# Question regarding design and drafting



## Brodie Sinn (Mar 13, 2011)

Hey everyone,

I'm new to the forum, this looks like a great site with a wealth of information. I've been lurking for a few weeks but decided to register today so I could ask this question.

I'm currently enrolled in a Architectural Drafting and Estimating degree program at a local technical college. When I graduate with my associate degree in this major would it be possible for me to design additions and remodels for local clients? I'm not really asking on a technical standpoint, I'm more curious in the legal side. Would it be illegal? Would I need an architect or engineer of some sort to stamp plans? 

I plan on drafting for a local architectural firm for quite a while after I graduate, I am just curious if its feasible to strike out on my own eventually.

Thanks for reading.


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## Tinstaafl (Jan 6, 2008)

Brodie Sinn said:


> Would it be illegal? Would I need an architect or engineer of some sort to stamp plans?


Probably not, and maybe. Depends on local codes. Some areas don't even require a building permit. Some require a permit but don't even do any inspections. Some require piles of paperwork and stamps.

A bigger issue would be whether you want to shoulder the possible liability of having a structure built according to your un-engineered specs--and then failing.


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## Rio (Oct 13, 2009)

Depends on what state you're in. Check with the state licensing board.


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

As far as I have ever seen anyone can "draw" plans. The High School CAD class does it all the time. The "trick" is to be aware of the building codes in your area and have a full set of plans that will get through plan check. The plans will need to be engineered before the contractor gets them so he knows what to bid. Now getting through plan check may be another battle.


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## greg24k (May 19, 2007)

If the state you be working at requires to have a license to provide such services, then without that you cannot do the drawings, although if you working for a firm with a license, then you can do the drawing but they have to approve it and seal the plan.


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## Brodie Sinn (Mar 13, 2011)

Thanks for the quick replys guys. I live in North Dakota. I have been searching the internet all day for information regarding blueprints or plans and the process to make them legal and viable, but no to avail. Could anyone point me in the right direction? I seem to be running in circles.


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## Kgmz (Feb 9, 2007)

Go to your local building department and ask. They will be able to tell you if the plans need to be stamped, etc.

But the other big thing others have mentioned is before you draw it, you have to know how to build it, and figure load calculations, etc. if there is no need for a engineer or architects stamp in your area.

Drafting courses only teach how to draw, not what to draw.


In ouir area I draw all my plans and have them stamped by a engineer. But there was a time about 10 years back where for most things I didn't need a engineers stamp and the building department would figure and check my calcs, etc. The big reason why most jurisdictions want a stamp now because they don't want the liability of approving something that was not stamped by a engineer, and want the engineer to take responsibility.


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## ScipioAfricanus (Sep 13, 2008)

Hi Brodie and welcome to the forum.
Spot on advice from all before. Your local Building Department may have a sheet on what is required to be shown on a set of plans in your jurisdiction, most do it seems.
It will probably tell you that they want a dimensioned site plan detailing the locations of existing and proposed structures, floor plans for each floor whether existing or proposed, foundation plan, roof plan and elevations views exist. & prop. Plus architectural details regarding windows, doors, siding, materials, weather protections, egress, glazing, yadda yadda.
Lots of stuff that you have to somehow familiarize yourself with.
I have been in the construction trades for about 30 yrs. so I picked up knowledge along the way. Here in California you do not need to be a licensed architect for a project unless that project meets certain criteria, like using tilt-up walls or large structural elements for commercial.
For residential design I can not use "conventional light frame" construction techniques as prescribed in the CBC 2010 if the project is in certain earthquake zones and more than one story plus a myriad of other possible scenarios.
Anyway, hit the books on construction and codes as often as you can and get some real construction experience under your belt would be my recommendation.

Good luck to you.

Andy.


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## Rio (Oct 13, 2009)

All good advice above: You can check with the South Dakota Architecture board to see what types and sizes of projects trigger the requirement to have a licensed architect (or in many cases a structural or civil engineer) stamp the plans.


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## PalmettoWandD (Mar 3, 2011)

Ok my friend, I seriously suggest you NOT waste your time. If you want to work as a drafter, designer, estimator then this training is fine. I guess I am speaking from personal experience. I graduated with an Architectural Engineering Technology degree last year (associates) and only found it to be not completely worthless but, not what I thought is was going to worth. I really wish I would have gone to a four year engineering school. Just something to thinking about, but always keep the future in mind.


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## glkirk (Nov 27, 2011)

Brodie Sinn said:


> Thanks for the quick replys guys. I live in North Dakota. I have been searching the internet all day for information regarding blueprints or plans and the process to make them legal and viable, but no to avail. Could anyone point me in the right direction? I seem to be running in circles.


May I suggest you visit your local building permit office and discuss all this with them.
I used to get permits to build homes drawn up on 9x11 paper with autocadlt by a quadrapledgic. He had no credentials. Not sure if the credentials requirements have changed.
The review process would take a day or two. 
I usually am able to pull permits with my drawings that I produce with autocadlt. I used to hand draw them.
But I have been doing it for over 30 years and I think the inspectors take that into consideration.
It's liability we are talking about here. Don't know what liability permit office accepts, but I think they have a clause??
Maybe make an appointment and sit down and discuss this at length with a permit official.


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## missionbrew (Nov 29, 2011)

You can do all the drafting and design you want, but you cannot call yourself an architect or say you are providing architectural services. You will want to get an engineer to do any structural calculations and details however, and you can submit to the building department with his stamp. Problem is, he may not know the codes that the architect would usually know....so, as long as you have that covered, you should get through plan check no problem.


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## missionbrew (Nov 29, 2011)

....if your goal is to become an architect, it is a royal ***** and hardly worth the effort. My best advice would be to speak with a licensed architect in your area and have them explain...in agonizing detail......all the hoops and years of work you have to do to get a license. And the pay pretty much sucks. Go get a 4 Year Business degree, or if you want to be in the construction business get a Construction Management degree. You will be WAY WAY AHEAD of the game in 10 years. In 10 years as a CM you will command $150/hr...or you will command $35/hr as a draftsman........


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## Zendik (Sep 18, 2005)

I've recently graduated with a similar degree.
Our instructors, mostly architects, let us know what was legal in our state.
Then it was easy to track it down and get the official word.

Didn't mean much to me as this degree is the first step towards a bachelors in construction management.


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## The Golden Rule (Dec 13, 2011)

ND Board of Architecture link

http://www.ndsba.net/?id=236&page=Architect+Reciprocity+Application

ND follows the 2009 IRBC (International Residential Building Code) along with ND's State Code (link below)

http://www.communityservices.nd.gov/government/state-building-code/

As others have already well advised, you need to contact your local codes compliance office as they have the right to amend building codes including whether or not you are required to be licensed (as an architect or engineer) in order to provide design services....... and whether or not construction documents have to bear the seal of a licensed architect or engineer. 

If I might add (as someone with a degree in architecture and now self-employed as a design-builder), it would be well worth your time to gain employment with a builder, architect or engineer for a few years before going out on your own completely. For the first year or two you will likely be a CAD jockey (it's a right of passage and has its purpose). You will be required to take the designs sketched out by someone else at the firm and create a working set of drawings which meets or exceeds the applicable building code requirements. Sounds mundane, I know, but you will actually learn quite a bit by that repetitive process. If your employer is laid back enough, he/she might let you be the designer on smaller scale projects (of course under his/her supervision). 

As a side note, not until I began working with my husband (who has been building homes for 24 years) did I truly learn about structure. (If he ever gets on here -- don't tell him I owned up to that) :whistling

Good Luck to you!


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## kgabriel (Nov 11, 2011)

Simply go down to the local permitting office and pick up a brochure at the information desk. In that brochure will be information stating whether or not your particular project will require a building permit and if an arch or engineer is required to stamp the plans. It all has to do with square footage, cost of construction, and what materials you are using.

done.


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## Willie T (Jan 29, 2009)

Rio said:


> All good advice above: You can check with the South Dakota Architecture board to see what types and sizes of projects trigger the requirement to have a licensed architect (or in many cases a structural or civil engineer) stamp the plans.


Just a guess, but the information might be more pertinent if he checked with North Dakota instead. :whistling


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## Rio (Oct 13, 2009)

Willie T said:


> Just a guess, but the information might be more pertinent if he checked with North Dakota instead. :whistling


Whoops!


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## Willie T (Jan 29, 2009)

No sweat, Obama does it all the time. :laughing:


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## ScipioAfricanus (Sep 13, 2008)

I hope the guy found out what he needed to know in 9 moths of searching.

Andy.


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## Willie T (Jan 29, 2009)

THAT'S the problem! He's been looking in SOUTH Dakota all this time.


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