# Franchising my remodeling company?



## louviermarcus (Dec 6, 2011)

My dad and I have managed to build a general remodeling company that is on pace for $2,000,000 in sales and profits around $450,000 this year. We own two locations in two counties and both generate about the same amount of revenue. We feel that we have the system down pact and would like to start exploring franchise opportunities. 

My question is: Why aren't there any general home remodeling company franchises? It seems like all I can find are niche franchises like bath, kitchen, outdoor, etc. 

I know virtually nothing in this area of business hence why I'm coming to you guys. This could be a really good idea or a really bad one. 

Thanks!


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## TxElectrician (May 21, 2008)

From looking at your website it appears you contract everything out, is that correct?


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

I've also been thinking of franchising so I'll be keeping an eye on this thread. One of the ideas I had for making it a little more appealing to a buyer would be that the percentage paid to the franchisee would go down a little (like maybe 1%) after 5 years, figuring that they have a better handle on the systems by then thus requiring less work/help/assistance from the franchisee. Possibly with another 1% drop at 10 years or 15 years, just something so they don't feel like they are stuck forever paying 4-10% (depending upon how it's set up).


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Case Remodeling and Handyman is a franchise


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

TxElectrician said:


> From looking at your website it appears you contract everything out, is that correct?


Probably.

When someone is interested in buying a franchise , in my experience, its for the systems.


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## louviermarcus (Dec 6, 2011)

Yes we sub everything out.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

I don't think it could work.


Most franchises are built on a system with set procedures. Think Subway. All food is the same.

Also, although two million is a lot, I can think of quite a few local companies who make 2 million look like pocket change.

How would you go about implementing this?

How do I get leads?

What marketing materials and training do you provide?

And a million other questions.


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## louviermarcus (Dec 6, 2011)

This is my idea.


Start only in surrounding Texas counties.
Start running our TV and radio ads in those counties (which have been very successful for us)
Provide them with our "sub screening process"
Provide them with our management structure 
Have a two week meeting laying out the details of our company and how we conduct business
For the first few years we help them with anything they need. Including making the first sell, finishing the first project, and any new problems that might arise during the remodeling process


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## TxElectrician (May 21, 2008)

good luck.


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## The Coastal Craftsman (Jun 29, 2009)

Unless you have a system no one else has avalible to them then you may as well forget. There's zero incentive for anyone to pay you for a franchise when you have no product to offer. Rebath have there's, bath fitter have theirs, pizza hut have theirs, starbucks has theirs etc etc. 

If you don't have this system then you Basicly asking a person for money for products and services they can get from a sub contractor local in their area already.


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## louviermarcus (Dec 6, 2011)

That is a very rough idea of what I have thought up. We really haven't sat down and worked out the kinks because we didn't know if it would be viable.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

I wouldnt buy a franchise, but I started from the bottom, no need. An insurance salesman or window or door salesman might be interested though.

Case Remodeling is a very successful franchise because of their systems. You have to live in an urban area to buy one though, from my understanding.


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## iggy (Mar 3, 2013)

If you are seriously contimplating this venture then here is a great resourse. 
http://www.ifranchisegroup.com/fran...chisability/?gclid=CKDY7pXor7YCFWFyQgodxhIAzg


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## carolinahandyma (Jan 6, 2006)

I think you have a great idea, and I would like to hear more. Franchising has a lot of appeal to those with money to invest. Look at what Case does, they have a very recognizable brand and the systems to go along with it.


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## skillman (Sep 23, 2011)

[QUOTE="Jaws"

Case Remodeling franchise .[/QUOTE]

Never heard of them . It's just so different in scope of work for remodeling in areas across America how can one fit all . If its one thing I can see it work but addition's to homes and like no .


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

2 mil is really not that much, have you made the top 500 list? 
Case is one of the few remodeling franchises that work, I think in 2011 they did 23mil.
They had a huge reputation before franchising, the whole family was well known in the industry also speaking at many Remodeling Show seminars for years.
I don't think it is as easy as you think, a lot of remodeling projects are sold based on a good relationship with the contractor not just a name.
Do some more research about Case and you will see what they have done.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

skillman said:


> Never heard of them . It's just so different in scope of work for remodeling in areas across America how can one fit all . If its one thing I can see it work but addition's to homes and like no .


I agree. I have no idea what they do or how they do it. They dont have a presence in my area.

Like I said, I am not that knowledgeable about it. Not my bag, I make my own systems.

Or wing it :whistling:laughing:


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## Metro M & L (Jun 3, 2009)

First question I would ask would be if you're system is so great and it can be done anywhere why don't you just continue to grow into surrounding markets and not have to share the pie with the franchisee.


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## john5mt (Jan 21, 2007)

I am with Metro on this....

First who are you going to sell your franchise to? The typical guy who is looking to get into running a remodel business is a young guy with a pickup truck and saw. Not someone with 150k in startup capital.

Second, why dont you focus that energy on expanding into more counties in your state and continue to grow your team and so each office in each county is self sufficient. To me if i was looking to buy a franchise that's what i would be looking for. A system that runs itself. Not a company that has 5-6 key people running everything well. Sure their are things to learn from those people, but if i cant purchase them i am not gaining anything by buying your franchise. Demonstrating the profitability of 20 independent offices in 20 different areas would make me less skeptical and more apt to buy. If you only show profitability in two adjoining counties you dont really have much to sell.


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## Roofcheck (Dec 27, 2011)

I think someone watched one too many episodes of undercover boss. 

Trying to get an idea of what kind of company OP has and his website is not opening up. Hmm. 

It is all about systems and exclusive products to build a franchise. You go out of town and see a Outback, McDonalds, ect one most likely already knows what to expect from such a franchisee. 

Construction is just difficult IMO as it has been said previously niche markets are the ones that work. 

There is a Roof Roof Franchise that I looked into awhile back. What you are buying into is a name and a brand- not a brand someone like myself could not build myself. That company being in Atlanta the bigger cities growing out from there seem to be on the move but we are 2000 miles away so here I don't think would. The instant Platinum Preferred is a nice feature to have when the doors first open, advertising 30,000 complete roofs is another. 

Just my 2 cents.


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## Roofcheck (Dec 27, 2011)

Metro M & L said:


> First question I would ask would be if you're system is so great and it can be done anywhere why don't you just continue to grow into surrounding markets and not have to share the pie with the franchisee.


True but it remains a win win for the Franchiser. What I mean is there is a buy in and build up name credibility completed by the blood and sweat of the franchisee and numbers are not met they can loose everything and the franchiser moves in to maintain and quite possibly resell to the next fool as they franchisee never really owns anything but limited rights.


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## CarpenterSFO (Dec 12, 2012)

...


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## Mavis Leonard (Mar 13, 2013)

Metro M & L said:


> First question I would ask would be if you're system is so great and it can be done anywhere why don't you just continue to grow into surrounding markets and not have to share the pie with the franchisee.


becaus he no want towork he wan to wear dokkers slaks an skim off other peopl work thy do to much of tht in the us today somthin for noting


work isonly as goodas th guy doin th actual wrk so a homeoner shld just eliminat midle man


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## Mavis Leonard (Mar 13, 2013)

Roofcheck said:


> True but it remains a win win for the Franchiser. What I mean is there is a buy in and build up name credibility completed by the blood and sweat of the franchisee and numbers are not met they can loose everything and the franchiser moves in to maintain and quite possibly resell to the next fool as they franchisee never really owns anything but limited rights.


remodling is crafsmanship not a damn samitch or bag o fries


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## CarpenterSFO (Dec 12, 2012)

Mavis Leonard said:


> becaus he no want towork he wan to wear dokkers slaks an skim off other peopl work thy do to much of tht in the us today somthin for noting
> 
> 
> work isonly as goodas th guy doin th actual wrk so a homeoner shld just eliminat midle man


I don't have a problem with someone trying to start a franchise business - it might not be the deal for me, but maybe he can make it work for his franchise owners. And if he does it right, they can deliver value to their customers.

Let's say, for example, that you target low- to middle-end bath and kitchen remodels, and put a system in place with particular finish suppliers. I could see a well-run franchise system delivering better value to home-owners than many of the contractors who are currently in that business.

As for wearing the dockers, I'd rather just stay in my pajamas and get money for nothing.:jester:


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

RobertCDF said:


> I've also been thinking of franchising so I'll be keeping an eye on this thread.
> 
> 
> > Like Archadeck?


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

RobertCDF-I've also been thinking of franchising so I'll be keeping an eye on this thread.

Like Archadeck?


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## Metro M & L (Jun 3, 2009)

Roofcheck said:


> True but it remains a win win for the Franchiser. What I mean is there is a buy in and build up name credibility completed by the blood and sweat of the franchisee and numbers are not met they can loose everything and the franchiser moves in to maintain and quite possibly resell to the next fool as they franchisee never really owns anything but limited rights.


Exactly. Years ago I spoke briefly with a franchise paint offer through home depot. Forget the name of the company. Their price point was much no lower 5k buy in and you had to buy all paint at home depot, at retail cost or maybe 5% below. Oh, they also wanted 30% of gross sales. Also you were responsible for maintaining in store marketing presence. For your money and loyalty you got to put a home depot decal on your truck. When I told them no, they switched their pitch from soft sell to hard close real quick. 

Point being this was a franchise company designed specifically to profit from the guy with a truck and a saw; or a paint brush in this case. If you want to franchise to tradesmen you need to drop your target price and increase the volume. It would quickly devolve from providing systems and branding to a con game perpetrated against less educated and naive tradesmen.


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

louviermarcus said:


> My dad and I have managed to build a general remodeling company that is on pace for $2,000,000 in sales and profits around $450,000 this year.
> 
> I know virtually nothing in this area of business hence why I'm coming to you guys. This could be a really good idea or a really bad one.
> 
> Thanks!


True net profit?

Personally I'd like to know how your system works in a larger area, like Houston, Dallas, Shreveport - before I'd even consider. Is it repeatable and verified repeatable or is your system's success oriented toward a more rural target market, like Brookshires Groceries? and still is it repeatable in areas like, Lake Charles, opelousas, Baton Rouge, Lufkin, Tyler. You did it once under your own power in your local area, how will that translate to a new region with new 'ownership'?


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## carolinahandyma (Jan 6, 2006)

Texas Wax said:


> True net profit?
> 
> Personally I'd like to know how your system works in a larger area, like Houston, Dallas, Shreveport - before I'd even consider. Is it repeatable and verified repeatable or is your system's success oriented toward a more rural target market, like Brookshires Groceries? and still is it repeatable in areas like, Lake Charles, opelousas, Baton Rouge, Lufkin, Tyler. You did it once under your own power in your local area, how will that translate to a new region with new 'ownership'?


Good points!


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## Shellbuilder (May 14, 2006)

louviermarcus said:


> That is a very rough idea of what I have thought up. We really haven't sat down and worked out the kinks because we didn't know if it would be viable.


From looking at your website (very hard to find) and your facebook page, it looks like you are starting off, not moving towards franchise.


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## Mavis Leonard (Mar 13, 2013)

Metro M & L said:


> Exactly. Years ago I spoke briefly with a franchise paint offer through home depot. Forget the name of the company. Their price point was much no lower 5k buy in and you had to buy all paint at home depot, at retail cost or maybe 5% below. Oh, they also wanted 30% of gross sales. Also you were responsible for maintaining in store marketing presence. For your money and loyalty you got to put a home depot decal on your truck. When I told them no, they switched their pitch from soft sell to hard close real quick.
> 
> Point being this was a franchise company designed specifically to profit from the guy with a truck and a saw; or a paint brush in this case. If you want to franchise to tradesmen you need to drop your target price and increase the volume. It would quickly devolve from providing systems and branding to a con game perpetrated against less educated and naive tradesmen.





dokker slaks wearin types who skim from th wrk of thos who laber my bos tll them topiss upa rope


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## skillman (Sep 23, 2011)

The problem if he tells people his system with out haven some contract he giving up on his business . Cause franchising he will have control of some sort . Sure tell me everything for free then go right up against his business model .


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## Mavis Leonard (Mar 13, 2013)

skillman said:


> The problem if he tells people his system with out haven some contract he giving up on his business . Cause franchising he will have control of some sort . Sure tell me everything for free then go right up against his business model .




nothin newundr the sun ereory remoding stuation is differnt itis jus a way for type to steel money no withou work


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## Shellbuilder (May 14, 2006)

Mavis Leonard said:


> nothin newundr the sun ereory remoding stuation is differnt itis jus a way for type to steel money no withou work


I dont really care what your problem is with getting knocked on the head or whatever. Use spellcheck and quit using your injury as an excuse to be a ****ing idiot here with your bigotry. You have no sympathy from me. I've experienced brain injury problems first hand, quit smoking weed and get with the program son.!!


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## CarpenterSFO (Dec 12, 2012)

Shellbuilder said:


> I dont really care what your problem is with getting knocked on the head or whatever. Use spellcheck and quit using your injury as an excuse to be a ****ing idiot here with your bigotry. You have no sympathy from me. I've experienced brain injury problems first hand, quit smoking weed and get with the program son.!!


I really don't care about the spelling but the bigotry stinks, Mavis.


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## jhark123 (Aug 26, 2008)

Does " type" count as a man who makes money with his mind as well as his body and has a keen interest on increasing wealth rather than enjoying temporary profits?

If so, count me in.


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## Shellbuilder (May 14, 2006)

jhark123 said:


> Does "type" count as a man who makes money with his mind as well as his body and has a keen interest on increasing wealth rather than enjoying temporary profits?
> 
> If so, count me in.


And you're a professional in the construction business?


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## Mavis Leonard (Mar 13, 2013)

CarpenterSFO said:


> I really don't care about the spelling but the bigotry stinks, Mavis.




imad my point the prob with country is tht too many wnt to tak an not offr anythin tagible in return lookat wall stree bail out nonsens too mny wan somthing fr nothing tak fromthe erners an offr nothin in retuurn it aint muchdiffren than welfare types an disabilty check takrs who cn really wrk tooo mny try to be clver types an not offr any actual produc or srvice in retrun take take take


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## jhark123 (Aug 26, 2008)

Shellbuilder said:


> And you're a professional in the construction business?


Haha, I also do land development and have one rental with plans for more.

Eta: I consider myself afflicted with a love of building, but I am not trying to cure it.


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

CarpenterSFO said:


> For some reason my wife has never liked the idea.:jester:


I wonder why... :whistling


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

Texas Wax said:


> Like Archadeck?


Along the same lines, we do a lot of things truly custom that can do well as systems in a franchise. 

I worked in a franchise construction and learned a lot about systems during that time.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

This would probably be a good thread to read if I could actually read it.


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## Shellbuilder (May 14, 2006)

Mavis Leonard said:


> i got idae for self clean bathrom everthin waterpoof work jus lika dishwasher close th dooradd sope and turn it on in 15 minutes yougots a santry claen batroom wood be prefec for comercial retials plces


Here is your free spell checker, please download it and use it.
http://www.iespell.com/


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## Youngndumb (Jan 22, 2013)

Ya I don't even bother reading what Mavis says id have to go down to my three year old level to read that. So horrible


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

Youngndumb said:


> Ya I don't even bother reading what Mavis says id have to go down to my three year old level to read that. So horrible


Don't insult the 3 year old...


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## KAP (Feb 19, 2011)

Mavis, just as an FYI when you are typing in a post, there is a spell-checker already there... anytime you see a squiggly red line, right-click on it and choose your word... think of it as a auto-texting tool... hope it makes it easier... Best of luck... 8^)

.
Franchising... I actually think there are a lot of guys in our industry that could benefit from franchising...

Franchises not only provide systems, but as part of the fee, they also generally provide advertising or advertising co-ops for brand-name recognition and lead generation...

1. Sales system
2. Accounting system
3. Business system
4. Marketing systems
5. Name recognition / extension of longevity (we've been in business since 19XX) for a new company...
6. Logo's, etc...
7. Marketing materials
8. Pricing 
9. Contracts
10. Best practices, Processes, techniques...
11. Standardized pricing for subs
12. Employee training & Policies
13. Support system
14. Exclusive products and/or supply lines
etc...

You of course can do all this yourself, but this forum is littered with guys struggling to do these very things all the time... more than half those things on the above list are not practiced by most guys... how many waste YEARS learning how to do it? You pay for it one way or another....

I knew a guy years ago named DJ Mills, who owned Dura-Oak out of Shreveport, LA... he owned that company for over 30 years, and he use to sell what he called a franship (franshise/dealership)... you pay him a $10-$12K one-time fee to get access to his system, products and use of the name... So since he started his company back in the 70's, and you were an extension of the Dura-Oak business, a new business could now advertise that their Dura-Oak company has been around since the 70's, and has had thousands of satisfied customers and their warranty for their products (they were primarily a refacing and bathroom company) was backed up by the parent company who was decades old... a lot of selling points there, and a big leg-up for someone starting out...

As part of the fee, he gave you the name, a sales system, a sales kit with samples, marketing, etc...

It was a great way for him to expand his door company (refacing) and expanded into baths... that was his goal, and the fee he charged helped off-set the costs in setting it all up... Last I heard he had hundreds across the country... but I think he closed shop on that and is now running a home energy company. 

There are lots of benefits to a franchise system... but if you are going to offer one, it has to be a tangible benefit IMHO, not a just a name and a fee...


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## cabinetsnj (Jun 10, 2012)

KAP said:


> Mavis, just as an FYI when you are typing in a post, there is a spell-checker already there... anytime you see a squiggly red line, right-click on it and choose your word... think of it as a auto-texting tool... hope it makes it easier... Best of luck... 8^)
> 
> .
> Franchising... I actually think there are a lot of guys in our industry that could benefit from franchising...
> ...


I don't see many people offering franchises for a one time fee today. Most require you to give them a percentage of your profits.


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

cabinetsnj said:


> I don't see many people offering franchises for a one time fee today. Most require you to give them a percentage of your profits.


Depends upon how it's setup. If all you get is a package of systems and rights to the name then a 1 time fee is probably better. Most offer constant updates, advertising, training and other expenses that continue past the initial buy in, in that case of course they're going to want a percentage of profit.


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## ZackyBundles (Dec 31, 2012)

Jaws said:


> You make your points without insults to others or you can get lost. Drop another racial slur and you get 86'd :thumbsup:


Lol where are the racial slurs I don't even understand this guy...I picture some Stallone looking guy who can't count past 9 cuz he cut off his finger


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## KAP (Feb 19, 2011)

cabinetsnj said:


> I don't see many people offering franchises for a one time fee today. Most require you to give them a percentage of your profits.


That was one of his selling points... it was a combination of a Franchise / Dealership that he called a "Franship"... 

Those that require a percentage are usually giving you something in return...


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

ZackyBundles said:


> Lol where are the racial slurs I don't even understand this guy...I picture some Stallone looking guy who can't count past 9 cuz he cut off his finger


They were deleted.

He had a brain injury.


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## cabinetsnj (Jun 10, 2012)

RobertCDF said:


> Depends upon how it's setup. If all you get is a package of systems and rights to the name then a 1 time fee is probably better. Most offer constant updates, advertising, training and other expenses that continue past the initial buy in, in that case of course they're going to want a percentage of profit.


I understand that, but people try to get as much money as possible out of franchising. Some franchises make you sell only their products or buy their materials.


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## KAP (Feb 19, 2011)

cabinetsnj said:


> I understand that, but people try to get as much money as possible out of franchising. Some franchises make you sell only their products or buy their materials.


Well they certainly aren't doing it to be your bestest buddy... :whistling


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

cabinetsnj said:


> I understand that, but people try to get as much money as possible out of franchising. Some franchises make you sell only their products or buy their materials.


I always though the entire point of *ANY* business was to make money...

Usually everything is clearly written in the agreement, the people always have a choice to NOT buy the franchise and go it alone. OR they can evaluate the agreement & contract to see if they think it will fit their needs and provide them with something of value.


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## BamBamm5144 (Jul 12, 2008)

RobertCDF said:


> I always though the entire point of ANY business was to make money...


Can you please tell that to 80% of the guys I bid against?


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## RobertCDF (Aug 18, 2005)

BamBamm5144 said:


> Can you please tell that to 80% of the guys I bid against?


No doubt... A few around here get it, that the company needs to make money beyond their salary, some think that just making a good salary for themselves is enough (no company profit), and some just want to make $20 hr...


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## CITY DECKS INC (Sep 4, 2012)

I think the 1/time fee for brand, set up marketing with fees for a short time until they get it together. There are a good builders but can’t get out there own way when it comes to making money. There just wrapped up in being an artist and not businessmen. Franchises are great thing the above in the industry. Construction I think is a harder to franchise then product rights / distribution etc. A lot variables to consider.


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## r3dko (Apr 16, 2013)

I can see where this model might be a bit tough to swallow for facets of the industry where the barrier of entry is limited to a Home Depot grab bag of tools and a beat up truck. I think a better direction for the franchise model would be a niche with high margins and an equally high cost of entry.


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## FrankSmith (Feb 21, 2013)

The biggest problem I see is building the relationships with the people you need to make a go of it in the new areas you move into. Once you have a good relationship with the right sub for each task things go fairly smooth. Even with that in place things can get a bit rocky. To start from scratch across the board sounds like a nightmare. If the person buying in already had the relationships it would work but something tells me that person will never participate. I think that is the difference between this industry and others. A restaurant does not rely on nearly as many outside entities. Having said all that I do think it could be done.


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