# Kitchen Circuits



## Hambone (Apr 4, 2007)

Is there a limit on the number of outlets in a kitchen on a circuil for normal backsplash outlets? I think codes says there must be at least 2 circuits for the kitchen area (outlets and refrig I believe), but I can't find anything yet on how many backsplash outlets can be on a circuit. I generally use the rule of thumb of 8-10 on a non-kitchen circuit - but haven't done many kitchen additions so want to make sure. Thanks for helping me be lazy today


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## thom (Nov 3, 2006)

You didn't state the code you use so I will assume IRC. 

To answer your question, "Is there a limit....?"

Yes, there is a limit.

Your other assumption about the two circuits, one receptacles and one refrig is wrong. There are a whole bunch of rules about electric in kitchens. You really need to read the rule book on this one.


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## Hambone (Apr 4, 2007)

Thanks Thom - I realize there are bunch of rules, but at this time I am only concerned with Outlets in the backsplash. Hopefully someone can answer ... back to reading the code (NEC 2005) for now.


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

The IRC and the NEC are mute on the number of receptacles along the kitchen countertop. Different under the CEC, if you happen to be up there.


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## thom (Nov 3, 2006)

Once again you are correct MD. We have some very specific requirements. They are local (state) additions.


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## Hambone (Apr 4, 2007)

I think I found what I needed in 210.52 ... Receptacles installed in a kitchen to serve countertop surfaces shall be supplied by not fewer than two small-appliance branch circuits. 

So you are correct that the number of outlets on a given branch is silent, but at least 2 circuits are required. I will check local requirements as I have heard that only 2 outlets are allowed on a branch. Problem with this remodel is the kitchen is huge and will require around 16 outlets - so that might be 8 seperate branch circuits depending on local code requirements.


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## Magnettica (Dec 19, 2006)

Two, 20 AMP small appliance branch circuits for the kitchen countertop receptacles is the bare minimum. As is the entire NEC for that matter. You say this is a big kitchen. Why do it on the cheap? Perhaps you can run 3, or 4 circuits to the countertop and avoid any possible overloads after the walls are closed up. I would also suggest separate 20 AMP circuits for the microwave, refridgerator, and any other neat things that demand alot of current. You will most likely need a few ckts for a dishwasher and garbage disposal too. Also, some of the new vent hoods require their own separate 20 AMP circuit as well.

Good luck!


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## Magnettica (Dec 19, 2006)

Hambone said:


> I think I found what I needed in 210.52 ... Receptacles installed in a kitchen to serve countertop surfaces shall be supplied by not fewer than two small-appliance branch circuits.
> 
> So you are correct that the number of outlets on a given branch is silent, but at least 2 circuits are required. I will check local requirements as I have heard that only 2 outlets are allowed on a branch. Problem with this remodel is the kitchen is huge and will require around 16 outlets - so that might be 8 seperate branch circuits depending on local code requirements.


FWIW, the (2) required circuits count as 1500 watts each when it comes to calculated loads.


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## thom (Nov 3, 2006)

And, check for local additions to your code. Our additions include:

Max 4 recepts per circuit
Min 2 circuits 
Countertop recept circuits may not extend elsewhere
Dedicated circuit for dishwasher/disposal
Dedicated circuit for microwave (if built in)
Dedicated circuit for any other built-ins (compactor,???)
Refrig on another circuit (not kitchen stuff), I just do dedicated
Lights may not be run off circuits listed above.


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## Tom M (Jan 3, 2007)

Every counter top needs a GFI . no more than 2 ft apart. IRC E3801.4.1


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

tom m said:


> ...no more than 2 ft apart. IRC E3801.4.1


You'd better read that again. That's not what it says at all :furious:


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## Tom M (Jan 3, 2007)

No point on the counter is more than 24" in any horizontal direction from a receptacle or 4' apart. With exceptions for corner sinks and ranges. Hows that MD?


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## mdshunk (Mar 13, 2005)

tom m said:


> No point on the counter is more than 24" in any horizontal direction from a receptacle or 4' apart. With exceptions for corner sinks and ranges. Hows that MD?


:thumbsup: Thanks for clearing that up. Now the earth can return to its normal axis.


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## Sparky Joe (Apr 29, 2006)

There is no limit to number of outlets, only common sense. But 2 small appliance circuits are required......

Just remember that kitchens use a lot of power . And that 2 circuit minimum rule is based on the smallest kithchen around.


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## Hambone (Apr 4, 2007)

Thanks everyone for the posts. This is a large kitchen and I am working with the electrician on how many circuits. We'll get it right - I don't like skimping on electrical outlets and its much easier/cheaper to add more circuits now than once this is finished up. 

Appreciate all the looks and posts.


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## Magnettica (Dec 19, 2006)

tom m said:


> No point on the counter is more than 24" in any horizontal direction from a receptacle or 4' apart. With exceptions for corner sinks and ranges. Hows that MD?


Thats correct. The rule is similiar to the habitable room requirement but instead of every 12', it's every 4'.

And instead of a receptacle needed at every wall space more than 24", for a kitchen countertop the rule is 12".

That's the best way to remember the rule, IMHO.


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## Sparky Joe (Apr 29, 2006)

That was a very simplified way to remember something Mag


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## bill r (Feb 19, 2007)

deleted


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## Tmrrptr (Mar 22, 2007)

Ham,
I'd get the client involved, too...

I oncegave all my builtins proper circuit & split two to each side of a kinda smaller kitchen and was called back in for tripping breakers...
Client dumped ALL their plug in stuff at one place AND proceeded to use it all at once.

I was very lucky... buildup and also service were right below.
r


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## Hambone (Apr 4, 2007)

Solution is 2 outlets per circuit for the kitchen. Local code mandates it and I think it is reasonable given the potential load of appliances and I want to be sure I don't have tripped breakers


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## Sparky Joe (Apr 29, 2006)

Tmrrptr said:


> I oncegave all my builtins proper circuit & split two to each side of a kinda smaller kitchen and was called back in for tripping breakers...
> Client dumped ALL their plug in stuff at one place AND proceeded to use it all at once.
> 
> I was very lucky... buildup and also service were right below.
> r


HUH????


And how does local code only allow 2 receptacles per circuit Ham????
That seems pretty ridiculous to me.


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## Hambone (Apr 4, 2007)

Sparky - was your question directed to me or the person you quoted in your response? I am actually not an electrician - just a GC. I am now consulting with the electrician who noted the local code. I agree it seems a bit much (2 receps per circuit) - but again, this is only in the kithen. Elsewhere I understand we can go up to 10 receps per circuit.


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## Sparky Joe (Apr 29, 2006)

The "HUH" I said was directly related to the post I quoted.
In other words I couldn't understand a single thing that was said.
It seemed as though he was talking to an old friend that was on that particular project with him, I mean how else unless you were there could you understand what he was talking about.

And your '2' devices per circuit in the kitchen sounds like a major 'upsell'(MD) by your electrician.
With a system like that your panel would be overloaded before you ever wired anything else.

But as an electrician; I say make a sub-panel for the kitchen; just more money for me, or my brothers????


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## Hambone (Apr 4, 2007)

Gotcha - thanks for the tips and I am definately going to dig around the 2 receps per circuit in the kitchen. I agree it sounds strange.


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## hcecalaska (Apr 1, 2007)

it sounds like you need a contractor who knows the local and national codes. not just an electrician. if you are posting the responses that your electrician is telling you then you need to find another. a good and qualified electrical contractor can tell you how many recepticals are needed in a kitchen and will serve the home owners needs the best. 
you have recieved several correct but incomplete answers here. the reason is that in your originol post it is evedent that you are trying to do work on your own that you are neither qualified or lisenced to perform, and now that your stuck you come to the experts for fee advice. i just hope the home owner dosnt pay for years for your lack of judgment in trying to save a buck.


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