# Middle of run RCP replacement due to operator error, or so i say, what do you do here



## Little (Jul 22, 2006)

Here's the scenario, on Tuesday we installed a pipe run of 300Lf of 18" RCP from and underground detention to a "B" Inlet across the parking lot. The site used to be an old trucking company and digging is very tough, even for our CAT 325 excavator. The entire site is covered by about 4-6" of 3/4" clean stone and right underneath this, about 3 feet of solid compacted millings, and below that some ****y ass clay. So yesterday, i have to get the telephone conduits run from the building to the pole on the side street and will cross the pipe run from the other day. I show my operator this, which he should know, he installed the pipe with the same crew. Around i'd say 11am, i get that call, Jim can you come out here, uh oh. The operator dug straight through the 18" RCP run, you can't feel anything in this ground and my pipe guys said he just kept ripping and ripping at what he thought was a chunk of concrete in the ground sheesh. I come out take a look, 3 lengths of pipe had to be removed as the first middle was completely destroyed and the other two were pretty bad to at the ends. I decided to try something i've never done before, repair in the middle of the run instead of pulling out all the way back to the manhole 125Lf away. I had my operator dig back 3 pipe lengths back on each side of the disaster site and also two buckets wide on each side parallel to the run, removed the broken pipe and bring the 3 new lengths in together sideways. It worked pretty good, minus a slightly chipped bell that we mudded up real good. What woudl you guys do in this situation???


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## dayexco (Mar 4, 2006)

we cut the bottom half of the female joint off the last pipe we're resetting, pour a concrete collar around that joint, most engineers we've worked with accept it. you still maintain the integrity of your inverts


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## Double-A (Jul 3, 2006)

First of all, I have my operator drug tested. Where was his head in all this? Strike one!

As for the repair, we'd be tempted yo pour collars around any joint that was damaged or didn't come up snug, spigot into bell. If your fall is good and wasn't compromised, you've done the most effective repair I can think to do.


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## tgeb (Feb 9, 2006)

dayexco said:


> we cut the bottom half of the female joint off the last pipe we're resetting, pour a concrete collar around that joint, most engineers we've worked with accept it. you still maintain the integrity of your inverts



That would be my way out.


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## PipeGuy (Oct 8, 2004)

We just finished doing something very similar on a 48" line. We had to take out about 5 lengths to lay a sewer that crossed under the RCP on a very long angle. We broke out the top 52% of the bells on two adjoining pipe, put a cable around one of them, rotated (spun) it in place 180 degrees and pulled it out. Breaking the bells took about 20 minutes with a sledge hammer and cutting wire another 20. When we were done with the sewer we relaid (4) of the 48's, dropped the last one back in the middle the way we took it out and respun it to place the broken bell up. Two brick collars later we were done.


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## rino1494 (Jan 31, 2006)

Well accidents do happen, but come on, that mistake is totally uncalled for. I would hate to be around when that guy is digging around a high pressure gas line. 

Anyways, I would cut the top half of the bells off and then butter them up with cement.


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## PipeGuy (Oct 8, 2004)

Little said:


> ... we installed a pipe run of 300Lf of 18" RCP [the other day]. So yesterday, i have to...cross the pipe run from the other day. I show my operator this, which he should know, he installed the pipe. The operator dug straight through the 18" RCP run...just kept ripping and ripping at what he thought was a chunk of concrete in the ground.


 The guy's a doper or a drunk - no two ways about it. I've fired too many like him over the years. Guys that set a fire hydrant, swing around 5 minutes later and shear it off with the counter weight. Guys that back up against a house and melt the second story siding with the engine exhaust. Guys that dig under a water line 5 times and tear it completely out on the sixth. The good guys rarely, if ever, do stupid sh*t (and when they do they feel genuinely awful). The wino's and crack heads can't help themselves and always blame someone else for their own idiocy.


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## rino1494 (Jan 31, 2006)

PipeGuy said:


> The guy's a doper or a drunk - no two ways about it. I've fired too many like him over the years. Guys that set a fire hydrant, swing around 5 minutes later and shear it off with the counter weight. Guys that back up against a house and melt the second story siding with the engine exhaust. Guys that dig under a water line 5 times and tear it completely out on the sixth. The good guys rarely, if ever, do stupid sh*t (and when they do they feel genuinely awful). The wino's and crack heads can't help themselves and always blame someone else for their own idiocy.



One of the main reasons why we stay small. I do 95% of the excavator work and we don't have to worry about costly mistakes. Yeah, i've made a few in my time, but who doesn't. The ones that I have made were minor and were not costly or life-threatening. How many pipe layers would trust a kid in their early 20's in a machine when they are 20' deep in a box. One time I saw a owner of a different company jump in the seat of a brand new excavator they got. He spun around and ripped the cab right off one of his pick-ups. He laughed about it too. I bet he wouldn't be laughing if one of his men were sitting in the seat.

You are right though pipeguy. The good guys that make mistakes do care and feel bad. The retards that laugh about it are the ones that you gotta watch out for.


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## Little (Jul 22, 2006)

The worst part about the operator, is he is 55 years old with i'd say 30 years experience. He is our lead 825 operating engineer. The guy isn't on drugs or alcohol, don't even think he ever drinks. He has been with us for at least 7 years now. I have told my uncle soo many times we need to get rid of him, he's terrible on a dozer, terrible on the hoe. 99% of the time now, i keep him in the loader but even there he destroys everything. My uncle will not fire him, so there is nothing i can do about it.


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## rino1494 (Jan 31, 2006)

Promote him with a PhD

Pine Handle degree :laughing:


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## Little (Jul 22, 2006)

I can count every bolt on the grousers when the guy fine grades a 25ft wide roadway with curbs on both sides, lol


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## TMatt142 (Apr 28, 2006)

Just because he holds an operator card doesn't mean he's good!!!! Most operators coming out of the hall this time of year are there for a reason!!! Though he may have 30 yrs experience, were they 30 "good" years...or 30 years of bad habits. Makes a huge difference if you settle on time spent in the seat compared to trying to make yourself better and better each passing day throughout your career. Most I've run into only care about the check they get at the end of the week. THOSE are the ones I'd watch out for!


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