# How do I tell an employee he stinks?



## Zewlander (Dec 18, 2012)

Ninjaframer said:


> I may have been planning on moving anyway but that guy stunk worse than anyone I've ever smelled. You don't have to put deodorant on evryday to not stink but you do have to shower (deodorant helps). This guy did neither. Freakin Pancho.


Heck, try being stuck in a seat on a flight from LA
to SF right next to 2 Middle Eastern people, that think
bathing is against their religion....was ready to puke.

And all these people are turning around looking at ME
in the aisle seat....'yeah I'm the one that smells like
a goats a$$!'


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## Ninjaframer (May 28, 2011)

I guess it would depend on how bad he stunk and of what. I have a employee that usually smells heavily of cigarette smoke and a certain green leafy substance but he doesn't stink of nasty BO. That BO smell is worse than a bag of smashed ass holes.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Ninjaframer said:


> I guess it would depend on how bad he stunk and of what. I have a employee that usually smells heavily of cigarette smoke and a certain green leafy substance but he doesn't stink of nasty BO. That BO smell is worse than a bag of smashed ass holes.


Good point anythings better then straight ass and BO


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## Zewlander (Dec 18, 2012)

I think the OP can tell his guy:

"I stuck up for you yesterday"

"really?, how?"

"our customer said you really stink and I told him 'like 
S*** he does'"

"hey, that's pretty funny"
.
.
"I wasn't joking"


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## sandshooter (Dec 30, 2012)

have a meeting with all the workers, and let it be known.
say
customers have complained about some construction workers and their personal heigien. 
please take time to make sure u guys are prepared to work around others. mouthwash, deodorant etc..

if this still doesnt work, pull the individual aside, and say u got a complaint about him and u would like for him to take care of it.


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## Zewlander (Dec 18, 2012)

sandshooter said:


> have a meeting with all the workers, and let it be known.
> say
> customers have complained about some construction workers and their personal heigien.
> please take time to make sure u guys are prepared to work around others. mouthwash, deodorant etc..
> ...


I agree, I've always thought don't target one person make
it a company meeting.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

That way they can target each other and you can keep your hands clean..


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## Ninjaframer (May 28, 2011)

You gotta wonder- if a guy doesn't care enough about himself to wash- how much could he care about the work he does?


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Great point. Can this skunk. .


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## sandshooter (Dec 30, 2012)

Ninjaframer said:


> You gotta wonder- if a guy doesn't care enough about himself to wash- how much could he care about the work he does?


Specially if construction is in an occupied area.


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## CarpenterSFO (Dec 12, 2012)

Talk to him. Just be clear that he understands that the problem has been ongoing, and that the solution must be ongoing, else you'll fire him. Yes, he's going to be embarrassed, but you're doing him a favor.


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## Electric_Light (Nov 25, 2007)

Ninjaframer said:


> I guess it would depend on how bad he stunk and of what. I have a employee that usually smells heavily of cigarette smoke and a *certain green leafy* substance but he doesn't stink of nasty BO. That BO smell is worse than a bag of smashed ass holes.


That should be dealt with in a serious manner. You are aware he reported to work with signs of illicit substance use. If he is injured, or another employee is injured because of him on the job or gets into an accident and member of the public is harmed. Guess who's getting sued? Probably you.


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## Ninjaframer (May 28, 2011)

If I fired every guy I suspected of smoking dope in his off hours I'd be working alone. What a man does on his own time is his own business. Now if I were to think he was doing this at work-that would be entirely different. He knows the risks, if he gets hurt and tests positive they wont cover him.


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## I Mester (Aug 21, 2011)

just carry a can of air freshner and spray it in the air when around him, and hope he gets the clue.


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## UALocal1Plumber (Jun 19, 2009)

Ninjaframer said:


> You gotta wonder- if a guy doesn't care enough about himself to wash- how much could he care about the work he does?


The most genius craftsmen i've ever met, the ones who have a particular fluency with the materials and tools... are the ones who are hard wired just a little differently than most folk. I'll admit that the two or three people who have knocked me out of my socks with the way they put out pristine work that I could never do, they've smelled and looked pretty weird.

Keith


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## Ninjaframer (May 28, 2011)

UALocal1Plumber said:


> The most genius craftsmen i've ever met, the ones who have a particular fluency with the materials and tools... are the ones who are hard wired just a little differently than most folk. I'll admit that the two or three people who have knocked me out of my socks with the way they put out pristine work that I could never do, they've smelled and looked pretty weird.
> 
> Keith


Weird is fine- like a hobo that just crawled through 5 miles of shi# is not ok.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Davinci weird is not ok...


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> davinci weird is not ok...


Fixed it


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## workingintx (May 8, 2010)

Yeah this guy does excellent work and is one of my harder workers but he just smells. He got the hint though.

I created a 2013 memo and it had new company policies including an appearance and hygiene policy. Also created a no smoking on the job policy. He has taken a shine too it. I've given everyone brand new collared shirts and made our folks buy new work jeans for 2013. There is a section in the policy that now states that the first 3 collared shirts are free but if they are ripped or damaged, they must be replaced at cost. Additionally we are doing spot checks now on jobsites to make sure a professional appearance is always happening. 

Let's see how long this works but it seems things have started on a good foot already for 2013. Thanks for all the input guys!


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

workingintx said:


> Yeah this guy does excellent work and is one of my harder workers but he just smells. He got the hint though.
> 
> I created a 2013 memo and it had new company policies including an appearance and hygiene policy. Also created a no smoking on the job policy. He has taken a shine too it. I've given everyone brand new collared shirts and made our folks buy new work jeans for 2013. There is a section in the policy that now states that the first 3 collared shirts are free but if they are ripped or damaged, they must be replaced at cost. Additionally we are doing spot checks now on jobsites to make sure a professional appearance is always happening.
> 
> Let's see how long this works but it seems things have started on a good foot already for 2013. Thanks for all the input guys!



I provide logo'd polos and pro fit caps, but dont expect them to replace them. When I was working I wore rags, because they got jacked up. But I also came up doing primarily new customs. 

The market changed and we have a seperate company (same guys, smwe sytems, just different name for marketing reasons) from our homebuilding company that concentrates on remodeling. Havent built a new custom since '11. Since we primarily work in occupied homes I want my crew to look pro. Crew wears logo'd Ts and leads where collared polos. 

They are going to get jacked. Framing, setting forms, welding, hauling material, ect... is hard on clothes. I wouldnt expect them to replace them. 

Also, buy 5 IMHO, one for every day of the week.


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## Zewlander (Dec 18, 2012)

I Mester said:


> just carry a can of air freshner and spray it in the air when around him, and hope he gets the clue.


Or hand him a packet of the Christmas tree fresheners
for cars.

When he says 'what do you think my truck stinks?'

Tell him 'no, I want you to put one under each armpit,
suck on one for a bit and stick one down the back of 
your shorts'.


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## Zewlander (Dec 18, 2012)

Jaws said:


> I provide logo'd polos and pro fit caps, but dont expect them to replace them. When I was working I wore rags, because they got jacked up. But I also came up doing primarily new customs.


I never provided or used uniforms, shirts, etc, but I always
had anyone working for me, or myself would wear a nice polo
shirt, etc even with customers I'd had for 10 years 
(commercial). 

Then if there was cable running, or other grunge work I would
have myself, or the guys wear T shirts (I preferred long sleeve
T shirts, so my arms didn't get banged up), but had to show
up to a site with that initial professional, or at least 'clean' look.

Never had a smell or hygiene issue, except if I farted and if I
did I would do the sideways head nodding thing to blame it
on the person next to me....weren't ever any dogs around
to blame it on.


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## 5starbuilders (Jan 22, 2011)

Zewlander said:


> Or hand him a packet of the Christmas tree fresheners
> for cars.
> 
> When he says 'what do you think my truck stinks?'
> ...


Brilliant , I should of thought of that


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Zewlander said:


> I never provided or used uniforms, shirts, etc, but I always
> had anyone working for me, or myself would wear a nice polo
> shirt, etc even with customers I'd had for 10 years
> (commercial).
> ...


Whats jacked up is I dont wear that stuff :laughing:

I wear Daluth Everyday Work shirts, no logo. I do wear company ball caps. 

I want to wear a collar but I hate polos. :laughing:


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

UALocal1Plumber said:


> The most genius craftsmen i've ever met, the ones who have a particular fluency with the materials and tools... are the ones who are hard wired just a little differently than most folk. I'll admit that the two or three people who have knocked me out of my socks with the way they put out pristine work that I could never do, they've smelled and looked pretty weird.
> 
> Keith


He could of built the Taj Mahal but if he smells like ass he's got to go.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Californiadecks said:


> He could of built the Taj Mahal but if he smells like ass he's got to go.


:thumbsup:


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## Zewlander (Dec 18, 2012)

Jaws said:


> Whats jacked up is I dont wear that stuff :laughing:
> 
> I wear Daluth Everyday Work shirts, no logo. I do wear company ball caps.
> 
> I want to wear a collar but I hate polos. :laughing:


I only like polos that breathe.

You really should think professional though Bro.

Get those T shirts with the tie on the front....:laughing:


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## Zewlander (Dec 18, 2012)

5starbuilders said:


> Brilliant , I should of thought of that


You still can 5star....the day's still young.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Zewlander said:


> I only like polos that breathe.
> 
> You really should think professional though Bro.
> 
> Get those T shirts with the tie on the front....:laughing:


:laughing:


Daluth Everyday FOM Workshirts I wear are button down collared tradesman shirts. They are pro, just not logo'd. I have a weird little thing about that.


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## Zewlander (Dec 18, 2012)

Jaws said:


> :laughing:
> 
> 
> Daluth Everyday FOM Workshirts I wear are button down collared tradesman shirts. They are pro, just not logo'd. I have a weird little thing about that.


Actually I always thought logos made one look like a gas
station attendant.

One of the companies that I worked with, against, side by side
was RFI out of San Jose (they were natl), while ADT, Bay Alarm, 
Omega, was wearing uniforms, the RFI guys wore normal 'clean' 
clothes like me. I always thought they looked more professional 
than the 'Gas station attendants'.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Its the one thing I pull rank on, I want them logo'd but not me. :laughing:


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

Many of the guys I work around wear a clean looking polo or as Jaws does a Duluth button down.

IMO, It's very pro looking to have a clean simple company name over the pocket.

This way I have an idea which sub I am talking to or can readily identify if a guy belongs on site.


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

griz said:


> Many of the guys I work around wear a clean looking polo or as Jaws does a Duluth button down.
> 
> IMO, It's very pro looking to have a clean simple company name over the pocket.
> 
> This way I have an idea which sub I am talking to or can readily identify if a guy belongs on site.


I agree, but Im a GC, not a sub. 

If I thought there would be a doubt, Id have my shirts logo'd HMFIC.:clap::laughing:

No, I will probably get my next batch logo'd. 



No first name though :no::no:


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

My hands may of unionized over first names. :laughing:


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

Jaws said:


> I agree, but Im a GC, not a sub.
> 
> If I thought there would be a doubt, Id have my shirts logo'd HMFIC.:clap::laughing:
> 
> ...


He!! yes.....:thumbsup::thumbsup:

JAWS
MFWIC

Then add your shark logo on the side....:thumbsup:


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

griz said:


> He!! yes.....:thumbsup::thumbsup:
> 
> JAWS
> MFWIC
> ...


I like MFWIC better, Im stealing it :thumbup:


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

Jaws said:


> I agree, but Im a GC, not a sub.
> 
> If I thought there would be a doubt, Id have my shirts logo'd HMFIC.:clap::laughing:
> 
> ...



You of all people should know you can be GC working on a commercial job with a certain SOW.

GC's commonly get, framing, siding, roof structure & interior finish.

Although they are working as subs,


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

griz said:


> You of all people should know you can be GC working on a commercial job with a certain SOW.
> 
> GC's commonly get, framing, siding, roof structure & interior finish.
> 
> Although they are working as subs,


Absolutely, I was joking. 

My old man subbed frames, trim, and finish work from the areas biggest "super custom" (3 mil- 7 mil) builder in the ninetys, while he was building houses for himself. If the guy hwdnt gotten stupid rich my dad would probably of rather done that, as he doesnt like networking.

We also subbed whole jobs from his former boss he was a PM for, high end remodels, and subbed our paint crew and did trim work for him after we partnered up. 

Have acted as a sub doing some commercial, too.

When I was a kid, some of the better "tool belt GCs) like my dad would hook up for big jobs and sub from each other. Now days everyone just has enough to keep their guys busy. 

A couple of paper contractors have asked us to sub frames, and one asked me to sub a whole house. That wouldnt work, two different mindets, cultures and values.


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## UALocal1Plumber (Jun 19, 2009)

Zewlander said:


> I only like polos that breathe.
> 
> You really should think professional though Bro.
> 
> Get those T shirts with the tie on the front....:laughing:


 http://www.snorgtees.com/tuxedo-t-shirt-jesus


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## tedanderson (May 19, 2010)

Another idea:

Take your smelly employee to a cheap motel with a pack of new underwear, new socks, and stick of deodorant. Also request a bottle of shampoo from the manager's desk. Don't send him into the room but go into the room with him and watch TV as you wait for him to clean up.

Then you tell him, "Next time you come on the job smelling bad, you'll have access to this motel room, however, BUBBA and Big Tiny, the two guys on work release, will be bringing you over.


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## slowsol (Aug 27, 2005)

tedanderson said:


> Another idea:
> 
> Take your smelly employee to a cheap motel with a pack of new underwear, new socks, and stick of deodorant. Also request a bottle of shampoo from the manager's desk. Don't send him into the room but go into the room with him and watch TV as you wait for him to clean up.
> 
> Then you tell him, "Next time you come on the job smelling bad, you'll have access to this motel room, however, BUBBA and Big Tiny, the two guys on work release, will be bringing you over.


Seriously creepy.


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## cabinetsnj (Jun 10, 2012)

tedanderson said:


> Another idea:
> 
> Take your smelly employee to a cheap motel with a pack of new underwear, new socks, and stick of deodorant. Also request a bottle of shampoo from the manager's desk. Don't send him into the room but go into the room with him and watch TV as you wait for him to clean up.
> 
> Then you tell him, "Next time you come on the job smelling bad, you'll have access to this motel room, however, BUBBA and Big Tiny, the two guys on work release, will be bringing you over.


That is a good one, but it could land you in trouble with the authorities.


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## CITY DECKS INC (Sep 4, 2012)

I have one with crap breath and realized he crashes around 1-2pm and starts making stupid mistakes. Like day 1 stupid stuff. wrong cuts etc....
he was skipping lunch to send more money back to mexico for his family. Out of shear frustration i confronted him and he said doesn't get hungry. I then explained that you work hard and need to feed your body if not your going get bad breath, get sick and cut your hours for the mistakes your making and loose your job. Then where will your mother be??? He can at least get a loaf of bread and pb& j that should last you about a week. 
Over all he’s good basic skilled general labor that is reliable. Other than that that he don’t drive or have any tools or bring anything to the table. As I’m writing this I’m seriously considering letting him go this week. Hey maybe It’s me. 
It’s so friggin hard to get help with out any baggage. There are the guys that have been doing it too long and are untrainable and just looking for a pay check. Then there’s the druggies drunks and baby drama. Our industry become a dumping ground for nonscence. One our union halls started there drug rehab center to get there members cleaned up. That’s how many they had.... wtf?? It’s so hard to get workers with there sh...t together.


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## tedanderson (May 19, 2010)

It could be trouble only if I force him to do it against his will. Although it may not be economically smart to rent the room and to have him on the clock doing something that he should have done prior to the workday.


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## tedanderson (May 19, 2010)

CITY DECKS INC said:


> It’s so hard to hard to get workers with there sh...t together.


That's probably one reason why it's hard to get a job if you aren't already employed. If you hire someone who is unemployed, chances are that his situation has a lot to do with his life issues. 

And then the guys who have themselves together have a hard time finding work because every interviewer believes that something is wrong with this picture.


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## CarpenterSFO (Dec 12, 2012)

CITY DECKS INC said:


> .... It’s so friggin hard to get help with out any baggage. There are the guys that have been doing it too long and are untrainable and just looking for a pay check. Then there’s the druggies drunks and baby drama. Our industry become a dumping ground for nonsense. One our union halls started there drug rehab center to get there member cleaned up. That’s how many they had.... wtf?? It’s so hard to hard to get workers with there sh...t together.


When you put it that way, it seems like a guy with hygiene issues isn't so bad. That's easier to solve than "druggies drunks and baby drama." If you want good people, you have to pay a little above the normal, and you have to be pretty ruthless about weeding out the problems. That's tough for a lot of guys in contracting to do, as some of us have our own imperfect histories, and as a result we think that people deserve a second chance.

Over time I've grown way less tolerant of screw-ups. I've granted a bunch of second chances in the past, and it was a mistake every time.


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Anyone that comes to work smelling like straight butt, has to go! I don't care if he built this single handed.


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## Electric_Light (Nov 25, 2007)

CITY DECKS INC said:


> I have one with crap breath and realized he crashes around 1-2pm and starts making stupid mistakes. Like day 1 stupid stuff. wrong cuts etc....
> he was skipping lunch to send more money back to mexico for his family. Out of shear frustration i confronted him and he said doesn't get hungry. I then explained that you work hard and need to feed your body if not your going get bad breath, get sick and cut your hours for the mistakes your making and loose your job. Then where will your mother be??? He can at least get a loaf of bread and pb& j that should last you about a week.


By "send more money" are you referring he's milking the clock? 

If you're letting him work through lunch it becomes an overtime liability for you. 

http://smallbusiness.chron.com/employee-refuses-lunch-16681.html


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## CITY DECKS INC (Sep 4, 2012)

Electric_Light said:


> By "send more money" are you referring he's milking the clock?
> 
> If you're letting him work through lunch it becomes an overtime liability for you.
> 
> http://smallbusiness.chron.com/employee-refuses-lunch-16681.html


 interesting overtime note. 
Not milking. Sending more money from his paycheck back home to mexico. Using less of his paycheck for himself. They all do it. Every body gets lunch a break and snack or two through out the day. He just doesn't want bring anything or buy anything he's simply cutting out the most basic expenses.


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## Electric_Light (Nov 25, 2007)

From the context " lunch to send more money back to mexico", I thought it meant that he was working through lunch in an attempt to rack up payable hours during that time(which it is if you are permitting him to work..) 

When you said he was "skipping" you didn't make it clear if he's just passing on eating, or if he's working through lunch break.

Start writing him up if you haven't done so already, so you don't get "wrongful termination" claim. You would have to do it consistently to everyone.. but is there something he does that is worthy of write up and everyone else doesn't? Write him up every time.


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## CITY DECKS INC (Sep 4, 2012)

Electric_Light said:


> From the context " lunch to send more money back to mexico", I thought it meant that he was working through lunch in an attempt to rack up payable hours during that time(which it is if you are permitting him to work..)
> 
> When you said he was "skipping" you didn't make it clear if he's just passing on eating, or if he's working through lunch break.


If and when I catch him I'll tell stop and go get lunch. The other workers brought it to my attention. We have 2/teams and does not usually work with me. He's not getting OT. he's just pinching pennies on lunch to send more money send back to the mother land. It's effecting his ability to perform. Further up the post you'll see he's making stupid mistakes and it's effecting production.


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## Electric_Light (Nov 25, 2007)

CITY DECKS INC said:


> If and when I catch him I'll tell stop and go get lunch. The other workers brought it to my attention. We have 2/teams and does not usually work with me. He's not getting OT. he's just pinching pennies on lunch to send more money send back to the mother land.


If you know and are allowing him to work, I believe that becomes payable hours. Although, if you've already told him to stop, tell him to not work during lunch hours. 

Pull him aside and tell him "you were asked not to work during lunch and you are again. Again, what I asked is still in effect.", then write him up again for insubordination. Do the same for safety infractions. (again, apply to everyone...) 



> It's effecting his ability to perform. Further up the post you'll see he's making stupid mistakes and it's effecting production.


I'm not an HR expert, but this appears to be the wrong tree to bark up on to get for-cause termination.


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## CITY DECKS INC (Sep 4, 2012)

he's out at the of the month. They have to finish this job then he's out for multiple things not just the lunch hr crap..


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Electric_Light said:


> If you know and are allowing him to work, I believe that becomes payable hours. Although, if you've already told him to stop, tell him to not work during lunch hours.
> 
> Pull him aside and tell him "you were asked not to work during lunch and you are again. Again, what I asked is still in effect.", then write him up again for insubordination. Do the same for safety infractions. (again, apply to everyone...)
> 
> I'm not an HR expert, but this appears to be the wrong tree to bark up on to get for-cause termination.


In my state I don't need a cause to fire someone. I can fire you just because I don't like you. I only can't fire by discrimination. Race, color, religion, etc.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Is this thread still stinking this joint up?


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## Jaws (Dec 20, 2010)

Californiadecks said:


> In my state I don't need a cause to fire someone. I can fire you just because I don't like you. I only can't fire by discrimination. Race, color, religion, etc.


Lifes to short to work with people you dont like.


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## donb1959 (Dec 9, 2004)

Dude...you smell like ass, are you allergic to soap?


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Jaws said:


> Lifes to short to work with people you dont like.


It doesn't matter how great of a carpenter you are if your not clicking with the crew and bringing us down your gone.


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## Electric_Light (Nov 25, 2007)

Californiadecks said:


> In my state I don't need a cause to fire someone. I can fire you just because I don't like you. I only can't fire by discrimination. Race, color, religion, etc.


You don't, but he might end up drawing unemployment benefits at your expense. 

If you have documented cause, for example, showing up drunk to work one day... for cause termination prevents that guy from drawing from it.

http://en.allexperts.com/q/Human-Resources-2866/Employer-responsibility-unemployment.htm


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

Electric_Light said:


> You don't, but he might end up drawing unemployment benefits at your expense.
> 
> If you have documented cause, for example, showing up drunk to work one day... for cause termination prevents that guy from drawing from it.
> 
> http://en.allexperts.com/q/Human-Resources-2866/Employer-responsibility-unemployment.htm


I would rather pay the unemployment then have someone work for me I don't like. 

Sometimes just give the guy the chit work and he'll just quit.


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