# Being a hired gun



## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

Well, i got my first job from my website..
the guy wants me to come build a a 15x50 4p roof over the existing 1p roof... he doesn't know how to cut rafters and layout so thats why he needs me.. I said, well i could do that for you, but on the condition that i am an employee of you and not a sub contractor, and as a result i have no liability. Well now, seems like an ok gig, he figures out the plan, he'll be there, i come help to frame it.. just a laborer. Well now, me and my dad always have this arguement. Hes all like "your liable if it fails".. uh no... i am just a laborer, plan is to code, i build it to plan, if it fails i have no liability.... 
What is the facts on this.. because i can do the job, i am not gonna ****ing look like a dumby and say sorry, my dad says i can't , just because my dad has large job anxiety...
whos right here?

with the three of us, it would not be hard to frame that roof and sheath it in under a day..


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Nick,

If you build it right then who cares about liability. Just get the insurance and over build it. Worrying about liability is onky for people who should be worried because of improper insurances and or knowingly shoddy work..


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> Nick,
> 
> If you build it right then who cares about liability. Just get the insurance and over build it. Worrying about liability is onky for people who should be worried because of improper insurances and or knowingly shoddy work..


well hes getting a designer. then i do not need to over build it.
im not gonna get insurance yet, and i shouldn't have to for this job.. he dictates whats to be done, heres the plan, cut and nail wood. thats it?


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## WilsonRMDL (Sep 4, 2007)

Your liable unless he's going to pay you as an employee, take taxes out or 1099 and he is a company. thats my take on it anyway. 

If you have insurance and do it right, Don't worry about it. 

I'd make sure he signs something stating that he is liable for any problems not you, regardless of I it will stand up in court.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

WilsonRMDL said:


> Your liable unless he's going to pay you as an employee, take taxes out or 1099 and he is a company. thats my take on it anyway.
> 
> If you have insurance and do it right, Don't worry about it.
> 
> I'd make sure he signs something stating that he is liable for any problems not you, regardless of I it will stand up in court.


well i would just be paid cash,
but i was going to make up contract saying something like 
" by signing here __________ I ______________ hereby accept the title of contractor of this work _______________ at adress______________
and therefore accept all liability for the work being done. As a result Nick __________ accepts no liability of this job or design.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

I am not sure but that kind of agreement has to be improper. In Ohio homeowners only have free range to work on their homes if they have no mortgage. Ofcourse there is no contractors license here either... 

Designer or architect?


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> I am not sure but that kind of agreement has to be improper. In Ohio homeowners only have free range to work on their homes if they have no mortgage. Ofcourse there is no contractors license here either...
> 
> Designer or architect?


not sure, hes supposed to call Heritage from here, who is a designer, and they will talk about the code specifics of the job. Hes the ocntractor, i am simply a laborer...


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## Mr Latone (Jan 8, 2011)

In New York, I couldn't hire you as an employee to work on a roof if you were under 18. I believe there are age restrictions for employee use of power tools in other trades as well.

I don't know the law so far as whether you could be a roofing _contractor_ if you weren't 18.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

I did my first reroof at 14 with my 13 year old brother by hand. Hand drove the whole roof. What a learning experience. I think we got like $5/hr..


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> I did my first reroof at 14 with my 13 year old brother by hand. Hand drove the whole roof. What a learning experience. I think we got like $5/hr..


yea ive done shingling way bigger then this
this is just a frame and sheet:whistling


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## knucklehead (Mar 2, 2009)

You don't want a contract. If he want to hire you by the hour, fine. Do a good job and it will lead to something else. That is the way **** works.

don't leave a paper trail, you don't need to start that any sooner than you have to.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

knucklehead said:


> You don't want a contract. If he want to hire you by the hour, fine. Do a good job and it will lead to something else. That is the way **** works.
> 
> don't leave a paper trail, you don't need to start that any sooner than you have to.


yea paid by an hour and thats it
this would be the perfect chance to show off my skills


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Thought you were working with Chris. Where has he been?


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## MAULEMALL (May 16, 2010)

I understand that you are young and you want to earn some respect from your father but you won't get it by disrespecting him and his opinion.

The whole deal sounds bad.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> Thought you were working with Chris. Where has he been?


im in school..
this is a weekend thing


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

MAULEMALL said:


> I understand that you are young and you want to earn some respect from your father but you won't get it by disrespecting him and his opinion.
> 
> The whole deal sounds bad.


its not a matter of opinion though, its a matter of facts.
the fact is, if i am hired by him as an employee... i have no liability related to the job.. he dictates what to do and i do it.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

I dont think he could hire you like said before without a w9 and or 1099. Or at least the northern equivalent.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> I dont think he could hire you like said before without a w9 and or 1099. Or at least the northern equivalent.


chris said if i give him my SIN number he would have to give me a t4


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

I think the only liability here is the results that will follow from disobeying your father. :whistling


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## MAULEMALL (May 16, 2010)

FramingPro said:


> its not a matter of opinion though, its a matter of facts.
> the fact is, if i am hired by him as an employee... i have no liability related to the job.. he dictates what to do and i do it.


I appreciate your wanting to do bigger and better but


> What is the facts on this.. because i can do the job, i am not gonna ****ing look like a dumb **** *and say sorry, my dad says i can't , just because my dad has large job anxiety..*


The one person who you should be trusting is the person who has your best interests at heart.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

MAULEMALL said:


> I appreciate your wanting to do bigger and better but
> 
> The one person who you should be trusting is the person who has your best interests at heart.


putting opinions aside,
i am legally right am i not?
my dad doesn't do this stuff, so he gets nervous around the thought of renovations or building. hes just not accustomed to building big stuff


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## Inner10 (Mar 12, 2009)

Just remember that no one on this board ever accepted cash payment for a labour job when they were in high school nor did they ever do anything against their parents will. :whistling


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

I think the govt schools are degrading the quality of your posts.. : laughing:

Listen to your Dad. 

If Chis said it was legit then Im sure it is. Ask Chris he will know better than any of us not in your area..


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Inner10 said:


> Just remember that no one on this board ever accepted cash payment for a labour job when they were in high school nor did they ever do anything against their parents will. :whistling


Especially not me.. : laughing:


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> I think the govt schools are degrading the quality of your posts.. : laughing:
> 
> Listen to your Dad.
> 
> If Chis said it was legit then Im sure it is. Ask Chris he will know better than any of us not in your area..


i did ask chris, and he said under the stated conditions it is.
now its just getting my dad on board..
without my own form of transportation im kinda stuck for now.
but le truck is coming soon


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Give him half the money..


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## Mr Latone (Jan 8, 2011)

It doesn't look like you would carry any liability so long as you aren't thinking of or making it out to be "your job"

So long as the HO is in charge, you are just there to provide labor.

I can see your dad being apprehensive if you are trying to 'take the bull by the horns'.

You should retain some humility and promote that you have a tool belt and some ability. At this stage anything beyond that could assign you some liability.


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## Mr Latone (Jan 8, 2011)

and what is with all the **** in your posts? This is a public forum


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

Mr Latone said:


> It doesn't look like you would carry any liability so long as you aren't thinking of or making it out to be "your job"
> 
> So long as the HO is in charge, you are just there to provide labor.
> 
> ...



its not even a HO its a contractor


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## Mr Latone (Jan 8, 2011)

So basically this contractor is looking for some part time help, that is you?


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

If he's a contractor then get him to put you on the pay roll or just get him to hire you as a sub. Just make sure your name isn;t on the building permit. And don't sign any contract with him that says that you're anything other than labour.

I feel for you with your dad, my wife is anxious and if it wasn't for me the kids would never do anything. If it's getting designed and your name is on zero paperwork then i wouldn't worry about it.

I beleive that in Ont the only law says that you can't have someone younger than 16 on a construction site.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

dom-mas said:


> If he's a contractor then get him to put you on the pay roll or just get him to hire you as a sub. Just make sure your name isn;t on the building permit. And don't sign any contract with him that says that you're anything other than labour.
> 
> I feel for you with your dad, my wife is anxious and if it wasn't for me the kids would never do anything. If it's getting designed and your name is on zero paperwork then i wouldn't worry about it.
> 
> I beleive that in Ont the only law says that you can't have someone younger than 16 on a construction site.


part time help and i wont sign anything.
no problem


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Sounds like a great opportunity Nick. I am sure you are going to impress the socks off of that guy.


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## Ninjaframer (May 28, 2011)

"Hired gun" I love it  I had a buddy I used to job hop with- frame a house here, another there- whoever paid the best. That's what we used to say " guns for hire!". I promise you nick- you are not the only one on this forum to ever take a cash job before he had all his government required ducks in a row  tear it up buddy.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

Ninjaframer said:


> "Hired gun" I love it  I had a buddy I used to job hop with- frame a house here, another there- whoever paid the best. That's what we used to say " guns for hire!". I promise you nick- you are not the only one on this forum to ever take a cash job before he had all his government required ducks in a row  tear it up buddy.


whats my legal standpoint on that.
i am just a laborer paid in cash, no trail or connection or liability


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Your puting too much into it Nick. Your just a young guy trying to make some new school clothes cash.


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## SC sawdaddy (Oct 15, 2008)

You'll do fine Nick.
Just post pics so we can rip you a new one if you hack it up.






















:w00t:


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## Ninjaframer (May 28, 2011)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> Your puting too much into it Nick. Your just a young guy trying to make some new school clothes cash.


Exactly- if people always worried about the "exact legality" of things America wouldn't exist


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

Ninjaframer said:


> Exactly- if people always worried about the "exact legality" of things America wouldn't exist


im not putting too much into it, i don't give a **** about all this,
its my dad who i have to find all this out to convince.


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWB85CKA6h8


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## shanekw1 (Mar 20, 2008)

1. Mind your father

2. Use the shift key.

3. Sticking **** or **** in every third sentence does not impress. In fact, it goes the other way.:thumbsup:


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

so what do i tell my dad. he is very unstable when it comes to stuff like this,
he tried to tell me this is too big for me.. Hmm i do recall doing 800sq of reroofing in the summer... cutting rafters is something i am very good at ,and sheathing a roof is the best.
I am not turning this down. I will fight my case


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## catspaw (Oct 29, 2008)

make sure there is some workmans comp in the mix in case you fall on your ass and have to get bills paid!


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

catspaw said:


> make sure there is some workmans comp in the mix in case you fall on your ass and have to get bills paid!


i have my rope.
lets no complicate it further.
i just need a clear, concise case to calm him down. I AM NOT TURNING THIS DOWN


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

You havent addressed the missing shift strokes..


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> You havent addressed the missing shift strokes..


what does the shift key do?


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

In your case you could use it to capitalize the first letter of sentances and other important words.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> In your case you could use it to capitalize the first letter of sentances and other important words.


Give me a second.:whistling


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

If your having a tough time you could hit CapLock then the letter then CapLock then proceed typing the rest of the word.


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## catspaw (Oct 29, 2008)

FramingPro said:


> i have my rope.
> lets no complicate it further.
> i just need a clear, concise case to calm him down. I AM NOT TURNING THIS DOWN


sorry i made you scream. be like nike, just do it!


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

catspaw said:


> sorry i made you scream. be like nike, just do it!


You did not make me scream..
I would love to just do it, but before my truck arrives, my dad is my source of transportation..
There is a time and place for thinking, but one something like this, where i am just a part time helper, there is absoultely no reason for all this bull****. Its not different from anyother job i have done, and what i shouldn't do it because I don't know the guy?
give me a break


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## Brutus (May 29, 2007)

catspaw said:


> make sure there is some workmans comp in the mix in case you fall on your ass and have to get bills paid!



If he is taking it as a cash job, no workmans comp.

Nick, you also told your father too much. You should of just said, helping a guy out with some work on his house. I don't tell my parents what I do at work. My mother would lose it on me. I also don't tell Mrs. Brutus what I do. She is too damned scared. I once told her about a slip and almost fall I had, she wasn't happy, so now I keep quiet and just say I had a good day and tell her all the jokes I heard/told.

You're old enough to legally be on a job site in Canada. I would rather see you on this guys payroll, then you would be good for workers comp. As others have said, don't put your name on any of the permits/plans/certificates... whatever. You are just a labourer, and just happen to know how to do a roof. That's it.


addition after reading a post I didn't see before:

Get buddy to pick you up, and grab him a coffee from Timmies so that you don't have to rely on your father for transportation.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

Brutus said:


> If he is taking it as a cash job, no workmans comp.
> 
> Nick, you also told your father too much. You should of just said, helping a guy out with some work on his house. I don't tell my parents what I do at work. My mother would lose it on me. I also don't tell Mrs. Brutus what I do. She is too damned scared. I once told her about a slip and almost fall I had, she wasn't happy, so now I keep quiet and just say I had a good day and tell her all the jokes I heard/told.
> 
> You're old enough to legally be on a job site in Canada. I would rather see you on this guys payroll, then you would be good for workers comp. As others have said, don't put your name on any of the permits/plans/certificates... whatever. You are just a labourer, and just happen to know how to do a roof. That's it.


Yep, thats it. I don't see why my dad is making such a fuss over it. He designs it, gets the plans. i am just a laborer. I do not have any liability, or connection to the job, he dictates and i do it. This is the sorta bull**** that really gets me:whistling


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## TxElectrician (May 21, 2008)

FramingPro said:


> its not even a HO its a contractor


So, you'll be working for a contractor that doesn't know how to cut rafters? Who wants to pay you off the books to work for him?

This is what it's come to? From working for a quality guy like Chris to working for a hack? Part time or not, that's what the guy is. 

If the OP was the "contractor" coming on here asking for advice about hiring this "kid", everyone would rip him a new one. But because it's the good kid everyone says it's OK?


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

TxElectrician said:


> So, you'll be working for a contractor that doesn't know how to cut rafters? Who wants to pay you off the books to work for him?
> 
> This is what it's come to? From working for a quality guy like Chris to working for a hack? Part time or not, that's what the guy is.
> 
> If the OP was the "contractor" coming on here asking for advice about hiring this "kid", everyone would rip him a new one. But because it's the good kid everyone says it's OK?


why is he hack? Because he doesn't know how to frame a roof?
I think its better that he asked for help, rather then just trying and royally screwing it up himself.:whistling


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## r4r&r (Feb 22, 2012)

All right Pro, see shift key :laughing:, this is probably gonna tick you off but here it is anyway. If the guy is paying you under the table, cash, then that makes you an illegal laborer, in the states anyway. This makes this guy appear as an under the radar contractor, aka a hack. 

Now for the part that is really gonna piss you off, I agree with your Dad. If something were to happen to you on that job the guy would disappear and your family would be stuck with the medical bills. If he is willing to skirt the system he sure won't be there to cover your a&& if something were to happen.


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

Nick,

You have a number of supporters on this forum, me being up at the top of the list.

However, no one on here is going to condone you going against the wishes of your Father.

Or working for some guy for cash.

This is not a mindset for you to follow. 

I admire your ambition & your drive. But what about the guy that could use that job to support his family.

It has been pointed out to you several times before that you should pay attention to spelling & grammar which you have chosen to ignore.

Your little BS **** like your trying to cuss doesn't cut it either.

Spend some more time in English class & for God sakes show some respect to your Dad.

Much more whining from you & this will get shut down.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

I am not disrespecting him..
And health insurance is not the issue, we have health insurance in Canada, the issue is liability.


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## Brutus (May 29, 2007)

FramingPro said:


> I am not disrespecting him..
> And health insurance is not the issue, we have health insurance in Canada, the issue is liability.



As soon as you go into the hospital and someone says you were injured on a job site. The Canadian Health plan will not cover you. Which is the purpose of workers comp. You don't have access to this guys workers comp if you are paid cash.


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## knucklehead (Mar 2, 2009)

Get some different help
or tell dad to call me

816 506 1513


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

By saying that my dad has construction anxiety is not disrespecting him..
Like i said before, he is not accustomed to the business, or the idea of building big things, so when it comes to stuff like this i have to coax him into it. If i let him, cap me, and shut me down each time a job comes up, then how will i ever grow and expand my skills? By taking on progressively bigger jobs i build up my skills, client base and portfolio. I am more then capable of doing this job, and under the right circumstances, i feel that there would be no issues in me doing it.


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## Brutus (May 29, 2007)

FramingPro said:


> If i let him, cap me, and shut me down each time a job comes up, then how will i ever grow and expand my skills?


Wait till after high school, and go out and mess around with you friends. It's halloween, you should be egging houses or something. :laughing:


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## Ninjaframer (May 28, 2011)

If your father says no and you are able to bring your passion under control and respect his wishes you just learned a far more valuable lesson than you would have framing this roof.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

Brutus said:


> Wait till after high school, and go out and mess around with you friends. It's halloween, you should be egging houses or something. :laughing:


It is raining like a SOB here, not sure if i am gonna go out :sad:


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

Ninjaframer said:


> If your father says no and you are able to bring your passion under control and respect his wishes you just learned a far more valuable lesson than you would have framing this roof.


As much as it is a passion, it is also an obsession that i can't stop.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

griz said:


> Nick,
> 
> You have a number of supporters on this forum, me being up at the top of the list.
> 
> ...


Its funny how close this is to what I was typing for Nick when my phone died towards the end of the post and then I gave up. 

This is Great advice Nick. The more you head it the better you will be!:clap:


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

FramingPro said:


> As much as it is a passion, it is also an obsession that i can't stop.


ummm weird and also an even better reason to not do the job. Obsessions are small steps from compulsions and also usually kind of creepy. Passions are much better


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

dom-mas said:


> ummm weird and also an even better reason to not do the job. Obsessions are small steps from compulsions and also usually kind of creepy. Passions are much better


Its like an addiction, i need my fix of framing.


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

You need a girlfriend. Go to Halloween Party and act normal..


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## Warren (Feb 19, 2005)

Another vote for Pops!
If this "contractor" wants to pay you under the table, he is not worth your skills Nick. If you have read everything here, you already know that. Good things come to those who wait.


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> You need a girlfriend. Go to Halloween Party and act normal..


I am waiting for this rain to stop..
Im going out dressed as a framer :whistling, if they like my costume then they get a card :thumbup:


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

FramingPro said:


> I am waiting for this rain to stop..
> Im going out dressed as a framer :whistling, if they like my costume then they get a card :thumbup:


I said act NORMAL. Use an umbrella, its the thing normal people use when its raining. Your Dad probably has one.:thumbup:


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## svronthmve (Aug 3, 2008)

Nick,

1.) Lose the attitude. 

2.) Respect your father's wishes - even if you don't agree with him. In the long run, that may win you more respect from him at a time it may really count. Win him over and bring him over to your side a bit at a time. There's obviously a reason he's hesitant. 

3.) Carrying on like you are and posting the way you are, only shows you need to develop some more maturity. I was your age once too. Someday, you'll look back at this incident and realize it's not worth the effort you're putting into arguing your side. Honor his wishes this time and give him a reason to respect and trust you.

4.) As was mentioned above

A.) Nick, read the writing on the wall. This guy is skirting things for a reason. He IS NOT acting like a competent contractor. Don't allow yourself to sink to his level.

B.) To the rest of you guys, quit encouraging Nick to go against his father's wishes. There is no decency in that in his type of situation. And txelectrician brings up a good point.....stop encouraging the wonder child to do what most everybody on here abhors and criticizes the hacks for doing. Some of you guys have castrated posters for lesser offences!


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

$20 bet that you HATE framing by the time you're 22 $50 by the time you're 25


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

dom-mas said:


> $20 bet that you HATE framing by the time you're 22 $50 by the time you're 25


$20 000 and you got a deal.


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## BC Carpenter (Dec 28, 2010)

I'd listen to your dad, especially if you are living under his roof and he is supporting you.

This fellow should not be hiring a high school kid to frame and sheet a roof for cash, if he is in fact a professional builder/contractor. No protection in case of an accident. I wouldn't have anything to do with him.

One thing to keep in mind- If this guy hires people for cash to work on a roof, and one falls and is seriously injured or dies, worst case scenario stuff... Around here anyways, the liability is now on the home owner. Do you want to work for someone that doesn't care about putting their clients into that kind of situation?


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## 413Sean (Jan 6, 2012)

Ninjaframer said:


> "Hired gun" I love it  I had a buddy I used to job hop with- frame a house here, another there- whoever paid the best. That's what we used to say " guns for hire!". I promise you nick- you are not the only one on this forum to ever take a cash job before he had all his government required ducks in a row  tear it up buddy.


Love the term "hired gun":laughing: had a gc recently ask me about a long time pal, that we basically fill in work with each other... I said "thats the hired gun you may see more of him" as we burst into laughter :thumbsup:


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## Tylerwalker32 (Jun 27, 2011)

I'm with all theses guys saying respect your dad first. Show a little respect for your dad, he's not telling to something just to hear himself talk. He's got your best interest in mind. He's lived a lot more years than you have and obviously he sees something about this job that you don't. Had a job at the beginning of the summer and before I even could pick up on it my dad heard about the job and he said I shouldn't take it, in the end he was right the guy was jerking me around about my work in just the meeting and in the end I saw what my dad did and walked away. Just let this one go, there's a whole lot more fish in the sea. I'm sure with your talents you'll find more work.


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## 413Sean (Jan 6, 2012)

Im with everyone else here, you have the many years ahead to frame buildings, dont disrespect your old man, there's plenty of time to work the remainder of you're career. You are a smart, talented, goal driven young man(I would hire you instantly based on your posts). For now go chase girls and dont lose sleep over this one, trust me you have many years ahead of you. Good Luck man


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## Ninjaframer (May 28, 2011)

Don't get me wrong- I say tear it up If dads on board- if he's not you gotta "render unto Caesar"  Dad's law is THE LAW and a super framer such as yourself is smart enough to know when it's time to fold the hand. Good luck brother.


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## Snobnd (Jul 1, 2008)

Say yes, help the guy out and have him nail off a few rafters ( take a picture of him nailing it down) collect cash and enjoy your day. :laughing:

If it falls down ( not that it will) Sir I just helped him cut the rafters :whistling


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## dom-mas (Nov 26, 2011)

I undersatnd what you're saying but from what I can see he isn't going at this job with any lack of personal integrity or responsibility. I'm sure that he will do his best and do it with gusto but as for his dads worry about him having any liability, there is nil...unless he acts in a grossly negligent manner which i don't think he will. And as for the worry about him being covered by WSIB (it's WSIB in Canada Nick not WC) he will be if the GC is above board and he will be covered by OHIP if he isn't and the GC will get fined into bankruptcy, hopefully business and personal


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## Brutus (May 29, 2007)

Kent Whitten said:


> Brutus is Canadian, as well as a sharp dresser.




:laughing:

Apparently Levis and black band shirts are considered dressing sharp where you from. :laughing:


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

I am really on the fence now.. i mean, i have done jobs with more liability and i have done jobs without WSIB, so how is this one any different?


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Because you asked the opinion of a bunch of professionals on a public forum. What did you expect?


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> Nick, how was the halloween party? Any dirty French nurses? : laughing:


party was saturday... yeah some nurses, some fire fighters and some i don't know whats..but i liked em :laughing:


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## FramingPro (Jan 31, 2010)

ohiohomedoctor said:


> Because you asked the opinion of a bunch of professionals on a public forum. What did you expect?


I will state my concerns to the guy, see what he says.. but my biggest concern is liability and without any, i feel better about this job


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## ohiohomedoctor (Dec 26, 2010)

Just tell everybody they are right and your not going to take the job. Then do whatever you feel is best because thats what your going to do anyways by the sound of it. Just be smart.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

FramingPro said:


> Why?


Because, though we often hate to admit it until a decade or three have passed, a lot of the time Dad does know best. We only know the side of you that's presented here. He has a lot more information upon which to base his opinions, and I feel safe in guaranteeing that those opinions have your best interests in mind. Whether you think so or not.

You think being a framer is cool, and to an extent it is. You also seem to think using **** words is cool, and that most certainly isn't. Nor is playing word games to justify doing things that are illegal, or at least putting you on the wrong side of ethical.

Are you worried that if you reveal your dad's wishes, we'll agree with him?


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## Spaint90 (Dec 26, 2011)

Theres alot of things in my teens i thought my old man was an "idiot" about..its kind of funny because ive been through the school of hard knocks enough times since then. I've realized with some age how smart he was, and i'm closer with him than i've ever been before.

Tinstaafl has some solid points..you can come on this site and try and be one of the "boys" all you want. Maybe you even have some trades skills. But it pays to shut up and listen every now and then.

Not that this post will make much of a difference though:laughing: you'll probably learn the hard way


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

When I was sixteen years old
I thought my father was the stupidest person in the world. 
When I was eighteen years 
I was amazed at what he had learned in just two years.

Mark Twain....

There are several versions of this but all mean the same...

When I turned 25 I made an Oak plaque, engraved this saying on it...

and gave it to my Dad....

My Dad is 88, he has asked what I want from the house.

I told him there is a picture I want & that plaque....


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## Ninjaframer (May 28, 2011)

Does every son have to go back and say "you were right and I should have listened"? I know I did


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## JWilliams (Nov 11, 2008)

How is it any different? Knowing the real reason between right and wrong. That's what. I know you will do the right thing in the end.


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