# Apron/Block plane for trimming and miter relief - suggestions?



## Justin Huisenga (Apr 10, 2013)

Spencer said:


> I have no problem dropping money on tools, but for some reason I have a hard time dropping $115 for a block plane. I guess I've just never used one so I'm wondering where I'm really going to use one.
> 
> What applications do you use a block plane in most for on site finish carpentry?


You don't necessarily have to. You can get something like a Stanley 60 1/2. There is usually tune up and flattening involved with one of these. The iron is OK but doesn't take or hold the edge of something like A2 steel that would be used stock on a Lie Nielson or Veritas. There are upgrade after market blades available. 

I like the Lie Nielson for its size, weight, and the way it feels in my hand. It's comfortable for me and is very well made. I'd get rid of all my Festool sanders before I gave up my block plane. 

I most frequently use one for tweaking/adjusting/back beveling miters and tuning scribes duck's ass tight. You can ease an edge quickly, flatten a corner on a door jamb that doesn't quite line up, tweak the gaps on a door that doesn't fit quite right, change the angle of a miter a bit to make it fit without walking back to the saw, and many more things. It saves a lot of foot steps to and from a cut or work station.


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

Justin Huisenga said:


> You don't necessarily have to. You can get something like a Stanley 60 1/2. There is usually tune up and flattening involved with one of these. The iron is OK but doesn't take or hold the edge of something like A2 steel that would be used stock on a Lie Nielson or Veritas. There are upgrade after market blades available.
> 
> I like the Lie Nielson for its size, weight, and the way it feels in my hand. It's comfortable for me and is very well made. I'd get rid of all my Festool sanders before I gave up my block plane.
> 
> I most frequently use one for tweaking/adjusting/back beveling miters and tuning scribes duck's ass tight. You can ease an edge quickly, flatten a corner on a door jamb that doesn't quite line up, tweak the gaps on a door that doesn't fit quite right, change the angle of a miter a bit to make it fit without walking back to the saw, and many more things. It saves a lot of foot steps to and from a cut or work station.


I'm can see I'd find a lot of uses for a plane. I think I've learned to work around not having one, its one of those things that would take a while to realize all its used I imagine.


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## Joemack1 (Oct 5, 2013)

If you think block planes are expensive don't look up jap sharpening stones.


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## Justin Huisenga (Apr 10, 2013)

Spencer said:


> I'm can see I'd find a lot of uses for a plane. I think I've learned to work around not having one, its one of those things that would take a while to realize all its used I imagine.


There's lots of uses. I personally wouldn't want to be without one. 

If you want to get in cheaper you can try eBay. Look for Stanley, Millers Falls, or Record with an adjustable mouth. 

Here's a link to Hock Iron block plane blades. They are a very noticable upgrade to the stock iron. http://www.hocktools.com/products/bl.html


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## Justin Huisenga (Apr 10, 2013)

Joemack1 said:


> If you think block planes are expensive don't look up jap sharpening stones.


Some of the Japanese stones are insane. I think the one I got was about $50 or $60 dollars from Rockler. It's a little soft but does a decent job.

You can spend some crazy money on sharpening tools and accessories. The Tormek and attachments go for between $400 and $1700 depending on wheel size and package. Nice set up but damn.


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

Justin Huisenga said:


> Some of the Japanese stones are insane. I think the one I got was about $50 or $60 dollars from Rockler. It's a little soft but does a decent job.
> 
> You can spend some crazy money on sharpening tools and accessories. The Tormek and attachments go for between $400 and $1700 depending on wheel size and package. Nice set up but damn.


Its like anything, make the best, or more importantly make people believe its the best, and there will be those who will buy it because there will always be those who want the best of a certain item.


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## asevereid (Jan 30, 2012)

Justin Huisenga said:


> Some of the Japanese stones are insane. I think the one I got was about $50 or $60 dollars from Rockler. It's a little soft but does a decent job.
> 
> You can spend some crazy money on sharpening tools and accessories. The Tormek and attachments go for between $400 and $1700 depending on wheel size and package. Nice set up but damn.


It's certainly no water stone....but I'm happy with my granite slab and sandpaper :thumbup:


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## Justin Huisenga (Apr 10, 2013)

asevereid said:


> It's certainly no water stone....but I'm happy with my granite slab and sandpaper :thumbup:


It's a good method. :thumbsup: I've tried it. That's how I flatten plane soles.

This is what I meant by starting an argument:laughing:. Thanks Travis


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## tjbnwi (Feb 24, 2009)

Float glass with emery cloth.

Tom


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## duburban (Apr 10, 2008)

I can't imagine finish work without a low angle block plane. 

If you need just one to try out get the lie neilson or lee valley low angle block plane. The neilson feels great to me but if you have bigger hands you may want the lee valley. I think lee valley makes a low angle rabbet plane which is ideal in certain situations. 

If your new to to all this get either of those planes and the lee valley angle guide for sharpening and your good to go.


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## Xtrememtnbiker (Jun 9, 2013)

Justin Huisenga said:


> You're gonna start a fight with that question
> 
> For the first grind on a chisel or iron I hollow grind it on a low speed wet grinder. I used to use a regular bench grinder but it's too easy to over heat and burn the edge. If you see a purple/black scorch mark you've just screwed up the temper and it won't hold an edge right. I then use a double sided Jap stone to flatten the back and hone the cutting edge. I used to do this freehand but recently purchased a Veritas honing guide to make it a bit easier and faster. I then go to a leather and plywood strop charged with stropping compound to polish the edge and back to a mirror finish. When I'm done I can shave with it without pulling hair. There are other techniques but I like these.
> 
> ...


I got the Stanley Sweethearts.

http://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B0051PCQ7Y/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1


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## tjbnwi (Feb 24, 2009)

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> I got the Stanley Sweethearts.
> 
> http://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B0051PCQ7Y/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1


Your dad is going to cut you off soon.

Tom


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## Xtrememtnbiker (Jun 9, 2013)

tjbnwi said:


> Your dad is going to cut you off soon.
> 
> Tom


Let's just say if I'm spending less $500, I don't ask him anymore. He would rather not be bothered. When I called him about the Planex, I was trying to explain the tool, the uses for the tool, and why I thought it'd be good for us.

He interrupts me and says "Travis, just buy it, I don't need to know all about it, if you'll have fun using it, buy it."

It's almost disappointing when you ask about a $2,500 purchase and he's never heard of it before and says yes in under a minute. I used to get to sell stuff to him...

Business is good. We do work that gets us more business, Dad estimates, I buy tools... it just keeps working. :thumbup:


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## Justin Huisenga (Apr 10, 2013)

Xtrememtnbiker said:


> I got the Stanley Sweethearts.
> 
> http://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B0051PCQ7Y/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1


A buddy of mine has a couple and liked them. I went vintage for my good set. Stanley Everlasting. Haven't been made in this style since WWII.


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## kwunch (Apr 27, 2014)

asevereid said:


> It's certainly no water stone....but I'm happy with my granite slab and sandpaper :thumbup:


I use granite and sandpaper to lap my water stones back to flat, but since I don't do much involving chisels the water stones are only for honing straight razor back into shaving shape.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

...


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## Joemack1 (Oct 5, 2013)

Justin nice set of chisels,and planes. I haven't seen that set of chisels in that good of shape. Every once and awhile I will see one nice chisel but never the whole set.


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

I ordered the 102 with case and extra blade.


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## Justin Huisenga (Apr 10, 2013)

Joemack1 said:


> Justin nice set of chisels,and planes. I haven't seen that set of chisels in that good of shape. Every once and awhile I will see one nice chisel but never the whole set.


Thanks,

They didn't start out looking like that. I am a single insomniac with more than my fair share of OCD.

I inherited a couple from my great grandfather (who apparently painted his tool handles green) and they felt right in my hand. I found them one at a time at flee markets or on Ebay (when the collectors didn't drive the price up) and cleaned them up. The hardest part was flattening the backs. There are more people out there who sharpen things with a belt sander than I would have thought.


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## EricBrancard (Jun 8, 2012)

Justin Huisenga said:


> Thanks,
> 
> They didn't start out looking like that. I am a single insomniac with more than my fair share of OCD.
> 
> I inherited a couple from my great grandfather (who apparently painted his tool handles green) and they felt right in my hand. I found them one at a time at flee markets or on Ebay (when the collectors didn't drive the price up) and cleaned them up. The hardest part was flattening the backs. There are more people out there who sharpen things with a belt sander than I would have thought.


I'm pretty sure that OCD is mandatory for the kind of work you produce.


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## Justin Huisenga (Apr 10, 2013)

EricBrancard said:


> I'm pretty sure that OCD is mandatory for the kind of work you produce.


Thank you.
OCD and trim guys kind of go hand in hand. It kinda sucks though having to open and close the door 7 times when I get home from work.:laughing:


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## Texas Wax (Jan 16, 2012)

Justin Huisenga said:


> Thank you.
> OCD and trim guys kind of go hand in hand. It kinda sucks though having to open and close the door 7 times when I get home from work.:laughing:


:laughing: Sucks can't turn it off, right? 



Justin Huisenga said:


> There are more people out there who sharpen things with a belt sander than I would have thought.


Yes many more than you thought with black and blue edges too :whistling


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## tjbnwi (Feb 24, 2009)

Had to use my RAS today to "sharpen" a chisel. Went to do one job, ended up doing another. Never planned on needing the chisel, all I had was a beater chisel with me.

Tom


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## Xtrememtnbiker (Jun 9, 2013)

I just bought the setup for sharpening mine. Looking forward to having a chisel that's sharper than I've ever used before. Gonna have to buy a plane or two soon as well...


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

I use an old Stanley block plane, nothing fancy. I just keep it sharp with a 600 grit diamond stone. I use all the time, it's always in my belt.


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

a SHARP block plane on high end stain grade work is used all the time...

as is a SHARP chisel....

did I mention it needs to be sharp and kept that way....:thumbsup:

one last thing it needs to be sharp.....:thumbup::whistling


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

griz said:


> a SHARP block plane on high end stain grade work is used all the time...
> 
> as is a SHARP chisel....
> 
> ...


don't forget it need to be real sharp... :laughing: :laughing:


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

I tell myself I'm going to keep my chisels sharp and only use certain ones for the "safe" applications. They all end up dull as spoons. Maybe if I dropped some serious coin on a couple I'd take care of them better.


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## Justin Huisenga (Apr 10, 2013)

Texas Wax said:


> :laughing: Sucks can't turn it off, right?
> 
> 
> 
> Yes many more than you thought with black and blue edges too :whistling


Between the door, having to avoid stepping on the grout joints in the kitchen, and the temporary dyslexia from cutting crown in position I'm a mess when i get home.

I can understand sharpening a beater quick like on a belt sander. I sharpen my glaziers bar and 5 in 1 on my belt sander combo. Sharpening even a half way decent chisel on one makes it basically useless. Without a flat black and square straight edge there's no way to use an edge tool accurately. You're right it's abuse.:thumbsup:


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## Justin Huisenga (Apr 10, 2013)

Spencer said:


> I tell myself I'm going to keep my chisels sharp and only use certain ones for the "safe" applications. They all end up dull as spoons. Maybe if I dropped some serious coin on a couple I'd take care of them better.


You don't need to spend big money to get decent chisels. I've tried some of the nicer ones from Veritas and Ashley Iles and they didn't feel right in my hand but an inexpensive Japanese chisel from Japan Woodworker did.

http://www.japanwoodworker.com/Product/156571/1-Japan-Woodworker-Bench-Chisel.aspx

They take and hold a good edge but won't break the bank.


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

> Thank you for ordering from Highland Woodworking.
> 
> We are temporarily sold out of:
> 
> ...


Well that's just lovely...


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## Justin Huisenga (Apr 10, 2013)

Looks like you can order straight from the company.

https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/block-planes/small-block-planes?node=4072


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## superseal (Feb 4, 2009)

They got some nice looking stuff!

I gotta upgrade my equipment for sure :laughing:


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## m1911 (Feb 24, 2009)

superseal said:


> They got some nice looking stuff!
> 
> I gotta upgrade my equipment for sure :laughing:


I got one of those yankee screwdrivers, real old and made in germany, maybe early Festool :laughing:


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## Justin Huisenga (Apr 10, 2013)

superseal said:


> They got some nice looking stuff!
> 
> I gotta upgrade my equipment for sure :laughing:


Here's a cheap upgrade for you Yankee driver. 

Take a regular modern bit tip holder and chuck it into a drill press backwards. Use the drill press like a lathe and with a file resting on a block of scrap used as a spacer grind the shank of the bit holder down so it will fit into the jaw of the Yankee. One it slides in easily use one of the old driver bits as a pattern for the retaining notches. Cut in the notches on a bench grinder or with a mini grinder. The whole process takes about 5-10 min.

You can change tips as easily as on a regular drill and the screws won't want to slip off damaging hand and material as is common with the old Yankee bits. I like Yankee drivers for lock sets and machine screws on door hardware.


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## Joemack1 (Oct 5, 2013)

Spencer I would start with a cheap stanley first. Learn to sharpen it and see how much you will use it. I personally don't use my lie Nelson on anything but inside and use the stanley on exterior trim and siding. You might not use a plane as much as you think. It all depends on your type of work.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

Spencer said:


> I have no problem dropping money on tools, but for some reason I have a hard time dropping $115 for a block plane. I guess I've just never used one so I'm wondering where I'm really going to use one.
> 
> What applications do you use a block plane in most for on site finish carpentry?


Last year I spent $80 or so on a "Wood River" (woodcraft) low angle block plane. Now I'm glad I have it. Great for shaving something off the top or upper edges of doors in old houses. 

Today I was running crown and was wrapping around a chase in the middle of the room. I was a hair short on my piece with the two outside corners, so I opted to remove some material from the back of one of the side pieces (I was low on material). That allowed me to close the gap on the miters. Fit like a glove.

Another use was to tweak some frames on some bifold doors before painting them. They were bowing toward each other a bit and I wasn't about to return them.

Another use would be running base on a floor with a bump (old house or whatever). Easy to remove some material from the bottom. Not that it happens often, but it did just happen to me.


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## Spencer (Jul 6, 2005)

I ordered direct from Nielsen this morning and I got a notice already that they shipped it out this morning. Forget the middle man.


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## brhokel606 (Mar 7, 2014)

And this thread is another reason why I love CT! I had never heard of or seen anyone using a plane to fine tune trim, what a perfect solution to speed things up! I have always returned to the saw to tweek a cut or change the degree a hair, where a plane would knock the heavy edge off perfect. THANK YOU GUYS

The sharp chisel part I need to get better at. Every few jobs I'll buy a new Stanley, Irwin or whatever chisel and say it's my good one, until I find that hidden trim nail or drop it on the concrete, etc...

I need to learn to sharpen, I have tried with my knives as I am a knife freek and they are razor sharp but it is a very difficult skill to get just right. It's kind of like a shoe polisher, I can shine my shoes and they look good but take it to a pro and those babies will blind passerby's. I need to master the "Art of Sharpening".


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

Don't forget to get Lion Miter trimmer, much faster than a block plane

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQhktaEgWhQ


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