# Commercial VCT removal



## TomthetoolMan (Mar 23, 2010)

I am bidding a commercial flooring job. The scope involves removing 4000sq. ft. of VCT (non asbestos) and 5000 sq. ft. of glue down carpet. Preping the floor and installing vinyl backed carpet tile over it all again. My question revolves around the issue of the hidden pit falls of the glue removal phase of the floor prep and weather or not the new flooring adhesives will have a problem sticking if the floor is not cleaned down to raw concrete. Thanks for your help. Tom the Tool Man


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## griz (Nov 26, 2009)

Greetings, Go back and give us an intro. Where are you & what you do. Welcome to CT.

Do your job specs call out what adhesive to use? Call the mfg. and see what they require. My experience with floor guys on remodels is that the prep usually eats them up. They find floors in poor shape or a bad previous prep. Has the old mastic been cleared of asbestos? If the old mastic is cleared getting the old mastic off is what usually gets you.


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## gideond (May 17, 2007)

There are machines you can buy or rent that make stripping the tile up much easier. They are basically a big vibrating razor blade. That leaves you with the glue residue to deal with. If it's fairly lumpy you need to go to town with a razor to scrape it off. If it's a very fine residue you can use an encapsulator (Apac Adhesives makes one) that will seal up the old residue and allow you to glue the carpet tile right over it.


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## TomthetoolMan (Mar 23, 2010)

"Where are you & what you do." Portland Oregon, This project is commercial carpet. We do commercial ceramic tile, flooring and carpet primarily. In this market we are bidding everthing that comes our way, siding, restaurants, framing, masonry block, kitchen and bath remodels. 
Current carpet bid: R&R 4000 sf VCT and 5000 sf glue down carpet, install 1100 sy new carpet.
The mastic I will be using is a Mannington product called MT711. The carpet tile is a 24" x 24" vinyl. The bidding public has been told by the owner (The Oregon Military) that there is no asbestos, in the VCT or the carpet adhesive being removed. 
Removing the carpet or the VCT is not my major concern. The old carpet glue is the typical dried tan colored latex, which should come up fairly easyily. We will used walk behind buffers with "Scape-away heads" to knock down the dried adhesive. 
I am more concerned about the VCT adhesive (mfg. unknown), and weather it will interfear with the carpet adhesive bond. I donot want to get bogged down in the floor prep or have a problem later with the carpet tiles coming loose.
I am not sure weather to bid chemical adhesive remover and if so what is the most cost effective product.


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## JumboJack (Aug 14, 2007)

I would take it down to the concrete.


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## TomthetoolMan (Mar 23, 2010)

You are the general public!


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## JumboJack (Aug 14, 2007)

Uh....ok.....


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## BKM Resilient (May 2, 2009)

TomthetoolMan said:


> "Where are you & what you do." Portland Oregon, This project is commercial carpet. We do commercial ceramic tile, flooring and carpet primarily. In this market we are bidding everthing that comes our way, siding, restaurants, framing, masonry block, kitchen and bath remodels.
> Current carpet bid: R&R 4000 sf VCT and 5000 sf glue down carpet, install 1100 sy new carpet.
> The mastic I will be using is a Mannington product called MT711. The carpet tile is a 24" x 24" vinyl. The bidding public has been told by the owner (The Oregon Military) that there is no asbestos, in the VCT or the carpet adhesive being removed.
> Removing the carpet or the VCT is not my major concern. The old carpet glue is the typical dried tan colored latex, which should come up fairly easyily. We will used walk behind buffers with "Scape-away heads" to knock down the dried adhesive.
> ...


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Scrape-away down to the concrete. Do NOT use any chemical removal process as that will get into the pores of the concrete. Over the old carpet areas you're good to go. There's three different types of VCT glue. Cutback, black thin spread and clear thin spread. Cutback will need to be skimcoated with cement based patch and latex additive. Neither of the thin spread products would be incompatible with Mannington MT-711 although I'm sure they'd recommend removing or skimcoating over it for a better bond. 

Many, many millions of yards of that kind of carpet tile backing are laid right over multi-purpose and thin spreads without even a full scrape-away process. It's a sloppy and half-a$$ way but there's not any real risk of a meltdown effect if you are sure what it is you are covering.


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## clagster (Mar 29, 2010)

*vct*

I installed flooring for over 10 yrs and if the VCT is a good install why remove it just to glue down carpeting seems like a waste of time to remove it its just carpet tiles your installing and ive installed enuff of that over top of vct


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## BuildersII (Dec 20, 2009)

I'm curious if anyone's tried a floor stone grinder to remove old adhesive. Would it just gum up or would it be effective?


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## bwalley (Jan 7, 2009)

BuildersII said:


> I'm curious if anyone's tried a floor stone grinder to remove old adhesive. Would it just gum up or would it be effective?


It would gum up rather quickly.


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## shovel13 (Feb 13, 2010)

surprised i didn't see this sooner, oh well. 

anything new on this project, did you get it, need help with it?:whistling


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## Rockwood (Dec 1, 2008)

I try a test spot to see how the tile and VCT comes up. I have run into situations where they used VCT for floor leveler. Take the VCT to a floor supply store to get a second opinion if it really needs to come up, this could be a lot of scraping or chemical if it is in bad shape.


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## JumboJack (Aug 14, 2007)

I have rented a floor buffer with one of these http://www.contractorsdirect.com/Concrete-Saw-Tile-Saw/Pearl-Surface-Preparation-Tools/15-Hexplate-With-Clutch-Only;jsessionid=0a010c451f43b3f04d3e68da4bf08a95c7e39cdc45fb.e3eTaxeKbh0Te34Pa38Ta38Ma3z0
to remove thinset.Depending on how much adhesive there is to be removed this might do the trick.


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## shovel13 (Feb 13, 2010)

why take up the tile unless it's real rough, just float out the edges. carpet tile glue is simply a pressure sensitive adhesive which is basically the same as clearset for VCT.


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## BuildersII (Dec 20, 2009)

JumboJack said:


> I have rented a floor buffer with one of these http://www.contractorsdirect.com/Co...8a95c7e39cdc45fb.e3eTaxeKbh0Te34Pa38Ta38Ma3z0
> to remove thinset.Depending on how much adhesive there is to be removed this might do the trick.


That's what I was talking about when I said a floor stone grinder. Perhaps my terminology was off.


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## BKM Resilient (May 2, 2009)

BuildersII said:


> That's what I was talking about when I said a floor stone grinder. Perhaps my terminology was off.


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That's the less effective brand/version of the "Scrape-Away" plate. It's great on very thick and dry (crystallized) multi-purpose but much less effective on thin spreads or multi-purpose that is still tacky and relatively thick. None of those work too well on pressure sensitive glue that has been rolled on thick.


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## BKM Resilient (May 2, 2009)

JumboJack said:


> I have rented a floor buffer with one of these http://www.contractorsdirect.com/Co...8a95c7e39cdc45fb.e3eTaxeKbh0Te34Pa38Ta38Ma3z0
> to remove thinset.Depending on how much adhesive there is to be removed this might do the trick.


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I bought one of those plates when I was doing many thousands of boxes of VCT in market remodels. It's effective on most adhesives but useless on some. I prefer the Scrape-Away plates.


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