# Fall protection for gutter installers



## AAA Gutter

I'm a little confused about fall protection when installing gutters.

Are my guys required to be tied off when they are on ladders installing, or only if they are on the roof. I am talking about 2-story buildings.

I want to be safe but I also want to be able to get the job done.


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## BBS

Hello Gutterman,

No safety harness is required while working on ladders if you are staying within the boundries of the ladder.If your belt buckle is outside the rungs of the ladder you are over extending.It is always better to worry about their safety instead of OSHA requirements.Besides OSHA requirements are only mininum standards.


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## jonbon

I've had to kick gutter installers off my job before because they would refuse/forget to wear their safety harnesses.

There's two main issues with me when your guys are working on a roof.

1. As the above poster said, why risk the safety of your guys? I know you believe they're really good and I believe they're really good but all it takes is one false move. And one false move when you're that high up can be fatal. Most accidents in construction are fall related so the odds aren't on your side. A lot of times I see these guys hanging over the edge of a roof with no protection. Makes me sick.

2. You are easily visable to onlookers or main roads/highways that pass by the job site. All it takes is a phone call to OSHA and not only are they writing up $1,000 fines per infraction on your guys but now they're looking at the entire job site for safety issues. Not a good way to make an impression on your customer you want future business from.

As far as HOW you implement your fall protection system. Well that's up to you. Just like anything there's a million different ways to do it and it really depends on the job/scope of work/etc. I could tell you how I'd do it but that may not be the best solution for the job you're doing. For instance, on the above job mentioned they anchored off to some roof gables. But there may not be any gables at the job you're working. A less desirable approach that I've seen used is the installer throwing the rope over the entire building and anchoring it to the ground on one side. He then would limit his installers to the side opposite anchor and then switch anchor positions to do the other side. Again.. not the best solution but I suppose it's better than nothing. If you go to a contractor supply shop I've seen "roof compliance in a bucket" where they sell an "anchor/harness/lanyard/rope grab/50' rope" all in a bucket.

I would ask other installers/roofers on what they use to be compliant so you can get a better feel. 

You can hope your chances are good (and I'm sure they are) that you'll never have an incident where one of your guys falls from the roof. But on the off chance they do you're going to not only be held liable and potentially lose a lot of money but you're going to ruin the reputation you have. When we look at contractors we look at safety and how many incidents they've had. If we come to you and ask "How are you going to keep your guys safe" and you have a plan and solution already in place and thought up you will look a lot more professional and will put our minds at ease.

If you're working with a GC it's in their best interest to work with you. If they're a good GC they'll have a good safety plan setup. Maybe they already have anchors in place at the roof for other trades and it's just a matter of scheduling?


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## Aiken Colon

BBS said:


> Hello Gutterman,
> 
> No safety harness is required while working on ladders if you are staying within the boundries of the ladder.If your belt buckle is outside the rungs of the ladder you are over extending.It is always better to worry about their safety instead of OSHA requirements.Besides OSHA requirements are only mininum standards.


This is not true. OP please do not take this advice it will lead you in to problems. Well at the least the ladder part. He is very correct about worrying about worker safety. OSHA is of great importance as well though.

JJ

doh sorry didn't realize this post was from April.


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## AAA Gutter

jonbon said:


> I've had to kick gutter installers off my job before because they would refuse/forget to wear their safety harnesses.
> 
> There's two main issues with me when your guys are working on a roof.
> 
> 1. As the above poster said, why risk the safety of your guys? I know you believe they're really good and I believe they're really good but all it takes is one false move. And one false move when you're that high up can be fatal. Most accidents in construction are fall related so the odds aren't on your side. A lot of times I see these guys hanging over the edge of a roof with no protection. Makes me sick.
> 
> 2. You are easily visable to onlookers or main roads/highways that pass by the job site. All it takes is a phone call to OSHA and not only are they writing up $1,000 fines per infraction on your guys but now they're looking at the entire job site for safety issues. Not a good way to make an impression on your customer you want future business from.
> 
> As far as HOW you implement your fall protection system. Well that's up to you. Just like anything there's a million different ways to do it and it really depends on the job/scope of work/etc. I could tell you how I'd do it but that may not be the best solution for the job you're doing. For instance, on the above job mentioned they anchored off to some roof gables. But there may not be any gables at the job you're working. A less desirable approach that I've seen used is the installer throwing the rope over the entire building and anchoring it to the ground on one side. He then would limit his installers to the side opposite anchor and then switch anchor positions to do the other side. Again.. not the best solution but I suppose it's better than nothing. If you go to a contractor supply shop I've seen "roof compliance in a bucket" where they sell an "anchor/harness/lanyard/rope grab/50' rope" all in a bucket.
> 
> I would ask other installers/roofers on what they use to be compliant so you can get a better feel.
> 
> You can hope your chances are good (and I'm sure they are) that you'll never have an incident where one of your guys falls from the roof. But on the off chance they do you're going to not only be held liable and potentially lose a lot of money but you're going to ruin the reputation you have. When we look at contractors we look at safety and how many incidents they've had. If we come to you and ask "How are you going to keep your guys safe" and you have a plan and solution already in place and thought up you will look a lot more professional and will put our minds at ease.
> 
> If you're working with a GC it's in their best interest to work with you. If they're a good GC they'll have a good safety plan setup. Maybe they already have anchors in place at the roof for other trades and it's just a matter of scheduling?


Jonbon,

I appreciate your advice, however my original question was about ladders. I understand the safety requirements while on top of a roof.

My question is: do my guys need to wear safety harnesses if they stay on the ladder and not venture onto the roof itself? 

Climbing up and down a ladder wearing the harness can be dangerous, if they get hung up while carrying gutter and/or tools up and down the ladder.


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## swantucky

AAA Gutter said:


> Jonbon,
> 
> I appreciate your advice, however my original question was about ladders. I understand the safety requirements while on top of a roof.
> 
> My question is: do my guys need to wear safety harnesses if they stay on the ladder and not venture onto the roof itself?
> No as long as the ladder is set up properly.
> 
> Climbing up and down a ladder wearing the harness can be dangerous, if they get hung up while carrying gutter and/or tools up and down the ladder.
> I tried to post the OSHA link that spoke about carrying a load up a ladder, I do not have enough posts to do so. Anyway be very careful having your guys haul anything up the ladder. The standard is very unclear as to what is a violation. They use the term "cumbersome" which could mean about anything.


I give up....


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## Aiken Colon

Here are the OSHA links that swantucky referred to. Also keep in mind a load cannot exceed the ladder weight limits also.

The complete page

http://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owadisp.show_document?p_table=STANDARDS&p_id=10839

Highlights off that page:

*1926.1053(b)(3)* 
Ladders shall not be loaded beyond the maximum intended load for which they were built, nor beyond their manufacturer's rated capacity.​*1926.1053(b)(22)* 
An employee shall not carry any object or load that could cause the employee to lose balance and fall. 

JJ​


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