# How not to build a roof



## 91782 (Sep 6, 2012)

hdavis said:


> He's the HO in this case, so he shouldn't have to do anything beyond laying around eating bon bons and writing the check...


Of course...


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## Calidecks (Nov 19, 2011)

You have to give the guy credit, he's got the stones of a buffalo for even exposing all of us to that **** sandwich.


Mike.
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## WBailey1041 (Jan 31, 2014)

NYgutterguy said:


> Not trying to pile on but that bracket to hold half round gutter ain't gonna work either.
> 
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> ...


You missed those birds mouths. Tight as virgin p....


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## rjconstructs (Apr 26, 2009)

That is a mess. What are you going to do?


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## bobmocarski (Aug 29, 2017)

NYgutterguy said:


> Not trying to pile on but that bracket to hold half round gutter ain't gonna work either.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah those would come down first storm. Too far apart and they are only attached to 1/2" OSB. What they called drip edge is also under them so the water will run behind the gutters. All needs to be replaced. 

You guys gave me a good laugh with some of the comments, but have me scratching my head over your attitudes towards homeowners. "The mess you have found yourself in is your doing". Really? So the contractor has no responsibility and it's always the HO's fault. Why would you want to be in such a crappy situation day in and day out working for the people you think so poorly of and how does that affect the work you are doing? Crappy way to live if you ask me.

Yeah, homeowners are a pita but they are paying a lot of money and are entitled to a certain amount of respect. They don't owe us anything except payment for a job well done. Perhaps a lot of the reason HO's badmouth contractors is because of the poor attitude towards them. Not all HO's are bad just like not all contractors are bad.

I was hoping to get some more ideas for what is fair with these guys and steps I can take to convince them to do the right thing. Some of the things I'll be doing if they don't take care of this are to have my attorney send them annoying letters, contacting the state attorney general and going after their GC license, contacting the dept of revenue to make sure they are current on sales and use tax, notifying the township to make sure they obtained the proper license to work in the township, contacting all the local municipalities so they know the type of work these guys do, bad reviews online, etc. I have a long list of things I will do to make sure it's more expensive for them to screw me than to do the right thing.


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## A&E Exteriors (Aug 14, 2009)

bobmocarski said:


> Yeah those would come down first storm. Too far apart and they are only attached to 1/2" OSB. What they called drip edge is also under them so the water will run behind the gutters. All needs to be replaced.
> 
> You guys gave me a good laugh with some of the comments, but have me scratching my head over your attitudes towards homeowners. "The mess you have found yourself in is your doing". Really? So the contractor has no responsibility and it's always the HO's fault. Why would you want to be in such a crappy situation day in and day out working for the people you think so poorly of and how does that affect the work you are doing? Crappy way to live if you ask me.
> 
> ...


A lot of homeowners come on here and try to pass themselves off as contractors to get info to use against the cheap hack they hired.

You seem to check out so sorry to confuse you as one of them.


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## bobmocarski (Aug 29, 2017)

A&E Exteriors said:


> A lot of homeowners come on here and try to pass themselves off as contractors to get info to use against the cheap hack they hired.
> 
> You seem to check out so sorry to confuse you as one of them.


I get it. I knew posting like that would look suspicious from post count alone. I was active on this forum a little about 5 yrs ago but couldn't remember my creds so started a new account. 

I already have a list of everything that is wrong and a good start at what I can do. Was looking for info from you guys as to how you would want it handled if you were on the other side (not that you'd do work as poor as this) and additional ideas for what is effective in getting a fair resolution.


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## A&E Exteriors (Aug 14, 2009)

bobmocarski said:


> I get it. I knew posting like that would look suspicious from post count alone. I was active on this forum a little about 5 yrs ago but couldn't remember my creds so started a new account.
> 
> I already have a list of everything that is wrong and a good start at what I can do. Was looking for info from you guys as to how you would want it handled if you were on the other side (not that you'd do work as poor as this) and additional ideas for what is effective in getting a fair resolution.


I'd tell them to give me back my money or I'd contact the licensing board to file a formal complaint


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## A&E Exteriors (Aug 14, 2009)

Disclaimer : Assuming they are licensed


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

i thought the cornice return was epic:thumbup:..take that Greeks..


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## WBailey1041 (Jan 31, 2014)

A&E Exteriors said:


> A lot of homeowners come on here and try to pass themselves off as contractors to get info to use against the cheap hack they hired.
> 
> You seem to check out so sorry to confuse you as one of them.


Ditto. Also, I get called a lot for free estimate requests to fix this kinda thing. I'm jaded to the point I flat refuse to do work I can't be proud of. I cost more for a reason.


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## bobmocarski (Aug 29, 2017)

Thanks. They are licensed. The owner inspected the work yesterday and admitted the work wasn't good. He wants the chance to fix it. I'm really torn on this one. All it takes in Pa to become a contractor is pay $50 to the Attorney General for a contractor license and get liability insurance. The tough part is that it's unlikely I'll ever see any refund. Easier to just close up shop and reopen under another name. If I let them do the repairs and I supervise closely it might be my only chance to get anything back.

This was a strange experience. The work is poor, but they showed up on time every day, added additional people to the crew without charge when they knew they were getting behind, and worked till dark most days. 

I've fully documented all the issues including pictures. If I do have them perform any rework, I'll be detailing out full specifications for each fix before they start.


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## SPG (Mar 9, 2017)

bobmocarski said:


> If I do have them perform any rework, I'll be detailing out full specifications for each fix before they start.


Sounds like you just got yourself a new job. Will they be paying you for your time as foreman?


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## NYgutterguy (Mar 3, 2014)

I just can't stop looking at the pics. Was owner ever on site ? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## bobmocarski (Aug 29, 2017)

SPG said:


> Sounds like you just got yourself a new job. Will they be paying you for your time as foreman?


I can always deduct that from the amount I would owe them if the job were completed satisfactorily. I don't think they could afford my rates though lol.

The owner was actually part of the team that worked on it in the beginning, and there isn't much wrong with what was done during that time. He had one guy who was supposed to be the expert carpenter who ran the show and the owner was basically a worker.

I can honestly say though that the owner was very busy dealing with other jobs and running around offsite on errands, and he was not here most of the time. By the time he got back involved in any real way towards the end they were seriously behind and they were all just scrambling around trying to get done what they can. 

When the owner came back to inspect it he brought one of the guys who worked on it. He was all excuses and defended the work. You know the standard stuff - it's just rough framing, the ledger bolts are behind the rafters, we didn't know how you wanted that finished, that isn't important cause it's not structural, etc, etc, etc. I threw him off the property when he told me he thought they were capping the Azek. He looked pretty lonely sitting in the truck waiting for the owner.

The owner looked pretty green when he inspected the work. Maybe I'll get a decent resolution. I'll keep you guys posted. I also have some additional pics I'll put up. You'll like how the back end of the gazebo roof looks.


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## bobmocarski (Aug 29, 2017)

Based on the pics, how long would you guys say that roof should have taken?


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## WBailey1041 (Jan 31, 2014)

bobmocarski said:


> Based on the pics, how long would you guys say that roof should have taken?


How many guys?..

Hand drive or guns?..

Kinda hard to say... but then I've never stapled Ice and Water shield.. 

How did they get behind while employing that expert time saving trick!?


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## A&E Exteriors (Aug 14, 2009)

It depends. Me and my brother could do it in probably 2 - 2 1/2 days

Me and a half ass helper.. 3-5 days


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## bobmocarski (Aug 29, 2017)

I was figuring 5 days for a crew of 3 to get the roof, columns, and decking installed. Took them 8 1/2 for 1/2 a roof. One reason the expert told me it took longer than usual was because they sorted the shingles. Supposed to look so much better than when you don't. If his courses were straighter maybe we'd be able to test that theory.


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## Tom Struble (Mar 2, 2007)

hmm..probably woulda been better if they didn't show up every day..


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