# how to price a 3-6 hour job



## skyhook (Mar 17, 2007)

Spike7 said:


> o.k . not asking , numbers here
> 
> what do you guys do , when a new client call and has a small , partial day job ?
> do you charge that partial day cost , or charge a full day cost?
> ...


Whenever I tell my wife how long a job will take, 1 hour, 3 hours, 5 hours,
she always comes back with _" times 3 "_. 
I have adopted that theory and now it's second nature.


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## Kent Whitten (Mar 24, 2006)

skyhook said:


> Whenever I tell my wife how long a job will take, 1 hour, 3 hours, 5 hours,
> she always comes back with " times 3 ".
> I have adopted that theory and now it's second nature.


X3? Dude, you need to get your act together. My wife says my estimate is x2 :laughing:


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## barry1219 (Oct 8, 2011)

2 thoughts here.

One is to charge a set rate for the day..which you seem to do already. If so then let her know you are charging for the full day and let her know that you will be available to handle some more work that day if she wants to pay the extra material charge and crown or chair rail another room. 


Last idea is to have a rate per foot that you charge up to a break point. For instance you charge $2.00 per foot up to 100lf. Over 100lf is $1.75 and over 200lf is $1.50.
Just a couple of ideas if you feel that you ever need to justify yourself to a customer. I am thankful that most of my work is referrals and I do not have to bid or explain why I charge what I do. It is a good practice to have a method to your madness so to speak and hopefully this helps.


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## Spike7 (May 18, 2012)

barry1219 said:


> 2 thoughts here.
> 
> One is to charge a set rate for the day..which you seem to do already. If so then let her know you are charging for the full day and let her know that you will be available to handle some more work that day if she wants to pay the extra material charge and crown or chair rail another room.
> 
> ...


all my work ( 30 years of it)is referrals too .

( hard to believe you don`t have to bid or explain why you charge what you do)

even a referral is new , and theres that feeling out period in the beginning of all relationships
.
i do charge per-foot, but this was 50 feet at most.
the lady was very nice . her last words were . " i was hoping to pay less , but i`ll call you if i have anything else."
lol , it just made me feel a bit guilty .


by my wife was right where your wives were, 
" we`ll, you have to make a living ! , don`t feel bad . you weren`t wrong."


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## EcoBuilder (May 2, 2011)

I just try to schedule on the days I have other bids I'm going to. I'll generally try schedule 3-4 bids in a day. If that doesn't work out, I'll just see if they mind me coming and doing it in the early evening (assuming it's only a 3 hour job).


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## skyhook (Mar 17, 2007)

Kent Whitten said:


> X3? Dude, you need to get your act together. My wife says my estimate is x2 :laughing:


X2 is soooo 80s. That wouldn't even cover my GL policy. :thumbup:


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## VinylHanger (Jul 14, 2011)

When I leave in the morning and tell my wife I'll be back in a few hours, she tells me she'll hold dinner for me. :laughing:


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## VinylHanger (Jul 14, 2011)

Spike7 said:


> all my work ( 30 years of it)is referrals too .
> 
> ( hard to believe you don`t have to bid or explain why you charge what you do)
> 
> ...


I feel guilty sometimes as well. However, like you said, I have to make a living. I'm not doing this for fun. It can be fun, but so can hanging around the house and watching movies, drinking beer. Gotta get paid and it is expensive to just get by these days.

As long as I am fair to the customer, I don't worry about it too much. If customers are constantly saying "Wow, that is cheap!", then you have a problem.


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## JWilliams (Nov 11, 2008)

This day in age everyone charges about tree fidy! :thumbsup:


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## Spike7 (May 18, 2012)

JWilliams said:


> This day in age everyone charges about tree fidy! :thumbsup:


but it does suck when you give a price , and before you finish the sentence , they`re saying " when can you start!"
not a good sign


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## charimon (Nov 24, 2008)

I Charge them for the full day if it is over 5 hours but I will sometimes mention to the client that if they have another little thing they need done lets add that in so they can get a lil xtra for the same price.


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## essrmo (May 2, 2007)

charimon said:


> if they have another little thing they need done lets add that in so they can get a lil xtra for the same price.


hows that working out for you?:laughing:


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## Everend (Jun 11, 2010)

my work is about 1/2 bid and 1/2 hourly work. I actually prefer working on bid because then I don't feel so rushed, if I want to take a little extra time to do something a bit better than planned, I don't have to ask for permission!

Because nearly all my projects are small jobs (3days or less) my hourly rate is such that I need to bill about 30hrs / week to keep my wife happy on payday. The other 20-30hrs I spend each week is doing billing, invoicing, bidding, cleaning and all the other tasks necessary for running a one man show. That means my hourly billing rate needs to work out to full time pay for 30hrs billable work. 
So to do the math, let's pretend your wife is happy with $1000/wk so you normally charge $200/day rate. If someone wants to hire you hourly, you'll have extra driving, extra billing, extra other work in addition to your simple day rate method. To reach your actual billable hourly rate, divide your day rate by 6hrs instead of 8hrs. Now your hourly rate is $33.33/hr (not $25/hr).
It's the same idea as buying your supplies in bulk. Get them one at a time for $33.33 or get 8 for $200.

NOTE: These are not real rates, just examples because the math is easiest at these rates.


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## Dirtywhiteboy (Oct 15, 2010)

JWilliams said:


> This day in age everyone charges about tree fidy! :thumbsup:


Tree fidy only takes my up till lunch, I gotta get fidy fy for the whole day:laughing:


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## Spike7 (May 18, 2012)

Dirtywhiteboy said:


> Tree fidy only takes my up till lunch, I gotta get fidy fy for the whole day:laughing:


barely makin " fo t fo down heeya"
we not the brightest bulbs in dis heeya city "myamma"
de don`t " **** eeglesh" but dey sho can make sum goooood rice n beens!!


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## Dirtywhiteboy (Oct 15, 2010)

There's a little dive down in overtown with some good rice n beens.
Dose anyone speak english anymore or is it all spanish?


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Dirtywhiteboy said:


> There's a little dive down in overtown with some good rice n beens.
> Dose anyone speak english anymore or is it all spanish?


Probably either mexican or cuban. Havent heard much Castelian Spanish around here. :laughing:


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## Dirtywhiteboy (Oct 15, 2010)

When I lived there we had a lot of Puerto Ricans, south Americans and Cubans. The educated ones from south America spoke good Spanish but the Cubans and Puerto Ricans not so good, in fact some had a down right hard accent.


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## Miss Brown (Mar 30, 2011)

My day today: Finish job A in the am, load out tools back to house, get new set of tools out to job b. Find that "dog chewed the trim up a little" is not a patch and paint. Need to pull trim. Need other set of tools. Need special cypress baseboard (7/8th!) from lumber yard on other side of earth. Need to pull saws n' things off another job, but can't get in, key's missing from lock box. Borrow chop saw from friend. Back to job, borrowed chop saw doesn't work. Attempt other bits on punch list...can't move the stacking washer and dryer out to get behind it because they built the trim after install. Where's my phone? In dog's mouth, and on the floor, and outside. I made anti-money today. My hourly just turned into a retroactive bid....this one is going to be day minimum, and is going to take me 2 days.


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## Dirtywhiteboy (Oct 15, 2010)

Miss Brown said:


> My day today: Finish job A in the am, load out tools back to house, get new set of tools out to job b. Find that "dog chewed the trim up a little" is not a patch and paint. Need to pull trim. Need other set of tools. Need special cypress baseboard (7/8th!) from lumber yard on other side of earth. Need to pull saws n' things off another job, but can't get in, key's missing from lock box. Borrow chop saw from friend. Back to job, borrowed chop saw doesn't work. Attempt other bits on punch list...can't move the stacking washer and dryer out to get behind it because they built the trim after install. Where's my phone? In dog's mouth, and on the floor, and outside. I made anti-money today. My hourly just turned into a retroactive bid....this one is going to be day minimum, and is going to take me 2 days.


And this is exactly what beer is for:thumbup:


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## Stunt Carpenter (Dec 31, 2011)

Miss Brown said:


> My day today: Finish job A in the am, load out tools back to house, get new set of tools out to job b. Find that "dog chewed the trim up a little" is not a patch and paint. Need to pull trim. Need other set of tools. Need special cypress baseboard (7/8th!) from lumber yard on other side of earth. Need to pull saws n' things off another job, but can't get in, key's missing from lock box. Borrow chop saw from friend. Back to job, borrowed chop saw doesn't work. Attempt other bits on punch list...can't move the stacking washer and dryer out to get behind it because they built the trim after install. Where's my phone? In dog's mouth, and on the floor, and outside. I made anti-money today. My hourly just turned into a retroactive bid....this one is going to be day minimum, and is going to take me 2 days.


Sounds like a bad day. 

For these small jobs I have figure that I need to take as many tools with me to all of them or else profits go out the window fast.


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## skyhook (Mar 17, 2007)

Dirtywhiteboy said:


> There's a little dive down in overtown with some good rice n beens.
> Dose anyone speak english anymore or is it all spanish?


OT but interesting. 
A distant relaitive lived on rice and beans for years. He did it to save money ($.50 per day groceries) so he could surf and not have to work.
A scout saw him surfing, entered him in competition. 
He is now a World Class Champion surfer with a manager, huge sponsers and mucho dinero (millions). 
All right D.H. http://vimeo.com/46187485
:thumbsup:


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## Everend (Jun 11, 2010)

Miss Brown said:


> My day today: Finish job A in the am, load out tools back to house, get new set of tools out to job b. Find that "dog chewed the trim up a little" is not a patch and paint. Need to pull trim. Need other set of tools. Need special cypress baseboard (7/8th!) from lumber yard on other side of earth. Need to pull saws n' things off another job, but can't get in, key's missing from lock box. Borrow chop saw from friend. Back to job, borrowed chop saw doesn't work. Attempt other bits on punch list...can't move the stacking washer and dryer out to get behind it because they built the trim after install. Where's my phone? In dog's mouth, and on the floor, and outside. I made anti-money today. My hourly just turned into a retroactive bid....this one is going to be day minimum, and is going to take me 2 days.


Sounds like you need a van that you can keep all your tools with you all the time. I got one about 6 months ago, it's been a HUGE success!


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## Seven-Delta-FortyOne (Mar 5, 2011)

Miss Brown said:


> My day today: Finish job A in the am, load out tools back to house, get new set of tools out to job b. Find that "dog chewed the trim up a little" is not a patch and paint. Need to pull trim. Need other set of tools. Need special cypress baseboard (7/8th!) from lumber yard on other side of earth. Need to pull saws n' things off another job, but can't get in, key's missing from lock box. Borrow chop saw from friend. Back to job, borrowed chop saw doesn't work. Attempt other bits on punch list...can't move the stacking washer and dryer out to get behind it because they built the trim after install. Where's my phone? In dog's mouth, and on the floor, and outside. I made anti-money today. My hourly just turned into a retroactive bid....this one is going to be day minimum, and is going to take me 2 days.


Whenever I have a day like this, I start to think I'm the only contractor out there who can't seem to get his chit together, and all the others are always professionally organized to a tee. It's nice to know it happens to others, too.

But it still sucks for you.


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## LEVELBEST (Dec 28, 2006)

A.T.C. said:


> Whenever I have a day like this, *I start to think I'm the only contractor out there who can't seem to get his chit together, and all the others are always professionally organized to a tee.* It's nice to know it happens to others, too.
> 
> But it still sucks for you.


I beat myself up often thinking this same thing.......


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## Spike7 (May 18, 2012)

LEVELBEST said:


> I beat myself up often thinking this same thing.......


yeah . 
like mondays when everything starts going wrong all through the day 
i always wonder " how does monday know its a monday??"


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## BC Carpenter (Dec 28, 2010)

I think we all have those days... sometimes better to just re-schedule rather than running around losing money.


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## Miss Brown (Mar 30, 2011)

> Whenever I have a day like this, I start to think I'm the only contractor out there who can't seem to get his chit together,and all the others are always professionally organized to a tee.


Most of my friends work in construction or landscaping, we have all invented this OTHER GUY: He's stronger, faster, clear-headed, has nicer tools, his crew is fast and looks great. He's also cheaper! 

I had a train-wreck job I called a carpenter/friend to howl about it. Client was thrilled with it, and didn't throw up at the bill (I did.) I thought it went badly. Client wouldn't know, it looked great. My friend says, "Well, I think of it this way. I'm the best man for this job, who is here doing this job." 

Yeah! Find me someone who can frame AND faux and find that person cheaper. Cuz I'd like to hire them. !


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## Miss Brown (Mar 30, 2011)

By the way...I had a fantastic 2 days after that last one...and the client who's dog ate my phone offered to replace it. I'm going to bill for my crappy day and call it even.


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## Miss Brown (Mar 30, 2011)

Mug shot


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## bizusn (Aug 17, 2012)

Tinstaafl said:


> Pinwheel has the best-case answer.
> 
> But generally speaking, you need to have a minimum charge to ensure that at least you break even for the day. Use that left-over couple of hours to catch up on some of the stuff you never seem to have time for. Paperwork, tool maintenance, cleaning out the truck etc.
> 
> While that's not billable time, it will contribute to your overall efficiency. :thumbsup:



Exactly


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## OKMrazor (Aug 8, 2009)

Stick to your guns with what you're charging.

Maybe change your approach, though...? Never been in a house that "only" need one thing, like chair rail.

Explain why you need to charge that way - then walk the house and do an assessment regarding other potential work.

Maybe the job doesn't happen next week, but two months from now when she can also afford to repair some exterior trim, rehang a door... whatever.

Maybe you even get a 3-6 DAY job out of it rather than a 3-6 hour job.

Just a thought


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## Spike7 (May 18, 2012)

OKMrazor your pretty much right on. i felt bad i couldn`t accomodate her.

the client since moved on 
she was in a hurry 

but i have , so many times gone in for a one day job , and ended up with days or weeks of other work.
once they see they feel good about you being in their house , it opens up into alot of other projects
it could have been a single woman with kids , or new divorcee , and they want to feel safe with a guy in thier house 

or , just the fact that most people know at least 100 other people , she could have ended up referring me to another good client.


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## Spike7 (May 18, 2012)

Miss Brown said:


> Most of my friends work in construction or landscaping, we have all invented this OTHER GUY: He's stronger, faster, clear-headed, has nicer tools, his crew is fast and looks great. He's also cheaper!
> 
> I had a train-wreck job I called a carpenter/friend to howl about it. Client was thrilled with it, and didn't throw up at the bill (I did.) I thought it went badly. Client wouldn't know, it looked great. My friend says, "Well, I think of it this way. I'm the best man for this job, who is here doing this job."
> 
> Yeah! Find me someone who can frame AND faux and find that person cheaper. Cuz I'd like to hire them. !



our spin on inventing an OTHER GUY
we always just blame the last guy who worked for me for everything that goes wrong ( even 6 months later)
" f**king jose!. he really messed this door up"
man ,i miss measured the crown , i`m short , f**king jose man!"

one of us will miss cut a sheet of plywood , and ...." f**king jose!"
"man this clients impossible !f**kin jose really pissed her off!"


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## A.T.H.I. (Feb 8, 2008)

I find that when people have "small jobs" that they really aren't small they just say that cause they think they can fool people into charging a small fee. 

Most of these people will say that it's easy and all you got to do is.....and it will only take an hour. I feel like telling these people that if they know that much about the job they should open up their own business or do it themselves.

I remain professional and tell people that I have a flat rate that would probably not make it cost effective to hire me. I tell them that if they give me a large job then the small job can be included in that. 

Sometimes I will tell them that the only difference between the small job and the large job is the amount of time spent doing it. All the other stuff is the same such as loading and unloading tools, signing the contract, collecting the payment, depositing it in the bank, cleaning up the worksite etc.


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