# Whatever happened to patience, common-sense, and basic personal-respect?



## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

pcplumber said:


> After reading these posts I can't believe some of you CT members were bagging on me last week. These are cynical views and this is the first stage of anger and aggression. It won't be long before you start doing what I do! Turn em' into a popsicle.
> 
> :laughing:
> 
> ...


Truth be told, there is way more supply than demand, and access to getting in touch with another ____ is available at the touch of a screen. The nature of plumbing service, and H.v.a.c. service is "right now". for better or worse


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## MTN REMODEL LLC (Sep 3, 2010)

flashheatingand said:


> Truth be told, there is way more supply than demand, and access to getting in touch with another ____ is available at the touch of a screen. The nature of plumbing service, and H.v.a.c. service is "right now". for better or worse


Not exonerating rudeness and lack of mutual respect and cooperativeness among/between our customers and us..... 

...but *FLASH* has a good point that some of the issues are no more than the functioning of a FREE MARKET.... which I think most of us respect.

7Delt has a signiture that may be applicable in some instances.... to the point that there is seldom one inocent and one guilty party... usually two guilty parties.

(I can hear, and have heard, legit customers have legit complaints about our industry also... it does exist?????)


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

99% of my customers want it "NOW". I designed my business to deliver just that. I deliver what they want and they pay accordingly.

The number one customer complaint, hands down, is that other contractors don't call back, don't show up on time, push people back for weeks and don't even answer calls. I use every one of those complaints as a competitive advantage. 

The "want it now" customers are my BIGGEST asset in pushing word of mouth. Those kind of customers built my company for me. They told me what they, as a group, wanted.....and I'm happy to deliver.


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## MTN REMODEL LLC (Sep 3, 2010)

Oconomowoc said:


> 99% of my customers want it "NOW". I designed my business to deliver just that. I deliver what they want and they pay accordingly.
> 
> The number one customer complaint, hands down, is that other contractors don't call back, don't show up on time, push people back for weeks and don't even answer calls. I use every one of those complaints as a competitive advantage.
> 
> The "want it now" customers are my BIGGEST asset in pushing word of mouth. Those kind of customers built my company for me. They told me what they, as a group, wanted.....and I'm happy to deliver.


GOOD POINT.... We are in the service business.... ie what does the customer want.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

When I started my business I knew that's what the customer really wanted. I knew they were demanding and I had a choice, either fight the customer or just deliver what they want. It really is that simple. I can't train customers and I have no interest in trying. For me and my business I need the customers last words to be.....

"Oh my gosh! That was fast! Thank you soo much for coming out here here that quick! I am definitely going to call you again"

And I hear those words every single day. It was difficult to achieve this, I worked hard to make that happen.


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## fast fred (Sep 26, 2008)

AtlanticWBConst said:


> Whatever happened to patience, common-sense, and basic personal-respect?
> 
> People seem to confuse what we do for work, with everything else that can be obtained very quickly, at the push of a button, or, home phoned-called-in and immediately answered = for "free"
> 
> ...


THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU

so nice I had to post it twice, you really summed up alot of what I have been feeling lately

it's been a very long summer, things have been off the hook since late march with no end in site

to this day I'll talk anyone out of being in business for themselves, it's the stupidest thing you can do

not to cry too much, but this week has been rough, it's only wed? it's been a struggle to nail two boards together for some reason, I'm so cooked, I'm getting frustrated by the simplest things, I can't get help to save my life, so I'm short handed, everyone thinks there is some guy sitting around looking for work, no one realizes I need skilled help or what skilled help is, I could even use a young kid with a great attitude and work ethic, but they don't exist anymore

I need a vacation, I'd love to just stay home and hang out but it doesn't work that way anymore because there is paper work to do, phone calls, meetings, the only way to stop it is to get away, but I can't do that right now, hoping to in late oct or nov. 

I shut a job down years ago when I was framing a house because I went on vacation for a week and the rest of the guys decided to take a week off too, winter was coming, the homeowner, contractor and everyone else was pissed at me because no one was working, nothing was happening............. some people just aren't allowed to relax I guess.


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## pcplumber (Oct 12, 2008)

*You are 100% right about wanting it now!*



Oconomowoc said:


> 99% of my customers want it "NOW". I designed my business to deliver just that. I deliver what they want and they pay accordingly.
> 
> The number one customer complaint, hands down, is that other contractors don't call back, don't show up on time, push people back for weeks and don't even answer calls. I use every one of those complaints as a competitive advantage.
> 
> The "want it now" customers are my BIGGEST asset in pushing word of mouth. Those kind of customers built my company for me. They told me what they, as a group, wanted.....and I'm happy to deliver.


Almost every complaint about my company on Yelp is about us being late and this is frustrating because it is absolutely impossible to call every customer to reschedule a job and it does not make our customer relationship better when we call because the customers are just as angry when appointments are re-scheduled.

I have many complaints on Yelp because we were as little as five minutes late and the customers were so angry we told them that we refused to give them service because of the way they were threatening and talking down to us because who wants to work for a customer that is that disrespectful and can't understand that contractor have to stop for red lights, gas, and maybe the last job took a few more minutes.

The customer's expectations are too high and I find it very difficult to apologize when customers I never did business with are screaming at me and asking what kind of a company am I running. I find it very difficult to proceed to their homes when they are threatening a complaint on Yelp or the BBB. I usually tell these people to take there business elsewhere (not in a nice way) and that is why I have many Yelp complaints.

Pushing service calls for weeks is not true for my company. We have the manpower and can do 100% of our service calls every day. The only problem we have is we may have to move jobs forward no less than 2 hours and this 2 hours is still a serious problem with almost every customer and the worse part is most of these people are home all day doing nothing.

I had one yesterday. The customer had a tankless water heater with a heat exchanger that was leaking for more than a year. I had an appointment at 10 a.m. and I was on time, but I didn't know the customer had the new heat exchanger that takes 2 hours to install. So, I told the customer I would send a certified technician to his home in 2 hours and he blew his top asking what kind of company am I running. I did a $15,000 job for this customer about 10 years ago, so he is familiar with my company. He is retired and has to use his dialysis machine almost every day. I almost told him to get someone else, but sent another technician in 2 hours.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

That's why the cable companies say "we'll arrive between 9:00 am & 3:00 pm"

Lol


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## Mrmac204 (Dec 27, 2006)

showing up on time is a huge advantage. I got a 7k crown moulding job two years back due to that. The "designers" carpenter had missed two meetings with the HO, so I got the call.

 that worked out great, and I got a nice referral from the client.

OTOH folks just don't seem to read the ad where it says "on site estimates only" ie: no phone estimates. It's usually some guy in a hurry and "well what's your price for ***xx I just need a quick estimate."

of course then there's the folks who call wanting some plumbing/wiring done.. sigh. I"M A TRIM GUY YOU DUMB S#$% ok I don't say that but sometimes I want to.

I had a lady call in July, she needed a quote on baseboard. I said no thanks, unless you will pay a fee of $50 when I show up. Well she was indignant about that. "no one else charges" fortunately I had recently organized my estimates, and I was able to quickly look her up. so I quoted her the two other times that I'd given her a price for jobs at other addresses. She said that wasn't me LOL yup, same ph# and name. Ok, bye now

I'm going this morning to a client's house to install basically 4' of base shoe. Waste of time? well no, they've given me a LOT of work this year, and a whole lot more to come, so I'm thinking that today is a pr day. And they make good coffee 

Most of the time folks are nice and they pay, it's pretty rare that things go sideways.


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## pcplumber (Oct 12, 2008)

*For a small shop!*



Mrmac204 said:


> showing up on time is a huge advantage. I got a 7k crown moulding job two years back due to that. The "designers" carpenter had missed two meetings with the HO, so I got the call.
> 
> that worked out great, and I got a nice referral from the client.
> 
> ...


For a small shop if you get only a few calls per day or maybe in a week. You should have absolutely no problems with being on time for appointments and you should be able to call every customer. But, try calling customers when you have to answer 150 to 200 phone calls per day and you are sending technicians to 30 to 60 homes every day. It doesn't matter how many people you have working the phones because humans make mistakes and consumers lack this understanding.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

Doing service work, it's very difficult to pinpoint an exact time. Too many things can go wrong on a job, and you can't leave in the middle, due to a previous engagement. That's one good thing about cell phones, it's easier to call someone with a ten minute heads up that you are on your way. Most of my customers have been very amicable.

I haven't had a problem with giving a ball park time frame, and giving them a heads up when running behind.


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## pcplumber (Oct 12, 2008)

*There is a major obstacle with changing appointments.*

I enjoyed doing business much better before we had cell phones.

Cell phones have changed the way people answer telephones in a strange way. Almost every day, I wonder how people survived so well without cell phones. Before cell phones I carried quarters in my truck and never had a problem contacting customers nor my employees. We had truck radios but employees were not always in their trucks and I still never had problems contacting people as much as we have today.

It seemed like in the old days I never had a problem calling a customer on the phone. You dialed the number and they answered. Today, almost every customer has no less than two phones; a cell and a house phone, but the strange thing is about 70% of the time I call customers they don't answer neither phone.

We have a busy shop and phones almost never stop ringing. We call a customer to move an appointment and most customers don't answer and we have to listen to a recording, or listen to music while other phones are ringing. This is a huge waste of our time and after we call and leave a message two things will happen. The customer is calling back at the same time we are listening to their recording, or the customer will call back several hours later and say they never got our message.

These are only some of the reasons we can't call customers every time to move an appointment and this results in bad reviews that are impossible to avoid.

This also happens about 5 times every week. We set an appointment and tell the customer we will be at their home between 9 and 12, and we tell the customer we will call when we are on our way and if they don't answer their phone we will not go to their home. We call the customer 5 times and they don't answer, so we don't want to travel 20 miles if they are not home. Then, the customer calls and tells us they were in the back yard and missed the calls. The customers almost always get mad because they can't understand that they caused us to miss their appointment, we have other appointments, and have to re-schedule.


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## flashheatingand (May 3, 2008)

I hear you about people not wanting to answer their phones anymore. I think the problem lies due to so many people trying to sell you something, so if the number isn't familiar....

I ask the customer is they do texting. More times than not, they do, and they are cool with texting when you are on your way. It's worked for me. Might work for your gang.


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

MTN REMODEL LLC said:


> (NOW truthfully, I do understand that there are dirtbag people that think they own you, and do not work cooperatively... just try not to ever contract them...
> 
> Just my thoughts
> 
> Best




I agree with this statement. One thing that is a hallmark of running a business is the ability to read people. In other words sort out those you initially meet and let your gut tell you if you want to work with them. It is true some will fall between the cracks and disclose their true identity after the contract is signed. This is where the way you carry / conduct your self will set the "theme" not allowing them to set it. The only way you can ever be treated as a door mat is if you lay down and let the people walk all over you. One needs to establish boundaries,explain them to clients if need be that do not intuitively grasp them and do not cave to unreasonable expectations.


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## CA & AZ Builder (Dec 22, 2009)

pcplumber said:


> Almost every complaint about my company on Yelp is about us being late and this is frustrating because it is absolutely impossible to call every customer to reschedule a job and it does not make our customer relationship better when we call because the customers are just as angry when appointments are re-scheduled.
> 
> I have many complaints on Yelp because we were as little as five minutes late and the customers were so angry we told them that we refused to give them service because of the way they were threatening and talking down to us because who wants to work for a customer that is that disrespectful and can't understand that contractor have to stop for red lights, gas, and maybe the last job took a few more minutes.
> 
> ...


pcplumber - I feel your frustrations, I read your posts and please don't get me started on this Sunday morning, which should be a day to recoup.

Yelp, Angie's List, Urrrrrrrrrrrrrr, etc. hell I get horrible reviews because our HIS visits the HO and either they "did not spend enough time with the HO" or spent too much time on the job visit" or "the estimate was too high they expected less" or "the level of detail of the FREE 3D kitchen design was not like they saw on a TV program", on and on.

They leave a horrible review simply because they did not like something about the salesman, too pushy, or not assertive enough, estimate high, refused to perform un-permitted work, did not like some suggestion, blah, blah, blah AND this review was written from a salesman first 30 minute visit with HO - no work has been performed, nothing to do with workmanship or quality just a bash and rant.

I have been contracting since 1978, literally tens of thousand of homes and projects, the face of the industry and the expectations of this generation is crazy!


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

adapt or die..pretty simple really..


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## svronthmve (Aug 3, 2008)

pcplumber said:


> I enjoyed doing business much better before we had cell phones.
> 
> Cell phones have changed the way people answer telephones in a strange way. Almost every day, I wonder how people survived so well without cell phones. Before cell phones I carried quarters in my truck and never had a problem contacting customers nor my employees. We had truck radios but employees were not always in their trucks and I still never had problems contacting people as much as we have today.
> 
> ...





CA & AZ Builder said:


> pcplumber - I feel your frustrations, I read your posts and please don't get me started on this Sunday morning, which should be a day to recoup.
> 
> Yelp, Angie's List, Urrrrrrrrrrrrrr, etc. hell I get horrible reviews because our HIS visits the HO and either they "did not spend enough time with the HO" or spent too much time on the job visit" or "the estimate was too high they expected less" or "the level of detail of the FREE 3D kitchen design was not like they saw on a TV program", on and on.
> 
> ...


You guys are getting the customers you deserve. I've read some other posts. 

But that's OK with me. You guys allow me to be the shining star to my customers!


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