# Corner bead problem



## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

It's strange, I don't think I've seen this before in a 10 year old house, many of the windows in this house have the mud coming off the corner beads. It looks like an adhesion issue. My guess is the builder used the wrong type of mud, or the corner beads were real dusty. You guys seen this issue often?


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## Sir Mixalot (Jan 6, 2008)

I've seen that many times before. It usually looks like the metal has oxidized. 

To repair it: I remove any mud that will come off> spray the areas with a can of Kilz> fiber tape > first coat hot mud and then AP. Unless it's only a couple corner beads to repair. :thumbsup:


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

They may have ran the bead with hot mud. It has a poor bond to metal .

If It's just the bead around the window wraps ..Could be a moisture issue ..The wood and board gets wet then drys out causing the wood and board to shrink then the bead to crush in ..Which causes the mud to pop loose. We call it bead crush.


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

I considered it might be a moisture related issue. It's on almost all of the windows to some extent. The outside stucco is sound no cracks. The home owner wants me to trim out all the windows with jams and casing. I don't want to cover up any potential moisture problems. I guess I have to pull off some drywall and look for tell tale sings...


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

I thought perhaps the framing lumber might have been wet and as it dried this was the result, sort of like nail pops.


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

Window frame gets cold, condensation, wallboard wicks it out, eventually compound starts to fail.

Used to get that on new builds. Then got the DW guys to hold the board off the vinyl 1/8". The painters caulk dw to window frame during prep.

It's not a cureall. Get enough humidity from a humidifier in winter up here, and visible moisture can still show up.


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## heavy_d (Dec 4, 2012)

I'm drywalling a basement right now and I got trimtex tear off L beads to prevent this if possible around the windows.


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## Big Shoe (Jun 16, 2008)

It's a bead issue. A mother load of 1980's homes here have that problem. 
I'm working in one right now. Multi million dollar. This whole high end development all have that bead issue. 
We've gone through entire homes scraping all the mud off 100% of the beads.
The painter is removing three rooms of wallpaper as we speak. I'm praying they don't peel all the mud off as they do it. ( I may be calling Paul to come down and help me out!)

And no, it's not a hot mud issue, cold or moisture related. :no:


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## Tom M (Jan 3, 2007)

Makes you lean toward using mesh as a second layer of defense. I see it too, I always assumed it was from temperature on metal breaking the bond or just dirty from day one.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

Big Shoe said:


> And no, it's not a hot mud issue, cold or moisture related. :no:


So you were there when the home was built. And you put the bead on and run them?


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## Windwash (Dec 23, 2007)

blacktop said:


> They may have ran the bead with hot mud. It has a poor bond to metal .
> 
> If It's just the bead around the window wraps ..Could be a moisture issue ..The wood and board gets wet then drys out causing the wood and board to shrink then the bead to crush in ..Which causes the mud to pop loose. We call it bead crush.


When you say "hot mud", are you talking about quick sand or durabond?


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

Windwash said:


> When you say "hot mud", are you talking about quick sand or durabond?


yes. Mix a little batch and smear it on a piece of fiberglass or metal and see how easy It Is to flake off!


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## Windwash (Dec 23, 2007)

blacktop said:


> yes. Mix a little batch and smear it on a piece of fiberglass or metal and see how easy It Is to flake off!


Ha! Although you didn't pick one, you must be talking about quick sand. You probably use a hawk but Durabond will make you wish you started cleaning your stainless mud pan about 5 minutes earlier if you try to go past the first booger that develops.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

Windwash said:


> Ha! Although you didn't pick one, you must be talking about quick sand. You probably use a hawk but Durabond will make you wish you started cleaning your stainless mud pan about 5 minutes earlier if you try to go past the first booger that develops.


All hot muds are the same ... Some a little better than others ...But they are all pretty much the same product .


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## Big Shoe (Jun 16, 2008)

blacktop said:


> So you were there when the home was built. And you put the bead on and run them?





blacktop said:


> yes. Mix a little batch and smear it on a piece of fiberglass or metal and see how easy It Is to flake off!


...


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## Big Shoe (Jun 16, 2008)

Sir Mixalot said:


> I've seen that many times before. It usually looks like the metal has oxidized.


Exactly.


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

blacktop said:


> All hot muds are the same ... Some a little better than others ...But they are all pretty much the same product .


I'm no expert drywaller, nor claim to be, but from my limited experience, the USG brand hot mud sticks to my metal pan like a mofo. I never buy the light crap, or the Hamilton or whatever that chit is that homodepot sells, since it doesn't seem to set up consistently.


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## mski (Apr 4, 2013)

Would it be possible the bead was dirty or had an oil film on it that prevented the mud from properly adhering?


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

Another thought:

If the corner bead problem is happening at the windows, but not at other locations in the same home, then it points more to temp/moisture as the culprit, and less to adhesion, oil, whatever.


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

SmallTownGuy said:


> Another thought:
> 
> If the corner bead problem is happening at the windows, but not at other locations in the same home, then it points more to temp/moisture as the culprit, and less to adhesion, oil, whatever.


The thought did cross my mind, however, all the other corners are rounded, so it's possible they where a different or cleaner material???


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

m1911 said:


> The thought did cross my mind, however, all the other corners are rounded, so it's possible they where a different or cleaner material???


That is certainly possible. Those pieces are run through a forming mill/press of some type, bound to be lube involved, bound to be ****-up factory days mixed in with the good ones - same as on the job site.

It's not like a mudder is gonna run his hand on every piece to check how oily or dry it is.

And no Mr. Moore, in all my years, I've never seen a _production mudder_ use hot mud. Just green lid, because hot mud costs money you know.

Maybe its a Michigan back woods thing.


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

I don't care much for the shiny 90s Tho I still use them from time to time .

The last batch I used was against my will.. Phillips bead.. [i won't get into why] 

I placed a 40'' piece in the bottom of a stairwell and coated it with blacktop a/p . So I could set the planks up ..The next day It looked like the OPs bead ..The mud popped right off. I was like:blink:

I checked out the stack of bead and, yes they were greasy . I tacked them on then took a piece of 120 sand paper in a fold and gave them a quick cleaning . That was 3 months ago ..I dropped by that home last week and everything looked good . Whenever I'm forced to use the shiny 90s I tape the flange with paper tape . 

Last fall I did a basement for a H/O that hung his own board and nailed on the bead ,,He coated a few bead and tried to tape a few seams with mesh of course !!! Then he gave up!! And called me. He was /Is an agriculture teacher at the local high school So I Schooled him!!!:laughing: He had 2 buckets of that L/W crap sitting in floor .. I didn't notice till I started tearing out his mesh and setting his tribillion screws that I noticed the L/W On his bead was pealing off..All I had to do was thump the bead with my finger and The mud just fell off.. I scraped the mud off and gave the beads a quick sand cleaning and my black top stuck just fine .. I blamed it on the L/W mud ..But thinking back I know He got his bead from the same supply that I deal with. I guess the greasy bead ain't a myth ...Not That I've seen this problem before ..It's new to me...And I've tacked on about 10,000 miles of shiny 90s And never seen mud just fall of like I have recently . 

My bead of choice is the USG B1 Superwides . You can run them with A/P Or Hot mud Both will stick just fine ..The other advantage to P/F Bead is no edge cracks or fastener pops . 


Drywall has many avenues tho!!!! You can take a home with the perfect conditions and have It loaded with a batch of rock that the supplier placed on the boom from the day before Without covering it ...Delivered in a rain storm ...? Attached to a wet green frame..? When I walk out the door some idiot walks in with a propane water hose heater and burns the house..? 

I went back to one home to fix screw pops after the homeowners lived there for 18 months after never having any issues till the hardwood floors started opening up. The floor guy told them it was a lack of moisture ...So they bought two huge humidifiers and place them in the basement and ran those damn things till water was dripping off the floor joist!! The floors closed up! The floor guy was right ... But the sheetrock went to chit . ALL the screws popped ..all the bead crushed in..All the seams peaked.. And this was a 2 story 2000 sg ft home .


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## blacktop (Oct 28, 2012)

SmallTownGuy said:


> That is certainly possible. Those pieces are run through a forming mill/press of some type, bound to be lube involved, bound to be ****-up factory days mixed in with the good ones - same as on the job site.
> 
> It's not like a mudder is gonna run his hand on every piece to check how oily or dry it is.
> 
> ...


I'm not a production mudder .. You'd be surprised at just how slow I am.. https://search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=sienfeld+mudder+youtube&ei=UTF-8&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-002



It's wallboard technician !!!!!


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

blacktop said:


> I'm not a production mudder .. You'd be surprised at just how slow I am.. https://search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=sienfeld+mudder+youtube&ei=UTF-8&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-002
> 
> It's wallboard technician !!!!!



I know Mr. Moore, I wanted to be clear that I wasn't trying to put you in the same group as our slap and go boys.

I also think you are on the money with your earlier reply too.:thumbsup:


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## elliot (Jan 24, 2009)

Its definitely oil from when the holes were punched, some pieces missed the degreaser ive had it happen a bunch of times but not in a long while.i just spray with degreaser and spray prime then coat


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