# experience with Fusion Pro grout



## AustinDB (Sep 11, 2006)

HO supplied this for a job, it was a shock using this. I spread out about 8SF, came back a few minutes later and the haze on the tiles was extremely difficult to remove. Ended up dousing it with water and scrubbing with a SS brush. Easily took twice as long as a sanded grout would have taken. 

I'm wondering if it was the tile I was installing that soaked up the grout or if it was in fact the grout. 

I've had experience with SpectraLock, difficult to work, small area and using vinegar to cleanup make it costly, but I believe it was a good product. What's the best grout choice for kitchen floors and bathroom showers (high traffic/water)?


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## avenge (Sep 25, 2008)

I've used it once, the haze it left freaked me out. The next morning I get a text from the HO "The floor looks great!" Went to the jobsite and indeed it turned out great the haze disappeared.

This was on a dark wood look porcelain.


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## Golden view (Feb 16, 2012)

I used it once and thought it was fine. No waiting a few minutes, I cleaned as I went. QL2 is better in all ways except price though.


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## PrecisionFloors (Jan 24, 2006)

You can not use urethane/acrylic/epoxy grouts like they are portland based. Waiting to clean will kill you. Small areas, clean as you go, micro fibre rags. If you spread 85ft of any of it and are by yourself - you're screwed and the haze cleanup will be a chore at the very least. It's not the product but the method.


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## Rhode Island (Mar 24, 2015)

I use primarily TEC grouts and adhesives. Basically I use one tile shop and that is what they carry. Maybe 10yrs using them with no issues.

I have no experience with the grout you used, but I would be scared to use a SS brush. Scotch brite pads or the equivalent would be the max I would use.


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## Creter (Oct 13, 2009)

Slow and low, that is the tempo - when it comes to that stuff...

Guys installing a large backsplash in the main showroom I use spread the stuff and then went to lunch...:whistling


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

Got sold on trying that 'Stuff', once. Asked about application> "just like regular grout" .... Insert Blue cloud with sponge bob horn and fish sounds swearing for 2 hours. And worse yet it was on travertine mosaic, shut the front door, mother Herman, cheese and rice, jerome joseph and mary .......

Should have known better than to trust, even a floor covering asst manager, at a big box store. That's on me, by mistake. Using that wonderful product again? :laughing: Not in the near future and NEVER on stone


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## aptpupil (Jun 12, 2010)

Read directions with all new products


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

aptpupil said:


> Read directions with all new products


Thank You Mister Helper, the directions didn't help much


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## country_huck (Dec 2, 2009)

We use urethane grouts 95% of the time. Once you get a system down you will never go back.


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## aptpupil (Jun 12, 2010)

Texas Wax said:


> Thank You Mister Helper, the directions didn't help much


They state to not use on natural stone without presealing and only use a few square feet at a time. Sorry whoever advised you that it's the same as cementitious grout misled you. Sorry if my comment came off as rude.


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## PrecisionFloors (Jan 24, 2006)

country_huck said:


> We use urethane grouts 95% of the time. Once you get a system down you will never go back.


Exactly. Once you learn how to do it correctly, urethane is easier to use than portland based grout. The haze is actually easier to prevent. No mixing and no grout going off on you either. The results are far superior as well. It's like anything else, there's a method. You wouldn't play baseball with a sledge hammer any more than you would break up an old a.c. pad with an aluminum bat...


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

I've posted this before, but it's airways helpful. 

I run a three bucket system. One with a sponge with a white scrubby. One with a few sponges and the last with a micro fiber.

Dampen the tile first (I use the scrub sponge)

Spread the grout and scrape as much excess of with a float.

Wash off large debris with scrubby sponge.

Wipe down several times with standard sponge. 

Wipe down with damp microfiber. 

Wipe down with dry microfiber.

It will leave virtually no haze.


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## GO Remodeling (Apr 5, 2005)

Texas Wax said:


> Got sold on trying that 'Stuff', once. Asked about application> "just like regular grout" .... Insert Blue cloud with sponge bob horn and fish sounds swearing for 2 hours. And worse yet it was on travertine mosaic, shut the front door, mother Herman, cheese and rice, jerome joseph and mary .......
> 
> Should have known better than to trust, even a floor covering asst manager, at a big box store. That's on me, by mistake. Using that wonderful product again? :laughing: Not in the near future and NEVER on stone


These new grouts are the future so you need to learn the proper way to use them.

Taking advice from some big box store assistant manager? What were you smoking? :whistling


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

olzo55 said:


> These new grouts are the future so you need to learn the proper way to use them.
> 
> Taking advice from some big box store assistant manager? What were you smoking? :whistling


:laughing: I said it was all on me. Will openly admit it. The experience still sucked.

The asst manager is a whole story unto itself. She knew exactly what she was doing Making the store $75 more than a grout install. Up sell to my client while I was putting up resistance to a 'new' product I hadn't used. So be it if the client saw value in it. Always up for new industry trends, typically with caution. It was fricken 8:30 at night, after roaming around for an hour doing selections. After working all day, 102 outside had the bath vent/s closed, window open for dust control ...  I did let my guard down just to get it over with.

Comedy of errors regarding the Fusion Pro. Can't think of a worse situation to try something new in... Still feeling the pain a year later. Job turned out well in spite of me. Client has referred 3 times the $$$ of it , and still counting, paid work. So nobody to blame only lessons learned or remembered in the Case of Big box employees.

I'll use urethane grout in the future ... but this time maybe on some nice simple ceramic tile job :thumbsup: Though I will never forget and likely never stop complaining about this...It sucked doing it improperly and getting good results after. Let it be warning is what I'm trying to say.


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## Evan1968 (Dec 5, 2010)

Love Fusion Pro! 
Never used it until we secured contracts for Chipotles. The prints spec out Fusion Pro. The tile is a 2"x8" glazed with lugs. Straight stack.
TNT's 3 bucket method works great. 
We use a 2 bucket system and im about 3ft behind the spreader. One bucket for initial and one bucket for final. Then we go back with a mico fiber cloth and the little haze thats left buffs right out.
Clean water is a must. We change both out every 200ft.
2 of us , with our system, can do about 900ft in a 8hr period. 

Guys better learn how to use urethane grouts. Cement based are going the way of the dinosaur.


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## superseal (Feb 4, 2009)

Just used it on a mosaic back splash, blue scotch brite (non scratch), clean water buckets, scrubby sponges and micro fiber made it easy.

It stuck a like crazy to the honed carrara and travertine however, but it did come off with elbow grease.


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## aptpupil (Jun 12, 2010)

superseal said:


> Just used it on a mosaic back splash, blue scotch brite (non scratch), clean water buckets, scrubby sponges and micro fiber made it easy.
> 
> It stuck a like crazy to the honed carrara and travertine however, but it did come off with elbow grease.


Did you pre seal?


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## GO Remodeling (Apr 5, 2005)

T.W.,

The warning should be to check a product out before you attempt using it for the first time. Had you looked it up or asked here before you used it, you would have gotten professional advice, not some assistant manager talking point.

Had you been prepared, the grout job would have been done without the pain.


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

olzo55 said:


> T.W.,
> 
> The warning should be to check a product out before you attempt using it for the first time. Had you looked it up or asked here before you used it, you would have gotten professional advice, not some assistant manager talking point.
> 
> Had you been prepared, the grout job would have been done without the pain.



Absolutely great advice Ozlo. 

Help me out here. Know I'm ruffling feathers by 'not' appreciating it the way I should.

I read the instructions. LOL Still have one of the buckets ... Just re-read now. They read the same to my understanding today as then.

Did a small test area to get a feel for how it was going to go down, clean up. Seemed to work fine, but that was a small area....

In hind sight should have stuck to smaller areas, but I followed the directions. Put down grout for 3-4 minutes, up to 20 sqft .... hit some where around 12 sqft. 

Part of the supposed appeal of Fusion Pro is that it acts as a sealer and grout on stone. Biggest frustration is HOW much the fusion pro affected the overall coloration and sheen. My love of the richness and look of natural stone was OFFENDED. Dramatic difference from small area to large area in terms of visual impact. 

The scrubbing began, following the directions. Part of the larger problem was temperature. Mid 80's in the room, 103 or so outside. Part of the 12 sqft area got away from me. Broke out the scotchbrite pads and continued to scrub to get rid of any thickness of grout. 

But the coloring affect from the Fusion was not controllable, compared to cement based grout. Most of this is frustration was hands on touchy feeling lack of experience with a new product and having HIGH END results expectations. In the end beat myself silly trying to do the impossible. 

Did the rest is small patches,  hangs head, no difference. Just less physical abuse. 

Not feeling the natural stone sealers helping the cause a great deal. Mostly due to the nature of a rough surface and how the fusion seems to lock into rough surfaces. Having worked with fusion, I can see the effects of it on sample boards now. Will sealing really make a significant difference on natural stone?

Even with advice probably should not have used a new product on this project and this application. I'm a picky SOB and teh fusion did not behave as expected. Probably more picky than needed in most cases. Lesson learned and after really thinking about it, probably shouldn't be that aggravated. 

Will try urethane based grout in the future. BUT a job with a bit less intensity and PIA than the 1x1 travertine mosaic. 

LOL Did not use the fusion on anything beyond the 1x1.


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## GO Remodeling (Apr 5, 2005)

you would have the same experience with any of the newer grouts. And with the room so warm the grout will dry faster on the tile.

First, sealing the stone is important,imo. These new grouts can get into micro pores and textured tiles easily. That is a drawback. So seal a tile and do a test sample. You might prefer the cement grout better for that particular job. 

Make sure to pre-wet the tile before grouting. I use a spray bottle and mist the tile. (I haven't tried it but a drop or two of dish detergent may help as soap is a wetting agent.)

Rob's advice advice applies to all the new grouts. White scrubby to loosen the surface grout then wipe with sponge and microfiber towel. The Fusion directions are lacking in those tips.

You might still feel a rough surface of some type after grouting. I've hit the tile with a fine sponge sanding pad to knock that off. I wouldn't do that on polish stone,btw.

Always have your extra water ready. These grouts like clean water more than cement grouts.

Finally, pick the grout to suit the application. You might like cement grout better for some tiles and the newer grouts for other times.


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

Thanks Ozlo

Appreciate ya! :thumbsup:


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## GO Remodeling (Apr 5, 2005)

I'm using Fusion Pro on a job now. 

I put 2 drops of Dawn dish detergent in a 32 oz. spray bottle. Then I lightly mist the area (about 10sqft) I'm doing before grouting. It seemed to spread and clean easier. I have more to do but I thought maybe some of you guys would like to try it and comment. 

For as little soap as I use, I doubt that it would affect the grouts performance. But I'll ask someone at Customs when I get some time.

BTW, I haven't needed the white scrubby. Either it's the tile surface being easy to clean or the soap. Either way, it's ok with me.


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## CO762 (Feb 22, 2010)

I've used it and if you're even a somewhat competent finisher, it's a nobrainer. Read the directions, looked at the video and realized it was a ten minutes of my life I'll not be able to get back. Not sure to do with the microfiber towels. Maybe I can use them to clean guns with.


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## PrecisionFloors (Jan 24, 2006)

CO762 said:


> Not sure to do with the microfiber towels. Maybe I can use them to clean guns with.


You pretty much refuse to embrace anything that is different from the way you always do things. I've gathered this from hundreds of your posts, not just this one. I'm just curious how you would have every learned your way in the first place with that attitude? I totally get the whole "this is what I'm comfortable with and how I do things" mentality. What I don't get is the belittling of anything remotely different from your way. Maybe I'm reading you wrong and if so, I apologize, but you come across as arrogant as hell and secure in the notion that you'll never learn another way to do something. Just an fyi - totally worth what you paid for it


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## GO Remodeling (Apr 5, 2005)

CO,

If you've used Fusion more than once and in an area bigger than 25sqft, you'd get that saving time is important. Don't know why you need a microfiber towel? Leads me to believe you have limited experience with the product. Microfiber towels are the go to for that final bit of shine on the tile( and for any type of grout, btw.)

Perhaps you missed the point of my suggestion. If you can produce the job with a better result in less time, that's a win in my book. I've just asked other setters to try it and see if they get the same results. Maybe yes, maybe no. So we'll see. Try to keep an open mind.


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## CO762 (Feb 22, 2010)

PrecisionFloors said:


> You pretty much refuse to embrace anything that is different from the way you always do things.


I have used fusion, as I said. And I even watched the vids, went to websites, got their data sheets, the whole thing. I got everything ready, per the mfgr, but other than doing it like I'd do unfilled porous stone on a hot day, I didn't think there was a lot of difference to it. 

As finishers adjust their mix/shape/wash/time depending on what they're about to do, they should quickly catch on to this, like I said. And no need for those microfiber towels, nor scratch pads, but both of those have been sold to people as grouting tools. I've never used them, nor know anyone that has, so like I said, I saw no need. I didn't need them here, so the pads I got a refund on, but the microfibers were opened, so I'll use them for something else, other than sticking to the skin on my hands.

I have used the plastics and the fabrics, but it's not all I use as they are for a time and a place. I've even used liquids since they were black and did a unit last week that used liquid/fabric...strictly because of a timing issue. 

My background is to show up on a job and use whatever is there on the pallets, so I've used a lot of different things and brands....thus not a lot of brand loyalty. Some gadgets speed things up sometimes, others no difference, others slow ya down and/or make it harder.

I do what I do and comment here and there mostly because of sometimes there's a tone of 'unless one uses this manufacturer/item, it'll fail'. This trade has turned into being manufacturer driven, and therefore, a lot of the new people in it just repeat what the marketing slogans are. Widgets people buy are a replacement for knowledge and experience a lot of times. People spend a lot of time and energy chasing those new fishing lures instead of just learning how to fish.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

I have no brand loyalty. I like a few different brand. But I guarantee I can get a cleaner finish faster using my method over yours. I guarantee I'll have zero haze. I use them because they make a huge difference in time and final product. If you don't know how to use them to your advantage don't for a minute think there is a lack there of.


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## CO762 (Feb 22, 2010)

TNTSERVICES said:


> But I guarantee I can get a cleaner finish faster using my method over yours. I guarantee I'll have zero haze.


Rob, you're such a dork sometimes.  I rarely have had a problem with haze, but when I did, it was a simple, easy remedy. As far as leaving a high glossy finish, rarely is that required in new const/commercial because the building will go on after you're gone, then they'll bring in a bunch of mexicans to clean everything up when everyone is punched out and done. But the times when a higher initial finish is asked for, that also is a simple remedy.

There are "tips and tricks" I don't share as these were what separated us from others a lot of times, they helped us with our speed and efficiency and that's why we got the jobs and that's how we could make money doing the jobs that others often could get, but not make any money doing. One of the reasons I rarely tell someone how to do something. One of them. But I do stick tidbits in now and then.....


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

CO762 said:


> Rob, you're such a dork sometimes.


I'm a dork all of the time.


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