# And another concrete counter top



## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

or two. I liked Stonecutter's techniques and wanted to try myself. We're getting ready for our local home show and these will be going along.

First the forms;










The table is an insulated torsion box. Over that I have a 36"x12' sheet of laminate installed with double sided tape. The form sides are strips of melamine and installed with hot glue weld on the outside edges. The insides are sealed with clay for water tight fit and a formed edge. 

This will be a two piece with a straight seam. After the show it will be installed as desk tops in our office, unless we accidentally sell them. On the end are two 18x24x3/4" that I'll do my experiments in. I didn't think to photo the other two piece form. No room on the table so that was made on sheets of melamine. 

Here's the desk tops filled;










These are wet cast with the forms seeded with colored glass bits. The gravel in the mix was selected for the colors in it. After curing it will be flipped and ground to expose the glass and gravel. No dyes were harmed for this project. 

This one would be more like Stonecutter's fireplace piece;










This is two forms butted together at the seam. The mix was a dry sand mix hand pressed into the form. For sand I used 1/2 black and 1/2 white. Only needed a little black dye to come up with a nice charcoal color.

Here we got the molds tore down, separated and flipped the pieces. That box is the buff dye for the first slurry.










Good Luck
Dave


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

First slurry is on;










This slurry was white portland, sand and buff dye. When I first mixed it I almost chucked it. Last time I saw this color I was cleaning out the calf's pen. 

But after a little quality time with 100 grit disc and it looked more appealing to me;










At this point I'm not really loving the colors but am sold on the process. This is wicked cool to work with. Thanks be to Stonecutter for that last kick in the pants to start me. 

We used a mold insert for this alleged bull nose. It's very slight, but much easier on the hands for the leading edges. 










Good Luck
Dave


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

The wet cast pieces were relocated to the outer shop;










The view ain't bad if you remember to look up once in awhile;










These will get ground with a 50 grit until they show their stuff. I've gotten started on that but have a ways to go tomorrow to get it there. The dry pack pieces are finished with the slurry and polishing. More pics tomorrow.

Good Luck
Dave


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## Dirtywhiteboy (Oct 15, 2010)

I love that stuff, thanks for the detailed post:thumbsup:


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Nice shop location. It must be hard to work when the fish are jumping..


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## 6stringmason (May 20, 2005)

Looks pretty nice. I dont care for the 2nd color personally lol.. but the technique is nice. I've done a few samples of the pressed technique myself and usually yields some nice results.

What are you sealing them with?


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## stonecutter (May 13, 2010)

It all looks great David. Your bull-nose looks nice and clean too! Looking forward to more pictures.

My next project is going to be a small ramp sink..like bar sink size.:thumbsup:


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## stonecutter (May 13, 2010)

Oh yeah....the black sand. Is that silica sand? I had been kicking an idea around to do some veining with a second color & portland mixed with black beauty. The grains are very sharp so I think it would work well.


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## CCCo. (Jul 19, 2009)

Beautiful :thumbsup:

I got to run out now - have a busy day planned, but I will be back to take some time reviewing this thread - so I can get a better look at it!


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

The final slurry was straight grey portland paste. I was going to use white but my son walked in and suggested grey just in time. I'm glad he did.










I switched to a 200 grit for the last slurry clean up. Once that was done I wet the slabs with Lithium silicate and polished that until it started to dry in place. Then a water bath and scrub, rinse.

For me, the third color saved it. I like it again. I'm hoping time allows me to flip the over to touch up the backsides. I didn't trowel it much and it's rough. The show time is coming up fast so don't know if I'll make that.

The sealer will by Xylexin for these pieces.

I'm not sure on the black sand, I think it's crushed shale. It's sold as leveling sand for patio pavers. The grains are longer than wide and very sharp. And it sucks up the water so I have to keep a careful eye on the consistency.

I thought this bait would work for catching Crow! Good to see you Jim.

Good Luck
Dave


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> Nice shop location. It must be hard to work when the fish are jumping..


This year the snow geese paid a visit on their way home. We'll see Canada geese almost all year round. River beavers, muskrats and an occasional mink. Not to mention all manner of fish.

Some days the river is placid, like a lake. That's when I have a hard time with the distraction.

Good Luck
Dave


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

I like playing with masonry tools and pretending I have an Italian heritage. But the truth is my heritage is more Scottish so we keep molds handy for the overage. We use these as freebies for our clients that purchase concrete counter tops.










That's a white portland, white sand mix with white titanium dye.

Good Luck
Dave


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

Note to self: Cover the pieces in the outer shop for overnights, lunch and other extended breaks.

Alternate plan: Brush up on BS skills so you can explain that those stains are naturally occurring and part of the beauty of the piece.

Good Luck
Dave


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## CCCo. (Jul 19, 2009)

DavidC said:


> Note to self: Cover the pieces in the outer shop for overnights, lunch and other extended breaks.
> 
> Alternate plan: Brush up on BS skills so you can explain that those stains are naturally occurring and part of the beauty of the piece.
> 
> ...


Brutal - but handled like a true professional :whistling

:laughing:


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

BS beats careful planning 9 times out of 10


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

dom-mas said:


> BS beats careful planning 9 times out of 10


So true, so true. But it seems to have worked out ok. Here's the prime suspect;










I was able to remove the stains completely. When careful planning takes a back seat and the BS skills need polishing, I'll take dumb luck any day.

This has been some of the most intense grinding I've done to date. I expected to see more gravel by now. After about 12+ hrs. of working it I will take this as what I get. 










The clear glass (above) doesn't show that well in the pic, kind of looks like more gravel here. On this end is bits of green glass;










I'm thinking it's either real dense concrete or the gravel didn't make it to near enough the surface. I'm leaning toward the density because you can almost see the gravel beneath the surface. It just refuses to pop.

Today it gets another slurry coat and more polishing while the other pieces will get sealed with xylexin.

Temps have returned to more like normal for this time of year so I closed the outer shop until further notice. Grinding time increases when you have to stop to thaw your fingers. Moved inside for today.

Good Luck
Dave


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## Metro M & L (Jun 3, 2009)

Maybe a diamond cup?


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

DavidC said:


> When careful planning takes a back seat and the BS skills need polishing, I'll take dumb luck any day.


Oh, yeah, dumb luck trumps everything.

looks good


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

Metro M & L said:


> Maybe a diamond cup?


Great minds do think alike. I just got back from picking one up. It says it's for grinding cured concrete so we'll see after lunch.

Good Luck
Dave


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

And we have a winner! Just a few passes with the diamond cup and there were my stones. Going back now to clean up the swirls and make it smooth again.

Good Luck
Dave


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## stonecutter (May 13, 2010)

You must have used a fine grit cup? I would have been worried that even fine would be too aggressive. Glad it worked out for you.

Looks really cool David!:thumbsup:

I'm posting some install pics right now!


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

stonecutter said:


> You must have used a fine grit cup? I would have been worried that even fine would be too aggressive. Glad it worked out for you.
> 
> Looks really cool David!:thumbsup:
> 
> I'm posting some install pics right now!


The cup I picked up is listed as 50-60 grit, the resin pad I was using is also a 50 grit. The diamond cup is definitely more aggressive, much more. There was noticeable chatter and it wanted to hop around. I would caution inexperienced users to practice on something less important first. 

The diamond cup took it down to the gravel quickly but left swirls and a rough feeling surface. I was able to clean it up with no problem using the resin pad. I have my final slurry (hopefully) on and will clean that up tonight. Tomorrow is what I figure to be my last day to get sealer on in time for a good cure. The show is this weekend.

Good Luck
Dave


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## lowellmason (Feb 8, 2012)

Great work Dave. I have always been intersted in learning how to do it. Just really never got the time.


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## 2low4nh (Dec 12, 2010)

I want more pictures of the glass in the counter top. I like it


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

My new little buddy. Not just aggressive, but determined too.










Remember the piece I gave up on? Here it is after just a few minutes with the diamond cup;










My camera really doesn't do the clear glass justice. You can make out the clear in the foreground, goes to no glass in the middle and green glass at the far end.










For clear glass we shatter old tempered windows. Colored glass is usually wine bottles. We take care to empty them first.

Good Luck
Dave


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

The other piece has blue on one end and a lighter green on the other. 










Same piece, different angle;










And then more slurry;










Their is no limit to what you can embed in the surface. One client provided their own glass, coins with significant dates and pieces from the old light fixtures when we remodeled their kitchen. We even had to work in pieces of the old pipes that used to freeze every winter.

Good Luck
Dave


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

Here's the hand pressed tops with the first application of sealer;




























They'll get another coat and done. Next pic of them will be set up at the home show in another thread.

I've decided to change course with the wet cast glass & gravel pieces. I'm going to polish them to a higher grit and use a penetrating sealer instead of the xylexine. I don't normally do this unless it's a waxed finish. Mainly because I don't know how well they'll hold up. These will be going back to our office, so I can keep an eye on how they wear.

Good Luck
Dave


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

Man that hand pressed stuff is awesome. Thanks for posting the pix and thanks stonecutter for the initial interest


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## EthanB (Sep 28, 2011)

Are you building the bull nose into the mold or routing it?


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

dom-mas said:


> Man that hand pressed stuff is awesome. Thanks for posting the pix and thanks stonecutter for the initial interest


Thanks again from me Stonecutter. I've been meaning to try this for a long time, just needed to see your pieces I guess.



EthanB said:


> Are you building the bull nose into the mold or routing it?


The bull nose is a mold that goes into the form. We also have a rough rock edge and there are many more that can be purchased or made.

Good Luck
Dave


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## stonecutter (May 13, 2010)

Well...I'm glad that project came along with great clients...they really showed some trust to allow me to do the press concrete.

I cant wait to see what all of you guys come up with...like I said you are really only limited by imagination with this typ of material.

And Dave, those pieces are great...the glass reminds me of terrazzo a little bit.:thumbsup:


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

Well I thought I remembered someone saying they wouldn't think the hot glue would hold up to this work. But it must have been another thread, or maybe a dream. Whoever you are, where ever you said it, this is for you;










That was the longer form sides. Even though they pried off fairly easy, the glue resisted enough to break them. But all the same, scrape the table with a wide knife, wipe with lacquer thinner and viola!, ready to go again.










That laminate top can be used over and over, sanded if you scratch it and used again. When it does need replacing, it's only on with tape. Some day I'll make some reusable sides along the same line. (or so I claim)

Good Luck
Dave


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## stonecutter (May 13, 2010)

David, you might have been thinking about something I had said regarding the glue gun. Not that it wouldn't hold, just that I didn't think of trying because it didn't seem strong enough. I can't wait to try it, because I don't like form building and this way would be faster.....I always want to jump right into the creative part.

One question about the glue. Do you brace the sides of the form on a long run to prevent a bow or is the glue enough to keep it straight?

One thing is certain...now that the hearth is in and that this thread has more pics, I am itching to make something else. No time right now but I'll get my glue gun ready for next week.


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

I'm with you on the form building. I haven't had any problem with bowing at all. The side pieces are always at least 3/4" stock and no more than 1 1/2" tall, so there probably isn't much risk.

Crunch time for the Home Show, opens a 4pm and runs through the weekend. This is about the only time I will willingly work the weekend. I'll start a new thread in Marketing with pics of our setup.

Good Luck
Dave


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

I'll preface this post by saying that I'm not that knowledgable about concrete.

Bowing happens because of Hydrostatic pressure which increases with height only, not with length or width. Also the drier the mix, the less pressure as well, I guess that one was obvious.


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## stonecutter (May 13, 2010)

dom-mas said:


> I'll preface this post by saying that I'm not that knowledgable about concrete.
> 
> Bowing happens because of Hydrostatic pressure which increases with height only, not with length or width. Also the drier the mix, the less pressure as well, I guess that one was obvious.


 What I was asking was really more of a question of whether the glue would hold the initial pressure from the mix....which will bow the sides of a form if they are insufficiently secured.


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

Here's what it looks like set up for our Home Show display;










and;










It was very popular with the crowd. I overheard one person say they didn't like the color, but over all it was well received. Some had trouble believing that it is concrete. One couple said they had decided on granite already but just changed their mind.

I'm going to recoat the sealer and put it in storage. Next show is in 3 weeks.

Good Luck
Dave


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## Dirtywhiteboy (Oct 15, 2010)

David that looks great:thumbsup: about the seams, are the counters always a single unit? I see that curved seam, is that for a two part show top? Can you bond a seam like a solid surface top?


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

Normally this size counter top would be one piece. I figure 8' length is about the most we can handle reasonably so seams are a fact of life. I curve the seam to try an make it a point of interest.

A bead of silicone would go between the pieces before assembly ordinarily. I can't make the seam invisible so I try to make it purty. I've seen some with a jigsaw puzzle like seam. Interesting, but a bit much for me.

Good Luck
Dave


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## duburban (Apr 10, 2008)

How are you selling your concrete? I make dang sure to announce its performance flaws tactfully and always push people to see my tops in service. I don't know what sealer your using but whatever it is, make sure it can easily be repaired on sight.


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## stonecutter (May 13, 2010)

DavidC said:


> Normally this size counter top would be one piece. I figure 8' length is about the most we can handle reasonably so seams are a fact of life. I curve the seam to try an make it a point of interest.
> 
> A bead of silicone would go between the pieces before assembly ordinarily. I can't make the seam invisible so I try to make it purty. I've seen some with a jigsaw puzzle like seam. Interesting, but a bit much for me.
> 
> ...


Great job David! Now you have me itching to do another piece!

I like the seam and think it was a cleaver way to prevent a break. Carrying a counter shape like that would make me nervous. 

I'm sure you've seen Cheng counters....he does diagonal seams once in a while. I like them but the curve looks more elegant. 

You probably thought of this already but....it would be cool if you made a sample board with a selection of colors and/ or aggregates.


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

duburban said:


> How are you selling your concrete? I make dang sure to announce its performance flaws tactfully and always push people to see my tops in service. I don't know what sealer your using but whatever it is, make sure it can easily be repaired on sight.


So far most sales are part of a remodel package. We do make certain that we tell folks that as pretty as it is it's still concrete so it may crack, chip, etc. I have checked on a couple of our earliest installs and so far no one reports any of this. The first was installed a bit over 3 years ago.

Our sealer is a 2 part epoxy that, so far, is proving to be very durable. Minor scratches can be buffed out and a simple recoat would remedy any deeper ones. I haven't seen any delamination yet or any staining. I have yet to do any actual stain testing in the shop so won't claim stain proof. Clients are advised to approach it as if their mother is over their shoulder. Use cutting boards and trivets, if you spill it wipe it up.

Any threads here with pics of your work? Sounds like you have some experience.

Good Luck
Dave


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## DavidC (Feb 16, 2008)

Stonecutter, it was Cheng's book that got me started. One thing that always stood out for me was he is a relatively small man, yet likes really massive counter tops. Like 2-3" thick. I'm leaning toward reducing ours to 1 1/4" to reduce the weight for handling purposes.

The curved seam isn't an original idea, I got that from somewhere on the web. But Cheng does advise embracing the fact and making it interesting. Or placing them at the sink hole to minimize them.

I visited your blog before the show last week. You've got some good articles there.

Good Luck
Dave


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## stonecutter (May 13, 2010)

Thanks David...it's a work in progress.

I own one of Chengs books and a video from Buddy Rhodes. They were good reference material leading up to my project.


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