# Quoting Small Jobs



## HCMUEL (Feb 20, 2015)

I recently started my own contracting business, specializing in built-ins, finish carpentry and traditional woodworking.

The last couple of customers I've had for small jobs (running a room of baseboard, trimming one door, etc.) have asked for more detailed estimates. I know how to put together accurate estimates for larger jobs and have no problem presenting these to customers.

For these smaller jobs I have been giving them a simple breakdown, labour cost, material cost, tax. But my customers have asked for more details.

Any suggestions on what to add to give my customers more info.

Cheers


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## pappagor (Jan 29, 2008)

what more can you add the time of day and the date :clap:


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## JPConst1005 (Feb 11, 2014)

If you are including the total footage on the quote/proposal, I'm not sure what else you may include. Estimated nails and glue used perhaps? :laughing: Kidding. 

I would list: 1. Trim/Material, 2. Misc. materials (nails, glue, screws, etc.), 3. Labor, 4. Overhead, and any Taxes that are required.


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## bentampa (Apr 9, 2014)

Typically, having the following should suffice:

Approximate material cost

How long the job will take (approx)

What you will charge to do it

I am unsure what else they could possibly need. I have run in to pain in the a** prospects that want to know every little detail and can tell you you're better off moving on if they want to knit pick every detail on a small job.

Congrats on the new endevour!


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## TheSidingGuy (Jan 25, 2008)

List each thing in each room


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## mikeswoods (Oct 11, 2008)

How detailed can you be on a small job?

I simply spell out the materials to be used--and if the materials will be caulked and puttied ready for the painter or not.

I do not break out labor and materials---just a bottom line,as I prefer to supply the trim---

Per foot pricing on a contract can bite you in the butt---one of these days a customer will measure your job and dispute the bill----


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## Philament (Dec 9, 2014)

I try to be as detailed a possible in the types of materials I am using. I feel it helps sell the job sometimes. Show's you're thorough and helps with any discrepancies once installed. 

For a small trim job, I put the type of wood, moulding profile & dimensions, all nail holes filled, joints caulked, primer and two coats of low VOC waterborne alkyd.

I don't separate out labour and materials though, small jobs can have as much overhead in picking up materials, setup/tear down, travel and site preparation than they do actually working on the job, so the labour would look pretty disproportionate.


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## prowork (Oct 5, 2012)

Why not just do a lump sum fixed price and list out the materials you will use? Thats the end.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

Sprinkle in some fancy words.

Scope of Work:
Room Name(s) 
1) remove & discard old base...blah, blah, prep
2) Supply & install millwork ______ trim (selected by client) 
3) Prep, prime, paint, etc. (name of paint, if you want)
4) Clean-up.


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

I wouldn't bother breaking it down. Scope of Work and price. That's it. If they want more info they either have trouble making decisions so they procrastinate by info-overload, or they're going to beat you up on price.

Unless it's some really fancy stuff I wouldn't even be doing quotes for some of that. Trimming one door? It's going to take you longer to quote it than to do it. Ballpark it and get to work if it's under a day's work.


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## mako1 (Sep 1, 2013)

It is none of my customers business what my labor cost is ,material cost is or my overhead.I detail the material as far as LF of trim and what kind,what kind of finish wil be applied.Size,brand ,quantity.Time to finish the job.As far as cost it's none of their business.You are giving them a finished cost.
If you start breaking down items into line item cost for material you are in trouble.They will start looking thru ads and saying "you can get this for this price here and you can get this for this price there". You're opening up a can of worms that can not make a small job profitable.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

BTW, don't give LF pricing...just gives them ammo to shop you. Let the next guy do his own site visit.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

HCMUEL said:


> I recently started my own contracting business, specializing in built-ins, finish carpentry and traditional woodworking.
> 
> The last couple of customers I've had for small jobs (running a room of baseboard, trimming one door, etc.) have asked for more detailed estimates. I know how to put together accurate estimates for larger jobs and have no problem presenting these to customers.
> 
> ...


How about an example of what you're doing now?


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## mako1 (Sep 1, 2013)

MarkJames said:


> BTW, don't give LF pricing...just gives them ammo to shop you. Let the next guy do his own site visit.


I give them lf of the millwork not the pricing.


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## Keystone621 (Feb 27, 2014)

I do all of my jobs as TM(I only do small jobs). When I first started I would go and look at a job and give the customer a price. I quickly realized this leads to price shopping and tire kicking so that is why I went to straight TM(it works for me bring a handyman). If they really push the issue I will give them a "ballpark" NTE. They can take it or leave it.


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## mako1 (Sep 1, 2013)

"When I first started I would go and look at a job and give the customer a price. I quickly realized this leads to price shopping and tire kicking so that is why I went to straight TM(it works for me"

If you gave them a price for the job how would this lead to price shopping since they don't know the price on material or labor?They agree to a fixed price for the job or they don't?


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## HCMUEL (Feb 20, 2015)

Currently I am giving them labour cost and time to complete the job, also a material cost overhead cost. The last estimate I gave (and this is all in writting) they asked me to redo to include more info, I broke it down and included a full material list (caulk, nails, glue, trim, garbage bags) a labour breakdown (time to set-up, install casing, caulk and fill joints, clean-up,etc.) then the overhead cost, tax and total price, work date, and conditions (need driveway, electrical outlet, sink). Doing all this work requires an extra hour of work and more headaches then the job is worth. Had several potential customers ask for breakdowns like this. Not sure how to handle this, for all these small jobs (less then a full days work).

Cheers


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

That is a total waste of time. Have you ever seen that level of detail from a professional business? 

Provide the customer with a price for the service they have requested. If they don't like the price, they aren't going to like it no matter how detailed the list is. Doing small repair work you need to be prepared for a low close rate. Most of the jobs are things that folks thought they were going to do themselves but decided not to because "they don't have the time". It's really hard to bid against somebody's imaginary free bid that they gave themselves.

I've done repair work and I gave up on trying to do detailed quotes, or even meetings for a lot of the small stuff. Close it over the phone and then check to make sure they described it accurately before you start. Time and materials is probably your best bet for this kind of work unless the project is going to take more than half a day. If it's a bunch of small jobs do T&M even if it is going to take longer.

There are a bunch of threads about T&M strategy on here but my feeling with repair was that it makes more sense to charge a fairly low markup on materials because people will frequently have already checked on little job material pricing. Put all of your markup on the hourly rate and don't be surprised at how high a rate you're actually going to have to charge. I also charged an even higher rate for the first hour to make those 5 minute jobs profitable.

You can still provide a rough estimate when a customer calls but it's an ESTIMATE.


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## Framer53 (Feb 23, 2008)

I do a lot of handynman jobs for commercial maintenance companies. I handle this by letting them know up front that I have a $150 minimum charge and if it is a large company where it will take 60 days to get paid the min is 200 plus.

I will never break down costs for homeowners. Now I do quote a daily and half day rate, plus materials. It works and like Ethan says, small jobs need to be closed on the phone without site visits.
If they want a site visit, then I charge, as my time is where I make my money, either people respect that of I move on.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

HCMUEL said:


> Currently I am giving them labour cost and time to complete the job, also a material cost overhead cost. The last estimate I gave (and this is all in writting) they asked me to redo to include more info, I broke it down and included a full material list (caulk, nails, glue, trim, garbage bags) a labour breakdown (time to set-up, install casing, caulk and fill joints, clean-up,etc.) then the overhead cost, tax and total price, work date, and conditions (need driveway, electrical outlet, sink). Doing all this work requires an extra hour of work and more headaches then the job is worth. Had several potential customers ask for breakdowns like this. Not sure how to handle this, for all these small jobs (less then a full days work).
> 
> Cheers


Something's not right. That's ridiculous detail. Keep it clear and simple, and be confident about it.

A couple suggestions:
1) scope, labor + estimated materials....or
2) scope, LF and your total price (As Precision mentioned)

If they need more detail than that, it could be they're not confident, or they're looking for lessons on materials and how to do it, or they just want to shop the quote.

I have a buddy who's been picking my brain for good roofers, window repair, etc., and I learned he's been shopping every damned quote for some small repairs. I'm like, "Wth? I gave you good leads, so bite the bullet and stop wasting everybody's time (including mine)."


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