# Flat black ceiling has roller marks



## Easy Gibson (Dec 3, 2010)

I've run into this a couple times now and I'm not sure if my technique needs adjusting.

I get hired to paint home theatres occasionally and the ceilings are generally always flat black.  I always use Ben Moore Regal.
Unfortunately, I have never been able to get them looking good with two coats. There's almost always at least a few lap marks. The past few jobs have taken at least 3 coats. Some 4. 

I use an 18" 3/8 nap Doo Z to roll ceilings. Am I missing something?


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## KennMacMoragh (Sep 16, 2008)

Back brush?


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## avenge (Sep 25, 2008)

Are you priming? Try a different brand of paint. I would use a lesser quality line and prime with a dark gray high quality primer. Why are you using a 3/8" nap? Use a 1/2".


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## Easy Gibson (Dec 3, 2010)

I've always used 3/8 for new work.

Nobody ever actually taught me how to paint with regards to industry standards. I learned how to cut and roll when I was really young and it's been something I could always due to make some money. My technique is great, or so I thought until I met flat black. I never drip, no roller marks or dry edges, I'm clean as can be, and I can cut a line straight as an arrow.
I never got any schooling on roller naps, which brush to use, mixology, or anything like that though. I've just been feeling it out over the last few years working for a GC. Now that I'm on my own I've been painting more and more so I'm slowly filling in my knowledge gaps.
Grey primer is a great suggestion. I'll definitely do that for the next one.
I've always used Ben Moore for everything. SW occasionally but really only their 200 line impresses me.

Thanks again.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

Flat paints are porous - start putting on a new coat, and it will suck up the new paint, so almost immediately you're stuck with lap marks you can't roll out easily. Thin it to the max, and work fast. Sometimes rolling and cross rolling helps, but it's a completely different technique from what I normally use. I also retaper my covers to keep a feathered edge on the rolling.

If you're priming first on bare drywall, try Zinnser Cover Stain tinted.


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## avenge (Sep 25, 2008)

Easy Gibson said:


> I've always used 3/8 for new work.
> 
> Nobody ever actually taught me how to paint with regards to industry standards. I learned how to cut and roll when I was really young and it's been something I could always due to make some money. My technique is great, or so I thought until I met flat black. I never drip, no roller marks or dry edges, I'm clean as can be, and I can cut a line straight as an arrow.
> I never got any schooling on roller naps, which brush to use, mixology, or anything like that though. I've just been feeling it out over the last few years working for a GC. Now that I'm on my own I've been painting more and more so I'm slowly filling in my knowledge gaps.
> ...


SW 200 line is what I used on all ceilings, no need for top of the line for ceilings. More often than not a thinner paint will give better results and I hate when someone says lay it on thick. SW Problock latex is one of the best drywall primers I've used. They may have a deep base primer otherwise just make it as dark as possible. BM should have similar products. Haven't used BM in years, I use Pratt & Lambert now which is actually owned by SW.

Sounds like you have a knack for painting, which is what you need because I think it's something that can't be taught. Unfortunately most employees aren't the most knowledgeable at paint stores.


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## Easy Gibson (Dec 3, 2010)

I'm fortunate in that where I am we have a multitude of paint suppliers that have been around basically the whole time. hah

I did notice that one the third coat I did better the faster I went, thought I was definitely trying to lay it on pretty "thick" in order to keep it wet. It seems like I was on the trail of figuring out what hdavis was saying. Next time I'll thin it out a bit and try to maintain speed. Maybe upgrading to a 1/2" nap would help my cause as well.

Steady as she goes....


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## Rich D. (Oct 14, 2011)

Install black grid and black tiles...? No painting neccessary


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## Easy Gibson (Dec 3, 2010)

Thinking outside the box. I like it.


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## Rich D. (Oct 14, 2011)

Usg and certainteed makes them I know for sure. And it's flatblack. Probably will have to purchase full boxes from supplier though..


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## Easy Gibson (Dec 3, 2010)

I can't keep running forever. 

Eventually me and this flat black are going to have to come to terms with being in each others' lives.


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## We Fix Houses (Aug 15, 2007)

Seems like these 100% acrylic's are drying faster every day ?

Add just a bit of XIM or Flotrol.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Make sure that you are leading with the shank side of the roller allowing the unsupported side to feather as you roll.


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## Easy Gibson (Dec 3, 2010)

I've been using my 18" Big Ben which is a two sided arm dealie. Would it be better you think to downgrade to a 12" with the shank for less even pressure?
This is getting pretty deep here. Pretty stoked to roll another black ceiling. hah
I've never used any kind of additives before. I just go 100% from the can.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Easy Gibson said:


> I've been using my 18" Big Ben which is a two sided arm dealie. Would it be better you think to downgrade to a 12" with the shank for less even pressure?
> This is getting pretty deep here. Pretty stoked to roll another black ceiling. hah
> I've never used any kind of additives before. I just go 100% from the can.


I've not painted with much else. It's just what I am used to. I don't have any issues with roller marks. Maybe someone that uses a two armed handle can help.


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

We Fix Houses said:


> Seems like these 100% acrylic's are drying faster every day ?


I was thinking the same thing, over the weekend, painting my own house with Regal Select. It seems like it has less open time than I remember Aura having.


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## Easy Gibson (Dec 3, 2010)

Unfortunately we're in the age where nobody plans for anything. Behr has been leading the charge on crappy paint that dries instantly for the last decade or so.
Admittedly, they've gotten better with the overall quality of their paint, but the open time has only gotten less and less.

For Eric, Regal Select is NOT the same as Regal. Bowing the to pressure put on them by Behr, Ben Moore is phasing out the old Regal line in favor of Regal Select which is garbage paint/primer to appeal to the HGTV crowd that wants everything done yesterday.
I mean honestly, how pressed for time are people that they need paint to dry in 10 minutes? Breathe, relax. It'll all be fine. Put a coat on, drink a beer, repeat. hah


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

Easy Gibson said:


> Unfortunately we're in the age where nobody plans for anything. Behr has been leading the charge on crappy paint that dries instantly for the last decade or so.
> Admittedly, they've gotten better with the overall quality of their paint, but the open time has only gotten less and less.
> 
> For Eric, Regal Select is NOT the same as Regal. Bowing the to pressure put on them by Behr, Ben Moore is phasing out the old Regal line in favor of Regal Select which is garbage paint/primer to appeal to the HGTV crowd that wants everything done yesterday.
> I mean honestly, how pressed for time are people that they need paint to dry in 10 minutes? Breathe, relax. It'll all be fine. Put a coat on, drink a beer, repeat. hah


Unfortunately, Regal is being phased out for select in a lot of local places. I wouldn't really call it garbage, because it's great when it's done, it's just harder to work with. All the stuff I sprayed with a 210FF tip is mint.


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## Easy Gibson (Dec 3, 2010)

I'm not a CEO so clearly I'm not on this level, but I don't understand why they're making the decision to phase out Regal in favor of what in my mind is an inferior product(if only for working with it). I can only assume it's to keep in line with the increasing homeowner demand for "OMG paint with primer!??//".
I hear it all the time from homeowners. "Can't you get that high quality Behr paint and have the job done in one coat?"

No.


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## Skyvorima (Nov 3, 2013)

Ive done in home theater ceilings of different textures and the best solution Ive found is to drop the walls, chairs, and floor then spray it out. Flashing can happen for different reasons---some of which are out of your control---and after switching to spraying I never had the problem again.


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