# Bad foundation



## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

Have a cracked foundation. The wall is bowed about 4 inches in, and cracked in several places, with some reaching top to bottom and all the way through. What are my options for this, is there an acceptable repair or should the foundation come down and be re-poured?


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## rustyjames (Aug 28, 2008)

Man, what a shame. They not only back filled, they REALLY back filled. If it was my foundation I'd want that side of the foundation replaced.


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## Seven-Delta-FortyOne (Mar 5, 2011)

Did you pour that?



Delta


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## slowsol (Aug 27, 2005)

Did they shore before they backfilled?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

The whole foundation was poured as one piece, is it possible to replace one wall?


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

No, this is my house and a well-known builder is building the house.


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

No, it was not shored.


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## platinumLLC (Nov 18, 2008)

John33 said:


> No, this is my house and a well-known builder is building the house.


What did this well known builder say about this? Sounds like somebody screwed up.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

I’m pretty sure they can fix that. You’ll have to reexcavate then get your foundation guy back out. Fire your original excavator. You can’t backfill a long straight wall like that more than 4’ deep without bracing. If it had to be backfilled he should have done the corners then only 4’ up on the long run. 

How long did it cure before he backfilled?


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

No, I notified them yesterday, they will get the message on Monday.


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## tgeb (Feb 9, 2006)

I agree, that wall can be repaired.

It needs to be excavated, pushed back out and the cracks should be pressure injected with epoxy.

Though it is poor practice to backfill prior to the slab and first floor deck being installed, in tract housing the foundations are typically backfilled within days of the concrete placement.


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

It cured for 7 days before backfilling


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

tgeb said:


> I agree, that wall can be repaired.
> 
> It needs to be excavated, pushed back out and the cracks should be pressure injected with epoxy.
> 
> Though it is poor practice to backfill prior to the slab and first floor deck being installed, in tract housing the foundations are typically backfilled within days of the concrete placement.




Will the foundation be as structurally sound as an fully intact foundation, with the epoxy injection? I attached a picture of one of the crack


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## MeanWeen (Nov 11, 2017)

Is should be fine, but I agree if you didn’t do the work get them to fix it. You guys don’t do any water proofing on wall like that?


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## Krok (Jul 9, 2016)

Some people have to wait decades to get that sort of "distressed" look at the corners of their foundation. 
Any crack fill will fill it, but won't address the bow. I'd line it to see if it's something you can work with framing wise and they may have to add a little to the outside where it's in too far, providing there's enough bite for the bottom plate. 
Excavation/landscaper may have to put a little extra attention there to make sure there won't ever be any back pressure there. 
Can't see if there's a beam pocket there or not, but if so, and depending where the bow is relative to it, might want to put a counterfort under that then hide it in a small wall under the beam for cosmetics. 
Then discount all of this off of your bill.

But I'm not a concrete guy, just a mold generating unlicensed remodler without insurance that can do whatever you need done!


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## B.Johnson (Sep 17, 2016)

Tough situation. Talk to the builder and if you don't get any satisfaction, then ask for a meeting with the builder and the inspector. As mentioned before, they shouldn't have back filled it that high without bracing. I'm not going to suggest a fix except to say that while "Any crack fill will fill it", you want a structural solution, not a cosmetic one.


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## cedarboarder (Mar 30, 2015)

Oh man, its exposed too... 
jackhammer and redo? 
Definitely only need to do the one wall.


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## FrankSmith (Feb 21, 2013)

They can probably get it pushed back and repair the cracks. That still leaves you with a new yet repaired foundation and a bad taste in your mouth.


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## cedarboarder (Mar 30, 2015)

sure it can be pushed back and crack patched. Needs a structural engineer at this point if this was in my City.
More prone to foundation leaks. 
And will never look right patched.


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## rustyjames (Aug 28, 2008)

Sure, it can be "fixed" but it's not like you're ever going to unsee what happened. If it was my house the builder would have to give me something back, if that part of the wall is repaired.


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## cedarboarder (Mar 30, 2015)

greg24k said:


> Footing settlement could also be the issue, is there a vertical crack in the footer also?


that too... That wall is FUBAR no saving it or repairing it.


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

Big Johnson said:


> John33 said:
> 
> 
> > Have a cracked foundation. The wall is bowed about 4 inches in, and cracked in several places, with some reaching top to bottom and all the way through. What are my options for this, is there an acceptable repair or should the foundation come down and be re-poured?
> ...


It is an 8? tall wall and about 40? in length


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

It is an 8? tall wall and about 40? in length


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

greg24k said:


> Footing settlement could also be the issue, is there a vertical crack in the footer also?


The footer look okay, but they were covered in cement dust so it was hard to say for sure


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## mstrat (Jul 10, 2013)

JAH said:


> Crap does happen and in todays world & its all about legally protecting yourself. Thats just the way it goes.
> Whats the harm in having your lawyer do a contract review & provide guidance for getting the issue resolved? I never said sue the builder!
> A lawyer can also bring up concerns that the op may not have considered. For example how will a repaired foundation effect the value of a new structure.


...is that how you'd do it when you buy a new car and there's a problem? Before calling the dealer you call a lawyer to see how the value of the car might be after the repair was made? 

Sorry, I shouldn't pick...just seems that calling a lawyer before calling the contractor seems a bit harsh. I understand if you talk things over with the builder and you aren't comfortable with the resolution, but Friday afternoon you discover something and Monday you're on the horn with an attorney before ever even trying to hear from the guy who's responsible?


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## Hardly Working (Apr 7, 2005)

If it were my dirt guy he'd looking for a new job. More than likely it was back filled to soon (less than 10 days). We'll back fill the inside to maintain equal pressure. 8 foot walls with no interior fill is asking for trouble. Somebody's gonna eat this. This can be repaired but it needs to go back to the corners and re-poured. In "Production Construction" it all about time. In this case time was rushed. Oh by the way your closing date has now been bumped. This is about 2 week repair.

If you are dealing with a major builder you should have a "builders representative" call them Monday morning and request a site visit regarding the issue for that day or ASAP. If you get the run around go above there head. You'll want to see an Engineering Report on the fix and ask for it to be re-inspected.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

So John, your profile says you're a contractor, yet you're having your house built by a contractor. This forum is for actual contractors, and I'm sensing that you aren't really one of us.

Care to enlighten us?


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## Easy Gibson (Dec 3, 2010)

Get out of here, you.

I'm invested at this point. I need resolution. At least keep it open until he talks to his builder.


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## Fouthgeneration (Jan 7, 2014)

33: Your picture appears to show 9' high walls??? AND the footing side mostly exposed, if the long busted wall footings are machine dug to the bottom of the footer completely, the spread footing is most likely destroyed/broken too....:sad: One more lazy man builder technique that will bite your lower parts.

NO ONE wants their wife to drive a car that been totaled in a bad wreck, no matter how good the frame welder is....

If your leg bone was broke an inch away from either joint, could it ever be splinted as strong as a unbroken bone?

The Cracks Have ZERO tensile strength, when it rains 10 inches in a week and liquidizes all 8' plus of earth bearing against it, will it hold the weight of ~200 pounds per cubic foot of sloppy clay and water? 24/7 till the soil drys?


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

Tinstaafl said:


> So John, your profile says you're a contractor, yet you're having your house built by a contractor. This forum is for actual contractors, and I'm sensing that you aren't really one of us.
> 
> Care to enlighten us?


I mostly do structural steel work


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## TimNJ (Sep 7, 2005)

greg24k said:


> Footing settlement could also be the issue, is there a vertical crack in the footer also?



I was thinking the exact same thing.

At the very least the entire wall needs to be completely cleared and cleaned of all backfill so the footing can be closely inspected.

I agree with an earlier post.

It's a new development. Pick another lot and let the builder straighten this mess out and pawn it off on somebody else.


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## TimNJ (Sep 7, 2005)

Do a close read of your sales literature and contract.


Does it state that your new home has a continuously poured foundation.

If they cut out the bad section and replace, you no longer have a continuously poured foundation.


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## Fishindude (Aug 15, 2017)

Looks like pretty crummy concrete work all the way around.
I'd at minimum insist on a long term written warranty saying that they will repair to your satisfaction in the event of structural issues or leakage. Get it in hand and have your attorney check it out before you pay anything.


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## Hardly Working (Apr 7, 2005)

TimNJ said:


> Do a close read of your sales literature and contract.
> 
> 
> Does it state that your new home has a continuously poured foundation.
> ...





TimNJ said:


> I was thinking the exact same thing.
> 
> At the very least the entire wall needs to be completely cleared and cleaned of all backfill so the footing can be closely inspected.
> 
> ...


1) I highly doubt it. The pour is dependent upon the ground terrain. 

2) He's got money locked in escrow for that Lot.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

Fishindude said:


> Looks like pretty crummy concrete work all the way around.
> I'd at minimum insist on a long term written warranty saying that they will repair to your satisfaction in the event of structural issues or leakage. Get it in hand and have your attorney check it out before you pay anything.


Builder has to give a lifetime warranty on foundations in my state.


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## dayexco (Mar 4, 2006)

Would help a lot of the mud guys would use number 5 bar on the horizontals.


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

Today the builder got back to us saying that the engineer told him to have some of the dirt removed to relieve the stress from the wall so he can inspect it tomorrow,and also said he would most likely be injecting epoxy in the wall to fix it


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

John33 said:


> Today the builder got back to us saying that the engineer told him to have some of the dirt removed to relieve the stress from the wall so he can inspect it tomorrow,and also said he would most likely be injecting epoxy in the wall to fix it


That better not be all they do.


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

Didn't open this thread until just now.

...and now I'm going to pretend I never looked at it.:whistling

Hey John33 - where the **** are you located? At least give enough info to make 2nd guessing have some credo.


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

Big Johnson said:


> Builder has to give a lifetime warranty on foundations in my state.


You and I are in different states with very similarly spelled names...


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## cedarboarder (Mar 30, 2015)

He paid for a new wall, not a cracked bowed one pushed back in place and epoxied. all depends on the contract.


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

cedarboarder said:


> He paid for a new wall, not a cracked bowed one pushed back in place and epoxied. all depends on the contract.


Agreed...but it can be replaced corner to corner as mentioned and be fine.


I am lucky..if this ever happened on one of my foundations my foundation sub would fix it no questions asked.


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## rustyjames (Aug 28, 2008)

fjn said:


> I agree with you........to an extant. Are we talking about some trim nails missing putty or a few trowel marks on the slab,or this foundation problem ?
> 
> 
> As I mentioned in a previous post this screw up would not give me a whole bunch of confidence in the builder. Not to mention the points raised by others regarding what type if any waterproofing was used and was it well drained back fill placed or clay from the excavation. The answer to those questions would determine how fast I would want to divorce myself from the builder. Could possibly be a blessing in disguise.


What I meant is there will always be mistakes made on every project, and some are big ones.


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## TimNJ (Sep 7, 2005)

overanalyze said:


> So all of your jobs are done 100% without defect from start to finish?



Yes they are.
When I turn over the product I produce it is done correctly and functioning the way it is supposed to.

If there is a defective product it is brought to the attention of the supplier. I expect it to be replaced. That may mean I have to go out and redo the job to replace the defective product. I don't get paid for that.

Once in a while...let it slide.
Repetitive...let supplier know why I am dumping their product line.


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

Today our builder got back to us his engineer report. The engineer want the basement slab to be poured ,1st floor deck to be put in ,respray the waterproof on the outside and epoxy the cracks from the inside .


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

TimNJ said:


> Yes they are.
> When I turn over the product I produce it is done correctly and functioning the way it is supposed to.
> 
> If there is a defective product it is brought to the attention of the supplier. I expect it to be replaced. That may mean I have to go out and redo the job to replace the defective product. I don't get paid for that.
> ...


I didn't ask if the final product was 100% defect free. You made my point, any issues you resolve. So to say his home would be devalued because of a repair to a defect is is incorrect.


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## overanalyze (Dec 28, 2010)

John33 said:


> Today our builder got back to us his engineer report. The engineer want the basement slab to be poured ,1st floor deck to be put in ,respray the waterproof on the outside and epoxy the cracks from the inside .


Now that I wouldn't accept.


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

John33 said:


> Today our builder got back to us his engineer report. The engineer want the basement slab to be poured ,1st floor deck to be put in ,respray the waterproof on the outside and epoxy the cracks from the inside .


Something's missing, no?


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

MarkJames said:


> John33 said:
> 
> 
> > Today our builder got back to us his engineer report. The engineer want the basement slab to be poured ,1st floor deck to be put in ,respray the waterproof on the outside and epoxy the cracks from the inside .
> ...


Nothing missing,going pour slab on Thursday. He said he is only going by what his engineer says only and no one else


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## MarkJames (Nov 25, 2012)

So the wall will remain bowed?


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

John33 said:


> Nothing missing,going pour slab on Thursday. He said he is only going by what his engineer says only and no one else




And who pays HIS engineer.........he does. I'd get an opinion from MY engineer if I was in your shoes.


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## 3bar (Jan 14, 2011)

John33 said:


> Nothing missing,going pour slab on Thursday. He said he is only going by what his engineer says only and no one else


i wouldnt accept that. if you had one or maybe 2 cracks in that wall, then maybe that'd be ok, but since your wall is cracked in 4 spots, there is no support except for the floor framing holding the wall.


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## rustyjames (Aug 28, 2008)

John33 said:


> Today our builder got back to us his engineer report. The engineer want the basement slab to be poured ,1st floor deck to be put in ,respray the waterproof on the outside and epoxy the cracks from the inside .


Unacceptable. The wall needs to be put back in place. I would insist that appropriate tiebacks are installed per an engineered design. Additionally, you should press them for some kind of give back in addition to the warranty.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

No way do they leave that wall bowed. Now it’s officially time to call a lawyer to get you out of the contract. He can fix it per his engineer, maybe he can also sell the house to his engineer while he’s at it. That wall looks horrible and will look worse when there’s a floor framed on top of it.


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

Big Johnson said:


> No way do they leave that wall bowed. Now it’s officially time to call a lawyer to get you out of the contract. He can fix it per his engineer, maybe he can also sell the house to his engineer while he’s at it. That wall looks horrible and will look worse when there’s a floor framed on top of it.




:thumbsup::thumbsup:


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

Hey guys,we should probably back off. We have stated our position on the topic. As the old saying goes "a word to the wise should be sufficient". It's his money,he has the right to dissipate it any way he chooses.:laughing:


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## jstanton (Mar 25, 2012)

John33 said:


> Today our builder got back to us his engineer report. The engineer want the basement slab to be poured ,1st floor deck to be put in ,respray the waterproof on the outside and epoxy the cracks from the inside .


No, no &no. The foundation supports the 1st floor not the other way around. I had a 40' wall get broken in 3 places and have a 2.5" bow at the worst part. My structural engineer required 4" c channel 10ft long at 3 different locations with bolting patterns, epoxy injection, & dig down and repair all waterproofing from the exterior. 

You need to hire your own SE with your interests in mind. He is getting "taken care" from his engineer IMO. At the end of the day you need a letter signed off from any SE and a copy of their insurance policy stating that they are covered for owning the repair they describe.

This can be fixed with the right people involved. I would never accept a 4" bowed wall with epoxy as the fix.


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

John33 said:


> Today our builder got back to us his engineer report. The engineer want the basement slab to be poured ,1st floor deck to be put in ,respray the waterproof on the outside and epoxy the cracks from the inside .





John33 said:


> Nothing missing,going pour slab on Thursday. He said he is only going by what his engineer says only and no one else


This person has not 

a; said who he is
b; said where he is
c; said what his contractor status or trade is

Have to take what little this person does say with a grain of salt - more likely a whole shaker of salt.

Typical homeowner/one post wonder - presents just those "facts" that encourage sympathy or "petting" from the gullible. There is more to this story being left out than is being told here.

While the rest of you are knee-jerking, I will remind you that "The Builder" has every right to make repairs "suitable for intended purpose" and until those actions are carried through and completed no one is in a position to yell lawyer or fire.

jeesh...


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## John33 (Nov 11, 2017)

jstanton said:


> John33 said:
> 
> 
> > Today our builder got back to us his engineer report. The engineer want the basement slab to be poured ,1st floor deck to be put in ,respray the waterproof on the outside and epoxy the cracks from the inside .
> ...


I did have my structural engineer look at it yesterday and said that the wall has to be repour,but the builder said he is only going to do what his engineer said and not what my engineer says.


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## Fouthgeneration (Jan 7, 2014)

No full value FHA loans with Three + cracks in the foundation that extend the full height of the basement.....


The overdigging of the footings means MOST LIKELY the FOOTING is BROKEN TOO......if it rained after the clay was exposed, but before the footers were poured, they would have only a fraction of normal lateral resistance/friction.....


The House #s across the street are 7505,7, and 9....durn hi resolution digital cameras....

One full depth poured stoop probably would have "saved" this basement.... or a Fireproof/gun safe vault poured against the long wall.....

Get the Engineer's # and see if he/she is an actual Structural engineer or soil Engineer


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## Fouthgeneration (Jan 7, 2014)

IMHO not ever qualifying for a FHA loan or not meeting IBC 2009 minimum standards is a BIG DEAL.

WHERE is the local Inspector official? 

Call an honest realtor/ loan officer and ask would they sell this foundation as Average or better? and would disclosure be required under federal and state Real Estate laws?

No city wants to known as the home of the busted foundations...

Want fast action, whisper "class action" law suite.......Ask to see the last ten basements team Booty built....

Some fool paid for the leaning tower of Pisa too.

Again the photo of the footing crack(itself a deal stopper) shows that most likely the spread footing were mostly dug and overdug? by the a machine( did the smooth operator switch to a toothless bucket?) Were the footings allowed to fill with ground water prior to pouring the footers, destroying most of sideways resistance?


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

Fouthgeneration said:


> IMHO not ever qualifying for a FHA loan..........


https://www.fhanewsblog.com/2011/06/fha-loans-appraising-the-foundation-and-basement/

_When it comes to the standards for foundations and basements, the FHA has a clear set of guidelines. To begin with, the foundation must be constructed to properly support the home. “All foundations must be adequate to withstand all normal loads imposed.” That’s according to the FHA official site, which also adds, “Stone and brick foundations are acceptable if they are in good condition.”

Basements and foundations with “any noticeable crack” must be addressed. Cracks may indicate the presence of problems with the foundation or other equally important issues that may require further attention before the home can be purchased._


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

Fouthgeneration said:


> IMHO not ever qualifying for a FHA loan or not meeting IBC 2009 minimum standards is a BIG DEAL.
> 
> WHERE is the local Inspector official?
> 
> ...


The OP has not stated where the build is being done. How would you then know what codes are currently in force?

The "building inspector" is going to inspect what he sees. He can well make note of an issue and request additional info regarding repairs.

You say "city", yet what is shown in the photos are houses being built within a large and fallow farm field. 

You jump to conclusions that somehow one foundation damaged by heavy equipment constitutes proof that the builder is somehow guilty of something.

All you are doing is sensationalizing something that no one here on this forum can make any definitive statements on, except this:

Cracked foundations can be repaired and pass every inspection, FHA, local code and national code.


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## rrk (Apr 22, 2012)

Fouthgeneration said:


> No city wants to known as the home of the busted foundations...
> 
> Want fast action, whisper "class action" law suite.......Ask to see the last ten basements team Booty built....


Why would the city care?

Even if you screamed "class action" do you have any idea what it takes to proceed on a class action lawsuit ? or the cost ?

The builder will not let you see any other basements and may not even let you see yours.

Once a contract is signed some major builders do not even permit you to be on the property you bought without permission until the closing. I had a customer who saw that his garage floor was damaged to to a heavy rain soon after pouring the concrete, he also mentions lawsuit and they ask him if he want to cancel contract. According to his contract he would have to pay something like $100k to cancel it. He kept the crappy floor.


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## Big Johnson (Jun 2, 2017)

SmallTownGuy said:


> The OP has not stated where the build is being done. How would you then know what codes are currently in force?
> 
> The "building inspector" is going to inspect what he sees. He can well make note of an issue and request additional info regarding repairs.
> 
> ...


If fha won’t finance a cracked foundation they might as well close up shop. The FHA that is.


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## B.Johnson (Sep 17, 2016)

I learned a new word today. "Fallow"

Other than that not much to gain from this thread.


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## Fouthgeneration (Jan 7, 2014)

Big Johnson @ post #165: Above, House #s of 79xx imply a town-City of at least 79 blocks(5.5miles @ 13 blocks a mile) in one dimension.... note Kerbs, not used much in rural subdivisions......

The main idea behind Building codes/permits is to ensure a large flow of property Tax revenue based on easily sold(qualified for federal reinsurance mortgages) real estate.....

You want to live under a blue tarp, move to Haiti or Islamic paradise on Earth.:thumbsup:

Most state define 'city' as over ten thousand people... the sociologists say 100,000 to 3,000,000 people.... City, town, village, comply or fight city/town hall....

He is guilty of failing to repair a BROKEN wall that makes the house that will sit on it much harder to sell FOREVER.....

Would you let him leave a broken rim joist or truss in place with just straightening it without replacing the damaged material?

It is possible this is the first time the GC has decided to do something on the very cheesy side of moral business acts, but I doubt it, see faux expert claims, and shoddy excavation practices.

GC's thought balloon,"Gee, if I repair this broken wall, I'll be on the hook for every busted wall I ever peddled....."

How can the broken wall be repaired without added footings, concrete walls and galvanized steel elements, outside the basement? (ANY concrete inside the basement lowers the value of the space(s).....

How DO you fix a broken footer.......

The continuous cracks also weakened the Two adjacent walls considerably.

Pretending this type of substandard construction is worthy of a Home loan guaranteed by US the USA's taxpayers nauseates me. 

No incorporated whatever wants its tax revenue based on some fly-by-Nite builders shack attacks.... That is why Building codes exist...

Class Action law suits SAVE $ money by reducing duplicate court actions....

Stupid people sign outrageous contracts= More fools born all the time..... Any contract that is doing something illegal is automatically ended in US civil law.... 

STG: Most towns with 79 block long streets have codes... I.e. who numbered the houses......?????

Where I live almost every city is SURROUNDED by fields...so what?

Any basement with cracks REQUIRES a pro to sign off the foundations suitability for its use, and makes the room unusable(non-conforming) as a basement bedroom.....FHA rules

An old stone, and lime sand mortar foundation would have been in a pile under the dirt and the maroon running the skidder/cat.:jester:

Doing a homeowner out of Tens of thousands of dollars because one hired a fool to back fill a very fragile basement isn't defense-able IMHO. 

GCs to cheap/stupid to pay the excavator to come back several times to gradually back fill deserve to be punished for their massive economic/professional ignorance.


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## B.Johnson (Sep 17, 2016)




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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

B.Johnson said:


> I learned a new word today. "Fallow"
> 
> Other than that not much to gain from this thread.


rhymes with "callow".

There ya go a 2-fer!


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

The word "callow" used in a sentence, phrase or verse.

The Brothers Four did perhaps the rendition with the most air time & charted in 1965.

Every singer with a rep covered the tune - people loved it.


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## B.Johnson (Sep 17, 2016)

Sorry, but my hearing isn't good enough to make out the word callow. I googled the lyrics and all I can say is that it's not a good song for the hard of hearing as every other line ends in ...llow :sad::blink:


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

B.Johnson said:


> Sorry, but my hearing isn't good enough to make out the word callow. I googled the lyrics and all I can say is that it's not a good song for the hard of hearing as every other line ends in ...llow :sad::blink:


I'm deef too. But I'm not going to ??llow in my self-pity.

hah !!!


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## Kumpel (Aug 30, 2017)

SmallTownGuy said:


> B.Johnson said:
> 
> 
> > Sorry, but my hearing isn't good enough to make out the word callow. I googled the lyrics and all I can say is that it's not a good song for the hard of hearing as every other line ends in ...llow
> ...


Lol!


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## jlhaslip (Dec 31, 2009)

I'm chiming in late, as usual, but here is my story which involves a similar situation that happened back in the good old days before all of your epoxy injection stuff was available.

D4 crashed into a 30 ft wall. 8 ft height, and 8 inch thick, much like this one. The dent moved the top of the wall about 3 inches as measured after the removal of all the dirt and the machine. Footing was deemed okay, and the repair proceeded as follows under supervision of a Structural Engineer and the AHJ.

* Chisel out the cracks to open them up to about 2 inches wide on the faces (both inside and outside)to ensure there were no "loose concrete chunks" around the cracks and create a good bonding surface for step 2
* Repair the cracks using Hydraulic cement to pack the cracks.
* Re form and re pour the wall as a 12 inch wall ensuring that the inner and outer walls were plumb and straight. If I recall correctly, a different concrete mix was used with small aggregate and a more plastic mix so it would feather out into the new forming.

One advantage this project has was a wide footing than normal for an 8 inch wall because the basement was for a Log home, so it had to carry a different load than was normally found in a stick framed house. That allowed for the additional 4 inch width of the wall.

The Cat Skinner's insurance covered the additional costs, the Engineer and Inspectors were happy, the Home owner lost very little space in the basement and we picked up some extra work. 
The Cat Skinner was also the buddy of the homeowner, so it didn't affect our contract for completion. Everybody won except the Insurance company.

That's how it was done 35 years ago.


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## dayexco (Mar 4, 2006)

Trying to compare this to my line of work, and this is only scenario I can come up with. 

Bear in mind, I've back filled hundreds, if not thousands of basements. I would never leave a customer like this. Hopefully, I'd have it replaced before they knew. 

Anyway, my scenario is, I install their 4 inch sanitary sewer line. It has a 2 inch sag. Will it work? Yeah, probably for a long, long time. 

Is it what I agreed and got paid to install? Hell no. Good contractors give the customer what they expected and paid for.

On edit, 90% of my work was repeat or referred. I couldn't take that chance of leaving my customer wondering what the hell happened.


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## fjn (Aug 17, 2011)

dayexco said:


> Trying to compare this to my line of work, and this is only scenario I can come up with.
> 
> Bear in mind, I've back filled hundreds, if not thousands of basements. I would never leave a customer like this. Hopefully, I'd have it replaced before they knew.
> 
> ...




:thumbsup::thumbsup:



There is a local construction firm near me,they have been in business since 1911 and do about 500 million dollars worth of work a year. I had friends who worked for them in the late 60,s and early 70,s. I remember them years ago telling stories what a great company it was to work for. They gave you more than ample time to do your work,but expected perfection. If their superintendent saw work he did not like,he would have you tear it out and re do it,never getting excited,however,it was understood that it should not happen often. If this foundation was on their job,I would bet the wall would not be repaired,the whole foundation would be jerked out and replaced.

This company would not have survived since 1911 with less than a stellar reputation. They pride themselves on delivering on schedule,under budget projects,all the while putting safety at the forefront. Especially since they are self insured. Their superintendents develop their own punch lists prior to the final walk thru by the owners / architects. The superintendents have rivalry among st themselves to see who can deliver projects with 0 items on a final walk thru.

Their is an old saying, "you live and die by your reputation and you are only as good as your last job,period ".


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## dayexco (Mar 4, 2006)

One of my "largest" fights, were contractors who low balled, and attempted to change order themselves into a profit. 

Geesus, bid as designed, you win, you win. You lose, you lose.


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## hdavis (Feb 14, 2012)

You're supposed to look at the plans, and figure out where change orders are going to be required. Then low ball knowing those change orders are 100% going to happen.

Something like bidding slab on grade assuming undisturbed soil, when you know a couple houses with basements were demoed and filled, or making a parking lot assuming normal soil conditions when you know for a fact there is ledge.


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## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

jlhaslip said:


> I'm chiming in late, as usual, but here is my story which involves a similar situation that happened back in the good old days before all of your epoxy injection stuff was available.
> 
> D4 crashed into a 30 ft wall. 8 ft height, and 8 inch thick, much like this one. The dent moved the top of the wall about 3 inches as measured after the removal of all the dirt and the machine. Footing was deemed okay, and the repair proceeded as follows under supervision of a Structural Engineer and the AHJ.
> 
> ...


yup.:thumbsup:


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