# ? wrong w/ ill mexicans?



## farrellpainting (Feb 24, 2007)

wackman said:


> I think every single one of the immigrants, legal and illegal, will be assimilated and be no different than us within two generations of entering the country.
> 
> I firmly believe everyone on the planet, at there deepest roots, is driven by greed and self preservation, with principles as a luxury.
> 
> We just need to change the system to force everyone to contribute to the system.





VitoFromNJ said:


> Why dont I hear complaints about the Polish, Brazilians, and the Portugese, the way I do about the Spanish speaking people from Mexico, C. America and S. America?


wackman, thats wack man!do you really believe that, i would asy most but not all!

i dont know much about other illegal ethnicitys, but the mex's are the highest volume in the trade biz.that my take vito

other than them not paying taxes, i dont see what the real problem is with them bustin their azzes here?they dont eat up ss, they dont collect unemploye, welfare, and other civil services like a good % of fat lazy addict americans do, and they spend their hard earned money here to simply support a fam!is the small % of unpaid taxes on their part extremely detrimental to our economy?all they want to do is work and they appreciate the opportunity. i dont understand the REALITY why they are so bad?

i wrote this before i got to read roofwiz's post, i think he's got a good point!
the legal american scum tractors that take advantage of their not having credentials are really worse than they are!thanks!


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## roofwiz74 (Oct 27, 2006)

i got a good point?let me get my calender...


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## farrellpainting (Feb 24, 2007)

funny wiz! im 23 and i just started contracting last year, so im a little behind you guys, i used to just go along with f the f'in mexicans, until that thread about "should i learn spanish" put me in the place to actually make an honest judgement about them. ill try not to voice my playground politics here. thanks for your input though!


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## Rich Wozny (Aug 18, 2005)

roofwiz74 said:


> who cares...go to work.I really don't care.we were all illegals at one point in time.if you do good work people will pay you for it.
> I have met many really good guys that were illegals,sucks for them cuz there are plenty here that shouldn't be.
> the problem isn't the illegal guys it the asswipes hiring them for nothing.if they paid them a decent wage they would charge a reasonable price and nobody would be affected.well accept the lazy people who would rather find a reason than go and do.


We were all illegals at one point in time? 

Man what kind of dope are you doing?

Both sets of my grandparents came here legally from Europe, through Ellis Island in New York/New Jersey.

Anybody who knowingly hires an illegal and pays them $hit or top dollar should be deported with them back to their f-in home country.


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## roofwiz74 (Oct 27, 2006)

good god,you need to chill.maybe I'll share some of my good dope.
you don't think that the white man is an illegal on this land?I don't hire illegals...or anyone for that matter.but just cuz they want to make a better life for their family(like your proud ancestors)I don't see why they should be hated.they are coming here just like everyone else that is here did..at one point in time or another.
lets try not to get into a history lesson (I'd fail)but see that it's not the illegals fault.there wouldn't be a problem if OUR contractors didn't pay them crap.which lets them lowball,still make a killing,and ...well you know the rest.
how are you gonna blame a guy for doing what he can?you would


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## farrellpainting (Feb 24, 2007)

woz, i somewhat agree with you, but try to look at the big picture. yeah i suppose its not fair that they just run into our country, but i think that there affect on America is minimal. look at george w.,scandalous politicians, gas/ oil co.s, pharmaceutical co.s,fat lazy adults that breast feed off of civil service's etc...etc...
i didnt have to take any test to stay here! sure its not fair to our immigrant great grand parents, but neither was slavery to Africans but we abolished that and they have got to be the laziest of all, yeah you did just read that! red neck kkk white trash is a close second or maybe theyre in first who knows?!i dont see why we cant just cut them some slack and open the fence and have them sign some damn papers?i know thats far fetched, but i just dont understand the problem?

just to cover my tracks about the nonsense slavery comparison, what i am trying to say is that not every one gets treated fairly, but there should come a time when some steps up to the plate and fixes it,


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## roofwiz74 (Oct 27, 2006)

you lost me there my friend.
FOCUS
the dope thing was a joke.


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## farrellpainting (Feb 24, 2007)

now im lost, i thought you were repliing to woz? i didnt take any offense to the dope joke or anything else you said, not at all!
actually if you want to send me some id be happy to give you my addy!lol
i think you thought that i was woz, maybe? its gettin late!
yeah i got it now you mistook me for Woz the painter above.
i gotta go!


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## roofwiz74 (Oct 27, 2006)

yeah,went from illegals to kkk and everything...strayed a bit dontcha think?

I've got a house of sick kids,no sleep for me.good news is no work,or was that the bad news.


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## evansbrothers (Mar 3, 2007)

*from the source*

Out of curiousity, I thought I'd ask my subcontractor's workers (through an interpreter of course) about some of the topics brought up. These answers are condensed from a group of about 8 Hispanic guys during their lunch break. 

Q: Do you pay taxes? A: (laughter)

Q: Do you want to become US citizens? A: Probably not. We send most of the money we make back to our families in (fill in the blank) and we already get all the benefits of being a citezen without the problems. 

Q: Problems? A: Yeah, like taxes or licenses or maybe being drafted. 

Q: You mean you wouldn't want to help to defend this country if it ever came to that? A: (laughter) That's for Americanos. You guys make all the problems, make other countries mad at you. 

Q: You don't like our policies or people yet you come here in droves. Because? A: Because no one wants to do any hard work here. It's a gold mine for us. Look at the fat people who own this house. 

Q: Why don't you, as a people, try to reform your own country's government? Remove the corruption, make it a economically feasible nation? You have ample marketable natural resources and you obviously have an extensive labor force. A: Because we'd get shot. (laughter) And it's easier to just come to the US.

So, there you have it.


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## dirt diggler (May 14, 2006)

pretty insightful Evans

thanks for bringing that up


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## Forry (Feb 12, 2007)

Huh.... gotta think about all that.


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## thom (Nov 3, 2006)

The way I see it, the taxes issue is a non-starter, at least in my state. You've got to be a licensed contractor, and you've got to have workmens comp. If you are licensed and have workmens comp, you also are in this country legally. An illegal cannot get licensed.

Taxes is a separate issue. Any employer can break the law by not withholding taxes. This is not a Mexican/American issue, its an issue of following the law. If the employees aren't paying taxes, their employer is breaking the law by not withholding. Prosecute him. Make him pay. That's the way the law works.

It wouldn't surprise me if many of those who think they aren't paying taxes really are. Their employer withholds, they cash the checks and never bother to file a tax return. This would be especially true if they didn't speak english. They wouldn't understand the pay stub, the withholding taxes, or the fact that they actually might get a refund if they filed.

If they are here illegally, they probably don't know our system, don't understand how it works, and don't want to interact with anyone who could explain it to them.

We regularly hear on the news of major companies getting raided by immigration. Those companies are withholding taxes, including social security and medicare. Because the SS#'s don't belong to the illegals who use them, they are not getting any credit for their contributions. That leaves more money in the pot that will, in a very small way, cover some of the SS shortfall.

Not filing a tax return is a lot different than not paying taxes.


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## wackman (Nov 14, 2005)

evansbrothers said:


> Out of curiousity, I thought I'd ask my subcontractor's workers (through an interpreter of course) about some of the topics brought up. These answers are condensed from a group of about 8 Hispanic guys during their lunch break.
> 
> Q: Do you pay taxes? A: (laughter)
> 
> ...


That definitely gets me peeved...but really, if I was in their shoes, I'd do it too. 

Greed and self preservation.

We just need to fugure out a way to change the system so no one, not the contractors that hire them or the illegals themselves, can take take advantage of the system without also contributing to it.

Someone said that he didn't think it was all that bad, that they aren't using up S.S. or welfare...well that's true, but who do you think pays for all the infrastructure that they *do* use? Who pays for the roads that they drive to work on? The street lights they use to see that road? The fire department, police, sewers, parks, drinkable running water, sidewalks, river clean up, etc... Not to mention all the free government programs that they do get?

Something has to change.


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## wackman (Nov 14, 2005)

thom said:


> It wouldn't surprise me if many of those who think they aren't paying taxes really are.
> 
> We regularly hear on the news of major companies getting raided by immigration. Those companies are withholding taxes, including social security and medicare. Because the SS#'s don't belong to the illegals who use them, they are not getting any credit for their contributions. That leaves more money in the pot that will, in a very small way, cover some of the SS shortfall.
> 
> Not filing a tax return is a lot different than not paying taxes.


Good observation....I wonder how often that happens, that would definitely be good. You still gotta pay, but if you're not legal then you don't get anything back. Nice trade for getting to be here illegally.


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## tinner666 (Nov 3, 2004)

thom said:


> How would you know if they are legal or not? The law says you must accept a social security card as legal documentation as long as it looks real. You can't verify because there is no way to verify. This is the law that was established during the Regan administration. The congress (both houses democrat at the time) would not go along with proper documentation requirements because that would tend to disfavor hispanics whether or not they were citizens or legal aliens.




http://www.ssa.gov/employer/ssnv.htm


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## Mike Finley (Apr 28, 2004)

All I will say is it's obvious there are a lot of people here who don't pick up a newspaper or any source of information on a regular basis.

It's like a bunch of people living in a little valley and never realizing there is anything over the hill.


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## mistcoat (Mar 3, 2006)

VitoFromNJ said:


> Why dont I hear complaints about the Polish, Brazilians, and the Portugese, the way I do about the Spanish speaking people from Mexico, C. America and S. America?


First time poster from the UK. I knew a post like this would get me started.

You don't hear complaints about the Poles (polish) because they are all over here in the United Kindom ripping off the British customer/client, undercutting time-served decent tradesmen/women who offer a an outstanding service/job with guarantees, they sleep on the job to lower costs. The average British decorator working in London can earn between £200-£250 p/day. The Poles work for £200 p/week (I kid you not)! 
I finished decorating a Mews property behind Buckingham Palace last September that Poles were involved with originally. They ruined everything from the decking on the balcony, the plumbing and the painting etc. They wanted over £100k cash before starting and never came back to rectify.

Had a young labourer on site where work was running short in London late last year. He popped across the road to another site to ask for some work and was literally surrounded by seven Poles who threatened him with shovels and various tools and told to "Fnck Off, this is a Polish site."

What is it all coming too I ask?

C'est la vie!!!  

Mistcoat


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## lawndart (Dec 3, 2006)

If you don't think illegal workers are hurting you as a business owner in this industry. You're not very well informed IMO.


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## farrellpainting (Feb 24, 2007)

your a big help


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## dirt diggler (May 14, 2006)

lawndart said:


> If you don't think illegal workers are hurting you as a business owner in this industry. You're not very well informed IMO.


ok ... such a huge problem

or a problem to some degree



*how do we solve this problem?? *


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## lawndart (Dec 3, 2006)

dirt diggler said:


> ok ... such a huge problem
> 
> or a problem to some degree
> 
> ...


Don't knowingly hire illegal workers. It's very simple


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## dirt diggler (May 14, 2006)

lawndart said:


> Don't knowingly hire illegal workers. It's very simple


let's start the Association of Legitimate Contractors Against Illegals

ALCAL

i nominate myself Chairman

:thumbup: arty:


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## farrellpainting (Feb 24, 2007)

dirt, thats actually a very reasonable proposal, you should seriously found an association like that.with all the time we all spend on here discussing and complaining about the issue we seriously could have already established an association. thats the best idea! wow!

im most definiley on board!


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## farrellpainting (Feb 24, 2007)

i just researched on how to start an association, all that you technically need is 10 paid employee's, not exactly sure how much. and established by-laws. then you can present it to the state for a certificate. do we already have an association of this nature, if not we could all (workers too) benefit from such a thing! i think maybe a new thread is in order!

thats all you dirt!


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## dirt diggler (May 14, 2006)

farrellpainting said:


> i just researched on how to start an association, all that you technically need is 10 paid employee's, not exactly sure how much. and established by-laws. then you can present it to the state for a certificate. do we already have an association of this nature, if not we could all (workers too) benefit from such a thing! i think maybe a new thread is in order!
> 
> thats all you dirt!


I've always wanted a non-profit organization

hell, ive got one now:laughing: 

but you know - one i could wear a suit and tie to:laughing:

maybe have a meeting that involves me not talking to myself for once HAHAHHA

the young busty admins ...
the 10 AM Fed Ex deliveries
the limos ... the airplane trips ...
company vacations - tax deductible of course

and the coffee ....
yes ... the coffee



can you smell it??? 

hazlenut ... mmmm 

cream ...


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## farrellpainting (Feb 24, 2007)

dirt, thats what im talkin about, well to an extent , google- how to start an association. i read the html of the third hit. im dead serious about it i just thought you deserve the credit! if you dont want to pull it together ill try! the first thing we need is some self/nominations for people to run for president then have an election. it would be the real deal. do some research on it!we should all put our efforts together so that we can get back to charging reasonably, w/o the scum tractors even having a chance to do business against us!


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## THINKPAINTING (Feb 24, 2007)

thom said:


> How would you know if they are legal or not? The law says you must accept a social security card as legal documentation as long as it looks real. You can't verify because there is no way to verify. This is the law that was established during the Regan administration. The congress (both houses democrat at the time) would not go along with proper documentation requirements because that would tend to disfavor hispanics whether or not they were citizens or legal aliens.
> 
> On my houses many of the tradesmen are Mexican. They work for sub-contractors, many of whom are Mexican. The contractors are legal, licensed, and I don't know if they are personally citizens or not. Many even most of their employees speak no, or very little, english. I deal with the boss, the boss deals with them. If I really need to talk to someone who doesn't speak english, I call my wife on the cell, tell her what I need to communicate, and hand the phone to the guy I need to talk to.
> 
> ...


Are you a American? We are being invaded by Illegals in my state, not good for our ecomony at all. Come to this country the legal way, and then chase the american dream. Tell ya what , sreve our country in the armed forces first before ya cahse any dream ......:furious: I am gald I dont live in your area. God Bless America and Americans......


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## farrellpainting (Feb 24, 2007)

thinkpainting, so your onbord dirt's ALCAL?


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## sonny (Oct 4, 2006)

*Illegals - The Trades as we Know Them Will Be Gone*

Illegals - if they are not in your town now - wait 6 months - 1 year & guess what? Yep there they are. If the situation continues as present- the building trades will be all but dead for the American born tradesman in 10 years or less. I have been involved in the building trades for over 30 years. Check out what happened to the 2 Border Patrol Agents that where Railroaded down in Texas Copy & Paste this link to your browser - Sorry This Site does not allow Url LInks- So do a Google Search for Texas Border Patrol Agents - Compean & Ramos. After reading this atrocity do something! Call the White House- Comment # 202-456-1111 simply say - Pardon The Border Guards Now. You also can contact your Senator or Congressman by calling the Switch Board - 202-456-1414 Simply tell them your State & they will automatically connect you to your Senator & Congressman. White House Email Address for comments. I believe most of you will find the information about what happened to these Border Patrol Agents to be interesting reading & how are Agents are so limited in doing their jobs. May explain why so many ILLEGALS are here everywhere. There is a very strong Grass Roots Movement Sweeping Across America in regards To the ILLEGAL Situation. Its time for all Americans to get involved in this Just Cause - We haven't much time! 

Stay Well

Sonny


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## dirt diggler (May 14, 2006)

farrellpainting said:


> thinkpainting, so your onbord dirt's ALCAL?



Farrell ... all we need now are some crazy ALCAL hats and t-shirts


oh - coffee mugs

OH - stickers!!!!!!


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## evansbrothers (Mar 3, 2007)

How about *ALCOHOLIC *- Association of Legitimate Contractors Opposing Hispanic Or Latino Illegal Contractors? 

(just having some fun. I'm doing another Q&A today with the workers. I'll post results)


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## farrellpainting (Feb 24, 2007)

ha! hi mr HO im an alcoholic member, and im just wondering if youve seen any illegal mexicans working around here?


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## farmboy555 (Aug 13, 2006)

Well here's my 2 bit's worth. It all could be stopped pretty quick.

You get caught with a illegal working for you $25,000. fine automatic per illegal. The job & contractor is shut down until the fine is paid in full.

After a few Contractor's / Employer's are busted and pay the fine. I don't think the jobs will be here for them, so they stay at home.

I know that ACLU would never let that happen, they would send them money to help them across the border illegally.


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## woodmagman (Feb 17, 2007)

If is looks like crap, smells like crap, tastes like crap, guess what.........Your buisness and your society is a product of what you allow to happen in your back yard.


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