# Elmers or Bondo/Epoxy



## Pray4Surf (May 5, 2013)

I'm starting an exterior project in coming weeks on a house built circa 1910. The emphasis on this project is on making the siding look as smooth as possible without stripping or replacing boards.
The HO will not consider replacing the siding so that's not an option.
After sanding down the blistered areas the surfaces will be very uneven and I'm left with Elmers or Bondo as my options.
I've never used Bondo on a project this big so I'm wondering if Elmers is even an option. 

Also, the last painter was fired a few months ago for not sanding and prepping enough. smh

I'll be using Zinzer Alkyd cover stain and top coating with BM Regal Select low luster.


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## KennMacMoragh (Sep 16, 2008)

Bondo. What kind of Elmer's are you considering? I wouldn't even take the job. You can't sand and fill every board on a house, it would just be cheaper to replace. That's why the last painter was fired, he knew you could only go so far before its more feasible to replace. I take it someone tried pressure washing before and made all the marks?


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## Pray4Surf (May 5, 2013)

Kenn, I've used Elmers Int/Ex wood filler in the past on small sections of siding just never on an entire house which basically is what this would be.
I'm most likely going to use bondo but just wondered if there was something new on the market that i'm not familiar with.
I've been lurking on these forums quite a bit and there's a lot of knowledge and experience on here so I just wanted to hear others input.

The explanation I got from the Architect and GC was that the HO wanted to preserve the front, left and right side of the house's original clapboards. There is an extensive addition built onto the rear of the house along with a 4 car garage. Go figure.
I've learned not to question peoples reasons for doing things, especially the rich ones.

The previous painters was fired by the GC after the architect stopped by to check on painters progress and also to address concerns from the HO on lack of prep. When questioned about the rough appearance of the siding, the painter told the architect that he thought it looked good. 
That same day the architect called the GC and the painter was relieved of his duties on that site and two others he had started. 
Mind you the HO is not stingy by any stretch and the painter was being paid a lot of money for this project. 
Apparently this was his 5th strike and the architect was going to fire the builder if he'd didn't replace the painter immediately. 
I'm not a fan of taking over projects once a sub has been fired but most of what I saw was pretty egregious and the painter left the GC with no options.


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## Railman (Jan 19, 2008)

I've had good results with using Minwax wood hardener, followed up with Bondo. The wood hardener soaks deep into the rotten/soft wood, & makes the bondo adhere even better. The minwax filler kit product looks, smells, & acts exactly like Bondo, but you can buy a gallon of Bondo for what pint of Minwax costs. http://www.minwax.com/wood-products...ood-hardener?gclid=CMLvhsKh_7YCFYMWMgodKRkAHQ
After using the bondo, I like to do a coat of hardener over the bondo to give better adhesion to the paint. I've used the hardener & Bondo over masonite stuccato, masonite garage doors, pine, & Hardie board on my personal home over a period of 12 years or so with great results.
I see the results every day.
Joe


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

I hope you are hourly on this one...


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## Pray4Surf (May 5, 2013)

Inner10 said:


> I hope you are hourly on this one...


lol, I wish. My OSF (oh **** factor) is 30% on this project just to cover my ass. Although I don't think it's going to happen, if I lose a little I'm ok with it. I'm just stoked to be working with a builder that stays busy year round. If I'm way off on labor, whatever I may lose now I'll more than make up for with a long term relationship. 
With the competitive nature of this industry and the state of our economy I'm blown away at why the previous painter would poison his golden goose. 
I had a couple of rough winters in 07 and 08. I never want to go through that again. :no:


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## KennMacMoragh (Sep 16, 2008)

Pray4Surf said:


> The explanation I got from the Architect and GC was that the HO wanted to preserve the front, left and right side of the house's original clapboards. There is an extensive addition built onto the rear of the house along with a 4 car garage. Go figure.
> I've learned not to question peoples reasons for doing things, especially the rich ones.


You buy into that? There's no reason to preserve siding, it can be replaced with something equal or better just fine. From what they are saying it sounds like they want to take you for a ride and looking for someone gullible enough to take the loss. 

There's no reason to take a job for cheap so you can "get on with that builder". Which sounds like that's what you have in mind. If they don't want to pay you what you're worth now, do you think they will later? 

The kind of filler you use should be the least of your worries. How long do you think it will take a guy to prep one board to their satisfaction? If they're not using flat paint then it's got to be preped basically perfect, or every ding is going to show up. Half hour to an hour to prep one board? I would include the time it takes with appropriate mark up plus 10% profit and give him a ball park price. If he cringes then don't even mess with him.

Work is starting to get busy. I'm busier than I've ever been. There's no reason to get started with a builder or architect trying to short all their subs. Find some decent clients, there are plenty available right now.


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## Rio (Oct 13, 2009)

There's a lot of really good points made up above, but if you do push forward make sure that everyone is on board with what 'completely smooth' means; do a test strip up to the agreed upon standard and see how long it takes to perform the work. That should give you a guideline.

A possible alternative to trying to fill in many areas might be to use a heat gun and strip the paint off the siding. Maybe you can upsell your client to this method.

If you go the bondo route be careful when working with it or other similar fillers for prolonged periods of time. I built up a sensitivity to it and what I think are other polyester resins and if I get near even the fumes now for just a minute break out in hives as well as having a lot of other very unpleasant reactions. Wear long sleeves, lots of throwaway gloves, face protection, and a good quality respirator. Be sure and factor in the added time it takes to work in such a manner.


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## Pray4Surf (May 5, 2013)

Kenn, I appreciate what you're saying but I met separately with the HO and she's the one who was insistent on not replacing the siding. 
I was very clear with her about what to expect and that under no circumstance would the finished product look like new siding. 

As far as pricing is concerned I've miscalculated labor in the past but I've never taken a job for less than it was worth just to get "in". My pricing is in line with other painting outfits in my area, $40/hour per painter. 
My difficulties in the past were due to not aggressively marketing my business. I'm always busy April through early December. It's the other 3.5 months that work becomes sporadic.

Rio, thanks for the heads up.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

How old is the house? I guess you checked into lead before you said you could do it. That's a awful lot of sanding so is gonna put you way over what RRP allow before needing to be certified.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

I wouldn't give 2 cents for a Bondo fairing job on wood - it may look good at first, but Bondo is not a fairing compound.

My opinion, and it's a very definite opinion is if the HO wants to keep the original boards (I know people who insist), all the clapboards come off, edges cleaned up, primed, and they get flipped and put back up. The back side of old clapboards are almost always bare, so you have a good surface to start from. There is no practical way to get the front surface of those boards to look like new. 

You can use epoxy fairing compounds, but who really wants to do that?


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## Caslon (Dec 15, 2007)

You can benefit both the owner and yourself if you give them longevity over appearance. Patches tend to break out or weaken over time, not to mention it's a lot of work to make them look unnoticeable.

If the paint layers aren't too thick, how about take some time feathering back trouble areas with a 5" disk sander? A few 5" paper discs attached and tear off each as they wear. Feather all areas well. Wash briefly and then spot prime with a quality latex primer/sealer. Apply an elastomeric over the prepped areas with a suitable sized brush. "SHUR-STIK Permanent Patch 101" is sold in gallon containers and brushes on well, easier than DAPS elastomeric. Finish coat with exterior latex.


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## VinylHanger (Jul 14, 2011)

Your only real option is a Festool RO 150, a big stack of discs and a HEPA vac, plus all the RRP gear that goes with it. Then a lot of work filling the worst areas with Crackshot, or your choice of filler. Or a version of that scenario. Or flip the boards, which would look great unless they are a dadoed board.

No matter what you do, make sure the owner knows there will be a lot of character left. The test patch is a no brainer. Pick the worst area and make that your end point. And charge a lot.


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## Pray4Surf (May 5, 2013)

BCConstruction said:


> How old is the house? I guess you checked into lead before you said you could do it. That's a awful lot of sanding so is gonna put you way over what RRP allow before needing to be certified.


I'm certified and lead safe practices is used more times than not. Going to have to erect a vertical containment barrier on two sides of the house. 

Thanks for all the responses.


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## painterman (Feb 5, 2005)

Using any type of filler to level that mess out is a total waste of time.It will fail and there will be a lot of finger pointing when it does. Just sand the heck out of it and spray on some peel bond real heavy,top coat with any good acrylic of your choice. Done... go home.


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## Big Shoe (Jun 16, 2008)

Looks like you're going to try to polish a turd. As we say. :whistling






Or...........Run Forest! Run!


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## GCTony (Oct 26, 2012)

Like some others have said, I don't know of any filler that will hold up, esp. bondo. It's not ment to flex, expand and contract with the wood fibers. I'm not an expert but I have some experience building wooden boats as a hobby. You never use anything other than epoxy and thickening materials (to make putty) that are formulated to expand and contract.

I would sugest before getting into this too deep is to do a sample section somewhere and have the HO approve the methods before you proceed.


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