# Heat loosening bond for backsplash



## Bastien1337 (Dec 20, 2010)

Had a client once who asked me to quote on doing a kitchen back-splash. He had a concern though about using ceramic premix for his tiles. I said in a place like a back-splash is usually not an issue but asked what was his major concern. He said that his family did lots and lots of cooking and was fearful that the heat might loosen the bonds of the glue and tiles would fall off. In a residential setting I said I highly doubt that it would happen but if it was a real concern i would look into it.

I ended up not getting the job, so I never came to a final solution for this problem. But i've never really heard of it before. Have any of you guys come across this before in a residential setting? even a commercial setting, are there considerations for this to be taken?


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

Depends on the exact material used but basically, yes, mastic _can _be affected by heat. 

Yes just another reason to never use the stuff. :whistling


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## Heritage (Mar 20, 2007)

Have you SEEN this chit once it's dried? Hell, I can hardly remember a time when I've ripped out a backsplash with Acrylpro on where I didn't damn near take the wall studs out with it. These are just fairy tale presumptions...I don't know the technical specs...but this stuff can withstand the "torch" test. Not an issue at all.100% success rate for 6x6 or smaller wall tile...everytime.:thumbsup:


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## Bastien1337 (Dec 20, 2010)

i've worked with it many times i know that its not an issue but this guy was trying to tell me that it had happened to a friend of his. I just couldn't personally believe it myself. 

I have no issues using mastic for back splash. any direct water area i would never use it, but back splash Im all over it, especially over drywall I feel like it would have way better hold then thinset....unless I bought some retarded awesome thinset which wouldn't be worth the money for a backspalsh.


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

Bastien1337 said:


> unless I bought some retarded awesome thinset which wouldn't be worth the money for a backspalsh.


What? Mastic, pound for pound is _way _more expensive than thinset.


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## Bastien1337 (Dec 20, 2010)

tis true, I was thinking more about the time savings of not having to mix


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## Heritage (Mar 20, 2007)

The cost difference over the course of a typical backsplash (40 sq/ft or so) is NOMINAL (Around $20 at best).

Mastic was made for backsplashes and other small tile dry wall applications.

They say you can use it for floor tiles up to 12x12 as well...I wouldn't trust that. Nor would I use it in any wet areas, or a steamshower, or anything silly like that. It has it's limits...but it has it's virtues and backsplash applications is one of them.


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## Bastien1337 (Dec 20, 2010)

there are mastic's out there that can be used in wet areas but I still wouldnt use it either. I tried looking up the on the technical data info for ceramic mastic but couldnt really find anything relation to heat other than boiling point, which isnt really talking about the relationship to the bond.

http://www.custombuildingproducts.com/docs/msds/AcrylPro Ceramic Tile Adhesive.pdf?user=arc&lang=en


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

Mastic was made by the devil to put all tile guys that use it in hell. :devil:

Mixing enough thinset for a backsplash takes me no more than 10 minutes. Not a huge savings of time there. The fact that I can mix only what I need helps me reuse the rest of the thinset. To have enough mastic to do multiple jobs means buying larger buckets, which is obviously more expensive. The smaller buckets won't handle multiple jobs so you're getting mastic waste. 

Sorry, mastic is _not _for me. :no:


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## Heritage (Mar 20, 2007)

angus242 said:


> Mastic was made by the devil to put all tile guys that use it in hell. :devil:
> 
> Mixing enough thinset for a backsplash takes me no more than 10 minutes. Not a huge savings of time there. The fact that I can mix only what I need helps me reuse the rest of the thinset. To have enough mastic to do multiple jobs means buying larger buckets, which is obviously more expensive. The smaller buckets won't handle multiple jobs so you're getting mastic waste.
> 
> Sorry, mastic is _not _for me. :no:


The lid is nice and convenient, you take out what you need, spread it, cover the lid. Easier clean up, less mess, no mixing and easier to apply.

Don't you find that thinset dries too quickly for the application of what is normally meticulous backsplash (aka, just time consuming)? You would have to mix like 3 batches...no?:blink:


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## Bastien1337 (Dec 20, 2010)

angus242 said:


> Mastic was made by the devil to put all tile guys that use it in hell. :devil:
> 
> Mixing enough thinset for a backsplash takes me no more than 10 minutes. Not a huge savings of time there. The fact that I can mix only what I need helps me reuse the rest of the thinset. To have enough mastic to do multiple jobs means buying larger buckets, which is obviously more expensive. The smaller buckets won't handle multiple jobs so you're getting mastic waste.
> 
> Sorry, mastic is _not _for me. :no:


for a guy who is strictly tile I can see this as making sense. Im also not trying to persuade anyone to use premix, but for what I do its perfect I buy what I need and Im gone. Theres nothing wrong with not using it. it just works for me. 

Most times when im doing backspalsh anyways its usually for a finished kitchen so if I can keep mess to a minimum the better. I also dont have to bust out the paddle and Variable speed drill. just more tools to trip over.


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

Heritage said:


> Don't you find that thinset dries too quickly for the application of what is normally meticulous backsplash (aka, just time consuming)? You would have to mix like 3 batches...no?:blink:


Not the case in my experience. Even if labor/material costs evened out, I still feel much better KNOWING how thinset performs.

No worrying about heat. No worrying about size of tile. No worrying about wall or floor application. No worrying about re-emulsifying. No worrying about is the location too wet or not. No worrying about if it will actually cure or not.

Mastic is sticky devil pooh :laughing: 

Sorry, *expensive *sticky devil pooh. :devil2:


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## Bastien1337 (Dec 20, 2010)

angus242 said:


> Mastic is sticky devil pooh :laughing:
> 
> Sorry, *expensive *sticky devil pooh. :devil2:


:laughing:


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

Bastien1337 said:


> for a guy who is strictly tile I can see this as making sense


Especially when my setting materials are purchased on a pallet. You can see why I consider a 1 gal bucket of devil pooh expensive.


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## Bastien1337 (Dec 20, 2010)

i hear ya buddy. mastic catches so much flak....I use it pretty much guilty free, but I know talking about it is gonna get me flamed from professional tile guys like yourself...lol like its my dirty naughty secret


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

Hey, wait a minute. Is this some kinda Toronto thing? :whistling


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## HS345 (Jan 20, 2008)

Mastic has it's place, but cost savings is not one of them.


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## Bastien1337 (Dec 20, 2010)

HS345 said:


> Mastic has it's place, but cost savings is not one of them.


yeah ease of use is....which is cost savings:thumbsup:


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## HS345 (Jan 20, 2008)

Bastien1337 said:


> yeah ease of use is....which is cost savings:thumbsup:


For a DIY'er maybe, but not for a pro.

The best thing about mastic is, you get a really cool 3 1/2 gallon bucket when you're through with it. :laughing:


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## Bastien1337 (Dec 20, 2010)

for a pro....fessional tiler maybe

the bucket is useful...great fro grout applications


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