# Hardwood Floor Pattern and End Joints



## 4yanx (Jul 23, 2007)

I've installed a number of hardwood floors for folks over the years. A few have used different widths and different wood types. Other than a couple with borders and one with a medallion, all have been strictly horizontal affairs with end joints staggered and no closer than 12 inches at adjacent boards.

A woman with a Chinese motif in her dining room has asked me to install a hardwood floor using 3" T&G American and Brazilian Cherry. She wants what is an Oriental-type geometric pattern which would have several consecutive pieces with the same end joint location. I know that staggering the end joints is advisable from an asthetic standpoint, but will I run into any structural problems with such a pattern that might result in long-term complaints (buckling or warping at the end joints)? I am wondering if I should do cookies at the end joints for stability. Or, am I worried for nothing. This lady is pretty picky and has a lot more work ro be done. I want to do this for her, lest she go elsewhere, but I want to do it right, too. I've searched for this on-line but about all I can find with regard to flooring patterns is herringbone.


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## camden09 (Dec 7, 2006)

I can mill your flooring for you!!!! Please let me know!!!


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## 4yanx (Jul 23, 2007)

With all due respect, I am not asking for milling work and your post smacks of advertising, which I thought was not allowed here.


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## JPhelps (Feb 26, 2007)

I found your post a little confusing but i'll offer my thoughts. You'll be looking at essentially the same expansion/contraction issues with a geometric floor, as opposed to one laid in a traditional way. As far as your endjoints, which Im' guessing are going to end in the same plane in several places, I would lay them out then route a groove or cut a tongue to engage the peice that will 'border' them. alot of the unfinished flooring i buy is not end matched, and imo when layed traditionally, as long as your subfloor is good and flat, there are no problems, no need for a biscuit or spline. I would reconsider biscuits or splines if i was laying something over 4".


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## JPhelps (Feb 26, 2007)

when i said route a groove or rip a tongue i meant route groove and rip tongue. a slip tongue to be glued in place. sorry if i'm confusing you.


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## 4yanx (Jul 23, 2007)

I am going to try posting a pic of the pattern I proposed and she is thrilled over. Now, I hope that I can carry this off. I don't seem to find anyone else doing stuff like this and I am fearful that there is a good reason why. :no: (?)

The darker color would be Brazilian Cheerry and the lighter American Cherry


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## Demal (Jul 24, 2007)

That looks cool! Looks like you only have three boards in a single line. I would think that the integrity would be fine myself as long as it is all t&g'd, but I have never done anything like that before. Can you post a pic when your finished?


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## Mike Costello (Aug 1, 2004)

Funky!

Make sure you get enough dough for that one.

Ive done stuff similar( although not as involved as that)

I just ripped the tongue off and grooved that side on a router table and used splines. I also used urethane adhesive underneath.

Love to see pics of it once your done


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## 4yanx (Jul 23, 2007)

Thanks. Routing the ends and using biscuits where several consecutives meet is what I was thinking of as a possibility and may well employ that. I did a few things this week for the same woman and now the wood has laid up in the room long enough such that I cannot stall her any more.  I will begin the floor install on Friday. Will post pics when complete. If, I should say! Ha! :laughing:

Oh yeah, the thing on the left is an alvoce where the China cabinet sits. Methinks it was once a closet and this room was once a bedroom.


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## PrecisionFloors (Jan 24, 2006)

As long as you spline it and make sure the sub floor is perfectly flat you shouldn't have any problems. I have done something similar in a 3.5" beveled edge oak(s) and didn't have any issues.
Gluing the joints with some Titebond wouldn't hurt either.


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## Mike Costello (Aug 1, 2004)

Ah Tightbond. That comapny should buy me a Carribean vacation with all the damn glue Ive bought from them


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## 4yanx (Jul 23, 2007)

PrecisionFloors said:


> As long as you spline it and make sure the sub floor is perfectly flat you shouldn't have any problems. I have done something similar in a 3.5" beveled edge oak(s) and didn't have any issues.
> Gluing the joints with some Titebond wouldn't hurt either.


 
Are you talking just those end joints that are consecutive , or all of the joints, end and edge? I have never glued a hardwood installation before, unless it was floating and thought that it went against recommendation because of our expand/contract friend.


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## 4yanx (Jul 23, 2007)

Here is a pic of what I accomplished today. Edges and trim tomorrow.


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## camden09 (Dec 7, 2006)

What did you charge for that??


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## 4yanx (Jul 23, 2007)

I still have no need for milling work.


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## PrecisionFloors (Jan 24, 2006)

Nice work, starting wall looks a little tight but you may have room under the drywall. I was referring to the consecutive end joints for the wood glue. I think you got it figured out though


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## 4yanx (Jul 23, 2007)

PrecisionFloors said:


> Nice work, starting wall looks a little tight but you may have room under the drywall. I was referring to the consecutive end joints for the wood glue. I think you got it figured out though


 
Thanks. You are exactly correct. There is room under the drywall! The owner is thrilled and that's what counts.


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## Mike Costello (Aug 1, 2004)

Looks great! Tell the customer to not put any furniture in there so they can enjoy it!..

Hey, wanna buy an undercut saw?lol


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## Teetorbilt (Feb 12, 2004)

Sweet! I would have canned some of the lighter colored Brazilian, the color is too close to the American. The pattern has some places that appear to blend as opposed to outline.


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## 4yanx (Jul 23, 2007)

Teetorbilt said:


> Sweet! I would have canned some of the lighter colored Brazilian, the color is too close to the American. The pattern has some places that appear to blend as opposed to outline.


 
No real need for canning. The contast is much better in person than in the pic. Plus, the woman's husband bought the wood sometime back and did not deliver on a promise top install it himself. I wound up with four pieces of Brazilian, each about 14 inches long! As such, I considered myself lucky that I even had enough. Seriously, though, I looked again at the pic and the contrast is much difference than as it llooks laid.

M. Costello. Does it look like I didn't use and undercut saw?


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