# RTC Tornado Leveling System



## Inner10

angus242 said:


> I like to use Mapei UltraContact when using the RLS.
> 
> "Ultracontact is a premium, polymer-modified, high-performance full-contact
> mortar. Its superior wet-out characteristics achieve outstanding transfer to the
> back of the tile and eliminate the need for back-buttering. Ultracontact is more
> fluid than traditional mortars, yet holds its ridges regardless of trowel size. It can
> be used in thin-set and medium-bed applications with all types of tile sizes."


Sounds like Laticrete Sure Set.

...but I like the medium bed...


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## PrecisionFloors

Interdasting. How's that mortar for hanging large format, Angus?


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## nhill2090

Best leveling system goes to"..........

Tls caps with rubi straps. Just trust me on that one. Tuscan straps are junk after using the rubi. And there cheaper


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## angus242

PrecisionFloors said:


> Interdasting. How's that mortar for hanging large format, Angus?


I like it. Doing some 12x24 right now with it on a floor.

Haven't used it for walls. I've been using Mapei Ultralite for showers. That's some crazy stuff too. Comes in 25lb bags but you get the same coverage as a 50lb bag. Weird


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## angus242

Inner10 said:


> Sounds like Laticrete Sure Set.
> 
> ...but I like the medium bed...


Sure Set is a medium bed.


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## Inner10

angus242 said:


> Sure Set is a medium bed.


So it is Angus....so it is....

In today's world thinsets are like ice cream, everyone makes a million different flavours with a million different fancy names. But in reality one could live a happy life consuming nothing but vanilla, chocolate and the occasional strawberry.

Decision making process for me is as follows:

- What do you have in stock

- What did Angus say is acceptable

- What's the cheapest that fit into the above two categories

Answer: 4XLT

Done.


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## angus242

:laughing:

Yeah, I've never had a single bad experience with Laticrete. However, their stuff just isn't in stock for the right price around me. That's why I use Mapei. Cannot beat the price either.

Me: Do you have some Ultraflex 2?
Floor & Decor Pro desk: Yes.
Me: Do you price match?
Floor & Decor Pro desk: Yes. What price are we matching? Our regular price is $16.88.
Me: $11.22
Floor & Decor Pro desk: What?
Me: Yes, $11.22. Here's a copy of my receipt from Daltile. 
Floor & Decor Pro desk: They must really like you.

Yes, thinsets have become like ice cream. But unless you try all the flavors, you don't know what's good. I think of Ultraflex 2 as vanilla. It's a great go-to. However, Ultralite is like some crazy Ben & Jerrys Hopped up on Hooch flavor. It's the weirdest thinset ever. But I really like it. Nothing like making a 25lb bag cover a 110 sq ft shower. Also, the Ultracontact is so much better to use than mixing Ultraflex 2 a bit watery. And finally, there's Adesilex P10. Won't use anything else for a backsplash. The nonsag stuff is the way to go. I don't think Ultraflex 2 would keep 2 sheets of toilet paper from sagging. Adesilex will hold any tile in place until _you_ move it. Comes in convenient 10lb bags.


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## angus242

Got my greasey little hands on these.


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## Inner10

I've been working on the renovation of rideau a little, the tile setting guys did about 70k square feet with UF2. But first they trowled on some light blue stuff, I think it was blue raspberry.


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## PrecisionFloors

Inner10 said:


> I've been working on the renovation of rideau a little, the tile setting guys did about 70k square feet with UF2. But first they trowled on some light blue stuff, I think it was blue raspberry.


Sounds like the Tec LiquiDam we used a couple of weeks ago. I even made the comment that it looked like blue raspberry kool aid. You never know until you taste it..


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## PrecisionFloors

angus242 said:


> I like it. Doing some 12x24 right now with it on a floor.
> 
> Haven't used it for walls. I've been using Mapei Ultralite for showers. That's some crazy stuff too. Comes in 25lb bags but you get the same coverage as a 50lb bag. Weird


Since you're giving away all of your thinset recipes - what do you prefer for glass? I like Laticrete Glass tile mortar.


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## Inner10

PrecisionFloors said:


> Sounds like the Tec LiquiDam we used a couple of weeks ago. I even made the comment that it looked like blue raspberry kool aid. You never know until you taste it..


It was a lighter baby blue, the Tec stuff looks pretty dark, but same idea.

They started with ride on tile rippers and Jack hammers, then they used grinding machines and pulse bac vac, then patched, painted on the blue raspberry then UF2.


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## angus242

PrecisionFloors said:


> Since you're giving away all of your thinset recipes - what do you prefer for glass? I like Laticrete Glass tile mortar.


Adesilex _is_ a thinset for glass. 90% of my splashes are either glass or stone. Adesilex is great for either. It's total overkill for ceramic but I started doing standard pricing so the cost of the Adesilex is included no matter what I'm installing.


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## Inner10

angus242 said:


> Adesilex is a thinset for glass. 90% of my splashes are either glass or stone. Adesilex is great for either. It's total overkill for ceramic but I started doing standard pricing so the cost of the Adesilex is included no matter what I'm installing.


What's that set ya back per bag?


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## Inner10

angus242 said:


> Adesilex is a thinset for glass. 90% of my splashes are either glass or stone. Adesilex is great for either. It's total overkill for ceramic but I started doing standard pricing so the cost of the Adesilex is included no matter what I'm installing.


Maybe one day you will see the light...grout, one step.


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## angus242

Inner10 said:


> What's that set ya back per bag?


I've been getting the 10lb bags for around $5.


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## angus242

Inner10 said:


> Maybe one day you will see the light...grout, one step.


QuartzLock is not one step approved.


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## Inner10

angus242 said:


> QuartzLock is not one step approved.


Permacolor baby!


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## angus242

Blah


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## Inner10

angus242 said:


> Blah


Only those as hardcore as Angus use QL2 on a backsplash.


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## PrecisionFloors

Inner10 said:


> Only those as hardcore as Angus use QL2 on a backsplash.


I use it on everything. Seriously. Well, I'll use Spectra Lock if they need the use of they the shower quickly.


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## charimon

here are a couple pics from a steam shower (with seating for 6) that i am working on at the moment. 12x 24 everywhere using 3n1 over schluter.


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## angus242

PrecisionFloors said:


> I use it on everything. Seriously. Well, I'll use Spectra Lock if they need the use of they the shower quickly.


Did you know that Bostik has produced a new formula of QL2 that is ready to go in 3 days? It's a limited supply right now but it's coming. It's called QuartzLock2 RapidCure.


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## angus242

charimon said:


> here are a couple pics from a steam shower (with seating for 6) that i am working on at the moment. 12x 24 everywhere using 3n1 over schluter.


Harbor Freight zip pole?


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## TNTRenovate

angus242 said:


> Harbor Freight zip pole?


I love those things. Got four in the truck right now.


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## angus242

Inner10 said:


> I know Angus loves to see questionable tile installations with the bare minimum, so I made him this video of my handy work:


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## Inner10

angus242 said:


> <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kpy2zMYmkoU">YouTube Link</a>


Nice one!

I wonder if the American quarter makes a difference.


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## angus242

Inner10 said:


> Nice one!
> 
> I wonder if the American quarter makes a difference.


Well we know it's worth less.


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## Inner10

angus242 said:


> Well we know it's worth less.


I should have slid a toonie accross.


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## PrecisionFloors

angus242 said:


> Did you know that Bostik has produced a new formula of QL2 that is ready to go in 3 days? It's a limited supply right now but it's coming. It's called QuartzLock2 RapidCure.


No I didn't. Because you haven't told me. Wtf man - you expect me to do my own research? You have a responsibility and an image to uphold. Now I know. And knowing is half the battle. Thanks for the info


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## angus242

Inner10 said:


> I should have slid a toonie accross.


Dammit Baxter, you know I don't speak Canadian.


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## angus242

PrecisionFloors said:


> No I didn't. Because you haven't told me. Wtf man - you expect me to do my own research? You have a responsibility and an image to uphold. Now I know. And knowing is half the battle. Thanks for the info


Holla


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## TNTRenovate

angus242 said:


> Holla


Nice grille Angus!


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## J.C.

I have a couple more questions. I think I'm going to go with an 1/4" grout joint. Can I use the 1/8" clips with a 1/4" joint?

Also, I was at the tile store the other day getting tile samples and I asked about grout. They have several different brands and types but they had recommended a cement sanded Mapei grout. I asked about quartzlock2 (which they also sell) since that seems to be a favorite around here and they still recommended the Mapei grout. Is Mapei good great or would I be better off going with the quartzlock? 

As always, thanks again!


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## Inner10

J.C. said:


> I have a couple more questions. I think I'm going to go with an 1/4" grout joint. Can I use the 1/8" clips with a 1/4" joint?
> 
> Also, I was at the tile store the other day getting tile samples and I asked about grout. They have several different brands and types but they had recommended a cement sanded Mapei grout. I asked about quartzlock2 (which they also sell) since that seems to be a favorite around here and they still recommended the Mapei grout. Is Mapei good great or would I be better off going with the quartzlock?
> 
> As always, thanks again!


You can, just use spacers in conjunction with the clips.


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## CarpenterSFO

Inner10 said:


> Only those as hardcore as Angus use QL2 on a backsplash.


Color me hardcore. Backsplashes get dirty.


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## CarpenterSFO

J.C. said:


> ...They have several different brands and types but they had recommended a cement sanded Mapei grout. I asked about quartzlock2 (which they also sell) since that seems to be a favorite around here and they still recommended the Mapei grout. Is Mapei good great or would I be better off going with the quartzlock?
> 
> As always, thanks again!


Mapei is good grout, for a cement grout. But why use a cement grout? For $100 more, your customer will get a shower, or a kitchen floor, or backsplash, or front hallway, in which the grout will not stain or require sealing. If someone expresses their plan to clean and re-seal their cement grout, point out that a single annual cleaning and re-sealing will probably cost more than the price difference for the grout. And no-one (except Tom's customers) ever does that work or pays to have the work done, and their tile will look like crap within a year.

Go with epoxy or urethane.

On a well-maintained commercial floor? Sure. On a saltillo patio with 1/2" grout joints, where QL or SL would cost $2000, sure, use cement.


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## CarpenterSFO

It drives me nuts that the guy in the tile aisle at Lowes knows more about leveling systems than the supposed pros at the tile suppliers. Ask someone at <your national tile or flooring company> about leveling systems and they'll hand you a bag of spacers.


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## PrecisionFloors

CarpenterSFO said:


> It drives me nuts that the guy in the tile aisle at Lowes knows more about leveling systems than the supposed pros at the tile suppliers. Ask someone at <your national tile or flooring company> about leveling systems and they'll hand you a bag of spacers.


My experience is that, the average tile guy's knowledge of new methods and materials is typically very behind. The tile trade seems to draw guys that get stuck in their ways and absolutely refuse to learn new things, even if you can prove on paper you have a better method. "I've been doing it this way for (insert #) of years and never had a callback!" Is heard in supply shops and distributors all over this country on a daily basis.

Sand and finish hardwood guys are a close second. I have no idea why anyone would actually choose to work harder instead of smarter and give away the benefit of better results but guys do. I've pretty much given up on attempting to educate someone unless asked.


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## Tech Dawg

jarvis design said:


> Tried out the Rubi leveling system today on some 12x24 tile being installed on 2 walls behind a free standing tub. Like others it recommended soaking the straps for 1/2 hour...done.
> 
> First off, I got 1/16 straps as that's all they had at my supplier. Came in a starter kit with 100 straps/caps and a tightening tool, which, btw, was missing the washer and nut and my supplier didn't have another one! Sent a guy to the hardware store to get them, which was annoying.
> 
> The first 2 caps that I went to tighten...snap! I got the hang of it after that but still managed to snap off a few more. I'll look to see if they have 1/8" available.
> 
> I will say I mixed up my first batch of 4XLT mortar a little thick....could that be why they snap so easy or is it just the fact they are 1/16"?


When I start a remodel I sit my bucket of straps in the garage and pour scolding hot water to soak. They stay there for days until its time to tile. I don't think a half hour is long enough in my experience.


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## Tech Dawg

Inner10 said:


> So it is Angus....so it is....
> 
> In today's world thinsets are like ice cream, everyone makes a million different flavours with a million different fancy names. But in reality one could live a happy life consuming nothing but vanilla, chocolate and the occasional strawberry.
> 
> Decision making process for me is as follows:
> 
> - What do you have in stock
> 
> - What did Angus say is acceptable
> 
> - What's the cheapest that fit into the above two categories
> 
> Answer: 4XLT
> 
> Done.


:laughing:

Sure Set is some good stuff. 3 in 1 like the 4xlt but its more like butter and maple syrup. .. its great for setting membranes with as well. 

I used it once on a basement floor setting thick/heavy 12x12 slate. Just to be sure, I picked the first couple up to verify coverage and that stuff morphs all over the place.


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## Xtrememtnbiker

Looks likes it's time to get the RLS for me. I'm excited to take tile installations to the next level of perfection. Do you guys buy online or at your local suppliers?


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## CarpenterSFO

Just got these today; we start setting tomorrow. I stand by the TLS.


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## Inner10

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> Looks likes it's time to get the RLS for me. I'm excited to take tile installations to the next level of perfection. Do you guys buy online or at your local suppliers?


I bought it locally at a stocking tile distributor and I paid a slight premium...but I'm old fashion like that.


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## CarpenterSFO

Inner10 said:


> I bought it locally at a stocking tile distributor and I paid a slight premium...but I'm old fashion like that.


Good luck to the OP finding a local distributor. What originally led me to the TLS was that they were sold by the only distributor stocking anything but the LASH, within 50 miles.


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## TNTRenovate

Tiletool.com

Just placed an order for this job last week.


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## Xtrememtnbiker

TNTSERVICES said:


> Tiletool.com Just placed an order for this job last week.


You got the RLS system off tile tools? I looked last night and couldn't find it. They had TLS, RTC, & MLT but no RLS.


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## TNTRenovate

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> You got the RLS system off tile tools? I looked last night and couldn't find it. They had TLS, RTC, & MLT but no RLS.


Sorry meant contractordirect.com. I had tiletools still on my clipboard when I sent that. Gotta start reading my posts better from my phone.


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## Xtrememtnbiker

TNTSERVICES said:


> Sorry meant contractordirect.com. I had tiletools still on my clipboard when I sent that. Gotta start reading my posts better from my phone.


Ok. I've got that site pulled up at home from looking around last night. Thanks for the info.


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## Inner10

CarpenterSFO said:


> Good luck to the OP finding a local distributor. What originally led me to the TLS was that they were sold by the only distributor stocking anything but the LASH, within 50 miles.


Yeah guess it depends on location, a place 10 min from my house keeps em in stock.


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## Xtrememtnbiker

So, 1/16 or 1/8? We pretty much use exclusively 1/8 spacers right now. Don't even have 1/16. The job I'll be using them on first is 12x24 in a 1/3rd offset pattern.


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## Inner10

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> So, 1/16 or 1/8? We pretty much use exclusively 1/8 spacers right now. Don't even have 1/16. The job I'll be using them on first is 12x24 in a 1/3rd offset pattern.


Buy what you are going to use.


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## charimon

our local Dal stocks RLS. 250 strap bags for $29 or less depending


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## Xtrememtnbiker

Inner10 said:


> Buy what you are going to use.


I'm asking what should I use? :laughing:

Angus used 1/16th in his video. Everybody wants to be like Angus... :whistling

pros/cons for grout joint size of 1/16 vs 1/8?


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## Inner10

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> I'm asking what should I use? :laughing:
> 
> Angus used 1/16th in his video. Everybody wants to be like Angus... :whistling
> 
> pros/cons for grout joint size of 1/16 vs 1/8?


I used the 1/8" and no body likes me...


so...in conclusion....


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## TNTRenovate

I pretty much do 90% 1/8" joints with the occasional 1/16".


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## Xtrememtnbiker

Well 1/8 it is then. I hear rumors of breaking less clips too... :whistling


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## angus242

1/16" grout joints are a challenge. That's why I suggest them to clients. Really, I like the challenge.....until you use crappy cupped tile and realize 1/16" is a stupid idea.


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## Xtrememtnbiker

angus242 said:


> 1/16" grout joints are a challenge. That's why I suggest them to clients. Really, I like the challenge.....until you use crappy cupped tile and realize 1/16" is a stupid idea.


Well since I lay tile on average twice a month, as much as I like a challenge... we'll stick with 1/8. :thumbsup:


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## RichVT

The rule for grout joints is that they should be 3 times the size difference between your largest and smallest tiles. So it really depends on how accurately sized your tiles are.


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