/sq.ft - this would translate to $24 per 4x8 sheet. Do guys go to homeowners with materials supplied, installed, taped and mud'ed for just $24/sheet? I am sure low-ballers do, I am not talking about them - just the average sub who charges fairly. My thinking is that
Labor is about $16/sheet and materials about $8/sheet - so labor should be about doubled to allow for expenses, marketing, insurance, reinvestment, and finally profit for $32/sheet in addition to about $8/sheet for materials. So the total I as a sub would charge say a homeowner would be roughly $40/sheet - materials supplied, installed and mudded. Of course different areas of the country have different pricing. Just wondering what is roughly correct.

-PlainPainter


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## BobBuild (Feb 7, 2005)

I found this guy locally and this came from his website 
Board Pricing - Residential 
Hang, Mud, Tape, Corner bead, Finish, Sand, Point up. Board Price = $17.50 per board (1/2" X 4 X 12). This price includes waste removal from building to designated area on site. Tray Ceilings = $75


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## housedocs (Jan 10, 2005)

> Let's say materials are $0.25/sq.ft - this would translate to $24 per 4x8 sheet.


You need to check your math, 4'x8' = 32s/f per sheet at .25¢ s/f that's $8 a sheet, which is a tad low board cost. My latest price sheet from supplier 1/2" 4' board delivered is .27¢, regardless of the length of the sheet. Then you have to add in the costs for mud, tape, bead, fasteners, glue, backers, and primer. Materials are gonna run .30¢ at least, labor end around this neck of the woods, you charge much more than .60¢ a s/f and you're going to price yourself out of the job, to much southern labor force in this market, they don't speak much english, but they do reasonably quality work for a dime less than that. They can't work for me, maybe I'm funny, but I feel like if you're going to live & work in this country, you should at least learn to speak our language, but alot of the bigger outfits in this part of the country don't seem to care what language their subs speak & by them being subs, not employees the company gets around proof of right to work legalities. In other words they don't know or care if the guys hanging & finishing their board are US citizens or have a green card. But these guys will work in god awful conditions. 

Couple of yrs back things were unusually slow, even for mid-winter, I call around and locate a large outfit out of Columbia, about 90 min drive south of me, they have plenty of sub work on a huge new apt complex, nearly 2,000,000 s/f of bd total. Great news, so the next morning I load up the tools, equip, & crew & we head down there at 0 dark thirty, get to the site at 7am. First thing I see is a swamp, literally 8"-10" of mud all over the site, 3 different 4wd p/u from various trades already stuck blocking the "roadway" into where we need to get to. We see a crew of mexicans sloshing thru the mud with their pouches towards the bldg where we were told to start working at, then I noticed the real kicker, these fools are hauling their benches up a homemade ladder in the breezeway, that's right the stairways weren't even installed yet!! Needless to say I turned around & came home. If this is what the Pres is talking about when he says these people are coming here & taking jobs that Americans don't want to do. He's right I'm not going to work under those type of conditions and I certainly wouldn't expect my crew to either. On the way home that day I seriously thought about giving OSHA & the I.N.S. a call. 

Sorry about the rant, getting back to the topic at hand, I've never figured costs or rates by the sheet, I see that type of pricing being used by alot of guys on the east coast from postings I've seen on the W&C msg bd and drywallflorida.com boards. Got to go give a bid this morning, but I think I'll sit down & do the math on it this afternoon. I'll post back my findings then.


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## BobBuild (Feb 7, 2005)

Hold it! Hold everything. He never posted a material cost. His price was for labor only. Sorry for the misunderstanding but as you can see he never priced materials.


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## BobBuild (Feb 7, 2005)

Thanks for your reply PlainPainter. This job is for metal studs to be hung for the walls then 2-5/8" sheets of drywall are placed on both sides of the wall then the drywall is fininished with 3-4 coats of mud to hide all traces of tape and screws. I got a price of $3.50 per SF from somewhere but I'm trying to make sure of a price before I bid the job. Thanks


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## PlainPainter (Dec 29, 2004)

Walldoc, when I wrote $24/sheet - you took me out of context. There was a rolling sum there. $.25/sheet to hang + $.25/tape&mud + $.25/materials. Or
$.75/sq.ft which does translate to $24 a board soup to nuts.

Bobuild - I guess $17.50 is ok for all the labor, doesn't sound like an outfit that wants any profit though. If I worked for someone, I would want $17.50 per board to do all the labor of hanging, taping, installing corner beads, mud'ing 3 times and sanding - and even vaccuming. Is that too much to ask?

What about outfits that only put up blueboard? What if they charged just
half of that to install. Could you make a living at it? 

-PlainPainter


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## housedocs (Jan 10, 2005)

My apologies PlainPainter, now that I read the post again, I did totally take you out of context. I see now that you were including the whole deal in that. Got  there this morning.

We just finished a sizeable drywall job. This was for hang & finish (splatter lids and knock-down walls), 2 coats primer sprayed on everything, scrapped out, basement floors scraped, everything hand-swept. 11,800 s/f, one 14' vault in a 16'x14' dining room, rest of the place was 8' & 9' lids. Our bill for services was $8800. Materials ran $4800. So if you figure that on 12'x4' sheets that comes out to $35.78 a sheet. I'd love to charge $40 a sheet, but I've lost 2 bids, that I submitted based on the same rates within the last month!  

Bob's job is including metal framing as well, that's got to add at least .30¢ a s/f to the bid as well. I don't get into alot of it, when we do framing I usually charge it at hourly rate, $25 a hr. man hours I'm talking.


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## BobBuild (Feb 7, 2005)

You better check your math. First item $.25 to hang and $.25 to finish is $16.00 per board my guy charges $17.50. Now I think if you use boards for pricing you need to compare apples to apples. Lets use 32board for a 4 X 8 and 48Board for a 4 X 12. Second item 8800 for the job less 4800 for materials leaves $4,000 Gross profit divided by 246 48Bds leaves $16.26 per 48Bd. That $17.50 price for labor for a 32Bd looks pretty good


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## housedocs (Jan 10, 2005)

That was $4800 is over and above labor costs. $8800 covered services rendered only so indeed dividing $8800 by 246 sheets (12' sheet=48s/f =11,800 s/f) you come up with $35.77235 per sheet.


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## housedocs (Jan 10, 2005)

*Pricing Discussion Update*

Did a job in a commercial bldg this week for a local fella owns alot of rental property, one business park, and is currently developing a residential tract that will eventually have just over a hundred new homes in it. 

Looked at his job, repair work after water damage from frozen pipe bursting. Real PIA job, to save on material replacement, they cut only 8" from the floor & removed the drywall & insulation. Told him we'd do it hrly have it done 3 days, no problem, finished the job today, collect immediately :Thumbs: and he has me look at an apartment that he wants textured next week. Give him a price on that, he agrees and says he'll call me back first of the week to schedule. Great!

So thinking I'm on a pretty good roll I hit him up to bid the next phase of the new residential units he's building this season. I give him my standard price $1.25 s/f for materials & labor, hung, textured finished, and primered, ready to paint including clean-up. I even hint that I could bargain a bit on the price in order to secure all of the season's work. Very nicely he tells me I'm not even in the ballpark, he's got another guy that has a 4 man mexican crew that comes in during the bldg season & works for him that can hang a 7000 s/f house in a day, he finishes himself with an alpha-tech in 3-4 days. total of 5 working days tops per unit, for get this .72¢ a s/f, yep that's labor & materials!! 

Material is a min of .30¢, so they're doing all of the drywall labor for .42 a s/f  How the hell do you compete with people working for peanuts


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## PlainPainter (Dec 29, 2004)

NIS 'em

-PlainPainter

I freakin' hate scabs! Go back to your own country and work for chicken ********************, just don't ruin it for all of us who want middle class incomes.


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## housedocs (Jan 10, 2005)

Got a bit more info today about this crew, the hanging crew works by the day $150 a man, so he's getting these units hung for $600 labor, so that's how's he paid for that 5K for the alpha-tech. :evil:


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## ProWallGuy (Oct 17, 2003)

Walldoc, what would be an 'alpha-tech'?


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## Teetorbilt (Feb 12, 2004)

#1 guy, pro.


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## ProWallGuy (Oct 17, 2003)

:Thumbs: 
I thought it was a new-fangled type of banjo or something.


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## housedocs (Jan 10, 2005)

An alpha-tech is a real slick new drywall tape and finish set up. Runs off air instead of muscle, no more aching shoulders  Here's a link to their site,
http://www.apla-tech.com/toolsets.htm
the taper has just come on the market, the finishing set-up has been out for a few yrs. I've seen it in operation and even tried it out briefly for an hour or so on on a jobsite down in Branson last year. Very sweet, but at around $5k for the complete set-up, it's just behind replacing my aging work truck on the priority list.


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## CR Contracting (Feb 7, 2008)

*Price changes on labor for different hights of walls?*

I'm new to this forum and was wondering when your hanging, taping, and texture for a 9 foot wall do you charge more than a $1 per sq ft plus matterials or the same rates as u would the 8 foot wall? And also i was wondering about stairways too if you normally charge more for the sq ft or just still the same rates? And if your rates differ from them, how much do you normally charge extra? thank you for your help, hope to hear from you all soon.


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## welgedrywall (Feb 19, 2008)

jdlong said:


> I like to use the Means estimating guide as a reference when I estimate a job. Because drywall prices changing almost weekly it is difficult to come up with hard numbers. On large jobs, I discount a bit per sq ft compared to small jobs. Working behind shelving should maybe add a 15% premium.
> 
> This is what Means lists for 5/8" fire rated drywall, primed and painted.
> I don't know the price of SW elasrometric but figured .06 sq ft for paint.
> ...


 

What is the Means Price Guide? Have not heard of it. Where do you find that at?


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## JumboJack (Aug 14, 2007)

Three year old thread!


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## CR Contracting (Feb 7, 2008)

*Rates for Removing Plaster and Laff?*

I recently had a customer that wanted to rip out all the plaster and laff in his house since it was all cracking and starting to fall appart in areas and redo it with drywall, but I've been doing all new construction since I started my business and had no idea what a reasonable rate would be for this. His house is 4,640 sqft. Does anyone out there do much for this work and have a rate for removal of plaster and laff?


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## JustaFramer (Jan 21, 2005)

welgedrywall said:


> What is the Means Price Guide? Have not heard of it. Where do you find that at?


They sell those at Home Depot.


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## JustaFramer (Jan 21, 2005)

CR Contracting said:


> I recently had a customer that wanted to rip out all the plaster and laff in his house since it was all cracking and starting to fall appart in areas and redo it with drywall, but I've been doing all new construction since I started my business and had no idea what a reasonable rate would be for this. His house is 4,640 sqft. Does anyone out there do much for this work and have a rate for removal of plaster and laff?




It's lath not laff.


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## Tim0282 (Dec 11, 2007)

I'm sure glad somebody mentioned the laff and the lath. I was getting itchy fingers. But then somebody might want the laugh taken out of their house. Who am I to say what a person would want removed from their house...
I'm sorry for being the jerk


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## Double-A (Jul 3, 2006)

Please start a new thread.


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