# Another estimating software thread



## Aladdin Builders

Everything but a data base..... all CSI divisions, a ton of documents, evrything you need to track an entire project including emailing and faxing your subs and vendors. Also it alows you to import vendors prices into the estimate after you email or fax them the quote request of course!
Accounting is a breeze.... RFI, Change Orders, etc.... cut and paste your data base from any excel or word doc. I found that the data bases that other programs talk about are worthless, you still need to adjust almost every item you input anyway. Look, I have Quest and it costs about $10,000.00 and comes with a data base (WORTHLESS TO ME) I have modified the whole thing.

The smartcontractor program is simple to use and very powerful. 
Email me and I will tell you how to download it without waiting for there response.


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## silvertree

I looked at Smart Contractor and it appears to do a lot. After 20 years as a GC I find myself wanting to do less work rather than more. I doubt if I will sell and produce more than $500,000 in work next year. This will be good work and I will take home a nice paycheck. In this regard, I feel I don't need a lot of what these programs offer, not to mention the time to learn how to use new software. So for me Excel and a work scope do just fine. As for what the client gets, I still provide a time frame, unit measures and products page. I try not to use allowances anymore, and I don't give breakdowns (such as 244 sf ceramic floor tile at $15.60 sf installed). That had a habit of working against me. You underestimate tile at published costs and you eat it, you have a box left over and some people ask for a rebate. I do provide a full scope with approximate SF and a total number at the bottom of the page. For someone who is doing a million or more you probably have to have this kind of software.


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## rbsremodeling

Silvertree

I hear you. I am in the process of scaling back hopefully after 2008. I probably go back down to the 500-750k range in 2009. I had to grow my business pass the 1mil mark for certain reason and it has benefited me. 

Banks, credit card companies vendors and subs look at you with differently when your gross dollar raises significantly. I did not make anymore money and had to work longer but I knew this going in. The benefits where what I was after.

Now that I have everyones attention. I want to scale back and have a life.


I want to have an estimator, salesmen and subs that can come on board from various locations. Raise my rates slightly so that I can accomadate the extract help and be able the have a life

I expect to be in 3 states DC,MD,VA by 2009. I am going to start changing gears in 2008 to reformulate my business in 2009. 

The thing with some of these software is that if they work right they make your job alot easier. The program I use now does design contracts, estimates, construction contracts, draw schedules and scheduling all in one program but has been hell for everyone around me to catch on. But I love it dearly. It does have a few limitations that I work with help from outside IT sources and the little bit of computer skills I have. But I want to be able to access and input info from anywhere so that I can work from anywhere, home, office, field and vacaction and secondly be user friendlly to everyone else.


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## silvertree

Well Rory, good luck. You have a plan and thats important. As for the software, well thats actually funny. For example, in my roundtable we did construction contracts, not AIA but better. One and a half years later half the participants have customized the paperwork. The funny part is the intent was for all of us to be competing on the same level, we accomplish that and immediately start changing the standard we had set. And I support this. My guess is this will happen all the time with software. It's evolution. But I get your point. 3 states? Thats a lot of ground to cover.


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## rbsremodeling

The 3 state goal is decieving. MD,DC,VA are literally about 20-30 minutes apart depending on where your going. The reason for the 3 state goal is to accept higher priced jobs and increase job leads.

Secondly the interntet and computers are powerful things and if utilized correctly you can accomplish alot with them.

2 seconds of research and i know your in mn, i know couple of people you have worked with, your a member of nari, certified remodeler, certified kitchen and bathr remodeler, how long in business and stuff i probablly should no know etc. welcome to the 21 century.

Either you lead or follow and damn it I'am a leader


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## silvertree

Yeah, secret identities are for most of us the stuff of spy films. technology is where everything is headed, but we still need to know our jobs, and we still need to fulfill the wants and needs of our customers. As for estimating systems, any system is better than none, and a bad plan is better than no plan, at least it shows your thinking. Being computer savvy is still a lot of work though, but it's better than it used to be. An all in one system is worth pursuing, but at this time it's kind of like a multifunction office machine, great when it works, but when 1 function goes they all seem to be impacted.


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## topdog

I use nova develipmont invoicing and estamates it is not complicated or expencive a great program for the inexpereanced .


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## rbsremodeling

The best beginning estimating software I have used is hometech. I still use it for my preliminary estimating. It was not hard for me to grasp and has an excellent data base and pricing is updated every three months. I do alot of estimates 2-3 hundred a year. 

It has assembly templates for kitchens, baths, basements, addtions etc. For a quick preliminary estimate I think its tops

you can bang out an estimate for common bids in and 1 or 2


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## rbsremodeling

I scheduled a demo of smartcontractor. I will give an update after reviewing it. Looks promising


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## PMI

*Many of these products are outdated though*

Hi guys,
I have been reading your comments but also think you should be very clear on your suggestions of product depending on the lead times of the business model. Anything to do with New Construction has a much larger lead time than traditional quick-fix repairs and smaller remodeling jobs. Many of the packages out there come from the Construction mindset and not for the Service (repair and remodel) side of the business. I kind of like to think of it like an Emergency Room doctor who is at the hospital visiting patients but everything changes when the ambulance pulls up. That goes for so many components of our business (Plumber for example). Each of us has to think about how much and how fast things have to get done, and how much of the business simply is not scheduled out but more reactive to the customer's situation. Building a new home is totally different than having people on stand-by to fix things. Be careful with reviewing products and find out who they cater to. For example, MasterBuilder should not be used by anyone in repair and remodeling since that is a product completely designed for New Construction and a large office staff. And what bothers me the most about most of the products out there is that there is no real innovation (except for a small handful of newer companies). Anyone who has been around for years will be dead in the water since they will have a big piece of their business holding them back. I really like the guys who have been looking at the business and only thinking about current technology through the year 2010. Think about, how many years ago would your father ever imagine that you would be on this forum? Does he even know what a forum it? Was the software company around before or after you thought of this and what is on their mind (1995, 2000 or 2010). Just food for thought.


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## rbsremodeling

I demo'ed smart contractor and actuallly thought it was a nice product. I will schedule another demo after I play with the trial version a bit and formulate some detail questions. I think for any software especially for small contractors to efficient has to have mobile access. You have to be able to take it in the field for access on a pc or handheld. I have a great program now but the mobile access is its limiting feature that i can't look pass.

Some of its features of Smart Contractor, if they work as advertised are very forward thinking and light years ahead of some of the products that cost alotttt more.


I also intend to demo myonlinetoolbox that also seems to have alot of promise for my next venture into the handyman/service business and for my possible use of estimators for the remodeling side


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## hatchet

Just catching up with some posts here. I just purchased UDA CS 2007. Overall I would give the software an 8 out of 10. It does most things very well such as document management, client tracking. It has a good selection of templates for everything from contracts (remod, new, commercial, etc) to lien releases and schedules. 
The reason for the 8 quite honestly is the estimating module. IMO it's actually worse than national estimator even though it provides you the national estimator database. They did some things with the way they do their quote system that really makes it more difficult to setup and to update after the fact.
I would suggest EasyEst for a stand alone estimating software, although on first look it's a glorified spreadsheet. After looking deeper they've actually made a very flexible system - from purchasing the modules that you want to how the database and estimates are created and can be modified.
Now I wish UDA would adopt some of the features of EasyEst


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## panthony

Software programs can get all but a very small portion of the detail...there still needs to be the human element involved.


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## hatchet

I absolutely agree. My biggest reason for mentioning EasyEst is that it's very easy to modify the estimate without having to go and create a whole new item for a custom molding that you'll only need once. Or modifying a number once input into the estimate without modifying the costbook. And no - I'm not associated with EasyEst in any way shape or form.
And in response to some prior posts regarding the downside of software programs. No program is going to guarantee that you won't miss anything - as with any computer program it's only as good as what you put into it. You can setup the same template on the computer as you have with pad and paper without ever having to recreate.
Now that my system is setup I can accurately create an estimate for a whole project in about 3 hours - 1 hour for takeoffs - 1.5 hour for inputting adjusting - and .5 hour for putting together a proposal. Well I shouldn't say that - every once in awhile there is a new hvac system or low voltage system that I haven't estimated before that I may need to wait for a bid to come back from a subcontractor.


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## Marty V

This topic is of special interest because quality estimating and cost tracking are two of the fundamental keys in this business. We are a design/build residential and light commercial remodelor. We have used Hometech (in book form) on the residential side and the SWAG on the commercial side. With good cost tracking the SWAG method becomes our own book for our cost on the estimate and the project proposal. We have purchased Clear Estimates but have had trouble getting it off the ground. We have used Excel and are pretty successful with that. However, we would like to transfer the estimate line item with a line item on the proposal. That is the reason we are looking into Clear Estimates. 
I have come to the conclusion that whatever estimating software you purchase should be dependent on how much training the software company offers. Without training the software is "never" used to its full potential. I have come to this conclusion having purchased ACT contact management software and the using of Excel. When we purchased ACT we got training for one day and it was up and running within a few weeks. Plus, we have purchased Excel training for 3 days over a year and can obtain the full power of Excel for estimating. Clear Estimates does not offer any personalized training just some short video clips from their website. I learn from listening, doing and then implementing. As a fifty something contractor I need assistance and I understand that I need to pay for that. Wouldn't you think these software people would use that as a profit center?

Marty V


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## Aladdin Builders

*I agree but....*

Marty V, I do agree with you on the training part but disagree on them charging the buyer (us) to learn the functionality of there product. I also own ClearEstimates and have used it for about 2 years now. The owner Nolan is very helpful and I think if you call him he will walk you through and answer any ?'s you may have. They will also help customize your library to your needs. Remember with any estimating program (I don't care about the cost) without a doubt, you still are required to enter your costs and adjust there's. Maybe these software companies need to offer unlimited support for there product..... Now that would be a great sell point!


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## Ed the Roofer

rbsremodeling said:


> I demo'ed smart contractor and actuallly thought it was a nice product. I will schedule another demo after I play with the trial version a bit and formulate some detail questions. I think for any software especially for small contractors to efficient has to have mobile access. You have to be able to take it in the field for access on a pc or handheld. I have a great program now but the mobile access is its limiting feature that i can't look pass.
> 
> Some of its features of Smart Contractor, if they work as advertised are very forward thinking and light years ahead of some of the products that cost alotttt more.
> 
> 
> I also intend to demo myonlinetoolbox that also seems to have alot of promise for my next venture into the handyman/service business and for my possible use of estimators for the remodeling side


Rory,

Any update on that Smart Contractor Software?

Ed


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## truckkin

Ed the Roofer said:


> Rory,
> 
> Any update on that Smart Contractor Software?
> 
> Ed


Hey Ed,

I found this review on Smart Contractor - http://www.constructionsoftwarereview.com/job-cost-accounting/smart-contractor-user-review.html .Might want to try shooting that guy an email to gather his thoughts...


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## silvertree

In regards to all this software, I have used 3 software systems. Hometech, Clear Estimates and Excel spreadsheets.
Excel is easy but it doesn't do all the fancy stuff like invoices or the dozen other functions a program like Smartcontractor does. In spite of that I like the controllable simplicity of it. When choosing software I try to include the cost of learning to use it. So I go for simple and thats usually cheaper.
For kitchens I have 2020 design. Great program and a full time job if you want it to be. 
In conclusion, I know a couple of guys who make a great living, whose jobs go well and the customers give them great testimonials. Neither one uses nothing but pen and paper and preprinted forms. I think a lot of the software recommended for remodeling is overrated. 
To each his own.


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## rbsremodeling

Ed the Roofer said:


> Rory,
> 
> Any update on that Smart Contractor Software?
> 
> Ed


Ed

I downloaded the demo and played with it for two months. I think it is a very good program. 

It has no data in its estimating module you upload data through excel spread sheets. 

You can send quotes to vendors and subs in an excel format an upload it into you estimating database or into a quote. you can also make templates or assemblies for common jobs

The features are very well thought out. I think most remodeling/GC or specialty contractors who use there own excel spreadsheets should check out this program.

There are also some features that are well ahead of the curve, stuff that no one else has but would be really helpful to most contractors.

The website is has all the info and a free download trial of the software. 

I ended up going with another software company because it better suited how I run my company and the direction i was going in the next few years.

But Smart contractor was a very close second on my list, well worth a look and test drive IMO.

Alladin currently uses this software if I remember correctly and really liked it as well. He brought it to my attention


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## Magic Hammer

Have you tried Home Tech's online estimate program? www.costestimator.com I think it's $15.00 a month
SuperBuild is free. www.superbuild.com/ 

Good Luck


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## rbsremodeling

Magic Hammer said:


> Have you tried Home Tech's online estimate program? www.costestimator.com I think it's $15.00 a month
> SuperBuild is free. www.superbuild.com/
> 
> Good Luck



I tried Hometech online estimator and ended up just buying the Hometech software. That worked out for me for 4years until in needed more

I looked at superbuild wasn't bad but did really jump out at me.


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## silvertree

All estimating systems are pretty good when you get used to them.
All are better than no system. And garbage in garbage out is still a true saying.


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## ELMS

*$500 Estimating (& more) Option*



huber117 said:


> I'm not sure how many estimators are on this site since most of the other estimating software threads dont help much and are mostly "i do it oldschool" replies from people afraid of computers. I use timberline for the person i am working with now, but i have an interview coming up and id like to have my own software on my laptop. There are dozens of programs out there and i was wondering if anyone had some experience whith which ones are worth demoing. Im comfortable with timberline and im sure if im good with that i can easily adapt to any software out there. Timberline would cost thousands and im looking for something in the $500 range. Any suggestions are appreciated, THANKS


Here is an option that has all the functionality you need: Estimating, Leads Management, Change Orders, Contracts, QB Interface, Project Scheduling. Decide before you buy with 30 day free trial .

Elms Software


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## modterry

I have a general question - Not one of the estimating programs out there addresses what I call the key issue - which is:
*Where are the Specifications*? - 

How can you bid a project without knowing what the Specs are?
What materials are going into the project ? -

Example: Kitchen Counters - 3 cm granite vs plastic laminate there is a big cost difference 
The Spec drives the material, the material drives the labor and I never see anything about Specs in these systems?

We create the specs with our customer - which may not be the case for a SubContractor ( a Sub has to bid what he is told - but does the Sub get the specs? )

I had to write a system where the bid is tied to the Specs with Categories / Spec Numbering - then the materials and labor tie to the spec number and can be calculated and translated into material lists, labor tasks, then these items can be attached to the purchasing system.

Makes estimating a real detail intensive situation - not to be used for 20 minute quick bids.

Any feedback greatly appreciated.


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## CoolRascal

Anyone got a seat of SharpeSoft they're wanting to part with?


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## ottagosoon

*Excel*



> I have used Hometech and Clear Estimates and the Craftsman system. I have also checked out many other estimating programs. After all this I went back to a work scope with LF, SF or amounts done with Excel. For me and many others whatever system we use becomes intuitive and so there is no best program out there. I belong to NARI and am in a roundtable with 12 members, all these contractors are professionals with sales from $250,000 to $4,000,000 a year in sales. Non of the 12 members use the same estimating program, but about half of them use Excel spreadsheets.


Excel is for me too! I have added macros to pull out all the line items from a long list of items broke down into categories that I used for an estimate to view or print. There is so much you can do with these spreadsheets today.


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## symmons

*I Love Using Turbo Estimator for Estimating*

*I've been using Turbo Estimator for more than a decade and really love it *because I can turn out estimates fast -- using my own data.

Their page is named: turbo-estimator (I'm not allowed to post the site)

When I started I had a laptop with a built in printer. I'd meet the prospective customers, take notes about the project, go back to my truck, and have an estimate for them in a few minutes. They were always very impressed at how professional I was.

Over the years I've tried the bigger programs but they just did not measure up.

Hope this helps.
Scott


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## Ed the Roofer

symmons said:


> *I've been using Turbo Estimator for more than a decade and really love it *because I can turn out estimates fast -- using my own data.
> 
> Their page is named: turbo-estimator (I'm not allowed to post the site)
> 
> *When I started I had a laptop with a built in printer.* I'd meet the prospective customers, take notes about the project, go back to my truck, and have an estimate for them in a few minutes. They were always very impressed at how professional I was.
> 
> Over the years I've tried the bigger programs but they just did not measure up.
> 
> Hope this helps.
> Scott


Hey,

I thought I was the only one who ever owned a laptop with a built in printer.

A cannon with a bubble jet built on the under side of the laptop, with a one page at a time feeder.

Ed


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## Handymanservice

*What about small jobs?*

For the non-remodelers here, does anyone have suggestions for Handyman jobs? I am looking for something that would be a quick estimator type deal. I use Craftsman, but it doesn't really do things the way I think. Or I don't think the way it works!

I know Hometech has a book, but I would like a software version.

Next question, is anyone currently using *Service CEO* to manage their business. I am looking at it and it has way too many features for me right now, but it looks like it has staying power and _I_ can grow into it. 

If you have information, please share, I am looking to purchase ASAP.


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## JCPI

rbsremodeling said:


> Ed
> 
> I ended up going with another software company because it better suited how I run my company and the direction i was going in the next few years.
> 
> But Smart contractor was a very close second on my list, well worth a look and test drive IMO.
> 
> rbsremodeling: Which software did you finally choose? Are you confortable with it so far?


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## FastKatt

I'm bringing back this old thread because it had the most info of the ones I found using the search

I saw alot of talk about software costs around $500-$2,000
Some talk about Xactimate (Full Insurance ver.) 

I used Xactimate back when it was a DOS program, & much cheaper...
I like the idea of full featured software for under $1,000 (even know it's per year)
Here's the pricing I was quoted:


> XactRemodel is licensed on a subscription basis, and the pricing is as follows:
> For a 30 day commitment the cost is $89
> For a 3 month commitment the cost is $209
> For a 6 month commitment the cost is $399
> For a 12 month commitment the cost is $599
> 
> With your subscription to the program you receive the following:
> 
> 
> 
> The Right to use the Program
> 24/7 Online Technical Support and Helpful Downloads
> Product Upgrade
> Monthly Pricing Updates
> Online Overview Training




I think I could swing $90/m threw winter then cover 6m or a year at a time...
The idea of monthly price updates & still inline with adjusters (when/if needed)
Plus, being able to see all your price points, print-outs based on each sub's job, material lists, & so-on...

I don't have a background in/with Excel, and my time is worth something...

Anyone found a better option?
Anyone using XactRemodel?


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## FastKatt

I've been using XactRemodel for a few months now & been very happy with the software...
What do you bring to the table???


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## fez-head

We are demoing the XactRemodel right now and just finished up our first webinar this morning. I am amazed at the power this thing has and what it can do for us. :thumbup:


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## CementCreek

Here's my question, maybe too basic for this far down. But if you pick a program to demo, don't you end up stuck with it. It takes a bunch of time to learn and them you're toast if you want to change. Or am I just looking at this all wrong?

And what's the opinion on subscription vs own. Sounds like the group likes subscription but I've always been one to buy. Then I know it's mine and how much it will cost.


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## FastKatt

Well the one I'm using doesn't offer an "own it" option...
Alot of them don't...

And, as for the trial,...
You try it, if you like it enough to learn it that far, most likely you'll keep it...
If you can't learn it in the trial, you'll give up...
JMHO


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## N.H. Concrete

For a small contractor I would recommend Planswift. Has been great so far, customer service has been fantastic. Nothing fancy, but should do everything you need. They have a free demo to download and try for up to a month to make sure it fits your company. You can do all your takeoffs on-screen and then everything transfers to your estimate (and integrates to Excel).


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## CementCreek

thanks I'll give PlanSwift a try. Downloaded it already looks good. They say there is training is it worth it?


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## rock16

I bought planswift about a month ago and so far so good. I have not used the one on one training that comes with it yet. I have found the online demos to be very good. There are quite a few useful plugins that do not come with the demo but add value to the program.
If you decide to buy dont just kick them a credit card over the internet, give them a call. I spoke with Derrick and got my first year of maintenance thrown in worth $200. They do seem to be willing to deal a bit.


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