# Master carpenter?



## fci

The other day I was asked if I was a Master carpenter or if I was certified. I told them no. I knew I had more experience than the project called for and was able to easily convince them of that.
My question, is there any importance to being a so called master carpenter or certified?


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## Leo G

My wife says I'm certifiable....

Being certified usually means you have taken a class(es) and passed tests in doing or working with certain materials or procedures.

Being a master carpenter is a tough thing. You must know just about everything about building. From proper technique in nailing to making a complex roofing system without the help from references. Usually 20+ years of experience is required.


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## fci

*Done*

22 years. I wonder how the certification committee views experience? It was explained to me that the five different types of carpentry were:
1. framing
2. form work which would include concrete castings, both decorative and structural
3. furniture
4. interior and exterior residential and commercial trim
5. cabinetry


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## stp57

I wished that I had worked for a Master Carpenter over the years. I work for myself now, but I would have learned so much more with a MC. Unfortunately, every general contractor/ carpenter I ever worked for was either a con-artist or couldn't do good bids & went belly up.
I can't do good bids myself so I charge by the hour.
Steve


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## BKFranks

This is taken from an interview with Norm Abram.

*Quote:*Kevin started the show by saying "it is a term that's thrown around loosely, but today we thought we would try to get to the heart of the definition and who better to help us then our very own master craftsman, Norm Abram". Kevin then asked Norm, "What's a master craftsman and how do you define it". Norms reply, "It's not a classification or position, it's really a level of craft that you aspire to. You start out as an apprentice, then you become a journeyman and eventually the master. Now once you're a master craftsman you now have the ability to teach the next wave of apprentices and journeyman (pause) keeps the craft and tradition alive".

So there you have it, though there is no official "master craftsman" certification for what Norm does, that's how Norm defines his status as a master crafsman.


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## Bill

I thought Bob Vila was the only true master carpenter?


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## Leo G

BKFranks said:


> This is taken from an interview with Norm Abram.
> 
> *Quote:*Kevin started the show by saying "it is a term that's thrown around loosely, but today we thought we would try to get to the heart of the definition and who better to help us then our very own master craftsman, Norm Abram". Kevin then asked Norm, "What's a master craftsman and how do you define it". Norms reply, "It's not a classification or position, it's really a level of craft that you aspire to. You start out as an apprentice, then you become a journeyman and eventually the master. Now once you're a master craftsman you now have the ability to teach the next wave of apprentices and journeyman (pause) keeps the craft and tradition alive".
> 
> So there you have it, though there is no official "master craftsman" certification for what Norm does, that's how Norm defines his status as a master crafsman.


 
Heeeeyyyyy, that makes me a master craftsman. :clap:


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## Bill

I have 6 children, so that makes me a master babymaker!


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## neolitic

USP45 said:


> I have 6 children, so that makes me a master babymaker!


Errrrr, not unless you *teach* the craft. :whistling
:laughing::laughing:


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## Bill

neolitic said:


> Errrrr, not unless you *teach* the craft. :whistling
> :laughing::laughing:


dont think the Mrs would appreciate that


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## Kent Whitten

I'm a master debater and cunning linguist.

saying master carpenter IMO doesn't mean ****. Carpenter is just too general of a term. Framer, finish, flooring, siding......all have their specialties. I don't go around saying I'm a master framer.

If you want to look at it in a broad sense, I think most people who call themselves master.....whatever...is something like 7 years or 10 years. 

Maybe you just like being called "master", making you feel important. Not my gig, I already know where I stand and where most everyone else does in my field


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## VitoFromNJ

I second that, master debater...Want to get a room?


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## Bill

Probably a power trip. They want to feel important. I have been a framer, trim man, siding man, painter, roofer and so on for over 20 years and I can honestly say that even though I have learned a lot over the years from older and sometimes younger people, I do not know it all, so how can I say I am master anything? Anyone who says they know it all is full of BS!


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## Bill

VitoFromNJ said:


> I second that, master bater...Want to get a room?


Sounds personal


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## cmansmith

*well*

I am pretty sure master carpenter is a union thing. I hired a master carpenter once and he wasn't worth a damn. This guy was scary. I sent him to cut plates and I thought he was going to cut off his pecker. Then I sent him to build headers, so he nails one side, stands the header up on edge and starts shooting towards himself. I had to let him go. It was a good thing I brought my check book that day.


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## novicepro

Everyone's a master handyman on CL:laughing: "they do it all"


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## ChrWright

This was posted in a thread awhile back:










I'm pretty sure the guy who made this was a Master. 

http://www.contractortalk.com/showthread.php?t=33554


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## pfloyd

I thought a "Master Carpenter" could do _everything_ to build a structure, including plumbing and electrical. At least, I thought that was how it used to be.


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## JPC2

ChrWright - that box truly must belong to a master carpenter. I see that as being essentially priceless. To know how to efficiently use every tool in there is a wealth of knowledge rarely seen these days. We take technology for granted sometimes. Picture having electricity knocked out for some unkown reason (and no backup), and then you break out that box and keep on gettin' it (but slower, obviously). Swweeeeeet.


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## silvertree

I have over 30 years as a carpenter, plus I'm certified.
My business card says Master Carpenter. When I think about it I remember all the guys I've met who were better than me, but not better at everything.
I have had plenty of apprentices and one went on to become head of the carpentry department at the U of M. This person called me once and thanked me for sharing what I knew.
Am I a Master Carpenter? Well I'm not an apprentice or journeyman. At my best, yes, on a bad day, I'm not. Whatever floats your boat I guess.


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## Marky Stone

LOL im 25 im gonna knock it out while i can


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## BattleRidge

Im pretty sure master carpenter is reserved for someone that does high quality work at their own pace. Not someone that slams metal studs.

this was built by a master http://www.theyellowstoneclub.com/land/residenceDetail.aspx?id=68

thats where our market is, making something go from a pile of wood into this. Anyone can put studs uprite fast.


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## JPC2

BattleRidge said:


> this was built by a master http://www.theyellowstoneclub.com/land/residenceDetail.aspx?id=68
> 
> thats where our market is, making something go from a pile of wood into this. Anyone can put studs uprite fast.


Hey man that's beautiful. Do you build those?


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## BattleRidge

Im only 21 so I don' thave near the experience to do log like that, I don't build them, I do work on them, I sub the rock on many and siding jobs on some, one of the cedar ones I posted up some of my siding pictures, I'll post my last sheetrock one on a HUGE vault. These projects are built by the best custom builders from all over. I sub hourly work for like 20 bucks an hour to them sometimes just to learn how to do the beam work. I help with this one but mainly just as a pee-on with the beams, its not really my expertise......yet.


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## neolitic

BattleRidge said:


> Im only 21 so I don' thave near the experience to do log like that, I don't build them, I do work on them, I sub the rock on many and siding jobs on some, one of the cedar ones I posted up some of my siding pictures, I'll post my last sheetrock one on a HUGE vault. These projects are built by the best custom builders from all over. I sub hourly work for like 20 bucks an hour to them sometimes just to learn how to do the beam work. I help with this one but mainly just as a pee-on with the beams, its not really my expertise......yet.


That's how you learn.
Eyes open, mouth shut, back sore! :laughing:


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## Marky Stone

BattleRidge said:


> Im pretty sure master carpenter is reserved for someone that does high quality work at their own pace. Not someone that slams metal studs.
> 
> this was built by a master http://www.theyellowstoneclub.com/land/residenceDetail.aspx?id=68
> 
> thats where our market is, making something go from a pile of wood into this. Anyone can put studs uprite fast.


I might SLAm metal suds but i get paid 55 an hour to do it, Im sure theres not to many guys working in that cabin making that kind of money.


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## Bill

neolitic said:


> That's how you learn.
> Eyes open, mouth shut, back sore! :laughing:


Thats right, and do not forget, pay attention to what us old people say and do. We been doing this stuff way too long:clap:


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## WarnerConstInc.

Well congragulations you want a cookie.

I know a few 'masters' They are the ones I call when I have a problem or situation that I know only someone that has done this for their entire life know. I think any more that one would have a hard time being a master carpenter with all the new "revolutionary" products that just keep coming out. The guys that can make new things that match the old things that true master craftsman made are probably the closest you will get now days.


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## Marky Stone

BattleRidge said:


> Im pretty sure master carpenter is reserved for someone that does high quality work at their own pace. Not someone that slams metal studs.
> 
> this was built by a master http://www.theyellowstoneclub.com/land/residenceDetail.aspx?id=68
> 
> thats where our market is, making something go from a pile of wood into this. Anyone can put studs uprite fast.


Im actually doing a interior fit out of a municipal building that is a log cabin as we speak. Everything is prefabbed at the shop they bring it on site and put it together. On all the partion walls I had to use a circ saw and a chain saw to hog out the logs so the dry wall can return into it. Its a night mare building partitions inside the everything has to be installed so the building can settle up and down 2" throught the seasons.


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## behrco

I think master carpenter just makes the homeowner feel better . For instance do you want us to send our master carpenter or just the average one we have he 's not bad he just bought his last chisel he needed for a complete set of tools.


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## wallmaxx

stp57 said:


> I wished that I had worked for a Master Carpenter over the years. I work for myself now, but I would have learned so much more with a MC. Unfortunately, every general contractor/ carpenter I ever worked for was either a con-artist or couldn't do good bids & went belly up.
> I can't do good bids myself so I charge by the hour.
> Steve


Wow, I saw Conroe TX in your profile and I had to say hey. I met my wife playing volleyball at the YMCA on loop 336 back in 1993. I used to live in those apts across from the Wal-Mart / Ryan's area on the loop.

You take care and I hope Ike didn't mess with you too much

Mike


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## gusthehonky

Once in a while I gotta use my brain...............I now crown myself MASTERMIND.

Seriously, I feel that it is a title truly earned by members and peers of your given trade. Unions may designate it by time served but talent cannot be taught in a million years. Time may enable one to mimic or copy the work of a true "Master", but the choice and application of methods proper for particular situation and their success is the final proof, time and time again.


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## KennMacMoragh

I have never heard the word master carpenter. Some people use the word journeymen or apprentice. Journeymen meaning you can go out and do just about anything on your own. And if you have your own business, you just put builder or contractor.


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## silvertree

What is a Master Carpenter? I think after so much experience you reach Master status. I have heard some guys say you are a Master if someone else calls you one. Some guys say (with false modesty) that only a few people they've met in their life approach this elevation. Baloney. If you are a Master Plumber or Electrician after 5 years, you can certainly be a Master Carpenter if your experience bears this out. Carpentry is many things, a great framer is a Master carpenter, or a great trim guy is, or a remodelor who does good work and satisfies the majority of his clients. If you have earned Master status, drop the phony humble attitude. Enjoy the respect, because the world is full of wanna bee's who tell everyone they are Masters and go through each day making life difficult for the rest of us.
Do you teach others the fine points of the trade, do you consult with homeowners, do you build from plans?
Whats that make you?
I still have a lot to learn, but no one can know everything, but I have learned a lot and will continue to learn.

Paul Lesieur/ Master Carpenter 35 years in the trades.:thumbsup:


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## Craft-man

I worked on a fishing boat for a while.... 




I guess i am a considerd a Master Baiter :whistling


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## Driftwood

*Well, guess,I am,who knows*

Ok, One of these days with help from Wife ,I'll post our work.47 Years so far.
Son's 37 had Him on a roof nailing shingles when He was 7, on Cape Cod Mass.
Some things We both can do. Any found. work, frame any structure, Lay out
any roof [ hips, valleys] , Layout any staircase [ winders] This includes the 
entire finished ballistrade. Roof .I also have 2 roof Kettles. Any kind of trim. I also was a cert. welder in the pile drivers union for years. We sub NATA! In Calif. We are able to LEGALLY, PULL all our plumbing and Elec. permits , on our remodels.I do all the plumbing By Myself,Son does all the wiring including service change outs. We also have a back hoe and large Dump truck. Now We couldn't do all this in another state! BUT WE ARE BOTH CA.LICENSED GENERAl B CALIFORNIA CONTRACTORS. You'll noticed I didn't say N.Y , N.H. MASS.
On the carpentry end,what I listed ANY journeyman Carpenter should be able to do without a hitch ! That's what I was taught in Mass. Years ago. Drift


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## woodworkbykirk

i'm a certified carpenter here in canada, to get this one must have 8000 hrs and 20 courses under your belt. journeyman certification is a red seal.

we also have "Gold Seal" Carpenter, which means you have your Red Seal and a B.A. . To work as a Superintendent with a Union Company being a carpenter you must have the Gold seal. I know a few Gold Seals. i know a few carpenters who lost their jobs as long term supers because they didnt want to go to university for a B.A to in order to get Gold Seal status

as for Master carpenter, i had this discussion with someone a while back and his understanding is that their is the actual title of "Master" which requires you to have 10 additional years under your belt after becoming a Journeyman and write a test that is for more in depth than the Journeyman exam, also their is a practical portion. Now whether or not this is true i dont know

If someone Can Build a house start to finish, without any head scratching, minimal mistakes other than the wrong paint color going on the wall. and everything is immaculate. Thats a master


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## silvertree

Good for Canada, over here you buy a tool belt, borrow a circular saw, get your magnetic signs and advertise on Craigslist. You are now a Master Cluster Fu**er! Why you would need a BA doesn't make sense, well maybe to the people selling education it does.


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## woodworkbykirk

the ba is for guys in charge of large scale commercial jobs. On multi-million dollar jobs they want guys with some business courses as well as "in the know" of how a job should run, as opposed to just a guy who cuts wood and is a ******* to everyone to make sure things get done on time


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## Snow Man

If you can place the sill foam on top of your foundation to shingling the roof , read prints ,not have to jack the home up 3'' at the end ...... "GET PAID " , then your a master.


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## billy d

Well thanks very much for the answer Willworkforbeer!At least I think it was an answer!


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## willworkforbeer

billy d said:


> Well thanks very much for the answer Willworkforbeer!At least I think it was an answer!


Its just the alcohol talking.


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## nj handyman

the guy who built the box was a piano maker, so perhaps those round tools had something to do with that.

http://www.phoenixmasonry.org/masonicmuseum/tool_chest_made_by_studley.htm


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## naptown CR

sk071077 said:


> I went to what is supposed to be one of the better trade schools in the country in New York.
> 
> That wouldn't be in wellsville would it?


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## deck king

willworkforbeer said:


> Sometimes I'll refer to myself as a master carpenter, there are so many dumbasses out there and narrowly talented guys I feel I can get away with it, I can build a house from footers up to the cabinets from scratch, however I have yet to see the guy who could do it all effeceintly and make money at every phase with his own hands. Doesnt leave much room for business either.


That the best answer I've heard so far. I once built a spiral stair case out of straight Mahogany, It took me about 4 months. about 3 weeks after I finished I found an ad for custom made ones, it would have been cheaper
to buy it. So I would add to your statement " and be profitable"


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## neolitic

billy d said:


> Red horse you say you have the tools in this box.So i have a question it's a genuine question and I'm not trying to bust your balls here.
> In the left hand till just above the masonic sign there are brass disc's 2 seem to have handles on them what kind of tools are they,what are they called and what function do they have.
> Sorry thats 3 questions but it's just bugged me for so long.
> I await you enlightenment. billy


Here's a little bit about the chest,
http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00088.asp
I think I saw a diagram listing
the contents once.
Since it is at the Smithsonian, maybe 
there is something more on their site?


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## mics_54

I think if a man came to work for me as a carpenter and brought a tool chest like that I would have to send him home.


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## neolitic

nj handyman said:


> the guy who built the box was a piano maker, so perhaps those round tools had something to do with that.
> 
> http://www.phoenixmasonry.org/masonicmuseum/tool_chest_made_by_studley.htm


Yeah, that's it!
http://www.phoenixmasonry.org/masonicmuseum/studley_1993_tool_chest_article.htm
Knew I saw that some where. 
It's harder to read here, but if one doesn't 
have the magazine.....


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## wallmaxx

*This Guy Is A Master Carpenter*

http://www.contractortalk.com/f11/richard-louis-dick-proenneke-one-hell-man-64763/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Proenneke

http://www.lakeclarkair.com/dick_proenneke.html


If you watch this on PBS you will be blown away!


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## JustaFramer

mics_54 said:


> I think if a man came to work for me as a carpenter and brought a tool chest like that I would have to send him home.



Then you would offer to buy it from him so he could feed his family.


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## Panhead Jack

*What is a master carpenter?*

I'm a Union Journeyman Carpenter with over 30 years experience. I've built Dams, worked in Nuke plants, built shopping centers/store build out's, recording studios for professional musicians, high dollar safe/panic rooms for wealthy clients, Homes, high dollar stables, etc. etc. So. Let me weigh in on the Master Carpenter designation. In my humble opinion, we will never really know who the Masters amongst us are until we have some sort of testing/examination procedure that will be open only to people with verified "bona fides" that first must be determined. Until then, they will be appointed by others. 
I view the Master carpenter as one who is the lead carpenter on the job. On large commercial/industrial jobs there is a carpenters foreman. He is the Master. Just as the Capt. is the Master of the vessal, he has a sailing master under him. There may be other carpenters who are more accomplished in certain areas of the trade, but they answer to the Master. A good Master will utilize the talents of these men. That's called leadership. I've been designated once or twice as the Master on site. I've had excellent carpenters, and in one case a very accomplished pattern maker report to me. I love it. I get to pick brains and learn new things. A good leader surrounds himself with great talent. Sure makes you look smart. However, I never refer to myself as a Master Carpenter. I let others do that. When I can test for it, that will be different.


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## Leo G

If he can lead but not do,he is no master carpenter.


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## Panhead Jack

Yeah Leo. I think I wrote, "The lead carpenter on the job will assume the Master Carpenter position." You can beat this till it's dead Leo, and you others that hang out here but I'm tellin ya. This is how you define Master Carpenter. And until we get some form of national testing/certification that will be accepted by industry, you can be all the Master you wanna be.


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## Anti-wingnut

If the foreman is the Master, what is the General Foreman or the Carpenter Superintendent?


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## Panhead Jack

Hell, if he can't do, he can't lead. Maybe you but not me.

"By hammer and hand, all things do stand."


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## Panhead Jack

Anti-wingnut said:


> If the foreman is the Master, what is the General Foreman or the Carpenter Superintendent?


General Foreman is over all trades, or would be over the foreman on a carpentry only project. But why would you need a general foreman on a project with only one trade? And in that case, I suppose he would be "the Master." My point here is, the lead carpenter is the Master Carpenter. The Superintendent is over the complete job and is a trailer rat. He is primarily concerned with paperwork, design issues, change orders, etc. He answers to the Project Manager and is busy handling sub's etc. Customer/Architect/Engineer interaction is the Superintendent's row to hoe. However, he IS usually a carpenter.


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## Joe Carola

I haven't read all the posts, but anyone who tells you that they are a master carpenter is delusional. I've had two guys say this to me in the 27 years and they were both delusional.


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## Jeff G

In my mind, I always think of anyone with capabilities and qualifications such as Norm Abrams (This Old House) as a master carpenter.


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## Anti-wingnut

Panhead Jack said:


> General Foreman is over all trades, or would be over the foreman on a carpentry only project. But why would you need a general foreman on a project with only one trade?


Union rules. Superintendent is over everyone. Carpenter GF is over the Carpenter Foremen. IW GF is over the Ironworkers Foremen.

Read your agreements carefully, most Foremen are limited to a crew of 16


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## Panhead Jack

Oh, and one more thing. Leo? If you are a "woodcrafter?" A "cabinetmaker?" A "sawdustmaker?" You are NOT a carpenter. You are a woodworker. Master woodworker. hmmmm. Let's get a cute reply from you on this one. 

I was trying to shed some light on the discussion.


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## Joe Carola

So, the consensus is that no one here calls themselves a master carpenter?


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## basswood

Joe Carola said:


> So, the consensus is that no one here calls themselves a master carpenter?


‎"If a man is truly working, he needs no title. His work speaks for him."--Henry Ford


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## Joe Carola

basswood said:


> ‎"If a man is truly working, he needs no title. His work speaks for him."--Henry Ford


I'm happy to find out that no one here is delusional.


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## Framer53

Joe Carola said:


> I'm happy to find out that no one here is delusional.


Some of us are, but like to keep it to ourselves:whistling


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## Panhead Jack

Joe Carola said:


> So, the consensus is that no one here calls themselves a master carpenter?


As I stated earlier, I would never refer to myself as a Master Carpenter. I'm still learning.


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## Joe Carola

Panhead Jack said:


> As I stated earlier, I would never refer to myself as a Master Carpenter. I'm still learning.


Like I stated earlier, only a delusional person would. I'm still learning also. I also enjoy it too.


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## WarnerConstInc.

I am getting really good at baiting.


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## Anti-wingnut

Nothing like a nice little blood bath on a resurected two year old thread


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## Leo G

WarnerConstInc. said:


> I am getting really good at baiting.


Warner may not be a master carpenter but he sure is a master baiter. :whistling






:laughing:


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## loneframer

Leo G said:


> Warner may not be a master carpenter but he sure is a master baiter. :whistling
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :laughing:


aboard a vessel full of salty sea men.


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## katoman

Panhead - where are you?

If you are in Canada, and have passed your C of Q exams, then you are a carpenter. 

If in the US, some equivelant of the British Guild Exams would suffice.

We already went through all this, if you are qualified to teach the trade to apprentices, then you are a master. ( according to others )

I agree that this is just an ego title. The proof is in the mans' work.

I've been doing it for 45 yrs, and still learning.


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## Hofmann

I definitely think there should be more levels of certified skill. As it stands, once you finish your apprenticeship, there is no way for a client/employer to distinguish someone like basswood from the local drunk. There is also no way for basswood to distinguish himself from this guy. I know there's job photos and published articles and peer reviews but it doesn't seem to be enough.

I think the shipping qualifications panhead used as a metaphor are a good example. First you get a coxswain qualification ( yes, make your jokes) which I have. It's no walk in the park but allows you to drive up to 45' boats commercially, like finishing your apprenticeship. Requires time served and a heavy duty course and they can never take it away from you, except for gross negligance.

Then you get master 5, master 4, 3, 2 and finally master 1 to drive container ships etc. To maintain these licences time has to be continually served and proven. The time served and knowledge required is unbelievable and it takes most guys till about 60 to reach master 1. The naval tribunals are harsh, one mistake and they'll knock you down to masterbaiter so fast you don't know what hit you.

I am not saying this exact system would work but I think we need more than we have. It's more a qualification of knowledge and experience than ability. 

Being a master 1 carpenter might make a nice little retirement plan for some. Lend your qualifications and a few hours a week to inspect jobs to a building company in exchange for a fee.


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## katoman

I'd be happy just to find a younger person who WANTS to become a carpenter. 

Today they just want to put the time in and get a pay check. No passion for the craft, no motivation to learn, and no ambition.


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## Morning Wood

I kind of pride myself as being a jerk off of all trades. Never a master carpenter though. too much pressure to be a master. Plus no one is ever done learning (I've got a lot to learn still). why just yesterday i learned it isn't a good idea to put shampoo in the rinse aid receptacle in the dishwasher.


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## JustaFramer

katoman said:


> I'd be happy just to find a younger person who WANTS to become a carpenter.
> 
> Today they just want to put the time in and get a pay check. No passion for the craft, no motivation to learn, and no ambition.



I have had the pleasure over the years to teach quite a few of those that really want to learn. I have a process that routs out those that are just pay check punks.


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## Hofmann

JustaFramer said:


> I have had the pleasure over the years to teach quite a few of those that really want to learn. I have a process that routs out those that are just pay check punks.


I think watching the way their toolbox grows, or doesn't, is a pretty good indicator.


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## JustaFramer

Hofmann said:


> I think watching the way their toolbox grows, or doesn't, is a pretty good indicator.


That would be a good one. But I have an initial process in accepting apprentices.


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## FLGC

*:* A master carpenter is one who has the talent and experience to perform any and all tasks that fall under the heading of carpentry. 
I think we are all MC's after 20 years of blood,sweat and tears.


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## JumboJack

FLGC said:


> *:* A master carpenter is one who has the talent and experience to perform any and all tasks that fall under the heading of carpentry.
> *I think we are all MC's after 20 years of blood,sweat and tears.*


I dunno about basing it on years..My wife has been cooking for over twenty years and she ain't exactly The Galloping Gourmet...


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## WarnerConstInc.

JumboJack said:


> I dunno about basing it on years..My wife has been cooking for over twenty years and she ain't exactly The Galloping Gourmet...


:laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## Warren

Texas Wax said:


> ... cool when a client or two go searching for terms to sum up your skills and produce "master carpenter"
> 
> ...even better when truly knowledgeable people within the trades and building professions do.
> 
> :whistling Warm fuzzies for a second or two then it's back to reality of doing what you do to be recognized as anything above average. After many years and years of hard work, mistakes and learning. No fricken easy button, tho staying at a Holiday Inn Express may help :blink:
> 
> :laughing: Maybe a few have mastered intellectual internet masturbation


I had an engineer once call me a "Framing God"

That's about as good as it gets.


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## Jaws

Warren said:


> I had an engineer once call me a "Framing God"
> 
> That's about as good as it gets.


:thumbsup: for sure


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## Texas Wax

Warren said:


> I had an engineer once call me a "Framing God"
> 
> That's about as good as it gets.


I got 5 stars once in a drywaller's contact book. He said they didn't have to shave one sheet in the entire house I framed. It was that level and square. Never heard from him again :clap: whooot and yee fricken haa:clap:


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## Warren

I got an email last week from a house that we framed a few months ago. The homeowner said that the building inspector told him he was lucky to find such a great framer. He walked around pointing out some of the techniques that we applied during framing. I never met the guy, but sounds like he knew a thing or two about framing.

Here is the email:

Hi Warren, 
In case I did not get to see you again, I wanted to make sure you knew how pleased and grateful I am for the incredible work you did in building my home. I could not have been happier with your work, your guidance, your attention to detail, your pride in what you do and your integrity. You were by far my favorite of all the trades we have had at work on my place. Feel free to use me as a reference any time. You are the standard setter for your profession in my book. 
In fact, the inspector spent about a half hour raving about several aspects of how you did your work. It gave me such confidence to hear a critic not only unable to criticize, but to tell me I was lucky to have such a pro crew in charge of such a crucial aspect of the building process. 
My sincere thanks to you and your men. 
Best Regards, 
Michael %%%%


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## overanalyze

Warren said:


> I got an email last week from a house that we framed a few months ago. The homeowner said that the building inspector told him he was lucky to find such a great framer. He walked around pointing out some of the techniques that we applied during framing. I never met the guy, but sounds like he knew a thing or two about framing.
> 
> Here is the email:
> 
> Hi Warren,
> In case I did not get to see you again, I wanted to make sure you knew how pleased and grateful I am for the incredible work you did in building my home. I could not have been happier with your work, your guidance, your attention to detail, your pride in what you do and your integrity. You were by far my favorite of all the trades we have had at work on my place. Feel free to use me as a reference any time. You are the standard setter for your profession in my book.
> In fact, the inspector spent about a half hour raving about several aspects of how you did your work. It gave me such confidence to hear a critic not only unable to criticize, but to tell me I was lucky to have such a pro crew in charge of such a crucial aspect of the building process.
> My sincere thanks to you and your men.
> Best Regards,
> Michael %%%%


That is awesome Warren!! It makes you feel so good when a client takes the time to let you know that.


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## Jaws

[ QUOTE=Warren;2251034]I got an email last week from a house that we framed a few months ago. The homeowner said that the building inspector told him he was lucky to find such a great framer. He walked around pointing out some of the techniques that we applied during framing. I never met the guy, but sounds like he knew a thing or two about framing.

Here is the email:

Hi Warren, 
In case I did not get to see you again, I wanted to make sure you knew how pleased and grateful I am for the incredible work you did in building my home. I could not have been happier with your work, your guidance, your attention to detail, your pride in what you do and your integrity. You were by far my favorite of all the trades we have had at work on my place. Feel free to use me as a reference any time. You are the standard setter for your profession in my book. 
In fact, the inspector spent about a half hour raving about several aspects of how you did your work. It gave me such confidence to hear a critic not only unable to criticize, but to tell me I was lucky to have such a pro crew in charge of such a crucial aspect of the building process. 
My sincere thanks to you and your men. 
Best Regards, 
Michael %%%%[/QUOTE]

get that woman in front of a few people at an ice cream social and you will drive up some business. Good for you man


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## Warren

This was a relative of a GC that I do a lot of work for. He was/very nervous about the cost of his new house. I know that he got a quote for framing that was substantially less than my quote, but he reluctantly went with us on the advice of his cousin, the GC. 

I think he feels that he spent his money well. :thumbup:


I was just saying the other day, that I don't know how many more big house frames that I have left in me. Hearing a few kind words can surely provide me with the incentive to press on with a few more.


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## FramingPro

I had the stucco guy amazed on my last frame on how straight, level and plumb everything was. :thumbsup:


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## Framer87

Had a customer call me once when he was laying hardwood in his house we framed, starts yelling and cussing on the phone about a 25'wall being 1/16" out. Turns out he wanted to give a thumbsup. His son in law is a framer as well but didn't trust him to do his own house


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## Morning Wood

I have a friend that is just really good. He builds a lot of one off stuff. Can do it right the first time first try. I would consider him a master carpenter. I'll look for some pics of his work. Me on the other hand. Not so much.


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## Leo G

Hell, most of the time I can do that.


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## JR Shepstone

Warren said:


> I got an email last week from a house that we framed a few months ago. The homeowner said that the building inspector told him he was lucky to find such a great framer. He walked around pointing out some of the techniques that we applied during framing. I never met the guy, but sounds like he knew a thing or two about framing.
> 
> Here is the email:
> 
> Hi Warren,
> In case I did not get to see you again, I wanted....



Print that out and hang it on the wall. 

Save it for the bad days when you need a pick me up. 

Great words to hear from a client!


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## ThaMasterCarp

A master carpenter is a mind thing. At sixty you will not see me Walking Backwards pulling my tape an laying out ruff-truss three stories on a outside wall anymore. Still have all my fingers an two thumbs.
A master carpenter will not do dumb stuff or let others around him or her do crazyness.


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## Morning Wood

*Master Carpenter?*

Whoa whoa whoa. My uncle just called me a master carpenter in an email he cc'ed me in. Who knew!!! Too bad he doesnt know what he is talking about.


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## knucklehead

I was a master carpenter about 20 years ago. I have grown alot since then.


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## nickatprobuilt

Being certified doesn't mean you can cut a straight line. Master Carpenter means you can make anything with a saw and nails. Master carpenter is usually an earned name and to profess yourself as one, you should be able to back it up.


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## nickatprobuilt

FramingPro said:


> I had the stucco guy amazed on my last frame on how straight, level and plumb everything was. :thumbsup:


The stucco guy? Seriously, he has to be the sloppiest of the trades :no: He doesn't even use levels and tapes :laughing:


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## ThaMasterCarp

.
To become a great carpenter you must first learn to be a great labor. Never let a real carpenter learn a skill trade secret. He or she will take it an run with it.


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## JR Shepstone

ThaMasterCarp said:


> .
> To become a great carpenter you must first learn to be a great labor. *Never let a real carpenter learn a skill trade secret.* He or she will take it an run with it.


What??? Isn't that why we do what we do? To teach each other? To help each other? To better each other? 

You wouldn't let someone know something to get better at what they do? I understand not telling every Tom, Dick, and Harry, but one of your peers? Come on...

In my eyes, a MASTER carpenter is the one who knows their ****, and can execute it, but also isn't so uptight with it that they hold onto it like it's a source of national security.


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## thehockeydman

ThaMasterCarp said:


> .
> To become a great carpenter you must first learn to be a great labor. Never let a real carpenter learn a skill trade secret. He or she will take it an run with it.


Wow am I glad most people don't have this attitude... Worst advice ever.

One of the best things about our trade is the ability to pass down knowledge and learn from others. I'm sure some would argue that real master carpenters inspire those around them to become better tradespeople, both through their work and through their lessons. 

My old boss taught me a ton while I was working for him. Yes you could say, I "took it and ran," since I'm now on my own. You know what else I did with the knowledge he taught me? Made him a hell of a lot of money. The #1 framer in our area was also trained by my boss (who's the best I've seen around here, although he openly admits is ex-employee has since surpassed him). When it's time for my former boss to hang up the bags, he not only leaves behind a trail of incredibly well built houses, but also a new generation of carpenters who he instilled his knowledge in, and who can use that knowledge to built great homes and pass it on to future generations.

Being tight-lipped about trade knowledge is about a juvenile a thing as I have heard. And it certainly isn't something a "master carpenter" would advocate. Doing so would completely stifle innovation and the advancement of our trade.


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