# Dodge/Fiat introducing commercial cargo vans



## duburban (Apr 10, 2008)

anyone know how much they're going to sell those diesel ford eco vans for ?


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## smalpierre (Jan 19, 2011)

This is the truck I want - in white, with a side loading ladder rack.


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## smalpierre (Jan 19, 2011)

You can get around 20mpg out of one - I'm going for a w-250, not the one ton.

cummins 12 valve, a727 3 speed auto, NP203 transfer case


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

duburban said:


> anyone know how much they're going to sell those diesel ford eco vans for ?


I was at the Ford dealer today and they are all out of the loop on that. Nobody knows until Ford releases it.

I do know they will have one at the Chicago Auto Show which I plan on attending.


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## smalpierre (Jan 19, 2011)

As for the supposedly gay little vans, I've seen them work out really well for some people.

But I seem to recall one thing Mike - weren't you the one that said mileage doesn't matter because your customers pay for the fuel?


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## joe dirt (Nov 29, 2008)

I'm curious about the Fiat/Dodge.
Right now I have 2 f350 diesels sucking back $300+ a week in fuel. I will not be getting rid of them, they do what they were made for heavy work and haulin. 
I don't require 1 ton to pick up smaller supplies.
Are the cargo specks out there for the Fiat/Dodge? Will it transport 4x8 drywall with the hatch closed?
Joe Dirt


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

smalpierre said:


> As for the supposedly gay little vans, I've seen them work out really well for some people.
> 
> But I seem to recall one thing Mike - weren't you the one that said mileage doesn't matter because your customers pay for the fuel?


Yes, and I still stand by that. What I do beyond that will be used to gain competitive advantage in the marketplace especially as I'm now in a stage of my business where I'm fine tuning things. 

I'm actually at a pretty advanced stage where I'm being more select and eliminating certain types of jobs. At this point not too many companies can compete with me......and that's with crappy gas mileage and crappy American trucks. Not a bad place to be in. 

Now it's all about profit. 

Also, the context in which I say that has more to do with the understanding that ultimately customers pay for everything.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

joe dirt said:


> I'm curious about the Fiat/Dodge.
> Right now I have 2 f350 diesels sucking back $300+ a week in fuel. I will not be getting rid of them, they do what they were made for heavy work and haulin.
> I don't require 1 ton to pick up smaller supplies.
> Are the cargo specks out there for the Fiat/Dodge? Will it transport 4x8 drywall with the hatch closed?
> Joe Dirt


Yes, the larger ones will.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

smalpierre said:


> As for the supposedly gay little vans, I've seen them work out really well for some people.
> 
> But I seem to recall one thing Mike - weren't you the one that said mileage doesn't matter because your customers pay for the fuel?


Remember also that these are all new vehicles, they are the new generation of vehicles replacing the old outdated ones.

It's much bigger than just gas mileage for me. The increased fuel economy amounts to a paltry $12.50 per service call.


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## smalpierre (Jan 19, 2011)

Oconomowoc said:


> Remember also that these are all new vehicles, they are the new generation of vehicles replacing the old outdated ones.
> 
> It's much bigger than just gas mileage for me. The increased fuel economy amounts to a paltry $12.50 per service call.


Do 5 service calls in a day and it starts to add up - 300 and change / week. Of course the customer pays for everything ultimately, but it doesn't have to be about saving them money - why pass on the savings when your competitors drive huge monster trucks, more efficient = more profit. Charge what the market bears, and if you waste money you make less profit.

Do that with 3 trucks running, and that's nearly 50g / year.


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

Oconomowoc said:


> and that's with crappy gas mileage and crappy American trucks.


I don't understand. What non-American truck can compete with my American truck?

I can drive empty at 21+MPG with plenty of room for anything I need to carry.

I can haul almost 3 tons in my bed. 

I can tow 14,000lbs without blinking an eye.

I can carry "important" items in my cab. I can carry "dirty" items in my bed.

I can purchase maintenance parts at almost any local store.

I can easily fit my entire family and show up at any event.

What's the downside again? :blink:


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## mpmaint (Sep 16, 2010)

I'd rather slit my wrists than to swap my Cummins Ram for a Fi-Fart!


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

angus242 said:


> I don't understand. What non-American truck can compete with my American truck?
> 
> I can drive empty at 21+MPG with plenty of room for anything I need to carry.
> 
> ...


I think pickup trucks are probably a little different but when it comes to vans the dynamic changes rapidly. I've had them all - Chevy, Dodge, Ford and multiple times. They are pure money pits when paired up against say the Sprinter. 

Over the years I've watched first hand how many problems they have and the expenses. The gas mileage is just horrible.

I love my cube van, I really do. It's a one tone Ford and it's bar none better than a Chevy or Dodge but it's still an outdated money pit. The new Ford pickup truck is simply awesome but it doesn't even come close in similarity with the Econoline. 

Gas is going up I think that's an unavoidable fact. This, combined with horrible resale value and repair work is not worth it compared to a Sprinter that gets 20+ miles to the gallon and has excellent service records.

I might wait for the ecoboost Ford van though, it looks like a winner so I might stay with the van scenario. I will not by buying the current van though.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

Also, I don't drive empty. Lol


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

aptpupil said:


> what's wrong with simply stating that it wouldn't work for what you do? instead you employ an anti-gay slur and deride its looks. then you proceed to get into it with inner and mike for no good reason. bizarre.


:laughing:


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Inner10 said:


> I never said anything about sexual orientation...:blink:


"Luckily gay people don't drive" :blink:


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

TNTSERVICES said:


> "Luckily gay people don't drive" :blink:


That statement doesn't connote sexual orientation anymore than your statements. 

You are a moron.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

Oconomowoc said:


> I think pickup trucks are probably a little different but when it comes to vans the dynamic changes rapidly. I've had them all - Chevy, Dodge, Ford and multiple times. They are pure money pits when paired up against say the Sprinter.


Now something we agree on. Trucks and vans are not comparable. But I do disagree about Ford Econolines being better than Chevy. I have owned 7 Chevy's with 200k+ miles, original engine and tranny and they still ran like champs. Most that we purchased were fleet vehicles with over 120k and looked pretty close to brand new on the exterior. Around here Econolines are rust buckets. I am not sure what Ford did or didn't do, but I have never seen an Econoline on the used lot that didn't have substantial rust issues when compared to the same Chevy model.

I did have my eye on the Sprinters when the first came out, but they had some real nasty body issue early on. I am sure that has been resolved by now. Love the head room and storage capacity. The fact that FedEx runs thousands of the them says a lot about performance. So it is the one van outside of the Chevy Express series that I will be looking at in the near future. My current 2500 is sitting on 185k, so another two years and it'll be time to start lookin'.


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

Oconomowoc said:


> Also, I don't drive empty. Lol


I average well over 17 when really full; like 4000lbs full.

I still can't take a van, Sprinter or other to a family event. That means to get an apples to apples comparison, I'd need to buy a second vehicle. Absolutely no savings there.

I spent $25k on a 2 year old vehicle that with proper maintenance can last me another 10 years.

You cannot really add any negatives to my situation.


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## WarnerConstInc. (Jan 30, 2008)

You know they put diesel's in the vans too Mike. A 2wd E-350 with a diesel gets damn good mpg's and will tow the hell out of some stuff. 

I won't even buy a vehicle, unless it has 100k on it.

You are all sorts of hating on american made vehicle's huh?


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

I'll say it one last time, of course the Sprinter is a nice vehicle.

No difference from buying a Ford Taurus or a Mercedes E350. You _pay_ for the difference.

Diesel is a missing option from the US market, no doubt. However, part of that reason is the quality (or lack there of) of diesel fuel sold in the US. Look it up. A few years ago, Volkswagen stopped selling diesel engines in their SUV because the thing couldn't run on the crappy fuel sold here.

Diesel sold in the US carries a premium and I don't see that evaporating anytime soon. Hybrids are all the rage and until the stupid public realizes plug in cars get their power from dirty coal burning power plants, that probably won't change. Electric is not the answer IMO.

I would always buy a diesel. Shame I cannot get one with my preferred manufacturer. I would buy a diesel car in a hot minute. I'd buy a diesel motorcycle in a hot second.


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## TNTRenovate (Aug 19, 2010)

angus242 said:


> I'll say it one last time, of course the Sprinter is a nice vehicle.
> 
> No difference from buying a Ford Taurus or a Mercedes E350. You _pay_ for the difference.
> 
> ...


I read somewhere that the advantages of diesel will be closely matched by gas within the next 10 years. That being the case, diesel wouldn't be a primary reason to switch.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

Diesel motorcycle. Interesting concept.


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

Ugly as sin, incredible performance:
http://www.neander-motors.com/motorcycle.html


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

angus242 said:


> I'll say it one last time, of course the Sprinter is a nice vehicle.
> 
> No difference from buying a Ford Taurus or a Mercedes E350. You pay for the difference.
> 
> ...


Why is it they use the diesel in the Golf/rabbit? Of course, they don't sell many.

That Ecoboost is pretty good I think. Ford is banking on it.


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## Oconomowoc (Oct 13, 2011)

angus242 said:


> Ugly as sin, incredible performance:
> http://www.neander-motors.com/motorcycle.html


Yeah that is ugly. That would of been easy to make it cool looking. Wonder what it sounds like.


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

Oconomowoc said:


> Why is it they use the diesel in the Golf/rabbit? Of course, they don't sell many.


It wasn't available from '07-'09.


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## angus242 (Oct 20, 2007)

Oconomowoc said:


> Yeah that is ugly. That would of been easy to make it cool looking. Wonder what it sounds like.


I've searched the internet high and low for 2 years and have never found a sound clip of one.


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## CompleteW&D (May 28, 2011)

WarnerConstInc. said:


> Even the Amish have to take their horses to the vet.
> 
> What do you call a guy with his arm buried up to his shoulder, in a horses butt?
> 
> ...


:laughing: 

I just woke my daughter up because I burst out lauging so hard she came running in to see WTH was wrong with me.

I'm still.... :lol:


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## CompleteW&D (May 28, 2011)

angus242 said:


> Hybrids are all the rage and until the stupid public realizes plug in cars get their power from dirty coal burning power plants, that probably won't change. Electric is not the answer IMO.


An even worse tragedy with hybrid/electric IMHO, is that no one seems to care about all of the toxic waste that will be created when the old worn out batteries need to be "desposed of" in some fashion. They'll all probably go into a big hole in the ground where they'll continue to leach all kinds of crap for years and years.


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## TimHoff (Nov 6, 2012)

I will let my work speak for itself


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