# LLC with Lawyer $?



## JumboJack (Aug 14, 2007)

Legalzoom.....149.00 to 359.00..


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## HomeSealed (Jan 26, 2008)

Max Nomad said:


> With this discussion, the problem is that we're all in different states and have only been subjected to our own experiences with said regulations.
> 
> For example, here in Virginia, setting up an LLC from Tax-ID to local biz license to state certificate will cost you about $150 dollars or so. If you go to California the LLC doesn't cost much more than that either -- BUT they also have to pay an $800 dollar Franchise Tax (yes, $800 minimum). Add that up and then it'll make sense how come the average lawyer out there in Cali will charge about $1000 to set up an LLC.


 That is a good point. I guess the issue of whether or not it is justifed depends on how complicated and costly it is in your individual state.


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## outlaw (Jan 7, 2009)

I paid 1k for s-corp from a laywer. That included my seal and my papers. That also included the lawyer being my designated whatchamacallit for the first year. 

Hey, I charge top dollar and deliver first class for my services. I seek and expect the same from other professionals.


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

So far everyone is talking about less than $1,000. It's a minor investment for an important process that is only done once in the life of your business. Personally I'd rather be productive while the lawyer is doing the legwork and filing. In my case I was switching from a sole prop. to a partnership LLC. We were booked and had work to do.

2 things we do. Pay insurance premiums while hoping we never have to collect and buy legal advise while hoping to never have to test it.

Good Luck
Dave


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## Logic (Jan 29, 2009)

HomeSealed said:


> Attorneys are very useful in many cases, but this topic seems a little ridiculous. The analogies used are way off. Doing your own LLC is more like an HO applying for a permit to get a sunroom, not building one. There is nothing more than filing a few forms involved. In WI you can actually do the whole ball of wax including FEIN, etc, right on the state website and it guides you through the process. There is really not much room for error. Its not like you are drafting up your own contract/documents, you are filling in blanks...I agree that consulting with an attorney to figure out whether an LLC or S Corp, etc fits your needs better is advisable, but paying $750 to file a few papers with the state is not. Also, whether you follow all the procedures that protect you as an LLC in the course of running your business has nothing to do with who filed the paperwork. Johnny Cochran could've filed the papers but if I do something that exposes me to liability it won't make any difference....Whatever helps you sleep at night I guess.


 
very well put....:thumbup:


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## Blast&Coat (Jan 15, 2009)

www.incfile.com is what I used when we did ours 2 years back. They were great and it only cost me about $160. Including having them get the tax numbers for me electronically so I could open accounts and what not faster. 

I know depending on the state the fees are different. good luck


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## capital city (Mar 29, 2008)

I asked a lawyer what the difference between LLC and S Corp was and he didnt know. This guy was recommended by the Chamber or Commerce and said he did about 80 LLC's a year and wanted to charge $500. An accountant said they would charge $200 and then on Turbo Tax I seen an ad that they would do it for free just pay the filing fees.


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## rbsremodeling (Nov 12, 2007)

I am going to say this once and you guys can go back to arguing. 

YOUR ACCOUNTANT TELLS YOU WHAT TYPE OF CORP, LLC OR WHATEVER YOU NEED TO SETUP NOT THE LAWYER.

The lawyer sets you up after that decision has been made by your accountant. Trust me on this


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## Max Nomad (Aug 29, 2008)

rbsremodeling said:


> I am going to say this once and you guys can go back to arguing.
> 
> YOUR ACCOUNTANT TELLS YOU WHAT TYPE OF CORP, LLC OR WHATEVER YOU NEED TO SETUP NOT THE LAWYER.
> 
> The lawyer sets you up after that decision has been made by your accountant. Trust me on this


If it'll help RBS to clear up any misunderstandings with this, he's 100% correct with this. 

Normally it goes like this: 

The accountant will ask you some questions to determine your situation as far as partners/no partners, tax situation, etc. They'll also take into consideration local and state tax laws, too, and eventually make a recommendation. The lawyer (or legal service) will whip up the paperwork for you. 

The cool thing about it is that if you pay attention along every step of the way, you'll be able to set up another company using the same process without having to pay the accountant/lawyer all over again -- just fill out the proper paperwork and pay the filing fees.


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## WilsonRMDL (Sep 4, 2007)

File the papers yourself, have your lawyer/accountant look them over, pay for an hour of their time, problem solved. I paid $75 to file my papers in MI and you can get the IRS numbers yourself for free at www.irs.com not that hard. As far as liability goes, as long as you have a competent lawyer you'll be fine, maybe pay him/her a retainer fee just to keep them available when you have questions/concerns.


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## WoodShop (Feb 21, 2009)

I think you would be crazy to file your own papers. Who are you gonna call if you need legal help? I would call my lawyer who filed mine. To me this is not where you should save a buck. There is one thing that I do not sacrifice in my business, and that is 'CYA'. People are always looking to sue, I want a good relationship with my attorney if that day should come. 

Also I did not pay a dime for my LLC, I traded services with my attorney. A half day job in return for knowing you are legal for the life of your business seems like a fair trade to me.


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## bhe (Feb 3, 2007)

LNG24 said:


> Because RUNNING an LLC is more involved than filling out some paperwork. Publish the notice in the wrong paper at the wrong time, fail to keep your books in the correct order, forget to add LLC to one ad and you just allowed anyone to PIERCE the LLC protection.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## bhe (Feb 3, 2007)

*Best Practices for Avoiding Piercing the Corporate Veil


Never cause your corporation or LLC to pay you an amount that would render it insolvent, or any amount that would seem unreasonable to an outside observer. Document the justifications for large payments made to shareholders or members.
Keep separate financial records for your business and yourself, and maintain a separate bank account for the business. Avoid borrowing money from the company for personal expenses. If you absolutely have to withdraw funds from the business, make sure that you keep accurate records of how much was borrowed and when you paid it back. Charge yourself a reasonable interest rate for the loan.
Do not verbally assure creditors that you will personally take on the obligations of the corporation if the company proves unable to do so. Do not blend corporate and personal obligations.
If you operate as a corporation, make sure to observe the required corporate formalities, such as issuing stock, holding shareholder and board of directors meetings, keeping adequate minutes for meetings, and formally approving and documenting any transactions between the company and shareholders. For more on required corporate formalities, see the Corporation and the Corporate Records sections.
If you operate as an LLC, the same formalities are not required, but LLC members should observe certain formalities, such as keeping detailed financial records and recording minutes of major decisions.
* If you are looking for more.....http://www.citmedialaw.org/legal-guide/piercing-corporate-veil


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## Magnettica (Dec 19, 2006)

HomeSealed said:


> Attorneys are very useful in many cases, but this topic seems a little ridiculous. The analogies used are way off. Doing your own LLC is more like an HO applying for a permit to get a sunroom, not building one. There is nothing more than filing a few forms involved. In WI you can actually do the whole ball of wax including FEIN, etc, right on the state website and it guides you through the process. There is really not much room for error. Its not like you are drafting up your own contract/documents, you are filling in blanks...I agree that consulting with an attorney to figure out whether an LLC or S Corp, etc fits your needs better is advisable, but paying $750 to file a few papers with the state is not. Also, whether you follow all the procedures that protect you as an LLC in the course of running your business has nothing to do with who filed the paperwork. Johnny Cochran could've filed the papers but if I do something that exposes me to liability it won't make any difference....Whatever helps you sleep at night I guess.



Bingo! It was a piece of cake. It took less than an hour of my time to set up, and all of it was done online for $125. When I was done there was an IRS link to getting my FEIN number and that was a piece of cake too. I am lucky I have a close friend who is a lawyer and even he said I could do it myself without much problem so that's what I did. :notworthy


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## Vince_B (May 9, 2008)

When you hire an attorney to set up your LLC, you are paying for legal advice applied to your circumstances. Filling out the paperwork is the activity you see.

I think we as trades people have a hard time wrapping our minds around _paying_ for advice, or even _taking_ advice for that matter.

Legal fees are part of the business. If paying competent legal counsel to help you build a firewall between you and your assets is something you don't think is worthwhile then don't bother with it at all. Eventually you'll end up paying more to have an attorney fix your screwed up LLC.


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