# slab, driveway and deck piers



## fiasco (Jun 13, 2008)

I've done some pretty extensive interior remodeling and never worked with cement except to replace cement removed to install non roughed in bathrooms over slab.

I need to have a 6' x 12'8" slab, 6 deck piers (32" deep) and an approximately 1200 sq ft driveway done on my home.

I have a few questions about what to expect to see when the work is being done. What substrate/base should be under the driveway and how deep? What thickness should the cement pour be?

My bids are all over the place as to price ranging from $6500 from a contracter that told me he could get cement $40 a yard cheaper in Illinois then Missouri (I'm in St. Louis) but would not handle disposal of the asphalt to $12,000 from another contractor which includes asphalt disposal.

The current driveway is asphalt. Where can I dispose of it and what should I expect to pay to do so. Can it be recycled? Is it considered "clean fill" as there are several places nearby with signs offering free dumping of clean fill.


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## LNG24 (Oct 30, 2005)

Not sure about your local, but where I am all the Blacktop plants take used blacktop for a fee. Its crushed and recycled and road base or Recycled Item #4. Some places do consider it Clean and Others don't. In my town they consider it clean for commercial property and it is not allowed on residential property. Go Figure, but I had to haul out a few hundred yards of it

I always put 4" of compacted base (3/4" gravel) under my concrete work. I DO NOT put base under piers. It is my belief that piers are footings and must rest on solid earth. 

You would be better off have a set of plans for your project and then get prices based on that. What you are doing is asking each contractor to design and spec your project. You will never get two similar estimates that way. Find out what is code where you live and make some detailed drawings complete with base, concrete, rebar and installation method. Then get your pricing. I would also require removal and legal disposal of any excavated material (driveway) this way you won't find it on your neighbors lawn.


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## fiasco (Jun 13, 2008)

LNG24 said:


> Not sure about your local, but where I am all the Blacktop plants take used blacktop for a fee. Its crushed and recycled and road base or Recycled Item #4. Some places do consider it Clean and Others don't. In my town they consider it clean for commercial property and it is not allowed on residential property. Go Figure, but I had to haul out a few hundred yards of it
> 
> I always put 4" of compacted base (3/4" gravel) under my concrete work. I DO NOT put base under piers. It is my belief that piers are footings and must rest on solid earth.
> 
> You would be better off have a set of plans for your project and then get prices based on that. What you are doing is asking each contractor to design and spec your project. You will never get two similar estimates that way. Find out what is code where you live and make some detailed drawings complete with base, concrete, rebar and installation method. Then get your pricing. I would also require removal and legal disposal of any excavated material (driveway) this way you won't find it on your neighbors lawn.


I submit site plans with the bid requests that I used to get my permits.


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## LNG24 (Oct 30, 2005)

fiasco said:


> I have a few questions about what to expect to see when the work is being done. What substrate/base should be under the driveway and how deep? What thickness should the cement pour be?


Either your site plans are not specific enough or I don;t understand the questions. If you are having them bid off the plan the questions above will be answered. It is obvious by the questions, this is not the case since you already are requesting bids.



fiasco said:


> My bids are all over the place as to price ranging from $6500 from a contracter that told me he could get cement $40 a yard cheaper in Illinois then Missouri (I'm in St. Louis) but would not handle disposal of the asphalt to $12,000 from another contractor which includes asphalt disposal.


The material cost to the contract really has no bearing on this. You are having them bid a job not labor, correct?



fiasco said:


> The current driveway is asphalt. Where can I dispose of it and what should I expect to pay to do so. Can it be recycled? Is it considered "clean fill" as there are several places nearby with signs offering free dumping of clean fill.


What method would you be using to remove of and dispose of this material? Do you have a dump truck? A typical driveway will require at least a Tri Axle to haul away material. 

I really think you need to go back and start with better plans regardless of what the town will accept for permits. Once you have proper plans showing all the layers; type, thickness and type of material including what type of base and cement as well as how it will be installed, what elevation to finish at and then include what has to happen on site. Work hours, staging area and what must be removed and what can stay.

At that point you can bid your project. Otherwise you need to hire a GC or architect who can do all this for you.


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## fiasco (Jun 13, 2008)

......


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## fiasco (Jun 13, 2008)

....


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## fiasco (Jun 13, 2008)

The whole project was spawned because I'm putting a new deck on the back of my house over the driveway.

I don't need no stinking architect or GC for a simple driveway! (double negative even!) I didn't need an architect to design the deck! 

Piers 14" square on top, 18" circle below grade out to 22" bell at the bottom 38" deep 760lbs of cement per pier.

Deck is 530 sq feet.

Building the pergola tops today.

I'll be doing my own driveway as well


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## BeetsZ71 (Nov 16, 2006)

I live in St. Louis. There are plenty of places to take the asphalt for a fee or find a free dump somewhere. In Jefferson, Lincoln, Franklin and Warren counties there are all kinds of free dumps for asphalt you just have to find them and call for permission. 

Pay Dumps:

Highway 141 and I-44 there are 2 pay dumps that will take asphalt.
Manchester Rd. and I-270 is another pay dump.
I-70 and Fifth street is another pay dump.
I-70 and Earthcity Expressway will recycle the asphalt for a fee.
Near Page and Skinker recycles asphalt for a fee.
Riverview and I-270 takes asphalt for a fee.
Dump on Broadway in North St. Louis takes asphalt for a fee.
These are just a few of the dumps. Tell me a major intersection by you and I can tell you the best dump and prices.


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## cleveman (Dec 28, 2007)

don't put so much cement in those piers next time. Mix in some sand and aggregate and it will be much stronger. 

I'm with you on those stinking architects and engineers.

Flatwork rates here are at $4/square foot. This doesn't include any grading, other than with a shovel. I know a guy who is in the process of getting a drive poured for 2.75 and we'll monitor that situation and see how it comes out. I'm anxious to see who will pay for the concrete on that deal.

The portland people will tell you that you can put a residential drive on black soil with no re-bar. And this is absolutely true. You surely can.

It would be more gooder, however, to have 4" of compacted base underneath. I've always thought that a thicker edge in any slab with a 5/8 rebar would keep the pieces from floating off into the atmosphere. Finally, pour on plastic and pour it as stiff as you can handle it. Get a vibrating screed to make it easier. Have fiber in your concrete. Pour it when it is cool if possible, and don't be afraid to cover it up with plastic when you have finished and wait a week.


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